9/21/113 Franklin County Sheriff cars presentDamon E. Wetterauer, Jr

Jenn to Lynn: Do you know if the two witnesses have showed up?

Whenever you’re ready…

(Jennifer’s laptop used, on projector) LE are we ready?For the record my name is Lynn Eisentrout I will be presiding over this hearing tonightWe will call a special council meeting Jason Gross’s appeal this meeting is called to order at 5:32 pm PPC hereSB hereMD hereRS presentKS presentTW presentI will caution the members of the audience that there is no opportunity to give input council members must give full attention to …given MRs. CroganJEnn on May 25th 2011 this year officer gross attended the Franklin county ovi task force he was paid for attending these meetings he attended meeting in uniform and represented the village…part of his duties for that day are also noted in his log bookIn June of this year a letter was received by MADD that was addressed to the mayor …I will read this to you I’m writing on be half of MADD and citizens of Minerva park who’s lives may be jeopardized from the action that has recently been attention a directive has come from you that all officers are prohibited making OVI arrests on Cleveland Ave even if that …no matter what the circumstances might be, in real time during the normal course of patrolling duties, find it difficult to accept that such a hands off look the other way approach. This policy has originated and mandated by the mayorCN was copied on this as well CN contacted the officer of the letter Doug Scoles executive director of MADDConfusing on the issue conception of this order CN learned through Mr. Scoles that the village officer was complaining to him of a recent discipline action the c knew that JG was the officer. CN determined hat further investigation was necessary and assigned finstermaker and beach. Finstermaker took the lead in the investigation. Started with the OVI meeting you will see with the evidence that during the meeting officer gross spoke to several other officers…during …officer gross misrepresented that …on 161 and stopping drunk drivers. The representation …directly contrary to the ..order issued by the mayor in November of 2010. the purpose of the general order is two fold the first purpose was respond to complaints other jurisdictions ..Keep officers that are paid by the village within this jurisdiction officer gross signed and acknowledged this order..

CN confirmed in feb 2011 that this order was still in effect. After cpl finstermaker as you will see finds several other violations of the policies and procedures of the police depart and he reports what findings he has to the chief. Chief reviews the findings and considers not only that but past experiences with officer gross in determining what ..Officer gross had twice been disciplined for insubordination in mayMaking a stop outside of the jurisdiction without utilizing mutual aid ..that cn will explain to you is an agreement with other jurisdictions that when a vehicle or crime is being committed that they radio in to that jurisdiction and determine whether or not their ASSISTANCE IS going to be needed. Officer gross was counseled on this violation and Cn took the time to explain to him hw the general order is to be applied. Officer gross had a trainee with hms o corrective action needed to be…Officer gross failed DARE for Hawthorne elementary I will show you that officer gross has a history of discipline which includes insubordination CN determined a that officer gross …referred the matter to the mayor with a recommendation to remove officer gross. The mayor is required to review all. Which she will tell you that she did. She received all …determined that no further investigation was necessary and notified officer gross of her decision to terminate him. As far as this process is concerned, officer gross is allowed …I think it will be very clear to you from the two officers who …And mayor that cannot have an officer on the force that continues to display …Including the record that up to the punishment and the mayor did or did not consider the six of you are then to serve as the jury of this case to determine first whether there was a violation and whether or not the judgment is …it will take 4 members of this council to agree any suspension termination or dismissal of any charges, as a side you are given the opportunity to d discuss this among yourselves there is nothing to make a decision tonight there is no pressure on you to do what you have to do except consider the evidence. .

I’m going to defer my opening statement I do not think it is..For a my understanding was the presiding officer was going to be president of council I don’t think it’s a appropriate for the mayor who’s decision is being reviewed by council. I disagree with ..you do not have the opportunity to go into executive session the law is clear about that the exception is only if the hearing is held in executives sessions which is not I’ll defer any opening statement…

Jenn: do we have someone to get witnesses, LE send someone from the sheriff’s dept down/Jenn to SD: Hickey (officer)

Jenn: right up hereOver here alrightSwear the testimony you’re about to give will be the whole truth…Jenn: Sergeant Karl hickey

Franklin county sheriff’s officeSergeant over the traffic beuaroI am coordinator of it (DUI task force)DUI task force is a group of almost all law enforcement agencies in FC we work together to work on removing impaired drivers from the roadways check poings different kidns of training grant from federal government national highway transportation safety administrationIssue the grant and we operate under that grant almost all FC law enforcement agencies belong to itMeetings held once a monthTo discuss past check points enforcement efforts, discuss upcoming enforcement efforts, go over OVI arrests throughout Franklin county discuss training opportunities anything that’s mostly ovi related traffic safety those type of thingsMeetings are not open to the publicJenn direct your attention may 25th of this yearRecallsJenn do persons sign in before leavingKH yes we have a sign in sheetI’m going to show you what I’m going to mark as exhibit oneI’m going to hand this to you tooCan you identify that document for me? KH this is a copy of the sign in sheet for …Jenn from that document are you able to determine that Jason gross..attend that meetingDo you recall speaking with officer gross at this meeting do you recall what he saidHe came up to me said e wanted to talk to me don’t know if he said private but obviously didn’t want to talk in front of other people basically told me he was concerned because the new police chief issued a policy in they can not do any traffic enforcement on Cleveland ave and asked if I had any advice for himJenn did he refer anything at all about an OVI situationWould it surprise you if he did state that when he as interviewedJenn what was your responseKH I’d have to think about it a little bit and get back to him. Jenn I have no further questionsJL: does that contain everyone KH there are people who come in late..JL sounds he was being discreetDid he tell you what the order was that Minerva officers have no authority to enforce traffic laws on Cleveland aveKH it was that they could no longerJL as a sheriff’s deputy in Franklin county assuming that…(new order) would you agree with me that that causes an issue of public safety KH yes it would be because if they don’t take action they could go down the road and cause a crash Agrees that it’s a safety issuesHe is aware of mutual aid agreementKH IM not aware of any formal we’ve basically responded to anyone that’s…

Jenn someone outside of their jurisdiction would you be surprised that they radioed out in order to respond to the callJL how realistic is it to expect that a franklin county sherrif or Columbus police officer if they’re informed about a potentially impaired driver will be able to respond to thatKH with the drivier continuing on ?JL absolutely KH could be going anywhere, we have to deal with traffic issues would be a non emergency JL you would be expectingKH I would expect any law enforcement agency to stop any impaired driverJL encompasses MP one cruiser that patrols an area that includes this villageKH that’s correct

