Volume III TuesdayNo. 19 24th January, 1967

PA R L I AMENTA R YD E B ATES

DEWAN RA'AYAT(HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES)

OFFICIAL REPORT

THIRD SESSION OF THE SECOND PARLIAMENTOF MALAYSIA

CONTENTS

ORAL ANSWERS TO QUESTIONS [Col. 2921]

BILL PRESENTED [Col, 2950]

THE SUPPLY (1967) BILL [Col. 2950]

ADJOURNMENT (Motion) [Col. 3023]

ADJOURNMENT SPEECH;Improvement of the Standards of the Cultural Programmes

on Television Malaysia [Col. 3023]

DI-CHETAK DI .JABATAN CHETAK KERAJAAN

OLEH THOR BEND CHONG , A.M.N., PENCHETAK KERAJAAN,

KUALA LUMPUR

1968

MALAYSIA

DEWAN RA 'AYAT(HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES)

Official Report

Third Session of the Second Dewan Ra`ayat

Tuesday, 24th January, 1967

The House met at Ten o'clock a.m.

PRESENT :

The Honourable Mr Deputy Speaker, TUAN SYED ESA BIN ALWEE,J.M.N., S.M.J., P.I.S.

the Prime Minister and Minister of Foreign Affairs,Y.T.M. TUNKU ABDUL RAHMAN PUTRA AL-HAJ, K.O.M.

(Kuala Kedah).

the Deputy Prime Minister, Minister of Defence and Ministerof National and Rural Development, TUN HAJI ABDUL RAZAKBIN DATO' HUSSAIN, S.M.N. (Pekan).

the Minister of Home Affairs and Minister of Justice,TUN DR ISMAIL BIN DATO' HAJI ABDUL RAHMAN,S.S.M., P.M.N. (Johor Timor).

„ the Minister of Finance , TUAN TAN SIEW SIN , J.P.(Melaka Tengah).the Minister of Works, Posts and Telecommunications,TAN SRI V. T. SAMBANTHAN , P.M.N . (Sungei Siput).the Minister of Transport, TAN SRI HAJI SARDON BINHAJI JUBIR , P.M.N. (Pontian Utara).

„ the Minister of Education , TUAN MOHAMED KHIR JOHARI(Kedah Tengah).

the Minister of Health, TUAN BAHAMAN BIN SAMSUDIN(Kuala Pilah).the Minister of Commerce and Industry, DR LIM SWEE AUN,J.P. (Larut Selatan).

the Minister for Welfare Services, TUAN HAJI ABDUL HAMID

KHAN BIN HAJI SAKHAWAT ALI KHAN, J.M.N., J.P.

(Batang Padang).

„ the Minister for Sarawak Affairs, TAN SRI TEMENGGONG JUGAHANAK BARIENG, P.M.N., P.D.K. (Sarawak).

the Minister of Labour , TUAN V. MANICKAVASAGAM, J.M.N.,P.J.K. (Kiang).

„ the Minister of Information and Broadcasting and Ministerof Culture , Youth and Sports , TUAN SEND BIN ABDUL RAHMAN(Kubang Pasu Barat).

„ the Minister of Lands and Mines, TUAN ABDUL-RAHMANBIN YA`KUB (Sarawak).

2915 24 JANUARY 1967 2916

The Honourable the Assistant Minister of National and Rural Development,TUAN SULAIMAN BIN BULON, P.J.K., (Bagan Datoh).

the Assistant Minister of Culture, Youth and Sports,ENGKU MUHSEIN BIN ABDUL KADIR, J.M.N., S.M.T., P.J.K.(Trengganu Tengah).the Assistant Minister of Education, TUAN LEE SIOK YEW,A.M.N., P.J.K. (Sepang).

the Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister of Health,TUAN IBRAHIM BIN ABDUL RAHMAN (Seberang Tengah).

the Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister of Labour,TUAN LEE SAN CHOON, K.M.N. (Segamat Selatan).the Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister of Finance,TUAN ALI BIN HAJI AHMAD (Pontian Selatan).

the Parliamentary Secretary to the Deputy Prime Minister,TUAN CHEN WING SUM (Damansara).TUAN ABDUL KARIM BIN ABU, A.M.N. (Melaka Selatan).

WAN ABDUL KADIR BIN ISMAIL, P.P.T.

(Kuala Trengganu Utara).TUAN ABDUL RAHMAN BIN HAJI TALIB, P.J.K. (Kuantan)

WAN ABDUL RAHMAN BIN DATU TUANKU BUJANG, A.B.S.(Sarawak).

TUAN ABDUL RAZAK BIN HAJI HUSSIN (Lipis).

TUAN ABDUL SAMAD BIN GUL AHMAD MIANJI

(Pasir Mas Hulu).

Y.A.M. TUNKU ABDULLAH IBNI AL-MARHUM TUANKU ABDUL

RAHMAN, P.P.T. (Rawang).

„ TUAN HAJI ABU BAKAR BIN HAMZAH (Bachok).

„ TUAN HAJI AHMAD BIN ABDULLAH, S.M.K. (Kelantan Hilir).

„ TUAN AHMAD BIN ARSHAD, A.M.N. (Muar Utara).

TUAN HAJI AHMAD BIN SA`AID, J.P. (Seberang Utara).

DR AWANG BIN HASSAN, S.M.J. (Muar Selatan).

TUAN AZIZ BIN ISHAK (Muar Dalam).

TUAN JONATHAN BANGAU ANAK RENANG, A.B.S. (Sarawak).

„ PENGARAH BANYANG ANAK JANTING, P.B.S. (Sarawak).

„ TUAN CHAN CHONG WEN, A.M.N. (Kluang Selatan).

„ TUAN CHAN SEONG YOON (Setapak).

„ TUAN CHAN SIANG SUN, A.M.N., P.J.K. (Bentong).

TUAN CHEW BLOW CHUON, J.P. (Bruas).

„ TUAN CHIA CHIN SHIN, A.B.S. (Sarawak).

TUAN FRANCIS CHIA NYUK TONG (Sabah).

„ TUAN CHIN FOON (Ulu Kinta).

„ TUAN D. A. DAGO ANAK RANDAN alias DAGOK ANAK RANDEN(Sarawak).

„ TUAN C. V. DEVAN NAIR (Bungsar).

TUAN EDWIN ANAK TANGKUN (Sarawak).

„ DATIN HAJJAH FATIMAH BINTI HAJI ABDUL MAJID(Johor Bahru Timor).

2917 24 JANUARY 1967 2918

The Honourable TAN SRI FATIMAH BINTI HAJI HASHIM, P.M.N.

(Jitra-Padang Terap).TUAN S. FAZUL RAHMAN, A.D.K. (Sabah).

„ DATO GANIE GILONG, P.D.K., J.P. (Sabah).

TUAN GANING BIN JANGKAT (Sabah).

„ TURN GEH CHONG KEAT, K.M.N. (Penang Utara).

TUAN HAJI HAMZAH BIN ALANG, A.M.N., P.J.K. (Kapar).

„ TUAN HANAFI BIN MOHD. YUNUS, A.M.N., J.P. (Kulim Utara).

„ TUAN HARUN BIN ABDULLAH, A.M.N., J.P. (Baling),

„ WAN HASSAN BIN WAN DAUD (Tumpat).

„ TUAN STANLEY HO NGUN KHIU, A.D.K. (Sabah).

TUAN HUSSEIN BIN TO' MUDA HASSAN, A.M.N. (Raub).

DATO' HAJI HUSSEIN BIN MOHD. NOORDIN, D.P.M•P., A.M,N.,

P.J.K. (Pant).

„ TUAN HUSSEIN BIN SULAIMAN (Ulu Kelantan).

„ TUAN HAJI HUSSAIN RAHIMI BIN HAJI SAMAN, S.M:K.(Kota Bharu Hulu).

TUAN IKHWAN ZAINI (Sarawak).

TUAN ISMAIL BIN IDRIS (Penang Selatan).

„ TAN SRI SYED JA`AFAR BIN HASAN ALBAR, P.M.N.(Johor Tenggara).

PENGHULU JINGGUT ANAK ATTAN, Q.M.C., A.B.S. (Sarawak).

„ TUAN KADAM ANAK KIAI (Sarawak).

TUAN KAM WOON WAH, J .P. (Sitiawan).

„ TUAN THOMAS KANA (Sarawak).

„ TUAN KHOO PENG LOONG (Sarawak).

TUAN EDMUND LANGGU ANAK SAGA (Sarawak).

TUAN LEE SECK FUN, K.M.N. (Tanjong Malim).

„ DR LIM CHONG EU (Tanjong).

„ TUAN LIM KEAN SIEw (Dato Kramat).

TUAN LIM PEE HUNG, P.J.K. (Alor Star).

DR MAHATHIR BIN MOHAMAD (Kota Star Selatan).

TUAN T. MAMMA SINGH, J.P. (Port Dickson).

„ TUAN C. JOHN ONDU MAJAKIL (Sabah).

„ TUAN JOSEPH DAVID MANJAJI (Sabah).

„ TUAN MOHD. ARIF SALLEH, A.D.K. (Sabah).

„ DATO' MOHAMED ASRI BIN HAJI MUDA, S.P.M.K.(Pasir Puteh).

„ TUAN MOHD. DAUD BIN ABDUL SAMAD (Besut).

„ TUAN MOHAMED IDRIS BIN MATSIL, J.M.N., P.J.K., J.P.(Jelebu-Jempol).

„ TUAN MOHD. TAHIR BIN ABDUL MAJID, S.M.S., P.J.K.(Kuala Langat).

„ TUAN MOHAMED YUSOF BIN MAHMUD, A.M.N. (Temerloh).

„ TUAN MOHD. ZAHIR BIN HAJI ISMAIL, J.M.N. (Sungei Patani).

„ WAN MOKHTAR BIN AHMAD (Kemaman).

2919 24 JANUARY 1967 2920

The Honourable TURN HAJI MOKHTAR BIN HAJI ISMAIL (Perlis Selatan).

„ TUAN MUHAMMAD FAKHRUDDIN BIN HAJI ABDULLAH(Pasir Mas Hilir).

„ TUAN HAJI MUHAMMAD SU`AUT BIN HAJI MUHD. TAHIR , A.B.S.(Sarawak).

„ DATO' HAJI MUSTAPHA BIN HMI ABDUL JABAR , D.P.M.S., A.M.N.,J.P. (Sabak Bernam).

„ TUAN MUSTAPHA BIN AHMAD (Tanah Merah).

„ TAN SRI NIK AHMAD KAMIL, D.K., S.P .M.K., S.J .M.K., P.M.N.,P.Y.G.P., Dato' Sri Setia Raja (Kota Bharu Hilir).

„ TUAN NG FAH YAM (Batu Gajah).„ TUAN ONG KEE HUI (Sarawak).

„ TUAN HAJI OTHMAN BIN ABDULLAH (Hilir Perak).

„ TUAN OTHMAN BIN ABDULLAH, A.M.N. (Perlis Utara).

„ TUAN HAJI RAHMAT BIN HAJI DAUD , A.M.N.(Johor Bahru Barat).

„ TUAN RAMLI BIN OMAR (Krian Darat).

„ TUAN HAJI REDZA BIN HAJI MOHD. SAID, P .J.K., J.P.(Rembau-Tampin).

„ TUAN SANDOM ANAK NYUAK (Sarawak).

„ TUAN SEAH TENG NGIAB, P.I .S. (Muar Pantai).

„ TUAN D. R. SEENIVASAGAM (Ipoh).

TUAN SIM BOON LIANG, A.B . S . (Sarawak).„ TUAN SIOW LOONG HIN, P.J .K. (Seremban Barat).

„ TUAN SNAWI BIN ISMAIL , P.J.K. (Seberang Selatan).

„ TUAN SNG CHIN Joo (Sarawak).

„ TUAN Sox AH TECK (Batu Pahat).

„ TUAN SULEIMAN BIN ALI (Dungun).

„ TUAN SULEIMAN BIN HAJI TAIB (Krian Laut).

„ PENGIRAN TAHIR PETRA (Sabah).

„ TUAN TAJUDDIN BIN ALI, P.J.K . (Larut Utara).„ TUAN TAI KUAN YANG (Kulim Bandar Bharu).„ TUAN TAMA WENG TINGGANG WAN (Sarawak).

„ DR TAN CHEE KHOON (Batu).

„ TUAN TAN CHENG BEE, J .P. (Bagan).

„ TUAN TAN KEE GAK (Bandar Melaka).

„ TUAN TAN T0H HONG (Bukit Bintang).

„ TUAN TAN TSAK Yu (Sarawak).

„ TUAN TIAH ENG BEE (Kluang Utara).

„ TUAN STEPHEN YONG KUET TZE (Sarawak).

„ TUAN HAJI ZAKARIA BIN HAJI MOHD . TAIB, P.J.K. (Langat).

ABSENT :

The Honourable MR SPEAKER , DATO' CHIK MOHAMED YUSUF BIN SHEIKHABDUL RAHMAN , S.P.M.P., J.P., Dato' Bendahara , Perak.

„ the Minister for Local Government and Housing,TUAN KHAW KAI-BOH, P.J.K. (Ulu Selangor).

2921 24 JANUARY 1967 2922

The Honourable the Minister of Agriculture and Co-operatives,TUAN HAJI MOHD . GHAZALI BIN HAJI JAW! (Ulu Perak).

the Minister for Sabah Affairs , TUN DATU MUSTAPHA BINDATU HARUN, S.M.N., P .D.K. (Sabah).

the Assistant Minister without Portfolio , TUAN HAJI ABDULKHALID BIN AWANG OSMAN (Kota Star Utara).

the Assistant Minister of Finance, DR NG KAM POH, J.P.(Teluk Anson).

TUAN ABDUL GHANI BIN ISHAK , A.M.N. (Melaka Utara).

TUAN HAJI ABDUL RASHID BIN HAJI JAIS (Sabah).

DATO' ABDULLAH BIN ABDULRAHMAN , S.M.T., Dato ' Biaya

di-Raja (Kuala Trengganu Selatan).TUAN HAJI ABDULLAH BIN HAJI MOHD . SALLEH,

A.M.N., S .M.J., P.I.S . (Segamat Utara) .PUAN AJIBAH BINTI ABOL (Sarawak).

0. K. K. DATU ALIUDDIN BIN DATU HARUN, P.D.K. (Sabah).

TUAN HANAFIAH BIN HUSSAIN , A.M,N, (Jerai).

TUAN AMADEUS MATHEW LEONG , A.D.K., J .P. (Sabah).

DATO' LING BENG SIEW, P .N.B.S. (Sarawak).

TUAN PETER LO Su YIN (Sabah).DATO ' DR HAJI MEGAT KHAS , D.P.M.P., J.P., P.J.K.(Kuala Kangsar).

ORANG TUA MOHAMMAD DARA BIN LANGPAD (Sabah).

TUAN QUEK KAI DONG, J.P. (Seremban Timor).

RAJA ROME BIN RAJA MA`AMOR , P.J.K., J.P. (Kuala Selangor).

DATO' S. P. SEENIVASAGAM , D.P.M.P ., P.M.P., J.P.(Menglembu).

TUAN TOH THEAM HOCK (Kampar).

TUAN YEH PAO TZE, A.M. N. (Sabah).

PRAYERS

(Mr Deputy Speaker in the Chair)

ORAL ANSWERS TO

QUESTIONS

TEAMS OF MEMBERS OFPARLIAMENT VISITINGCAMBODIA, PHILIPPINES,EASTERN MALAYSIA--NOVEMBER/DECEMBER,

1966

1, Dr Tan Chee Khoon (Batu) asksthe Minister of Foreign Affairs howmany teams of Members of Parliamenthave been sent in November-Decemberto visit Cambodia, Philippines, EasternMalaysia and the names of those whowent on each tour, the cost of eachtour and whether the tours were

really necessary in view of the warningby the Minister of Finance that hewould reduce Government expenditureby hook or by crook.

The Prime Minister: Mr Speaker,Sir, two groups of parliamentarianswere sent on goodwill tours inNovember/December of last year tothe Philippines and to Thailand.They did not, however, visit Cambodiaas stated by the Honourable Member,because at that time Cambodia wasvery busy with the GANEFO Games.However, these two groups, consistingof 13 members in each group, andincluded among them Members of theOpposition as well, went on this good-will visit and were very well receivedand left a very good impressionbehind.

2923 24 JANUARY 1967

I think the Honourable Memberwas rather worried about the moneyspent on them. The only money thatwas spent on them was about $50,000for which a vote--I cannot rememberhow much; perhaps the HonourableMember can refer to the BudgetEstimates-had been approved in thisParliament, with the object ol7 allowingnot only our parliamentarians butalso other members of our society tovisit countries abroad and to meettheir counterparts abroad and to helpstrengthen the tie of friendshipbetween our countries.

Dr Tan Chee Khoon : The Honour-able Prime Minister mentioned the factthat $50,000 were spent on these twotrips. In his eyes it may be a paltrysum--it amounts exactly to one tenthof the vote for last year for this pur-pose, which was half a million dollars.Is the Honourable Prime Ministeraware that the spending of this$50,000 on what was blatantly aChristmas shopping spree, in thatChristmas was approaching and theend of the year was also approaching;perhaps, the Ministry of ExternalAffairs finding that the money wasnot spent he said, "Let us go on ashopping spree, spend this before wehave to hand the money back to theTreasury". Is the Honourable PrimeMinister aware that this is a practicethat must be condemned in no uncer-tain terms. If tours of this nature arenecessary, they should be thought outcarefully and spaced out carefully.

The Prime Minister: This matter hadbeen discussed in the Parliament, andthe Honourable Member was one ofthose who supported it very strongly.(Laughter).

Dr Tan Chee Khoon: I have notsupported it. I think the HonourablePrime Minister must not put words inmy mouth. I have not gone on any suchjaunts in the past.

The Prime Minister: At least, he didnot oppose it. I presume that by notopposing it, he had supported it, andI can assure the Honourable Memberthat money was never used on any

2924

Christmas shopping spree or Christmasspending . They went there, as I said,on a goodwill visit. This team has donevery well and I am very pleased withthe results of these visits.

Tuan Lim Kean Siew (Dato Kra-mat): I do not think the House objectsto study or genuine goodwill tours.What we object to are study and good-will tours becoming shopping tours.The very fact that $50,000 was spentat the end of last year, because therewas a vote for it, does not provenecessarily that it was justified; andthe question asked was "In view of theFinance Minister's warning that he willreduce Government expenditure byhook or crook, whether or not in viewof that warning and the increase inour taxes, that such a visit at that timewas justified?"

The Prime Minister: I must say thatit was justified, otherwise we wouldnot have sent these people there. Ifthese people went on a shopping spree,they could well have done it hererather than going to the Philippines, forI do not know what they can get forthe money they have, by way of allo-wance or for that matter in Bangkok.So, I say to suggest that they went on ashopping spree is utterly a suggestionwithout any foundation. Two or threemembers of the Opposition are here.If you like, you ask them whetherthey went on a shopping spree-andone is the Honourable Member fromBachok. (Laughter).

Tuan Haji Abu Bakar bin Hamzah(Bachok): Ada-kah Kerajaan sedarbahawa lawatan yang sa-macham initidak sempurna dan boleh jadi kurangmenguntongkan kalau kita tidak serta-kan sama dalam rombongan itu Ahli2daripada Dewan ini yang tahu ber-kenaan dengan perubatan dan tahuberkenaan dengan undang2 supayakalau ada orange kita yang sakit itu,kita tidak payah engage doktor2 dariluar. Jadi ada-kah Kerajaan berfikirbahawa pada lain kali akan memasok-kan ahli2 yang bersifat peguam dandoktor2 sama dalam lawatan yang sa-macham ini. (Ketawa)?

2925 24 JANUARY 1967 2926

The Prime Minister: Saya, TuanSpeaker, suka memasokkan doktor2dengan loyar, tetapi dia orang hendakchari duit di-sini .... (Ketawa).Kalau dia pergi juga, dia ta' dapat duit.

Tuan Lim Kean Slew: I do not thinkthat we are concerned as to whether ornot Members of the Opposition went.No doubt, when you send people ontour, you might send some people likethe Member for Bachok, who probablyfeels that he is a suitable person toattend such tours. But the question isthis : Was it necessary (1) in view ofthe warning of the Honourable Minis-ter of Finance; (2) how were themembers of the team chosen-werethey chosen because of their nicemanners, were they chosen because oftheir ability to speak Thai language, orwere they chosen because of theirability of understanding parliamentaryprocedure elsewhere, or were theychosen purely by lots, or by chance,filling in the blank places with Mem-bers of the Opposition in order tostop question in this House?

The Prime Minister : Well, in thefirst place, they apply to go on thisvisit, and then it is to the Committee todecide whether such a visit is necessary.When the Committee has made up itsmind, or its decision, that the visit isnecessary, then they are sent on thistour.

Dr Tan Chee Khoon : Just now theHonourable Prime Minister stated thatI did not oppose this and, therefore, Imust have approved of it. Unfor-tunately, he was not here yesterdaymorning when I made my speech Icondemned this allocation in nouncertain terms. I stated, for the benefitof the Honourable Prime Minister, thatwe, Members of Parliament, are sovery prompt in voting for ourselvessuch perks while the taxpayers of thiscountry are groaning under the taxesheaped upon them by the HonourableMinister of Finance. One part of thequestion that I have asked is the namesof those who went on this tour and Ishall be very grateful to the PrimeMinister if he will reel off the nameswhich will be very revealing.

The Prime Minister: I thought ofsaving the time of this House by notreeling off the names of the 26 mem-bers. However, if the HonourableMember want it, I shall do so. Now,Sir, in reply to his suggestion-he madehis speech yesterday-these peoplewere sent in November and Decemberof last year, and the people who wentwere :

1. Senator Syed Darns bin SyedHashim

2. Senator Nik Hassan bin Haji NikYahya

3. Enche' Ikhwan Zaini

4. Pengarah Banyang anak Janting5. Geh Chong Keat6. Enche' Hussein bin To' Muda

Hassan

7. Enche' Mustapha bin Ahmad8. Enche' Mohd. Daud bin Abdul

Samad9. Enche' Ramli bin Omar

10. Tuan Haji Abu Bakar binHamzah

11. Enche' Suleiman bin Ali

12. Tuan Haji Zakaria bin HajiMohd. Taib

13. Enche' Yeh Pao Tze.

These are the first thirteen.

The next thirteen-we must remindhim that they also visit East Malaysia :

1. Senator Bibi Aisha binti HamidDon

2. Senator Mohamed Adib bin Omar

3. Enche' Abdul Ghani bin Ishak

4. Enche' Hanafi bin Mohd. Yunus

5. Enche' Abdul Razak bin HajiHussin

6. Enche' Joseph Manjaji7. Enche' Hussein bin Sulaiman

8. Enche' Chin Foon

9. Orang Tua Muhammad Dara binLangpad

10. Enche' Mohamed Idris bin Matsil

11. Tuan Haji Ahmad bin Saaid

12. Enche' Seah Teng Ngiab13. Che' Ajibah binti Abol.

2927 24 JANUARY 1967

Wan Abdul Kadir bin Ismail (KualaTrengganu Utara): Oleh kerananampak-nya bangkangan kapada per-kara lawatan ini timbul daripada PartiBuroh sahaja, maka boleh-kah PerdanaMenteri menimbangkan pada masahadapan, supaya tidak kechil hatiahli2 Parti Buroh, memasokkan samaahli2 Parti Buroh dalam rombongandan sa-bagai-nya.

The Prime Minister : Say a suka me-masokkan dia orang, dia orang ada duaorang sahaja. Dua orang ini, sa-orangdoktor, sa-orang loyar, ta' sukakeluar-rugi duit. (Ketawa).

Dr Tan Chee Khoon: Tuan Yangdi-Pertua, barangkali kita pekerja2tidak senang pergi melawat negeri2luar !

Tuan Lim Kean Siew: Is theHonourable Prime Minister suggestingthat those people sent to traveloverseas are people who are out ofjobs? (Laughter). A further supplemen-tary question : Is the HonourablePrime Minister suggesting that becausethe people are busy, therefore, it ispresumed that they cannot go on agoodwill mission?

The Prime Minister: It is my pre-sumption. On the other hand, I will tryand invite you to the next tour, andsee whether you will come on this tour;and if you can I shall be very happyindeed to include you in the list oftours.

Tuan Lim Kean Siew: Supple-mentary question, Mr Speaker, Sir.According to the information of theHonourable Prime Minister, at leastmembers of the Opposition agree thatwe are not concerned whether or notwe are invited to goodwill missions;we may or may not go to goodwillmissions; what we are asking is this,was it necessary in view of the Honour-able the Finance Minister's warningthat our funds must be saved? And,if we may make a further suggestion,will the Honourable Prime Ministeragree to the fact that if goodwillmissions are to be sent in future, thereis no need to send so many people,

2928

and it is essential further that weshould see whether or not these peopleare qualified to go on such a goodwilltour, and that qualifications should notinclude unemployment?

The Prime Minister: When they areMembers of Parliament, I suppose theHonourable Member must understandthey are in employment. In fact, theyhave got quite a lot of work travellinghere and there . It is because ofthe Honourable Member's lack oftravelling , that he has lost many of hissupporters . On our side they have allthe time to visit their constituencies, toattend to the needs of the members oftheir constituencies , and so they are inemployment , and it is not to suggestthat they are unemployed and beggingto go all the time . However , the sugges-tion, which the Honourable Memberput to me just now, I will certainly putit to the Committees who attend to allthese tours.

LAWATAN WARTAWAN RUSSIAKA-MALAYSIA

2. Tuan Ahmad bin Arshad (MuarUtara) bertanya kapada Menteri LuarNegeri (a) sama ada lawatan sa-orangwartawan Russia ka-Malaysia padaakhir tahun lalu, ada-kah di-ataspermintaan Kerajaan Russia atauKerajaan Malaysia; (b) sama adawartawan itu telah mengunjongi Per-dana Menteri, jika tidak, mengapa; dan(c) sama ada sa-buah persidanganWartawan2 Malaysia telah di-adakanuntok menghantar suatu rombonganmelawat Russia, dan juga, nyatakansama ada permintaan dari TASS untokmenubohkan sa-buah pejabat di-Malaysia ini, telah di-terima.

Perdana Menteri : Tuan Yang di-Pertua, dua orang wartawan Soviettelah melawat negeri kita ini is-itusatu daripada PRAVDA, OfficialNewspaper Soviet, Mr Yuri Yasnevdan satu daripada TASS, Mr Matsusin.Masa mereka ada di-sini tidak dapathendak berjumpa dengan saya olehkerana saya tidak ada di-KualaLumpur, tetapi mereka ada-lah ber-jumpa dengan Timbalan PerdanaMenteri dan juga Menteri Hal Ehwal

2929 24 JANUARY 1967 2930

Dalam Negeri, Menteri Kewangan,Menteri Kerja Raya, Pos dan Talikomdan Menteri Perdagangan dan Perusa-haan. Jadi saya tidak tahu berkenaandengan soal ada-kah wartawan2 kitadi-sini ada mengambil keputusan ber-chadang hendak melawat Russia;jikalau ada says berasa sudah tentuKerajaan tidak ada tegahan merekamelawat negeri Russia dan negeri2yang lain. Itu-lah sahaja.

Tuan Ahmad bin Arshad : Soalantambahan. Berkenaan dengan jawapanyang telah di-berikan oleh Yang AmatBerhormat Menteri Luar Negeri kitatadi, sa-telah pulang wartawan Russiaini ka-negara-nya tentu ada membuatberita atas kacha mata negeri kita ini,ada-kah Kerajaan kita ini mendapatberita2 yang di-tulis oleh wartawan2itu untok pengetahuan Kerajaan kita?

Perdana Menteri : Belum lagi dapatcherita di-atas apa yang mereka tulisberkenaan lawatan mereka di-sini.

Twin Haji Abu Bakar bin Hamzah:Soalan tambahan. Berbangkit daripadajawapan Yang Teramat Mulia TunkuPerdana Menteri berkenaan denganlawatan wartawan kita ka-Russia, sa-kira-nya mereka itu membuat keputu-san Kerajaan tidak menegah. Jadi, sayahendak bertanya, ada-kah Kerajaantidak berkata apa2 kalau sa-kira-nyaada Member of Parliament dapat suratdaripada Moscow menjemput pergika-sana dan Member of Parliament itubersedia hendak pergi pada bila2 diasenang?

