‘Rapp Live’ community forum transcript Event sponsored by the Rappahannock News, with the cooperation of

the Theatre at Washington, Va., on June 19, 2014

Note: In some cases, names were inaudible, or it was not clear who was speaking. We tried otherwise to identify all the speakers by name. If you find any errors or inaccuracies, please let us know (info@rappnews.com) and we will correct them and repost this document.

Roger Piantadosi: Let’s get started then. Thank you, all of you, for coming. We were worried that no one would show up. (laughter) Um, I’m Roger Piantadosi, I’m the editor of the Rappahannock News and we’re sponsoring (applause) — That was unexpected and uncalled for, but thank you. We have asked everyone to come out for fill­in­the­blank with whatever reason you’ve heard.

The real reason is so that we can all meet each other and hear each other and this, we hope, will lead to a continued conversation about this topic — development in Washington, in Rappahannock and others, other venues. So I really do appreciate the turnout here. And we have some rules. We are recording this event — if that inhibits you, fine. (laughter) We’re asking folks, as the supervisors and other bodies here do to keep your comments initially to three minutes. And we have, uh, Walter is — Walter Nicklin, the publisher of the Rappahannock News — will be keeping a stopwatch and will raise his hand when you’re getting close.

The reason for that is if you have something more to say, we’d like everyone to have one chance, and then you can come back around and speak again. We ask that when you do speak, if you would identify yourself, that would be helpful. If you want to say where you live or what your connection is, that would be even more helpful. We ask that there be no personal attacks, and that we all act in a way that tomorrow’s recording — we’ll be proud to put in on the website, which is certainly what I expect from everyone here because we’re, none of us right now, online, are we? (laughter)

I want to introduce the panel, and the panel is here to speak, in three out of the five cases — I think — to speak, to make an initial statement and then you will have your turn to speak. On my right, your left, that’s Mayor John Sullivan of the Town of Washington where we are right now. This is Rev. Jenks Hobson of Trinity Episcopal Church, who has been in this very spot for 41 years — more or less, more or less. And on my left, this is Jim Abdo, a fellow you may have heard of. This is Roger Welch, the chair of our board of supervisors, the owner of a longtime business gallery in town.

Roger Welch: My wife’s gallery.

RP: Your wife’s gallery, the Geneva Welch Gallery. And next to Roger is John McCarthy, our county administrator for these past thir . . . re . . . number!

John McCarthy: 28 years.

RP: 28 years. (applause) We asked these three to make an opening statement. Roger and John can certainly do so, but they’re mostly here to answer questions. Between the two of them, there’s more than 60 years of experience dealing with development, conservation — and the whole point of why I think we’re all here, which is that we are unified in our opinion that Rappahannock is a special place. And that it is beautiful. And that as we progress tonight I hope you keep in mind that why we are here is to keep it beautiful and to keep us beautiful. (laughter) I’d like to introduce Jenks.

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Jenks Hobson: I think the mayor made the proper comment: “Must be a heck of a good movie tonight.” And the other is I’m not gonna pray. Um, I do make a disclaimer: I do not do Rappnet. I went no email years ago when I was on dial­up and it was up­and­coming and I never went back. But I understand it’s been a little rough recently — and some people tell me that’s an understatement.

Um, some facts about me: I moved here in mid­June 41 years ago. Um, I was interviewed and quoted in “the article,” um, and I am an avowed country boy. At 41 years I’m still a “come­here” in Rappahannock, but my family have been living in rural Virginia ever since us Europeans showed up here 400 years ago. Um . . . And I like when city folks come out and look at the spaces between the buildings to kind of look at them and they say, “What do you do out here?” And I look ‘em dead in the eye and I say with all honesty and certainty: “We got more going on here per capita than you ever thought about in the city.” (laughter, applause)

I wanna tell two stories about quotes. One, by the time I finish telling it, most of you all will know who it was. Um, the other one, not so much. But a friend of mine came to church one time many years ago — he wasn’t much of a church­goer, and he didn’t quite get what was going on. And I was preaching on that text from the Hebrew scripture, or the Old Testament as we call it, where Moses goes up the mountain — um, some of you all have heard this before — Moses goes up the mountain and they keep waiting for him to come down. And they get impatient and they tell Aaron he better do something about it, so Aaron makes a golden calf. And kinda offends God and Moses a little bit. And I said that’s kinda like that old rock song, “If you can’t be with the one you love, love the one you’re with.”

Well my friend, that week, in his real estate ad, where he liked to put pull quotes says, “Rev. Hobson says, ‘If you can’t be with the one you love, love the one you’re with.’” (laughter) Now some of you all who know your trivia know that’s a quote from Steve Crosby, not me . . . Stephen Stills? David Crosby. Okay, whatever. (laughter) It’s been a long time. Um . . .You know, and obviously I made that statement and then I preached in a different direction! And that got left out too. So that quote was exactly quoted; I said those precise words, in that order, but it couldn’t have been more misquoted the way it was used.

The other one was from a friend recently, who has been a fairly high­level government bureaucrat and had been interviewed and quoted many times, said, “You know, I tend to read the articles about me and realize all the mistakes they made. And then I read the article next to it and believe every word of it.” We need to be careful about quotes.

I was quoted in that story, but very narrowly. There were some things I said that could have changed the direction of the story, but the author was not interested. Like, when he said, “What do you think of Mr. Abdo’s plans for Washington?” I said, “Who?” And that was just fun. I also said, okay it’s not the first time. In my 40 years, it’s the fourth or fifth run through of this. And I could name some names from the history that I suspect also had an agenda for this town. And as Al [Henry] said in the paper this week, a lot of them left really good things around here.

I suspect that I was asked to be the first one to speak to try to set a better tone. I’m not here representing Trinity Church anymore than all of us are here representing our care and concern for this town, but I’m here as a pastor to hopefully set a tone. And I do ask that we all listen and learn together. You know, with the folks that are being offered here, the folks that have things to say — it’s not hard to be civil, and it’s cheap. It doesn’t cost you anything . . . Because, as Roger said, we’re here because we care about this place. We have different ideas about it. But we care about this place.

And to Mr. Abdo, whom I just met for the first time a moment ago, um, despite my qualifiers on quotes, I

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suspect there’s still some here that think there’s room for the opinion that you might not quite get what the country’s about. And I offer to you — and this is genuine, heartfelt offer, not some flippant thing — that if you give me a couple hours, I’ll walk you around town and tell you what I know. Mostly. I’m a priest; I can’t tell it all. (laughter) But I mean that. And somewhere’s there was my card . . . There’s my card with my favorite email on it. Because this is a neat place to live. A neat place to raise your family. Um, and next year I get to retire, but I hope I don’t have to go too far because I still love being in this area. And that’s all I got to say. (applause)

John Sullivan: Thank you Roger, thank you Rapp News, thank you Jenks. I thank everybody for coming here. Thank you Ben Jones. That was not a joke; not a joke. Thank you Ben Jones. Um, I’ve been described as the mayor. Let me just tell you; you’re going to hear a little something about me if you don’t mind and then I’m going to tell you — give you some perspective — of what I think. Some of it’s been in the paper today, but I’m not sure everyone’s read it.

My wife and I came to this county in 1986. We came to this town in 2005. I’ve served on the Architectural Review Board for a couple years, the town council for six or seven, and I’m mayor. And I love this town. I love this town. And I move around this town, I walk around this town and Ben described me on a Rappnet thing that he struts around the town. Maybe I do. Maybe I strut; I don’t know, I think I walk.

I love every building in this town, and I like the people in this town. And I essentially decided five years ago that this is gonna be the rest of my life, in terms of professional and emotional. And I think we have something very special in this town, I think we have something very special in this community. And it’s been ripped apart obviously. There’s a very fragile ecosystem that exists, and to the extent that I’ve done something to contribute to that, I apologize very much.

But having said that, there is a ‘but.’ I do have some views. Let me go back one step, I’m sorry. I, um, if I strut, this is not my town. The town belongs to the 135 people in it. And to some extent, to a large extent, the folks that live in this county. And we’re all sort of stewards of one sort or another. And that is really the way I view my . . . my activities.

Now let me just give you a sense of a couple of things. There’s been a lot of talk about, “Is the town of Washington dying or not dying?” Well let me just give you a couple of facts. I think words like “dying” or “not dying” are unnecessary. But if you look at the numbers, this town once had 500 people in it. Then it had 300 people in it. In 2000 it had 183 in it. In 2010, 135. That’s a 25 or 26 percent decline in people during the first decade of this year. This century.

And if you go back five years ago you could walk through this town, as I did, and there were 10, 11 or 12 empty buildings. It was really dreary. And some of those buildings had been empty for so long you wondered if they were gonna stand, and who’s gonna do something with them. And then we had the sewer [system] come in, as all of you know, after much fight — decades of fight. And then whole goal of that wastewater system was not only to take people off of failing septics, off of stuff their houses had been floating on, but to allow the town to grow. And it simply couldn’t grow until there were wastewater facilities.

So what’s happened as a consequence of that? Couple years, not much. And then in the last couple years, folks have started to move into this town. And I am not gonna bore you, but I can go building by building by building of new people that have come to live in the Town of Washington. This didn’t really — wasn’t — a cool place to live, I think. But it’s become more so recently. And there’ve been businesses that have

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started up. And there are all the businesses in town that people know and love and cherish, but they’ve actually been — many cases — struggling. It is not easy, and everybody knows that.

So what this town and the town council and the comp plan been publicly pushing and open about was to try to grow this town with more residents, more people living here — yes, more children. This is sort of pathetic but we’ve now gone from one child in this town to now we have five. (laughter) You know, how many people have said we don’t have children in the Town of Washington? Well, I’m so micro we’re up to five! Every inch, step by step. It’s guerilla warfare to make things better. Um, so I think we’ve had something of a turnaround going. And Ken Thompson, as everybody knows, has been one of the leaders of that — but a lot of people, I shouldn’t just give Ken credit. (applause) And I think there’s a sense of vitality, etc., etc.

Now Jim comes along and buys a B&B, and fixes it up, and makes it into a really attractive building. And I have to say this laughingly, and I’ve said it before: My wife doesn’t like the yellow door. I like the yellow door. People fight about this, that and you know, whatever. But I think that’s it made a major improvement. And then he has bought up some other buildings, as everybody knows. Now, in this town . . . First of all, anyone can buy or sell any building at whatever price they want. That’s pretty obvious, but sometimes it’s almost forgotten. You can buy and sell whatever building you want. And some of these buildings have been sitting there for two, three, four, six, eight, nine, 10, 15 years empty. And nobody bought them until the last three or four years.

The question is, once someone has bought the building, what do you do with it? And the town has, what are regarded by people on the outside, as pretty good ordinances, a good comp plan — I’m sure it can be better — but stuff that people in this community have worked for 15, 20 years to try to refine. I see Hal Hunter out here, I mean he’s been in the middle of this stuff. We have an architectural review board.

So what’s the point? You can buy a building, but there’s only so many things you can do with it . . . And what it looks like gets reviewed by the ARB. So Jim Abdo, and anyone else who’s buying in this town, is gonna go through that process. And in fact Jim already has, in regards to two properties. And he went through the appropriate processes, didn’t skip a step and paid deference to the rules and the basic, um, attitude, civility, whatever, of that process.