That’s all either have for KH

Jenn: next witness we have is Sergent Kacee Adams

KA: takes oathJenn: state your name for the recordKacee adamsGroveport, sergeantJenn familiar with the franklin county dui task force KA it’s an organization of surrpoiinding departments in franklin county that look at battling ovi …Jenn do you attend meetings on behalf of groveport police departmentKA yes I doJenn do you recall attending a meeting . Ask you to look at a documentKA this is a standard sign in sheet right before t emeeting we always sign it. I did (sign in )Yes. ?(recalls JG attended meeting)

Do you recall speaking to fficer gross at the meeting

Jenn did you prepare an internal investigation statement and formward it to cpl finstermaker. KA yes I did

Hands him …take a minute to look at that

KA this is the one I typed out o june 29th 2011 cpl came down and talked to me requested a written statement Computer (statent) chief prepared this Direct yoru attention to the last paragraph on page oneIt’s “the officer copmlaing of the deparmente dincluding having his shift switched sheince she cam on and that he was not perm itted to work traffic control enforcement on

SR 161 because the mayor did not want the agency to work traffic enforcement on the roadway the officer asked if my agency was hiring any officers at this oing the offi advicsed that we were only putting on part time officers right now and I could not …

JL did youg et the sense that he was talking about some great secerent? KA noMy superiours won’t let us do traffic enforcement on 161KA yes. No further questions

Jenn: cpl finstermaker

(witnesses held downstairs)

Fenstermaker.

Matthew

MF sworn in. Cpl Mathtew fenstermakerBusiness address 2898 minerva lake road Minerva park ohioOfficer within inverva park Corpral is personnel supervisor.

Jenn do you recall directive from chief to conduct in…5 fascets to the investigation I can’t remembver them off the top of my head d o you mind(I’m going to submit this as exibit 3 identify it later) 5 facets to the orders statements from OVI task members when he complained about he department, mayor, and documents

written statements from both you (myself) and sergent beach as to knowledge of this situation and what directions you provided officer gross to discourage his actinos

which MP policies were violated

any orders you gave to officer gross which he voliated

written statement from officer gross after he is advised to be truthful

duty logs any kind of documentation involved such as the log from the task force to obtain Jenn mark this as exibit 4. could you take a look at that documentMF officer gross’s duty log for may 25th 2011Jenn is it stated as a dialy cruiser logYes

What significatnce does this lgo haveIt specifies that he was present at the OVI task force meeting at Main and Parsons

I’d also like to hand you what has been exhibited as ..Sign in log for the DUI task forceSo you stated that you obtained the task force log what di you do next? I obtained the sign in sheet for the task force I spoke with the director, sergent hickey and asked him questions pertaining to whther or not he saw officer gross there at the meeting, who he spoke to , who he saw him with, and..

Jenn did you keep the chief apprise of your, ruing investigain

Yes.

Results: Found that there were mulitiple violations to departmental policy. Did you prepare a reportYes I didCan you identify if exhibit 3 is a copy of your reportYes it is.

Jenn: I believe that you stated on eof the items you were required to do as part of your invesitation was to prepare a statement as well I’d like to mark as 5 and ask you to take a look at that for me do you recognize?Yes I do, it is my written statement to CN is that your signature on both of those pages? Yes it isIs part of your function to detemirne what discipline No Gather facktsWhat do you do once you gather them I complie those and determine if any violations of department policies and proceedings took plce and present those to the chief.

I’m going to hand you what I’ve got exhibit 6 and ask you if you recognize that documentThis is the policies and procedures rules of conductJenn are those the rules and pcoedurese hat you used in order to make the determination as to wheteher an yplicies and procedures

Are you familiar with general order number 1? Yes I amThis was issued prior to thisDid CN do anything regarding order 1 after she took officeYes she did, she specified she was going to review general order and whether or not it was a valid order

Did she make a determinationYes she did it was a valid orderShe did (express that to department)Issued a memorandum to all the officers specifiying the exact procedures to follow if a violation was ..outside of corporation limits. Ask you if you recognize that document.This is the order that CN issued concerning the procedures. And do you understand the nature of general order number one? YesWhere you given the opportunity to ask questions regarding order number oneDoes order number one prevent you from stopping drunk grives?No. What is the …..if inside the village limitsWe are to notify the appropriate jurisdiction either franklin county radio..Inside…Stop the vehicle What if they are on those three roadways outside the limitsAt that point we are to notify by radioWhat are you notifying them ofDescription of vehicle driver, howt hey are driving, any pioetential violations. If, that’s doens therough dispatchIf dishpatch tells you to rpoced and follow thhe vehicle are you able to do so under general order number one? YesHow long have you worked with officer grossRoughly 10 yearsDuring that time hae you bene a supervisor of officer grossYesAs a usprovieosr have you had the opportunity to observe officer gross over the yearsOne of the best officers I’ve seenHow about with following ordrs or new policiesThat’s where his short comings whereWould you explain that answer for meWhenever an order would be issued he would a lot of times question those orders if it would ever come to an occation where he would be issued an order he would question an order and it would raise to the level of insubordination a lot of times. Jenn I’m going to hand you exhibits 8, 9, and 10 and take a look at those let me know if you are readyCan you identify thoseMF yes mam they are letters of reprimand to office grossWho issued those? I was the one who drafted them. JL what are those? 7,8,9 on the listor tabs 7,8,9.Doi you know whther oce you’ve prepared those did you give a copy to officer gross