Perdana Menteri: Kita suka kalaudapat di-hantar Ahli2 Yang Berhormatpergi melawat ka-negeri sa-umpamaitu termasok-lah Ahli Yang Berhormatdaripada Socialist Front. (Ketawa).

Dr Tan Chee Khoon : Tuan Yang di-Pertua, kalau sa-kira-nya saya hendakmelawat Russia, boleh-kah Menteriyang berkenaan bagi kebenaran?

Perdana Menteri : Sentiasa-nya sayaberi kebenaran.

Tuan Lim Kean Slew: Will theHonourable Prime Minister make surethat the Honourable Minister of Home

Affairs has understood his answer.(Laughter).

The Prime Minister: We have alwaysworked together, whatever I agree;he will agree; whatever he agrees, Iwill agree. (Laughter).

Tuan Ahmad bin Arshad : SoalanTambahan. Berhubong dengan warta-wan Russia tadi, saya sa-bagaimanara`ayat negeri ini dapat tahu, bahawawartawan daripada PRA VDA itutelah menghadiahkan Pingat Kebak-tian Sederhana kapada Ketua MenteriMelaka, Enche' Abdul Ghaf ar Baba.Penerimaan ini ada-kah dapat per-setujuan daripada Kerajaan kita ataudi-tunjokkan oleh Kerajaan kita. Danpingat yang di-beri itu ada-kah dari-pada Lembaga Persurat-khabarandaripada Russia atau pun daripadaKerajaan Russia?

Perdana Menteri: Hadiah chuma-nyamenunjokkan perasaan muhibbah yangmereka dapat kenangan-yang merekadapat sambutan yang baik di-sini,maka dengan itu Kerajaan tidak tegahapa2-bukan Kerajaan Russia-chumadaripada mereka yang datang itu sa-haja.

NEGARA2 KOMUNIS YANGTELAH BERUBAH SIKAP

TERHADAP MALAYSIA3. Tuan Ahmad bin Arshad bertanyakapada Menteri Luar Negeri ada-kahbenar sa-tengah daripada negara2 ko-munis telah berubah sikap terhadapMalaysia; dan jika ya, nyatakannama negara2 yang demikian sertabukti2 yang menunjokkan perubahansikap.

Perdana Menteri: Tuan Yang di-Pertua, sa-benar-nya Kerajaan Komu-nis Socialist-negeri2 yang memakaidasar Socialist Komunis itu ada-lahsadikit masa ini nampak-nya berubahperasaan-nya terhadap negeri kita mi.Dengan perubahan itu negeri itu telah,sa-bagaimana saya katakan tali,menghantarkan wakil2 daripada surat2khabar ka-negeri ini dan kita punhantar rombongan kita ka-negeri.umpama Russia, tetapi sunggoh punada perhubongan sa-umpama itu,belum lagi ada daripada mana pehak

2931 24 JANUARY 1967 2932

atau pun daripada pehak kita denganmereka itu menunjokkan atau mem-buat chadangan hendak mengadakandiplomatic relation dengan negeri2 itu.

Tuan Haji Abu Bakar bin Hamzah:Soalan tambahan dalam bulan Machtahun yang lalu saya berada di-TimorTengah dan saya bertemu dengan duaorang daripada negeri yang sayafaham negeri itu komunis is-itu Bul-garia dan Czechoslovakia atau Poland.Jadi, dalam perbualan itu orang itumenggunakan satu perkataan yangsaya pun hendak bertanya pada hariini, kata-nya : "Your Prime Minister,Tunku Abdul Rahman, is my goodfriend. (Ketawa). Jadi, saya hendakbertanya di-dalam term istillah bagai-mana-kah yang or ang2 daripada negerikomunis itu sayang kapada PerdanaMenteri kita ini lebeh daripada kamidalam pembangkang sayang--sa-hingga mengatakan good friend. (Ke-tawa).

Perdana Menteri: Terima kaseh, sayapun tidak tahu orang sayang kapadasaya (Ketawa), Allah Taala yang mahakaya, maha kuasa, saya tidak pernahkenal pun dia orang.

Dr Tan Chee Khoon: Soalan Tam-bahan, Tuan Yang di-Pertua boleh-kahYang Amat Berhormat Perdana Men-teri beritahu kapada Rumah yangBerhormat ini ada-kah dia adaberhubong rapat dengan lain2 orangekomunis?

Perdana Menteri: Saya sa-benar-nyatidak pernah-saya jumpa Chin Pengsa-kali di-Baling. (Ketawa).

LATEHAN TENTERA

4. Tuan Haji Abu Bakar bin Hamzahbertanya kapada Menteri Pertahanansama ada benar atau tidak bahawaKerajaan berchadang hendak mewa-jibkan tiap2 warganegara Malaysiasupaya menjalani latehan tentera sejakmereka di-sekolah lagi; dan jika ya,bila-kah peratoran ini akan di-kuatkuasakan.

The Deputy Prime Minister andMinister of Defence (Tun Haji AbdulRazak): Tuan Yang di-Pertua, soalanini tidak benar.

LATEHAN TENTERA BAG!AHLI2 PARLIMEN

5. Tuan Haji Abu Bakar bin Hamzahbertanya kapada Menteri Pertahanansama ada Kerajaan akan menggalak-kan Ahli2 Parlimen supaya menjalanilatehan tentera untok tempoh sa-kurang2-nya dua bulan; jika ya, bila-kah peluang menjalani latehan iniakan di-buka kapada mereka.

Tun Haji Abdul Razak: Tuan Yangdi-Pertua, Kerajaan tidak ada chada-ngan pada masa ini hendak menggalak-kan Ahli2 Parlimen bagi menjalankanlatehan tentera tetapi jika sa-siapa jugaAhli2 Dewan ini suka hendak men-dapat latehan boleh-lah mereka itumasok Askar Wataniah atau pun Pa-sokan Pertahanan Tempatan.

Tuan Haji Abu Bakar bin Hamzah:Soalan tambahan, kalau sa-kira-nyaAhli Perlimen hendak masok TenteraWataniah, bagaimana-kah layananyang akan di-beri oleh pehak Kera-jaan.

Tun Haji Abdul Razak : Tuan Yangdi-Pertua, sama juga layanan yang di-beri kapada Ahli2 Parlimen tenteraWataniah dan Pasokan Pertahananyang lain.

Tuan Haji Abu Bakar bin Hamzah:Soalan tambahan jika ada Ahli Parli-men yang ingin hendak berkhidmatdalam tentera dan meminta kapadaKementerian Pertahanan boleh-kah isdi-benarkan mengambil Iatehan DepotMilitary yang sa-benar-nya, tidakdalam Tentera Wataniah?

Tun Haji Abdul Razak: Tuan Yangdi-Pertua kalau hendak masok tenterasukarela ini terpaksa-lah kita mengikutPeratoran Tentera ini, latehan2 akandi-beri oleh Pegawai2 Tetap-TenteraTetap kapada semua Ahli2 yangmasok berkhidmat dalam TenteraSukarela mi.

Tuan Lim Kean Siew: Mr Speaker,Sir, in view of the practice of theSingapore Government making Cabi-net Ministers as colonels, will theHonourable Deputy Prime Ministerconsider whether or not to make the

2933 24 JANUARY 1967 2934

Honourable Member for Bachok aLieutenant-Colonel?

Tun Haji Abdul Razak : I wouldlike to test him first-to test his ability,etc. (Laughter).

BUMIPUTERA SABAH DANSARAWAK MEMASOKI ASKAR

MELAYU DI-RAJA6. Tuan Haji Abu Bakar bin Hamzahbertanya kapada Menteri Pertahananada-kah Kerajaan membuka peluangkapada bumiputera2 di-Sabah dan di-Sarawak untok memasoki PasokanAskar Melayu di-Raja dan jika ya,berapa orang-kah telah di-ambil sa-takat mi.

Tun Haji Abdul. Razak: Tuan Yangdi-Pertua, bumiputera2 Sabah danSarawak telah di-benarkan masokdalam Askar Melayu tetapi sa-hinggahari ini belum-lah ada sa-orang punlagi yang meminta masok.

PETITION FROM PERSONSDISMISSED ABRUPTLY FROMTHE MINISTRY OF DEFENCE

7. Dr Tan Chee Khoon asks theMinister of Defence if he is aware thathis Permanent Secretary, Tan SriAbdul Kadir bin Shamsuddin, hasreceived a letter signed by 34 personscomplaining about the manner of thedismissal of these persons, and alsoassure this House that adequatenotice will be given to persons whoseservices are being terminated by hisMinistry.

Tun Haji Abdul Razak: Mr Speaker,Sir, I am aware that the Secretary forDefence has received a letter signed by34 persons about the manner of theirabrupt dismissal. The letter came fromthe personnel of the Territorial Army,who have been looking after thesecurity of Camp 61 Ordinance Main-tenance Park, Setapak.

These people were called up forfull-time service for the period of theconfrontation. With the ending of theconfrontation, they are being demo-bilised from full-time service and revertto part-time service as they were beforethe confrontation.

They were informed about theirdemobilisation at the end of the yearon 1st December, 1966. The shortnotice of one month given to themwas due to the fact that, as a result ofplanning difficulties, the decision todemobilise them was only taken to-wards the end of November. Normally,as long notice as possible extendingup to three months is given to thesepeople before they are demobilised.However, in this case, I have decidedto extend the period of notice to threemonths.

Dr Tan Chee Khoon: Mr Speaker,Sir, is the Honourable Minister awarethat, far from what he has told thisHouse of a notice being given on the1st of December, notice rather wasgiven round about 7th of December,and soon after that they wrote thisletter to the Secretary for Defence?Will the Honourable Minister alsotell us whether he has received severalother letters from others other thanthese 34 that I have mentioned, all ofwhom did not even get acknowledge-ment letters from the Ministry ofDefence?

Tun Haji Abdul Razak: Mr Speaker,Sir, according to the record, the noticegiven was dated 1st December. I havenot personally received representationfrom other personnel. If the Ministryhas received it, obviously this matteris being looked into, and normally thismatter will be brought to my personalattention.

Tuan Haji Abu Bakar bin Hamzah:Soalan tambahan, saya ada menerimabeberapa surat daripada anggota2pasokan ini yang mencheritakan masa-alah pemberhentian mereka itu danlayanan2 yang tidak baik. Semua suratitu telah saya kirimkan kapada Ke-menterian Pertahanan dan saya sukamendapat tahu ma`alumat itu di-luardari Dewan ini supaya kita tidak sebokdi-masa meshuarat. Saya hendak tahuada-kah surat2 itu telah sampai danmengapa-kah surat2 itu tidak di-jawabdan pengakuan bahawa di-ketika me--ngirimkan itu, masa itu aver bah yangpertama di-Kelantan itu, jadi, sayasendiri tidak dapat hendak mengata-kan bahawa surat itu betul dalam pos

2935 24 JANUARY 1967 2936

boleh sampai, tetapi yang saya hendaktahu jikalau sampai mengapa-kahsurat2 itu tidak di-j awab kerana di-dapati di-dalam surat2 itu banyak-lahperkara2 rahsia yang saya lebeh sukaMenteri itu sendiri mengatasi daripadamembuka benda itu dalam Dewan.

Tun Haji Abdul Razak : Tuan Yangdi-Pertua, Surat itu tidak-lah sampaika-tarigan saya sendiri tetapi kalau sa-benar2 surat itu telah di-hantar tentutelah sampai kapada Kementerian saya.Saya akan siasat perkara mi. Kalauada surat itu says perchaya tindakan2,kalau belum pun di-ambil, akan di-ambil di-atas perkara2 yang di-kemukakan itu.

Dr Tan Chee Khoon: Mr Speaker,Sir, by now, the Honourable Ministerfor Defence should know that comp-laints of this nature are fairly wide-spread, and that none other than theHonourable Member for Bachok hashimself sent the letters he has receivedand has not even got an acknowledg-ment from the Ministry of Defence.This seems to be a contagious diseasein Government Departments or Minis-tries. Mr Speaker, Sir, will the Honour-able Minister of Defence tell uswhether, if I hand over a letter to himor to any officer that he may designate,we can get his Ministry to look intoand reply? What the main grouse ofall these people is that they did noteven get a letter of acknowledgmentfrom the Ministry.

Tun Haji Abdul Razak : It is thenormal practice that letters would bereplied to, but sometimes I think theDepartment and the Ministry do take alittle bit of time to look into thematter, and it is only after action hasbeen taken that a reply is sent. So, inthese instances, possibly that matter isbeing looked into, and I will see to itthat all these letters are being replied.

AUSTRALIAN CANBERRA JETBOMBER SQUADRON STATIONEDIN MALAYA SENT TO SOUTH

VIETNAM

8. Tuan Lim Kean Siew asks theMinister of Defence to explain thedespatch of an Australian Canberra

jet bomber squadron stationed inMalaya to South Vietnam recently andwhether this is not complicity in thebarbarous U.S. war in Vietnam.

Tun Haji Abdul Razak: Sir, Iassume that the Honourable Membermust be referring to the 8 CanberraBomber Squadron stationed at Butter-worth as part of the CommonwealthStrategic Reserve. With the ending ofthe Indonesian confrontation, theAustralian Government has informedus that they would like to withdrawthis squadron for services elsewhere.Obviously, we have no objection tothe withdrawal of this squadron. Whatthe Australian Government wants todo with the squadron after it has beenwithdrawn from this country is solelya matter for the Australian Govern-ment to decide.

Dr Tan Chee Khoon : Mr Speaker,Sir, is the Honourable Minister ofDefence aware--at least it is announc-ed in the press-that this squadronwill be replaced by another squadron?If so, will it not show us in the eyes ofthe world that we are already partici-pating in the conflict in Vietnam andthat will not improve our image in theeyes of Afro-Asia?

Tun Haji Abdul Razak : Mr Speaker,Sir, the stationing of the CommonwealthStrategic Reserve in this country hasnothing to do with the war in Vietnam.We have a Defence Treaty with theUnited Kingdom. Government and theAustralian and the New ZealandGovernments are associated with thisDefence Treaty, and we agree underthat Treaty that these three countriesare allowed to station troops here asa Strategic Reserve, and the characterof these troops is changed from timeto time with our agreement.

Tuan Lim Kean Siew: Mr Speaker,Sir, the reason given for the sending ofthe Canberra Bomber 'Squadron toSouth Vietnam by the AustralianGovernment was because of the endingof the confrontation and because theydid not see any need to further stationthe Squadron here; and yet thisSquadron was replaced by another

2937 24 JANUARY 1967 2938

Squadron. Therefore, the reason givenby the Australian Government was notquite correct. If that is so, should notour Government point this out to theAustralian Government?

Tun Haji Abdul Razak: Mr Speaker,Sir, they have not indicated that theywill replace this Squadron yet, andfrom the information that I havereceived, when they wanted to with-draw this, they only asked our agree-ment to withdraw this squadron and Isaid, obviously, we had no objectionto withdraw it. That is all we did.

Tuan Lim Kean Siew: Mr Speaker,Sir, we of course, do not know whatreally happens in private correspond-ence between our Government and theGovernment of Australia, but never-theless there was a press report sayingthat this Government's squadron wasbeing replaced by another squadron,and if that is not true then at least,the paper report should be corrected,because the impression given was asquadron from here was sent toVietnam and in its place there cameanother Australian squadron.

Tun Haji Abdul Razak: Sir, it isnot a matter for us to correct the faultin the papers, if it is not true. Fromtime to time, if there is any matter ofpublic interest, we do make pressstatements and I think if only whenthe Government does make that pressstatement you can take that as the realtruth from the Government.

Tuan Lim Kean Siew : Will then theHonourable Deputy Prime Ministerinform this House that this squadronhas not yet, or is not being, replacedby another Australian squadron?

Tun Haji Abdul Razak : I know thatit has not yet been replaced.

Tuan Lim Kean Siew: Supposing, Iwere to inform the Honourable DeputyPrime Minister that, in fact, anothersquadron has come to take its place,will the Honourable Deputy PrimeMinister claim us what he would thendo?

Tun Haji Abdul Razak: I cannotanswer a theoretical question.

Tuan Lim Kean Siew: It is not atheoretical question. I am now inform-ing the Honourable Deputy PrimeMinister that, in fact, a squadron hasreplaced this Australian squadron inButterworth.

Tun Haji Abdul Razak: I will checkit, Sir.

Tuan Lim Kean Siew: Sir, will theHonourable Deputy Prime Ministergive us this assurance-that he willcheck and, if possible, correct anywrong information in the press.

ROMPAK BERSENJATAKA-ATAS NELAYAN2

9, Tuan Ahmad bin Arshad bertanyakapada Menteri Hal Ehwal DalamNegeri (a) berapa kejadian rompakbersenj ata yang berlaku ka-atas nela-yan2 kita sejak konfrantasi di-jalankanhingga sekarang, (b) sama ada mangsa2itu mati akibat rompakan itu, danberapa-kah anggaran kerugian-nya.

The Minister of Home Affairs (TunDr Ismail): Tuan Yang di-Pertua,bilangan case2 rompakan bersenjataka-atas nelayan2 kita sejak mula-nyaberlaku konfrantasi sa-hingga sekarangis-lah 290. Dua orang yang menjadimangsa rompakan2 itu telah di-bunohdi-perayeran Malaysia dan empatorang di-perayeran antara bangsa.Jumlah yang terbunoh is-lah 6 orang.Jumlah taksiran harga barang danharta benda yang kechurian is-lah$1,192,334.60 di-samping itu $9,850wang tunai telah di-bayar sa-bagaitebusan dan dengan itu Jumlah besartaksiran kerugian is-lah $202,184.60.

ALLEGATION OF INEFFICIENCY,MISMANAGEMENT AND

MALPRACTICES IN RAILWAYADMINISTRATION

10. Tuan C. V. Devan Nair (Bungsar)asks the Minister of Transport whetherhe would institute a commission ofinquiry to look into the allegation of"inefficiency, mismanagement and mal-practices" which the Railwaymen'sUnion of Malaya maintained was thereason for the mounting financial lossof the Railway.

2939 24 JANUARY 1967

The Minister of Transport (Tan SriHaji Sardon): Mr Speaker, Sir, I havereceived RUM's allegations, and heardother allegations too, against the Rail-way Administration, but the Unionhas not substantiated any of theseallegations. Surely, the HonourableMember for Bungsar cannot expectme to waste time and money to setup a Commission to probe into theunsubstantiated allegations, and inaddition I have requested through theGovernment of Malaysia to get UnitedNations experts, a team of experts.on systems of transportation-not oneman but a group of experts on railway,road transport, civil aviation andshipping. We hope that they will comein the middle of this year, and willgo into all aspects so that we can co-ordinate all the means of communica-tion so as to give a better share to theRailway in the matter of carryinggoods because of the great competitionby lorries, especially the "C" lorries,which I explained previously. However,I like to say here and now that theRailway Administration should, infact, be complimented for managingits affairs so creditably despite seriousproblems and difficulties which it hashad to face.

I would also like to mention that in1960 and 1961 handsome profits orsurpluses were earned by the Railway.It was only after the railway strike(December 1962-January 1963) thatthe Railway began to incur deficits.The position of Railway surplus anddeficits over the past seven years areas follows :

1960 Surplus ... $2.4 million1961 Surplus ... 1.7 million1962 Deficit ... 196,6001963 Deficit ... 1.4 million1964 Deficit ... 4.1 million1965 Deficit ... 2.4 million1966 Deficit ... 9.4 million

The deficits over the last 5 yearshave been caused entirely by factorsbeyond the control of the RailwayAdministration. These are

(a) The phenomenal increases insalaries and allowances since1962.

2944

(b) The increasing amounts of loancharges paid by the Railway tothe Government.

(c) Severe competition from otherforms of transport especiallylorries which forced the Railwayto cut its freight charges, in orderto get goods, otherwise emptywagons will result.

(d) The severe drop in iron-oretraffic due to the closure of manyiron ore mines in the Ipoh andTemengan areas.

Increases in salaries and allowances-

Since 1963 all Railway employees.except Division I Officers (other thanTechnical Assistants Superscale) andthe Welfare Officer and General GradeE officers in Division II, have beengranted salary increases at one timeor another. The magnitude of theseincreases in salaries and allowancesmay not be appreciated, if I do notmention them. These are as follows :

per annum

$(i) Increases granted by the

Industrial Agreement, 1963, toDivision II, III, IV and ex-daily-rated staff, but exclu-ding clerical grades ... ... 2,504,000

(ii) Due to Package Deal grantedby Government w.e.f. 1964:

(a) Increases of Housing Al-lowances ... ... 600,000

(b) Increases of GazettedPublic Holidays ... 500,000

(iii) Increases in Travelling andSubsistence allowances gran-ted by Government w.e.f.1965 500,000

(iv) Revision of salaries of Ma-chine Operators and Typistsgranted by Government w.e.f.1964 ... ... ... ... 61,000

(v) Revision of salaries of Tech-nical Assistants granted byGovernment w.e.f. 1964 ... 66,000

(vi) Interim awards of 5% or$12.50 per month for DivisionIV and Industrial ManualGroup granted by Govern-ment w.e.f. 1965 ... ... 1,790,000

The impact of these increases insalaries and allowances amount to atotal of $6.6 million per annum com-pared to 1962. The Railways accountsfor 1966, however, also had to absorbthe arrears for 1965 of the interimaward granted to the Division IV and

2941 24 JANUARY 1967 2942

Industrial Manual Group , amountingto some $1.5 millions. Thereforecompared to 1962 the Railway'saccounts for 1966 include increasedsalaries and allowances totalling some$8.1 millions , To this must be addedthe element for annual incrementsestimated at $500,000 per annum.

For the sake of comparison, thetotal amounts of salaries and allow-ances (excluding pension and providentfunds) paid to the Railway employeesin 1961 and 1962 (i.e . before the Rail-way Strike) and the two most recentyears 1965 and 1966 were as follows :1961 $29 .6 millions (salaries paid out

of a total expendi-ture of $66 millionamounting 43.7 percent)

1962 ... 29 .6 „ (out of a total ex-penditure of $65.5millions i .e., 45.5per cent)

1963 34 .4 „ (out of a total ex-penditure of $71.3millions)

1966 40 . 1 „ (out of $76.5 mil-lions)

Now, in percentage the figures are :

1961 ... 43.7%1962 ... 45.4%1965 52.8%1966 ... 59.7 %-put it in round figure--

60%Loan Charges

Unlike Government departments, theRailway Administration must earn itsown revenue to pay for all its expendi-ture. Even for development andmodernisation projects, unlike Govern-ment departments, the Railway Ad-ministration also does not receive anyoutright grants from the Government.If it has not sufficient fund of its ownto finance its development and modern-isation projects it has to borrow fromthe Government, and these loans haveto be repaid with interest. The amountsof the redemption and interest chargeson these loans over the past 5 yearswere as follows :

1962 ... ... $1.53 millions1963 ... ... 1.771964 ... ... 2.161965 ... ... 2.481966 ... ... 2.84

Local Authorities AssessmentsIn addition , Local Authorities all

over the country have also beendemanding more and more assessmentcharges from the Railway for therailway properties in their areas, likerailway godown , offices , quarters, rail-way track road marshalling yards andworkshops . The Railway is not in aposition to pay in full the amountsdemanded by the various local authori-ties. However, it hopes to come tosome satisfactory terms with the localauthorities.

Revenue

On the revenue side, the Railwaylost quite a big slice of its traffic toroad transport as a direct result of theRailwaymen's Strike in December1962-January 1963. In addition , duringthe last few years competition fromroad transport especially the "C"lorries have grown more severe eachyear . Despite all these, through prudentand careful planning and also by itsspecial fares policy , the Railway inthe last few years has succeeded notonly to regain much of its lost trafficbut to capture new traffic as well. Toillustrate this , in 1965 the Railwaycarried 15 % more tonnage of goodsthan in 1962 , the ton-miles were 33%more , and the revenue earned wasabout 13% more than in 1962. Thestatistics for 1966 were equally favour-able despite the fact that due to theclosure of several of the big iron-oremines the iron -ore traffic declined from1,139,400 tons in 1965 to only 316,800tons in 1966 and the revenue thereforedropped from $4 .3 millions to $1.4millions.

Renewals ProvisionIn yesterday 's Malay Mail the

General Secretary of the Railwaymen'sUnion of Malaya (RUM) was reportedto have said that the Railway's deficitswere not caused by the increases insalaries and allowances but werecaused by the whims and fancies ofthe Railway Administration in makingexcess provisions for renewals. I havealready explained how phenomenalthe rise in the railwaymen 's wages orthe Railway 's wages bill have beenover the past 4 years.

2943 24 JANUARY 1967 2944

As far as the allegation by theGeneral Secretary of RUM in regardto the Railways Renewals provision.I must categorically refute this charge.Nothing can be further than the truth.The Railways Renewals provision isexactly the same as what is known as"depreciation" in the industrial andcommercial world. Nobody but themost ill-informed person can deny thatthe Railway Administration is right inadopting the prudent policy of makingdepreciation charges on a consistentbasis. I have not yet met or heard ofany sound businessman who varies hisdepreciation charges from year to yeardepending on the amounts of hisprofits or revenue. The amounts ofrenewals provision, or as businessmencall it depreciation charges, made bythe Railway Administration over thepast few years were as follows :

1961 ... ... $7.4 millions1962 ... ... 7.91963 ... ... 7.51964 ... ... 7.9 „1965 ... ... 8.01966 ... ... 8.0

The slight variation was caused bydeletion of life-expired or condemnedassets and addition of newly acquiredassets.

I like to repeat between 1962 and1966:

(a) Salaries and allowances (exclud-ing normal increments) of therailway staff increased by $8.1million;

(b) Loan charges increased by $1.31million;Whereas Renewals provision ordepreciation increased by only$100,000.

How can anyone say that the Rail-way deficits were not caused by theincreases in the wages bill? How cananyone say that the deficits were causedby the whims and fancies of the Rail-way Administration in making excessdepreciation charges?

As far as I am concerned, as Ministerof Transport since 1959, I have beenthrough all these strikes, all the pros-perity and austerity, whatever you call

it in the Railway. I am here trying mylevel best. If any Honourable Memberhere has got good suggestions, forgoodness sake, please quickly com-municate to me, so that I will try toanalyse them and put them intopractice, so that we can help theRailway instead of cursing one solitaryman, who is the sole corporation, thatis the General Manager. And in fact Iwould like to add, I think, the Govern-ment has agreed in principle, in factwe have agreed in principle, on therecommendation of putting the RailwayAdministration, which is a sole cor-poration, into a corporation aggregate,but unfortunately we have spent somuch time on the dispute whether Rail-way employees are civil servants or not.Now, however, that they are Govern-ment servants, it is high time that theyshould rally round and make theRailway Administration really acommercial and a running concern.

Tuan C. V. Devan Nair : Sir, wehave heard a most complicated answerto a very simple question. (Laughter).I wonder what, Sir, the Minister ofFinance will think, if he had heard hisMinisterial colleague congratulatingan Administration which has chalkedup such a lot of phenomenal deficits,as he calls it. Sir, would the Honour-able Minister, bearing in mind thefollowing observations I make, give ushis answer: First of all, statistically, ifthe Railway continues to grow moreand more inefficient, then it is quitepossible, statistically, that a hundredper cent of the revenues of the Rail-way would be expended on wagesthrough no fault of the workmen, butthrough the inability of the RailwayAdministration to improve efficiencyand thereby to increase revenue.Secondly, Sir, to be fair to the Rail-waymen's Union, they have offered tosubstantiate the charges they havemade before an impartial commissionof inquiry. The facts which theHonourable Minister has got from theRailway Administration are not dis-interested facts-he has got his assess-ment from an Administration whichhas failed. So, in that light, Sir, wouldhe not consider an impartial commis-sion of inquiry to go into this matter

2945 24 JANUARY 1967 2946

of serious deficits for the Railwaywhich is a matter of general publicconcern.

Alternatively Sir, he says that a teamof experts are going to visit this coun-try. Would it be possible to include inthe terms of reference of this U.N.team of experts a careful examination,after considering all the evidence andlistening to the Union's side as well, anassessment of the real reasons for theRailways phenomenal deficit, andwhether or not any reason would existto congratulate the whole lot of failuresin the Railway Administration.