So now the question is what is Jim gonna do with the rest of this stuff? And that’s on everybody’s mind. The town’s had a rhythm. There is a rhythm. The status quo is not — there’s no such thing as a status quo. The town is either declining or it’s rising up, strengthening. So the question is how does it strengthen, what direction? And I am in favor of the strengthening movement. And I am very, very open to, um, the views of the people in this town and certainly the views of people in this room. So with that, I thank you, and I think this should be very interesting. Thank you. (applause)

Jim Abdo: Well good evening and thank you all for coming out. I know this was a stormy day; I hope it’s not a stormy or stormy in here. But, uh, I want to to, uh, first thank Wendy for making this facility available. (applause) I have sat where you’re sitting many­a­time in this building over the years and I’ve seen some amazing performances right here, and I can assure you that this is not gonna be amazing performance tonight. I’m gonna do the best I can and I’m gonna answer all your questions. I’m gonna be very up front, open and honest with you.

About a week, or, I don’t know, two weeks now, the Washington Post wrote a story. And it was on the cover of the Washington Post business section. Some of you might have read it. I think all of you did. In that story, I was quoted. Like you, sir, not exactly — but close enough. And some of the verbage that I

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used and the words that I said to describe some of the things that I felt and that I saw offended some of the people in this town and some of the people in this county. And I stand before you right now to say that I am deeply sorry.

I never meant for anyone to be offended. And people that know me know that I would never offend anyone purposefully. It’s not part of my character; it’s not the way I was brought up. I love this county and I love this town — and I would never, ever do anything to offend anybody here purposefully. And frankly I think, over the course of this evening, what I hope you’re gonna realize is that I am far more aligned with all of you than opposed. With any of you.

There’s a lot of innuendo going on out there, and there’s a lot of people saying things — about me — and that’s fine. It’s not my first rodeo. And I’ve dealt with this kind of thing before. But don’t jump to conclusions, okay? There was a piece written in the Rappahannock News on page 2 that I’m sure a lot of you read. Like you, sir, I don’t read Rappnet. I don’t even know what it is, but frankly, from some of the things that people have told me, it’s not . . . not my cup of tea. But that said, um, there was, there was some opinions expressed in the Rappahannock News recently and people are all entitled to their opinions. They can be as mean­spirited as they wanna be — free speech.

But they should try to at least be accurate. Okay? Now there were a lot of things in that article — in that op­ed piece or whatever it was — that were not accurate. And they spoke about me and my character and who I am. And I really want to — just, for those people that don’t know me — tell you a little bit about who I am. Because I am your neighbor and I’ve been your neighbor here for 22 years. Okay? That’s how long I’ve owned land in this county.

I’m from Ohio, from a small rural town. I’m a product of workforce housing, public schools. I graduated first in my class, not because I’m smart, but they gave out the diplomas in alphabetical order. (laughter) I’m not the sharpest knife in the drawer, okay? I don’t have all the answers. And people that do have all the answers, that do know everything make me nervous. That’s not me. So I’m here to listen to you and I’m here to hear your ideas — just like the way I run my business in the other Washington.

Now let’s go back 22 years when I fell in love with this place. I actually courted my wife, who’s sitting right over here in the corner, out here in this county. We fell in love in this county. We spent our honeymoon in this county. When my children were born, on the sixth day that they were on this earth, we brought them to this county. That street right outside that door, and the street right behind me, is the streets that I taught them how to ride their bikes on. If you dialed back eight years ago, some of you might have remembered seeing me running up and down the street holding the back of their seat while they were hooting and hollering. I can tell you, I’m still exhausted from it right now.

I understand the calmness and the tranquility of this town. And I want to protect it, not undermine it. Like you, I take my trash to the recycling center every week. Before that, when I had a house down 522, I’d be at the Scrabble dump and you’d see me down there, okay? I was called, in that piece in the paper, a “reclusive weekender.” Okay? I’ve had an account at the farmer’s co­op for 20 years. I used to go in there religiously to listen to a very smart man named Mr. Thornhill that used to be able to tell me how I could make my hay grow taller and take care of my place. Now Michael’s doing a great job over there. The Thornhill family — David and Barrigan and their kids — are among my wife’s and mine’s closest friends. My children were in their weddings — their two kids’ weddings.

I’ve been to people’s funerals in this county. I’ve been to their weddings, I’ve been with them at their lowest points and their highest points. I am part of this community. But I do not stand before you and pose

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and act like my heritage is from the state of Virginia or that I have relatives that go back to the 1730s — because they don’t. And I’m upfront about that. But I love this county and I love this town.

Now, I have some pictures here, on a PowerPoint. We can go through or we can blow it off; it’s up to you. But the reason I brought this PowerPoint was to allow you to see every property in this town that I am personally involved with, as well as the properties that I have inspired friends, who I love dearly, to invest in this town. And I will tell you what is gonna happen — maybe, maybe not — or what we’re thinking, or God forbid I use the phrase “what my vision is” for each one of these properties. But I’m happy to share that with you. There’s no conspiracy, there’s nobody hiding in a back room, there’s no deals being cut — anywhere.

I have followed the rule of the law in this town, and I have followed the comp plan to the letter, and my intention here — I think you will see — is good. Now I can walk you through — it won’t take that long, if you want me to go house to house, property to property and walk you through it. (applause) You got that laser pointer?

Before we get, get started on this, I do wanna say a couple things about your town and the people that, uh, donate their time here. I, uh, I go through a lot of zoning meetings in the big Washington, I go to a lot of community meetings and I meet with a lot of people that are in the hierarchy of that city and I can tell you that what you have here in this town are some of the most ethical, well­spoken, thoughtful volunteers that are protecting the best interests of, not only this county, but this town. And you’re very fortunate to have them.

And I can also tell you this: Uh, this man here, who’s been around 28 years is probably the most talented zoning administrator you’ll find in the state of Virginia, in my opinion. (applause) All right, I’m gonna . . . shall I get on the floor and let you guys all see? Okay, there is, that is a house, I think it’s called 90 Main Street. Can you guys see that?

That’s not the Pullen House — Purnell House, thank you. So, so my friend Jeff Akseizer, who you’ve probably read a little bit about — he was mentioned in the article too, and Jeff if you’d be kind enough to just get up and wave to everybody here. Jeff is a dear, dear, close friend. He is called “Uncle Jeff” in our house. Jeff spends a lot of time at our place out in Rock Mills, fell in love with the county, just like a lot of you in this room have. And he wanted to be out here. He recognized what this county could mean for him and his life and he, uh, purchased this house.

Go ahead, keep going. Now, the house isn’t in great shape. I went over there with my tractor and bushhogged and helped them clear out some fields that had never been mowed in years and we’ve got some — a lot of a repair of work to do. And I can tell you, from, uh, seeing Jeff’s personal residence in town, uh, and his attention to detail, that this is a house that he plans to restore and property that he plans to restore. Go to the next one.

This is the land next door to that house.

Unknown: I’m sorry, did you just say he plans to restore the house and do what with it?

JA: Oh, I’m sorry, that’s a very good question. What does he plan to do with it? Jeff, my understanding is that you’re gonna live in that house.

Jeff: I’m gonna relax there.

JA: You’re gonna relax there. He’s gonna relax there and he’s gonna look his window at one of the most

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beautiful farms in the county — Ginger Hill — and he’s gonna just think, “Why would I ever go back to the city?” That’s what he’s gonna do, because that’s what I do at my house. He then bought the land right next door. Um, you can go to the next one.

Lot of trash, inside and outside that he’s been putting in dumpsters. And Jeff did this, which was interesting — go to the next one — he painted that little house, just because he didn’t like the color of the brick. And the irony of all that is he’s gonna tear this house down. Okay? This is a non­contributing, non­historic structure. It’s not in the historic district to the best of my knowledge, it’s just not a contributing structure. “Why is it stopped? Why is all that work out there stopped? It looks terrible!” Well it’s stopped because he’s working with the Army Corps of Engineers right now to determine if there are wetlands and where they are on that property before he tears down the building. He’s been working very close with Richie Burke throughout the process here and that building, ultimately, will come down.

Now the question is, “What’s he gonna do with it?” Well, I’ll tell you. Nothing. He’s gonna have a field next to his house. He might put some goats on it, he might put a little bit of livestock, but he just wants green, open grass to connect to his house. You’ll probably see some new board fencing running down there, but other than that . . . Have I missed anything? That’s it. All right? Those two properties — we’re done. Let’s keep going.

This, this is a cool building. I fell in love with this building, I wanted this building but I helped one of my dearest friends in the world acquire this. And Alex Sharp and his wife were very kind in this transaction. Because this transaction wasn’t about money, wasn’t about getting rich — in fact, none of this is. Uh, this was a transaction that was about emotions, and was about new beginnings. Debbie Windsor, who is seated right here, was a widow. She’s a recent widow. She has three daughters. Her husband, Kurt, was my best friend. Debbie has been through a very difficult year and a half. Kurt was 49 when he died — about, well, just before Christmas a year and a half ago.

Debbie has not had a lot to look forward to of late, she’s been through a very tough period. She came out and spent time out in Rappahannock. We all know how renewing this place can be, for all of us. And it was for her too. She started talking to me about some of my ideas — my “vision” for what could be in this town. And she liked it, and she wanted to be a part of it. And I helped put this deal together for someone I love. And what she’s doing there, I think, is quite nice.

Debbie is a designer, she designs her own furniture. She had a store in upper Georgetown called “August George.” You can write it down, you can Google it, you can go to the website. She makes furniture, she sources furniture. She’s very talented, and she’s an interior designer. She’s been published in a variety of magazines. She just wants to set up a design store in that building. That’s all she wants to do. And she wants to be able to come back and forth and meet with people — maybe from the county, maybe not — maybe visitors from the Inn at Little Washington that have lots of money. Whatever, She’s opening a small business on your Main Street. Next.

There’s the building from the side, and she’s restoring it fully. But she didn’t just get that — we got her into this, too. That’s the house next door. You can see the work that’s taking place there now. What’s Debbie gonna do with that house? Well, she’s got three daughters. She wants to be able to come out to the country, she wants to be able to relax. They’re gonna stay in this house from time to time, and when they’re not staying in that house, to help supplement her income, this house will be part of the White Moose Inn’s hospitality portfolio. As a tourist house, so other people can come and enjoy this county and add to the tax base of this town. That’s it. That’s what’s happening with those two buildings. Next.

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A­ha. This. I think John Sullivan talked about buildings that have been vacant for — how many years? 10? 15? I don’t know. Someone in here knows. Been a while, right? All right, this building, I bought this building because I fell in love with it. And I actually bought because I heard someone was contemplating buying it and knocking it down. And what I was told was, “Absolutely you can knock it down! Who the hell would want this building?” I want this building! This building, yeah I know it had three, two stories on top of it. I know this is only one­third of what was built in the 1830s, but guess what? That’s real, historic fabric. That building tells a story of the history of this town. And it should be saved, not put in a dumpster. Okay? So I bought it.

I didn’t know what I was gonna do it, didn’t have a clue what I was gonna do with it, but I knew that just having it thrown away was a mistake. Let’s look at it a little bit. Next. You know, it’s a little funky, it’s weird but actually I like this building a lot. Not in great shape, things are kinda falling apart. I guess it was a museum or something like that at one point. Um, I love this: This is an old, what’s left of an old stone fireplace that was in the building. On the building. Great stone foundation around part of it. Anyhow, there’s a small restaurant — and it’s all gonna come back, gimme a second — there’s a small restaurant in Washington, D.C., ranked number 13 in Washingtonian out of 100 restaurants. It’s owned by a young man, 32­years­old, that was raised on a 500­acre farm. Farm boy, just like some of us. Sort of. Kind of like a hybrid farm boy.