MF I triedWhat do you meanHe would either refuse to sign or he would he would refuse to sign the documents is what he would doJenn so those documents are not signed correct? Correct. Explain exhibit 8, what was tenautre of the repremeandSrgn beach was primarily the officer woul would be checking aperowrk whenever he was in town he apparently went on vacation in a specified time, he had tasked me to check paperwork, it was a crash report that officer gross did ther were some corrections that needed to be made he specified to me he was going to wait until srgnt beach came back form his leave. What aobut exibit 9 what is the nature of that reprimandHe as issued a must appear foa juvenile criminal trial and uh, apparently he oculd not make it to that trialAnd what about exhibit 10 what is te circumstance regarding thatThe end of 2010 the mayor asked me to asked me to go around the village and determine whthere or not speed limit signs were the proper size as well as whthere or not we needed any more. Once I go thtat duty I divided up the work. And you did you divide it withOfficer grossAnd um, what was the nature of that write upSorryThat’ sok. The reprimandSince I worked third shift at the time I went around the village and counted the signs also determined where we possibly needed signs because there was alarge gap in some places drafted a chart and gave that chart to officer gross specified ot him he had a time period I believe it was a week sine he dworked day shift to measure those signs. 9federal guidelines ) he never didDid you follow up with him regarding his assistanceSeveral times What was his reason to Not his job to do so it was the job of zoning to do it and then when I told him that iw as his job to do it anyway he specified that he dind’t have the proppert tools to do it he didn’t have a tape measure I specified to him you work during the day when the mayor’s here we have a maintainance person here you can get a tape measure you can go around an do dath I divided up the work you can do itDo you know if he ever completed the task No another officer had to do itOnce I wrote, well once he refused to do it, I wrote up I consulted with srgent beach and told him exactly what happened he said go ahead I wanted ot issue a reprimand he said go ahead and do it based upon previous experience issuing reprimands to fofficer gross issuing being insubordinate I wanted to have a witness I called a witness downstairs . needless to say he refused to sign the witness felt so uncomfortable he had to get p and leave. Was srgent beah the acting chief at the time

He specified to me that we were both right and we were both wrong.

Did ..concerning a diriver on Cleveland ave. YesAnd um, what was your um, what is your knowledge about that discipline on Cleveland aveFrom myunderstanding he stopped a vehicle that was being operated erratically once he stoped th vehicle the person didn’t have dirvelrys licene or something but the person was nt intoxicatedDid that happen inside oru outside jurisdictionOutsideSay naything with general order number one being violatedHe specified to me he would do it again if he had toDo you believe he has an understanding of what general order 1 meansYes Have you ever attended at task force meeinYesWhat is your duty Represent the MP departmentWere you paidYes Go in uniformYesSpeak ot offociers YesDo you consider speaking to other officers as part as your job duties while attendingYes Do you believe that his cations had a …YesWhat do you believe he had a detrimental ..Given that he is not only a full time officer but also a field training officer he would have the occastion to speak in front of other officers and new officers and be insubordinate in front of those officers Do you believe his actions have had a detriment working outside this departmentBecause of that it would ruin the drepouation of the dparmtnet gossip would start up between us blendon township when the general order 1 was issued the day I came into work and he was outside speaking with a deputy sherrif in the parking log showing himt he general orderYou said it oculd have a detrimental effect do you know ny that currently what are thoseSpeaking with other depts. Specifically Objection ….speaking with others outside of this (hearsay)LE sustained

Jenn that’s all I have thank you

JL Mr. Fenstermaker I have your testimony he’s on eo fthe best officers you’ve ever seenYesQuestions for you about your investigation cpl um, Jenn is it ok if I give him the exhibitYesJL you have in front of you CN ‘s order of feb8th about what officers are supposed to do, um, if they’re out on Cleveland ave, 161 or Westerville road with regard to potential traffic violations um, there’s nothing in that written order that saysi fyou call the dispatch and dispatch says you should pursue the driver go ahead and persuenoDid that policy go into effect after officer gross was terminatedNoWhen did it go into effectI don’t recall an exact when but it was when officer gross was hereHow was it comumunitcated to offierVerballyBy whomChiefIn a meeting with all the other officersIdk it was issued in a meeting but I do remember it being mentionedWas it something just mentined to you perhapsI don’t …Possibly Srgnt beachWho was thereJust meCN told you that if yo’ure out on patrol and you se e a potentially dangerous driver on clevel and you’re authorized to go pursue themHow far? She didn’t sayLimit she dind’t say no limitShe didn’t sayWell what’s your understanding of itIt all depends Let’s assume that is no Columbus ..High and broad street, outside of high and ..otside of the countyDo you have the authority of CN to go outside the conytyMy understanding is if we spot something and we raidio it in the county says through Columbus or whomever they don’t’ hve anybody available I’ve specifically asked CN what happens if they don’t hve somebody in the ares ahse said yyou make the determination at that pointAs far as you know that’s the conversation she just has dwiht youI was there yes Just the two fo you

This investigation you’ve had with officer gross vased on report and statement you’ve made this entire envestigation and reason whe’re sitting her eis the mayor and hcief got a letter from MADDNot just thatThat’s wht initiated it isn’t itI don’t knowDo you have yoru rpeot infront of tyouYes I doSection one first two paragraphs isn’t that exactly what t says this investigation was intitated because of a letter …Doesn’t say intitiated thoughI’ms orry?Ok, letsFair pointLook at the first paragraph just read the first paragraph: MD on june 6, 2011 CN approached cpl matthew finstermaker with a ltter from MADD which was sent do the mayor of MP Lynn Eisnetrout chief of police kim nuesse and…First sentence of second paragraphChief investigated that scoles spoke with ptlrm Jason gross and …The matter being investigated is the letter from MADDCorrect? Yes.

Did you meet with CN before you began your investigationI work with her during the day of courseMy question was did you meet with her during your investigationSureDid she tell you how to conduct the ivnetstiationJL..no method. Were you given directions as to how to conduct…you met with doug scholes you’re rport with that interview was recordedMF I thought it was recorded it returnes the equipment has a malfunctionWas that the same you recorded with Jason gross

It was a body cam that the department is using as beta testingJL so you were attempting surruptitiosly video record doug scoules without teling himI don’t need toThat snot my qeustison was that what you tried to doYes It wasn’t so much a failure it was a malfunction on my part I pushed the button too many timesNo, didn’t use that with Jason grossAre you taking about the interview hwne you were there. No did notThat was a separate corder.