Tan Sri Haji Sardon : I give thisassurance to the Honourable Memberfrom Bungsar, Sir. When I said that ateam of United Nations experts arecoming, I mean that they are comingin to investigate into all aspects oftransportation including the railwaysection itself. That is why there is noneed to have duplication-we have toomany commissions. In fact, one of themost important recommendations bythe five men experts from India was toturn as early as possible this RailwayAdministration, which is a sole cor-poration, that is the General Manager,according to the Enactment in 1948,into a corporation aggregate like theC.E.B. As the Member for Bungsar, iswell supported by our Railway boysas a trade unionist, can he persuadethem to agree that that is more econo-mical and more beneficial to them. Igive the undertaking that we are look-ing into all aspects-not only the meansof transportation.

Tuan Lim Kean Siew: I do notunderstand what he means by solecorporation into a corporation aggre-gate. Does he mean a corporation soleinto a corporation aggregate, or solecorporation to many corporations?

Tan Sri Haji Sardon: My learnedfriend for Dato Kramat is a lawyerhimself, has he not read the RailwayOrdinance, 1948? It is a sole corpora-tion, or corporation sole, whatever it is.It means that the General Manager isthe only man-and I think more headsare better than one. That is why theCommission on the Economic Running

of the Railways has recommended toconvert this into a corporation aggre-gate, which the RUM resists strongly.

Tuan D. R. Seenivasagam: MrSpeaker, Sir, I think the whole answerboils down to one word "failure" and,as a consequence of that, will the Hon-ourable Minister resign?

Tan Sri Haji Sardon : It is not foryou to say whether I resign or not. Iwant to make sure that I can put rightthe Railway, if only the RUM and allemployees will give full co-operationfor their good, for our good and for thewhole nation's good.

Dr Mahathir bin Mohamad: MrSpeaker, Sir, in view of the almostinsurmountable difficulties that arefacing the Railway Administrationnow, may I ask the Honourable Mini-ster whether he would consider clos-ing down the railway services andconcentrating on road transport andother means of transport? (Laughter).

Tan Sri Haji Sardon : It is not forme to say that. I have to refer itto the Government, because many ofthe Honourable Members in this Houseare not aware that we have got $300million assets, and these assets arenational assets. The only thing now isthat there is no flood to close therailways, and when the roads are underflooded you all travel by railways.Please do not forget yourselves.(Laughter).

Dr Tan Chee Khoon: Mr Speaker,Sir, the Honourable Minister ofTransport, who is a lawyer, in reelingoff his statistical data, which must havecaused a lot of us some mentalindigestion, appears so defensive thathe appears to be a witness in the dock,and most of us on this side of theHouse are for the prosecution.(Laughter). Mr Speaker, Sir, thequestion I would like to ask theHonourable Minister for Transport isthis-a very simple one. There hasbeen in the Press differences ofinterpretation of the latest award bySir George Oehlers, Can he tell uswhose interpretation is correct-thatgiven by the one or that given by

2947 24 JANUARY 1967

some official of the Railway Adminis-tration? Number 2, will the Honour-able the Minister for Transport ... .

Tan Sri Haji Sardon : Mr Speaker,Sir, on a point of order. This is aboutthe Railway Administration, but thatreport is not within my jurisdiction. Itis a different question. You can writeto the Secretary of the IndustrialRelations Court, and you will get aninterpretation. I have got no right toreply to something which is outsidemy jurisdiction.

Dr Tan Chee Khoon : The Ministerhimself, in his reply, if I heard hislongwinded reply correctly, mentionedthat Railway servants are not Govern-ment's servants, and that has been amatter of contention between RUMand the Railway Administration. Con-sequently, I am asking him a simplequestion. Are Railway employees nowregarded as Government servants ornot, and with it goes the implicationthat they will get pension rights, theywill get medical benefits, instead ofgoing to the Genera' Hospital and betold "Awak bukan pekerja Kerajaan,pergi-lah doktor luar?"

Tan Sri Haji Sardon : Mr Speaker,Sir, I think the Honourable Memberfor Batu should understand this: thateven Government servants not all arepensionable; you read the PensionsOrdinance, and you will see that thereare Government servants enumeratedas pensionable and those who arenot--leave alone Railway employeeswho are converted as civil servants,and if they are not in the pensionableordinance, they are not. It is not forme to answer. It is legislation, Sir.

Tuan Haji Ahmad bin Abdullah(Kelantan Hhir): Soalan tambahan,Tuan Yang di-Pertua. Di-dalam ke-terangan yang telah di-kemukakanoleh Yang Berhormat Menteri Peng-angkutan berkenaan kerugian yangbagitu besar is-itu sa-banyak $9 jutais-lah kerana kekurangan perkhid-matan. Sa-tengah daripada-nya is-lahkerana daripada lombong2 besi telahdi-tutup dan sa-bagai-nya. Tetapi suka-lah saya hendak bertanya kapada-nyaada-kah pemintaan saudagar2 kayu di-

2948

Pantai Timor untok mendapat lebehbanyak lagi wagon2 untok mengangkutkayu2 balak ini ka-Singapura dan lain2tempat telah di-tunaikan? Kerana iniis-lah satu peluang yang paling baiksa-kali bagi Pejabat Kereta Api iniuntok mendapat hasil yang lebeh baik.

Tan Sri Haji Sardon : Saperti yangsaya menjawab dalam Budget Meetingyang lalu, Kereta Api sudah menam-bah 100 gerabak2 istimewa keranamembawa balak2 terutama sa-kali di-Pantai Timor. Tetapi saya pun tidakdapat tahu yang akhir2 ini berapa ratusgerabak itu sudah sampai. Insha'Allah, terima kaseh, kita akan usaha-kan tentang gerabak itu.

Tuan Lim Kean Siew: Mr Speaker,Sir, the Honourable Minister just nowinterpreted the Pensions Ordinance; atthe same time, to my Honourablecolleague for Batu, he said that it wasnot the job of his Ministry or theRailway Administration to understandthe Arbitration Court award, or tostate what the proper interpreta-tion.....

Tan Sri Haji Sardon: Mr Speaker,Sir, I think it is a matter for theIndustrial Relations Court. It is notwithin my jurisdiction, and if they havegot any doubt write to them, they willreply to you.

Tuan Lim Kean Siew: Sir, thequestion asked him was which inter-pretation is correct, and he did state inthis House that, if one wants toknow the correct interpretation, towrite to the Arbitration Court, andthey would tell him what the correctinterpretation is as it is not within hisjurisdiction to know what the interpre-tation is. Will the Honourable Minis-ter, therefore, inform us if that is notevidence of inefficiency--that he couldnot even write to the ArbitrationCourt for such a fine interpretation?

Tan Sri Haji Sardon: There was astatement by the P.E.O. the Railway,and the Ministry are looking into this.They are still looking into it, and howcan I tell you what is the result, whenit is not finished.

2949 24 JANUARY 1967 2950

Tuan Lim Kean Slew: That was notwhat you said just now.

Tan Sri Haji Sardon : You asked meas a Minister with limited power asfar as the Railway is concerned-thatis all.

The Minister for Labour (TuanV. Maniekavasagam): There is no dis-agreement between the Railwaymen'sUnion of Malaya and the Governmentover the terms of the award, Sir. Imust make it very clear.

Tuan Lim Kean Slew: Mr Speaker,Sir, on a point of order-this is ques-tion time, Sir. Is he asking a questionor is he answering.

Tuan V. Manickavasagam: I wishto clarify the position, Sir, because theHonourable Member for Batu saidthat there was a dispute over theaward and I must make it clear herethat there is no dispute over theaward, and if there is any, the partiesare at liberty to write to the IndustrialCourt.

Dr Tan Chee Khoon: Mr Speaker,Sir, the Honourable Minister forTransport in his long reply also tookthe opportunity to pay bonquets to theGeneral Manager.

Tan Sri Haji Sardon: Not theGeneral Manager, but to the RailwayAdministration, Sir.

Dr Tan Chee Khoon: The RailwayAdministration. I shall not put wordsin his mouth. I do not know how hereconciles, Sir, these compliments tothe Railway Administration, in viewof the perennial bickerings and openwarfare between the Railway Adminis-tration and RUM. The Member forIpoh has called for the resignation ofthe Minister for Transport. MrSpeaker, Sir, I will be a little kinder.I will ask him whether, in view ofthis pergadohan between RUM andthe Railway Administration, he willconsider sacking the General Manager.

Tan Sri Haji Sardon : We will lookinto all the aspects. It is not for youto tell us. We, as the Government,know what we have got to do.

Mr Speaker: Order, Order. Time fororal questions is now over.

BILL PRESENTED

THE HIRE PURCHASE BILL

Bill to regulate the form and thecontents of the hire purchase agreementand the rights and duties of parties tosuch agreements; presented by theMinister of Commerce and Industry;read the first time; to be read a secondtime at the subsequent sitting of thisHouse.

BILL

THE SUPPLY (1967) BILL

Second Reading

Order read for resumption of debateon Question, "That the Bill be nowread a second time" (23rd January,1967).

Tuan D. R. Seeniva .sagam (Ipoh):Mr Speaker, Sir, I rise to participatein this debate, and we must realisethat 1967 brings us to ten years ofindependence. Where a country requiresmoney, as the Honourable Minister ofFinance said, that money can only begot in the form of taxation. With thatstatement, I agree. But I think that thepoint at issue is this, who brought thecountry to a state where taxation hasto be imposed at these levels? I thinkthe answer to that question is whatthe people of Malaysia would want toknow. The answer obviously is, "TheMinister of Finance and the Govern-ment of this country have brought thecountry to a stage where taxation atsuch high levels has to be imposed".Like any business-the running of thecountry is a business--if the manage-ment is bad the remedy lies with theshareholders of that business-and thatis, the citizens of this country-and Ihave no doubt that when the timecomes, they will consider whether theyshould change the managers or partnerswho have mismanaged the affairs ofthis country.

Mr 'Speaker, Sir, but more importantthan that, perhaps, is the year 1967,because it is in this year that the very

2951 24 JANUARY 1967

controversial issue of language willhave to be resolved in this House,either by a Bill or by a Resolutioncoming before both Houses ofParliament.

In 1957, we, as politicians , as citizensof this country , set out to build aunited Malayan nation at that time,and subsequently a Malaysian nation.Mr Speaker , Sir, how far have wesucceeded? How far are our Budgetestimates and the moneys we havespent and the moneys we havecollected gone towards forming thatMalayan nation , and subsequently theMalaysian nation? The HonourableMinister of Finance has already toldus what the Malaysian nation hasbrought us. Sabah and Sarawak haveonly been a burden on the people ofMalaya . Large sums of our money arespent in East Malaysia , and I have nodoubt that parts of East Malaysia haveno desire to be in the Malaysian sceneat all.

If the Kampong Bharu By-Electionis hailed as a victory for the Alliance.then the defeat of the Alliance in theSarawak by-election , in a strongholdof the Alliance, is similarly a vote ofno-confidence in the Alliance organi-sation in Sarawak . But, Mr Speaker,Sir, these by-elections are a pointer,because Kampong Bharu by -election iscertainly no victory for the AllianceParty- -if it is a victory at all, it is avictory for the Opposition-and on theother hand , the Sarawak result isan outright condemnation of theMalaysian set-up.

Mr Speaker , Sir, this country hasgone on for ten years , and for tenyears what have the people been told?The people have been told : "We aregiving you democracy . This is a demo-cratic nation. You have rights. Youhave privileges and you have obliga-tions". Let us, first, see how democracyhas been whittled down in the lastten years , how it has been damagedand destroyed to such an extent thattoday even the Civil Service of thiscountry has no confidence , and that isthe reason why the Civil Service hasdeteriorated to a position where certainGovernment servants say , "We don't

2952

care two hoots. We are working hereand so long as we work we will justdo our jobs. That is all"; and thereason for that, Mr Speaker, Sir, islack of confidence , unfair treatment,promotions done improperly--positionsof importance not given to personswho are entitled to them, but given asfavours and gifts to other personsabove the heads of those who areentitled to them. That is the positionof the Civil Service in this countrytoday.

Mr Speaker , Sir, first , on the demo-cratic side , in the last ten years theGovernment took away the electionsto local authorities. It is an institutionwhich prevails in every democraticcountry, which the Honourable PrimeMinister promised-and I emphasise -promised that on the ending of con-frontation it would be re-establishedin this land. Confrontation has ended.Where are the local elections? Evenwe in Ipoh are only sitting as statutorymembers of the Municipal Council ofIpoh. We have no desire to sit thereas Statutory members, and we callupon the Government to implementthat promise to re-establish electionsto local authorities at the earliestpossible opportunity.

Mr Speaker, Sir, on freedom of theindividual , it is shocking that politi-cians are being gagged by writtenorders of the Honourable Minister ofHome Affairs. There are many cases,but take the important case of Enche'Ahmad Boestamam . He was released.He was declared to be no longer asecurity risk to this country. Now, canany sane person, can any person ofordinary common sense , imagine whyhe should be restricted from politicalactivity in this country , if he is nosecurity risk to the nation? MrSpeaker, Sir, that is the clearestexample of getting rid of politicalopponents in this country . Mr Speaker,Sir, can there be justification for it? Ifhe is no political risk , then whyshould you stop him from being apolitician? Similarly , with so manyother detainees who were released;everyone has a condition-"You shallnot delve in politics". Mr Speaker, Sir,there can be no justifiable reason,.

2953 24 JANUARY 1967

except a blatant, complete, nakedviolation of the fundamental right ofa citizen of this country.

Mr Speaker , Sir, on freedom of thePress, in November, last year--I shallgive the date and the time if my wordsare not accepted--by a written letterthe Honourable Deputy Prime Ministercalled the Press for a meeting . Repre-sentatives of almost every Press inMalaya, except the foreign Press--andthat is important , except the foreignPress--were called for a meeting withthe Honourable Deputy Prime Minister.This was a period when the languageissue was being spoken of in so manysections of the community of this land,when it was a raging controversialissue in November , 1966. A meetingwas called and , amongst other things,the Honourable Deputy Prime Ministersaid words to this effect-these arenot the actual words : that the Govern-ment did not like any publicity overthe language issue in the Press of thiscountry. Mr Speaker , Sir, I understandone pressman had the courage to say,"We will publish what we want withinthe law". Then the Honourable DeputyPrime Minister is alleged to have saidthat the vernacular Press , in particular,were playing up the language issue abit too much . Mr Speaker , Sir, thoseobservations by themselves may meannothing , but taken in conjunction withthe fact that newspapers in this countrymust get a licence to live at the endof every year means something andbecomes something of great significance.

Mr Speaker , Sir, it would have beennoticed by the people of this countrythat the Press did not give muchprominence to views by the citizensof this country in favour of multi-lingualism in this land, and in fact,the newspaper told me. "Don 't wasteyour time sending any press statementsbecause we have instructions not topublish". When I asked, "Instructionsfrom whom?", of course , they re-mained silent. So , I am unable to saythe instructions came from whom. Butinstructions were in fact given, andthat newspaper is the Straits Times Iname it here so that there can be nomisunderstanding.

2954

Mr Speaker, Sir, every free nationmust have a free Press. Where renewalof licences are made necessary by lawevery year , then that Press cannot befree when during the course of thatyear there are interjections that theGovernment will like this , the Govern-ment will not like that, you should dothis, or you should do that. MrSpeaker, Sir, I call upon the Govern-ment to withdraw the requirement ofannual licensing of newspapers in thiscountry, because it is a violation of thefreedom of the Press, and it is aweapon which can be used in so manyways to stifle a free Press. Mr Speaker,Sir, if the Press is not free in this landthen the public of the country will notbe duly informed of the issues that goon.

Take the language issue, for example.From 1957 , in fact I would say from1955, when independence was spokenof, there were people in this countryand amongst them was the HonourableMember from Malacca Tengah orBarat, I do not know , who stronglycampaigned , who went as far asLondon to say, "We want recognitionof four languages in this land , amongstthem the Chinese Language". ThatHonourable Member still sits in thisHouse , and I am sure the people ofMalaya are grateful to that HonourableMember for, perhaps , starting the battlefor multi -lingualism in this countrywhen he was a member of theMalayan Party. Subsequently , politicalparties , such as mine , carried on withthe issue and made our recommenda-tions to appropriate constitutionalbodies for recognition of these langu-ages. The Alliance Party brought inthe Constitution of Independence with.out multi-lingualism-I use the word"multi-lingualism" for convenience--and said that for a period of ten yearsEnglish and Malay may be officiallanguages and Malay shall be thenational language . Ten years have nowcome . What has happened in the lastten years over the language issue?From time to time you got the M.C.A.,suddenly they will say, "Well, we wantmore liberal use of the Chineselanguage" . The M.C.A. youths passedresolutions, "We want recognition of

2955 24 JANUARY 1967

the Chinese Language "; the TamilTeachers Union passed a resolution,"We want recognition of the Tamillanguage in this country"; M.C.A.youths say, "We will fight this battleto the last in a constitutional manner".Leading members of the M.C.A.,Members of Parliament sitting herefrom Johore and other places took partin meetings , demanding by constitu-tional means the establishment of theselanguages . UMNO reacted; UMNOsaid, "Kick these Members out; theyare disloyal". The M.C.A. leaders,some got stomach ache , some said,"We never took part in these meet-ings"; others said , "This was not whatthey passed". Then, there was one marl,Mr Lim Lian Geok-no more a citizenof this country , deprived of his citizenship certificate , and therefore unableto speak on the political issues of thisland; he was a leader of the Chineseteachers, he took up the battle, andhe fought it until such time as he wasdeprived of his citizenship certificate.But, as I always said , when one mangoes, another will rise, and so rose aman from the M.C.A. ranks them-selves, Mr Sim Mow Yu, YouthLeader, a man to replace Mr Lim LianGeok . The guilds and associations inMalaya , a most powerful organisationof the Chinese , appointed a committeeto send a memorandum to the Honour-able Prime Minister setting out whatwas wanted in this country. Thatcommittee consisted of leading peopleand I am sure all members of theM.C.A. at least will have this-thatcommittee consisted of Mr Sim MowYu, Mr Chong Fong, Mr Tan Toh Engand Mr Wong Wee Keong, all leading,prominent citizens of the community,businessmen and leaders of the guildsand associations and members of theM.C.A. The memorandum was sent tothe Honourable Prime Minister, butuntil today no reply has been receivedto that memorandum . Then came 1966,when the people realised that the battleis now or never-the constitutionalbattle must be now or never. It wasrealised by sections of the M.C.A. who

"Now or never".came out and said,Guilds and associations came out andsaid, "Now or never". They wantedto start a signature campaign to con-

2956

vince the Government that theselanguages should receive recognitionif you want to build a united Malay-sian nation of loyal citizens to thisland. What was the reaction? Again,suppression, oppression. Close it up,do not bring it out to the public. TheRegistrar of Societies writes a letter tothe guilds and associations on the 14thof November , 1966, and it will beinteresting to this House , if I tell whathe wrote . He said this :

"To all Guilds and Associations"-particularly to the one in Malacca,where Mr Sim Mow Yu is staying-"I am to inform you that membershipof your Society in accordance withregistered rules is not confined toMalaysian citizens. Persons, who arenot Malaysian citizens would obvious-ly have been admitted as members ofyour Society. It is a generally acceptedprinciple"--generally accepted prin-ciple-"that only citizens may takepart in political affairs of the coun-try"--I wonder where it says it is anaccepted principle--"As there are non-Malaysian citizens as members of yourSociety , you cannot properly discussor take part in any action or matter ofa political nature . I am thereforedirected to request your Society torefrain from discussing or taking partin any action on the controversialChinese language issue so as not toheighten the tension that has alreadyarisen over this matter.".

Mr Speaker, Sir, the guilds andassociations are muffled , the guildsand associations are warned , that theyare not to carry on with their signaturecampaign . Whatever the legal positionmay be , the question is this : Why is theGovernment afraid, who directed theRegistrar of Societies, and why is theGovernment afraid if the people wantto express their views in a democraticmanner in an open society? Why doesthe Government want to do things ofthis nature which can only send themunderground into the hands of thecommunists elements of this country?Why does the Registrar of Societiessuddenly wake up, when in 1959,in Perak the guilds and associations,put up huge banners "Guilds andAssociations support the Alliance.

2957 24 JANUARY 1967 2958

Vote Alliance". That was in Ipohin 1959 . When leaders of the guildsand associations with the guilds andassociations banner stood up withM.C.A. leaders on the Ipoh padangpolitically campaigning for the Alli-ance-they still lost any way-whythen did the Registrar of Societiessleep ? Why did he then not say : "Youcannot take part in politics accordingto your constitution"? Because it wasin support of the Alliance, he wassleeping? Now, because they are notin support of the Alliance on thisissue, he suddenly woke up and foundout that the guilds and associationscould not take part in political affairs.Does that not show bias? Does thatnot show victimisation of the rightsand liberties of the subjects of thiscountry ? Mr Speaker , Sir, the guildsand associations have taken part onthis issue from time immemorial, fromthe time this issue arose in thiscountry.

Mr Speaker , Sir, I would not say,"I call upon ." I will say this : I askthe Government to think carefullyabout the implementation of thelanguage problem in this country. TheHonourable Prime Minister madecertain observations in Ipoh , which Ihave no doubt he honestly and sincerelymade , that he had a compromise planto solve this language issue. Thismemorandum from the guilds andassociations refers to that and say,"Please tell us your promised plan".I have no doubt that the HonourablePrime Minister himself in his ownright may have had a compromise planwhich may be acceptable to all peoplesof the country . But, he cannot act inhis own right , he has to act accordingto his party policies and party dictates.Therefore , there is no compromiseplan because if there is a compromiseplan, then we will see a new set-up onthe Alliance side on the Governmentbenches . Therefore , the people are notwaiting for a compromise plan be-cause there is no compromise plan. ButI can assure the Government that fromwhat I hear and from what I see,these people are not going to keepquiet. They are certainly going tocampaign ; they are certainly going to

muster up every one of the threemillion living people of their race inthis country to campaign peacefully,to campaign democratically , to cam-paign within the laws, to see thatthere is a proper place for these otherlanguages which are claimed in thiscountry . A situation such as that, Iagree, is a situation filled with dyna-mite. It is a situation which can ex-plode , but which will not explode, ifthe leaders think sensibly and areprepared to accommodate the legiti-mate demand of other races.

Mr Speaker , Sir, from time to timewe get statements , "Well, you can haveyour school ; we are giving money foryour school ." But money cannot buyeverything . You are giving schools,but what is the use of going to thoseschools when you would not recognisethem? What is the use of learning inthose schools , when you go for a jobin the Government Service they tellyou "Sorry, we do not recognise thatsort of education , except for theSpecial Branch, otherwise , we do notrecognise the education ." Therefore,Mr Speaker , Sir, this is pulling woolover the people's eyes, and as thememorandum has stated, they haveseen through it that it is wool pulledover their eyes . To learn withoutultimate objective is more destroyingthen progressing a language of thiscountry.

Mr Speaker, Sir, it is my hope, I saymy hope , that the Government will nottry to stifle either the Press of thiscountry , or the people of this countryfrom expressing their views on thelanguage issue . It is an issue which isburning, it is an issue which must bespoken of, and it is an issue whichmust be solved. Let it be solved eitherway. But before it is solved, let everycitizen have his freedom to speakwithin the laws what he wants to speakon the language issue , because after1967 the language issue will be closed,because it will then be law. Peoplewill, no doubt , campaign but once it islaw people will have to obey and thecitizens of Malaya will obey whateverthe law is. We will try to change it,but once it is law, we will obey it.

2959 24 JANUARY 1967

Mr Speaker , Sir, coming to thequestion of citizenship , I think it ismost improper for the M.C.A. to say,Well, in exchange for citizenship, we

give up language ." That is not so, asindeed this memorandum , if properlyread , shows that that was not so, thatwas not the bargain struck betweenUMNO and M .C.A. in 1955. I refer nowto a very remarkable statement whichthe Hon'ble Minister of Commerce andIndustry made and which was reportedthis time in Suara Malaysia. I amreading from the Straits Echo andTimes of Malaya of January 19th, 1967.It says this : "He was commenting on areport-he means the Commissionerof National Registration-whichappeared in Suara Malaysia,-aweekly publication of the Ministry ofInformation and Broadcasting, whichquoted the Minister of Commerce andIndustry, Dr Lim Swee Aun, as saying,"Today a Chinese can obtain citizen-ship by registration , if he has lived inthis country for at least 8 years andknows a few words of Malay". MrSpeaker , Sir, that is utter rubbish.There is no Chinese or Indian ornon-Malay who can get citizenshipin this country today by living 8years in this land . There is nosuch thing . It is fantastic that aMinister of this realm is 4 yearsbehind time . That provision of lawwas revoked in 1963 by this veryHouse. Now, you must live in thiscountry for 10 years out of 12 years,and you must know not a few wordsof Malay but you must know sufficientMalay to become a citizen of thiscountry. Mr Speaker , Sir, was it anerror ? If it was an error the Honour-able Minister has misled large numbersof Chinese in this country , because inIpoh itself it caused an upheaval. Itcaused an upheaval in my chamberswhere dozens of Chinese and Indianscame in. They said, "We have livedhere 8 years , give us our citizenship".I was unware of such a statement. Isaid, "Why do you come now? Whatis the rush about?" They said, "TheMinisters said so. " I said, "Sorry, butit is 10 years out of 12 years", andthen I checked it up : the HonourableMinister, either deliberately tried tomislead those innocent people who

2960

attended the function , or it was byignorance which is unpardonable fora Minister of this land-a thing whichhad been revoked in 1963 , he says isin force now , an unpardonable sin; oneway or the other, he has misled theChinese of this country . I said that itwas perhaps more deliberate thanignorance , because he was putting thatup as a point in favour of the M.C.A.on the controversies that now exist inthis country . Now, the Deputy PrimeMinister just now said, "Well, if it isnot an official publication , we do nothave to correct it." But Suara Malay-sia is an official publication of theGovernment and the HonourableMinister did not correct it and has notcorrected it yet. Then the Commis-sioner of National Registration had tocorrect it on an interview with thenewspapers . Mr Speaker , Sir, I dohope that Ministers will be more care-ful, will be more up-to-date in thelaws of this country , before they makestatements on a serious issue such asthis, because misleading can only leadto resentment and greater strife, per-haps, in later years.

Yesterday , I raised the question onMalayan Banking. The Hon'bleMinister of Finance was rather excited,a bit too excited to be good, andone wonders why. I made no allega-tion, neither did any Member of theOpposition , as far as I can remember,make any allegation . We only askeda series of innocent questions. AndI intend to ask them again, now.in the course of my speech. If theHonourable Minister of Finance says."Well, I am not going to answer this,"if anybody causes a run on MalayanBanking, it would be the Ministerhimself , who causes the run becausethese are simple questions which canbe answered simply, if everything hasbeen well in Malayan Banking. MrSpeaker , Sir, the Honourable Ministerof Finance said, "Malayan Bankingis now all right-re-established".Very good. We are not interested inthat, but we are interested to know :did anything go wrong in MalayanBanking-if so, for how long has itbeen wrong ? When did the Ministerknow? When did Bank Negara know?

2961 24 JANUARY 1967

Was any action taken-if not, whynot? Has any action been takennow, either criminal or civil, againstindividual or more than one individualfor what was wrong in Malayan Bank-ing? If not, why not? Those are thequestions to which we want theanswers-not whether Malayan Bank-ing today is good or no good. I am notinterested. If it is good, it is good. Ifit is not good, it will soon come tolight. But we know that somethingwas rotten a short. time ago, and wewant to know why that rotten partwas left to remain there for aconsiderable time.

