Abu Jaiyana THE WIVES ARE MEMBERS OF THE AHLAL BAYT aff. Abu Jaiyana neg. Hussein Abinal

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Abdurrahman Bin Ali, Prince Salman, Alex M. Son-song and 12 others like this.

Hussein Abinal Salaam. Please start.

April 29 at 8:58am via mobile · Like · 2

Abu Jaiyana Salam Attorney. Hussein Abinal .Sorry for the delay - walang kuryente kanina, lowbatt laptop ko

April 29 at 3:10pm · Like · 2

Abu Jaiyana Bismillahir-Rahmanir-Raheem

I begin by mentioning the name of Allah, the sustainer, the cherisher, and the controller of all affairs in the universe.

I testify that there is no deity worthy to be worshipped but Allah, the revealer of the Glorious Qur‟an and all the revelations

before it. Allah is the Beneficent, the Wise.

I further testify that Muhammad, whom muslims always say salallahu alayhi wa salam after his name which means peace

and blessings be upon him, is the last and final Prophet of Allah to mankind. It is through him that the clear wisdom of Allah

in the Qur‟an is conveyed to us. This salutation is extended to his beloved household which includes his wives, and his

progeny, his beloved and blessed companions and those who follow their footsteps until the Last Day.

THE WIVES ARE PART OF THE AHLAL BAYT

In this debate, I will be defending four points as bases of my argument/s that the wives of the Prophet s.a.w. are indeed

members of the Ahlal Bayt.

1. THE DEFINITION OF THE WORD AHLAL BAYT ITSELF

2. LOGIC AND COMMON SENSE

3. THE USAGE OF THE TERM AHLAL BAYT IN THE QUR‟AN AND THEIR RESPECTIVE CONTEXTS

4. THE CONTEXT AND THE IMPLICATION OF THE TERM AHLAL BAYT IN THE SAHIH AHADITH

1. THE DEFINITION OF THE WORD AHLAL BAYT ITSELF

Let us reproduce what Arabic dictionary has to say:

Ahl: noun; relatives including wives, children, brothers, sisters, and other kinsmen, and sometimes used to refer to fellow

tribesmen

Bayt: noun; house; place of residence

Ahl-Al-Bayt: noun; those people in relation to a man who live in his house, especially his wives and children that live under

his roof and are provided for by him. In fact, the primary definition of Ahl Bayt is a man‟s wives; in Arab culture, it is

considered rude to call a man‟s wives by their actual names, and hence people will refer to a man‟s wives simply as his “Ahl

Bayt”.

I would like to challenge my opponent to produce any definition of Ahlal Bayt in which the wife/wives are not included as

members/part of it.

2. LOGIC AND COMMON SENSE

Ahlal Bayt means the family of a man living in his house. If we were to ask any Shia who is a part of his own family, he

would most definitely include his mother (or his spouse) in his response. Mothers and wives are the basic foundation of a

family. If we were to ask an unbiased third party as to who the family of Muhammad (صى هللا عي آ س) was, the first

names they would mention would be the Prophet‟s wives.

ب سب إا لذا شأر عي إلا ا أج ج إلا آي ط إاب اغبثشي

15: 59-60. (All) save the family of Lut. Them we shall deliver every one. Except his wife, who, We have ascertained, will be

among those who will lag behind."

The construction “EXCEPT HIS WIFE” would be nonsensical unless the wife was included in the family of Lut a.s. Otherwise,

why would Allah need to clarify that Loot‟s wife was an exception to the rule that the family of Lut a.s. would be saved?

I would like to know my opponent‟s stand whether he agrees with me that in the context of Surah 15:59 – 60 the wife of

Prophet Lut a.s. was assumed as part of his family which is why when the Angels said that all of Lut‟s family members will

be saved except his wife.

If my opponent doesn‟t agree with me in this context, I would like to know his logical argument.

continue next post

April 29 at 3:11pm · Like · 5

Abu Jaiyana 3. THE USAGE OF THE TERM AHLAL BAYT IN THE QUR‟AN AND THEIR RESPECTIVE CONTEXTS

The Quran specifically refers to the wives of the Prophet as Ahlel Bayt in the following verse:

“O wives of the Prophet! You are not like any other of the women; If you will be on your guard, then be not soft in your

speech, lest he in whose heart is a disease yearn; and speak a good word. And stay quietly in your houses, and make not a

dazzling display, like that of the former Times of Ignorance; and establish regular Prayer, and give regular Charity; and obey

Allah and His Messenger. And Allah only wishes to remove all abomination from you, you Ahlal Bayt (People of the House),

and to make you pure and spotless.” (Quran, 33:32-33)

Even without resorting to the Hadith literature, the principle of tafseer (Tafseer al Qur‟an bi Al Qur‟an), no one could deny

that the addressee in the passage above is non-other than the wives of the Prophet s.a.w.

This becomes a very solid argument when we try to find out the witnesses of the revelation, namely the companions of the

Prophet s.a.w. who know exactly as to whom those verses were revealed; Asbāb al-Nuzūl: Also in Sahih Bukhari

commentary on Surah 33:33, and Tafseer Ibn Kathir.

” Abu‟l-Qasim „Abd al-Rahman ibn Muhammad al-Sarraj informed us> Muhammad ibn Ya„qub> al-Hasan ibn „Ali ibn „Affan>

Abu Yahya al-Hamani> Salih ibn Musa al-Qurashi> Khusayf> Sa„id ibn Jubayr> Ibn „Abbas who said:

“This verse was revealed about the wives of the Prophet, Allah bless him and give him peace (Allah‟s wish is but to remove

uncleanness far from you, O Folk of the Household, and cleanse you with a thorough cleansing)”.

„Aqil ibn Muhammad al-Jurjani informed us (through a verbal authorisation)> al-Mu„afa ibn Zakariyya al-Qadi> Muhammad

ibn Jarir> Ibn Humayd> Yahya ibn Wadih> al-Asbagh> „Alqamah> „Ikrimah who said, regarding the words of Allah, exalted

is He (Allah‟s wish is but to remove uncleanness far from you, O Folk of the Household):

“This verse was not revealed about whom you think it was revealed. Rather, it is about the wives of the Prophet, Allah bless

him and give him peace”. „Ikrimah used to proclaim this in the marketplace.

“She said: „O wonder! shall I bear a son when I am an extremely old woman and this my husband an extremely old man?

Most surely this is a wonderful thing.‟ They said: „Do you wonder at Allah‟s decree? The grace of Allah and His blessings on

you, o you Ahlel Bayt (People of the House)! for He is indeed worthy of all praise, full of all glory!‟” (Quran, 11:72-73)

زا شيء عجيت ا ي شيخب إ زا ثع أب عجص يزى أأذ لبذ يب

11: 72. She said: "Alas for me! shall I bear a child, seeing I am an old woman, and my husband here is an old man? That

would indeed be a wonderful thing!"

اجيذ يذ ح اجيذ إا أ عيى ثشوبر ذ اا سح ش اا أ لبا أرعججي

11: 73. They said: "Dost thou wonder at Allah's decree? The grace of Allah and His blessings on you, O YE PEOPLE OF THE

HOUSE! for He is indeed worthy of all praise, full of all glory

In the verse above, Prophet Ibrahim‟s wife asks the angels how can she have a son, and they respond back calling her and

Prophet Ibrahim as AHLAL BAYT. And again, the collective pronoun is used to refer to the Prophet Ibrahim and his wife.

Nobody else was in the room other than them, and the angels referred to them all as AHLEL BAYT, including Prophet

Ibrahim‟s wife.

Many Shi‟a apologist‟s, in their desperation to support their argument in Surah Al Ahzab (33:33), they usually appeal to

Arabic Grammar, that is a masculine pronoun is used in the ayah, therefore it could not have referred to the wives of the

Prophet s.a.w. otherwise the Qur‟an would be guilty of grammatical mistake.

I will discuss this line of argument later, but I would advance this question to my Shi‟a opponent:

WHY DID THE QUR‟AN USE MASCULINE PRONOUN ( اجيذ أ عيى ثشوبر ) [WA BARAKATUHU `ALAYKUM „AHLUL-BAYT]

FOR THE WIFE OF PROPHET IBRAHIM A.S.?

Also, if the ayah 33 of Surah 33 DOESN‟T REFER TO THE WIVES MERELY BECAUSE A MASCULINE GENDER IS USED, I

would like to ask my opponent to discuss in his presentation and/or rebuttal how the ayah fits to the character of a male

subject/s such as Ali bin Abi Talib:

And stay quietly in your houses, and make not a dazzling display, like that of the former Times of Ignorance; and establish

regular Prayer, and give regular Charity; and obey Allah and His Messenger. And Allah only wishes to remove all

abomination from you, you Ahlal Bayt (People of the House), and to make you pure and spotless.” (Quran, 33:33)

DID ALLAH S.W.T. REALLY MEANT TO SAY TO ALI, OR TO HASSAN, ETC. TO STAY QUIETLY IN HIS HOUSE, NOT TO MAKE

A DAZZLING DISPLAY LIKE THAT OF THE FORMER TIMES OF IGNORANCE – DO THESE REALLY FIT TO A MALE SUBJECT?

Continue next post

April 29 at 3:14pm · Like · 5

Abu Jaiyana 4. THE CONTEXT AND THE IMPLICATION OF THE TERM AHLAL BAYT IN THE SAHIH AHADITH

DID PROPHET MUHAMMAD CALL HIS WIVES AS AHLAL BAYT?

Absolutely YES!

SAHIH BUKHARI VOLUME 6, BOOK 60, NUMBER 316

Narrated Anas: (“…THE PROPHET left and went towards the dwelling place of AISHA and said, "Peace and Allah's Mercy be

on you, O‟ PEOPLE OF THE HOUSE! (YA AHLAL BAYT)" She replied, "Peace and the mercy of Allah be on you too. How did

you find your wife? May Allah bless you. Then HE WENT TO THE DWELLING PLACES OF ALL HIS OTHER WIVES AND SAID

TO THEM THE SAME AS HE SAID TO AISHA and they said to him the same as Aisha had said to him.”

So based on the four points I presented, any neutrally minded person would have no doubt whatsoever, that the wives of

the Prophet s.a.w. were not only part/members of the Ahlal Bayt, but they are the PRIMARY MEMBERS of the Ahlal Bayt of

the Prophet s.a.w

DO ALL THESE ARGUMENTS MEAN THAT ONLY THE WIVES COULD BE MEMBERS OF THE AHLAL BAYT?

Of course Not!

In discussion about 15: 59-60, the family includes the children as well. The Prophet s.a.w did not only limit his Ahlal Bayt

with his wives and children, but also his grandchildren, and even his son-in-law‟s brothers. They were specifically mentioned

because they were the ones who are not entitled to receive Zakat, while the Prophet‟s wives are not forbidden to receive

Zakat.

SAHIH MUSLIM BOOK 031, NUMBER 5920

He (Husain) said to Zaid: Who are the members of his household? Aren't his wives the members of his family? Thereupon

he said: HIS WIVES ARE THE MEMBERS OF HIS FAMILY (but here) the members of his family are those for whom

acceptance of Zakat is forbidden. And he said: Who are they? Thereupon he said: 'Ali and the offspring of 'Ali, 'Aqil and the

offspring of 'Aqil and the offspring of Ja'far and the offspring of 'Abbas. Husain said: These are those for whom the

acceptance of Zakat is forbidden. Zaid said: Yes.”