JL you wrote hand written notes about the progress of your investigation let’s see what date I’m woking at. ..MF asks Jenn for water (thank you) smiles

JL on june 24th, what day did you interview officer gross? One second… (looks through paper) I think it was june 24th. Notes on june 24th say you spoke with chief was advised body cam had no recroding. They’re not numbered so you’re june 24th 2011. hang on a second I’ll find it

See what I’m looking atYes I doJL so your testimony attempt a serruptitious recording of doug scolesI believe I wasJL your investigation did not attempt to record gross body recordDid you do that on your own or did CN approach you with thatIt ws her idea or yoursBoth

Um, scoles told yout hat he had a copy of general order At one time he did yesYou later determined that copy came from either rick west or blaine allen, citizens of Minerva parkCorrectYou determined as part of your investigation that Jason gross did not give a copy to doug scolesCorrectHe hdad it from someone elseYesThere is no evidence that you uncovered that Jason gross is the one that called maddCorrectDoug scoles called ajason grossCorrectThere is no evidence that that call occurred while officer gross was on dutyNo….Did youmake any conclusions about thatBvesides officer gross admitting that..I’m asking you whter he spoke with doug scoles at his house or working for Minerva parkOfficer grosswouldn’t admit either oneInf at he told you he was at his house when ..I dind’ tremember him saying that, did he? You don’t’ remember documenting thatI don’t recall thatI do rememver him saying I don’t recall an awful lot.

In his written statement he as ordered to provide, he didn’t specity either wayYou don’t know that either wayNo that would b eon the audio tapeOk, fair enoughAnd you’ve concluded from your interview tih doug scoles wast hat he had received a written reprimand for stopoing a dirver on Cleveland that appeared to him to be impaired but turned out not ot boCorrectWas an active summary Jenn I’m going to objectHe wasn’t here to know if it was accurate or notLE sustainedJL he didn’t tell Doug scoles that he had stopped a drunk driverJenn I’m going to objectI’m going to object on heresy again

LE sustained

JL as part of your investigation did you confirm that George f…was not at the OVI task force on may 25th 2011. He specified he spoke to Jason gross…if he wa she didn’t sgn the logagain my question there is not evidence that you hagfe that he was thereNo evidence, no

JL do you recall asking if he ws at he ovi task forceDon’t recall

You interviewed Karl Johnson of Mifflin township and there is nothng that you gained in your interview with …Needless to say that was a hostile interview. You gusy odn’t like each otherKarl doesn’t like youMutual or notHe’s my field training officer hi have some respect for him.

You interviewed both rick west and bliane allen is that correctYesYou’ve summarized those interviews in an email to CN s that correctYes

Stands, I’m going tos how you what I’ve marked as gross exhibit A (to all council members)

Can you identify that document for me? MF yes. Is that two emails that you sent to CN on Sunday june 26th 2011 regarding your interviews with blaine allen and rick westYesBoth of them confirm that they had communications with MADD about general order 1YesYou say in the first page of exhibit a about the 4th line down this is yoru conversation with blaine allen he’s ar esudentYesStarted a converstation with him using deceptionWs that something that the ief advised you to doYesI didn’t specify to him it was an ongoing investigationYou told him that, MADD hd contated you with questionsYesThat wasn’t trueYeahYou say on a second page gross exibit a third line I used the same tactic conversation with rick west also a citizen YesPolice are allowed to lie to get what they need?deception is usedwhere did you get trained in that concept?Police are allowed to lie? We’re allowed ot use deceptiona…

wen it comes to interviewing people we’re allowed to use deception as…

did you go with CN when she served um, officer gross with charges and termination letter from the mayoryesand you would agree that that was Monday July 18th. I believe so yesWhen were you told that JG was going to be terminatedThat morningBy whomI don’t remember exactly whterer it was CN or the mayor’s secretaryWho’s the mayor’s secretaryThat would be sarah shumackerYou had not known that prior to july 18th NoHad you seen a copy of chargesNo

She didn’t’ consult you when she prepared the chargesCtually she did consult with me prior to that she did say some of my charges were not going to be sustainedDid she tell you the was going to recommened to the mayor that officer gross be terminated? No. Ehibbits I guess they’re now marked 8,9, and 10 of the reprimands that you testified about do you have those in front of you.. None of those are signed by you’CorrectNone of tese were in Jason gross’s personnel file at the time he was firedI don’t’ knowThe reprimand that you attempted to issue him that was marked exhibit 10 I understand that this was December of last yearYesSergeant beach …NoHe didn’t shred it did he tell you he didn’t serve officer gross with this reprimandNo

You haven’t signed copies of any of these reprimands I signed the ones he refused to sign Do you know what happened to them? You’d have to ask sergeant beachOk

Did beach ever tell you [that] you had no authority to issue reprimands to officer grossNoYou’ve complained outside the department about both the chief and mayor have you?YesWhat have you complained about? My scheduling hours prior to being on day shiftUm , general order 1You’ve complained to people outside the department about htYesYou haven’t been disciplined have youNoDo you know of any other officer that have complained about order number one and not been terminated /reprimandedI don’t’ knowOfficers did not want to sign it there was a lot of discussion about it ‘what does it mean’ with are we allowed to do it was talked about inside and inside [the department]The FOP yesNobody to your knowledge other than this officer that you describe as the best officer you’ve seen have been terminated over itThat’s correct

Jenn I have a few more questions have you ever complained in a meting representing village of MPAbsolutely notHave you been trained to do internal investigationsYesGeneral order 1 this wasn’t a new concept for the officers was itNoIn fact similar orders have been issued in the past relating similar to general order 1Yes And who would have issued those ordersFormer chief bobby HillardThat’s all I have at this timeI don’t know if Mr. Shaw has any..Just a second.

JL that were times prior to nvo 2011 when officers were in fact permitted to make traffic stops on Cleveland ave, 161, and Westerville road Yes sirAnd as part of your normal patrol duties as a minervea park police officer you are required to be on those roads to fulffil your duties there are businesses you have legitimagte reason to be on those raodsYes sire How amny hours regular hsift on those roadsHalf the time?? Id’ say that’s a fair assumption. Jenn nothing further, thank you.