Mr Speaker, Sir, the HonourableMinister also said, in reply on thisbanking issue in the last few days,that the directors have a right toborrow. They have a right to get loanor advances. True, we all know that,but the right involves a duty. Was theright abused and misused in the caseof Malayan Banking? That is thequestion. We are not contesting theright. Was it abused, or was it mis-used to such an extent that depositorswere in danger in Malayan Banking?That is the question-not whether hehad a right or he had no right, or theyhad a right or they had no right. MrSpeaker, Sir, we want to knowparticularly, amongst other things, howmany directors obtained unsecuredloans from Malayan Banking. We wantto know how many firms, which wereconnected with directors as partnersmanagers, or agents, obtained loansfrom Malayan Banking, the guarantorbeing a director of Malayan Bank-ing-not an outside man but adirector of Malayan Banking beinga guarantor for loans to firms inwhich the directors of Malayan Bank-ing were involved. We want to know,in particular, any companies in whicheither directors or directors' sons weresubstantial shareholders obtained loansor advances from Malayan Banking.We want to know what action hasbeen taken, if any, for these loanssecured or insecured being realised byMalayan Banking. Has any actionbeen taken to realise these loanswhich were given? Has the MalayanBanking fully complied at all times

2962

with the provisions of section 12 ofthe Banking Ordinance? This is asimple question which can be answeredby "Yes" or "No". And the Honour-able Minister of Finance says, "I amnot going to tell you anything." Wewant to know whether the returns,under section 12, disclose particularsof all unsecured advances, unsecuredloans, and unsecured credit facilitiesgranted by it to private or publiccompanies in which it or any of itsdirectors, wife, husband, father,mother, son, or daughter of a directoror officers or employees is interestedas director, manager, agent orguarantor, as required by section11 (1) of the Banking Ordinance.The Banks must disclose these in theirreturns under section 11 (1). HasBank Negara, Malaysia, at any time,under the provisions, again, ofsection 11(2) advised the Minister thatunsecured advances, unsecured loans,unsecured credit facilities, were beinggranted to the detriment of theinterest of the depositors of that Bank?Has Bank Negara ever informed theHonourable Minister? If he wasinformed, has the Minister takenaction under section 11(2) by makingan order in writing, prohibiting orrestricting or giving any direction asis contemplated in that section? Hashe tried to stop this if, in fact, he hadinformation of it, and if in fact it didhappen, and we say it did........

Mr (Deputy) Speaker : How long areyou going to take?

Tuan D. R. Seenivasagam: I willtake some time--about another 45minutes, Sir.

Mr (Deputy) Speaker: The sittingis suspended for fifteen minutes.

Sitting suspended at 11.45 a.m.

Sitting resumed at 12.10 p.m.

(Mr Deputy Speaker in the Chair)

Debate resumed.

Tuan D. R. Seenivasagam: MrSpeaker, Sir, before adjournment, Isaid that we would like to know about

2963 24 JANUARY 1967

these unsecured credit facilities. Iwould like to add that we would alsolike to know what are the credit facili-ties given to the same series of ques-tions I asked where those facilitieswere not adequately secured-secured,but not adequately secured . Particularreference , perhaps , can be made to $6million somewhere in the region ofHong Kong area. I think that shouldstrike a cord in the memory of theHonourable Minister of Finance,because in Hong Kong now, there isa building, half put up , skeleton form,"For sale-Malayan Banking".

Mr Speaker , Sir, and the last ques-tion on Malayan Banking , which Ihope the Honourable Minister will beable to answer , is this : is the Ministersatisfied that Malayan Banking hasnot made a loan to any of its directoror directors of any company , which byvirtue of Section 6 of the CompaniesAct, 1965, is deemed to be related tothe Bank , or entered into any guaranteeor provided any security in connectionwith the loan made to such a directorby any other person contrary to theprovisions of Section 133 (1) of theCompanies Act, 1965? Now, if theMinister is not satisfied , has any actionbeen commenced ; or is any actioncontemplated under the provision ofSection 133 Sub -section (4)-and, if so,against which individual is such actiongoing to be taken as it, in fact , shouldbe taken?

Mr Speaker, Sir, to sum up theposition on Malayan Banking, thewhole question is this : has there beensuch gross negligence , such gross shut-ting of the eyes , to obvious mis-management , mal-administration and,perhaps , downright roguery in MalayanBanking-and , if so, why were eyesshut when that state of affairs wasgoing on in Malayan Banking? Theauestion is not, "Is it being put right?"It was wrong . Why was it left to go onbeing wrong ? That is the questionwhich we would like to know.

Mr Speaker , Sir, before I go intoother local subjects , perhaps, I wouldlike to touch on a matter of inter-national importance so often men-

2964

tioned in this House, i.e. , Vietnam.Now, whatever justification there maybe for the presence of Americantroops in South Vietnam, there can beno justification for the aggression intoNorth Vietnam; there can be no justi-fication for the bombing of innocentcivilians in the North; there can be nojustification for atrocities, which onlythe wildest of men, which only themost uncivilised of men , are commit-ting in the Vietnam war, are beingnow committed and perpetrated by theAmericans in that area under theleadership of President Johnson.

Mr Speaker , Sir, here is a StraitsTimes cutting of 22nd December, 1966,showing the picture of the year, takenby a Japanese photographer of theU.P.I., Mr Sarwada . It comes out asthe picture of the year, it shows anAmerican tank, or vehicle, with a star,U.S. Army, and what does it show?A Vietcong tied with rope dragged onthe ground in Vietnam . Why did theworld prosecute the Japanese whooccupied Malaya? Why did theyprosecute them? For atrocities, atro-cities such as this and many others.War does not justify cruelty ; war mayjustify killing, but war does not justifycruelty perpetrated only by the mostuncivilised of nations. And the ques-tion which we ask is this : Would theG.Is have done this if this was a whiteman, would the G.Is have tied him ona rope and dragged him on a U.S.transport through Vietnam if he wasa white man? And we, this Govern-ment, say that we are not against theU.S. for fighting this war in Vietnam.We may not be against the U.S. butare we against this sort of atrocities?Answer it. Are you not going to cam-paign for President Johnson to be pro-secuted in a war crimes court as theycampaigned for the prosecution of theJapanese who perpetrated crimes ofthis nature ? Are you going to sit backas a nation and say, "We close oureyes to this ," defeat communism, thatis all we are interested in." Goodcommunists and bad communists, Iunderstand there are now-there is adistinction between good and badcommunists too.

2965 24 JANUARY 1967

Mr Speaker , Sir, we condemn thiskind of action; we condemn the aggres-sion in Vietnam ; we condemn the massdemoralisation of the Vietnamesepeople in all aspects of life by thepresence of G.Is in that area of thisworld , and I hope that this Govern-ment will condemn cruelties and atro-cities committed in the name of wipingout communism. There can be nojustification of cruelty of this nature.

Mr Speaker, Sir, Kuala Lumpur isadministered by a Municipality (nomi-nated) where the Minister of Housingand Local Government has authorityover this Municipality . Now, I do nothave much experience in law, I amjust learning as we all are , but I haveyet to hear where parts of buildingsare re-zoned : upstairs is differentzoning , downstair is different zoning;one massage parlour is re-zoned for amassage parlour , the next one, "No,you cannot ." "Because I frequent thismassage parlour , I do not go to that,so I will re-zone this." On whoseinstructions ? I shudder to say, "onwhose instructions". But this is whatis happening in Kuala Lumpur town.By what authority is the Ministerialinterference to that extent in the Muni-cipality of Kuala Lumpur?

Mr Speaker, Sir, there seems to beno planning in Kuala Lumpur inrespect of petrol stations. Petrolstations come up in all parts of KualaLumpur . There is no policy on whichthe Municipal Commissioner can work.He is sometimes overruled . He recom-mends one thing ; the Honourable theMinister says , "No, go ahead and dothis". Sometimes , this is not in writingand when it comes toy a push , who hasto take the blame? Municipal officershave to take the blame . Nobody else.This sort of thing. I say, is not in thebest interest of Kuala Lumpur town,and it is my hope that things of thisnature will be stopped , and stopped bythose who have higher authority thanthe Minister concerned himself. I saythe Prime Minister must stop this sortof affairs going on in the Municipalityof Kuala Lumpur.

Mr Speaker , Sir, how lax can anadministration be? And here I disclose

2966

at once that I was-I am not now--professionally interested in this matter.It is my duty to disclose, Sir. I speakof two restaurants; I forgot the nameof the hotel where they are lodged.One is the Shanghai Restaurant andone is the Luk Kok Restaurant in theTown House Hotel. Sir , there has beenlitigation over it, but the paint wherethe Municipality comes in is interest-ing. Now, the Luk Kok Restaurantoperates there , in unauthorised pre-mises, built without plan and orderedby the court to be demolished. Dayspassed, months passed , years passed;even today, you can go to Luk Kokand have your lunch , because it is notyet demolished . How long does it takein Kuala Lumpur to enforce a courtorder of demolition ? Are the Muni-cipal guards afraid to go and demolishit? They have a very efficient PoliceForce well versed in beating up people.You can always get them to go anddemolish this building without danger.But by what circumstance can LukKok carry on their business for solong? It is a violation , a crying shame,that the Federal Capital cannot enforceorders and directions in this town. Ihave no doubt that they will enforce it,but I want to know why there is thedelay. Why is an unauthorised restau-rant allowed to carry on-not onlyunauthorised , not only unlicensed, butoperating in an unauthorised building,causing , perhaps , danger to those whogo into that building ? Mr Speaker,Sir, if such things happen in KualaLumpur, then the form of administra-tion of Kuala Lumpur Town iscertainly one which calls for lookinginto.

Now, referring to the same Honour-able Minister's portfolio , or Depart-ment, again , I come to the Rent Actwhich has come into operation. It hascaused an upheaval . It has caused aconfusion , which will take a long timeto resolve. It has, perhaps , been mis-understood by landlords, who now say,"Well, we will teach you tenants alesson". Tenants are throwing thoseletters into the wastepaper baskets-atleast in Ipoh-on the advice of apolitical party. They are advised to

2967 24 JANUARY 1967

throw them into the wastepaper bas-kets. What is the position going tobe, if tens of thousands of tenants allover the country throw their noticesinto the wastepaper baskets? Theirlandlords have to go to the Tribunals?When are these cases going to finish?One year ? Two years ? Three years?Four years ? What is the purpose ofthe Rent Act ? Is it not at oncedefeated-both for the landlords andthe tenants? When it came into opera-tion there was criticism of it from theOpposition. That criticism was notheeded . Mr Speaker , Sir, be that as itmay, I think it is time now for thatRent Act to be reconsidered . All thisstupidity of landlords and tenantsnegotiating on a friendly term, weknow it can never happen in thiscountry, or in any other country. Theremust be amendments to the Rent Act,here and now, so that the situationwill not deteriorate into a positionwhere landlords will have to waitperhaps for five years before their casescan be heard , or the tenants will haveto wait for five years, before theyknow what their fate is. Mr Speaker,Sir, important is the set up of theTribunals. The Rent Tribunals areimportant . The Appeal Boards areimportant . Each State appoints its own.

In Kuala Lumpur there is a funnysituation . The Appellate Presidentappointed was Enche' R. R. Chelliah,a well-known advocate and solicitor-capable , able, suitable. Who areappointed to the Rent Tribunal? I amcasting no aspersion on the gentlemenconcerned . I make it very clear thatthey are brother barristers -at-law-oneMr Hoffman and one Mr Lye. MrHoffman just came in from Singapore,comparatively a few years back. MrLye is comparatively new. But theimportant point is that both of themare from the firm of Allen & Gledhill,and we want to know why two mem-bers of one firm sitting on the RentTribunal. Why? The firm is signifi-cant-Allen & Gledhill. Who appointedthem? Was it in consultation withanybody? Was the Bar Council con-sulted ? Was the Registrar of Courtsconsulted? Was anybody who shouldhave been consulted in fact consulted?

2968

Or was it an off-the-bat appointmentfrom Allen & Gledhill by the Honour-able Minister of Local Governmentand Housing ? These are the questionsthat Members of the Bar in KualaLumpur are asking, and I hope therewill be answers to them, because Ithink it is not proper leaving the per-sonalities of these gentlemen out. Thevery thought of it makes one shudderto think of what would happen. MrSpeaker, Sir, I am sorry that theHonourable Minister is not here him-self, but perhaps his deputy, or hisattorney , will answer them in duecourse.

Mr Speaker , Sir, whilst I am on thissubject of the Rent Act, perhaps, Ishould mention the Courts of thiscountry. Recently, we read in the news-papers of even a Mobile Court inoperation in Kuala Lumpur. Now,Kuala Lumpur has seven Courts in thelower jurisdiction limit--six Courtshave buildings and one Court is amobile one-it moves from place toplace. One day you go to the Court-assuming you are accused of, say,corruption-you are told, "You come,you will be tried in Court No. 3".Now, when your case comes up, yougo to Court No. 3. You sit and sit,nothing happens . Suddenly a police-man comes along and says , "Well, youdidn't appear in Court No. 5. Here isa warrant of arrest. I am now arrestingyou." The man goes to Court No. 5,and says , "You told me last time thatit is Court No. 3", and he says , "Sorry.it is now Court No. 5. Anyway, Iexcuse you. Next time don 't be with-out turning up ! " Whose fault is it?You tell him, "Court No. 3"; youchange your mind and go to Court No.5, and then you arrest that man.

Mr Speaker , Sir, the Courts bring inrevenue for the Government-a largeamount of revenue . Perhaps , they arethe best revenue -producing Department,and yet what do we have ? We havecourts which have no permanentbuildings . We have courts which aremobile, that run from place to place,and the lawyers and the clients have tochase around those courts . You haveseven courts but you have only three

2969 24 JANUARY 1967

magistrates . So, four courts are justsitting there ; maybe if you are luckyyou get the magistrates ; if you arenot lucky you do not get them. MrSpeaker, Sir , why is the position so?Why is it that people do not join theJudiciary ? Why is it that the salary ofthe Judiciary , perhaps, one which hasnot been revised for a very, very longtime? Why do you expect magistratesto live on less than $1 ,0010 a month?Is it humanly possible for them tomaintain their dignity , their positionand their integrity ? More importantthan all, if you do not pay them suffi-ciently and adequately , is it anysurprise then that the Judiciary, in.strength and in number is not increa-sing? It is going down . You are get-ting resignations without recruitment,because the incentives to go into theJudiciary are not there when theyshould be there. Mr Speaker , Sir, wehave heard a lot about salaries goingup and that the Government is suffer-ing, but nothing on the Judicial side.They are peaceful people , they neverdisturb , and so we can bully them. MrSpeaker, Sir, the public wants theJudiciary to be free , impartial andstrong, and we cannot have thatJudiciary unless we look into thissubject thoroughly and carefully. MrSpeaker, Sir, appeals today in thiscountry-it never happened during theimperialist days , but today it happens-an appeal takes two years to comeup; an appeal takes nine months tocome up ; an appeal sometimes takethree years to come up. Why? No-body's fault. Not enough staff, notenough people to type , not enoughpeople to get the records ready forappeal. In the meantime , no bail isallowed to the man , and he is lockedup in jail . By the time the appealcomes , he says, "I don't want it, myterm is finished : why should I appealnow?" Is that justice which thisGovernment is maintaining and up-holding in this country, or is it a merefarce? But we are lucky that we havea strong Judiciary with men of integrityand honesty , and let us keep it thatway.

Mr Speaker , Sir, again in theJudiciary , as in other Government

2970

Department , there is dissatisfaction-dissatisfaction over promotions, dis-satisfaction over transfers and dis-satisfaction over the manner in whichthey are treated . Senior men are notgiven the proper positions , just becausesomebody wants to be somewhere, justbecause that somebody has influencewith somebody else. It has spread eveninto the Judiciary , and unless thatstops there is going to be trouble,because people will just take so muchand they will not stand any more. Youwill finally find that you will havealmost no more judges-when I sayjudges I mean lower courts-no magis-trates to try the cases that come up inthis country. This is a matter which isvery serious and which I hope that theMinister will appreciate and look into.All you have got to do is to set up asmall committee . Call them up, "Whatis the trouble ?" They are not afraid;they are lawyers; they will tell us whattheir troubles are, and they can besolved easily and quickly.

Mr Speaker , Sir, again , whilst weare on law, one Honourable Memberyesterday said, "Anybody who doesnot put up a signboard in Malay, youfine him." I say, "You try and do that.You try and do it, then we will see."

Whilst on law again , Mr Speaker,Sir, it is becoming increasingly clearthat the practice of torture of personsdetained in police stations is a fact andit is increasing. It is no use saying thatit does not exist, because it does exist,and the proof of it has often come outin our law courts . I am sure theGovernment does not approve of thisbecause, guilty or not guilty, a manmust be tried without cruelty to him.I do not want to go further except tosay, "Let us realise the fact, let us putit right before it is too late, before itgets out of hands in this country."

Mr Speaker, Sir, this morning wehad, I would say, a shameful exhibi-tion of the Honourable Minister ofTransport standing up in this Houseand saying that neither he, nor all theKing's men and all the King'shorses in Malaya could put theRailway Administration correct. Wehad to run to the United Nations and

2971 24 JANUARY 1967 2972

nobody in Malaya could put thisthing correct . There again the questionarises every year, going up , gettingworse, getting worse , getting worse;now, when it is intolerable , you tell thepublic, "Sorry, we are all smashed up.Now we want the United Nations tocome in". Why wait so long? Whywait until you cannot control thesituation? Is that the duty of aMinister , or was it the duty of a Minis-ter to go to the Prime Minister andsay "Sir , I cannot handle this matter;we must do something about thisbefore it is too late"? Now, when itis late in the day, when even theAlliance backbenchers say, "Close theRailway Administration ; we do notwant railways in this country", you say,"Let us salvage this thing out". Whois going to pay for all your faults?The people by taxes ? Why don'tpeople use Malayan Railways? Whyis it that tin ore was not transportedby Malayan Railways ? I know it, Ilive in the area of tin ore production.Because the Railways do not give youthe same facilities that lorries giveyou, because the Railways arehaughty, impertinent , and non-accom-modating . That is why you lose yourrevenue-not because they do not wantto use your railway , but because theyfind it more honourable to use othertransport than your railway . That isthe reason-there was bad administra-tion. Why blame the RUM? Blameyourselves , the administrators of theRailways. Sir, I do hope that theHonourable Minister concerned willseriously consider resigning his post, inview of his abject admission of failureto properly supervise administration ofone of the most important branches ofhis Ministry.

Mr Speaker , Sir, fragmentation ofestates in this country has reachedproportions which have caused alarm-ing damage to workers in this country.Now, whilst it is appreciated thatlegislation to stop fragmentation is,perhaps, somewhat difficult, it is notimpossible. Why is it that up till nowno legislation of any sort has everbeen embarked on? This danger wasa rising danger . Estate workers werebeing continuously sent out of employ-ment: continuously they had to carry

their mattresses and their small pil-lows; and trek along the roads ofMalaya to catch their boats back toIndia. Why was it kept silent? Whywas nothing done? Is it, and I readfrom "The Rocket" an article by DrMahathir , where he says that even thesmall M .I.C. has the same rightswithin the Alliance . That may be so,but why was no legislation introduced,because fragmentation was done bythe leaders of the M .I.C. was donealmost exclusively by leaders of theM.I.C. from Penang right down toJohore? Only a few names arenecessary : Mr Periasamy , Mr Renga-samy-all these names which are sofamiliar-Mr Kathirigama of Sitiawan,the biggest fragmentors this countryhas ever known . Is that why no legisla-tion was made to stop fragmentation?

Mr Speaker , Sir, the Governmentmust take immediate steps to stopfragmentation , because it is a diseasewhich must be stopped-it is adisease where the rich gets richer,where they cut and kill, where theychop the land and kill the man-thatis fragmentation. Mr Speaker, Sir, Ihope that the Government at thismeeting will announce that immediatesteps are being taken to stop fragmen-tation in this country , because thatwould be the best news this countrycould look forward to at this meeting.

Mr Speaker , Sir, there is one point,somewhat touchy , but I think I mustmention it, because it has beeneditorially referred to. I am not sayingthat the editorial is correct; there mayhave been a misunderstanding of thespeech made by the HonourableMinister of Commerce and Industry atthe Lions Club meeting in Penang re-ported on the 16th of January, 1967-the dinner was on the 14th, I think. Ittakes the Minister to task for referringto free -port status of Penang . I am nottouching on that aspect , but I amtouching on this aspect . The editorialwas by Mr Saravanamuthu , a leadingnewspaperman for many years, and Iam sure he has no bias against theHonourable Minister , but that articlewas surely a terrific one. The point heraises is an interesting one. Mr Spea-ker, Sir , what should the Ministers do,

?973 24 JANUARY 1967 2974

when they travel around the country,sometimes on public funds, sometimeson private funds ? It is important, Ithink, at these functions , which aresocial functions--"Lions" are socialservice clubs-I think it is necessarythat they should keep away entirelyfrom politics, because if you touch onpolitics somebody else is going tostand up and touch on politic, andthese clubs are multi -racial and multi-political in view. So, if you do that,one of these days there is going to betrouble at one of these functions-Ihope that Ministers will realise that.I am not criticising them for the sakeof criticising , but I am criticising themfor the sake of stopping ugly incidentsat social functions whenever thingsof this nature come up. I think it iswrong , it is unfair , to the organisers ofthe functions, and it embarrasses themso much that in fact at this functionone of the organisers came up to meand said "Can you get somebody toreply? ". I said, "Forget it , we do notwant to reply."

Mr Speaker , Sir, Sarawak is goingslowly , steadily it is going away fromMalaysia. (Laughter). I do not like thatlaughter , because people who laugh,they cannot think properly in view ofthe circumstances of today. Why did theSarawak Alliance lose the last by-election? On what issue did they lose?They lost on the issues which are nowstanding out . That election was lost-no doubt the voting strength is a smallvote, but it is a vote in a Dayak area,it is a vote in what was a strongholdof the Alliance Party-it was a wardwhich was won , I understand, by theAlliance in previous elections , unlikeKampong Bharu which was always anAlliance stronghold-in a momentI will come to Kampong Bharu, wewill see why they won. Mr Speaker,Sir, I think it is the bounden duty ofthe Ministerial bench and the Govern-ment to hold their promise to holdelections in Sarawak at the earliestpossible opportunity . It is our hopethat no false excuses of emergency,communist bogeys , and subversion willbe put up to stop elections from takingplace in Sarawak ; and I hope whenthe results are out the will of the people

will triumph over the desires of thosein power today.

Mr Speaker, Sir, communalism inMalaya proper has reached a stage ofshamelessness, complete shamelessness,on the part of the Alliance. The Kam-pong Bharu election brought it to light,and I say that if anybody should beprosecuted for raising communal senti-ments, it is the Alliance themselves,which should be prosecuted and con-demned. Look at this poster, MrSpeaker, Sir, put up in KampongBharu. What do the Malay words say:"Undi-lah Perikatan untok kepentinganbangsa, ugama dan Tanah Ayer". Tran-slated by a good tanslator, certifiedtranslator, it means this: "Vote for theinterest of your race, religion and na-tive land". What do the Chinese wordsand Tamil words say? Translated,again, by good official translators itsays this : in Chinese, it reads : "Votefor peace, progress and prosperity".What does the Tamil translation say?"Vote for peace, justice and pros-perity". The race, the religion, and thenative land disappear as far as theChinese and Tamils are concerned.Is that not shameless communalism? Isthat not the most outrageous offenceagainst what the Prime Minister prea-ches-build a united nation in thiscountry. What did the speakerson the platform say, and this isfrom the record. I am not reading theactual words. Anybody who wants theRocket can read it, but the words areto this effect : "Forget about the non-Malay candidate. I am a Malay candi-date". That is the Alliance campaignin Kampong Bharu. Mr Speaker, Sir,are the Police going to take action?What about the Internal SecurityAct? What about the law which says"You shall not raise communalfeelings"? What about the attack bythe Alliance on the P.M.I.P., whenthey accused them of using religion?What is "ugama" if not religion?Why do you do what you attackedothers of doing? Why in KampongBharu did you start your electionrallies with a Quran reading? Whenthe P.M.I.P. did something aboutreligion you said, "Religious fana-tics". When you do it-"Religious

2975 24 JANUARY 1967

good man". Is that the policy of theAlliance Government? Mr Speaker,Sir, I ask the Minister of HomeAffairs and Internal Security, orwhoever he is, to cause a Policeinvestigation , charge , prosecute andjail all those responsible for raisingcommunal sentiments in the KampongBharu by-election. You were cam-paigning only for Malay votes inKampong Bharu , and you got onlyMalay votes in Kampong Bharu.If that is you victory , then I say, "Itis a hollow victory . It is a divisionand not a victory for you."

Mr Speaker, Sir, I have nothingmore to say.

Tan Sri Syed Ja`afar bin HasanAlbar (Johor Tenggara): Tuan Yangu:-PLr^ua, saya ingin mengambil baha-glali dalam perbinchangan AnggaranBelanjawan bagi tahun 1967 mi.Nampak-nya Anggaran Belanjawanbagi tahun 1967 ini ada -lah bertam-bah dan lebeh banyak lagi daripadaAnggaran bagi tahun2 yang lalu. Danini memang -lah satu perkara yanglazim kerana keperluan2 kita bertam-bah dari satu tahun ka-satu tahun,dari satu masa ka-satu masa . Tidak-lah kita hatran melihatkan bertambah-nya belanjawan yang di-untokkan bagitahun ini kerana ini menunjokkanbahawa ranchangan2 bagi kemajuan,bagi pembangunan , bagi kenaikanra`ayat negeri ini sa-makin di -usaha-kan dengan bagitu rupa hingga kitaterpaksa menambahkan belanjawankita.

Sa-perkara yang saya berasa kurangsedap dan tidak menyenangkan is-ituapakala belanjawan ini bertambah dandi-naikkan , mengekor sama kenaikanchukai2 yang di-kenakan oleh Kera-jaan kita. Saya tidak menentang dasarmenaikkan chukai atau meluaskanbase chukai2 yang di-pungut oleh Kera-jaan bagi menampong kekuranganbelanjawan kita. Tetapi sa-perkarayang patut dan wajib mendapat per-hatian daripada pehak Kerajaan is-lahsupaya di-pelihara sa-berapa bolehkenaikan chukai2 itu tidak di-tang-gongkan dan tidak di -pikulkan kapadara`ayat biasa . Telah menjadi ke-laziman peniaga2 dalam negeri kita

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ini apakala sahaja Kcrajaan menaik-kan chukai atas satu barang atau atassatu benda , walau benda itu tidakkena -mengena dengan keperluan2ra'ayat, maka barang2 keperluanra ayat juga ikut naik. Apakala sa-orang consumer (pembeli) bertanyakapada penjual , maka jawab-nyamullah sahaja is-itu menunohkan ke-salahan itu ka-atas Kerajaan menaik-kan chukai , pada hal barang yang di-naikkan harga-nya itu tidak kena-mengena dengan chukai yang telahdi-naikkan. Jadi , di-sini-lah saya mintadan berharap daripada Kerajaan su-paya perkara mi dapat di-perhatikandan di -chari chara2 untok menyelamat-kan ra`ayat daripada membayar hargayang lebeh bagi keperluan hari2-nya.Boleh jadi kenaikan barang2 itu sa-sen dua yang tidak di-rasa oleh sa-orang yang macham kita barangkalimempunyal kehidupan dan pendapa-tan yang mewah atau besar , tetapikenaikan sa-sen dua ini di-rasaidengan pedeh -nya dan terok-nya olehra`ayat2 yang di-kampong yang mem-punyai pendapatan2 yang terhad-pendapatan yang terlampau kechiluntok memenohi keperluan hidup-nyadan keluarga-nya.

Jadi, di-sini saya minta dan ber-harap kapada Kerajaan pada masa2yang akan datang sa-belum memikir-kan kenaikan chukai2 untok memben-dong kekurangan belanjawan negarakita supaya di-fikirkan chara2 yanglain is-itu meluaskan perkembanganekonomi bagi membanyakkan hasilnegeri ini dan di -beri segala galakansupaya perkembangan ekonomi ituberjalan dengan lanchar dan tetap,supaya dapat kita menampong segalakekurangan belanjawan kita padamasa2 yang akan datang.

Menaikkan chukai atas barang2 yangsedia ada itu hanya satu chara men-dapatkan tambahan wang bagi belan-jawan kita, tetapi yang perlu is-lahekonomik negara mesti -lah di-semak,di-kaji sa-mula dan maseh banyaklagi peluang untok mendapatkan hasilnegara yang belum di-tax, yang belumdi-usek , tetapi malang-nya kadang2-nya Kerajaan tidak pergi untok tappuncha2 hasil itu dia lari ka-kochekorang ramai untok menarek apa yang

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dapat di-tarek daripada kochek2 itu.Jadi ini saya fakir satu perkara yangamat berat pada pandangan saya yangwajib Kerajaan menarohkan perha-tian-nya yang begat dan bersunggoh2.Negeri kita ini boleh di-katakan mem-punyai banyak peluang untok mem-banyakkan industry dan juga untokmembanyakkan pengeluaran agriculture,mengapa-kah, umpama-nya, wang kitatidak di-gunakan lebeh banyak danlebeh tepat lagi kapada projek2 yangmendatangkan hasil daripada mem-belanjakan kapada projek2 yang tidakmendatangkan hasil. Jadi , denganchara membelanjakan lebeh banyakkapada projek2 yang ada mendatang-kan hasil pada tahun2 ka-hadapanmaka ini-lah yang akan mengubatekonomik negara kita yang pada hariini menanggong belanjawan yangbagitu berat kerana menghadap kea-daan yang kita sedang hadapi se-karang.