CORROBORATION FROM OTHER SOURCE:

In MUSNAD AHMAD, HADITH NO. 18464 Zayd said ”HIS WIVES ARE AMONG THE PEOPLE OF HIS HOUSEHOLD” but simply

that they are a portion of the Ahlul Bayt to whom Zakat is not forbidden. In other words, the wives are part of Ahlul Bayt

but they can collect Zakat because what would happen to them in case of divorce and they were left in need?

Therefore, we can understand from the explicit evidences above that the wives as well as the children and grandchildren

are part of the Ahlul Bayt of the prophet s.a.w.

We can also understand that the Prophet s.a.w did specify those members of His Ahlal Bayt on whom Zakat is forbidden,

and those whom the Zakat is not forbidden.

I would like to discuss the Hadith of Al-Kisa (the Cloak) and the hadith wherein the Prophet said that Salman Al Faris r.a. is

also part of the Ahlal Bayt. However, I believe that my opponent will probably cite that as evidence for his case, I would

rather discuss them in a rebuttal form during my rebuttal Inshaallah.

I would like to leave this question to my opponent:

WHAT IS THE STANDARD CRITERION OR CRITERIA FOR JUDGING WHETHER OR NOT A PERSON IS A MEMBER OF THE

AHLAL BAYT (HOUSEHOLD)?

It would be nice if he would give a reference / link for his answer instead of just personal opinion.

Jazakallahu Khair

April 29 at 3:16pm · Like · 5

Hussein Abinal In the Name of Allah, the Beneficent, the Merciful

La ilaaha illallaah. Muhammadun Rasulullaah, Aliyyun Waliyyullaah.

Allaahommaa salli 'alaa Muhammad wa aale Muhammad

The subject of this debate proposed by Bro Abu Jaiyana is whether the wives are members of the ahl al bayt.

But the very issue here should be "whether the wives of the Messenger s.a.w.a. were the people for whom the verse of

purification, 33:33, was revealed" which is, indeed, a great honor and bounty not bestowed to anyone before the

Messenger s.a.w.a. for the guidance of the believers

This is exactly what my opponent has tried to prove in his presentation.

The definition of the Arabic words ahl / people and bayt / house given by my opponent is not disputed.

What is being disputed is his assertion that the parenthetical sentence,

Surah Al-Ahzab, Verse 33:

ت يز ب يشيذ اا ...... إا يشا رط شو يط اجيذ اشجس أ عى

....... Allah only desires to keep away the uncleanness from you, O people of the House! and to purify you a (thorough)

purifying.

(English - Shakir)

has been revealed in honor of the wives of the Messenger s.a.w.a. relying on the context of the verses 33:28-33 as well as

11:72-73 and 15:59-60, among others

We must be reminded that the people of the house / ahlulbayt addressed by the Angels a.s. in 11:72-73 were Ibraahim a.s.

and Sarah a.s. as they were the beneficiary of the good news of Ishaq a.s., a son, and Ya'cob a.s., a grandson. The other

house of Ibraahim a.s. where Isma'el a.s. was born was not automatically included in the favor bestowed to Ibraahim a.s

through his wife Sarah a.s.

In the same manner, the wife of Lut a.s., while, admittedly, among his family member, was not saved from the punishment

that Allah s.w.t. inflicted upon the people of Lut a.s. She was not favored with any distinction or salvation when she

disobeyed her husband, Lut a.s.

Surah Al-Ankaboot, Verse 33:

ج إاب ل رحض لبا ل رخف رسعب ضبق ث ب طب سيء ث ب أ جبءد سس ا اغبثشي شأره وبذ ه إلا ا أ ن

And when Our apostles came to Lut he was grieved on account of them, and he felt powerless (to protect) them; and they

said: Fear not, nor grieve; surely we will deliver you and your ahl / followers, except your wife; she shall be of those who

remain behind.

(English - Shakir)

The Qur'an also speaks of the people of the house of Musa a.s. pointed to by his sister in 28:12.

Surah Al-Qasas, Verse 12:

ى ثيذ يىف عى أ أدى فمبذ لج شاضع ا ب عي بصح حشا

And We ordained that he refused to suck any foster mother before, so she said: Shall I point out to you the people of a

house who will take care of him for you, and they will be benevolent to him?

(English - Shakir)

The mother of Musa a.s. was favored with a son, Musa a.s., a Mukhlas, Nabi and Rasul.

33:33 is talking about the people of the house / ahlulbayt who were cleansed from all rijs / abominations and were purified

with a thorough purifying.

If this verse is removed from the verses talking about the wives of Messenger s.a.w.a. from 33:28-34, the flow of the verses

using the feminine gender and the plural noun houses / buyot is not disturbed in the least.

As already mentioned by Abu Jaiyana, the verse of purification,33:33, uses the masculine gender ankum and the singular

noun house / bayt and not the feminine gender ankunna and plural noun buyot / houses used for the wives of the

Messenger s.a.w.a.

Many verses of the Qur'an could be cited as examples. One of them is 5:3 whereby the verse of the perfection of religion

was inserted in a verse talking about the prohibited animals.

Surah Al-Maeda, Verse 3:

ا خمخ ا ث ا غيش اا ب أ اخضيش ح اذا يزخ ا ذ عيى ا حش لرح ب رثح ب روايز جع إلا اسا ب أو اطيحخ ا يخ زشد فل ديى وفشا يئس اازي ي فسك ا ى ر ا ثبلصل أ رسزمس صت عى ا أو اي اخش رخش ى دي ذ ى

زجبف ل صخ غيش خ اضطشا في ب ف دي سل ال سضيذ ى زي ع ذ عيى أر غفس ساحي ا اا فئ ث

Forbidden to you is that which dies of itself, and blood, and flesh of swine, and that on which any other name than that of

Allah has been invoked, and the strangled (animal) and that beaten to death, and that killed by a fall and that killed by

being smitten with the horn, and that which wild beasts have eaten, except what you slaughter, and what is sacrificed on

stones set up (for idols) and that you divide by the arrows; that is a transgression. This day have those who disbelieve

despaired of your religion, so fear them not, and fear Me. This day have I perfected for you your religion and completed My

favor on you and chosen for you Islam as a religion; but whoever is compelled by hunger, not inclining willfully to sin, then

surely Allah is Forgiving, Merciful.

(English - Shakir)

If the verse talking about the perfection of religion and completion of favor is removed from 5:3, the flow of the verse on

the Islamic Law on prohibited animals / meat is not affected.

Surah Al-Maeda, Verse 3:

....... This day have those who disbelieve despaired of your religion, so fear them not, and fear Me. This day have I

perfected for you your religion and completed My favor on you and chosen for you Islam as a religion;....

This explanation elucidates the truth that the verse of purification, 33:33, was not revealed together with the other verses

giving advices and warnings to the wives of the Messenger s.a.w.a. from 33:28-34.

That Jibrael a.s. delivered this ayah not to the houses / buyot of the Messenger s.a.w.a. inhabited by his wives but to one

specific house, the house / bayt of the Messenger s.a.w.a. inhabited by Fatima a.s , Imam 'Ali a.s., Imam Hasan a.s and

Imam Husayn a.s.

The people of the house / ahlulbayt alluded to in this verse were the Messenger s.a.w.a. and his family a.s. specifically

intended or addressed by Allah s.w.t. and the inclusion of the other Imams a.s. is by the truthful tongue of the Messenger

s.a.w.a.as he was the recepient of the Message from Allah s.w.t. just like when Ibraahim a.s. and his wife Sarah a.s. were

addressed as people of the house in 11:72-73 and given the news of a son and a grandson who shall be Imams guiding

others to the right path by the command of Allah s.w.t. 21:72-73

To be continued....

April 30 at 2:56pm via mobile · Like · 4

Hussein Abinal The Wives of the Messenger s.a.w.a. were given the choice. Believe or disbelieve. Obey or disobey.

The believers and obedient ones among them will be given a mighty reward.

The guilty and disobedient ones among them will be doubly punished.

This is the summary of the lessons from the verses starting from 33:28 up to 34.

The importance of the verse of purification, 33:33, could be realized if one would understand and examine verses 56:75-79.

Surah Al-Waqia, Verse 75:

ج الع ا ث فل ألس

But nay! I swear by the falling of stars;

(English - Shakir)

Surah Al-Waqia, Verse 76:

عظي رع ا مس إا

And most surely it is a very great oath if you only knew;

(English - Shakir)

Surah Al-Waqia, Verse 77:

إا وشي مشآ

Most surely it is an honored Quran,

(English - Shakir)

Surah Al-Waqia, Verse 78:

ى ا في وزبة

In a book that is protected

(English - Shakir)

Surah Al-Waqia, Verse 79:

ش ا ط إلا ا س لا ي

None shall touch it save the purified ones.

(English - Shakir)

The purifed ahlulbayt a.s. could touch the Qur'an in the Kitaabi Maknuun. That is, it is the ahlulbayt a.s. who knew and

understood the Qur'an in its entirety as they have been given the Khilafat, Imamah and Wilayah after the Messenger

s.a.w.a.

The verse of purification is telling us that the ahlulbayt who were cleansed from abomination and purified with a thorough

purification were totally and completely protected from the schemes of Iblis l.a. Therefore, their path is the right path.

Whereas, some of the wives of the Messenger s.a.w.a. were reprimanded by Allah s.w.t. Meaning, they were capable of

committing sins and in fact committed acts that necessitated the revelation of the following verses:

Surah At-Tahrim, Verse 4:

ججشي ل ا اا فئ شا عي إ رظب ب فمذ صغذ لثى يش إ رزثب إى اا ه ظ لئىخ ثعذ ر ا ي ؤ صبح ا

If you both turn to Allah, then indeed your hearts are already inclined (to this); and if you back up each other against him,

then surely Allah it is Who is his Guardian, and Jibreel and -the believers that do good, and the angels after that are the

aiders.

(English - Shakir)

Surah At-Tahrim, Verse 5:

بد لبزبد ربئجبد عبث ع ؤ بد س ا ى اجب خيشا أص ا أ يجذ إ طامى أثىبساسى سث ذاد سبئحبد ثيجبد

Maybe, his Lord, if he divorce you, will give him in your place wives better than you, submissive, faithful, obedient, penitent,

adorers, fasters, widows and virgins.

(English - Shakir)

via iQuran

To be continued....

April 30 at 7:05pm via mobile · Like · 3

Abu Jaiyana Grabe naman ang tagal matapos ng presentation ni atty.hussein abinal, parang hindi debate ito.

Sir Hussein Abinal, pwede bang tapusin mo na ang presentation mo, sobrang tagal ng gaps ng installment posts mo.

Sa rebuttal, post mo din ng sabay sabay lahat. Boring masyado itong ganitong style ng pakikipag debate.

Salam

May 1 at 5:48am via mobile · Like · 1

Hussein Abinal Salaam. Nagawa ko na kagabi ang last part ng aking pressntation ngunit nakatulog ako di ko pala

napindot ang post.

InahaAllaah mamaya ma i post ns.

May 1 at 8:00am via mobile · Unlike · 2

Prince Salman isang pindot lng, got one hour...tagal yan attorney...hehehehe..