This guy’s a real farm boy. Loves the country. Worked in the city, built himself this little tiny restaurant, seats 16 people — ranked number 13 out of 100 restaurants in the city . . . What’s his concept? His concept is farm to table, but not as a cliche — really farm­to­table. And the restaurant isn’t just a restaurant, it’s a little store. It’s called Seasonal Pantry. I invite you to Google it, go online and see it. This is a man that is so creative, he takes locally sourced vegetables, fruits, anything you can imagine that comes from local farms, and he makes brilliant things out of them. And he cans them, and he jars them and people come into his little store and they buy it, and it’s all healthy. And it’s all created right there. And guess what? He wants to do that right here. Here!

He came out for a guest chef dinner that we did at the White Moose Inn, cooked for 12 people, a 10­course meal, and I said to him, I said, “God I’d love to have you out here.” And he said, “Man I’d love to be out here.” And I said, “Pick a building. Pick a building from what I have. If you tell me that you will come out here, if you will leave 9th Street, across from the Washington convention center, and move to this town, to this Main Street, I’ll build it for you.” And he said, “Yes, I will. I’m gonna do this.”

And I said, “Well what building do you want?” I took him to some others that I thought, you know, he’d jump on, and he saw that and that’s the one he wanted. And I knew I loved the guy when he did that. Go to the next picture please.

That’s Dan O’Brien. Dan O’Brien is somewhere . . . Figures my wife is sitting next to him, he’s 32 years old. Dan O’Brien, right here. Seasonal Pantry. That building — we want it to be that. We want you to be able to come in, have dinner that’s locally sourced — all from local farms — from this county. Okay? We want him to be able to ship this product anywhere in the world and have people see it as from Washington, Va., with pride. We want him to hire people. We want him to add to the town’s tax base, right? Isn’t that how it works here? What is it, uh, 200 percent and it’s taxing on lodges and it’s taxes on meals. It’s right in the comp plan; this is right in the strike zone. This is exactly what your comp plan is asking for — adaptive reuse, historic preservation, jobs adding to the tax base, diversifying the tax base, saving old buildings and bringing new residents here.

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Heck, this guy’s 32 years old. The inn manager at the White Moose, she’s a young woman, she’s sitting right here. Sarah. She’s engaged. She and her husband have already put property under contract on Piedmont. There might be children. (laughter/applause) Right? Oh my God, let’s think about that. You know, in 1990 the census figures had 33 children between the ages of 5 and 17 in this town. You heard the mayor. The 2010 census, there were six. Children, running around Little Washington. That’s change. Oh my gosh, that’s change! Well, you know what? I like that. All right, Seasonal Pantry. What else?

Look at this. Love this building. I wanted it, but, Jeff, he’s a lot bigger than me, he said, “No, no Jim. Move outta the way. That’s right down my alley.” The old packing shed, right? Go ahead. Not in great condition. Just sort of, like a lot of these other buildings, eroding before people’s eyes. Go ahead. I mean, you’ve got some real structural issues going on here. Should we just forget about it? “No change! Just let it go.” No, we shouldn’t. We should save buildings like this. These kinds of buildings tell a story about a town’s history. We brought in our structural engineer, we went through this things completely. Jeff . . . Go to the next one. He doesn’t know what he’s gonna do with this building yet. He doesn’t know. But I’ll tell you what he will do: He’ll follow the comp plan. He’ll reach out to the community, he’ll be in front of the ARB, he’ll talk to people and he’ll do the right thing. And slowly, even though he doesn’t know what he’s gonna do yet, this building is being protected and it’s been brought back. Go ahead, go ahead.

Oh yeah. And then there’s some buildings in town, well, they’re not what I would consider historic or contributing but adaptive reuse looks beyond. What can this be? I bought this building and I read the comp plan. And there were some comments in the comp plan about these 1950s structures on Main Street that said, “Gosh it would be nice, it would be nice if we could do something about the flatness of the roofs on these buildings.” And I talked to my neighbor next door, to Jackie, who has the spa, and she said, “Jim, what would you do with this building?” And I said, “You know what I’d do, Jackie? I’d put dormers on top of it and I’d put a metal roof on the building and I’d put a proper parking pad here that doesn’t look like that. And I’d actually try and discourage people from parking in the front of the building.”

Well, she did a lot of the things that I suggested; it’s her building, she can do whatever she wants with it. But I think it looks pretty darn good. So now we got this building here. What are we gonna do with it? Let’s look at it a little bit. You know, it’s showing some age. Well, for visitors that have checked into the White Moose Inn, they found that what we do, because I’m not, I am not a great chef, and there’s some great chefs cooking at some great B&Bs in this town. Foster Harris House? Phenomenal. And I'm dying to go there for dinner because I hear it’s amazing. But that’s not me.

So, we are serving Red Truck Bakery food, uh, at our inn. I’m a huge fan of Brian Noyes, who’s here in the audience tonight. Brian, can you just . . . ? (applause) He’s a good man, he’s a great person and he is an amazing baker. And you know, I don’t like driving 40 miles round trip to get a great pie if I’m living right here in Rappahannock County. Why can’t I have it right here on Main Street? Why can’t I meet my neighbors right here on Main Street and hang out —

Audience: (Dissatisfied mumblings) You can! Sperryville has pies.

JA: What’s that?

Audience: Go to Sperryville! (other mumblings)

JA: Okay, okay, that’s fine. I like his. I like a fresh one right out of the oven. How’s that? Is that okay? I like a fresh pie, from him —

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Ben Jones: We got ‘em!

JA: Okay, that’s cool. That’s fine. That’s fine. So let’s, so let’s look at what we’re talking about here. because maybe, what you can do, maybe what you can do here tonight is convince Brian not to come. You can do that. You’re entitled to. This is what we’re looking to do — we’re looking to add some, uh, some dimension to the upper part of the, of the building. Go to the next one. It’s gonna have 18 seats in here. We’re gonna discourage parking in the front, we’re gonna have tables and chairs out front. And the nice thing about this, and I’ll be done shortly, is we, we are gonna have the ability for him to hire people to bake here. Not in Warrenton, but here. Permanent jobs. Here.

This guy does 4,000 deliveries out of his facility a year and has to shut down before Christmas because he can’t keep up with demand. Those are real jobs, those are jobs that are happening right around Christmas time for people that can live in this county. Go ahead. And there he is. Go ahead.

All right. Pullen House, that’s what we call it. Bought this from Bill Pullen. This took, this was a long deal to get done. We did this together at the, uh, the Country Cafe over many cups of coffee, and, uh. we finally got this one done. Don’t know what I’m doing with this property. Right now our employees are living in this property. This property was deteriorating pretty bad. We’ve cleaned up the yard, we’re gonna clean it up more. We’re gonna paint it, we’ve painted the roof already. We brought this property online with the sewer system, brought $15,000 through this transaction of purchasing it to, to the town sewer system. It’s gonna be coming back online. Don’t know what it’s gonna be, but we’ll be — you’ll all be involved in that process. Go ahead. Go ahead. Go ahead.

BJ: Good.

JA: Department of Transportation. Yes, I bought that with a couple of friends. Jeff’s one of them. Now why the hell did I buy that? What am I up to? High rise? Casino? (laughter) Uh, strip club?! No. Sorry. I don’t know. But what I do know is that I actually read the comp plan. And the comp plan talks about the importance of the entryways coming into this town. Okay? And how they need to be maintained and preserved. So I don’t know what to do with this. But I do know I’m gonna talk to people like our county administrator, zoning administrator, our mayor, you, our town council and we’ll figure this out. Go to the next one. Not in great shape. I’ve had people call me wanting to put all kinds of stuff on this property. No. We’re gonna wait. We’re gonna figure this out together. Go ahead. You can right through the property is a beautiful new property being built right down there, right th — a stone’s throw away. Should this property be annexed? Does the city have a use for it? I don’t know. But we’re here to help with this property and make sure the right thing is done with it. Go ahead.

Last but not least, we’re coming back and then I’m done. This is, uh, what was the Heritage House when I bought it. Gary and Michelle, lovely people, great neighbors, I admire them tremendously. I think Gary would be the first one to tell ya, they closed this down for their own reasons, it started to go into disrepair, we bought it — go ahead. We took it apart. It didn’t look like — go ahead — didn’t look like mu. . . Well there’s some good local plumbing, from a local contractor. Father and son. Go ahead. We started taking the whole place apart; the more we took it apart, the more we needed — more we realized we had to just gut the whole thing. But when we were done, we created something that we thought was pretty special. Keep going. Keep going. Keep going. This is standing in the same spot here. Okay, next shot. Okay. So, this is, uh, I can’t remember, it’s either called the Mexican Cathouse or it’s the White Moose Inn. Anyhow, it doesn’t matter, it’s one of those two. But I can tell you that that building, that building was built — with me, side­by­side — with all local sub­contractors. Every one of them. Jobs, here in this town,

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adding to the tax base. And, every one of these contractors — plumbing, electrician, mechanical, tree guy, excavator, you name it. They all live right here in this county, and they are all very excited about the next buildings. And they were proud of this Mexican cathouse. I think we have the finest Mexican cathouse in the state of Virginia. Thank you.

(scattered applause)

RP: Thank you, Jim. Before I start carrying this microphone around the audience, which is what I’m gonna do — and in most cases, I’m not gonna let go of the microphone, so just be aware. (laughter) Before I do, I think we just saw an example of someone who is very enthusiastic, committed and involved in their work. I am very enthusiastic, committed and involved in getting people to understand each other, so I just wanted to say that before I came out here to see if anybody — (applause) — wants to . . . Hands. Hands, anybody? Questions, comments? Sharon? No, I’m just gonna hand it.

Sharon Kilpatrick: I’m Sharon Kilpatrick, I’ve lived in Slate Mills since Christmas of 1999, and for most of my time there I hoped to sell my house and move to Washington, Va. But I couldn’t keep up with the inflation and the real estate prices in Washington. I’ve lived in Rappahanock for 40 years, full time, and part time for 13 years before that. I’m definitely a “come here,” but I’ve been here a while. The Town of Washington has plenty of life, and plenty of pulse, but too few people. I’ve known Patrick O’Connell since he and Reinhardt were yard boys for my in­laws, then bartenders, then caterers. I am in awe of what they have accomplished with the Inn. But they are part of the reason too few people — former residences converted to business.

First, the Allmon house and the Sisk house, then the Eldred house. I remember when seven people were living there; there are no residents there now. It’s not just the Inn, specifically, residences are being converted to businesses. So now we have a town of real estate offices, B&Bs, lawyers, with some good food, theatre — but far too few residents. The Rapp News building being converted to a bakery — I’m all for that. But notice where the Rapp News has gone; that was a residence, now it isn’t. You’ve had a chance to reverse that with a proposal from People Inc., which was rejected — a clear message that only rich folk are welcome, not those less well off. (applause) That is a disastrous message. Your job, Mr. Mayor, and those members of the town council who are here, is to find a way to increase the availability of residential property. If we’re turning residences into businesses, then we need more residences. And not just for the super rich. (applause)

RP: Thank you.

JA: Can we respond to that or not?

BJ: No.

Unknown: Just wait till the end.

RP: If someone doesn’t just ask a question, I think we can wait until the end, if you wanna speak again. Was that the timer?

Brian Noyes: Hello, I’m Brian Noyes. I need a little light. Um, years ago I started peddling my pies, breads and granola from my old Red Truck at the E­Cow, at the Corner Store and at Ballard’s. I baked everything myself in my farmhouse 20 minutes from here, using only local seasonal fruit from Rappahannock and nearby areas. When customers lined up long before I arrived, I knew I had to make this a full time deal. The Red Truck Bakery’s first home was supposed to be here in Little Washington

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after the late Claudia Mitchell made me promise to consider her town. And she and I looked at many sites, but the lack of sewers then were a hindrance.