Beach. Sworn in

Are you an officer with MPYes I amSergeantDid you receive a memo from the CN to conduct an internal investigationYes I didI was instructed to start a IA investigation the chief pulled me in office and take a trainee another week and I was supposed to ..trainee next week. Did you advise the chief that you had a lack fo training with internal investigationsNoWhat did you do with the ivnestiatgionI sat in on an interviewThe interview that CPL finstermeaker set upDid you take notesYesWere you asked by CN to give a memo or statement regarding conversations with officer gross

YesDid you do thatYesExhibit 11 ask you to take a look at that document for me.Do you recognize that documentYesWhat is that documentThe conversation I hd with patrolman grossIs that your signature at the bottome of that documentYes it isWhat does the memo stateMy response for the chiefCorrectThis was about a week ago I asked patrolman ..I asked him if he awas talking patrolman gross stated no I went on the hours for the saturation patrol for the holiday …conversation ended and we went out on the street. Did you give any other statements with respect to the investigationNoHave you ever attened DUI task foceYesHow many years did you attend2004-2011what are your duties with the meeting attending as MP officersign hours and dates for saturation patrolwhen you say represent that geny are you talking bout representing MPyeswhere you paid for attending the meetingsyes did you go in uniformyesand as part of your representation did you speak to other agencies (art of your duty )yesthis order was prior to chief taking…yesI was (acting chief at the time)Did you receive any advice on whether it was valid (FOP) and who could enforce itYesDo you recall what that advice from the FOP wasNot off the top of my head I don’tI’m going to hand you a document and ask you if you’ve seen that document beforeJL Jennifer is this in the ..? No?You have not seen that document before?No, if I have…Does it have your email at the top, MP beach? No

What about below that? It was sent to me, yeahDoes that refresh your memory as to what was given to you with general order number one?I’d have to read it again butGo ahead

(reads)

okdoes the ..say…who can enforce itchief of pliceand you were acting chief?YesDid you enforce general order 1? NoI didn’t ave any issues with itYou didn’t ha ea need to enforce itJenn do you recall any other prior chiefs before yourself dealing with telling officers that they ..Used to put out stationary radar on Cleveland aveNo received orders not to do stationary radar.Received ordersFrom bobby chief hillard

I’m going to makr this document as exhibit 12 and ask you to make a look at ati tell me when you’re done(22)

Hillard Memo (doesn’t share on overhead……..while Beach reads….)Ok, Can you identify

At this point is a privlidge not a right the village can not afford to prosecute thse case in franklin county municipal court Mayor eisentout and we have a meeting on octobver on this issue. This will be my last communication to you asking you to stop issuing traffic scitation pursuant to ORC 2935.03.(2005)

Do you recall issuing any …stating that they should stay within the jurisdictionDo you recal receiving any complaints from other jurisdictions No

I’m going to hand you what I have marked as exhibit 12 and ask you to take a look at that, JL 13Hillard’s order of ’05 was marked 12 I thought. Ok, thank you.

Let me know when you’re ready

I have received several complaints about our officer’s …if you are nt dispatched or requrested over the radio or receive another complain about this problem I will start the process following our policy and procedure maual …Officers are sitting in other jurisdictions working stiationary traffic enforcement please make sure ..So in fact you had sent out an e-mail stating to stay within jurisdciitonThat is corretDecember 24th 2009When CN took office did she confirm that general order 1 needed to be followedYesDo you currently understand general order 1I doMy understanding is that it was something to control the police departmentOkDoes it ….Yes it doesWhat if you spot a drunk driver going …Are you allowed to respondIf they are inside the jursidction can you still stop them.

According to general rule 1 you’llg et written up for itAre you familiar with mutual aidMutual aid is when another dept asks them to hel pythem out. Are you allowed to call in a violationYou anHas CN expressed that you should do soYesHave you ever done soNoHave you ever issued any discipline to officer grossI probably haveDo you recall any of the discipline you ..Not off the top of my head no

I’m going to hand you what I have identified as exhibit 13, 14, and 15 which would ve 27aJennifer this is 13, …14, 15, 16

they are 27A , 25 and 26

Would you take a look at those documents for meLet’s do 27 a first

Exhibit 14. Do you recognize that documentYesWht is thatIt’s a yearly eval. Is your signature. Who’s evaluation is it forPatrolman grossIs your signature on the lst pageYes it isCould you read the suprovizor commentsPtl. Assigned to patrol and bike patrol you have signed up for the stop program and not shown up for your assignment you have also been written for violations for not going to court you have been told about yoru cleanliness of your cruiser multiple times. You hve imporived your OVI arrest…

Exhibit 15, do you recognize that document? YesIs your ginature on the 2nd page? Yes it isWhat is this document? Oral counciling for not going to courtOk and what happened on thseYou said for not ogin to court who did not go to cout Officer grossIt’s documentation of oral counciling.

His not attending court is a violation of his job description correct? YESAnd then um, exhibit 16, do you recognize thatAfter looking at it, yesIs that your signatureYes it isIwhat is that documentIt looks like a written reprimand not logging the vehicle (impound) Who is that reprimand to Officer gross

That one was 26. I’m also gonna hand you um, have you talked to officer gross since his terminationYes

Whend id you talk to officer grossI’ve talked to him lots of timesDid you attend a party held by rick westYesWhen was thatLast SaturdayWas officer gross in attendanceNot when I was thereAnd, going back to general order 1 have you been received any discipline with respect to gen order 1I’d have to see the reprimenand if you have that with you (when that was) When was the reprimandIt happened the date on this one was 4/27/11 it happened the dsay after..You did so correctDo you remember the circumstances regarding the incidentYes I doWhat was that? I’ll just read my statement if that’ sok with youThat’s fine..4/26/11 stopped a drunk driver in area of 161 and 270 I was close to the area and was …vehicle identified had gone on 270 south gave red sedan ….then a flatbed truck was faollowing the driver was able to find the driver before the Easton exit to advise the two county units I followed the vehicle until the two county hvehicles were …at 270/62 talked to the driver about the call and not using the turn signals to change lanes gave the driver a verbal warning and …did you meet with the chief to discuss why she issued you an oral reprimandshe said it was a violation general order 1do you nderstand why? Not really because of the fact due to serious physical harmDo you stae that the county was already in routeMutual aidCorrectThey were already in route collowing the drunk drive ar the timeNo they were notThe ywere nto? NoI have a copy of the dispatch record have you heard that and gone through it with CNNoDid she sit down with you to discuss it?The video and audio tape?…just gaeve me my suprovisor review…told em not to do it againgoing to hand you that documentok

(April 30 2011 on top of page. )

just need to read the first paragraph.

So did she discuss with you why it was a violation of general order 1Correct she said the response was outside of the jurisdictionYou indicated on the geral order?No, were more clear on what she wanted in this incidentWe do not have mutual aid with the county, Clinton township, miffilin township…Past practice was we had a multijurisdiction to do with, so it was something new, I went on help on a mutual id thing and I got written up for itObviously we’re not allowe doding that so I haven’t done it since

You stated though that you were dispatched by the mutal aid agreement to follow the drunk driverI …dispatch aired that there was a drunk driverThey were in route there I was the first one behing the carThey were responding to the area too yes,You yourself responded that you would go as well I was in the area yes I ..