Di-sini chara untok mendapatkanWang kita telah mendapat bayangandaripada uchapan Yang BerhormatMenteri Kewangan is-itu akan memo-tong perbelanjaan2 , menjimatkan,menchermatkan perbelanjaan2. Sayafikir dengan hanya memotong danmenchermatkan di-sana sini sapertiyang telah terdengar berkenaan dengangaji2 pegawai atau bilangan pegawai'dan kakitangan Kerajaan hendak di-kurangkan , maka ini tidak akan dapatmengubat keadaan kita. Kalau adachadangan hendak menurunkan gajiatau hendak mengurangkan kaki-tangan Kerajaan , pada padangan sayaini tidak akan mengubat keadaanekonomi negeri kita. Yang sa-wajib-nya bukan gaji2 itu di-kurangkan ataukakitangan itu mesti di-kurangkan,tetapi hendak-lah di-semak balekjentera pentadbiran negeri ini supayatiap2 pegawai itu dapat mengeluarkanhasil kerja -nya sa-imbang denganwang dan duit yang di-terima-nyasupaya Jabatan2 Kerajaan lebeh cher-gas, lebeh efficient daripada yang adasekarang mi. Itu sahaja chara yangdapat kita membetulkan keadaanekonomi kita.

untok menjadi pandangan kapadaKerajaan kita bagi menunjokkan be-tapa karang efficiency dalam Jabatan2Kerajaan. Saya ada menulis surat per-mohonan kapada satu pejabat, suratitu pergi lepas sa-tahun, saya sudahlupa permohonan saya, baru sayaterima surat acknowledgement receiptdan saya maseh simpan kadacknowledgement itu di-tangan saya.Untok hendak mendapat acknowledge-ment daripada sa-buah pejabat me-nunggu sa-tahun lebeh . saya fikir inisudah melampaui belum lagi jawapanitu-ma'ana-nya menolak atau punmengkabulkan, menerima permohonansaya-hanya acknowledgement. Kalausurat daripada sa-orang saperti sayaWakil Ra `ayat daripada sa-buahPejabat Kerajaan macham itu ada-nya,apahal ra`ayat yang tidak mempunyaikuku? Jadi, soal-nya hendak menam-gong kekurangan perbelanjaan negarakita ini , bukan-lah mengurangkan gajiatau mengurangkan kakitangan Kera-jaan tetapi to make them work, jadi-kan mereka bekerja bersunggoh2supaya tiap2 Jabatan Kerajaan ituefficient dan dengan efficiency yangada ini maka segala2-nya akan ikutberkembang dengan sehat dan denganbaik.

Beribu2 permohonan yang di-hantarkan kapada Pejabat2 Kerajaan,umpama-nya , permohonan keranamelombong dan sa-bagai -nya, ada sa-tengah permohonan -nya balek ka-belakang-nun-sa-hingga sa-belumperang dahulu belum selesai , pada halpermohonan2 yang sa -umpama ini jikatelah di -selesaikan dengan lekas makaini akan menambahkan revenue Kera-jaan, hasil Kerajaan , hasil negara, dantidak memerlukan Menteri Kewanganpusing kepala pada tiap2 tahun datangka-Dewan ini dan membachakanuchapan-nya menaikkan chukai inidan menaikkan chukai itu yang men-jadikan Menteri Kewangan unpopularkapada orang ramai . Saya kasehansunggoh kapada Menteri Kewangankalau terpaksa Yang Berhormat itudatang ka-magi pada tiap2 tahundengan chadangan kenaikan chukai.

Tuan Yang di-Pertua, saya bolehsebutkan satu chontoh dengan tidak Lagi sa-perkara berkenaan denganpayah menyebut negeri dan pejabat penambahan basil negara ini is-itu

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sunggoh pun Kerajaan kita telah mem-berikan kemudahan2 untok membiak-kan atau mengembangkan atau untokmembangunkan perkembangan indus-teri dalam negeri ini, tetapi banyakperkara lagi yang boleh di-buat olehKerajaan untok menggalakkan indus-tri, untok menggalakkan, untok men-jinakkan modal2 yang ada dalamnegeri dan dari luar untok di-investkandalam negeri ini bagi membanyakkanindustri kita dan membesarkan industrikita di-dalam negeri ini..

Kita telah ada peratoran, taiafprintis umpama-nya dan ini satu per-kara yang baik tetapi ada perkara2lagi yang patut di-buat oleh Kerajaansupaya kemudahan2 itu di-berikansa-banyak2-nya dan sa-boleh2-nyasupaya perkembangan industri dalamnegeri kita dapat di-jamin dan dapatmemberikan hasil yang lebeh dandapat menghindarkan kita daripadamenaikkan chukai bagaimana charayang kita telah buat sa-lama mi.Salah satu perkara yang patut men-dapat pertimbangan daripada Kera-jaan dalam soal menggalakkan industridalam negeri ini is-lah soal TradeUnion. Apakala saya menyebut ber-kenaan dengan Trade Union jangan-lah menyangka bahawa saya ini sa-orang kapitalis yang chuba hendakmenekan gerakan2 dan perkembanganTrade Union dalam negeri kita ini,tetapi sa-perkara yang patut di-sedari is-itu Undang2 Trade Uniondan Undang2 Boroh yang ada padahari ini tidak memadai untok mem-berikan keyakinan dan keperchayaanyang peioh kapada modal2 untokdatang menchurah2 ka-dalam negerikita mi.

Kira-nya Kerajaan dapat menyemak,dapat mengkaji Undang2 ini, makadapat-lah menggalakan kapital ataumodal di-pergunakan dengan sa-penoh-nya dalam negeri ini dan de-ngan memberikan galakan kapadamodal2 ini tidak bererti kita mestimenindas Trade Union yang adadalam negeri ini. Apa yang perlu ia-lah kawalan yang sempurna keranakita faham dan mengerti bahawa adadi-kalangan Trade Union sa-tengah2pemimpin yang tidak bertanggongjawab yang hanya hendak mengguna-

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kan Trade Union itu sa-bagai senjatauntok mengugut dan menakut2kankapital daripada di-perluaskan peng-gunaan-nya dalam perkembanganekonomi negara kita mi.

Mr (Deputy ) Speaker: Masa sudahpukul satu. Meshuarat ini di-tanggoh-kan hingga pukul 4.00 petang mi.

Silting suspended at 1.00 p.m.

Sitting resumed at 4.00 p.m.

(Mr. Deputy Speaker in the Chair)

BILL

THE SUPPLY (1967) BILL

Second Reading

Debate resumed.

Tan Sri Syed Ja`afar bin DasanAlbar (Johor Tenggara): Tuan Yangdi-Pertua, benarkan-lah saga me-ngemaskan balek atau merengkaskansa-mula uchapan yang saya telahlafadzkan dalam Dewan ini pada sa-belah pagi tali. Bagaimana yang sagatelah jelas dan tegaskan is-itu sambilsaya sendiri tidak menentang d asarkenaikan chukai sa-bagai satu dasaryang penting dan perlu untok men-dapatkan wang bagi menampong ke-kurangan belanjawan negara, sayamerayu dan meminta kapada Kerajaanmengadakan chara2 bagi memelharaatau pun menjaga supaya b^bankenaikan chukai itu tidak di-tanggongkan dan tidak di-pikulkankapada ra`ayat yang tidak berkemam-puan.

Lagi satu perkara yang saya tegas-kan dalam uchapan pada sa-belah pagitali is-lah berkenaan dengan leng-kongan atau pun kawasan atau puntempat untok hendak mendapatkanhasil yang lebeh banyak is-itu supayaKerajaan dapat bertumpu lebeh banyaklagi dalam usaha2 membanyakkanranchangan2 mengeluarkan hasil dari-pada tanah2 kita yang bagitu luasdalam Malaysia mi. Dengan hanyamembanyakkan kilang2 tidak memadaimalah industry dan pertanian mesti-lah di-luas dan di-perbesarkan lagilebeh daripada yang ada sekarang mi.

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Kita memuji apa yang telah di-jalankan oleh Kerajaan dalam usaha-nya membuka tanah2 untok getah dankelapa sawit tetapi maseh banyak lagibenda2 yang boleti di-tanam yang da-pat di-usahakan dan dapat di -jalankandalam negeri ini yang bukan sahajaakan membanyakkan hasil negaratetapi akan memberi peluang kapadaanak negeri ini untok menchari ma-kanan dan pekerjaan.

Sa-lain daripada itu, Tuan Yang di-Pertua , saya telah menyebutkan ber-kenaan dengan Undang2 Buroh ataumemelihara keadaan dan kedudokanTrade Union dalam negeri ini. Padapandangan saya , Undang2 yang adaini tidak memadai dan tidak chukupuntok menjaga dan hendak memeli-hara ketenteraman buroh di-dalamnegeri mi . Menteri Buroh, umpama-nya, apakala berlaku suatu perteling-kahan , satu pertikaian industry dalamnegeri ini , Menteri Buroh itu dapatidiri-nya dengan tangan yang tidakbersenj ata. Dia hanya dudok dalamsa-barang pertikaian itu sa -bagai orangtengah yang tidak mesti di -dengarinasihat-nya atau chakapan -nya. Jadikeadaan yang sa -umpama ini, sayafikir, tidak membantu atau tidakmenggalakkan perkembangan ekonomidalam negara kita. Saya ingin meng-ulangkan is-itu dengan chadangan inisaya tidak bermaksud untok menindasatau menekan Trade Union atauburoh2. Kita berkehendakkan pekerja2yang ada dalam negeri ini, apa yangkita kehendaki, supaya ada persaimba-ngan yang `adil di-antara modal yangdi-gunakan dalam satu2 industry itu,sama ada modal orang atau pun modalkeringat atau modal peloh atau modaltulang urat.

Satu perkara yang amat mengejut-kan di-dalam uchapan belanjawanyang di -bachakan oleh Yang Berhor-mat Menteri Kewangan is-lah ber-kenaan dengan bilangan anak2 kitakeluar atau lepasan daripada sekolahpada tiap2 tahun . Mengikut kenyataanYang Berhormat itu bahawa lepasansekolah kita pada tahun 1966 ada sa-banyak 142,000 manusia. 142,000mulut dan perut dan pada tahun initentu bilangan itu akan bertambahlagi dan saya tidak fikir Badan

Peranchang Keluarga akan dapatmenolong dalam perkara ini. Jadi, apayang menjadi kewajipan Kerajaanpada pandangan saya, is-lah supayapergi kapada tanah dan meluaskanpembukaan tanah di-dalam negeri ini,supaya dapat menampong anak2 kitaini daripada hidup tidak ketentuandan tidak ada pekerjaan . Sunggoh punmembuka kilang2 dalam negeri iniwajib di-galakkan, bagaimana yangsaya katakan pada permulaan tadi,tetapi dengan mengadakan kilang2 sa-haja dalam dunia moden sa -umpamasekarang ini tidak akan menolongbanyak dalam mengurangkan un-employment dalam negeri ini , sebab,Tuan Yang di-Pertua tahu, bahawajentera2 modern sekarang ini biladi-pasangkan dalam satu kilang, diatidak memerlukan banyak kaki-tangan,dia memerlukan hanya beberapa orangsahaja untok menjalankan jentera2 itu.Jadi , tempat yang lapang dan luas,yang boleh menelan sa-banyak2-nyajiwa manusia yang di -keluarkan olehsekolah2 kita itu lain tidak, melainkanis-lah pada tanah dan tanah jua.

Dari sebab itu, saya merayu ka-pada Kerajaan supaya Jabatan Eko-nomi dalam Jabatan Perdana Menteri,ekonomik unit dalam Jabatan PerdanaMenteri dan juga kalau ada jabatansa-umpama itu dalam KementerianKewangan , supaya bekerja siang danmalam memikirkan perkara2 ini danmembuat chadangan2 untok mengubatkeadaan kita pada masa yang akandatang.

Saya fikir , Tuan Yang di-Pertua,kita tidak dapat hendak bergantongbanyak kapada getah dan harga-nya.Harga getah telah merosot bagituhebat sa -kali dan saya tidak nampakdalam beberapa tahun ka-hadananini harga getah akan dapat naik. ®lehsebab itu , kita mesti-lah mempunyaihasil2 pertanian yang lain, sa-lain dari-pada getah , untok menampongkekurangan yang di-sebabkan olehhasil yang kita dapat daripada getahlnl.

Tuan Yang di -Pertua , di-sini sayadatang kapada satu soal berkenaandengan kominis dan kominisem. Dalamkenyataan2 Kerajaan sama ada dalam

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Dewan ini dalam beberapa hari yanglalu atau pun kenyataan2 yang terlebehawal daripada itu, saya nampak satuperkara yang amat membingongkansaya. Dan saya harap Kerajaan akandapat memberikan penjelasan yangterang supaya keadaan bingong ituakan dapat di-hapuskan . Saya men-dapat faham daripada kenyataan2Kerajaan bahawa kita tidak menentangkominis dan kominisem sa-bagaidasar , sa-bagai fahaman , tetapi kitamenentang kominisem kerana kekera-san dan violence dan juga keranasubversion.

Ini yang saya dapat f ahamkan dari-pada kenyataan Kerajaan dalam sa-hani dua ini dan pada masa yangsudah2. Ini, Tuan Yang di-Pertua,membingongkan fikiran saya, keranasa-bagai sa-orang yang telah di-lahirkan dalam keluarga yang beru-gama dan telah di-didek dan di-besarkan dalam sekolah2 ugama, pen-dapat ini sangat bertentangan danberlawanan dengan jiwa dan keyakinansaya.

Boleh-kah saya dapat memahamkandaripada kenyataan Kerajaan ini is-itukalau kominis dalam negeri ini meng-ishtiharkan tidak akan menjalankansubversion dan tidak akan mengguna-kan kekerasaan , ada-kah Parti Kominisakan di -akui sa-bagai satu parti yanghalal dalam negeri ini?

Saya tahu, bahawa kita, saya sendirisekurang2 -nya, kita menentang komi-nisem , kerana di-dalam dasar komi-nisem itu ada satu benda , ada satuperkara yang berlawanan dengan jiwakita yang berugama. Dan kita tidakpernah menyangka walau sekelip matapun salama ini bahawa kita menentangkominisem kerana kekerasan yang di-gunakan-nya, kerana dalam sejarahabad 19 dan 20, kita tidak pernahmenengok kominisem menggunakankekerasan . Orange yang menggunakankekerasan dan peperangan is-lahkuasa2 barat yang menindas ra`ayat2di-Afrika , ra`ayat2 dalam Asia.

Siapa yang membunoh orang?Siapa yang menganiayakan orang?Siapa yang mengishtiharkan peperan-gan, peperangan dan menggunakankekerasan ? Barangkali dalam masa

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yang akhir2 ini baharu kita nampakkominisem sa-bagai satu kuasa ganasyang menggunakan kekerasan , tetapisa-panjang yang saya ingat dan sa-panjang yang saya tahu dalam sejarahperjuangan manusia untok membebas-kan diri daripada belenggu penjajahan,yang menentang manusia yang menun-tut kemerdekaan itu, yang membunohmanusia , yang berperang denganmanusia yang berkehendakkan hak-nyadan kebebasan -nya dalam dunia inibukan kominis daripada Russia, tetapiis-lah kuasa2 barat yang kita agong2kandemokrasi yang mereka bawa ka-negeri mi.

Jadi saya tidak mengerti mengapaKerajaan pada hari ini beraleh Pan-dang atau bertukar sikap dalam soalkominisem . Saya berharap apa yangsaya fahamkan dalam soal ini dapatdi-jelaskan dan di-terangkan olehKerajaan, kerana saya fikir ke-bingongan ini bukan saya sa-orangsahaja, tetapi tentu banyak orangeyang di-luar Dewan ini yang berasabingong berkenaan sikap dan pen-dirian Kerajaan dalam soal kominisemmi.

Dalam pertanyaan pagi tali wakildaripada Muar Utara telah bertanyamana -kah negeri2 kominis yang sudahbertukar sikap terhadap Malaysia?Pada pandangan saya, negeri2 koministidak ada yang bertukar sikap terhadapMalaysia , tetapi Malaysia yang ber-tukar sikap . Oleh sebab itu, TuanYang di-Pertua , soal ini terlampauserious , saya minta penjelasan yangtegas dalam soal kominisem ini supayadapat kita memelihara ra`ayat kitayang berugama dalam negeri ini,selamat daripada benchana komi-nisem. Yang saya maksudkan ugamadi-sini bukan sahaja ugama Islam,tetapi semua ugama.

Dalam uchapan Yang BerhormatMenteri waktu mengemukakanBelanjawan-nya telah menyebutkansatu perkara atau pun satu sebabmengapa Belanjawan kita pada tahunini melambong bagitu tinggi pada halkonfrantasi telah tamat.

Jadi salah satu daripada jawapanyang di-berikan is-lah kerana kitahendak mempesatkan, menchergaskan

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lagi gerakan pembangunan di-Sabahdarn Sarawak , dan jugs kerana kitaterpaksa mempertahankan negeri itusendiri sa-telah askhar2 British danCommonwealth keluar daripada sana.

Apa yang saya suka hendak sebut-kan dalam perkara ini is -lah sayaharap saudara2 kita daripada Sabahdan Sarawak akan appreciate, akanmenghargai , beban yang kita diMalaysia Barat pikul kerana saudarakita yang di -Malaysia Timor itu. Dansaya harap saudara2 kita daripadaSabah dan Sarawak akan dapat me-nengok dan melihat dan merasaibetapa dalam -nya kaseh kita danikhtiar kita untok berdamping lebehrapat lagi dengan saudara2 kita yangdi-Sabah dan di-Sarawak . Dan sayaberharap sa-tengah2 perkara yang adadalam Perlembagaan Malaysia padahari ini yang telah di -buat bagitu rupauntok memberikan keyakinan dankeperchayaan kapada orange dua bushwilayah itu yang kita daripada Malayaini bukan tuan yang datang hendakmenjajah tetapi kawan yang hendakmenolong dan saudara yang hendakmembantu supaya dapat mereka sen-diri membawakan pandangan2 supayaSabah dan Sarawak akan lebeh rapa,tlagi dan segala sekatan2 yang di-buat2itu dapat di-elakkan supaya hubongankita benar2 hubongan saudara yanghidup dalam satu negara yang tidakberpechah kerana di -pisahkan oleh tautyang bagitu besar.

Kita maseh ada banyak perkara2 danmaseh barangkali sa-tengah2 orang di-Sabah dan Sarawak, ada sa-tengah2orang musoh2 Malaysia yang chubahendak melaga2kan atau menerbitkankeraguan , kesangsian orang2 di-Sarawakdan di-Sabah terhadap kejujoran kitayang ada di-Malaysia Barat mi. Jadidengan ada -nya Belanjawan yang adapada hari ini dan yang akan datangpada masa2 akan datang saudara2 kithyang ada di-Sabah dan di-Sarawaktidak akan terpengaroh dengan iblis2yang chuba hendak memechah belab-kan kita.

Saudara2 kita di-Sabah dan di-Sarawak mesti-tah yakin bahawa kita-lah orang-nya yang di-Malaysia Baratini yang menjadi saudara yang benar2

hendak menolong kebangkitan dankemajuan mereka dan bukan -lah bekastuan2 yang memerentah negeri itudahulu. Orange yang bekas memeren-tah Sabah dan Sarawak dahulu yangmaseh mempunyai sadikit sa-banyakpengaroh dalam negeri itu dan kitatelah banyak dengar di -luar dan di-dalam Dewan ini betapa manusia2 inibekerja untok menjarak atau menjauh-kan jarak perpisahan di-antara kitadengan saudara2 kita di -wilayah Sabahdan Sarawak.

Jadi saya berharap -lah Ahli2 Dewanini yang daripada Sabah dan Sarawakakan balek, pulang sa -telah Dewan iniselesai meshuarat -nya membawa kha-bar baik yang datang daripada KualaLumpur ini dan dengan itu agak-nyaakan dapat membunoh segala kuman2yang di-taborkan oleh seteru2 kita yangchuba hendak memechah belahkanantara barat dan timor.

Saya berasa wajib menyebutkan di-sini berkenaan dengan soal bahasakebangsaan , kerana wakil Yang Ber-hormat dari Ipoh telah menyentoh lagisoal mi . Apa yang saya hendak sebut-kan berkenaan dengan soal bahasakebangsaan ini is-lah supaya pemim-pin2 yang ada dalam negeri ini mem-punyai rasa tanggong -jawab yangpenoh bagi keselamatan dan keten-teraman dalam negeri kita mi.

Banyak atau pun ada sa -tengah2pemimpin yang hendak menggunakansoal bahasa ini untok kepentinganpolitik-nya dan saya fikir soal bahasaini terlalu merbahaya untok di -jadikan.alat bagi kepentingan politik sa-saorangatau sa-sabuah parti . Jadi saya harapwakil dari Ipoh ini sedar bahawa apayang di-mainkan-nya itu is-lah apiyang akan membakar parti-nya dandiri-nya.

Apakala Perikatan mengambil ke-tetapan dan kesimpulan hendak meng-gunakan satu bahasa bagi negara kitaini tidak sa-orang pun dalam puchokpimpinan Perikatan menaroh ingatanatau menaroh niat atau menaroh satu2tujuan hendak membunoh satu2bahasa . Apa yang kita maksudkandengan mengadakan satu bahasa ituis-lab supaya dapat pendudok2 negeri

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ini berfikir dengan satu bahasa danbertutur dalam satu bahasa, dan iniakan dapat menolong merapatkan lagijarak yang ada dl-antara kaum2 yangada dalam negeri mi. Tidak adateringat dan terlintas dalam fikirankita waktu menetapkan satu bahasakebangsaan bagi negara kita ini is-lahuntok menindas lain2 bahasa. Ke-betulan bahasa itu bahasa Melayu. Itubukan salah siapa tetapi kerana bahasaitu memang bahasa negeri ini. Jadiitu-lah kita terima bahasa Melayu sa-bagai bahasa kebangsaan yang tunggaldan rasmi bagi negara kita ini dan inisatu perkara barangkali amat lojikmenjadikan bahasa Melayu bahasarasmi dan kebangsaan yang tunggalbagi negara kita ini. Chontoh yangmenunjokkan bahawa Perikatan yangmemegang tampok Kerajaan pada hariini tidak mempunyai sa-barang niatjahat terhadap kapada lain2 bahasa,Kerajaan berbelanja berjuta2 ringgituntok pelajaran lain2 bahasa dalamnegeri mi.

Jadi, untok hendak menggunakansoal bahasa ini bagi mendapatkansokongan dan bagi mendapatkansimpati daripada sa-tengah2 gulongan,ini saya fikir satu perhuatan yangtidak bertanggong-jawab yang patutKerajaan mengambil perhatian yangberat terhadap orang2 yang mengguna-kan soal bahasa ini, supaya di-rentikandi-mana mereka ada sekarang mi. Kitamengerti kalau maseh ada sa-tengah2kaum yang bukan Melayu dalamnegeri ini maseh ber-ia2 benar dalamsoul bahasa ini, kita tidak hairan,kerana dalam perkembangan pem-bangunan sa-suatu bangsa kita kenaada sifat tolerensi-sifat sanggup me-nerima dan mempunyai pandangan danfikiran yang jauh kahadapan. Tetapikita tidak dapat tolerate orang2 yangmenggunakan soal bahasa ini bagikepentingan parti-nya atau bagi ke-pentingan diri-nya. T'erima kaseh.

Tuan Ramli bin Omar (Krian Darat):Tuan Yang di-Pertua, mengikut sejarahnegeri kita, dahulu di-panggil TanahMelayu dan sekarang terkenal dengannama Malaysia. Tuan Yang di-Pertua,di-sini saya suka mengatakan is-ituberba^ai2 masaalah bebanan dari me-

nahan anchaman negara kita darikominis sa-lama 12 tahun lama-nya;sa-lepas itu tamat-nya anchaman komi-nis pada tahun 1960, maka datang-lahpula satu terajidi yang ta' asing lagidaripada negeri tetangga kita, konfran-tasi sa-lama tiga tahun. Dan di-masakita membahathkan Perbekalan Ang-garan ini, Tuan Yang di-Pertua, datangpula satu terajidi baharu is-itu ben-chana bah yang memusnahkan segalaharta-benaa ra`ayat ta' kira dari apaketurunan, bangsa, ugama dan parti.Tuan Yang di-Pertua, sejak KerajaanPerikatan memegang teraju negeri ini,negeri ini di-ambil daripada imperial-ist dan berbagai2 anchaman yang sayakatakan tali telah dapat di-hindarkan.Kita bershukor kapada Allah sub-hanahu wata`ala yang telah menunjok-kan Kerajaan Perikatan kita jalan yangselamat hingga menjadi ma`amor.

Kema`amoran negara kita telah di-nyatakan sendiri oleh President negarayang terkaya sa-kali di-dunia dan yangterkuat di-dunia itu. Tuan Yang di-Pertua, saya bangun is-lah menyambutbalk serta menyokong Rang Perbe-kalan tahun 1967, yang telah di-bentangkan oleh Menteri Kewangankita yang mana pada fikiran kita ada-lah sangat lojik dan kena pada tempat-nya sa-bagai sa-buah negara yangsenang membangun. Chadangan Men-teri Kewangan kita ini untok men-dapatkan wang tambahan untok mem-biayai kewangan negara kita yangsenang membangun itu ada-lah di-anggap sederhana sahaja, tetapi sa-balek-nya pehak sa-belah sana meng-anggap sangat berat atas chadangan2baharu Kerajaan itu dan mendatang-kan tidak senang hati-nya di-kalanganmereka. Chadangan baharu Kerajaanbagi mendapatkan wang itu tidak-lahsa-bagitu berat saperti yang di-tudoholeh pehak Pembangkang-wand itutidak-lah sa-bagitu berat sa-benar-nya,tetapi pehak Pembangkang sengajayang suka mengheboh2kan perkara itu.Ra`ayat telah sedar bagaimana kata2kosong oleh pehak Pembangkang kitayang telah memboktikan di-akhir2 inidalam satu pertarongan Pilehan Rayakechil di-Ibu Kota yang mana Parti2Pembangkang sendiri bertelagah sa-sama sendiri untok menegakkan

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benang basah mereka itu. PilehanRaya kechil di-tengah2 Ibu Kota itutelah memboktikan hasrat ra`ayat yangintellectual tahu memileh yang manyhitam dan yang mana puteh-yang.mana baik dan yang masa busok,kerana letak-nya Pilehan Raya itu di-tengah2 gelombang masharakat sophis-ticated, 90% daripada pengundi2 ituada berpelajaran dan pula letak-nyatempat Pilehan raga itu di-gedongperubatan Ahli Yang Berhormat wakildari Batu. Tuan Yang di-Pertua,Kerajaan mengenakan sadikit chukaiuntok membiayai perbelanjaan itu Sayakatakan lojik , is-lah kerana orangedi-kawasan luar bandar yang sayawakili, khas -nya, dalam kawasan sayatidak pernah menentang -nya, chumakapitalis yang menghisap darah sahajayang selalu menentang-bukan menen-tang membela , menentang menahankochek mereka itu.

Saya suka hendak menarek perhatiandan saya suka hendak memberi tahuDewan ini, peladang2 di-luar bandaryang memberi nyawa kapada pendudok2bandar tidak pernah menuntut menaik-kan hasil-mahsul -nya-kalau ada punbukan P'arlimen menentukan hasil-nyatetapi kaum2 kapitalis menentukansegala hasil2 mahsul peladang itu.Tetapi, apabila Kerajaan Perikatanmemerentah , mengambil aleh daripadaKerajaan imperialist , telah sedan akantanggong-jawab-nya untok menaikkantaraf hidup petani dan berbagai2 charadi-chari untok mema ` amorkan petani2.Saya, bagi pehak kaum tani, meng-uchapkan sa-tinggi2 tahniah atas usaha2Kerajaan Perikatan berkenaan denganmema`amorkan mereka itu.