May 1 at 9:06am · Like

Hussein Abinal 'A'isha reported that Allah's Apostle (may peace be upon him) went out one norning wearing a striped

cloak of the black camel's hair that there came Hasan b. 'Ali. He wrapped hitn under it, then came Husain and he wrapped

him under it along with the other one (Hasan). Then came Fatima and he took her under it, then came 'Ali and he also took

him under it and then said: Allah only desires to take away any uncleanliness from you, O people of the household, and

purify you (thorough purifying)( Sahih Muslim: The Book Pertaining to the Merits of the Companions (Allah Be Pleased With

Them) of the Holy Prophet (May Peace Be Upon Him) (Kitab Al-Fada'il Al-Sahabah),Book 31 - Hadith # 5955)

This hadith has been narrated. on the authority of Shu'ba with the same chain of transmitters. Amir b. Sa'd b. Abi Waqqas

reported on the authority of his father that Muawiya b. Abi Sufyin appointed Sa'd as the Governor and said: What prevents

you from abusing Abu Turab (Hadrat 'Ali), whereupon be said: It is because of three things which I remember Allah's

Messenger (may peace be upon him) having said about him that I would not abuse him and even if I find one of those

three things for me, it would be more dear to me than the red camelg. I heard Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him)

say about 'Ali as he left behind hrin in one of his campaigns (that was Tabuk). 'All said to him: Allah's Messenger, you leave

me behind along with women and children. Thereupon Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) said to him: Aren't you

satisfied with being unto me what Aaron was unto Moses but with this exception that there is no prophethood after me. And

I (also) heard him say on the Day of Khaibar: I would certainly give this standard to a person who loves Allah and his

Messenger and Allah and his Messenger love him too. He (the narrator) said: We have been anxiously waiting for it, when

he (the Holy Prophet) said: Call 'Ali. He was called and his eyes were inflamed. He applied saliva to his eyes and handed

over the standard to him, and Allah gave him victory. (The third occasion is this) when the (following) verse was revealed:"

Let us summon our children and your children." Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) called 'Ali, Fitima, Hasan and

Husain and said: O Allah, they are my family.( Sahih Muslim: The Book Pertaining to the Merits of the Companions (Allah Be

Pleased With Them) of the Holy Prophet (May Peace Be Upon Him) (Kitab Al-Fada'il Al-Sahabah),Book 31 - Hadith # 5915)

May 1 at 9:11am via mobile · Like · 1

Hussein Abinal Yazid b. Hayyan reported: We went to him (Zaid b. Arqam) and said to him. You have found goodness (for

you had the honour) to live in the company of Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) and offered prayer behind him,

and the rest of the hadith is the same but with this variation of wording that lie said: Behold, for I am leaving amongst you

two weighty things, one of which is the Book of Allah, the Exalted and Glorious, and that is the rope of Allah. He who holds

it fast would be on right guidance and he who abandons it would be in error, and in this (hadith) these words are also

found: We said: Who are amongst the members of the household? Aren't the wives (of the Holy Prophet) included amongst

the members of his house hold? Thereupon he said: No, by Allah, a woman lives with a man (as his wife) for a certain

period; he then divorces her and she goes back to her parents and to her people; the members of his household include his

ownself and his kith and kin (who are related to him by blood) and for him the acceptance of Zakat is prohibited.( Sahih

Muslim: The Book Pertaining to the Merits of the Companions (Allah Be Pleased With Them) of the Holy Prophet (May Peace

Be Upon Him) (Kitab Al-Fada'il Al-Sahabah),Book 31 - Hadith # 5923)

May 1 at 9:11am via mobile · Like · 1

Hussein Abinal Those prophetic traditions proved beyond doubt that the ahlul lbayt in 33:33 a.s. are the family of the

Messenger s.a.w.a. who have been favored with guidance and mercy from Allah s.w.t.

The narration.regarding the revelation of the verse on hijab where the Messenger s.a.w.a greeted each and everyone of his

wives in their different dwellings cannot be used as a proof to show that just because 33:33 mentions the ahlulbayt, the

latter must be the wives of the Messenger s.a.w.a. because the narrations of A'isah, Ummo Salama and other Companions

regarding the composition of the ahlulbayt that represented the Muslims and Islam in Ayah Mubahala, Ayah Tatheer, Ayah

Salaat, Hadith al Kisa, Hadith al Thaqalayn, Hadith and Nujoom, Hadith as Safiina has been explained and identified by the

Messenger s.a.w.a. for the guidance of the Muslims.

I am also adopting the proof provided by other brothers like Cairoden Dimasangca, Love Ahlul bayt and other brothers in

this forum on the issue under discussion because our intention in this debate is to show the truthfulness of our position on

matters that are being disagreed upon by the Muslims of different persuasions.

Shukran and thanks for your patience.

May 1 at 9:36am via mobile · Like · 1

Abu Jaiyana Salam Bro hindi aabot ng 1 week ang debate na to kapag magrereply ng mabilis si Atty. Hussein Abinal.

pabayaan mo na yang mga sawsawiro dyan, role yan ni Datu KO dito ahehehe. Palatandaan lang yan na tagilid na sila kasi

dumarami na ang kalaban ko heheheh. I'll post my rebuttal in a moment inshaallah.

May 1 at 4:30pm · Like

Abu Jaiyana I begin by mentioning the name of Allah, the Most Gracious, the Most Merciful.

I testify the there is no deity worthy of any worship except Allah alone without any partner. I further testify that Muhammad

is Allah‟s slave and Messenger.

Truth has come and falsehood perishes for falsehood is by its nature bound to perish.

Ladies and Gentlemen:

The topic of this debate is “THE WIVES ARE MEMBERS OF THE AHLAL BAYT”. I provided explicit evidences for my

arguments that the wives of Prophet Muhammad s.a.w. were indeed members of the Ahlal Bayt (Prophetic Household).

I provided evidences from the linguistic point of view i.e the definition of Ahlal Bayt. I also cited from the qur‟anic point of

view that the word Ahlal Bayt was used in the Qur‟an to refer to a woman (feminine) who has got no offspring yet such as

the wife of Prophet Ibrahim a.s. Sarah. Moreover, I also provided a clear hadith from Sahih Al Bukhari wherein the Prophet

s.a.w. called his wives as Ahlal Bayt. Based on those points, I argued that the wives of the Prophet Muhammad s.a.w. are

members of the Ahlal Bayt of the Prophet.

What surprised me so much is that my opponent, Atty. Hussein Abinal does agree to all my points thus, declaring me to be

the winner in this debate. He is accepting the fact that the wives of Prophet Muhammad are members of his family (Ahlal

Bayt). Well, logically he should because it is very undeniable. Only dumb and stubborn people would deny that the wives of

the Prophet are members of the Ahlal Bayt because the evidences are so explicit, rational, and overwhelming.

So thank you very much Atty. Hussein Abinal for accepting the truth. Your act of declaring me to be the winner in this

debate doesn‟t really matter all because I am not debating Shi‟a for the sake of fame or honor; my intention is to spread the

truth of Islam, clear the misconceptions about the teaching of Islam as much as I could, and defend Islam from the false

teachings of those pseudo-Muslims for the sake of pleasing Allah s.w.t. Your acceptance of the truth is a big, big deal not

only for the Ahlus-Sunnah, but also for your Shi‟a brethren in this group especially to your avid fans. Many Shi‟a would deny

to death that the wives of the Prophet are members of the Ahlal Bayt, yet here you are as an apologist for the Shi‟a faith,

telling your Shi‟a brethren that they are completely wrong about the Ahlal Bayt. I appreciate that very much.

Welcome home to Ahlus-Sunnah my dear brother, elder brother, Atty. Hussein Abinal.

Since, Atty. Hussein Abinal has already admitted and accepted that the wives of the Prophet are members of the Ahlal Bayt,

then this debate is over because the only issue to be resolved here is WHETHER OR NOT THE WIVES OF THE PROPHET

ARE MEMBERS OF THE AHLAL BAYT. Since my opponent and I are now in agreement that they are truly members of the

Ahlal Bayt, then this debate is over.

Thank you.

Continue next post.

May 1 at 4:30pm · Like · 1

Abu Jaiyana THE RED-HERRING FALLACY

This part here is not part of the issue to be resolved in this debate. It is called as a red-herring fallacy.

What is a red-herring? It simply means a misleading clue or distraction. In debates and other types of argumentation, a

debater diverts the attention of the audience by discussing something that is not part of the original issue of the debate and

tries to convince the audience that what he is discussing is actually the main issue of the debate. The reason why it is a

fallacy is because there is an element of deception. If the audience is not familiar with this trick, they would think that what

the debater is discussing is actually the real issue, thus they are misled.

HOW DID ATTY. HUSSEIN ABINAL TRY TO MISLEAD THE READERS?

Since he can‟t refute the explicit and overwhelming evidences that the wives of the Prophet are indeed members of the

Ahlal Bayt which is the very issue of this debate, he agreed to it thus making himself loser in this debate. He, however, tried

to cover that up by diverting from the original issue and tried to convince the audience that the real issue is really about

“whether or not the wives of the Prophet s.a.w. are purified members”.

I would like to caution the audience about this trick. Don‟t be misled by a clear red-herring fallacy. The issue in this debate

is “whether or not the wives of the Prophet are members of the Ahlal Bayt” NOT “whether or not the wives of the Prophet

are purified”.

Anyway, let me entertain this red-herring fallacy; I don‟t have to but I would for the sake of clarification.

I pointed out in my opening presentation, from the four points I presented as proof for my affirmative argument, the wives

of the Prophet s.a.w. are indeed members of the Ahlal Bayt, to which my opponent, Atty. Hussein Abinal, undeniably

confirmed.

If that is so, since he is arguing that the members of the Ahlal Bayt are purified people, it is a very logical argument to

conclude that the wives of the Prophet are purified people.

Here is the logical argument to that:

Premise 1: The wives of the Prophet s.a.w. are members of the Ahlal Bayt.

Premise 2: The members of the Ahlal Bayt are purified people

.

Premise 3: Therefore, the wives of the Prophet s.a.w. are purified people.

Does the argument make sense? Of COURSE it surely does!!! I challenge atty. Hussein Abinal to refute that argument.

Continue next post

May 1 at 4:31pm · Like · 1

Abu Jaiyana Atty. Hussein Abinal tried to refute the ayah 33 of Surah 33 (Al Ahzab) that the people whom Allah s.a.w.

wishes to purify, the wives of the Prophet, are not included because of the following (incorrect) reasons:

1. Because the gender of the pronoun used is masculine; had it been referring to the wives of the Prophet, it should have

been feminine.

What makes this argument very comical, with all due respect, is that the term “Ahlal Bayt” is a generic term which includes

both male and female members of the family, primarily the husband and the wife/wives, and the children if they have.

In Arabic language, the masculine gender always includes the feminine gender, unless there is an indication that it is

exclusive for masculine gender only.

This is also very true even in English language. For example, if the Congress enacts a statute that the salary of policemen

shall increase 5% per annum of their basic salary, no policewoman or policewomen would go to the Congress and complain

as to why is it that only the policemen‟s salary is given an increase while the policewomen is not. That would be ludicrous.

The noun “policemen” which is in masculine gender includes the policewomen (feminine gender).

That‟s the reason why in Surah 11:73, a masculine genderعيى (Alaykum) is used instead of feminine (Alayki or Alaikunna)

for the wife of Prophet Ibrahim a.s. The masculine (alaykum) used for the Ahlal Bayt includes the husband Prophet Ibrahim,

especially that the good news brought by the Angels is not only for the wife Sarah, but for them (husband and wife) both.