Why did you feel the need when the county was already in route to go when asking I thought the vehicle was going into our jurisdiction unitl they went into 270 south

You did not aks dispatch if they needed your assistance? No I did notAfter you were counciled by the chief she advised you if you need to ..If you are on Cleveland ave yesDid not seay with respect to general order 1.She said you see a car on Cleveland ave you are supposed to radioWhat about 161? ‘This one was not on jurisdiction at the time correctTat is correctThat’s all I have at this time

Are you going to mark these, Jenn no I’m notI think I will I don’ thave copies

Do a B and CDo you still have the copies in front of you ? NO I do not (Beach) B is the 4/--11Srgt beach chief nuesse since she’s been chief there’s been discussion of new order she’s never told you that if you sport somebody on Cleveland ave Westerville rd or SR161 you

believe for puroses of example is an impaired ddriver that what you’re supposed to do is call dispatch and if dispatch says to you you’re good to go to pursue that car. She’s never otld you that?She did at a meeting after I think we had a meeting in June or MyWas it after officer gross was terminated?YesAfter officer gross was fired officers were told if you’re told to pursue you are supposed to pursue .Yes That was not in place when officer gross as an empoloyee here(correct)

I want to be sure of your understanding of general order 1 and…If you’re on celve/161/westerviller odad that you have no authority to stop them at allYesThat is regardless of whether or not you believe that driver poses a risk of serious physical harm to someoneYesWhen you got he general order in Nobmeber frm Mayor eisnetrout there’s an exception in that order that would allow officers to infact stop somebody if you perceive that the driver pose a serious harm riskThat’s roccredIs it your understanding that she wrote that exception out of the orderShe said that..You are going to be disciplineYes So th eeexception doesn’t applyThat’s correctNot to use an extreme example, someone blows through 3 red lights on Cleveland ave you’re under the influence of alcohol your testimony is under …Is that regardless of whtehre or not someone is eirouly injured Id didn’t get that farYou are to let them go and acll dispatch and tell somebody from Columbus or franklin county what’s going on YesIn yor experience that tehre’s going to be a CPD cruiser of Franklin couny to make that top? never Always too busy backed up on calls for at least 2-3 hoursWhas there ever any discussion on general order 1 or feb 8 2011 oder about the risk to the public about the orders that No; You have to be on Cleveland ave as part of your duties that’s corretYesIf you make that sto that I just described you’er going to get disciplined Yes

I’m going to go back to this april 26th

Where you when that call went outMinerva lake and Rt 3Is that outside or inside the jurisdiction of MP yesAt 161 WB/270 Is that an area you normally patrolPretty closeYou were told that was a suspected drunk driver YesYou \presumed that this was a dangerYes After county …no CPD cruisers in the area you made the stop because you perceived that...you were told not to do that again if you do that again you’d be disciplined even worse than the first timeYes

….

This isn’t safe is it? No

Have you sen the letter form doug scoles? YesHave you reviewed itYes Accurate descriptionYesProhibited from making ovi arrests on Cleveland aveYesCN had discussedwith you and other officers about Mifflin township[ and said that you’re not to respond to any calls from Mifflin twp exception is felany and officer in trouble that’s because she believe s ther’e sno mutual aida agreementCorrectPrior to CN being chief let’s assume a domestic voilcnce call mp officers assistYesThat’s not th policy nowYes

One of the charges of officer gross was untruthfulnessAbout a conversation he had with george franey To your knowledge was he at the meetingNoHe didn’t lie to you about that did he

No he did notSo that charge there is no basis for thatCorpral Fenstermaker, if you could look at exhibit 10. um, the village, sergeant beach have you seen that before? No. Recall having discussion with CPL enstermaker

I’m sorry I didn’t vie you the whole thing. Did you have a discussion with CPL fenstermaker about ving a reprimand to jasno gross for something it had something to do with mearsuing traffic signsYesYou told fenstermaker you were not gin to issue that and shredded it correctWhat I told, I counciled both of them, I did shred it. So that was not ,No it was not (reprimand never issued)Reprimands usually assignedDid you ever give authority to sign..Generally no we have not.

[[notice psychology of chairs, attorneys, council, hve padded chairs Jason gross has folding chair, a padded chair is empty in corner]]

referring to what I’ve marked now as gross exhibit Bin which he counciled slash reprimanded you for attepting to stopyesdo you still hae the evaluationst hat were performed for sergeant gross? Exhibit 14.

You have ehibit 14 in front of you? Yes sirThat evaluation was done whan you were acting chief of policeYesOne of your duties was to evaluate performance of police officers That is correctDifferent areas rating officer different gradationsto all ares of job performanceYesOn page 3, of that document um, is that Jason’ gross’ ssignature on July 12, 2010That is correctWho is the signature below thatMineTwo signatures there, one as a suporvisor 9/13/2010 mayor’s signature

looking back in 2010 none of the areas of his job performance was he reated to be unsatisfactory and hasn’t been evanuated sincenot by me he has not

you have no discipline issues from 9/13/2010 till you were no longer the acting chief of plicethat is correctofficer gross is not the only officer that you have issued oral reprimands to that is correct

Memo that Ms. Croghan showed you, let me back up, there was a time before CN became chief and before this general order in November when officers in MP were in fact enforcing traffic laws on mwesterviller oad and state rout 161That is correctDo you know when that change occurredYou were shown by chief hillard when did you resume having the authority make those stopsI don’t remember him sending that order ..Officers generally were making stops on those two roads and no one was being disciplined for itThat is correct

Jenn I hav ea few questions for Srgnt beachYou staed that the mutual aid dispatch policy was not in plae when officer gross as employedWas that corredct? That the mutual aid radioing in when officer gross was employedThere was a different policy You were stating at the tie you did not now that was the procedure when officer gross was employedI believe so yesYou were counciled on april So ythat policy was in plae after you got coucniled

The discussion we had was against general order 1 ti had nothing tod o with radioing it inOk so she did not council you about calling in to dispatchWe did not have a clear conversation she made it clear at the department meeting I believe that was after gross got firedYou believe or you knowBelieveShe’s had three sice she’s been here I don’t’ know the exact dates Tere was one in june, one in aug, I’d have to look at my emails. We’ve had department meetings

But you’re testimony is after your april stop Yes we got councilng hwo to handle those callsCalling into dispatch was not part of that conversationNot in my reprimand it was not