Tuan Yang di-Pertua , pertama soyahendak menarek perhatian Dewan danKerajaan is -lah berkenaan denganmengurangkan atau memotong gaji2pegawai Kerajaan . Sudah kena-lahpada tempat dan masa -nya bagi Kera-jaan membuat chadangan2 yang con-structive untok mendapatkan dan men-jimatkan wang . Sa-benar-nya mengu-rangkan gaji atau perkhidmatan tenagaKerajaan itu , pada flkiran saya, tidakperlu masa sekarang mi. Apa yangsaya lihat dan dapati, ada sa -tengah2tempat pegawai2 Kerajaan tidakchukup kerja, ada sa- tengah2 tempat,

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kerja banyak tetapi pegawai-nyakurang . Ini dapat -lah di-lihat darisudut mata kasar kita-satu datanglambat, berbual2 di-kantin membuangmasa , berbual2 dan balek lekas, datanglambat-ini boleh di-katakan kenapada semua bahagian . Tidak-lah sagahendak mengatakan pada sa -siapa ataupada bahagian mana , tetapi siapa yangmakan chabai tahu-lah pedas-nya.

Satu lagi, Tuan Yang di-Pertua,berkenaan dengan French leave ataumedical leave daripada doktor2 private.Di-sini saya sutra menarek perhatianKerajaan , French leave yang sayamaksudkan ini daripada private doctoruntok pegawai2 Kerajaan hendak-lahdi-haramkan . Kerana saya katakanbagini , Tuan Yang di -Pertua, adakedai2 doktor menchari kekayaan dari-pada menjual leave certi ficatebukansahaja kita haramkan anchaman komi-nis, tetapi chuti hasam sa-baginihendak-lah di-haramkan oleh pejabat2Kerajaan , sa-tengah2 Kerajaan dansuku-Kerajaan . Tuan Yang di-Pertua,ada pejabat2 Kerajaan yang saya dapattabu, apabila hendak meminta men-ambah pegawai pejabat-nya di-hantar-lah laporan atau report kapada Trea-sury, F.E.O. atau Pesurohjaya Per-khidmatan `Awam-hujjah2-nya itukalau di -bacha memang gerun, tetapibila sudah di -beri kelulusan mengambilpegawai, kerja-nya Pula ta' chukup,saperti mana yang di-reportkan di-dalam laporan-nya.

Jadi , di-dalam masa ini apabilaKerajaan hendak memenohi sa-suatujawatan itu, jangan-lah menerimabulat2 laporan2 atau report2 yangmengatakan kerja banyak tetapihendak-lah meneliti betul2 atau benar2kerja di-situ banyak . Kalau ada tempatpegawai yang ta' chukup kerja trans-ferkan sahaja dia itu ka-tempat yangchukup kerja supaya benar2 semuapegawai Kerajaan itu chukup kerja.

Tuan Yang di-Pertua , sekarang kitasedang sebok di-mana2 juga berkenaandengan saudara2 kita yang kena ben-chana `alam atau ayer bah yang tidakpernah di-`alami oleh kita-bukansahaja ra`ayat di-Malaysia Barat meng-`alami-nya, tetapi juga ra`ayat di-Malaysia Timor pun sama sa-nasib

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dengan ra `ayat di-sabelah sini. Kita ber-terima kaseh kapada semua gulonganra`ayat , luar dan dalam negeri, yangbersimpati dengan menderma apasahaja yang boleti di -hulorkan kapadasaudara2 kita yang kena ayer bah itu.

Yang aneh-nya, Tuan Yang di-Pertua , negara sedang menchari dermadi-sana sini untok menolong saudara2kita yang menderita itu. Ahli daripadaBatu (Buroh), parti yang mencharipublicity tentang dia menalong danmenderma sa-banyak $20 heboh satukampong, panggil reporter masokkansurat khabar itu dan mi. Dalam kitamenghadapi benchana ayer bah ini,Tuan Yang di-Pertua , saya sukamengeshorkan kapada Kerajaan supayamengambil tindakan dari sekarang.untok mengatasi ra `ayat kita di-sanasupaya mereka itu tidak terasa benaryang dia itu di -dalam kesusahan. Sa-berapa yang Jaya dan dapat, hares-lahkita membuat persiapan dan per-tolongan dengan segera.

Pada fikiran saya , Tuan Yang di-Pertua , soal pemulehan , pencharianmereka, hares-lah di-hidupkan sa-mula; kesihatan , perumahan , hendak-lah di-segerakan . Kalau benar2 inisudah dapat di-atasi dengan segera,tidak-lah dapat orang2 lain mencharipublicity yang murah mengena dermabenchana `alam ini , oleh kerana sam-butan ra`ayat bagitu meriah keranahendak menolong saudara2 mereka,ada orang2 yang menanggok ikan di-ayer yang keroh . Di-sana sini saya lihatada orang yang mengutip derma ayerbah, boleti jadi juga banyak kutipanyang di-dapati . Shukor-lah kita kapadaTuhan , kerana dermal ini yang di-dapati . Yang aneh -nya si -tukang pe-mungut itu lesap, orang entah ka-mana , wang -nya pun entah ka-mana.Jadi, saya fikir pengutip derma inipun harus -lah di-sekat , jangan ber-maharaja lela sangat sampai terkeluardaripada lunas2 derma ayer bah yangsa-benar-nya.

Dengan ada-nya ayer bah itu, TuanYang di-Pertua , pehak2 capitalist yangjuga mengambil kesempatan menaik-kan harga barang2 melarpbong tinggidan bersempena Pula akhir2 ini, Men-teri Kewangan kita ini mengenakan

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chadangan2 baharu untok mendapatkanwang, ini-lah helah2 capitalist2 me-nanggok di-ayer yang keroh.

Di-sini saya fikir Menteri Perda-gangan hendak -lah memberi pene-rangan dengan sa-luas2-nya mengenaikenaikan harga beras , gula dan l^ain2barang keperluan harian yang datang-nya dari dalam negeri atau dari luarnegeri . Sambil saya berchakap ber-kenaan dengan soal perdagangan ini,biar-lah saya teruskan sadikit lagi,saya harap barang2 keluaran tempatanhendak-lah di-luaskan di-MalaysiaTimor kita. Saya dapat tahu banyakbarang2 keperluan di-sana itu "madein Singapore". Kita tahu negara ituada mengeluarkan barang2 yang samadengan keluaran negara kita is-ituduplicate, mithal-nya, sabun, rokokdan lain2 barang yang ada di -keluarkandari negeri kita; is ada duplicate-nya;yang berlainan is-lah "made in"-nya.Barang "made in Singapore" mni murahsadikit dari pada barang keluarantempatan kita, kerana dekat agak-nyadan sudah tentu murah tambangpengangkutan -nya. Jadi , kita hendak-lah memberi perlindongan yang sa-chukup2 -nya kapada barang2 keluarannegeri kita supaya barang2 lain tidakberluas sangat di-Malaysia Timor itu.

Satu lagi soal di-dalam perdaganganini is-lah saya suka mengeshorkansupaya Kerajaan bertindak menuboh-kan satu sharikat perkapalan yangmenjelajah di -sakeliling negara kitaMalaysia . Perkapalan ini is-lah untokmengangkut penumpang2 saperti kitsjalankan Malayan Railways , sapertiitu-lah keadaan -nya lebeh sadikit.

Jadi, dengan ada-nya terkapalanyang sa-macham ini, tambang murah,dapat-lah ra`ayat sa-belah barat melihatsaudara -nya di-Timor dan dapat-lahra`ayat di-Timor melihat keadaan sau-dara -nya di-Barat . Jadi ta " banyak-lahorang2 kita menghabiskan masa lapang-nya ka -negara2 asing , malahan bolehjuga melanchong ka-negara. ASA atauIndonesia.

Sekarang saya suka menarek per-hatian kapada hal pertanian. ®lehkerana saya datang daripada kaumtani, maka sudah sa-wa jib-nya saya

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berchakap serba sadikit tentang haltarn. Dengan tertuboh-nya F.A.M.A.dan Persatuan Peladang, maka petani2bershukor kerana hasil mahsul-nyatelah dapat di-perhatikan oleh pehakyang berkuasa. Tidak sia-sia jugarupa-nya tenaga tani ini, dapat jugaperhatian berat daripada KerajaanPerikatan. Kalau parts lain memeren-tah, entah apa terhadap kaum tani, ta'tahu-lah. Agak-nya di-paksa sahajakaum tani untok mengeluarkan hasil,tetapi ta' menghargakan kaum tani.Kalau Parti PAS memerentah, ashekmenghasut ra`ayat, ashek mengasohra`ayat dengan petua2 kolot, partiD.A.P. ashek dengan rocket-nya bilahendak di-lancharkan ka-angkasa pura,parti Buroh dengan gendang kosong.Pendek kata Parti2 Pembangkang inigendang kosong sahaja, bukan hendakmembela ra`ayat ... .

Tuan Haji Abu Bakar bin Hamzah:Untok penjelasan. Boleh jadi apayang di-tudoh oleh Yang Berhormatitu berlaku yang pada satu masayang kita tidak ada pada masa ini,tetapi pada masa ini, saya suka mene-rangkan bahawa Parti P.M.I.P. walaubagaimana pun di-tudoh sa-kali puntelah berjaya memerentah sa-buahnegeri, is-itu tidak ada sa-buah partipun dalam Malaysia yang ini yangbersendirian, yang dapat memerentahsa-buah negeri dan kami dapatsurvive sampai dua kali. Jadi, kalauhendak di-tudoh kata hendak me-maksa kaum tani, itu saya rasa per-kara yang ta' patut sangat-lah, TuanYang di-Pertua; macham itu ta' patutsangat.

Tuan Ramli bin Omar : Tuan Yangdi-Pertua, sebab itu-lah saya buatkenyataan dalam Dewan yang muliaini, kerana dengan petua2 itu-lah,maka PAS ini dapat dua kali me-megang pemerentahan negeri itu. Jadi,baik-lah saya ta' payah-lah berbahathdengan sahabat saya di-sabelah sana,tunggu-lah tahun 1969.

Jadi, di-sini, Tuan Yang di-Pertua,saya rasa bangga dan sa-kali lagi bagipehak ra`ayat di-dalam kawasan sayamenguchapkan sa-tinggi2 tahniah apayang kaum2 tani berkehendakkan ia-

lah jaminan atas hash mahsul-nya-itu telah lama terbiar bagitu sahajatenaga usaha tarsi. Dengan tertuboh-nya saloran2 pasaran pertanian ini,baik-lah sadikit kehidupan mereka itu.

Saya rasa dan saga berharap jangan-lah sahaj a padi di-beri jaminan, hasil2pertanian yang lain juga harus di-berijaminan, sunggoh pun hasil2 lain itukechil, tetapi kapada kaum tani itubesar erti-nya. Sekian, terima kaseh.

Datin Fatimah bind Haji AbdulMajid (Johor Bahru Timor): YangBerhormat Tuan Yang di-Pertua, ter-lebeh dahulu kami menguchapkantahniah kapada Yang BerhormatMenteri Kewangan yang telah berjayamenyusun satu rangka kewangan yangmengandongi 67 muka, yang manapads keselurohan-nya ada-lah mem-bawa satu perubahan yang memberikesan yang baik di-bidang ekonomira`ayat dan negara. Walau pun untokmelaksanakan ranchangan chukaibaharu Yang Berhormat MenteriKewangan kita akan memerlukanpenjelasan agak lanjut bagi di-fahamioleh sa-tiap pehak yang berkenaanatau pun terlibat, dengan naik turun-nya chukai yang akan di-kenakan itu,namun demikian pada kita dapat-lahdi-mengertikan pada dasar-nya ba-hawa walau pun keadaan negara telahberansor puleh pada zaman perpaduandan persahabatan atau lebeh tegas di-katakan telah lepas daripada zamankonfrantasi, tetapi ini tidak-lah ber-erti yang kita boleh lepas daripadatanggong-jawab berwaspada dengananchaman2 yang sentiasa mencharijaran untok membuat kekachauandi-dalam negara ini, sa-bagaimanayang pernah dan sedang ber-laku di-negara2 jiran tetangga kitayang hingga sekarang maseh di-dalamkeadaan perang yang tidak rasmi.Dengan kerana itu ada-lah mustahilbagi kita boleh memperkechilkan lagianggaran belanjawan yang di-perlukanoleh negara terutama di-dalam bidangpelajaran yang menurut Estimatesyang telah di-ranchangkan is-lah sa-banyak $385 juta untok tahun 1967.Saya rasa anggaran yang chuma sa-banyak itu untok kepentingan pela-jaran bumiputera memang-lah tidak

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dapat di-elakkan memandang kapadabetapa banyak-nya bilangan kanak2pada sa -tiap tahun yang memerlukanpelajaran rendah hingga pada peringkatmenengah.

Yang Berhormat Tuan Yang di-Pertua, kalau tidak silap kami, YangBerhormat Menteri Kewangan di-dalam Uchapan Belanjawan muka 40Fasal 76 bahawa negara kita di-tahun1967 memerlukan perbelanjaan sa-banyak $1,828 juta sedangkan hasilnegara yang dapat di-anggarkan hanyalebeh sa-banyak $1,685 juta. mi berertinegara ini kita mesti menchari Jayautama untok menambah perbelanjaanyang kurang sa-banyak $143 juta itusupaya kita menjadi solvent keranamenutup perbelanjaan yang kekuranganitu.

Tuan Yang di-Pertua, di-dalamuchapan Menteri Kewangan beliau adajuga menyatakan yang beliau sendiritidak gemar dengan tindakan yangterpaksa di -lakukan oleh Kementerian-nya itu tetapi beliau juga menganggapada-lah mustahak bagi menaikkanchukai2 yang di-ranchangkan itu demikepentingan menutup kekuranganbelanj awan saperti yang terchatit di-muka 44 Fasal 86 yang mana denganchara demikian mungkin dapat me-nambah sa-takat $115 sahaja. Walaupun maseh kekurangan lagi sadikit,bererti dapat-lah juga di-ikhtiarkansa-kadar yang ada . Chuma adasadikit di-dalam perkara menaikkanchukai tambahan itu kerana sayadapati di-dalam uchapan Yang Ber-hormat Menteri Kewangan is-itu di-muka 55 Fasal 107 menyatakan ba-hawa chukai beer akin di-naikkan, sa-sunggoh-nya balk chadangan itu te-tapi kenapa chukai2 minuman kerasyang lain saperti whisky, brandydan lain' jenis lagi minuman yangsa-umpama itu tidak di-naikkanchukai-nya pada hal kami berpen-dapat orange yang gemarkan minumanini is-lah orange yang lumayan ke-adaan kewangan -nya. Oleh yangdemikian tentu-lah mereka denganmurah Kati sahaja boleh membayarchukai minuman yang di-sukai -nya itu.

Yang Berhormat Tuan Yang di-Pertua, Yang Berhormat Menteri Ke-

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wangan ada menyebutkan sadikit ber-kenaan dengan pendapatan gaji kaki-tan.gan Kerajaan saperti yang kitadapati terchatit di-muka 39 Fasal 74di-barisan 6 yang di-antara lain beliauberkata bahawa sebab2 menyebabkanperbelanjaan di-bahagian kaki-tanganKerajaan di-beberapa tahun yanglampau bukan -lah di-sebabkanbanyak-nya jumlah mereka bekerjatetapi kerana berlebehan gaji yang di-berikan kapada mereka atau lebehtegas di-ma`anakan mereka2 ini men-dapat gaji lebeh banyak daripadakhidmat2 yang di -berikan kapadaorang ramai. Dan di-dalam Fasal 74itu juga beliau menegaskan bahawatelah hampir- lah masa-nya bagi Kera-jaan mengambil langkah mengurang-kan kaki-tangan Kerajaan atau punmembuat penutupan gaji, potongangaji bagi sen^ua pegawai2 dan kaki-tangan Kerajaan.

Yang Berhormat Tuan Yang di-Pertua, berdasarkan penerangan2 yangdi-beri oleh Menteri Kewangan kitasa-bagaimana yang di-chatikan di-muka 12 paragraph 20 yang beliaumenyatakan pada tahun 1966 kira2142,000 kanak2 laki2 dan perempuanakan meninggalkan bangku sekolahkerana menchari pekerjaan dan angkaini akan bertambah lagi di-akhir tahun1967 kapada sa-banyak 150,000 orangyang mana kami tahu sa-bahagianbesar daripada jumlah kanak2 ini ia-lah datang-nya daripada anak2 pe-gawai2 Kerajaan. Oleh kerana ituYang Berhormat Tuan Yang di-Pertua,izinkan -lah dengan segala hormat-nyamenyatakan di-sini bahawa kami tidakbersetuju sernua sa-kali dengan cha-dangan membuang sa-bahagian dari-pada kaki-tangan Kerajaan itu, sebabapa terjadi kapada anak2 mereka yangterlibat dengan langkah2 yang akan di-ambil oleh Kerajaan di-dalam bidangpersekolahan nanti.

Sa-lain daripada itu sa -banyaksadikit tentu -lah akan mendatangkankesan yang burok kapada negara kitayang sedang membangun mi. Padaf ahaman kami apa yang perlu olehKerajaan di-dalam perkara gaji lebeh,kerja kurang itu , is-lah mengadakanpengkajian yang mendalam supayatindakan yang akan di-ambil kelak

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ada-lah memberi kesan yang balkpada segi kemajuan ra ` ayat dan ne-gara kita. Sebab perkara yang sa-umpama ini yang di-nyatakan olehYang Berhormat itu tidak-lah bolehdi-nafikan ada-nya berlaku di-pejabat2Kerajaan saperti kerja2 yang patutdi-buat oleh ketua2 pejabat di -perentah-kan orange di-bawah menjalankanmungkin tugas yang sa-umpama ituyang mana di-salah gunakan olehorangz yang tidak bertanggong-jawabmelakukan-nya. Sa-lain daripada ituada juga antara pegawai2 Kerajaanyang di-tempatkan di-pejabat yangtidak sesuai dengan pengetahuan danpengalaman-nya, ini menjadikan harapsegala tugas itu di-kerjakan oleh oranglain. Dan dia juga tidak dapat memi-kirkan atau meranchangkan sa-suatuyang boleh mendatangkan kemajuankapada perjalanan pejabatz yang di-ketuai-nya itu.

Demikian juga pada pendapat kamibanyak terdapat di-negeri '- kita inibilangan pegawai2 yang berjawatantinggi lebeh dari bilangan pegawai2yang berjawatan rendah . Ini pun satudaripada puncha2 yang menyebabkanperbelanjaan banyak-membayar gajidan elaun rumah tinggal sedangkankerja2 tidak bertambah . Dan lagi pulayang bertungkus lumus memberes sa-suatu kerja bagi kepentingan orangramai is -lah pegawai2 yang berjawatanrendah. Dan saga berfahaman sa-bahagian daripada pegawai2 tinggihanya menurunkan tandatangan sahaja.Maka dari segi ini -lah yang kami rasaperlu di-buat pengkajian yang men-dalam agar sa-tiap perkhidmatanKerajaan tidak terjejas dengan tin-dakan yang melulu.

Yang Berhormat Tuan Yang di-Pertua, ada sadikit lagi hendak kamimemperkatakan di-sini is -lah mengenairanchangan melawat keluar negerisambil belajar . Kami rasa agaksudah sampai masa-nya bagi Kera-jaan mengkaji sa-mula sama adaranchangan2 yang sa-umpama ini elokdi-tahan buat sementara waktu ataupun buat sa-lama2-nya. Sebab kamikatakan bagitu kerana memandangkankekurangan belanjawan yang bakal di-hadapi oleh Kerajaan bagi kepen-tingan negara yang lebeh perlu di-

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utamakan daripada ranchangan mela-wat sambil belajar itu, supaya tidak-lah wang yang di-belanjakan itusaperti menchurah ayer di-atas dawnkeladi yang tidak memberi apa2 ke-san yang baik, menchurahkan belanjaitu. Sebab sa-panjang yang di -ketahulsa-bahagian daripada orang yang men-dapat peluang melawat ka-luar negeriitu apakala balek ka-tanah ayer tidakada membuat apa2 laporan atau punjauh sa-kali daripada mendatangkanshore atau chadangan2 daripadapandangan yang di-dapati darilawatan-nya itu dan ada juga sa-bahagian yang telah menghantarkanlaporan tetapi laporan-nya itu tidakdi-kaji. Jadi untok kepentingan pem-bangunan negara ini , dengan Sebabto-lah kami berpendapat elok-lah di-

kaji sa -mula ranchangan ini supayadapat di -beri pertimbangan yang sa-wajar-nya sama ada baik di -teruskanatau di -hapuskan sahaja sa-hingganegara ini puleh sa-mula dengan sa-wajar-nya di-dalam segala segi ke-wangan kita.

Dalam tugas melaksanakan bahasakebangsaan , Yang Berhormat TuanYang di-Pertua , menurut Perlembagaankita di-tahun 1967 ini bahasa kebang-saan di-jadikan bahasa rasmi yang tung-gal bagi negara kita. Di-dalam hal inisaya menaroh sa-penoh2 keperchayaandi-atas pengakuan Kerajaan itu. Te-tapi ada sadikit yang kami perlu men-jelaskan is -itu baru2 ini Kerajaan telahmengeluarkan satu surat Pekililing(Circular) mengatakan pada sa-tiapjurutrengkas bahasa Inggeris mesti-lahmengambil Pelajaran Trengkas BahasaKebangsaan di-dalam tempoh tigatahun. Ini bererti mereka yang ber-kenaan di -beri masa sa-lama tigatahun lagi daripada tahun 1967 mi.Untok mengetahul trengkas di-dalambahasa kebangsaan . Tidak-kah ini,pada fahaman kami mengganggu ran-changan perlaksanaan yang di-ranchangkan berjalan sa -chepat mung-kin dari tarikh bulan Ogos yang telahdi-tentukan oleh negara kita?

Yang Berhormat Tuan Yang di-Pertua, lagi sate yang membingongkankami memikirkan kerana kami dapati

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jumlah kanak2 yang di-masokkan se-kolah tahun 1967, is-itu tahun per-laksanaan merasmikan bahasa ke-bangsaan negara Malaysia ada lebehbanyak yang pergi ka-sekolah yangbahasa pengantar-nya bahasa Inggeris.Di-Johor Bahru sahaja yang saya nam-pak ada dua buah sekolah kebangsaanLaki2 dan Perempuan telah di-tumpangkan belajar di-sabelah petang-nya oleh kanak2 yang Baru masok di-sekolah Inggeris. Ini di-sebabkanbanyak kanak2 yang berdaftar belajardi-sekolah bahasa pengantar-nya ia-lah bahasa Inggeris. Jadi, di-sini manaletak-nya keperchayaan orange ramaiterhadap penggunaan bahasa kebang-saan bagi menjamin mass hadapananak2 mereka.

Sa-tengah daripada sa-tengah ibubapa yang kami tanya mengapa merekatidak mahu menghantarkan anak2mereka belajar di-sekolah kebangsaan.Jawab-nya yang kami terima boleti di-katakan hampir sa-rupa belaka, is-itutidak menaroh keyakinan yang bahasakebangsaan bolch menjamin nasibanak2 mereka. Dan lagi kami lihatpemimpin2 kami dan pembesar2 kamitidak ada yang sanggup memboktikankapada ra`ayat semua yang anakmereka juga telah di-sekolahkan di-Sekolah Kebangsaan Rendah, Mene-ngah dan sa-terus-nya ka-Universitymenerusi mata pelajaran bahasa ke-bangsaan. Kalau pehak yang meran-changkan berbagai2 ranchangan ataumemajukan bahasa kebangsaan tidakmenaroh keperchayaan di-atas ke-bahagian anak2-nya dengan hanyabelajar menerusi bahasa kebangsaan,bagaimana-kah chara2 mereka bolehmenanamkan keyakinan di-hati kamisemua supaya menyerahkan anak2mereka belajar di-Sekolah Kebangsaanuntok mendapat peluang hidup baha-gia di-masa akan datang?

Yang Berhormat Tuan Yang di-Pertua, apa-kah erti-nya perlaksanaanbahasa kebangsaan kalau kita tidakberupaya memberikan keperchayaankapada ra`ayat supaya mengutamakanbahasa kebangsaan dari bahasa Ing-geris, sedangkan untok mendapatkanpekerjaan yang sa-rendah2 jawatan sa-kali pun anak2 kami sa-kurang2-nyamesti berkelulusan L.C.E. bahasa

Inggeris, jika tidak, tak usah-lah di-harap kata-nya Akan dapat kerjadengan Kerajaan? Oleh yang demikiankami minta-lah dengan hormat-nyaMenteri yang berkenaan memberikanjawapan yang tegas di-dalam masaalahyang kami katakan ini supaya dapatkami menerangkan pula kapadamereka.

Tuan Yang di-Pertua, di-dalamuchapan Yang Berhormat Menteri Ke-wangan juga telah mengatakan Kera-jaan terpaksa berbelanja besar, satudaripada sebab-nya is-lah melanchar-kan Ranchangan Pembangunan Me-nanam Getah Semula untok mena:m-bahkan pendapatan ra`ayat, dan Kera-jaan telah berhutang kapada negarayang lain dan akan membayar bunga-nya. iSudah-kah pehak Kerajaan meng-kaji dengan sa-luas2-nya bahawa sa-tiap ranchangan yang di-ranchangkanitu akan dapat di-nekmati hasil,nyaoleh ra`ayat keselurohan-nya? Kamimaseh ragu2 dengan ramalan tersebut,apakala telah di-kaji dan di-tolak pergihanya yang menekmati keuntongan iniis-lah pemborong2, penjual bahaa2tanaman, penjual baja pokok dan lain2orang yang tidak berkenaan denganhasil ranchangan itu, tetapi berolehkesempatan mendapat untong denganada-nya Kerajaan membuka tanah2dan menanam semula untok rancha-ngan tersebut? Oleh yang demikiankami harap elok-lah Kerajaan meng-kaji sa-mula ranchangan2 Kerajaanhendak memberi kebahagiaan dankema`amoran hidup kapada ra`ayatdapat di-nekmati oleh mereka dalamerti kata yang sa-benar2-nya.

Yang Berhormat Tuan Yang di-Pertua, pada awal tahun 1967 negarakita telah mendapat benchana di-sebabkan banjir, is-itu ayer bah yangtelah berlaku di-Kelantan, di-Trengganu, Perak dan Perlis yangmana Kerajaan telah mengalamikerugian dan ra`ayat juga telahmengalami kerugian haraa benda danrumah tangga. Dan kami perchayaharus akan berlaku kemalangan yangsa-rupa ini di-negeri2 yang laintermasok-lah negeri Johor khas-nyadi-kawasan kami di-Johor BahruTimor, kerana di-kawasan kami ada

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juga ra`ayat yang telah menderita di-sebabkan ayer bah pada masa meng-hadapi bulan raya, bulan ra`ayat ber-suka ria, mereka telah terpaksameninggalkan rumah tangga menum-pang rumah2 kawan dan juga di-tempatkan di-Balai Raya di-sebabkan ayer telah naik ka-rumah2mereka. Mereka juga telah mengalamikerugian walau pun sa-keping tikargetah dan sa-bidang permaidani, tetapipada orang yang hidup-nya sederhana.kerugian itu ada-lah di-pandang berat.Kami telah berkali2 merayu sama adadi-dalam Dewan ini dan juga di-dalamMeshuarat2 Luar Bandar supaya Kera-jaan memberikan wang peruntokanmembuat tali ayer untok menahansupaya rumah2 mereka tidak di-naikiayer, tetapi Kerajaan jawab tidak adaperuntokan dan Menteri Perumahansendiri telah berjanji di-dalam Dewanini akan berikhtiar sa-bahagian dari-pada rumah2 yang di-naiki ayer ituakan di-angkat kapada tanah yangtinggi yang tidak di-naiki ayer, tetapimalang-nya sa-hingga hari ini belumada satu2 langkah yang telah di-ambil.Pengundi2 mereka telah bersungut.Kata-nya sa-belum Kerajaan Perikatanmemerentah, rumah2 mereka tidak per-nah berayer, dia tidak pernah menarekkain (Ketawa), manakala KerajaanPerikatan memerentah, banyak rumah2besar di-dirikan dan tanah2 rendahdi-tinggikan oleh yang mencharifaedah. Rumah mereka, Tuan Yangdi-Pertua, di-naiki oleh ayer di-sebabkan taliayer tidak di-perbaiki.