The economy crashed and the few potentials . . . few potential investors had parted, leading me to do this on my own. I needed a place where I could make this work quickly and settled on a gas station in Old Town Warrenton. It enabled us to get our feet wet, become friends with the local farmers, set up an online commerce site and, uh, earn a loyal following. It hasn’t been easy in a crappy economy, but I think we’re doing a great job. Customers like a hangout to enjoy our baked goods and our coffee, and church groups show up each week for meetings around our table. Our little rural bakery has been named one of America’s 50 best bakeries and named one of the 30 places in Virginia to eat before you die. We love that one. (laughter) And this year and last we were voted the best bakery in Virginia by Virginia Magazine readers. We’ve long outgrown our house and we look, uh, we’re looking for more room to bake, to sell and ship, while still keeping the Warrenton store to honor my commitment to my customers there. I still love Little Washington as a location, even after Fauquier boosters tried to find sites in the northern end of the county for us to move to.

Over the years I’ve looked at eight buildings here, with the help of Ken Thompson, Mary Thompson, Butch Zindel, John Sullivan, Gene Goodine, Nancy Raines and the Leggett family, and none of those panned out. Jim Abdo stopped by the bakery a while back and introduced himself and told me that he’d love to have the Red Truck here in this town. I told him I wasn’t interested in duplicating what we had going there. I needed a place with more room. I didn’t know this guy but I was aware of his D.C. work and I became intrigued by his enthusiasm. While walking Main Street here with him, I asked why was he doing this? And he told me he simply wanted to give back to the town. I told Abdo I was interested. I worked for a decade at the National Trust for Historic Preservations, so I get the importance of not disturbing this small village’s historic fabric. I like the idea of the old Rapp News building as the bakery’s new home . . . (timer alarm going off) In a second. I grew up in a newspaper family, my dad was a publisher (discontented murmuring), I hung out at the paper with him after school and I spent 10 years at the Washington Post before launching the bakery. Reaction from the Rappahannock customers about a move here has been great. My staff is excited. And I’ve got, uh, I’m glad to be closer to the farmers and orchards we rely on each day to supply us. I’ve supported from the beginning, I’ve never turned down a request for a donation, including those from the Rapp Farm Tour, the Belle Meade school, the CCLC and the Food Pantry. And we want to continue to be your good neighbor. Most of you know our bakery as a place that serves all the people in the community and that’s what I want to do when we move here. Thanks very much for your support. (applause)

RP: I think your muffins are done. (laughter) Uh, does anyone . . . Hands? Um, any other comments? Upstairs? I can climb. Demaris?

Demaris Miller: Thank you, gentlemen, for being here. Thank you all for being so interested in the community. I’m Demaris Miller. We still own 525 Main Street, though Jim and I moved out five years ago five miles away to an accessible “forever home,” and now it’s occupied by a wonderful family with two children. (applause) And we want it to stay that way, but we would to see more residents in the town. When we were . . . When we saw that article, we were deeply, deeply offended. And I think that was, on your part, Mr. Abdo, an unforced error. Then when we saw the White Moose being built, we thought, “That was great!” I said, “You know, this guy really wants to do something a little unique to attract people. Okay, so the yellow door’s a little silly, but, uh, (laughter) if it attracts his customers, that’s great.

I had no idea what was going on in the background, and I say I’ve seen this movie before. I remember when Rae’s Place, a wonderful little delicatessen was essentially put out of business forever by someone

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who had grand ideas that didn’t last. We have in this town . . . This town is not an island, it is part of a greater ecosystem of the county. We have Merry Moo Market that could easily be put out of business by some of this. We have the Triple Oak Bakery that could easily be put of business by some of this. We have other businesses that are going to be challenged by what is going on by someone with deep pockets in this town. That would be probably okay, because I do believe in free enterprise, but my fear is that, in the end, these people will find they can’t make the big bucks here in town and they will leave too, and we’ll be worse off than before. Please, Mr. Abdo, in the future, involve the community before you make these grand plans. I think you have some good ideas, I’d love to see some of the improvements — I’m a little questionable about that painting the white on the packing shed. But, but I want to see more families in Washington and it’s not going to happen until this town wants to see families instead of rich people from town coming out to enjoy. (scattered applause) One other point: I am very disturbed by something that is not your fault, at least not directly. I like Stonyman, I think it’s a great business (applause), it’s in a great location and they are being driven out of town. Thank you.

BJ: Hey Roger. I’m Ben Jones. Uh . . . Getting up here Alma just said, ‘Be sweet.’ I didn’t know I was coming to the Jim Abdo Show. (scattered laughter) Eh, you know — three stars, maybe. I’ve played this house a lot; it’s a great theatre, a fabulous theatre. And, uh, we got the right acoustics, we don’t really need these mics. If I could have a few minutes. I was told that this event was going to be where you guys spoke for three minutes and each of us spoke for three minutes. What we got instead was a, uh, PowerPoint presentation telling us how grateful we should be for all you’re doing. (scattered applause) I don’t know how we made it all this time without you, Jim! Let me ask you something, Jim. I’m gonna make a few comments and ask a couple of questions that you don’t need to answer — just so you’ll ruminate on ‘em, meditate on ‘em. Contemplate on ‘em.

I, uh . . . You know . . . It, uh . . . A guy like you, it reminds me of a guy who was being tarred and feathered and run out of town on a rail. And he said, “You know, if it weren’t for the honor of the thing, I’d just as soon walk.” (laughter) Uh, John Sullivan — our relationship is strained. Let’s be honest, buddy. This is a small town, everybody knows everybody and this has really torn some people apart. Unnecessarily, Mr. Abdo. Unnecessarily. That’s the worst scar here, is what has happened to our community. We all know each other, we all love each other, got along great. But your style, sir, is different from most folks here. Most folks who can’t eat at the Inn, or your White Moose Inn. Or any of these other places, maybe. And you took me out . . . He . . . I’m the guy that said he was a recluse. I read that you wrote, you said that in the Washington Post. And in the New York Times! “I just come out here and do nothin’! I just lay out here on the farm, look at the Blue Ridge mountains.” Right? (pause, unintelligible) You didn’t say that?

JA: I don’t remember saying that.

BJ: Oh, okay then. Well, that’s where I read it. That’s, that’s the Washington Post, about two weeks ago. Uh, let me ask you something: Do you still think we don’t have a pulse? (laughter, applause) Uh, I had some good ones here, but I’m gonna speed it up. I think we, uh, some of you have done your preliminary impact studies to see how all that you’re doing is going to possibly even negatively affect some of us. We got a lecture and a sermon about how, how grateful we should be for all the passion you’re putting into this. But most of us — maybe half of us, I’d say half of us — were just gettin’ along fine without you, Jim. Uh . . . Oh, by the way. You said how, uh, that was just sort of — you apologized for saying that stuff about us being vacant and empty and hollow and not having a pulse. How you’re come to elevate us, and you were gonna use these, uh, create these corridors using the, you know, a catalyst and leverage and all that stuff. Well, did you know that right now, on your website — White Moose Inn, y’all can punch it up if you want to, it says, “D.C. developer Jim Abdo is the mastermind behind a plan to transform the quiet,

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postage stamp­sized town into a buzz — buzzing gateway for visitors from D.C. and the suburbs.” Quite different from what you laid out, but it’s on your website. No, I’m — wait a minute, I didn’t interrupt you.

JA: Who wrote it? What document are you speaking of? (alarm goes off)

BJ: It’s from the Washington Post.

JA: There ya go.

BJ: You put it on a website!

JA: Sure! I’ve been on your website. (laughter)

RP: Okay, calm down.

BJ: Well you can’t have it both ways here, brother.

JA: That’s right. Whoop­dee­do.

BJ: My time up?

Unidentified: Yes.

BJ: Well I ask the right to revise the extent of my remarks. (laughter, applause) Says here, “Abdo may be leading the charges coming to the small town formerly called, uh, Little Washington.” People from here don’t call it that. “But the nascent transformation is far from a one­man affair. Meet some of the other people behind the small town with big things in store.” Brian Noyes, we met him. Daniel O’Brien, Patrick O’Connell — we know him. And John Fox Sullivan! All right, Johnny. Ya got it in the big time now.

Unidentified: That’s not necessary.

BJ: What wasn’t necessary? Kidding John? (alarm goes off again)

Unidentified: No, your rhetoric.

BJ: The rhetoric?

Unidentified: Yeah.

BJ: Okay.

Judd Swift: I wanna second that. It’s not —

BJ: Thank you Judd!

JS: (unintelligible) . . . buddy. But I wanna second that —

BJ: Okay.

JS: You’re out of line.

BJ: Let me tell you: I apologize, then.

JS: You ought to.

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Unidentified: That’s right.

BJ: Well I just did, Judd!

JS: Well thank you!

BJ: You’re welcome!

Audience: (murmuring) Sit down! Sit down!

BJ: I’m upset. I’m upset, this has made me upset. Roger said we had to come here at five o’clock, lot of people couldn’t come — they couldn’t have got in here anyway. I don’t know whose time we’re accommodating. He told me we were each gonna have three minutes to talk, including John and, uh, and, uh, Jim. But, uh, that isn’t what happened. That is not what happened. I’ve been here and listened to this, and listened to this and listened to this about how wonderful this thing is. And I ain’t buying it. I’m just not. I’m sorry, John, if I made fun of ya. But, uh, we could do this at my house or your house —

Audience: Sit down.

BJ: But in here it’s inappropriate. But there’s been a lot of other things inappropriate about this whole business. We’re being presented with a fait accompli. Thank ya, sir. (applause)

JA: I just wanna talk about what he said —

Audience: (murmuring)

RP: Can you guys identify yourselves when you speak?

Bill Walton: Um, I just wanna respond to Mr. Jones —

Audience: Identify yourself.

BW: Uh, my name’s Bill Walton, I live in Harris Hollow. I live about a mile from, uh, uh, Mr. Jones, and we bought the house that, uh, that Dick and Katherine Bull sold to us. We’re full­time residents. We, uh, intend to be here forever. But sir, I don’t find your ad hominem remarks about people at all appropriate. You did not offer a, uh, an alternative plan, and I don’t know what it is you saw in any one of these buildings that was so, uh, so exceptionally bad. (applause)

Bill Walton’s wife: And sir, I would like to ask you, do you have a German shepard puppy?

Audience: (murmuring)

Wife: Ben Jones?

Audience: Why do you ask that?

RP: Sorry but that, uh, that really doesn’t have a place here —

Wife: It’s appropriate if he has one.

Alma Viator: No we don’t.

Audience: (lots of murmuring; someone “shushes” everyone else)

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Fran Krebser: My name is Fran Krebser, I live in Wakefield district. And I’ve been listening to all this, and reading all this on Rappnet and The Post and everything else that’s been published, and frankly I’m disappointed in some of the unhappy, nasty comments I’ve heard. And read. But in listening to the presentation that just came through Mr. Abdo, I like the fact that we would have more business here in the town. We need more business in this community. I work at the public schools, and I helped try and find jobs for students through CTE classes. We have no place that we can send kids to learn about trades, because the businesses are so small. We also do need a place for people to live in the town, and that’s another problem altogether. But I really do think that the intent of Mr. Abdo is to get good some business here and to keep our community viable. I don’t know this man at all. But I know that my husband, who was part of this community for many, many years, was involved in the planning of keeping the small village concept and keeping that viable, to maintain our open space in this county. And we need to do that. And I think, while it needs some work, there’s a good part of a plan here that we can start to build on. Thank you. (applause)

Bill Fletcher: My name is Bill Fletcher, and I think I can say I’m a native.