You stated when mr. shaw was talking about where your loation was on the april 26stop was at 270 and 161 is that in MP jurisdiction

It is not It is not and you did ot see the vehicle form where you were located That is correctAnd we ask you about resuming the authorization from chief hillard to patrolling again you indicted there as no disciplineI don’t’ be leive there was any I ever had any discipline isseus

Anything on Cleveland ave within Minerva park jurisdictionWe have to travel on Cleveland ave to get to those areas of the village. You stated that Columbus ws stoo busy to assistHave you ever contcted Columbus through dispatch and orderede to ask for assistance to find out if they’re too busyNo, because I don’t want to be laughed atBut you haven’t done it to find out if they will respond have youNo

You did respond to the 4/26 call they were already outside of the jurisdictionThat’s correctThere wera relady franklin county vehicles in pursuit of the vehicleNo, they..They were ontheir way to the callThat is correctYou ended up out towards easontActually in Gahanna How long after you arrived did it take for them to pull up It was at 670 and 270 he was the first car to get to me, How long did someoneThey followed right behind me but they didn’t catch up to me until 670.

Shaw: I think we’re getting a little bit confusedAs part of chief Nuesse’s feb8th 2011 order what the officers were told if you see a traffic violation of any nature on Cleveland ave, 161, Westerville you’re supposed to call franklin county dispatcher or Columbus dispatcher

I believe she would get back to us on it

Part of the Feb. 8th order says that’s what you’re supposed to doIn the order? It was in a meeting, we had a meeting in Feb. general order till stands and Shaw as going to do the research and get back to us on how she wanted us to handle it

No time were you told specifically that you all dispatch and cay we can’t respond at no time did chief nuesse say you’re good to go on those callsShe said after she had the mutual aid agreement I believe it was in a meeting if they didn’t have in the area all we needed was permission from the agency Agency or dispatcher? …dispatcher if they say there aren’t any cars in the area.

Chief Nuesse.JL Can we take 5minutes? Absolutely

7:46pm ready Chief Nuesse sworn in Kimbery Nuesse2898 Minerva Lake RoadSworn in January 14th started officially January 23rd

Do you recall receiving a copy of a ltter from MADD directed to the Mayor? Yes I do16 or 17 I don’t..hang on

I’m going to hand you both exhibit 17, asked tot ake a look at that document what is that docuemtnThis is the madd letterfrom doug scoles Is it a true and acurage copy of the letter that you receivedYes it is As a result of this letter what did you doI ordered na internal investigation with Jason gross into possible violations on policy and procedureIn general timers what was in internatl investigationInternal because ther was no criminal alleged or possibly ligations of policy What was the purose of an intenrla investigation? To look into his conduct and actins as a result of this letter

Who conducted this investigationSergeant beah and fenstermaker were taksedI asked both of them and srgent beach indicated that he had not been trained he had…fenstermaker had an dhad fensetermaker take the lead with beach’s supportDid you give him instructions regarding invesitagaionYes, id id I gave it to him in writing

I’m going to hand you um, what I’m going to identify as exhibit 18 and ask you if you recognize that document

Um, it is tab 16.

What is that document? this is an inner office memo dated 6/7/11 regarding Jason gross and my direction to them for an internal investigationIt’s your instructions on what you want them to do correctYes What were your instructions generallyTo investigate offier Jason gross’s actions/conductDid you specificially tell copl fenstermaker how to investigatNo ig ave him guidelines as outlined here..what ewre the results of the internal investigationhe wrapped up this investigation I took a few days to review it resulted in my recommendation to the mayor that officer gross be terminatedwas there a report generated by fenstermakeryesexhibit 3this is the investigation reports summary by cpl fenstermakerprovided ot youyesconversation with the mayoryes I didI let her know that we were conducting an internal investigation as a result of the MADD letterI let her know she would be receiving a report from me which I ..Did you infact submit a report to the mayor with yoru recommendationYes I did

Going to hand you what I have marked as exhibit 19a dn ask you if you can identify thatThis is my report to the mayor summarizing the results of the investigation and my recommendation too You’re recommendation was whatTermination of his employmen, officer gross

And in that report you have specificationsYes

Wand what are the specificationsThery’re a summary of wht was contained in internal investigation report by cpl fenstermakerIs it ment to be all encompassingNo it is notReport mentions policies and procedures that are violatedWhat is meant by policies and procedures?

These are guidlnes the MP police department things they are supposed to do, things they are not supposed to do

I’m going to hand you exhibit 6 and ask if that is part of that proceduresYes they Are Report mentions prior incidents of insubordination YesCan you explain what those prior incidents are that you’re referring toYes, um, in the report let me find it here, I believe I refer to um, discipline that was issued by my to offiver gross on two occasions . Mark on page..Hand you what I have marked as exhibits 20 and 21 and ask you to take a look at those two documentsJL what are those in the book? Jenn I’m looking hold onlThey are 18 and 19Suspention is 20? Is that right? Is the suspention …um, CN the suspention is 21 and the reprimand is 20. Jenn would you explain the written reprimandYes I issued a written reprimand and stated here because officer gross had a traffic stop with a trainee officer with a him on Cleveland ave that was in violation of a genarl order that was General order 1 issued by mayor prior to my arrival as police chief, I belive dated November laast year Mark um, ethis is 22 tab 12, can you identify that document for meYes, this is te general order 1 I was referring to

Can you explain what general order number one is? General order number one is outlined in detail here that you are not to go outside of boundaries for traffic enforcement. …Is hwat you’re holding a true and accurate copy that is contained in police records. YesDid you have any conversations ofr subsequent ..with officers I did on more than one occasionI’m going to hand you what’s been previously marked as exhibit 7Do you recognize thatThis is an interoffice memo listing more than one issue for the officers to all officers in the department at the very last general order number one still in effect this was to reinforce as it states here what we discsussed when I firest met with the officers What was discussed when you first met with them in janJan 29 was my first day in the department I called ro a deptartmen tmeeitn to lay out my expectations to the officers, toward the end of the meeting one of the officers I don’t remember who brought up their concerns with it told them I’d look into it I was aware of it mayor it was an order we had to abide by it I was going to look into it further and we talked about mutual aid I was not aware if we had mutual aid in effect at that time one of