Dengan ini, kami merayu kapadaMenteri yang berkenaan supaya me-ngambil perhatian yang berat dan kamiberharap supaya di-beri-lah wangperuntokan kerana membuat taliayer2supaya rumah2 mereka tidak sentiasadi-naiki ayer-pantang sahaja harihuj an turun 2 hari, rumah merekatelah di-penohi ayer, mereka ber-keliaran lari ka-sana sini untokmenyelamatkan harta benda mereka.Dengan ini sa-kali lagi kami merayukapada pehak Kementerian yang ber-kenaan supaya dapat menimbangkanrayuan kami kerana sudah memakanmasa tiga tahun yang kami telahmerayu meminta, sama ada memintajambatan, meminta wang peruntokan

3002

membuat taliayer dan walau punKementerian telah mengaku untokmengangkat rumah2 itu kapada tanahyang tinggi, kami telah di-tempelakoleh pengundi2 kami bila-kah rumahkami akan di-angkat. Manakala kamimerayu Yang Berhormat Wakil kamitelah mengatakan, rumah kami akandi-angkat kapada tanah yang tinggimemandangkan belanja yang banyakuntok membuat taliayer, lebeh baik di-alehkan kapada tanah yang tinggi te-tapi sa-hingga hari ini ranchangan2itu belum pun di-laksanakan.

Sekian. terima kaseh.

Tuan Haji Abu Bakar bin Hamzah:Tuan Yang di-Pertua, dengan izintuan, saya tumpang sadikit berchakapberkenaan dengan Anggaran Belan-jawan kita bagi tahun 1967 mi. Sayajuga turut, Tuan Yang di-Pertua,merasa sedeh sa-bagaimana Ahli YangBerhormat daripada Johor BahruTimor is-itu ra`ayat kita pada tahunini mengalami benchana yang besar-benchana alam, banjir bukan sahajadi-Johor tetapi di-Perak, Trengganudan Kelantan dan saya berharap-lahperkara ini men jadi satu perkarayang di-utamakan di-dalam per-laksanaan Kerajaan walau pun di-dalam Estimate ini tidak termasokkerana benda itu catastrophic yangkita tidak tahu benda itu hendak ber-laku. Chuma saya tidak tahu-lahbanjir ini sama ada Kerajaan Perikatanmemerentah atau tidak, tetapi yangpelek-nya di-Kelantan PAS memeren-tah pun turun juga huj an, agak-nyasebab ada Pembangkang Perikatan di-situ, kalau tidak ada, tidak turunhujan, Tuan Yang di-Pertua.

Tuan Ahmad bin Arshad: TuanYang di-Pertua, saya minta jalan.

Mr (Deputy) Speaker: Dia memintajalan kalau di-beri.

Tuan Ahmad bin Arshad: Mintapenjelasan daripada apa yang di-kata-kan oleh Ahli Yang Berhormat daripadaBachok tali. Sebab bah itu, itu tidakbetul bagitu. Sebab banjir yang berlakudi-Kelantan oleh sebab orange PASmengkafirkan orange Islam makadengan sebab itu bala-nya Tuhanturunkan.

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Tuan Haji Abu Bakar bin Hamzah:Tuan Yang di-Pertua, itu sangkaan dia,tetapi yang sa-benar-nya banjir inibergantong kapada nature bumi ataupun topography, nothing to do withkafir-mengkafir, tetapi bagitu-lah AhW-daripada pehak di-sana dua tahunmenjadi Member of Parliament hujanpun di-ingatkan fasal kempen-diatidak belajar geography gamak-nya-must study topography of the country.

Tuan Yang di-Pertua, saya tengokpada tahun ini peruntokan kita lebeh$130 juta berbanding dengan tahun1966 di-sebabkan yang lebeh YangBerhormat Menteri Kewangan kitaberi empat perkara. Tetapi, Tuan Yangdi-Pertua, yang menjadi pelek-nyasaya hendak meminta tolong Menterikita menerangkan lebeh jauh lagi ia-itu berkenaan dengan Treasury Memo-randum, Command Paper 49 of 1966,muka 2 yang menggambarkan rangkakasar bagaimana anggaran ini bolehbertambah dan menunjokkan peratus2yang lebeh-nya. Dalam perkara 4-Debt Servicing (Public Debt agak-nya)$219.6 juta is-itu 12.0% daripadajumlah besar anggaran mesti di-bayarkapada Servicing. Ini lebeh banyakdaripada economic servicing yanghanya memakan 8.1. Jadi servicinghutang sampai 12.0.

Tuan Yang di-Pertua, saya bukan-lah sa-orang economist dan tidak jugaorang yang pandai dalam kewangan,sebab itu saya meminta Menteri kitamenerangkan. Saya amat dukachita-lah memandang kapada Public Debtatau pun Hutang Kerajaan ini, is-itusaya bersetuju chara mana2 MenteriKewangan, bukan sahaj a Mr Tan SiewSin kita, sa-siapa sa-kali pun menjadiMenteri Kewangan pada tiap2 tahuntidak-lah banyak orang memuji, banyakorang marah dia dan tidak dapathendak membuat sa-suatu supayaorang sayang kapada dia kerana diaterpaksa menchari wang untok meng-adakan perbelanj aan.

Tetapi saya dalam menyokongMenteri Kewangan meminjam-samaada pinjaman itu dari dalam negeriatau pun dari luar negeri-jangan-lahhutang2 itu merupakan hutang yangburok (bad) bukan-nya good is-itu

yang tidak ada figure di-sini yangdapat saya menunjokkan tetapi dari-pada kenyataan2 sa-telah saya rumus-kan, saya dapati bahawa hutang yangkita berhutang ini boleh kita sif atkandia sa-bagai bad debt bukan good debtis-itu di-dalam local loan yang kitahutang di-dalam ini saya bersetuj usupaya benaa ir^i dia lebeh banyaklagi daripada hutang daripada luar,kerana saya dapati di-dalam kenyataandan di-dalam perkara2 yang berlakudalam negara kita, hutang yangmereka transfer kapada satu sectionmasharakat kita kapada satu sectionyang lain di-dalam negeri kita juga,maka hutang2 yang sa-macham inisaya rasa real burden bagi kita danitu boleti menguntongkan masharakatkita sendiri tetapi kalau sa-kira-nyakita meminjam wang daripada luarnegeri yang termasok juga di-dalamDebt Servicing dia itu sampai 12.0daripada perbelanjaan kita itu daripadaluar negeri, maka ini menyebabkankesusahan bagi negeri kita bukansahaja dari segi kesusahan yang sa-benar-nya tetapi dari segi moneyburden kita pun terok dan ini akanmenjatohkan kedudokan ekonomi kitadi-mata dunia luar dan Jaya mintyMenteri kita ini menerangkan bahawaapa-kah yang sa-benar-nya hutang kitaini dapat kita namakan good debt ataupun sa-mata2 satu kenyataan menun-jokkan kita berhutang sa-banyak itu.

Mr (Deputy) Speaker : Persidanganini di-tempohkan sa-lama 15 minit.

Sitting suspended at 5.20 p.m.

Sitting resumed at 5.40 p.m.

(Mr (Deputy) Speaker in the Chair)

Debate resumed.

Tuan Haji Abu Bakar bin Hamzah:Tuan Yang di-Pertua, sa-bentar tadisaya telah chuba mengulas berkenaandengan hutang yang meningkat bagitubanyak sa-hingga servicing-nya punsampai 219.6 million, is-itu 12%daripada anggaran mi. Ini amat-lahmenjolok mata bila kita bandingkanperatus ini bagitu jauh daripada apayang di-untokkan betul2 bagi economicservices yang hanya 8.1 %. Tuan Yang

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di-Pertua, saya bersetuju dengan YangBerhormat Menteri bahawa kita di-dalam Dewan ini tidak-lah bergunahanya mengecham pehak Kerajaantentang policy Kewangan, tetapi lebehbaik kita mengemukakan sa-suatusupaya menolong Kerajaan mengatasikesulitan2 yang ada. Jadi, dalammenolong Kerajaan, Tuan Yang di-Pertua, saya suka memberi dua pen-dapat-dua segi pendapat; is-itu darisegi mengulas chara2 yang berlakudan juga dari segi hendak mengemuka-kan satu perkara yang berlainandaripada apa yang di-buat olehKerajaan.

Tuan Yang di-Pertua, walau punkita tidak dapat angka yang sa-benardi-sine-di-hadapan saya ini angkayang sa-benar berkenaan denganberapa hutang dan berapa hutangdaripada luar negeri dan berapahutang daripada dalam negeri, tetapinyata-lah servicing hutang ini yang219.6 million lebeh banyak daripadakekurangan yang kita hendak chariis-itu kira2 115 million yang kitahendak chari, yang saya dapati per-bezaan di-antara Peruntokan tahun1967 dengan tahun 1966 is-lah sa-banyak 127 million. Yang kita hendakchari sa-kurang2-nya yang mustahaksangat is-lah 115 million ini, TuanYang di-Pertua, kalau kita dapatdengan mullah sa-kali pun $115 jutaini sa-mata2 kita hendak menutupiservicing bagi hutang sa-banyak $210juta itu pun dekat separoh lagi kitaterpaksa kena menchari. Jadi, untokmembayar interest-membayar bagitubagini kesemua lebeh daripada 115million. Saya perchaya dalam servicingini tentu-lah ada sinking fund-nyabagitu bagini. Tetapi, apa-lah musta-hak-nya, Tuan Yang di-Pertua, yangkita berhutang sampai bagitu-sa-hingga deficit yang kita hendak chariitu rendah daripada yang kita hendakbayar servicing ini Tuan Yang di-Pertua, chuba kita lihat di-dalamkenyataan di-sini menerangkan bagai-mana hutang' itu terpaksa di-bayaryang kata-nya 53 million yang kitahendak bayar dalam tahun 1966sampai kapada naik-nya servicing inidaripada 166.6 million tahun 1966sampai 219.6 pada tahun 1967 is-lah

kerana kita hendak membayar hutang2di-dalam negeri yang sudah matang,is-itu maturity date-nya sudah sampai,jadi kita hendak membayar di-situsahaja interest-nya servicing-nya $34million.

Tuan Yang di-Pertua, di-sini-lahsaya suka mengingatkan Kerajaan,is-itu dari mana wang yang kitahendak dapat hendak membayarservicing ini, tidak lain dan tidakbukan daripada hanya kita mengena-kan chukai2 baharu atau pun tambahchukai surtax atau pun kita mengada-kan excise lagi di-atas barang2 dalamnegeri kita sa-lain daripada kitamenaikkan custom duty di-atasbarang2 daripada luar. Jadi, TuanYang di-Pertua, apa-kah akibah akanjadi kapada negara kita kalau kitamemungut wang yang sa-macham mi.Tuan Yang di-Pertua, saya tunjokkanchontoh-kata-lah kita hutang daridalam negeri-hutang ini bukanhutang luar negeri, hutang dari dalamatau local loan dengan jalan kita jualbond dan bagitu bagini. Jadi, orangyang membeli bond itu, Tuan Yangdi-Pertua, bond holders ini tentu orangkaya, orang ada duit; kalau tidak diabagaimana hendak bagi hutang ka-pada Kerajaan, jadi, dia ini sudahkaya. Apabila kita kenakan chukaibaharu untok hendak membayarinterest kapada bond holders ini,maka chukai yang kita kenakan itutidak kena kapada bond holders danorang kaya sahaja, kena pada ra`ayatsama. Jadi, erti-nya dalam kita meng-ambil wang daripada ra`ayat kenachukai baharu di-atas barang2 excise,chukai2 excise atau pun chukai2 ba-haru yang kita kenakan dalam negarakita ini terkena kapada ka-semuaorang-miskin tidak kira bagitubagini. Kemudian duit itu Kerajaanambil, Kerajaan jadi kaya, dia mem-bayar balek kapada bond holders itukapada orang kaya juga.

Jadi, erti-nya negara kita ini di-gendalikan oleh sa-buah Kerajaan yangbermain mata dengan bond holdersitu, yang terok-nya ra`ayat juga. Jadi,ini-lah yang saya nampak sudahbanyak. Sebab itu-lah kita dapati apa-bila Kerajaan tawarkan hendak ber-hutang 5 %-kah interest atau 4 %-kah

3007 24 JANLFARY 1967

interest , dengan sakejap mata kitaboleti dapat duit itu bermilion2, ke-rana yang akan membayar besok2 initidak lain dan tidak bukan is-lahmengenakan chukai2 kapada ra`ayat--jadi, yang terok -nya is -lah bukanKerajaan . Kerajaan terok -nya menye-diakan kertas, tetapi dia boleh ber--kira dengan pehak bond holders, yangna' kena ra`ayat juga.

Ini-lah yang saya rasa pada kali2yang lain, saya tidak tahu ada-kahmenjadi satu practice dalam duniaParlimen ini, Tuan Yang di-Pertua,kerana saya baharu Pilehan Raya inimenjadi Member of Parliament . Patut-lah pehak Kerajaan ini meminta pro-posal, meminta chadangan Budget inidaripada tiap2 parti yang ada di-sinedan kami boleh memberi satu Budgetmengikut fikiran kami. Kerajaan hen-dak terima atau tidak, itu masaalahlain. Jadi , dengan demikian dapat-lahdi-ambil apa yang patut di-ambil, di-tolak apa yang patut di -tolak, dan di-masokkan apa yang patut di-masokkandan di-keluarkan apa yang patut di-keluarkan.

Jadi, Tuan Yang di-Pertua , itu sateperkara yang kita nampak dengan ter-ang, is-itu Kerajaan sudah menekanra`ayat ini dengan sa -chara tidak lang-song, is-itu dengan chara mengenakanchukai2 kapada ra'ayat untok me-menohi interest atau pun faedah yanghendak di -berikan kapada bondholders.

Tuan Yang di-Pertua, untok men-guatkan lagi apa yang saya katakanini tidak ada jalan lain bagi pehakKerajaan melainkan mengadakanchukai2 kapada ra`ayat untok hendakmembayar servicing ini dan untokhendak membuat projek2 baharu-chuba kita lihat sekarang ini sebab2mengapa Anggaran Belanjawan kitatelah naik . Yang Berhormat Menterikita memberi ada lima sebab : yangpertama kata-nya, di-dalam uchapan-nya menyatakan domestic demand initerlampau kuat, terutama dari pehakpublic sector, jadi erti-nya dari pehakKerajaan . Jadi, ini, Tuan Yang di-Pertua, bererti kita telah membelanja-kan untok perbelanjaan hangus bagipublic sector ini terlampau banyak

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sedang service yang kita dapat dari-pada perbelanjaan public sector initidak sa-imbang dengan apa yang di-harapkan oleh Kerajaan . Sebab itu-lahpehak Kerajaan tidak malu2 mengata-kan kita hanya ada dua jalan-memotong duit daripada peruntokanyang akan di-berikan kapada compre-hensive education atau pun kita men-gurangkan pegawai Kerajaan atau punmenurunkan gaji-nya , atau membuatsa-suatu mengambil duit daripada situ.

Tuan Yang di-Pertua , kalau betul-lah domestic demand ini datang dari-pada public sector mengapa pula yangKerajaan tidak malu hendak memo-tong gaji orang itu , kalau betul demanditu betul.. Ini menunjokkan , Kerajaanchuba hendak menarek keperchayaanpegawai2 Kerajaan ini mengatakanbahawa domestic demand ini datangdaripada public sector dan kami sudahmemberi dan kalau tidak perlu kamiakan menarek balek . Ini dia memain2-kan pegawai Kerajaan yang orangitu sa-benar-nya itu-lah orang yangrunning the Government . Orange iniyang membuat policy yang satengah-nya kalau pegawai Kerajaan itu datang.dia sendiri ta' tahu hendak menjawab-nya. Jadi, dia main2kan dalam perkaraini, Tuan Yang di-Pertua.

Jadi, ini satu perkara yang sayahairan pengakuan di-dalam uchapanMenteri mengatakan domestic demandini di-buat oleh public sector , tetapidi-dalam uchapan-nya itu juga men-gatakan kita boleh , kalau terok2sadikit kita potong duit orang itu.Jadi, dari segi mana-kah yang sa-benar-nya, sebab2 maka anggaran ini bolehjadi banyak? Kita tidak dapat hendakmenerima satu kenyataan dalam satuuchapan yang berlawanan dalam satumasa.

Kemudian daripada itu, Tuan Yangdi-Pertua , salah satu daripada sebab-nya anggaran belanja ini mengatakanis-lah kerana kita membuat projekini terlampau banyak , tetapi olehkerana kita membuat serentak-at thesame time-jadi boleh jadi banyakperkara itu, kerana kita buat seren-tak-why , mengapa? Sampai bagitukita bodoh , kita tahu bendy itu kita

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boleh buat daripada satu masa ka-satu masa , kita buat serentak bagitu?Jadi akibat-nya bila kita buat serentak,pada zahir-nya pembangunan itutinggi, tetapi kita hendak bayar tahunyang di-hadapan itu-the immediateyear--itu terpaksa kita kena chukai,tekan lagi ra`ayat lagi sa-kali dengankebodohan kita membuat serentak itumenekan ra`ayat lagi sa-kali.

Ini, Tuan Yang di -Pertua, kalau punsaya tidak kata perkara ini tidak bijak,tetapi saya rasa patut di-tukarkanchara2 yang sa-macham mi.

Tuan Yang di-Pertua, perkara yangketiga sebab yang naik-nya is-lahmengatakan kita berhadapan denganbeanja defence-pertahanan-yangbagitu banyak dalam tahun 1967.Dahulu , Tuan Yang di-Pertua , apabilaanggaran ini banyak , kita kata olehsebab konfrantasi . Konfrantasi sudahhabis . Tentera Commonwealth pulaIan, hendak ganti orang lain, naikjuga, ada juga sebab defence itu.Nanti tahun hadapan pula defence initentera wataniah ini minta kerj a pula,hendak beri lagi di-situ.

Ini, Tuan Yang di-Pertua, padatahun 1965 dahulu saya kata berkali2,saya bukan hendak mengurangkanperbelanjaan untok defence , tetapi kitamesti sedar bahawa defence ini bukanekonomik , erti-nya Benda yang tidakmendatangkan basil sa-suatu, diapergi bagitu sahaja. Kita terlampausangat menggunakan duit kita dalamperkara2 yang tidak bersif at ekonomik,sebab itu-lah terpaksa kita menekanra`ayat kita mengenakan bermacham2chukai . Saya sebut menekan danmengenakan chukai itu , kerana sayaakan pergi kapada perkara chukai, dansaya akan membuktikan bahawa Kera-jaan kita terlalu keras dalam men-genakan chukai2.

Yang keempat, Tuan Yang di-Pertua , saya tidak faham mengatakanK.erajaan kita sekarang ini ada under-taking, berjanji hendak buat satukemajuan di -Malaysia Timor. Yangkita berjanji dahulu $500 million di-dalam masa lima tahun , tetapi nampak-nya dalam masa dua tahun ini sudahjadi $2 .7 million erti-nya dekat tujoh

ratus ribu kita membuat lebeh dan ini-lah sebab-nya saya katakan dahuludengan bahasa yang tidak elok sadikit,tetapi saya mengulangi apa yang sayakata dahulu , dahulu saya telah mintama`af menggunakan perkataan itu.

Jadi, saya mengulangi yang sayaminta ma`af itu-is-itu saya katadalam kita membentok Malaysia ini,memasokkan Sabah , Singapura danSarawak dengan tidak mengkaji halus2dari segi perjanjian , kita hendak me-majukan negeri itu betul2 , kita mem-bawa orang ini, menanggong sa-bagaimana kita menanggong biawakhidup sahaja . Tuan2 tengok-lah sampaisekarang pun ada pehak2 di -Sarawakitu yang tidak mahu lagi kapada kits.Kita beri lebeh daripada yang kitaberjanji hendak beri $500 million ituperuntokan dari satu masa ka-satumasa ; dia tidak mahu lagi. Sayamengeshorkan kapada Kerajaan supayamembuat satu kajian yang tertentudi-halusi betul2 berkenaan denganSabah dan Sarawak dan kalau kitadapati orang itu tidak mahu dengankita, perkara itu mullah sahaja, diaorang boleh move a motion , dan diaorang boleh pergi sa-bagaimana Singa-pura pergi daripada kita mengenakanchukai kapada ra`ayat untok faedahorang itu , sedangkan yang kita dapatdaripada Sebah dan Sarawak tidakbagitu memuaskan. Menteri sendiripun mengaku.

Ini, Tuan Yang di-Pertua, bukanbererti saya hendak mengenepikansaudara2 saya daripada Sabah danSarawak . Kita telah menjadi sa-buahnegara, tetapi ini-lah position di-negeriSarawak yang kita telah beri lebehbagitu. Masa akan tiba sama adatuan2 tidak keluar , atau pun Malayaini tidak berpisah , kita akan berpisahdengan sendiri-nya oleh keadaanekonomi yang ada sekarang mi. Itusatu perkara yang saya harap Menterikita tileki dalam masaalah pembaha-gian kewangan.

Tuan Yang di-Pertua, sekarang kitsmarl kapada chukai-taxes-yang di-kenakan oleh Kerajaan sekarang yangsaya kata menekan ra`ayat. Sayabelum lagi dapat hendak mengatakanBudget ini sound , atau pun realistic

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sa-bagaimana sahabat saya ini diaterlalu chepat , bole's jadi suara itu,suara orang lain, maka dia tolongmenyebutkan . Jadi, saya terpaksa kenamengatakan dahulu sebab2-nya danmenunjokkan chontoh2-nya dan di-masa itu-lah saya baharu beranimembuat conclusion sama ada diarealistic atau pun sound dan saya tidaksebutkan realistic sa-bagaimana sahabatsaya dan barangkali dia pakar dalamkewangan , maka dia dapat membericonclusion lebeh dahulu daripada diamemberi kenyataan..

Tuan Yang di-Pertua, chukai2 yangbaharu kita kenakan is-lah Develop-ment Tax-Chukai Pembangunan 5%.Ini, Tuan Yang di-Pertua , saya pujidi-sini . Ini-lah satu daripada chukaiyang saya boleh menyertai Kerajaanis-itu chukai ini bersifat progressive,kerana kita kenakan kapada orangeyang mampu . Ini direct tax dan sayapuas hati dengan perkara itu.

Yang kedua, Tuan Yang di-Pertua,kita mengadakan chukai2 baharu. Inipun, Tuan Yang di-Pertua, perkarabiasa juga di-buat di-dalam negeri2yang lain daripada kita, tetapi, TuanYang di-Pertua , saya bimbang chukaiyang di-kenakan , chukai import is-itusurtax on import, barang2 yang di-kenakan di-atas barang2 yang di-bawamasok . Ini, Tuan Yang di-Pertua, padazahir-nya kita nampak chukai ini di-kenakan kapada taukeh2 yang mem-bawa masok barang2 itu, kapadaimporters. Surtax yang 2% ini, kita rasaringan , 2% kena kapada importers.Taukeh2 itu pun orange kaya, bus i-nessmen yang membawa masokbarang, tetapi apabila kita kenakansurtax 2% maka dia pula akan menjualbarang2 itu, dia kenakan surtax puladi-atas ra`ayat ini sa-kurang2 -nya 2%'sudah jadi 4%. Ini-lah yang di-namakan indirect tax yang akan kenadi-atas kepala ra`ayat, walau punturnover tax sudah di -buang , tetapisubstitute-nya itu juga. Jadi , barangyang burok kapada sate barang yangmacham itu juga, tidak berubah,hanya benda lain sahaja , nama sahajalain.

Jadi, surtax ini sama-lah juga denganTurnover Tax. Jikalau tidak, Tuan

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Yang di-Pertua, kalau -lah ada per-bedzaan dari segi kewangan yang sa-benar di -antara Surtax dengan Turn-over Tax ini mengapa Turnover Taxitu di-masokkan mengapa di-letakkandengan perkara ini. Ini menunjok katabahawa Turnover Tax dengan Surtaxini synonymous-satu sahaja-bendadi-tukar yang ini di-letakkan yang mi.Jadi, Tuan Yang di-Pertua, kalaura`avat rasa sedar di-atas chara Kera-jaan Perikatan menchari nama baharu,menukar nama baharu ini, sudah tentumereka itu tidak mengundi lagi padatahun 1969 kapada Perikatan, walaupun dia orang tidak mengundi PAS,itu masaalah lain, tetapi dia tidakmengundi Kerajaan Perikatan dalammenipu ra`ayat di-atas n ama2 yangtidak betul.

Tuan Yang di-Pertua, apabila kitamengenakan tax yang sa-machamini kita ada pula menaikkan sadikit ia-itu chukai pendaf taran-registrationfees-di-kenakan, $20 kemudian stamp-kah, saya lupa kena $5 jadi kena $25,kita naikkan bagitu . Ini, Tuan Yangdi-Pertua , pada satu segi, kita hendakmenchari wang daripada orange yangmembuka sharikat kerana kita sangkaorang yang membuat sharikat itukaya, patut-lah bila dia hendak mem-buat sharikat dia meregister , dia mem-bayar duit sa-tahun sa-kali; dahulutiga tahun sekarang tiap2 tahun pulakena-nya.

Tetapi, Tuan Yang di-Pertua, apayang akan berlaku, kita akan kenakanchukai ini kapada tiap2 sharikat, yangterok-nya is-lah sharikat yang merupa-kan partnership, sebab orange yanghendak belajar business-orange yanghendak masok business, tentu-lah diatidak boleh buat sendiri, dia hendakkena berpakat. Itu menunjokkan diatidak ada wang tetapi kompani yangbesar bagaimana sa-kali pun dia kenasa-banyak itu juga , $20 dengan $5 jadi$25 sama dengan orang yang hendakbuat kompani jual belachan denganorang yang hendak bawa masokbarang refrigerator dan berbagai2 lagidaripada England dan Eropah. Ini,Tuan Yang di-Pertua , hendak di-samakan sa -macham ini terlalu com-munistic-bersifat kominis dalam per-kara ini yang kaya kena sa-macham

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itu dan si -miskin pun kena sa -machamitu. Saya suka registration fees ini di-kenakan juga tetapi biar-lah kita laku-kan chukai registration ini sa-bagai-mana kita kenakan chukai2 bawabarang masok yang di-namakan aero-drome is-itu mengikut size , mengikutcapital sharikat itu sendiri. Kalausharikat itu besar kita pertinggikanlagi fees -nya, kalau sharikat itu kechil,rendahkan , jadi dengan demikian yangkaya kena padan dengan dia, yangmiskin kena padan dengan dia. mihanya mengurangkan capitalist2 yangada dalam bandar ini sahaja tetapiorang di-luar bandar yang hendakbelajar business sudah tentu tidakberani hendak register sebab dia kena$25, dia kena jual dua ekor kambing,mithal -nya. Jadi , saya menchadangkanbahawa kalau hendak di-kenakanboleh -lah di-fikirkan bahawa charskita mengenakan chukai ini biar-lahkita kenakan di-atas jumlah capital itudaripada chara kita mengedakansekarang.

Apabila kita kenakan new taxes-chukai' baharu saya tidak dapathendak menunjokkan kesemua, TuanYang di-Pertua, tetapi saya ada chatit-kan dua tiga chukai baharu-}rya is-ituexcise pula chukai , kena pula barang2macham arak , tembakau yang di-buatdalam negeri ini di-kenakan chukaiexcise , dahulu 40 sen sa-gelen, se-karang 80 sen. Arak macham manasaya tidak tahu , tidak pernah oranghantar chontoh kapada saya.

Tuan Yang di-Pertua, saya tidakmembangkang mengenakan duty atautax tetapi , Tuan Yang di-Pertua,barang2 yang kita kenakan tax inisekarang is-lah barang2 yang tidak di-kehendaki oleh masharakat kita-bukan keperluan , macham arak, ma-cham tembakau, macham bagitu bagini,betul-lah relative kapada sa -orang itu,kalau dia tidak minuet arak dia tidakboleh hidup, Jadi necessity kapada dia,tetapi kita tidak mahu masharakatkita ini berubah daripada manusia2yang dunia tahu barang ini luxuriouspada dia necessity, jadi kita ini sudahmenjadi satu masharakat lain daripadadunia . lain, kita hendak masok bieharadengan orang tidak boleh sebab istilahkita berlainan dengan orang lain.