Moreover, in the hadith from Sahih Bukhari I quoted, the Prophet s.a.w also used the masculine gender (alaykum) when he

greeted his wives;

Narrated Anas: (“…THE PROPHET left and went towards the dwelling place of Aisha and said, "Peace and Allah's Mercy be

on you (ALAYKUM), O‟ People Of The House! (YA AHLAL BAYT)" Sahih Bukhari Volume 6, Book 60, Number 316

So, would any Shi‟a dare to accuse the Prophet s.a.w of using an incorrect grammar in his statement? I don‟t think so.

In ayah 33:33 in particular, Yusuf Ali commented:

“Notice the transition in this clause to the masculine gender, while before this the verbs and pronouns were in the feminine

gender as referring to the Consorts. The statement in this clause is now more general including (besides the Consorts) the

whole family, namely Fatimah the daughter, 'AIi the son-in-law, and their sons AI Hasan and Al Husayn, the beloved

grandsons of the Prophet. The masculine gender is used generally, in speaking of a mixed assembly of men and women.”

(Yusuf Ali Commentary of the Qur‟an /Qur‟an Reciter program)

Therefore, the grammar (gender) used is perfectly correct. The masculine gender is used because the Ahlal Bayt includes

not only the women or just the wives but also the male members, hence the term is generic.

In fact only those who have no background in Arabic language would use this “appeal to the use of gender”. I am

wondering why my opponent Atty. Hussein Abinal, whom I presumed to be very literate in Arabic language, used this very

comical argument.

2. Because there are instances in the Qur‟an wherein the subject matter of an ayah (verse) suddenly change, therefore

Surah 33:33 could have changed also; from the wives of the Prophet, which is the subject of the ayah in the beginning of

the verse, to some other people, i.e. Al Hassan, Ali, Fatima, Husain (peace be upon them all).

It is a fallacy called Essentializing Fallacy. It is what it is and it will always be that way. It doesn‟t always follow that since

some ayat of the Qur‟an suddenly change their subject matter, then every ayah in the Qur‟an is so.

As a matter of fact, the ayah he cited (Surah 5:3) did not completely change its subject matter. Allah merely exalts Al Islam

for being a complete religion in a sense that it even clarifies minute issues such as the lawful and unlawful foods. That‟s

why at the end of the ayah Allah goes back to the original issue by giving an exception about the unlawful or prohibited

foods, that is they can be consumed during extreme necessity, i.e. for the sake of survival from death due to hunger. So

there is no change of subject matter there.

Even if we agree that there is a change of subject in that ayah for the sake of argument, it would be incorrect to say that

every ayah has its subjects change simply because other ayat do, or because you want to have different subject matter in

an ayah to suit your argument, especially that authentic evidences have been presented that the ayah was revealed in

connection to specific people, i.e. the wives of the Prophet though it may include some other people by way of

generalization because the term used is generic (Ahlal Bayt).

If Atty. Hussein Abinal really wants to exclude the wives of the Prophet in ayah 33 of Surah 33, then he has to provide

explicit and authentic evidences that ayah 33 was not revealed about the wives of the Prophet s.a.w. He has to show and

explain to us that the context and the flow of ayah 33 of Surah 33 could not have included the wives of the Prophet s.a.w

I have explained that the context of the ayah and the whole passage clearly talk about the wives of the Prophet. I also

provided not only the chain of narrators in Asbab An-Nuzul that ayah 33 of Surah 33 was revealed in connection to the

wives of the Prophet, but also the ahadith corroborating to the asbab an-nuzul. Therefore, I now shift the burden of proof

to my opponent to present his evidences against my evidences. Merely insisting personal belief or opinion is absolutely

weightless argument without supporting it with explicit and authentic proof.

Continue next post

May 1 at 4:32pm · Like · 1

Abu Jaiyana 3. Because the Prophet said that Ali, Hassan, Fatima, and Husain (May Allah be pleased with them) to be his

Ahlal Bayt, therefore the wives are not members of the Ahlal Bayt because they were not mentioned in the list.

This line of argument is a fallacy called ARGUMENTUM AD IGNORANTIUM (Argument from Ignorance). You can‟t ru le out

that since some people are not mentioned in one hadith therefore they are not part of the group. You have to provide clear

evidence that those who are not mentioned could not be part of the group because of an obvious impossibility, then that‟s

the time that you can make a sound or valid conclusion.

For example, in Sahih Bukhari, the Prophet s.a.w. called his wives as Ahlal Bayt, could I now say that since Ali, Hassan,

Fatima, and Husain, and others (May Allah be pleased with them all) are not members of the Prophet‟s Ahlal Bayt? Of

course NOT!

Atty. Hussein Abinal would not agree to me in that sense because there are other hadith wherein other people were also

called as Ahlal Bayt of the Prophet; he would surely say that I have to consider other ahadith also and not just focus on one

hadith – which is absolutely correct. But in his case, he is alluding that since the so-called “Hadith Kisa” the wives of the

Prophet are not mentioned, therefore they could not be part or members of the Ahlal Bayt – That‟s ludicrous!

Moreover, in the hadith Kisa (people of the cloak), the Prophet didn‟t say that “these are the only members of the Ahlal

Bayt”. The Prophet‟s statement is not exclusive, just like his statement in Sahih Bukhari when he called his wives as Ahlal

Bayt; he didn‟t say “You are my Ahlal Bayt ONLY”. Had he said so, that would be an exclusive statement, other people can‟t

qualify.

Furthermore, the hadith Kisa is not directly connected to the revelation of Surah 33:33.

Atty. Hussein Abinal alluded that it is connected to the reason of the revelation of Surah 33:33 which is absolutely wrong!

The Hadith Kisa was connected to Surah Al Imran 3:59-61 also known as Al Mubahala. In a Mubahala, only those closely

related in kinship could be involved by a man who wanted to engage in Mubahala.

The historical context is about the debate between the Christian delegation from Najran and the Prophet s.a.w. They were

debating about the true status of Jesus Christ a.s. Since the Christian wouldn‟t give up in their argument, Allah told Prophet

Muhammad to challenge them for Mubahala:

Verily, the likeness of `Isa before Allah is the likeness of Adam. He created him from dust, then said to him: "Be!'' and he

was.) (60. (This is) the truth from your Lord, so be not of those who doubt.)

Ayah 61. Then WHOEVER DISPUTES WITH YOU CONCERNING him after the knowledge that has come to you, say: "Come,

let us Call Our Sons And Your Sons, Our Women And Your Women, Ourselves And Yourselves, Then We Pray And We

Invoke Allah's Curse Upon The Liars.''

In connection to the above ayat, the Prophet went to the house of his daughter Fatima r.a.:

Amir b. Sa'd b. Abi Waqqas: (This is also corroborated by another hadith narrated by the Mother of the Believers A‟isha r.a.)

(….(The third occasion is this) when the (following) verse was revealed:" Let us summon our children and your children."

Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) called 'Ali, Fatimah, Hasan and Husain and said: O Allah, they are my family.)

Sahih Muslim Book 031, Number 5915

This challenge of Al Mubahala, Surah Al Imran 3:59-61, took place in totally different occasion. Surah 33:33 was revealed in

connection to the Prophet‟s wives.

Amazingly, Atty. Hussein Abinal also quoted this very hadith as evidence for his claim, not knowing that this particular

hadith is the KEY to DEBUNK his entire argument. As I said in my presentation that I am fully aware of this hadith; I

purposely didn‟t discuss it in my presentation because I am using it as a bait for my opponent since many Shi‟a newbies are

using this hadith as evidence for their accusation that the wives of the Prophet are not members of the Ahlal Bayt. They just

simply don‟t know the historical background of the hadith. They thought that it is a ripe star apple fruit for them, not

knowing that it is in fact a deadly grenade for them.

Therefore, the reason behind why the Prophet specifically mentioned the names of Ali, Fatimah, Hassan, and Husain and

gathered them in his cloak is about the Mubahala which took place in totally different occasion and circumstance. This

doesn‟t in any way mean that the wives are excluded from being members of the Ahlal Bayt.

It is something to do with relationship in kinship (consanguinity) and not about relation through affinity. It therefore makes

sense that in another narration, when the Mother of the Believers Umm Salama r.a. asked the Prophet to join the people of

the Cloak, the Prophet told her that she is a virtues woman and she has a good future because she is already one of the

members of the Ahlal Bayt by default which Allah s.a.w wishes to purify in Surah 33:33.

Moreover, though she is a virtuous wife, the Mubahala only involves those who are related in kinship (consanguinity) not in

affinity.

The prophet didn‟t say that she can‟t join the group because she is not a member of the Ahlal Bayt because the Prophet did

call her and her co-wives as Ahlal Bayt.

The Shi‟a wanted to superimpose their interpretation to the text that Umm Salama r.a. was not allowed to join the Group

because She is not a member of the Ahlal Bayt, thus the Prophet was wrong in calling them as Ahlal Bayt in Sahih Bukhari

Sahih Bukhari Volume 6, Book 60, Number 316.

That is extremely bad exegesis by the Shi‟a due to cherry-picking of evidences.

According to the tafseer of Yusuf Ali, he called this passage as the Consorts of Purity (AZWAJ MUTAHHARAT); their position

was not like that of ordinary women or ordinary wives. They had special duties and responsibilities.

This is the core of the whole passage. The Prophet's Consorts were not like ordinary women, nor was their marriage an

ordinary marriage, in which only personal or social considerations enter. They had a special position and special

responsibilities, in the matter of guiding and instructing women who came into the fold of Islam. Islam is a Way of Life, and

the Muslims are a family: women have as much place in Islam as men, and their intimate instruction must obviously be

through women.

While they were to be kind and gentle to all, they were to be guarded on account of their special position lest people might

misunderstand or take advantage of their kindness. They were to make no vulgar worldly displays as in the times of

Paganism.

Therefore, the way that Allah wishes to purify the wives of the Prophet s.a.w. is explained by the passage itself starting

from ayah 28 up to ayah 33, which is through HIGH STANDARD OF MORALITY OR VALUES.

This is why it is very important to read and understand very carefully the context of the ayat in order to avoid erroneous

interpretation (exegesis) of the message of the Qur‟an.

My rebuttal is quite long now, I can refute even the other minute points raised by Atty. Hussein Abinal but that would be so

lengthy to be discussed here; I believe that I have refuted the major ones. It would not be necessary to kill all the pawns of

the opponent if the King is already in checkmate so to speak.

In case he would focus on those minor issues in his rebuttal, I would refute them a bit in my conclusion inshaallah.

Continue next post

May 1 at 4:33pm · Like · 1

Abu Jaiyana Summary of my rebutta:

1. If Atty. Hussein Abinal would insist that the purification doesn‟t include the wives of the Prophet because a masculine

gender is used in 33:33 instead of feminine, they he has to refute/falsify all the evidences I cited that masculine gender is a

generic term which necessarily include both male and female member of the family particularly the husband, the wife, and

the children/child if there is any.

2. He has to falsify also the ahadith which I cited wherein the Prophet addressed his wives as Ahlal Bayt.

3. He has to refute also my argument that though Sarah, the wife of Prophet Ibrahim, didn‟t have any child on that time,

yet the Angels called/addressed her as Ahlal Bayt.