Audience: (agrees, someone shouts “Yeah!”)

BF: And I’ve seen a lot of people come and go over the years, as has Jenks and some others of you. Mr. Abdo is exercising his rights as a capitalist. It looks to me like he’s doing a good job. He had an unfortunate statement to the Washington, uh, “Misprint Post.” I’ve had the opportunity to deal with them on several occasions, and I cancelled my subscription there over 30 years ago. (laughter) Uh, they said there was a clan of, uh, “devil worshippers” down F.T. Valley, and that they came in their helicopter down to Montpelier and they wrecked their trucks, and we helped them get out and of everybody that was out there, only Channel 7 News reported something close to accurate. I don’t necessarily believe what The Washington Post says, um, and I’m not trying to insult you now, Mr. Abdo. I’m gonna tell you a story I read in a magazine, a little picture book called “Rural Virginia.” There used to be a country store in Etland, right past O.J. Weaver’s, um, welding shop. And there was a picture in there of the store, and it told a little story. And this guy in a big Cadillac from New York or Washington, D.C. drove in there and asked for a Coke and a pack of nabs. And he looked at this fella, who’s probably kin to some of the people in this room, he said, “How do you make a living out here? It’s so damn poor and all!” And the guy there says, “Well I make a living off damn fools like you!” (laughter)

Uh, this county needs more business. It needs more building, it needs more local tradesmen supply, uh, given business. The county’s decreased in population since 1860. Uh, and that’s — the county lost a third of it to the park in the 30s, when the park came up and stole the land. I’ve seen carpetbaggers from the north, the south and in Rappahannock here in my lifetime. And I don’t think Mr. Abdo’s doing anything except exercising his constitutional right. Uh, on March 30 — I mean Sept. 30, there’s gonna be a play here that I advise everyone to come to watch: “Much Ado About Nothing.” (laughter, applause) Thank you.

Patty Hardee: Hi I’m Patty Hardee, my husband and I live in Flint Hill — well, we live in Flint Hill’s suburban sprawl, we’re on Ben Venue Road. Anyway, I just wanted to say that there’s also a segment of the population that is served by some of the nonprofit organizations, folks who I suspect are not well­represented here tonight — maybe people who need the Food Pantry, or who rely on senior services or other kinds of things. And while I think a lot of your plans sound really exciting, Mr. Abdo, I hope that there’s also some plan to help support some of the nonprofits, whether it’s for folks who are less fortunate, or if it’s for the environmental organizations here, or, you know, some of the others. One organization —

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I’ll put in a plug — one organization that I’m involved with, the RAAC Community Theatre, which is right across the street (applause). And we have seen our audience grow and grow and grow over the last few years, and it’s been very gratifying. And, um, all of the performance opportunities here are just growing other grassroots performance opportunities. There’s another performance venue here that’s started up in the county, there are other people talking about doing things, so I’d also like to see that the arts would be well­represented and well­supported by the folks that come into the area. (applause) So, thank you for sharing your plans, I have been wondering what the buildings were.

RP: Before I get to Molly, I think I should apologize for the heat and the air­conditioning here, and also that we are here at 5, and not at 7, which is when we’d really like to do these in the future. So, I’m sorry. And, you’re Molly.

Molly Peterson: I am. Hi, I’m Molly Peterson, my husband and I, Mike, upstairs, we live in Sperryville, we’ve lived in Rappahannock for six years. Before we moved to Rappahannock County, we were in Colorado. I can say right now, we’re 30 years old, when we lived in Colorado, we were on the government affordable housing list, to get in a tiny little community, for two years — without a call. They called the week we moved to Rappahannock County and said, “We have a house for you,” and I said, “Well, great, too late.” That community, we were totally pushed out of the market. I get that we were young, but we were pushed out of the market. So, being here, I love this county. I have felt so supported, and I’m so amazed by all of the small business owners, and the artisans, and the arts . . . we’ve been completely held up.

We own two small businesses in the county, we own a farm store, and I’m a photographer. So my hope is that, as the county grows, as it will — it kinda needs to, to some degree, right, I hope we can all agree on that — that the intentions stay pure. And that it does allow people of our age group to come in, ‘cause I gotta tell ya, there aren’t a whole lot in our age group around here. (laughter) And I realize we work a lot and don’t have a whole lot of time to socialize, but — so my hope is that everyone can please stand together with the hope and honest pure intention, that we can all continue to live here, and stay here, and grow our families here, and have our businesses here. Because it isn’t — no, it isn’t always easy. But we do pay our taxes, and we open our doors, because we like being here. So, that’s just kinda my spiel, as a young business owner here. I hope that it continues to grow in a positive way. I also hope at the same time, maybe someday we’ll be able to afford to buy land here. Because at this point in time, we’re still priced out of the market. But I hope that we aren’t pushed out, eventually, as we were in Colorado. (applause)

RP: Oh, it’s pouring rain, and if you have a blue Toyota Corolla, with a green sticker on the back, you’re not going to be happy, but you better get outside soon. (laughter) Windows open.

Michael Mahoney: My name is Mike Mahoney, I live in the Hampton district, and my comments are directed to Brian Noyes. If it is really true, sir, that you cannot die before you eat at the Red Truck Bakery . . . I am not going to. (laughter, applause)

Brian Noyes: My only response to that line is, it wouldn’t kill you to buy a pastry.

RP: Okay.

Henry Gorfein: Hi, my name is Henry Gorfein, I live down in Harris Hollow, Mr. Walton and I actually share a common driveway . . . except his road’s in a lot better shape than mine. The question I have is actually for Mr. McCarthy and, or Mr. Welch. Um, I keep hearing about how this town will grow and prosper for this. But it seems to me, and I don’t maybe understand it, that the major source of revenue

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comes from the B&B tax, which the county does not share, from the town. They do get property tax. And I’m wondering if these businesses will put a strain on county services. In other words, will we need more police, more sheriffs, will we need more, uh, services as far as the uh, rescue squad goes, and stuff like that? And also, uh, you know, I think you all know my wife was on the school board, I’m a great believer in the school system, and we’re hearing children, children, children. I think that’s great. But we know now, of course about $12,000 or something like that, per kid, or $10,000 or $11,000, to put them through one grade here. And, you know, who’s going to pay for that? Are these businesses going to generate enough money so the other taxpayers in the county, who live next to the town, or near the town, are not basically subsidizing these businesses? You know? That’s the question I have. And I don’t know if you can even answer, but are there any projections on that?

Roger Welch: I’m glad I got the mic, been trying to hold back for a long time. But, uh, as far as the county’s concerned, any increase in business and increase in population is obviously gonna services needed. As far as police is concerned, well you know we just opened a brand new jail in Warren County, so we’ll have room for some of these people. (laughter) But the answer to your question is simply yes.

John McCarthy: Um, I guess what I’d say is that the net effect of the meals and lodging tax — the first part of comment was about whether the town’s revenue preempts the county — and of course, yes, the town will get the benefit of the meals and lodging tax, but there’s sales tax on top of that and the county gets a percentage of that. There’s one percent that stays locally, and there’s one percent that comes back in the form of state aid for kids. Um, none of the businesses that have been talked about here are likely, in and of themselves, to generate population growth, except inasmuch as they will have service workers who are there. They . . . Those families may have kids, as witnessed Jim’s talking about his, uh, White Moose Inn manager whose husband and she have bought a house and they may start a family and that — that was a big applause line at the front end of this meeting, and it may be a, uh, a down line later — but the net effect of school population . . . The uh, the net effect of school population is we’ve had a declining school enrollment for the last 15 years. We can stand to have more. And I really think we need to have more in town. And while I was gonna say something at the end, I wanna adopt the Rama manual, “never let a crisis go unexploited” logic and toss in now (laughter) by saying that, as a regulator, it’s irrelevant to me whether it’s 10 people buying 10 different properties, or one person buying 10 properties. The rules are gonna be the rules, no matter which way that shakes out. As a planner, my concern is, looking at the town’s future. Patrick, God love him, is sixty — 67 years old?

Audience: 68

JM: All right. I was gonna be generous but . . . Is 67 years young and presumably doesn’t intend to live forever, unlike non­eaters at the [Red Truck] Bakery. (laughter) Um, the practical reality is it’s a company town in many ways. (murmurs of assent, some applause) When the mill closes down in company towns, bad things happen. Just as you invest in a bunch of different stocks if you’re fortunate enough to have money in them, rather than the one stock you think is gonna bring the most money because that one might go south, diversity is good, for the tax base. As a planner, I’d like there to be other businesses in the town that are producing revenue, so that succession at the Inn may be a bump, but won’t be a train wreck.

But having said all that, the last high tide of uh, the last innovative mind that came to town, was gonna invest and do different stuff still owns several properties on Harris Hollow Road that are the natural next growth area for the town. The Clopton and Updike properties on Harris Hollow Road are still owned and are the natural place to put housing. Its actually in the county, but Mr. Welch and I were talking, and have talked with our, our — my masters and his peers on the board of supervisors for years that when the

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town’s ready, when it gets through some of its growth spurt and its rehabbing of some of these structures in the town and is ready to start tackling the notion of housing expansion, the county is open to the idea of adjusting the town/county boundaries so the town takes that land in and works on its residential growth expansion.

It is not a town if there aren’t dogs chasing sticks, kids riding bikes and harried parents chasing futilely in their wake. That’s what we have to have long be — (applause) — Those kids are cost in the school system, but we’ve got room for them now and we need to put them back. My concern about the rescue squads is not dealing with kids. My concern is about the fact that, demographically, this crowd is aging. (some laughter) You know, there’s, there’s a lot more white there than there was and a lot of people in the audience — you look at the demographics in this county, slip­and­falls and “help me, I can’t get up” is gonna be the concern — (some laughter) — not “do we need a third geometry class?” (applause)

Gary Schwartz: I’m sure that’s gonna be tough to follow, but, um, I’m Gary Schwartz. I actually live in town, and I’m probably part of the problem. And um, I did sell the Heritage House to Jim Abdo couple of years back after Brian [Noyes] came out and said it wouldn’t work for him, and after several other people came out. Um, due to health reasons — and you’ve seen my, me on crutches and you know where health is — it’s not great. So having an 1837 property wasn’t, um — I wasn’t gonna make it. So, I guess I’m part of the problem. I sold Jim my property, but there wasn’t a big stack of people coming in to buy it as residents and make affordable housing out of it, nor did I have that option.

But I guess I’m part of the solution, too. Um, you can complain about things and you can not do anything about it, or you can complain about it and do something. Well, I guess I’m doing something. I’m vice­mayor under John [Sullivan] for four or five years now; I’ve been reelected come July 1, and I’ve been chairman of the planning commission for probably 12 years — 10­plus years now. So I know a little bit about the zoning ordinances, maybe a little bit more about the comprehensive plan, the historic district ordinance, subdivision ordinances than a lot of people. And certainly I’ve authored, with the help of the planning commission, the historic district guidelines and two revisions to the comp plan. And all those are public meetings. And I guess I see a lot of new faces here because they’ve never been at the meetings.