Jadi, saya menchadangkan bahawabenda2 yang kita boleh buat di-sinikita export keluar , biar-lah kita kena-kan excise itu kurang daripada yangada sekarang atau pun kita kenakantinggi lagi daripada ini, sebab berapaorang yang boleh minuet arak itu ia-lah orange yang ada duit, orang yangada duit yang tidak sempat mendapatpelajaran tinggi, dia untok hendak ber-chakap bahasa dia chari arak dia bolehberchakap empat bahasa dalam satuminit. Jadi orange yang sa -macham mi.Tuan Yang di-Pertua, patut-lah kitakenakan chukai excise itu lebeh banyakkapada barang2 yang macham itudengan yang demikian kita dapat duakeuntongan, yang pertama duit kitaboleti masok dalam negara kita walaukita tidak boleh buat development sa-kali pun kita tolong bavar-lah hutangkita yang lama tali.

Yang kedua , dengan sendiri-nyakita mengajar-educate-masharakatkita meninggalkan perangai gemarkanarak itu-tidak usah menjadi tahi araklagi. Jadi-hanya dengan menganakanrate barang2 yang sa-macham ini;tetapi Kerajaan kita tidak membuatperkara yang sa -macham mi. Ada Pulakata-nya, ada sa -tengah barang2 yangdatang ini kita abolish-kita repealduty dia, kerana tidak banyak sangatyang masok ka-dalam ini, dan kitapun tidak dapat duit daripada situhanya chukai2 duty di-atas barang2luar menyakitkan hati sahaja. Bagai-mana . pula chukai boleti menyakithati, Tuan Yang di-Pertua, baranghendak masok di-sini kita katakanexcise , kita kenakan ka-atas mashara-kat kita sendiri barang dari dalam kitatidak sakit hati , dia sebut dalam inidia kata macham sakit Kati.

Jadi, Tuan Yang di -Petua, sayamengeshorkan walau pun custom dutyyang kita dapat itu sadikit di-atasbarang2 luar masok, saya menchadang-kan di-kenakan juga; saya tidak mahudi-masokkan langsong tetapi tidakmengikut jenis sa-bagaimana sekarangini ada code nombor 218, 17 jenis inikena, jenis ini kena . Saya suka Kera-jaan mengubahkan bukan mengikutjenis tetapi mengikut quantity dia--aerodrome , berapa banyak kamu bawamasok di -kenakan chukai sa-banyak

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itu. Jadi, sa-kurang2 -nya tidak lepassahaja harang2 masok . Ini, Tuan Yangdi-Pertua, di-lepaskan sahaja itu-lahyang saya nampak-nya patut Kerajaanmemberi perhatian di -atas chara2mengambil chukai mi.

Tuan Yang di-Pertua, lagi satesaya mengeshorkan supaya di-kenakanduty atau chukai barang2 luar inisupaya lebeh tinggi lagi daripada yangada sekarang ini, is-itu saperti barang2perfumes, benda2 yang tidak nampakluxurious yang orang kelas tinggi sa-haja memakai tetapi tidak ada per-ubahan yang sa-macham ini, Kerajaankita tidak pernah mengenakan perkaraitu malah dia minta hendak bagikurang pula lagi perkara2 yang ma-cham itu . Saya menchadangkan supayaperkara ini di-tinggikan lagi chukai-nya.

Ada lagi satu perkara , Tuan Yangdi-Pertua , dalam masaalah tax iniyang saya hendak menchadangkan,boleh jadi orang marah kapada saya.Kerajaan barangkali suka , public nantimarah , is-itu saya menchadangkankapada Kerajaan supaya direct tax-income tax-ini di-naikkan lagi 5persen, daripada dahulu 45 kalautidak salah saya di-naikkan rangingbetween 45 dengan 50. Sebab, TuanYang di-Pertua, income tax ini is-lahdirect tax yang kena kapada orangyang ada, tidak kena kapada orangramai tetapi mengapa Kerajaan kitatakut sangat hendak mengenakandirect tax kapada orange yang ada duittetapi dia berani mengadakan surtaxdi-atas barang masok , turnover taxyang dia baleh berkata bukan akuyang mengenakan chukai tetapi taukeh2itu yang mengenakan chukai dia takutkapada ra`ayat dia berselindong kapadataukeh2 itu sebab itu -lah, Tuan Yangdi-Pertua , banyak Ahli2 Yang Ber-hormat daripada pehak di -sana punmengatnkan supaya Kerajaan me-ngambil langkah yang tegas terhadapnekedai2 yang menjual barang2 denganharga yang lebeh tinggi dengan alasanchukai telah naik . Jadi, barang itutidak kena sa-kali pun chukai tam-bahan-nya.

Jadi , ini, Tuan Yang di-Pertua,menun jok kata bahawa turnover tax

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amat merbahaya dan bagitu jugaSurtax yang di -kenakan kapadabarang2 itu akan membolehkan in-direct tax kapada ra`ayat, apa salah-nya kalau betul2 Kerajaan kita beranimenjalankan ke`adilan di-dalam lapa-ngan ekonomi ini kita mengenakan 45persen itu kapada 50 persen direct taxkapada orange yang ada, jadi yangsaya rasa yang hendak mengelakkan-nya is -lah orange yang ada sahaja.

Tuan Yang di-Pertua, lagi satu sayapuji Menteri kita tentang forestry ia-itu pendapatan kita daripada barang2kehutanan . Saya ada beberapa per-kara yang saya hendak sebutkandengan rengkas-nya.

Tuan Yang di-Pertua , satu langkahyang bijak is -itu kita dahulu -nya mem-benarkan kapada saudagar2 balak dankayu apabila dia hendak membayarincome tax kita membenarkan diadaripada jumlah yang patut di-kena-kan 50%, tetapi pada tahun ini kitamengambil 50% itu, jadi kita tidakampun lagi pada dia . Dengan ini, TuanYang di-Pertua , akan hapus-lah orangeyang menjadi "Ali Baba" ini, sebaborange yang mendapat lesen kayubalak mithal -nya bahawa dia tidak ada,duit dia berjanji dengan orang yangada duit menjalankan business itudengan lesen yang di-beri , kemudianorang2 ini yang sa -benar-nya diahendak membayar sagu hati atau punroyalty kapada tuan lesen itu, dia katadia kerja banyak dan meminta 50%Jadi , kita di-sini pun memberi kapadaorang itu tidak membayar 50%. Padatahun ini kita tarek balek, makadengan demikian duit pun kita dapatdan "Ali Baba" pun tidak timbul,walau pun agak-nya banyak Ahli2 di-sana akan tidak berapa suka -lah bilatidak ada "Ali Baba" itu , tetapi sudahsampai masa -nya, dan saya menyo-kong dalam membuat chadangan yangsa-macham mi.

Tuan Yang di-Pertua , satu lagi yangsaya nampak dari segi itu apa-kahPula arti -nya kita maseh lagi exportkayu2, sama ada yang sudah di-kilangkan atau pun tidak, ka-Singa-pura? Saya dapati di-dalam per-jalanan Kerajaan ada perkiraan khasis-itu chatitan khas yang ini di-hantar

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pergi ka-Singapura , yang ini di-hantarpergi keluar negeri. Kalau Singapuraitu bukan sa-bahagian daripadaMalaysia , mengapa Singapura itu di-single -outkan ? di-namakan export ka-Singapura, katakan yang di -export ka-Singapura , katakan yang di-exportkeluar negeri , negeri2 yang kitaexportkan barang2 kita ini, ini ter-masok-lah Singapura , tetapi mengapadi-Singapura itu kita sebutkan exportka-Singapura?

lni, Tuan Yang di -Pertua , apabilasaya membacha sa-tengah2 kenyataanyang saya dapat ma`alumat yangsampai kapada saya , saya dapati rupa-nya Singapura menjadi orang tengahbagi Malaysia untok export kayu, jadibila kita hantar kayu di-situ dia sudahuntong foreign exchange , dia sudahuntong.

Yang kedua labour dia di-situ bolehbekerja , yang kita hantar kayu di-situ sedangkan kita boleh hantar directdan saya menchadangkan kapadaKerajaan tidak lagi menghantar ka-Singapura sa-bagai satu langkah un-tok export keluar negeri. Kalau kitahantar ka-Singapura betul, hantar ka-pada dia dengan harga luar negeribetul, tidak dengan harga yang meng-untongkan Singapura dari segiforeign exchange dan memberi peluangkapada labour di-sana mendapat un-tong sedangkan labour kita tidak men-dapat apa satu pun . Saya menchadang-kan export Singapura dengan istilahyang ada sekarang ini di-mansokhkansama sa-kali.

Tuan Yang di -Pertua , berkenaandengan Education kita membelanjakanpada tahun ini anggaran kita is-lahtermasok Social Services , Education,Public Health , Labour and WelfareServices semua -nya $29 .4 million.

Tuan Yang di-Pertua , kita telahmengakui , dan Menteri kita telahmengakul , bahawa lepasan daripadacomprehensive school itu telah meno--long kita banyak di-dalam perkhid-matan , sebab orang itu di-salorkankapada aluan yang tertentu , dan baru2ini saya bacha dalam surat khabarfirm objective atau pepereksaan sa-loran tertentu akan di-aaakan. Jadikalau kita nampak bahawa mengapa-

kah terlalu sadikit sangat yang kitabelanjakan untok education dan me-ngapa kita kuatkan sangat berkenaandengan defence? Saya tiap2 kali me-ngatakan bahawa walau keadaan kitasa-bagaimana susah sa-kali pun makaeducation sahaja termasok lagi socialservices semua itu, Education alone(sahaja) dia mesti-lah sa-kurang-nya21 j 3 daripada Budget sa-sabuah negarakalau kita betul2 hendak memberipelajaran, dan kita tidak boleh ter-pengaroh dengan keadaan konfrontasiatau pun keadaan perang atau punbenchana `alam tetapi Educationmesti tetap sa-banyak yang machamitu, sebab kalau ra`ayat kita mendapateducation atau pun pelajaran yangchukup maka negara kita akan lebehsihat lagi, tetapi kalau kita mem-banyakkan tentera2 dengan maksudyang tertentu, apabila maksud ituselesai, tenter. a2 itu balek ka-kampongdia hendak memulakan kehidupanyang baru dia menjadi satu tanggong-jawab pula kapada kita dan biasa-nyaini-lah orange yang kita terpaksamenghanap dengan lebeh berat dari-pada perkara2 yang biasa.

Mr (Deputy) Speaker: Saya tidaksuka menyekat kebebasan berchakap,tetapi saya harap-lah di-rengkas sahajasupaya saya dapat peluang memberiramai lagi Ahli Mesuarat berchakap,chuba-lah rengkaskan sahaja.

Tuan Haji Abu Bakar bin Hamzah:Tuan Yang di-Pertua, saya minta-lahkapada Tuan Yang di-Pertua, hendakberchakap panjang sadikit daripadabiasa, kalau boleh kerana saya tidakdatang sudah dua hari balek tengokayer bah dan boleh jadi besok sayakena balek lagi ka-kawasan saya yangterok sa-kali dan boleh jadi dalamBudget speech ini, hari ini-lah sayaberchakap. Jadi, saya minta-lah ka-pada Tuan kalau boleh dan kalau agakpanjang sangat Tuan tegor saja, sayadudok.

Tuan Yang di-Pertua, Yang Ber-hormat Menteri kita meminta bahawaAhli2 dalam Dewan ini tak usah me-ngecham sahaja mengutok itu tidakbaik, ini tidak baik, tetapi kemukakan-lah perkara2 yang baik. Maka, TuanYang di-Pertua, pada tahun sudah,

3019 24 JANUARY 1967

budak2 yang keluar daripada sekolahdekat 140,000 first timers . Kemudiandaripada itu pada tahun 1967 kitataksirkan tidak kurang pula daripada150,000. Jadi, arti-nya dekat 300,000orange yang menunggu kerja , ini bolehkita katakan menyebabkan pengang-goran-unem ployrent . Tidak ada satupun chary yang di-kemukakan olehKerajaan untok mengatasi masaalahini padahal signi ficant bagi satu2 Bud-get itu is-lah dia dapat mengadakanwang untok membelanjakan keperluanPublic Sector dan dia dapat memberiservices kapada ra`ayat tetapi tidakada, ini ada-lah satu chachat di-dalamKerajaan mengemukakan Budget.

Jadi, Tuan Yang di-Pertua, sayamengulangkan apa yang saya katakanpada tahun lalu is-itu kita hendak-lahmengadakan lebeh banyak lagiPolytechnic is-itu sekolah2 yang me-ngajar perusahaan , sebab dalam tahun1968 kita akan mempunyai orang2muda tidak kurang daripada 300,000orang yang tidak mempunyai pekerjaan.Apa-kah kita kesemua orange ini kitahendak beri kerja jawatan .Kerajaan?

Jadi kalau kita mengharapkan a-watan Kerajaan yang kita hendakberikan kapada mereka itu, makadomestic demand daripada publicsector akan bertambah berlipat gandadaripada apa yang ada pada tahun inilagi. Kalau kita hendak membiarkanbagitu sahaja maka penganggoran akanberlaku, sebab itu-lah kalau kitaboleh -nya kita mengadakan sekolah2perusahaan polytechnic yang sa-macham itu maka dengan demikianprivate sector dengan sendiri-nyaboleh menolong keperluan2 domestickita yang di-lakukan oleh publicsector sa-bagaimana yang di -adukanoleh Menteri kita sekarang.

Tuan Yang di-Pertua , saya telah ber-chakap berkenaan dengan Budget dansaga tidak berchakap berkenaan de-ngan politik, saga tidak berchakap ber-kenaan dengan bahasa kebangsaan.saya tidak berchakap berkenaan de-ngan platform satu2 parti tetapi sayasuka menyentoh sadikit , Tuan Yangdi-Pertua . masaalah bahasa kebangsaan.

Apabila kita telah mendengar ke-nyataan2 daripada Ahli Yang Berhormat

3020

daripada Ipoh tali mengadakan bahawadari pehak Perikatan sendiri pun masehtidak bulat lagi di-dalam perkarabahasa kebangsaan. Saya bimbang,Tuan Yang di-Pertua, apabila sampaimasa kita hendak melaksanakan bahasakebangsaan, maka Alliance ini akanberpechah. Apabila berpechah, bukansahaja Perikatan yang rugi tetapira`ayat yang rugi. Sebab tentu-lahtimbul bermacham2, kami yang tidakkena-mengena ini pun akan mendapatsusah sama. UMNO kuat. M.C.A. kuatdia berlawan dua itu, M.I.C. mana2sate dia memehak, kalau tidak kapadaM.C.A. dia memehak kapada UMNO.Jadi apabila dua ini bertentangan kamiyang dudok di-sini pun terok samaantara dua itu berjuang, kechuali-lahkalau kami masok kapada mana2 satupehak-itu masaalah lain sudah tentu-lah kami boleh prevent masaalah ini,itu kami gunakan kebijaksanaan kami.Tetapi yang ra`ayat akan melihat ia-lah satu perkara yang akan menyedeh-kan dalam masaalah bahasa.

Tuan Yang di-Pertua. masaalahbahasa satu masaalah yang chukupsensitive, chukup menimbulkan rasahati dan apabila persoalan bahasa initidak dapat di-selesaikan, maka khid-mat2 kita untok negara ini dankedudokan ekonomi pun tidak akanstable kerana orange yang mengambilbahagian dalam persoalan bahasa ituis-lah jenis2 yang dudok di-dalamnegeri kita ini dan orange yangmemegang business itu is-lab orangeyang menuntut bahasa mereka itudi-rasmikan di-samping bahasa ke-bangsaan.

Apabila perselisehan ini berlakudengan sendiri-nya perselisehan dalamekonomi akan menyebabkan kesusahandan saya perchaya, saya membuatramalan supaya Kerajaan menimbang-kan is-itu dalam tahun 1967 ini tidakpayah menunggu tahun 1968, kerja-sama daripada entrepreneur atau punpublic sector tidak akan menolongpublic sector di-dalam memajukannegara ini dan saga berani-lah meng-ulangkan lagi sa-kali bahawa privatesector bagi Malaysia pada tahun 1967dan tahun 1968 tidak akan memberipertolongan kapada public sector di-dalam memajukan negara kita ini, dan

3021 24 JANUARY 1967

ini kita akan melihat dalam BudgetMeeting kita pada tahun 1967.

Tuan Yang di-Pertua , masaalahbenchana alam ada-lah satu masaalahbaharu bagi negeri kita dan kita hen-dak menyediakan Budget pun tidakboleh, sebab kalau kita sedia diatidak menj adi, kalau tidak sedia diamenjadi. Pada tahun ini angka yangtidak rasmi yang terkeluar di-dalamsurat khabar, di-Kelantan sahaja $30juta. Saya pada tahun sudah, telahmemberi tahu kapada Kerajaankemungkinan banjir akan berlaku dansaga meminta -lah Kerajaan mengada-kan outlet atau pun membuka mukasungai yang memakan belanja tidaklebeh daripada $ 10 juta. Saya bukanEngineer, Tuan Yang di-Pertua , tetapisaga sudah menengok tempat itu dansaya bertanya di-taksirkan kapadasaya is-lah $10 juta. Kalau bendaini boleti d1-buat maka banjir yangdatang pada tahun ini tidak- lah bagitumengganas sangat , tetapi Kerajaantidak mahu membuat , Kerajaan tidakmemakai , tidak mahu menerimafikiran orange daripada pehak di-sini,kerana di-katakan kolot. Tetapi se-karang ini benda itu sudah berlaku dandi-taksirkan $ 30 juta atau sa-rendah2-nya. Pada hal Yang Teramat MuliaTunku Abdul Rahman sendiri apabilapergi saya menunjokkan map tempatsaga, Bachok , dan saya suka mema`a-lumkan, Tuan Yang di-Pertua, sayatidak memuji diri tetapi saya wellversed dengan kawasan saya. Kalauorang bertanya berapa ribu ekor ayampun saya tahu, jangankan kata tempat2lain. Saya mempunyai peta sa-bagai-mana gerakan perang dalam bilek Sayaberkenaan dengan Bachok. Jadi sayatahu betul2.

Apabila saya kemukakan benda ini,Yang Teramat Mulia Tunku sendiripun, bukan sahaja tertarek , tetapi diamengaku kebenaran apa yang sayakatakan dan dia sudah berjanji bahawasalah sate daripada benda yang sayahendak fikirkan pada tahun2 akan da-tang is-lah memechahkan saloran ayeritu lagi lebeh beruntong daripada kitamemberi sagu hati atau relief-to pre-vent is better than to cure . Ini, TuanYang di-Pertua , saya meminta-lahKerajaan memasokkan perkara ini

3022

di-dalam bahagian Development-adadi-dalam Estimate kita ini yang di-peruntokkan untok Development danitu di-utamakan dahulu lebeh baikdaripada kita membayar kerugian2pada tiap2 satu orang . Sebab kalau kitamengubat yang sa-macham itu, penya-kit itu datang lagi pada tahun hadapan,kalau kita membuang penyakit itumaka kalau dia datang pun tidak-lahbagitu sangat besar dan saga bagikawasan saya , saya sanggup memberikenyataan yang lengkap berkenaandengan ini daripada kerugian-nyasampai -lah kapada keadaan topo-graphic sendiri , saya sanggup mem-beri-nya.

Tuan Yang di-Pertua , ada dua tigaperkara lagi saya hendak sebutkan isitu berkenaan dengan pegawai2 Kera-jaan yang di -ugut sa -chara tidaklangsong bahawa mereka itu akan di-potong gaji-nya atau pun di-berhenti-kan kerja atau pun di-tiadakan ataupun kedua2-nya sa -kali. Tuan Yangdi-Pertua , negara kita sedang menujukapada kemajuan dan kita tentu-lahberhajat lebeh banyak kapada kaki-tangan untok hendak mengimplement-kan, hendak menjalankan kemajuanitu, tiba2 dalam sa`at sa-macham inikita hendak mengurangkan pegawai2tadbir itu , hendak memotong gajiorang itu . Walau pun kita tidakberi sa -macham itu , tetapi kata2 sa-macham ini menyakitkan Kati danboleti jadi , Tuan Yang di -Pertua,dalam enam bulan yang pertama bagitahun ini pegawai2 Kerajaan tidakberasa sutra hendak bekerja sunggoh2lagi, dia ingat aku ini kalau bekerjabetul pun, ini sudah hendak masoksecond half year , boleh jadi aku kenabuang kerja , boleh jadi gaji aku akanturun, bagitu bagini . Ini melemahkansemangat daripada orange yang sa-macham ini.

Sa-patut-nya kita mengemukakanbahawa, kita tambah lagi satu per-untokan yang kechil. Kita mobiliseorang itu , memberi kechergasan danmemindah orange itu kapada jawatan2yang munasabah.

Saya dapat tahu, Tuan Yang di-Pertua, di-antara pegawai2 tinggikerajaan , dia pergi mengaji ekonomi.

3023 24 JANUARY 1967 3024

Balek, dia dudok dalam education punada. Sekarang saya tak tabu-lah. Jadinampak-nya, di-Malaya ini di-kira,bila balek Universiti dia bagi posttinggi. Dia tidak kira orang itu dari-mana datang-nya.

Kemudian, berlaku-lah orange initak pandai, potong gaji, tak chekap,kita mahu buat polisi, orang ini taktahu hendak menjalankan. Machammana hendak menjalan ! Hamba Allahitu pergi mengaji ekonomi, suroh buatdalam education. Jadi, kita hendakpaksa dia, sa-olah2 orang ini, kitaPandang dia bodoh daripada kita :kita mahu buat polisi, suroh orang itumenjalankan. Apabila tak boleh men-jalankan, kita marah kapada dia. Tapikita meletak orang tak betul, wrongman on the place. Yang sa-patut-nyapertukaran yang sa-macham ini di-lakukan di-dalam pegawai2 Kerajaanitu, bukan memotong gaji orang itu.

ADJOURNMENT

(MOTION)

The Minister of Information andBroadcasting (Tuan Senu bin AbdulRahman): Tuan Yang di-Pertua, sayamohon menchadangkan majlis ini di-tanggohkan sekarang.

The Assistant Minister of Culture,Youth and Sports (Engku Muhsein binAbdul Kadir): Tuan Yang di-Pertua,saya menyokong.

ADJOURNMENT SPEECH

IMPROVEMENT OF THESTANDARDS OF THE CUL-TURAL PROGRAMMES ON

TELEVISION MALAYSIA

Tuan C. V. Devan Nair (Bungsar):Mr Speaker, Sir, it will be recalledthat in March last year I asked aquestion relating, in particular, toTamil cultural programmes on televi-sion. In reply, the Honourable Minis-ter of Information and Broadcastinghad assured this House that he wouldseriously consider the proposal ofappointing advisory committees com-prising of cultural experts in all thevarious cultural streams in the country

to advise on standards and quality ofcultural programmes in all languagesput over television. To date, noindication has appeared as to whetherthe Government has, in fact, givenconsideration to the proposal. I amobliged, therefore, to ask whether theHonourable Minister of Informationand Broadcasting has taken any stepsat all to improve the standards of thecultural programmes in all languageson television and, in particular, to askhim to inform this House whether any-thing at all has been done to appointadvisory committees of cultural expertsto advise on television programmes.

Lastly, Sir, I am to draw the atten-tion to the dissatisfaction with Tamilcultural programmes in particular,which has been conveyed to me bysome of my constituents in Bungsar.I may summarise in brief the griev-ances which have been communicatedwith regard to Tamil programmes onTelevision Malaysia :

(1) There is a complaint that thetime allocated to Tamil pro-grammes is relatively insufficientcompared to other programmes.

(2) A number of letters apparentlyon this subject had been for-warded by viewers of TelevisionMalaysia but they have notreceived the courtesy of ack-nowledgement or reply; and thecomplainants were of the viewthat the representations have notreached the Minister, perhaps,but have instead been divertedto the wastepaper basket by theofficials who received the letters.

(3) There is then a complaint thatthe Tamil films shown on T.V.have neither a beginning nor anend.

(4) The Tamil Daily Newspapers,namely, the Tamil Nesan andthe Tamil Murasu have promptlypublished grievances of Tamilviewers, but the authorities haveturned a deaf ear.

(5) When the necessity arises towithhold any programme infavour of more important publicitems, the Tamil programme isautomatically withdrawn, and

3025 24 JANUARY 1967 3026

this does not happen so much inrespect of other programmes.

These are the complaints that havebeen received, and it is my duty to myconstituents to communicate them tothe Minister.

It will be appreciated, Sir, thatviewers of Tamil programmes pay thesame licence fee of $24 and they areentitled not to be discriminated against.I hope, Sir, that the representationsand submissions, which I make on thissubject, will be attended to by theHonourable Minister, so that adequatesatisfaction is given to Television fansbelonging to all language streams inthe country. Thank you.

Tuan Senu bin Abdul Rahman: MrSpeaker, Sir, I would like, first of allto congratulate the Honourable Mem-ber for Bungsar for his keen interest inthe improvement of the cultural pro-grammes on Television Malaysia. Thefact that he has made a pains-takingstudy of the problems is indeed a creditto the Department concerned.

From the outset. I would like toassure the Honourable Member thatwe in the Ministry are only too wellaware of the need to improve furtherthe standards of all programmes onT.V. particularly the cultural pro-grammes

Our Television service is compara-tively young in age and, as the Hon-ourable Member knows well, we hadto start almost from scratch. Yet,within a short space of time, we havebeen able to effect considerableimprovement both in the type as wellas in the quality of the programmesto meet the needs of the viewers.

It must be admitted that for thepresent we do not have as many livecultural programmes as desired. Wemust agree that local talents are not inabundance just now, and, although itis our intention to encourage localartists in music, dance or drama, wedo not have adequate facilities tocater for them. In spite of this, Tele-vision Malaysia, in collaboration withthe Ministry of Culture, Youth andSports, is doing everything possible to

foster and encourage local talents in aneffort to raise the standard of thesecultural programmes and provide aricher variety of programmes. This isour long term project, and I canassure the House that, with the com-pletion of the first phase of the Malay-sian Broadcasting Centre-at PantaiValley, we will have adequate facilitiesto cope with the situation. Even now,I am sure the Honourable Membermust have noticed a very appreciableimprovement in certain programmes ascompared to, say, a few months ago.

Dealing with his second point on theneed to appoint advisory committeesto advise on the standards and qualityof the T.V. cultural programmes, Iwould like to say that the Departmenthas, on its staff, members and peopleof experience. In any case, I am surethe Honourable Member would agreewith me that one cannot run any ser-vice, be it Television or Radio, bycommittees all the time. For the Hon-ourable Member's information there isalready a parliamentary group dealingwith Television and Radio, whoseadvice will be sought as and whennecessary. However, as I said before,I am always prepared to receive anyadvice from anyone, including experts.

On the subject of Tamil. culturalprogrammes, it is true that the Minis-try has been receiving complaintsabout the quality and standard ofsuch-and-such programmes, but to saythat there is widespread dissatisfactionis somewhat of an exaggeration-I amsorry to say that. Our Television hasreceived a good lot of bouquets too,and we have had letters offeringconstructive suggestions from wellmeaning people. In fact, I readily wel-come such things, as they enable us toassess our popularity and to effectnecessary improvements.

I would like to emphasise, however,that Television is a national service,serving the whole nation. As such, itsprogrammes should necessarily bethose which have an appeal to all sec-tions of the community. This has beenthe policy since Television came intobeing. Unfortunately, the HonourableMember has raised the question of air

3027 24 JANUARY 1967 3028

time allocated for Tamil programmesonly, which according to him, is caus-ing dissatisfaction. I would like tomake it clear that television pro-grammes are planned on our nationalneeds and, as such there is no questionof allocating air time on languagebasis at all. It is our desire that all theprogrammes whether in the NationalLanguage, English, Chinese, or Tamil,should be commonly shared andappreciated by all sections of ourpeople. Even the Honourable Memberhimself not so long ago emphasised theneed to share each other's cultureamong our people. In any case, thedemand of air time on language basisis anomalous, for it would lead toendless demands from other languagegroups-the Hindi speaking, Telegu,Malayalee, etc., not to mention thenumerous Chinese dialects. Are wethen to meet these demands? This is

a dangerous trend which runs counterto our aim in building a united Malay-sian nation.

Finally, I would like to reiterate thatsince Television is a national service,the cultural programmes must, there-fore, have a nation-wide appeal ratherthan based on narrow racial or sec-tional interest. It is my hope that inthe not too distant future, TelevisionMalaysia will be able to provide morecultural programmes reflecting ournational interest and identity whichevery one, irrespective of our racialorigin, will be able to enjoy-most, ifnot all of them-in the quiet comfortof our homes, thus enriching our liveswith our variegated culture.

Question put and agreed to.

Adjourned at 5.43 p.m.