4. He has to falsify also the Hadith and the proof from Asbab An-nuzul that ayah 33:33 was revealed concerning the wives

of the Prophet.

5. He has to justify also his argument that the pronoun used in 33:33 is masculine yet Fatimah r.a. is included in it.

6. He has to explain how the Hadith Kisa excludes the wives of the Prophet s.a.w. being purified despite them being the

subject matter of the ayah, when the Hadith Kisa is connected to Surah Al Imran 3:59-61 which talks about Al Mubahala.

7. Would he agree with the Ahlus-Sunnah that if all the related evidences are harmonized the wives of the Prophet, the

family of Ali, the Family of Aqeel, Jafar, and Al Abbas, were all members of the Ahlal Bayt but their way of purification is

different: The wives of the Prophet is through high standards of moral conduct as compared to other women but they are

allowed to receive Zakat, while the other members of the Ahlal Bayt are not allowed to receive Zakat.

Jazakallahu Khair.

May 1 at 4:34pm · Like · 1

Abu Jaiyana excuse me * rebuttal

May 1 at 4:37pm · Like

Hussein Abinal Rebuttal

In the Name of Allah, the Beneficent, the Merciful

Allaahommaa salli „alaa Muhammad wa Aale Muhammad

28:56

Sahih International

Indeed, [O Muhammad], you do not guide whom you like, but Allah guides whom He wills. And He is most knowing of the

[rightly] guided.

In this rebuttal, I will answer first the summary of the rebuttal of Bro. Abu Jaiyana and then I will deal with his other

objections later as this rebuttal progresses.

1. If Atty. Hussein Abinal would insist that the purification doesn‟t include the wives of the Prophet because a masculine

gender is used in 33:33 instead of feminine, they he has to refute/falsify all the evidences I cited that masculine gender is a

generic term which necessarily include both male and female member of the family particularly the husband, the wife, and

the children/child if there is any.

Answer:

The verse of purification 33:33 contains the continuation of the advices, warnings and commandments of Allah s.w.t. to the

wives of the Messenger s.a.w.a. when, suddenly, the talk turned to the keeping away from all blemishes and thorough

purification of the ahlulbayt a.s. which is similar to the speech of the husband of Zolaica, when he was addressing Yusuf a.s.

and suddenly turned to his wife in ayah 12:29 using the feminine pronoun {ki)without mentioning the name of Zolaica.

12:29

Sahih International

Joseph, ignore this. And, [my wife], ask forgiveness for your sin. Indeed, you were of the sinful."

In the same manner, Allah s.w.t. is talking to the wives of the Messenger s.a.w.a. then suddenly He bestowed His favor to

the chosen and purified family of the Messenger s.a.w.a.

33:33

Sahih International

And abide in your houses and do not display yourselves as [was] the display of the former times of ignorance. And establish

prayer and give zakah and obey Allah and His Messenger. Allah intends only to remove from you the impurity [of sin], O

people of the [Prophet's] household, and to purify you with [extensive] purification.

The reasons why the wives cannot be included in the verse of purification are the following:

1. When the verse was revealed, the wives of the Messenger s.a.w.a., Ummo Salaama and A‟isah testified that this favor

was particularly revealed for the five personalities, The Messenger s.a.w.a, Fatima a.s., „Ali a.s., Hasan a.s., and Husayn a.s.

These wives of the Messenger s.a.w.a. did not have the audacity to include themselves in it but Abu Jaiyana is trying his

best to tamper with their narrations as if he is the one apportioning the mercy and favors of Allah s.w.t.

2. Numerous ahadith have been given to support of the truth that this verse was revealed not for the wives of the

Messenger s.a.w.a. but for the chosen and guided blood relatives of the Messenger s.a.w.a.

3. The verse of purification would only make sense if the plural masculine gender is used for the Messenger s.a.w.a. and his

blood relatives who will succeed him as his khaliifas and imams of the Muslims after him for the guidance of the Muslims

rather than if it is used for the Messenger s.a.w.a and his wives who could never be his successors or leaders of the Muslims

after him.

4. The verse of purification is one of the favors bestowed upon the Ummatan Muslimatan from the progeny of Ibraahim a.s.

and Isma‟el a.s. whose mentor and leader is the Messenger s.a.w.a. which could be understood from the following verses:

2:127

Sahih International

And [mention] when Abraham was raising the foundations of the House and [with him] Ishmael, [saying], "Our Lord, accept

[this] from us. Indeed You are the Hearing, the Knowing.

2:128

Sahih International

Our Lord, and make us Muslims [in submission] to You and from our descendants a Muslim nation [in submission] to You.

And show us our rites and accept our repentance. Indeed, You are the Accepting of repentance, the Merciful.

2:129

Sahih International

Our Lord, and send among them a messenger from themselves who will recite to them Your verses and teach them the

Book and wisdom and purify them. Indeed, You are the Exalted in Might, the Wise."

2:143

Sahih International

And thus we have made you a just community that you will be witnesses over the people and the Messenger will be a

witness over you. And We did not make the qiblah which you used to face except that We might make evident who would

follow the Messenger from who would turn back on his heels. And indeed, it is difficult except for those whom Allah has

guided. And never would Allah have caused you to lose your faith. Indeed Allah is, to the people, Kind and Merciful.

2:151

Sahih International

Just as We have sent among you a messenger from yourselves reciting to you Our verses and purifying you and teaching

you the Book and wisdom and teaching you that which you did not know.

3:164

Sahih International

Certainly did Allah confer [great] favor upon the believers when He sent among them a Messenger from themselves,

reciting to them His verses and purifying them and teaching them the Book and wisdom, although they had been before in

manifest error.

22:77

Sahih International

O you who have believed, bow and prostrate and worship your Lord and do good - that you may succeed.

22:78

Sahih International

And strive for Allah with the striving due to Him. He has chosen you and has not placed upon you in the religion any

difficulty. [It is] the religion of your father, Abraham. Allah named you "Muslims" before [in former scriptures] and in this

[revelation] that the Messenger may be a witness over you and you may be witnesses over the people. So establish prayer

and give zakah and hold fast to Allah . He is your protector; and excellent is the protector, and excellent is the helper.

62:2

Sahih International

It is He who has sent among the unlettered a Messenger from themselves reciting to them His verses and purifying them

and teaching them the Book and wisdom - although they were before in clear error -

62:3

Sahih International

And [to] others of them who have not yet joined them. And He is the Exalted in Might, the Wise.

62:4

Sahih International

That is the bounty of Allah , which He gives to whom He wills, and Allah is the possessor of great bounty.

The Sunnites should know that Islam, a perfect and complete way of life, has to be led by the Ummatan Muslimatan prayed

for by Ibraahim a.s. and Isma‟el a.s. in 2:128 who will, among others, be purified by the Messenger s.a.w.a. as mentioned

in 2:129, 2:151,3:164 and 62:2 as they are the Ummatan Wasatan / Middle / Just / Medium Ummah 2:143, blessed /

favored believers 3:164, believers 22:77, Ummiyyun / Unlettered 62:2 who were chosen by Allah s.w.t. from the family of

Ibraahim a.s. 22:78 who will be the Witnesses for the people and the Messenger s.a.w.a. will be a Witness for them.

The clear guidance of the verses of the Qur‟an as to who should be followed after the Messenger s.a.w.a. will be irrelevant

if it was the wives of the Messenger s.a.w.a. who were purified with a thorough purification.

May 2 at 3:14am · Like · 1

Hussein Abinal 2. He has to falsify also the ahadith which I cited wherein the Prophet addressed his wives as Ahlal Bayt.

Answer:

The Hadith you have given merely shows that the Messenger s.a.w.a. greeted everyone of his wives one after another in

their respective residences or houses which is related on the revelation of the ayah on Hijab and not on the verse of

purification 33:33. You have only proven through this hadith that the wives were people of their respective houses then you

conclude that they were the members or part of the ahlulbayt of the Messenger s.a.w.a who were favored with purity of

body and soul indicated in 33:33.

3. He has to refute also my argument that though Sarah, the wife of Prophet Ibrahim, didn‟t have any child on that time,

yet the Angels called/addressed her as Ahlal Bayt.

Answer:

The Angels addressed both Ibraahim a.s. and Sarah a.s. as people of the house because they were the occupant of the

house of Ibraahim a.s. visited by them to deliver the good news of Ishaq a.s. and Ya‟cob a.s. Sarah a.s. was both a relative

and wife of Ibraahim a.s. who begot Ishaq a.s. from whose progeny the Nubuwwat continued up to „Eesa a.s.

In the same vein, the sister of Musa a.s. pointed to the people of the house / ahlulbayt a.s. who gave birth to Musa a.s., the

mother of Musa a.s. 28:12

As already mentioned in my presentation, Angel Jibrael a.s. delivered the verse of purification 33:33 to the Messenger

s.a.w.a. in the house of Fatima a.s. which has been corroborated by A‟isah when she said that one morning, the Messengers

get out one morning wearing a cloak and made his family eneter it when this verse

4. He has to falsify also the Hadith and the proof from Asbab An-nuzul that ayah 33:33 was revealed concerning the wives

of the Prophet.

The Asbab an Nuzul of 33:33 as far as it pertains to the wives was the time and situation when the Messenger s.a.w.a.

made an oath that he will not visit his wives for one month and the asbab an nuzul of 33:33 inasmuch as it pertains to the

keeping away of blemishes and purification with a thorough purifying was as disclosed by Ummo Salama and A‟isah and

other respected companions of the Messenger s.a.w.a.

5. He has to justify also his argument that the pronoun used in 33:33 is masculine yet Fatimah r.a. is included in it.

The plural masculine pronoun kum has been used for the mixed assembly of men and woman 33:33, the Messenger

s.a.w.a., Fatima a.s., „Ali a.s., Hasan a.s. and Husayn a.s. or to a man and woman 11:73, Ibraahim a.s. and Sarah a.s.

6. He has to explain how the Hadith Kisa excludes the wives of the Prophet s.a.w. being purified despite them being the

subject matter of the ayah, when the Hadith Kisa is connected to Surah Al Imran 3:59-61 which talks about Al Mubahala.

The hadith al Kisa is the hadith explaining the revelation of the verse of purification, 33:33 as explained by numerous

traditions when the Messenger s.a.w.a. said: O‟ Allah, these are my ahlul bayt. The hadith al Mubahala explains the people

who could represent Islam composed of the self of the prophet s.a.w.a. Imam „Ali a.s., his women, Fatima a.s. and his sons,

Hasan a.s. and Husayn a.s. and he declared; O Allah, these are my ahlulbayt. The Hadith al Thaqalayn / Two Weighty is

related to the verse of proclamation 5:67 and perfection and completion of Religion 5:3 when the Messenger announced

that the Qur‟an and his ahlulbayt a.s. are the two weighty things.

This assertion of Bro Abu Jaiyana is a result of his ignorance of the Qur‟anic verses and the ahadith explaining them.

7. Would he agree with the Ahlus-Sunnah that if all the related evidences are harmonized the wives of the Prophet, the

family of Ali, the Family of Aqeel, Jafar, and Al Abbas, were all members of the Ahlal Bayt but their way of purification is

different: The wives of the Prophet is through high standards of moral conduct as compared to other women but they are

allowed to receive Zakat, while the other members of the Ahlal Bayt are not allowed to receive Zakat.