So, I welcome your input. We don’t have a crystal ball. We do the best we can as volunteers, we hire independent consultants to help guide us, but we have a set of comp plans. And I guess being part of the solution I’ve also said I’m Jim’s best friend and his worst enemy. I’m a construction engineer — he can’t do much without me seeing it in my backyard. (some laughter) You know, as far as the planning and the ARB, I see what’s going on. He brings the, uh — there’s command and control by the town. We have these ordinances, we have a sequence that they go through for permitting, for applications and if you wanna be part of that, come to the meetings. We’re gonna hold Jim to the ordinances, to the comp plan. And the town has command and control; it’s not the other way around. I welcome Jim as a neighbor and I, I commend him for his vision. Thank you. (applause)

RP: I’m, uh, I’m not trying to embarrass anyone, but I’m just curious: How many people in this room, just raise your hand, actually live in the town of Washington?

Audience: (some murmuring, some laughter)

RP: That’s more votes than you got, John. (laughter, some applause)

Beth Gyorgy: My name’s, uh, Beth Gyorgy, I live about 10 miles south of Sperryville, uh, in an old village area called Slate Mills. Um, John [McCarthy], when you mentioned the, uh, the, uh, town expanding its borders, I hear a disconnect here. Um — well, wait a minute, I’ll, I’ll get to that in a minute. Let me go

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back. Uh, uh, John [Sullivan] was talking about the decline of population in the town, and how we — how the town, I should say, because I don’t live there — uh, the town needs more people. I don’t see where Mr. Abdo’s proposals are going to bring those people. And, he may be hiring them hand over fist — I imagine he is, that’s what he said. But they can’t afford to live here. And the last attempt at affordable housing in this city was torpedoed. And I personally find that unconscionable. (applause)

You know, our — I mean, I know the salaries the deputies make, for instance, and it’s — there’s a, there’s a, there’s a, um — there’s a camel’s nose under this tent. And I’ll just, I’ll just speak from my own experience. I lived in Loudoun County for three years before we evacuated. (some laughter) There were houses going up in that county — it was like mushrooms. I’m a freelance editor and I got to hear that construction equipment from dawn to dusk. This has nothing to do with Mr. Abdo, other than the fact that when I read the word “developer,” and that’s my own sensitivity. I’m not saying — it’s the word “developer.” Um, and then when I read the Washington Post article . . . For me, intent doesn’t have anything to with it. I will assume you didn’t intend to offend anybody. Why would you? It’s not in your interest. I found those words so condescending . . . like what I considered to be a typical developer’s attitude. And, as far as — I, I would like very much to trust you, for my own selfish reasons because I don’t wanna see Loudoun County out here. I mean that — that was raping and pillaging, let’s face it. But, you know, your words still stand and it, it has nothing to do with the paper in which they were written. Those were quotes. Unless they misquoted you, in which case I’d have your lawyers call them.

And, um, the other problem I have here and then I’ll shut up, is the kind of elephant in the living room. And this isn’t the “come­heres” versus the “been heres” versus the people like Bill, who — Fletcher, who is from one of the founding families. Or maybe the founding family. I’m sorry, Bill. Um, it’s the city folks. You’re bringing businesses here from the city with the exception of the Red Truck Bakery. I think I’m right on that; if not, I apologize. And as far as I can see, they’re gonna cater to city people. Now that will bring in some tax money, but it — it’s kind of this colonization attitude. We, you know, as, as Ben was saying, and maybe I can clean it up again — Ben is a friend of mine. Um, it can come across as condescending. This, this town does have a great pulse. I walk around here at night when it’s so quiet, you know — we come to Little Washington quite frequently. It’s the city — it’s the county seat. So far we’ve avoided the court. (some laughter) And that’s, that’s, that’s because of my dear husband. He always tell me when I’m expressing homicidal thoughts, “Sweetie, it’s hard time.” (some laughter) Um, and sometimes that’s the only thing that works.

Um, I also wanted to ask quickly about the mitigation plans for the property. Is it Jim Abbott? I’m sorry if I don’t have your name right. Uh, the property to . . . next, uh — the property next to 90 Main St.

Jeff A: Jeff Akseizer.

BG: Jeff, I’m sorry. Uh, your mitigation plans there. Uh, has the court requested that, um — I assume you’ve applied for a permit. Have they requested, granted it and requested um, mitigation measures or . . . ? I’m just wondering about the status.

Jeff A: We actually walked with, uh, the county first.

BG: Mhm.

Jeff A: And we’re waiting for some feedback. But we were actually, just recently let known that the area we’re looking to do the demo work is not a wetland area.

BG: Oh, okay so the area that’s been —

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Jeff A: The field will remain. I want it to be a green space, so we’re not looking to interrupt any of what’s going on with, uh, the topography of the land. (unintelligible) . . . where the house is. And actually see that —

Audience: Louder!

Jeff A: I’ll take the mic after you.

BG: Yep. Uh, are there gonna be any moose over there? (laughter)

(bunch of people talking, clapping, yelling “Roger!”)

Jeff A: Hi everybody, I’m Jeff Akseizer. And I’m not from the country, until this year. Um, I am a good friend of Jim and my’s and uh, to tell you, kind of, how much Jim loves this place, when we first met each other it was over business in the big Washington. And, he said to me, directly after the meeting, not even knowing me that he wanted me to come to his home for the weekend. And I’d never had somebody immediately say to me, “I want you to my home for the weekend.” I thought, “It’s been great meeting you.” And he said, uh, “No, I want you come to my home for the weekend. I’m gonna text you the address.” So I Googled him, of course, and I saw that he lived in Washington, D.C., and I guess I didn’t read enough Googles down, but the text message I got was not of an address in Washington, D.C. The address that he sent me was off Rock Mills Road, with specific instructions on exactly how to get there because everything Jim does is exact. It is precise, it is with care and it is with love. He wanted me to get to his home that weekend, and it wasn’t his one in Big Washington. And I was intrigued, I thought, “Wow, this guy drives an hour and 20 minutes to get to work every day?”

So, I began to think about the type of person he was as I drove out here, and I learned a lot about him, obviously, over the course of that weekend. And I saw that the country is where he lived, and the city is where he worked. And in his heart he lived here with his family, and I, of course, began to get to know his children and his lovely wife Mai. And I made that emotional connection and investment with those folks, and it grew from there, to the point that I then started to think, “This is a wonderful place.” And he began to introduce to all — some of you I’ve met over the last couple months as I bought some of the properties you saw on the screen. And I bought them because I thought to myself, “I’d love this to be my home one day.” If I could figure out a way to do some of what I do in the big city but make this my home, I wanted to feel and to experience what Jim has done so beautifully with his family for 20­somewhat years. And I was like, “Wow.” And he said, “Jeff, you don’t know how to relax. You need to do this because you’re gonna find peace at home. And this is home.”

And so, it’s funny — just kinda move forward and I’ll answer your quick question about the various things I’m doing — but um, but, uh . . . You know, it’s funny, I would call Jim after we met and I’d say, “Hey, do you wanna meet for lunch? Are you around for dinner tonight?” And he’d say, “Um, well, um . . . Why don’t we pick a day this week?” And I’d think, “Where is he? It’s the middle of the week.” And he says, “I’m working on something, I need some quiet time to myself.” And I’d think to myself, “I know exactly where he is.” And so it’s funny — you know, I’m a very honest person, very transparent, you can ask me any question you want — but the only place I’ve started telling little fibs is on my scheduling calendar with my assistant because I’ve also started now to come hang out here during the week. Because it’s really where I wanna be.

And so, I’ve learned that, you know, in kind of following some that passionately feels about this place like I’ve never seen anybody else feel about a place, um, and so, I then convinced my best friend Jamie Brown

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to come out here and start spending time out in the county as well. So it’s contagious. Because happiness — peace, love and serenity — is contagious. It’s what we do. Why do I work hard? I work hard so that at the end of the day I can breathe! You know? I can open my eyes and come out and watch the sunset. Um, and I recognize that obviously there’s a lot of people that have all different needs and services and capacities within the county that need to be, obviously, be worked out. But this is a wonderful place, and I wanna let you know that everything I’m doing — and it’s really under Jim’s supervision, and assistance and guidance and caring — I mean the guy is a caring person. He’s not a developer; he’s a listener.

Audience: (people start talking, someone shouts, “He’s a developer!”)

Jeff A: Okay? So I want you to hear that he’s a listener. And so, going back to what I’m doing over there, I walked with the county, I had a couple professionals, I walked with the county and I’m currently getting the land surveyed and trying to get the pieces together so that everybody can see the topography. I’m only actually taking down the house and then seeding that little area right there. Uh, in addition, the packing shed — in terms of displacing people was one of the questions before — Justin is a wonderful person, he’s in the packing shed and he’s staying there. (alarm goes off) As far as I know. And we’re on great terms to keep somebody who’s an artisan in that wonderful space. So anything that we do is about, again, happiness, caring — (scattered laughter) — and, and involving people that are already here doing wonderful things. (crowd is murmuring) Um, so, you asked; I answered. (more crowd murmuring, a few people laugh)

Audience: (multiple cries of “Roger!”)

RP: Yes, coming. I’m just starting to realize that my realtor was lying when he told me that we were the last ones. (laughter, two people clap)

Ron Makela: Uh, Ron Makela, I’ve, uh, I’m a small business owner here in the county. Uh, I came here as a small business owner — I took over a family business, Hackley’s Store, down in, uh, in Amissville, and I just wanted to give you a little insight into running a small business in Rappahannock County that is dependent upon local support. It’s not easy. It’s . . . we tried for eight years. We added, we subtracted — didn’t make any different what we did. At the end of the year, the profit was flat. It . . . the business was dependent upon local support. And I don’t begrudge the people that didn’t come in and buy all their groceries from us because, as a small business, you have to pay more for the product, you have to charge more for the product, everything you buy you pay more for. It’s next to impossible to run a small retail business in Rappahannock County that is not tourist­oriented. We have . . . You’ve seen most of the small stores have closed up. Most other, uh, businesses other than, uh, say the computer businesses and stuff like that — business that, you know, businesses that are oriented towards successful businesses in the county can do it. But it’s something we have to be aware of, and that — you can talk all you want about the, you know, wanting the local businesses for the local people or whatever, and that’s all well and good, but there’s just not enough people in this county to make it work. (applause)

John McCarthy: I’ll intrude for a moment ’cause I wanted to follow up on something Beth [Gyorgy] was saying, about businesses for people in the county, and Ron [Makela]’s comment about whether local businesses can be sustained. And what I wanted to remind everybody is that the principal land­use planning goals of the county are to maintain agriculture and to support tourism. Whenever local governments look to create other sources of tax revenue — and for those of you who have heard this bit of mine, I apologize — they end up courting that great white whale of economic development: The clean, white­collar business.

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And my counterpart in Warren County, Doug Stanley, or Paul McCullough in Fauquier and I will find Mr. Brown of ABC Widget Company is looking for a place to put his 30­employee factory or office, and we’ll court them and I’ll take them to the schools, which have made remarkable improvements in the last 25 years, I’ll take him to the town, I’ll take him to the restaurants, I’ll take him to everything I can possibly do. And at the end of the day, he’s going to say, “You’re right, it’s a gorgeous place. I’m going to live here. But I’m going to put my factory on 66 in Warren County, or on 29 in Fauquier County.” Because let’s face it, we are not on the way to anywhere that there isn’t a better way to get there than to come through us. Now that’s a blessing, and it’s a curse.

The blessing part of it is that’s why a fair number of people in this room that are not natives are here — because you have to work to be here. But the way we pay for everybody else, and the way we pay for not having enormous increases in the tax rates — and Mr. Welch and I have just sat through a series of budget hearings in which everybody was telling us, “Let anybody else in here who will pay money rather than raise my real estate rate!” Now we know that everybody doesn’t want that.