Answer:

Based on my presentation and rebuttal, I have to disagree with the ahlus-Sunnah on the composition of the ahlulbayt a.s.

mentioned in 33:33 because the wives of the Messenger s.a.w.a. and the Family of Aqeel, Ja‟far and al Abbas were not the

people of the house intended by Allah s.w.t. for the verse of purification 33:33 which is a distinct honor and favor befitting

the best Ummah ever evolved for the benefit of mankind whose duty is to enjoin the good and forbid the evil as Imams of

guidance and custodian of the knowledge and wisdom of the Messenger s.a.w.a.

When the ahadith / traditions enumerated and identified the people for whom the verse was revealed, those who were not

included and who did not even insist to be among the ahlulbayt a.s. are deemed excluded. Only the bearer of the Message,

the Messenger s.a.w.a., has the authority to include the people Allah s.w.t. commanded him to declare as among the

ahlulbayt a.s. even if these people were not present when the verse was revealed as in the case of the other Imams a.s.

after Imam Husayn a.s.

To be continued...

May 2 at 3:31am · Like · 1

Hussein Abinal 3. should read as follows:

......which has been corroborated by A‟isah when she said that the Messenger s.a.w.a. went out one morning wearing a

striped cloak of Camel's hair and made his family enter it when this verse was revealed...

May 2 at 3:35am · Like

At this point of the debate, the format of the debate was messed up. Hussein Abinal didn’t post for a long time so AbuJaiyana thought that his rebuttal is over. Hussein Abinal started to refute the comments of the audience/readers instead of finishing his rebuttal.

After AbuJaiyana’s conclusion, Hussein Abinal post a continuation of his rebuttal but did not post his

conclusion until the debate is closed. He continued to refute the audience’s comments for AbuJaiyana and abandoned the debate.

Abu Jaiyana Thank you Atty. Hussein Abinal for your rebuttal. I think that it is done. I will post my conclusion in a moment.

Thanks

May 2 at 12:04pm · Like · 1

Abu Jaiyana CONCLUSION:

Bismillahir-Rahmanir-Raheem

I testify that there is no deity worthy to be worshipped but Allah, the revealer of the Glorious Qur‟an and all the revelations

before it. Allah is the Beneficent, the Wise.

I further testify that Muhammad, whom Muslims always say “salallahu alayhi wa salam” after his name which means peace

and blessings be upon him, is the last and final Prophet of Allah to mankind. It is through him that the clear wisdom of Allah

in the Qur‟an is conveyed to us. This salutation is extended to his beloved household which includes his wives, and his

progeny, his beloved and blessed companions and those who follow their footsteps until the Last Day.

Dear Brothers and Sisters in Islam:

We, the Ahlus-Sunnah, are accused of being Nasibis (enemies of the Ahlal Bayt) by the Shi‟a who are claiming to be

followers of the Ahlal Bayt. They are using this rubbish accusation in order to poison the minds of the innocent laymen,

hinder them from following the Sunnah of the Prophet s.a.w. and adopt the cultish practices of the Shi‟a.

In this debate, every Muslim could decide himself/herself as to who really the real Nasibis are.

Please take not brothers and sisters that in debates, especially in comparative religion, personal opinions, and personal

beliefs are totally weightless if there is no clear and explicit evidence to back up the claim. It is considered as a fallacy called

circular reasoning.

Please watch out also about the evidences used as proof for the claim; there are lots of references cited but they are not

actually related to the argument which they are used as evidence. This is also a fallacy called Snow Job fallacy. (Snow Job:

“Proving” a claim by overwhelming an audience with mountains of irrelevant facts, numbers, documents, graphs and

statistics that they cannot be expected to understand).

The numerous ayat about the so-called “Imamah” doctrine of the Shi‟a are posted here. I already have debunked those ayat

during our debate on Imamah, yet they are still presented here even though the topic is about who the members of Ahlal

Bayt are. We are being BLUFFED of numerous ayat from the Qur‟an which are totally incoherent with the topic of the

debate. Somebody is hoping that those irrelevant ayat may give the impression that the poor argument he presented is

actually backed up by numerous Qur‟anic ayat. So watch out for this kind of trick.

Continue next post.

May 2 at 12:04pm · Like · 2

Abu Jaiyana Let me respond to the rebuttal of my Brother Atty. Hussein Abinal:

In my rebuttal, I numbered the summary of the points I raised in in this debate because I didn‟t see them being refuted

during the presentation of Hussein Abinal.

The first challenge was:

“If Atty. Hussein Abinal would insist that the purification doesn‟t include the wives of the Prophet because a masculine

gender is used in 33:33 instead of feminine, they he has to refute/falsify all the evidences I cited that masculine gender is a

generic term which necessarily include both male and female member of the family particularly the husband, the wife, and

the children/child if there is any.”

Question:

Did Atty. Hussein Abinal refute/falsify my argument that the term Ahlal Bayt is a generic term which included both male and

female members of the family?

No, he did not!

Except for his argument that the plural masculine gender only makes sense if used for the Prophet and his blood relatives

who will succeed him as “Khalifas”; his wives could never be his successors or leaders of the Muslims after him. Then, there

comes the Snow Job of ayat about Khalifa.

Response:

With due all respect, this argument is the one which absolutely doesn‟t make sense. It doesn‟t even answer to the question

given. Atty. Hussein Abinal is superimposing their fanatical concept of Khalifa in this issue which is totally irrational.

He is virtually saying that any wife can‟t be considered as member of the house hold of the husband because his wife could

not succeed him anyway after his death. This is absolutely ludicrous argument brothers and sisters, with all due respect to

my lawyer brother Hussein Abinal. Not even the most idiot person on earth will agree with this argument.

Folks, every wife in the world is considered as member of the family, in fact the prime member of the family, even if their

role is not more than a house wife.

If Atty. Hussein Abinal would be asked to draw their Family Tree he would not include his wife and daughters because they

could not succeed him anyway. I don‟t think he would do that, but how absurd and ironic on his part to apply that to the

family of the Prophet s.a.w.

So that is nonsensical argument from all angles.

Moreover, I cited explicit evidences that the word Ahlal Bayt is a generic term which included both male and female

members of the family primarily the husband and wife. Atty. did not falsify my evidences so they still stand firmly.

We will wait for Atty. Hussein Abinal‟s rebuttal if he could produce any evidence that the word Ahlal Bayt is not a generic

term but an exclusive term for males.

If he can‟t produce any evidence for that, then my argument stands.

He also argued that, the subject matter of Surah 33:33 does change, but he did not offer any convincing evidence for his

claim other than his personal Shi‟a bias to the text. He tried to offer hadith kisa as evidence for his claim, but I already have

refuted with explicit evidence from Sahih Muslim which Atty. Hussein Abinal used in his presentation that hadith kisa was

revealed in connection to Surah 3:59-61 known as Al Mubahala which explains why did the Prophet gather Ali, Fatima,

Hassan and Husayn under his cloak:

(….(The third occasion is this) when the (following) verse was revealed:" Let us summon our children and your children.(

Surah 3:59-61)" Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) called 'Ali, Fatimah, Hasan and Husain and said: O Allah, they

are my family.) Sahih Muslim Book 031, Number 5915

He didn‟t refute/falsify that hadith. That hadith is very explicit proof that that hadith kisa is connected to Surah 3:59-61. He

can‟t refute that hadith to be false because he cited that as evidence for his claim in his presentation, hence a big dilemma

for atty. Hussein Abinal.

Please notice also the hypocritical argument of the Shi‟a:

They are trying to discredit the wives of the Prophet for being bad women, yet they are appealing to the hadith which is

narrated by the same women whom they slander and accuse of being unpurified and liars – Allah is exposing the

inconsistencies and lies of the Shi‟a from their own argument. May Allah guide them to the right path.

Continue next post.

May 2 at 12:05pm · Like · 1

Abu Jaiyana The second challenge was:

“He has to falsify also the ahadith which I cited wherein the Prophet addressed his wives as Ahlal Bayt.”

Question: Did Atty. Hussein Abinal falsify the hadith I cited in Sahih Bukhari?

No, he did not! Atty. Hussein Abinal confirmed that hadith to be true! Thank you!

He said though that the Prophet was merely calling them as Ahlal Bayt because he was just greeting his wives one after the

other in their respective residences but it was not related to Surah 33:33.

Response:

Exactly! So even without appealing to Surah 33:33, the Prophet did call his wives as Ahlal Bayt, so how can they be

excluded from the Ahlal Bayt of the Prophet s.a.w? Did the Prophet fail to understand that his wives are not members of his

Ahlal Bayt?

If his answer is yes, then he is blaspheming the Prophet of being idiot (na‟udhubillah)!

If his answer is no, then the Shi‟a argument against the wives of the Prophet s.a.w. is false and therefore Shia‟ism must also

be false.

The third challenge was:

“He has to refute also my argument that though Sarah, the wife of Prophet Ibrahim, didn‟t have any child on that time, yet

the Angels called/addressed her as Ahlal Bayt.”

Question: Did Atty. Hussein Abinal refute my argument?

Well, he tried but extremely unconvincing and in a deceiving way. He said that the Angels addressed both Prophet Ibrahim

and his wife Sarah as Ahlal Bayt because they are the occupants of the House of Ibrahim. Hussein Abinal is telling us that

Sarah would beget children in the future anyway so she is part of the Ahlal Bayt.

Response:

This line of argument is a fallacy called “Argument To The Future”. This is analogous to what we say as “counting the chicks

before the eggs are hacked” In simple Filipino, “Binibilang na ang mga sisiw bago pa mapisa/mabiyak ang mga itlog”

Can I call Atty. Hussein Abinal as “the dead man” or “the cadaver” because he would die in the future anyway?

Of course NOT! He would be very mad at me, yeah?

Atty. Abinal also said that Sarah was a close relative of Prophet Ibrahim. He is alluding that the closeness in kinship of the

wife to the husband is a criterion to judge whether a wife could be considered as member of the husband‟s household or

not.

Where did Atty. Hussein Abinal get this hilarious principle? Ask him where, I am very excited to know!

The dilemma of Atty. Hussein Abinal is that he already argued that the wife could not be included in the Ahlal Bayt being a

masculine gender because she can‟t succeed the husband. Sarah did not in fact succeed Prophet Ibrahim, so according to

Hussein Abinal‟s own criteria, Sarah could not be a member of the Ahlal Bayt of Prophet Ibrahim.

So which is which Kuya? Why are you shooting your own foot???

But, let‟s ride on with that hilarious principle. Ummul Mu‟minin ZAYNAB bint Jahsh was a cousin and one of the wives of

Prophet Muhammad s.a.w. So, is she a member of the Ahlal Bayt now Sir?

Continue next post.

May 2 at 12:06pm · Like · 2

Abu Jaiyana The fourth challenge was:

“He has to falsify also the Hadith and the proof from Asbab An-nuzul that ayah 33:33 was revealed concerning the wives of

the Prophet.”

Question:

Did Atty. Hussein Abinal falsify the hadith and the asbab an-nuzol of Surah 33:33 was revealed concerning the wives of the

Prophet s.a.w?

No, he didn‟t! Mentioned something which he thinks to be the asbab an-nuzol of Surah 33:33 but he didn‟t provide any

authentic evidence.

Here is the evidence which could not falsify/refute:

” Abu‟l-Qasim „Abd al-Rahman ibn Muhammad al-Sarraj informed us> Muhammad ibn Ya„qub> al-Hasan ibn „Ali ibn „Affan>

Abu Yahya al-Hamani> Salih ibn Musa al-Qurashi> Khusayf> Sa„id ibn Jubayr> Ibn „Abbas who said:

“THIS VERSE WAS REVEALED ABOUT THE WIVES OF THE PROPHET, Allah bless him and give him peace (Allah‟s wish is but

to remove uncleanness far from you, O Folk of the Household, and cleanse you with a thorough cleansing)”.

„Aqil ibn Muhammad al-Jurjani informed us (through a verbal authorisation)> al-Mu„afa ibn Zakariyya al-Qadi> Muhammad

ibn Jarir> Ibn Humayd> Yahya ibn Wadih> al-Asbagh> „Alqamah> „Ikrimah who said, regarding the words of Allah, exalted

is He (Allah‟s wish is but to remove uncleanness far from you, O Folk of the Household):

“This verse was not revealed about whom you think it was revealed. Rather, IT IS ABOUT THE WIVES OF THE PROPHET,

Allah bless him and give him peace”. „Ikrimah used to proclaim this in the marketplace.

The above evidences are attested by Sahih Bukhari, Sahih Muslim, and all famous books of tafseer such as Ubn Kathir,

Commentary of the Qur‟an by Yusuf Ali, and others.

So, should be take Atty. Hussein Abinal‟s opinion rather than the explicit evidences above unanimously agreeing that Surah

33:33 was revealed concerning the wives of the Prophet s.a.w?

The fifth challenge was:

“He has to justify also his argument that the pronoun used in 33:33 is masculine yet Fatimah r.a. is included in it.”

Question:

Did Atty. Hussein Abinal give any logical justification?

This time YES!!! But a JUSTIFICATION FOR MY ARGUMENT that the term “Ahlal Bayt” includes both male and female

members of the family.

Atty. Hussein Abinal debunks his own argument that the masculine pronoun used for “Ahlal Bayt” only makes sense if it

refers to the Prophet and those men who will succeed him in leadership but his wives can‟t be included because they could

not succeed the Prophet in leadership. However, Fatima r.a. was included by the Prophet in his Ahlal Bayt who is a female

and have no intention of succeeding the Prophet in leadership.

Please Sir Abinal, stop shooting your own foot, for your own sake.

The sixth challenge was:

“He has to explain how the Hadith Kisa excludes the wives of the Prophet s.a.w. being purified despite them being the

subject matter of the ayah, when the Hadith Kisa is connected to Surah Al Imran 3:59-61 which talks about Al Mubahala.”

Question:

Did Atty. Hussein Abinal give any explanation and is it logical?

Yes, he did because he has to response to my question. However, he did not support his assertion with explicit evidence. He

is asserting that Hadith Kisa is directly connected to Surah 33:33 when his own evidence in Sahih Muslim says that it is

connected to Surah 3:59-61. Not unless Atty. Hussein Abinal would falsify his own evidence in Sahih Muslim which explicitly

saying that Hadith Kisa is connected to 3:59-61 (Al Mubahala) that it is weak or fabricated hadith, then his refusal to admit

the correctness of my argument is no more than an act of denying the truth for the sake of pride.

The last point was:

“Would he agree with the Ahlus-Sunnah that if all the related evidences are harmonized the wives of the Prophet, the family

of Ali, the Family of Aqeel, Jafar, and Al Abbas, were all members of the Ahlal Bayt but their way of purification is different:

The wives of the Prophet is through high standards of moral conduct as compared to other women but they are allowed to

receive Zakat, while the other members of the Ahlal Bayt are not allowed to receive Zakat.”

I knew that he would not agree with the Ahlus-Sunnah with the above proposition because it would mean accepting the fact

that the Ahlus-Sunnah are right all along while the Shi‟a are in a great delusion.

I purposely asked that question in order to show in this debate that the Ahlus-Sunnah are the real followers of the Ahlal

Bayt (Prophetic Household), we love them all and we don‟t discriminate any of them.

On the other hand, the Shi‟a who constantly accuse the Ahlus-Sunnah of being Nasibis (Enemies) of the Ahlal Bayt are in

fact the real Nasibis.

The Ahlus-Sunnah accept all the Sahih Ahadith about the Ahlal Bayt while the Shi‟a only pick and choose (Cherry-Picking

fallacy) of the Sahih Ahadith, they use some of the Ahadith only when it is convenient for them.

Allah admonishes this type of attitude of people in the Qur‟an.

“Do you accept part of the book and reject the other part?”

In conclusion, the Ahlus-Sunnah, based on all the authentic ahadith presented in this debate, believe that the members of

the Ahlal Bayt of the Prophet s.a.w. are his wives, the family of Ali, 'aqil and the offspring of 'Aqil and the offspring of Ja'far

and the offspring of 'Abbas as explicitly summarized in the following explicit ahadith:

SAHIH MUSLIM BOOK 031, NUMBER 5920:

He (Husain) said to Zaid: Who are the members of his household? Aren't his wives the members of his family? Thereupon

he said: HIS WIVES ARE THE MEMBERS OF HIS FAMILY (but here) the members of his family are those for whom

acceptance of Zakat is forbidden. And he said: Who are they? Thereupon he said: 'ALI AND THE OFFSPRING OF 'ALI, 'AQIL

AND THE OFFSPRING OF 'AQIL AND THE OFFSPRING OF JA'FAR AND THE OFFSPRING OF 'ABBAS. Husain said: These are

those for whom the acceptance of Zakat is forbidden. Zaid said: Yes.

In MUSNAD AHMAD, HADITH NO. 18464 Zayd said ”HIS WIVES ARE AMONG THE PEOPLE OF HIS HOUSEHOLD” but simply

that they are a portion of the Ahlul Bayt to whom Zakat is not forbidden.

The Shi‟a are merely obsessed with their fanatical doctrine of Imamah. This is the reason why they don‟t feel ashamed to

even slander and discriminate some of the members of the Household of our Noble Prophet s.a.w. They are so proud to

shout to the world that the Noblest Prophet of Allah left a very chaotic family, feuds between his wives versus his children et

cetera.

Continue to next post (last post).

May 2 at 12:08pm · Like · 2

Abu Jaiyana Finally, we have to groups of people who are claiming to be the followers of the Ahlal Bayt, the Ahlus-Sunnah

and the Shi‟a.

Think about dear readers if you put yourself on the Prophet‟s shoes; who do you think are the people who really love your

family:

1. Those who defend the whole family of the Prophet which includes his wives, his children, grandchildren, and those near

to him in kinship, thus keeping the image of the whole Ahlal Bayt of the Prophet s.a.w. united (the Ahlus-Sunnah), or

2. Those who divide the family of the Prophet, put enmity among them, discriminate some of them, slander his wives, thus

making the image of the Ahlal Bayt of the Prophet s.a.w. a big, big mess (the Shi‟a).

Allah s.w.t exalts Prophet Muhammad s.a.w. many times in the Qur‟an: one of which is that he is the best example to be

followed. Think about this:

Is a man who left a family disunited and having feud with each other till the Day of Judgment really a good example to

follow?

Think about of the hadith wherein the Prophet s.a.w. said that he would be proud of his Ummah for their great multitude on

the Day of Gathering. His will recognize his Ummah through the radiant of their faces. On that Day, each one of the

Prophets will refuse to help the people for fear of Allah‟s anger, except for Prophet Muhammad s.a.w.

Guess what! His wives, whom he loved very much, supported him until his death, are the Queens of Hell Fire.

Would our Noble Prophet be really proud before all of his Brother Prophets of the outcome of his mission that he left his

family disunited and having great feuds?

Could we really consider our Noble Prophet as the most successful and the exemplified father, or it is a big, big shame for

us?

I leave you those questions to ponder for yourselves dear brothers and sisters in Islam. I apologize for this lengthy

conclusion because it is mixed with my evaluation of our presentations and rebuttals. I tried to respond to all relevant points

as much as I can.

I hope that we learn something from this debate. Judge the merits of our arguments based on sound logic, coherency of

the evidences to the argument presented, and the positive outcome and good image to Islam that each side is trying to

portray.

I thank you very much. May Allah guide us all to the right path, ameen!

Jazakallahu Khair

May 2 at 12:09pm · Like · 2

Hussein Abinal Continuation of my rebuttal.

In the Name of Allah, the Beneficent, the Merciful

Bro. Abu jaiyana has declared prematurely that he is the winner in this debate because he has proven that the wives are

members of the ahlulbayt.

Then he lectured the readers and members of this group and his audience on the different fallacies in argumentation such

as Red-Herring Fallacy, Essentializing Fallacy and Argument from Ignorance.

The truth is, he is the one guilty of these fallacies.

Allah s.w.t. clearly commands the believers to return their disputes to the Qur'an and the Sunnah of the Messenger s.a.w.a.

if they are really believers in Allah s.w.t. and the Last Day. Otherwise, they will be considered hypocrites who merely

pretend as Muslims.

4:59

Sahih International

O you who have believed, obey Allah and obey the Messenger and those in authority among you. And if you disagree over

anything, refer it to Allah and the Messenger, if you should believe in Allah and the Last Day. That is the best [way] and

best in result.

………….And if you disagree over anything, refer it to Allah and the Messenger, if you should believe in Allah and the Last

Day. That is the best [way] and best in result.

42:10

Sahih International

And in anything over which you disagree - its ruling is [to be referred] to Allah . [Say], "That is Allah , my Lord; upon Him I

have relied, and to Him I turn back."

4:65

Sahih International

But no, by your Lord, they will not [truly] believe until they make you, [O Muhammad], judge concerning that over which

they dispute among themselves and then find within themselves no discomfort from what you have judged and submit in

[full, willing] submission.

33:36

Sahih International

It is not for a believing man or a believing woman, when Allah and His Messenger have decided a matter, that they should

[thereafter] have any choice about their affair. And whoever disobeys Allah and His Messenger has certainly strayed into

clear error.

If the subject of the debate “ the wives are members of the ahlulbayt” is returned to the Book of Allah s.w.t. and the

Sunnah , we will be able to realize without too much mental effort that the wives are people of the houses of the Messenger

s.a.w.a. as they did not reside in a single house. Moreover, the verses concerning the wives of the Messenger s.a.w.a. are

related to the time and situation when some of them were causing trouble to the Messenger s.a.w.a. that made the

Messenger s.a.w.a. abstain from them for one month or 29 days.

33:28

Sahih International

O Prophet, say to your wives, "If you should desire the worldly life and its adornment, then come, I will provide for you and

give you a gracious release.

33:29

Sahih International

But if you should desire Allah and His Messenger and the home of the Hereafter - then indeed, Allah has prepared for the

doers of good among you a great reward."

33:30

Sahih International

O wives of the Prophet, whoever of you should commit a clear immorality - for her the punishment would be doubled two

fold, and ever is that, for Allah , easy.

33:31

Sahih International

And whoever of you devoutly obeys Allah and His Messenger and does righteousness - We will give her her reward twice;

and We have prepared for her a noble provision.

33:32

Sahih International

O wives of the Prophet, you are not like anyone among women. If you fear Allah , then do not be soft in speech [to men],

lest he in whose heart is disease should covet, but speak with appropriate speech.