But the thing that does come in, that doesn’t cost much in the way of services, that is a net tax producer, are tourism­based businesses. They hire a lot of locals, they use local contractors, they sustain themselves largely in the environment that we’ve created. And it’s like shoe stores in shopping malls — you don’t want one, you want eight. Eight restaurants do better than any one of them would if they were the only place in town. Now there are people that get squeezed out, there are losers in the game. I don’t know how to game that system. I’m sorry as hell about it. But one thing I do know is, tourism and agriculture — tourism and agriculture are inextricably linked. We sell landscape to these people who come out from the city, whether you are running an apple stand in Sperryville 30 years ago, or you’re selling smoked mussels on the half shell in some frou­frou kitchen today — you’re still soaking the tourists. (laughter) We do that well. There’s nothing dishonorable about that. (laughter and applause)

Sharon Pierce: Uh, Sharon Pierce, and, uh, I’ve been in this — a full­time resident of this county for a long time. Um, I’ve done a lot of things, I’ve been a business owner in Little Washington so I understand some of the problems. Cabin Fever Books, Mike Mahoney was kind enough to remember it . . . (applause) Yeah, it was a while ago. Uh, my children have run through the streets; they’re grown up now. Um, I’ve also been on the planning commission of the county and the chair of the planning commission. Worked with John [McCarthy], think he’s great. We’re fortunate to have him. Um, and I’ve been president of RCCA. Lots of different hats. And my take on this is going to be a little bit different than what anybody else has been talking about. I think your plans look great. I’m really, um, think it’s unfortunate that you didn’t do like Ken Thompson, and do it a little bit more organically and talk to people, and get a sense of where the community was rather than just kinda spring it on — but you know, everybody’s got their own style. I’m also of course concerned that we still don’t have housing. But really there are three points that I want to make. And, um, I feel like they haven’t been covered. And one is, Little Washington has 134, according to the census I read, maybe one other person moved in, 134 people —

JS: Ah —

SP: — can I finish please? I didn’t interrupt you.

JS: No, I’m sorry, I just wanted to . . . (trails off)

SP: So 134 people, 135 — pick your number. It’s too small to be a political entity. Um, it has its own bureaucracy, it has its own comprehensive plan, it has its own ordinances. And I want to come back to

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that in a minute. Um, but there has been a perception, and the People Inc. was certain a big part of that, there’s been a perception that there’s, you know, one or two people meeting in a broom closet deciding everything in the town — and that is not a good perception to have out in the county. Okay, I think it, you know, that’s my opinion, for what it’s worth, it’s too small.

Uh, the second is, and, and I really thought about this a lot — why are we all so upset about this? Besides the fact that we don’t know you and you’re a D.C. developer? And you didn’t choose your words too well. But the second thing is, this is our county seat. Can I emphasize that again? It is our county seat. As such, and it has been for centuries — as such, it belongs to all of us. But, and that’s the third point I want to get to, we, as county residents, don’t have any vote in what goes on in the town. Maybe — their comprehensive plan is great, and I’m sure Mr. Sullivan, and Mr. Abdo, and everybody else wants to keep it as it is. And their ordinances as it is.

But, as I think John [McCarthy] mentioned, Patrick [O’Connell] is 67. You know? It’s a company town. We’ve got a company town. Used to be a company town right , uh, right down the road, Laurel Mills; it was pretty derelict for a very long time. Uh, if they want to change, we have no impact on the town’s comprehensive plan. Now they can come, again, as I’ve been on the planning commission, I’ve done a lot of comp plans, two, right John? — Three? I forget — comp plans. And we have these meetings, and everybody comes to them, and we listen to people, and there’s a lot of input. This didn’t happen here. Um, but more, a bigger concern, I would like to see us quit being reactive and be anticipatory. Patrick dies, we got a black hole. What happens? Do we have somebody else from D.C. move in and go, “You know what? Let’s get together, let’s change this comp plan.” It could happen. We in the county have no input into that. Thank you. (applause)

(more general crowd murmuring)

Susan James: Hello, my name is Susan James and I’m, uh, a co­owner of Stonyman Gourmet Farmer and I’m happy to see all of you here tonight. Um, my family settled in the Shenandoah Valley in the early years, not in this county but not too far away. Um, we have a farm about half an hour away in the Blue Ridge. And we were — it’ll be a year from now we’ve been, we were married 25 years ago at the church down the street in Washington, Va. So our life has been entwined with this town and, as you know, we also are now, uh, working in town with Stonyman Gourmet Farmer. It was very interesting to hear the discussions about businesses, and I thought it would be interesting to talk about our business because I don’t think people know that much about it. And there was some discussion about the, um, disappointing tax revenue from the businesses who operate now. Oh, when we look at our, um, business here we thought — and when we started it was in the spring of 2008, we had a plan, it was terrific. And then the economy tanked. And we, like everyone else, including the Inn, reexamined our situation. And we decided to survive that we would diversify, and we diversified our markets. And so now, when you look at our tax returns for our meals taxes, you only see a fraction of what we actually sell. So, we have markets — a market here — and two­thirds of our sales are generated elsewhere. But the product is produced here, with employees here in Washington, Va., in Rappahannock County. And so what has happened is, over a difficult period of time, we’ve developed a business that’s a success, that’s known, um, in the communities around Washington, D.C. And we are known as originating in Washington, Va. So, oh, we are very pleased by this community. The support has been essential, but we’ve had to also grow and diversify.

Um, a couple of things to say, and that is that we brought a lot of interest to town. Uh, we have hosted, um, as you know, uh, the, uh, Porsche Club. And you could say that they’re tourists — they come, they eat and they leave. They’re welcomed by John [Sullivan] or John [McCarthy], and, um, then they go home. But we know that they come back again. They like the county. So they say, “Oh, I was over in Flint

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Hill and I ate at one of the restaurants there.” Or, “I was down in Sperryville and I ate at a restaurant there.” So, bringing people to town, um, showing the county, really makes a difference. And that’s who we should work. I know that was part of what John McCarthy’s office has worked on.

Um, we are concerned about our situation because of the changes in the town, whether you’re pro or con. But essentially we find that we will probably be homeless. Because we have been asked to leave our property. So, uh, for us the big question is, for successful businesses, how much support can we look for? What can we do to solve this problem? And can we, um, follow the, the idea of participatory discussion and the idea that we wanna bring new business but we wanna keep business. And the old adage, “Do no harm,” I think is very appropriate here. I’m going to take less minutes now and just have my other half say a couple of words.

Alan James: Very quickly, I’m Alan James. The co­owner of Stonyman Gourmet Farmer, and one of the things that Susan and I were talking about over the last few days, thinking about this meeting, is the whole business of um, how a business like ours kind of grew up organically, in the area, from our farm originally, and then getting to know this part of the world, how we sort of started a much smaller business than what it is now, and it’s grown. At the same time, the economy is challenging, and yet we are just from a business standpoint, fairly solid. From the outlook, less solid, but just from the business standpoint, we managed to get through a very rough economy. And one of the things that happened as we grew here in this location is, a lot of diversifying of the way we presented our offerings, the way we do business, the way we operate and experimented a lot, and had a number of local people working with us, we have learned, um, that basically there is a strength in our own diversification, within our business. And at the same time I think, in this larger environment of the town, I think there is maybe a point that businesses that grow organically in this town, that have the ability to survive and put down roots, is something that I think is beneficial to the town — in addition to new projects.

It’s not that new projects are terrible, nor is it that small, modest, organically growing businesses are inconsequential. I think to have the fullness of something that’s interesting, is not artificial but but very interesting and organic, and compatible with this environment, a lot of variety is needed. And we again, as Susan said, we feel good about where we’ve gotten so far. The prospect for continuing is rough. Thank you. (applause)

Marian Bragg: Kinda melting here. My name is Marian Bragg. My husband and I are restoring an old farm in Gid Brown Hollow, where I’m going to be bringing my llamas later this year where we’re both going to live, this is going to be our home. This is our forever home. And I really just wanted to say that learning about these plans in The Washington Post . . . made me feel irrelevant. I would’ve thought that we would’ve had some advance notice. And I’m very disappointed by that. And it makes me very suspicious. And I think it’s going to take a lot for me to get over that. Thank you. (applause)

Alice ?: Hi, my name is Alice [unknown], I live over on Tiger Valley Road, I’d like, I just would like an explanation of a remark one of you made, one of the gentlemen in the front, regarding something about Mexican? I’m 80 years old, and I . . . don’t know what that means. Could you explain it please? (laughter)

John McCarthy: Not in a family room, no.

Alice: What, I’m sorry? My hearing is also faulty.

JM: It was a reference in an email post, to a Mexican house of ill repute.

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Alice: Oh, so it was from an email?

JM: Yeah, and it was also online . . .

Alice: Well, whoever made it, I found it offensive.

Christine Smith: Thank you, Roger. Hello, my name is Christine Smith, and I am not a native of Rappahannock or Washington. But you know the saying — I got here as soon as I could. (laughter) I lived with my family in Washington in the late ’80s and early ’90s, but I currently reside in Sperryville. I have two questions. One that I hope will help the mayor with his credibility problem, and one in general. Mayor Sullivan, at the [town council] meeting Monday night, you insisted that you haven’t done anything wrong, that there is no conspiracy and that it is part of your job to be nice, hospitable and, for lack of a better word, to schmooze people. I get that, I really do. But what leaves me with an unsettled ethical dilemma kind of feeling in the pit of my stomach is pictures like those posted by Washingtonian contributor Carol Joynt on her social life blog. Let’s go over the highlights if you haven’t seen it. It looks like you had an evening on Friday, April 24, and you and your wife were treated to a dinner party at the Abdos home, prepared by the incoming Seasonal Pantry chef. Alcohol flowed freely, provided by the Abdos. What would be the price tag for this evening for a regular Joe? Dinner for two at Seasonal Pantry ranges from $130 to $160 a plate. A hundred dollars of wine and drink is probably modest. Taxes and gratuity — $500 to get out the door. But wait, there’s more. The party was then moved after hours to the Inn at Little Washington for a private affair hosted by Patrick himself, complete with more drinks and wine, games, popcorn with shaved black truffles on top, foie gras with foie gras on top — and I’m not making this up, you can look at the pictures. I think the MasterCard commercial said it best when they said, “Priceless.”

So, I get why you schmooze them, Mayor. But what worries me is why they schmoozed you. (scattered applause, murmurs) I can’t help but wonder where the party ends and the professional begins. It looks a bit blurry from where I stand. But my primary question — and I feel really smart because John [McCarthy] and Sharon [Pierce] have already brought it up — with an almost­70­year­old chef at the helm, it is a bit of a castle in the sand with the tide coming in. Why are we building additions to the castle? Thank you for your attention. I feel really silly because I made sure it was under three minutes, so I appreciate your attention. (applause)

Ken Thompson: My name is Ken Thompson. Thank you for a couple of times, the comments tonight, appreciate that. I don’t know Jim well, but I can tell you that the few times I’ve been in a room with him, and had food together, he called me, and I think it’s important that you see a little bit of this side of Jim, because it doesn’t sound like it’s well known. The first time Jim called me, I invited him over the Thornton River Grille, and we had dinner together. We each paid our own. John was with us and I know we all paid our own. Uh, but Jim wanted to know if there was, if anything he was planning on doing, at the White Moose, would interfere with my plans in Little Washington. I found that important. And I thought it said something about the guy. And I ended up telling him, “C’mon.” I mean, for what you’re doing over there, people in Little Washington are eventually going to eat at my restaurant in Little Washington, and if I ever get my bar open, they’ll drink there, too. But I appreciated that.