33:33

Sahih International

And abide in your houses and do not display yourselves as [was] the display of the former times of ignorance. And establish

prayer and give zakah and obey Allah and His Messenger. Allah intends only to remove from you the impurity [of sin], O

people of the [Prophet's] household, and to purify you with [extensive] purification.

33:34

Sahih International

And remember what is recited in your houses of the verses of Allah and wisdom. Indeed, Allah is ever Subtle and

Acquainted [with all things].

Sahih Bukhari Volume 007, Book 062, Hadith Number 131.

Sahih Bukhari Book 62. Wedlock, Marriage (Nikah)

Narrated By Ibn 'Abbas : One morning we saw the wives of the Prophet weeping, and everyone of them had her family with

her, I went to the mosque and found that it was crowded with people. Then 'Umar bin Al-Khattab came and went up to the

Prophet who was in his upper room. He greeted him but nobody answered. He greeted again, but nobody answered. Then

the gatekeeper called him and he entered upon the Prophet, and asked, "Have you divorced your wives?" The Prophet, said,

"No, but I have taken an oath not to go to them for one month." So the Prophet stayed away (from his wives) for twenty

nine days and then entered upon them.

Sahih Bukhari Volume 007, Book 062, Hadith Number 130.

Sahih Bukhari Book 62. Wedlock, Marriage (Nikah)

Narrated By Um Salama : The Prophet took an oath that he would not enter upon some of his wives for one month. But

when twenty nine days had elapsed, he went to them in the morning or evening. It was said to him, "O Allah's Prophet! You

had taken an oath that you would not enter upon them for one month." He replied, "The month can be of twenty nine

days."

May 2 at 12:55pm · Like · 3

Hussein Abinal The portion of 33:33 regarding the purification of the ahlulbayt a.s. has been explained by the clear

prophetic traditions given below.

……... Allah intends only to remove from you the impurity [of sin], O people of the [Prophet's] household, and to purify you

with [extensive] purification.

Sahih Muslim Book 031, Hadith Number 5955.

Sahih Muslim Book 31. The Merits Of The Companions (PBUT) Of The Holy Prophet (PBUH)

Chapter : The merits of the family of the Prophet (may peace be upon him).

'Aisha reported that Allah's Apostle (may peace be upon him) went out one morning wearing a striped cloak of the black

camel's hair that there came Hasan b. 'Ali. He wrapped him under it, then came Husain and he wrapped him under it along

with the other one (Hasan). Then came Fatima and he took her under it, then came 'Ali and he also took him under it and

then said: Allah only desires to take away any un-cleanliness from you, O people of the household, and purify you

(thorough purifying)

Sahih Muslim Book 031, Hadith Number 5923.

Sahih Muslim Book 31. The Merits Of The Companions (PBUT) Of The Holy Prophet (PBUH)

Chapter : The merits of 'Ali b. Abi Talib (Allah be pleased with him).

Yazid b. Hayyan reported: We went to him (Zaid b. Arqam) and said to him. You have found goodness (for you had the

honour) to live in the company of Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) and offered prayer behind him, and the rest

of the hadith is the same but with this variation of wording that lie said: Behold, for I am leaving amongst you two weighty

things, one of which is the Book of Allah, the Exalted and Glorious, and that is the rope of Allah. He who holds it fast would

be on right guidance and he who abandons it would be in error, and in this (hadith) these words are also found: We said:

Who are amongst the members of the household? Aren't the wives (of the Holy Prophet) included amongst the members of

his house hold? Thereupon he said: No, by Allah, a woman lives with a man (as his wife) for a certain period; he then

divorces her and she goes back to her parents and to her people; the members of his household include his own-self and

his kith and kin (who are related to him by blood) and for him the acceptance of Zakat is prohibited.

Sahih Muslim Book 031, Hadith Number 5920.

Sahih Muslim Book 31. The Merits Of The Companions (PBUT) Of The Holy Prophet (PBUH)

Chapter : The merits of 'Ali b. Abi Talib (Allah be pleased with him).

Yazid b. Hayyan reported, I went along with Husain b. Sabra and 'Umar b. Muslim to Zaid b. Arqam and, as we sat by his

side, Husain said to him: Zaid, you have been able to acquire a great virtue that you saw Allah's Messenger (may peace be

upon him) listened to his talk, fought by his side in (different) battles, offered prayer behind me. Zaid, you have in fact

earned a great virtue. Zaid, narrate to us what you heard from Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him). He said: I have

grown old and have almost spent my age and I have forgotten some of the things which I remembered in connection with

Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him), so accept whatever I narrate to you, and which I do not narrate do not compel

me to do that. He then said: One day Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) stood up to deliver sermon at a watering

place known as Khumm situated between Mecca and Medina. He praised Allah, extolled Him and delivered the sermon and

exhorted (us) and said: Now to our purpose. O people, I am a human being. I am about to receive a messenger (the angel

of death) from my Lord and I, in response to Allah's call, (would bid good-bye to you), but I am leaving among you two

weighty things: the one being the Book of Allah in which there is right guidance and light, so hold fast to the Book of Allah

and adhere to it. He exhorted (us) (to hold fast) to the Book of Allah and then said: The second are the members of my

household I remind you (of your duties) to the members of my family. He (Husain) said to Zaid: Who are the members of

his household? Aren't his wives the members of his family? Thereupon he said: His wives are the members of his family (but

here) the members of his family are those for whom acceptance of Zakat is forbidden. And he said: Who are they?

Thereupon he said: 'Ali and the offspring of 'Ali, 'Aqil and the offspring of 'Aqil and the offspring of Ja'far and the offspring

of 'Abbas. Husain said: These are those for whom the acceptance of Zakat is forbidden. Zaid said: Yes.

Sahih Muslim Book 031, Hadith Number 5915.

Sahih Muslim Book 31. The Merits Of The Companions (PBUT) Of The Holy Prophet (PBUH)

Chapter : The merits of 'Ali b. Abi Talib (Allah be pleased with him).

This hadith has been narrated on the authority of Shu'ba with the same chain of transmitters. Amir b. Sa'd b. Abi Waqqas

reported on the authority of his father that Muawiya b. Abi Sufyin appointed Sa'd as the Governor and said: What prevents

you from abusing Abu Turab (Hadrat 'Ali), whereupon be said: It is because of three things which I remember Allah's

Messenger (may peace be upon him) having said about him that I would not abuse him and even if I find one of those

three things for me, it would be more dear to me than the red camel. I heard Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him)

say about 'Ali as he left behind him in one of his campaigns (that was Tabuk). 'All said to him: Allah's Messenger, you leave

me behind along with women and children. Thereupon Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) said to him: Aren't you

satisfied with being unto me what Aaron was unto Moses but with this exception that there is no prophethood after me. And

I (also) heard him say on the Day of Khaibar: I would certainly give this standard to a person who loves Allah and his

Messenger and Allah and his Messenger love him too. He (the narrator) said: We have been anxiously waiting for it, when

he (the Holy Prophet) said: Call 'Ali. He was called and his eyes were inflamed. He applied saliva to his eyes and handed

over the standard to him, and Allah gave him victory. (The third occasion is this) when the (following) verse was revealed:

"Let us summon our children and your children." Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) called 'Ali, Fitima, Hasan and

Husain and said: O Allah, they are my family.

Please consider the following conclusive evidences:

………Then came Fatima and he took her under it, then came 'Ali and he also took him under it and then said: Allah only

desires to take away any un-cleanliness from you, O people of the household, and purify you (thorough purifying)

………and then said: The second are the members of my household I remind you (of your duties) to the members of my

family. He (Husain) said to Zaid: Who are the members of his household? Aren't his wives the members of his family?

Thereupon he said: His wives are the members of his family (but here) the members of his family are those for whom

acceptance of Zakat is forbidden……

………. (The third occasion is this) when the (following) verse was revealed: "Let us summon our children and your

children." Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) called 'Ali, Fitima, Hasan and Husain and said: O Allah, they are my

family.

May 2 at 1:00pm · Like · 2

Hussein Abinal Bro Abu Jaiyana is the one employing deception by using the assertion that the wives of the Messenger

s.a.w.a. are members of his ahlulbayt to jump to the conclusion that the wives are the people purified by Allah s.w.t. in

33:33. He is accusing me of employing Red-Herring fallacy but clearly, the reason he is making this debate is to prove that

the wives are the people of the house mentioned in the verse of purity, 33:33.

He is guilty of Essentializing Fallacy because since the wives were residents of their houses according to verses 33:28-34, he

is extending this fact to the ahlulbayt alluded to in the verse of purification in 33:33. He is also using the verse 11:73

mentioning or addressing Ibraahim a.s. and Sarah a.s. as people of the house when he knew that this is the only way that

the Angels could address them in the verse and if the wife of Ibraahim a.s., Hajar a.s., is to be included as among the

addressees, then the Angel a.s. would have to address all of them as people of the houses of Ibraahim a.s. Despite this

knowledge, he made the conclusion that the wives of the Messenger s.a.w.a., just like Ibraahim a.s. and Sarah a.s., must

be the people of the house favored with the verse of purification.

In fact, all the arguments of Bro Abu Jaiyana are the product of argument from ignorance because he has been making

conclusions based on wrong premises or inaccurate information ignoring the dictates of the verses of the Qur‟an, the

Sunnah narrated for them and reason which he has a just share as a human being and as a researcher.

In order for him to achieve his objective of distorting the truth, he employed the narration where the Messenger s.a.w.a.

greeted his wives in their respective dwelling places / houses as his proof for his assertion that the wives are people of the

house lumping all the wives in a single imaginary house he has created in his imagination that does not correspond with

reality as he knew that this hadith has no connection with the revelation of 33:33.

Sahih Bukhari Volume 007, Book 062, Hadith Number 084.

Sahih Bukhari Book 62. Wedlock, Marriage (Nikah)

Narrated By Anas : The Prophet offered a wedding banquet on the occasion of his marriage to Zainab, and provided a good

meal for the Muslims. Then he went out as was his custom on marrying, he came to the dwelling places of the mothers of

the Believers (i.e. his wives) invoking good (on them), and they were invoking good (on him). Then he departed (and came

back) and saw two men (still sitting there). So he left again. I do not remember whether I informed him or he was informed

(by somebody else) of their departure)."

It would be beneficial for Bro. Abu Jaiyana and others to believe the truth as presented below:

Premise 1. The right path is the path of the servants of Allah s.w.t. who were chosen and purified by Him. 15:39-42

Premise 2. The ahlulbayt a.s. composed of the Messenger s.a.w.a., Fatima a.s., „Ali a.s., Hasan a.s. and Husayn a.s. have

been chosen and purified by Allah s.w.t. with a thorough purifying. 33:33

Conclusion: Therefore, the right path must be the path of the Messenger s.a.w.a. and his ahlubayt a.s.

The logical argument of Bro Abu Jaiyana given below is nonsensical, irrelevant to the guidance that Islam conveys and

totally devoid of any basis from the Qur‟an and Sunnah for reasons already given above.

Here is the logical argument to that:

Premise 1: The wives of the Prophet s.a.w. are members of the Ahlal Bayt.

Premise 2: The members of the Ahlal Bayt are purified people

Premise 3: Therefore, the wives of the Prophet s.a.w. are purified people.

Alhamdulillaahi rabbil „aalameen.

Allaahommaa salli „alaa Muhammad wa Aale Muhammad.

End of the rebuttal.

May 2 at 1:01pm · Like · 3