The second time was, um, he came over to the Kramer Building, and shared with me that he was talking to Brian Noyes. Because we serve some baked goods, I presume, he wanted to know if that would be a problem for me. And again, he didn’t need to do this. I thought it was pretty good of him. I told him I’d stood on my head three or four years ago to try and get Brian out here myself. We sold Brian’s goods in the Corner Store, for a year and a half. We couldn’t get enough of his goods in the store. Whatever we

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picked up on Thursday was gone by Sunday noon. So, I mean the guy’s got a following, he’s got great stuff. I’ve never found anybody that understands branding as well as he does, and I’m tickled to death to have him in the county. And I conveyed that to Jim, and I’m tickled to death that you guys will be able to work that out.

The last thing I’ll say, Jim, is if there’s anything you can do to help Alan and Susan [of Stonyman Gourmet] find a place, God bless you because we need good people in the town. (applause)

RP: Two things. One, Ken, you reminded me by mentioning, uh . . . is the bar going to be open by 7:30 tonight?

Ken: No.

RP: Um, the second is that you just brought up, what you just said to Jim reminded me, because I was hoping that this event, and this, with this kind of turnout, would lead to some future . . . meetings — whether they are private, or smaller . . . and I’m trying to think of a way for us to manage requests or any . . . anything that people would like to ask about or follow up on in the future. I guess we should just . . . well, call the newspaper.

There are hands. Still, hands. Oh.

Jim Abdo: I appreciate all the comments, I really do, every one of ’em. To the young woman who is concerned about collusion, and ethics, and all that — let me tell you, we . . . well, people are saying this is all news to them. I was at three separate hearings at the town hall. Those hearings were all posted in the Rappahannock News. We went in there, showed all these plans to whoever would come in. No one in this room that I recognize, other than Gary, a couple of others, were there. We were, there’s — there’s no collusion, I’m not pulling any wool over anybody’s eyes. I studied that comp plan backwards and forward, and everything that I’m doing is right down the strike zone — there. It just is. You can review it yourself.

Christine Smith: I have, and I have a comment about that too. On page 44 of the comprehensive plan, and I thank the Rappahannock News for posting it because the city didn’t get around to it until this afternoon, even though it was posted, or drafted, in 2012 and —

RP: Page 44 . . .

CS: Excuse me?

RP: Page 44, you were saying . . .

CS: Page 44, items 11 and 12, specifically call for small projects with, I can’t remember, historical something, and small footprints. I don’t call developing eight buildings a small project.

JA: Okay, you’re a little bit confused, with all due respect, each one of these —

CS: No, I’m not.

JA: You are. Each one of these buildings is small, we’re not changing the footprint, some are getting some minor expansion. Let me just explain this. Any, anybody could have bought those buildings. Anybody. Okay? It coulda been —

CS: But you did.

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JA: That’s right. I did. And maybe one day, you’ll thank me for buying those buildings. You don’t know. They could sit there vacant indefinitely. If any of you wanted to buy ’em, buy them. You know, if you have an alternative use for what I’ve come up with and worked hard to get to, tell me what it is. I can tell you some of the uses that people have called me and said they wanted to put in. They’ve called my office, you want to hear some of ’em? I’ll tell ’em to you — tattoo parlor. That was husband and wife, they want to do tattoos, on Main Street. You want me to rent it to them? I can do that. I can do that. We have somebody that wants to put in a junk shop, which I don’t mind, because my wife and I like to poke around and buy stuff from the junk shops. A consignment store wants to be out here. Somebody talked to me about a gun store. I don’t even know how you would, can you license something like that in the city? I got somebody wants to put in a mini­storage, here.

I said no. No, no, no, no. No. I’m trying to come up with things that hire people, that use the resources of the farms here, that . . . I am trying to save old buildings, that are decaying — but what I’m really trying to do is broaden the tax base of this town because, let me tell you something, when you have 80 percent of the tax base of this town coming from one source, the Inn at Little Washington, that is a bad business model! It’s bad! And I’m trying to change that . . .with my money. And let me tell you one other thing. Go do some math, pull out your calculators, look at how much I paid for these buildings, look at how much it’s going to cost me to rehab all of them, look at how much it’s going to cost me to run payroll for these buildings, and look and see . . . if the rich are getting richer. I am not going to get rich off of anything I am doing in this town. But I’ll tell you what I am doing — I am exercising a labor of love. I love this town, I love these old buildings, I want to save them. Nobody has stepped up to do it! Okay? (applause)

Diane [last name inaudible]: I appreciate what you’re explaining but would you be doing this, knowing . . . . Are you in the business of losing money?

Audience: Good question.

JA: I am not in the business of losing money. I, uh, told you earlier, I came from nothing, I built a very, very successful business, you can go online, if you want to, and read about it. I am at a stage in my life where I don’t have to do any of this. I can buy these buildings and let them sit, and fall down like they were. Okay? I want my children, and my children’s children, to go through this town, and be able to see these buildings still standing because their grandfather and father took the time and the money to restore them. I don’t know if these business models are going to work. I don’t know if Brian’s going to make it, I don’t know if I can convince — with this warm reception, I don’t know if this guy’s gonna come here and do this restaurant. I don’t know! But you know what, I’m not going anywhere. I’m not packing up and moving to Hawaii. And saying the heck with this town. I’m staying here, okay? I love this county. I’m gonna figure out a way to keep these buildings relevant and standing, and that’s . . . you know, it — it’s a labor of love. Call it crazy, call it stupid, I’ve been driving past them for years. And years, and years. And you know, I — I just said, “Somebody’s got to do something.” And that’s what I’m doing.

Hal Hunter: People can go on the town website and download their own copy of the comprehensive plan, and the zoning ordinance, as I have, and look at it. There’s lots of protections in there. (applause)

Gary Aichele: My name’s Gary Aichele, and with my wife, we own and operate the Gay Street Inn, right down the street. We’ve been here a little over a year. I don’t know why really, maybe because I have a political science background, and there’s not a lot to do evenings in the town of Washington, Va., but I’m a fairly regular at the council meetings. Along with Nancy [Buntin] here, who faithfully attends virtually every meeting in this town. You don’t have to be a resident, one of the 138 special people who live here.

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You can come from anywhere. Phil Irwin I think is a pretty regular face. I would say that in the 10, 15 meetings I’ve attended on different things in town, that on an average evening, the council outnumbers the public. There are public sessions held, virtually every single meeting. They are posted in the local publications, they give you fair notice, they tell you exactly what the issue before the council will be. I am, in the interest of full disclosure, a new member of the planning commission. Here’s what I’d say to all of you. I have no idea where I stand tonight, on half the things that I’ve heard — I’m glad I’ve heard them. That’s why I came, that’s why I’m staying, because I think information is helpful. My wife and I made a major commitment. This is where we plan to live our lives. We cashed out retirement and bought an inn, in a place called Washington, Va. As somebody said at the last meeting, “We have a lot of skin in this game.” We don’t just drive through this town, we walk through this town, on a regular basis. I don’t know whether Mr. Abdo’s plans will enhance our town, destroy our town, make it better, or make it worse — we may not know that for a decade. It has a lot to do with issues much bigger than what goes on here, or what goes on in town council. No one could’ve predicted 2008; most didn’t. I too wish that successful businesses and dear friends find places to stay in town, and don’t get forced out. So there’s a lot on the table, and there’s a lot of reason for people being here and being upset, but I’ll tell you this, if you are as concerned as you seem to be, please join Nancy and me. There’s plenty of room in the town hall. Don’t come just when you have a personal issue at stake, for 15 minutes, bounce in, get heard and leave. Come when they start, stay till they’re finished. If you have concerns, they have been more than courteous, understanding, patient and kind, to answer questions of a newcomer. And actually put up with things I say. So I would encourage all of you: come, get involved, and — if you don’t like the plans Mr. Abdo is presenting, say so. And the best time to say so is when he’s appealing for a variance or permit for whatever. Come in. Once they’re approved, then it’s too late, then it will happen. But there is a process and I’m here to tell you, honest to God, they do follow the process. I don’t care who buys the mayor dinner, frankly, so long as every request comes to an open process, with public notice, where I and anyone else who’s interested, has a right, and maybe a duty, to show up. And talk about those things then and there. That’s how we do business in the town, and I for one am completely happy with it. (applause)

RP: Yeah, go ahead. I’m going to say that this is the last comment, then you, Jenks. You can start us off and end it . . .

Dan O’Brien: Hi, my name is Daniel O’Brien, I’m from Bloomingdale in D.C., my hometown is Rochester, N.Y. Live in small town, grew up in a small town, Clarkson, N.Y.. Jim brought me down here a while ago, actually contacted me two years ago, coming into my shop. Let me give you an overview of my shop. Two hundred and forty square feet, two induction burners and a pancake griddle. (scattered laughter) That’s what I cook off. Thirteen — number 13 in the Washington Post, and that’s what I cook off. No pretentiousness. I have two girls that work with me, 24 and 26. They’re rock stars. They’re butchering whole animals, they’re breaking down stuff, they’re canning over 60 jars a week when we’re in peak season. And I run the [not clear]. We have a market that’s open three days a week, we can’t run it six days a week because I worked 120 hours doing so for the first year. I took no salary. I lived in the back end of my shop. I worked my butt off to get to the point where somebody would actually notice me.

I love to cook. I love hospitality, and I love small communities. This opportunity, I don’t know, Jim and I are still talking, discussing. He showed me a couple places. Pullen house would’ve been nice, it probably had plumbing. (laughter) But I’m the moron that said, “That’s a barn. That has history, that has uniqueness.” When you go on Seasonal Pantry’s website, yeah, I do, I charge $137 per person, that’s tax, tip, gratuity, 12 courses and . . . two and half glasses of wine. I started out charging $40, for four courses. In three years I got to $137. I couldn’t hire two cooks when I first started. There was me, a server, and guess who did the dishes. I did. So I worked hard to get to that point, and I’m willing to work hard to get to

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this point here. I like Italian, I’m half Italian, half Irish. Italian rustic is what I like to call it. Peasant food, some of it. Somebody’d go ooh, I don’t want to eat that. But if you’ve ever had bread soup, a little tomato, some old country sourdough thrown in there. (murmurs, some clapping) You know what I’m talking about, good salt, good parmesan if you can get good parmesan I know there’s a cheese lady up there that I want to work with. Cause it sounds delicious to me, some people have reached out and said hello, because of that article. I just wanted to reach out and say hello. So thank you all. It’s been very interesting to sit down here, drive out and watch this. And I hope that Jim and I can work on coming out here, and I hope to cook for you, and no — I hope it won’t be a $137 price tag, I wanna see fried chicken on Wednesdays is what I wanna see for the town. (applause) I want you to open up your door and smell it, and be like — it’s Wednesday. ’Cause Dan’s got the chicken fryer on, and it smells darn good. Thank you all, have a wonderful evening. (applause)

Jenks Hobson: I promised my wife I’d keep my mouth shut. I lied. I’m not qualified to speak on much that’s up here. You want zoning, talk to Gary, talk to John. You want many things. But I have a semi­claim on speaking about morals. And my friend Christine, you were my neighbor for several years, but I got to stand up and defend the guy to my left. I don’t know Mr. Abdo one way or the other, but I do know John Sullivan. And there’s nothing wrong that John Sullivan does outside of caring very much for this town. And everybody might not agree with the way he does it, but to accuse him of some kind of collusion is not something I can . . . it’s a moral charge, and I simply cannot stand here and let that be said. (applause)

RP: Thank you all for coming (applause). Really, thank you all for coming — and for staying. (more applause).

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