the officers borught up what ifwe have an overlap and it’s on vcleveland I was very vey clear with my direction to them they were to get on the raido with whatever jurisdiction it was in those two areas Columbus police department were not in the villge notify Columbus police department if they felt it was an issue continue to follow them and wait for the jurisdiction …that occurred in January at that meeting Is there any of the officers with tehdepartment ath you know were not at theat meeting in JanuaryNot that I knowI velkive becery one was thereWhen you issued your order in feburary did you have any other conversations regarding mutual aid and dispatch fsome fothemw ere individual officers officer gross had questions wanted to bring up a lot of what if secenarios I don’t want to argue with this this is the order this is the way it needs to be handled You did discuss with himMore than onceWhat is the problem with officers not following general order 1It’s a lawful order of this village, it’s not in their jurisdiction you have to handle calls appropriately we don’t have county jurisdiction or state by this you have to abide by the village policy and procedures. You have not instructed any of the officers that they are not permitted to enforce a DUI outside of jurisdiction because of general order number oneNo, in fact you can’t say something like that I advised what the policy in procedures to handle thatYou would not support officers just letting them goThat’s correct there’s no reason that those officers couldn’t continue to follow that vehicle and call into appropriate jurisdiction under professional curtsey for the offence make the decision was to how to handle it sometimes they’ll say we don’t have anybody available sometimes they’ll say we have an officer on the way but the officers have to take those stops to .Have you taken those tesp personally since you’ve been chiefYesHave you gotten a response?Yes Columbus police department both timesWould you write up an officer that has followed general order number one and radioed in for assistanceNoHave you written up officers who have not followed general order number oneYesAny other officers Yes cpl boyersOn the first time that happens what has been your responseIt varies it depends on the situation it depends on what happened when the officer’s responds to I try to be fair about discipline but I couldn’t ...each situation is different each officer’s intent and actions are different it depends on certain things it depends on how many times I’ve had conversation with these officers to clarify whether they were

confused or misunderstood or second or third time I’ve had this conversation I would got o..I =’d like to direct your attention to a traffic stop by officer beach that occurred in April of 2006 and had you what’s been marked Gross exhibit CYes I do this is a weekly evaluation report to gtive the officers feedback and final yearly evaluation This one is one I generated and discussed with sergeant beach. What did you tell sergeant beach? When I discovered the on the roll call board that this traffic stop was listed I asked him about it, I asked him to give me in writing why he as outside the jurisdiction because I had no details because ..I put it in writing with the copy of the video tape from his cruiser and get a copy of the audio transition from the track and reviewing all that I made the determination he did not follow general order number one policy or procedures or verbal orders. In accordance to that he told me he was wrong, “I missed up I was wrong wont happen again” I told him we had to document it on his weekely and…

Did you express to him again how the dispatching and calling in worksYes, and you did obtain a copy of that dispatchI’m going to play for you um, something and ask you to identify it

255, sergent beah’s radio. April 26, 2011 at 22:09 in area of 33-10 minerva lake possibly across the street. 22:10 caller is at 33-10 maybe he can …special attention on blendon township westbound and unable to maintain lane caller is following in a flatbed trailer Lincoln. Just got on 270sb from 161. Continue to follow him? Caller still following him. Officer just passed himHe’s referring to me,255 what’s your complication? Easton and …

Chief do you recognize that audio? Yes it is the call put out …Is this what you listened to to determine whether the call Yes, he was not dispatchedHe was no where close, jumped on 270 southbound and was all the way to EastonHad he radioed in and asked whether or not his assistance was needed would he have been written up for this call? Not if he’d called in and asked if he should continue until they got there. He did not observe the driver he went ton to 270 searching for the driver.

I would also like to mark as an exhibit I think I’m on number 22 and ask you to review this document

SB 23. Thank you sharonl In the book? Number 14Do you recognize that document? Yes I doWhat is that document? This document is an interoffice memo conversation with citizens and elected officials while on duty (early may )

Meeting with citizens or certain elected officials pending an extended period of time with political issues and not what officers are paid to do consultation tih the department issued this memo to guide their conduct. This relates to only while they’re on dutyIf an officer wanted to speak to citizens while off duty that isWe have to give the appurtenance of veng neutral enforce fairly we can’t do that when engaged in types of conversations when you get allegations of bias which asbeen..There was testimony on sergeant beach about you working on a new mutual aid agreementThat is correctHe indicated that you have had conversations with the officer stating wt they were and were not allowed to do until a new mutual aid was put in to place Do you recall that I do it was the same protocol I just outlined if they had a serious call you have to go to the same steps and jurisdictions over to somebody’s calls there were other police agencies that had people closer and they Could not respond to any call from Mifflin townshipNo I didn’t say thatThat’s not how I phrased thatAnd how did you phrase thatJust how I explained it..yes what I did say was what I just reiterated it didn’t make sense to me that our officers were responding regularly to calls in Mifflin township with blendon twp and county other agencies close by other people available why are your cars responding when we’re available I conveyed that specifically to officer gross and to the other officersalso sergeant beach? Yes, to all of themYour report to mayor also mentions the DUI task forceYesWhat is the FC DUI task forceThe Franklin county sheriff’s office does a l….participate as far as OVI related checkpoints and other activities to help curb people driving under the influence. You’re aware that Jason Gross was at a May meetingYes I assigned him to .Why does MP attend?

We have a contract to participate in these types of activitiesAre the officers on duty while attending these meetings?Yes they are, they’re paid to attend and represent.What are your expectations of an officerMy expectation is to attend and represent our community in a professional manner and abide by our policy and procedures and cooperate and inform me of those check points and over time details Is speaking to other persons in the meeting part of their duty? YesHow does that relate to their dutyExchange of information, updates, laws, training, have to be able to converse to convey that information. Why did you recommend to the mayor termination of officer gross?He was not following policy and procedures and representing the village well it had a negative impact on ..Did you terminate him because of the statements that he madeNo it was conductDid you look at his past performance in considerationYes this officer had done a good job in several areas but in my observation as chief of police he consistently showed a pattern and it was a liability to the village negative impact of the officers who were complying with the policies and procedures it was just an …I had what I felt was no choice to give him his terminationDo you agree that an officer needs to give accurate information?Yes I doDo you feel ..

Do you feel he conveyed accurate information?No What was not accurate?From the internal investigation report it became clear to me he was upset about his discipline by me regarding not following policies and procedures 2 day suspension which was my attempt to get him to modify his behavior he was not going to comply he was going to continue to misrepresent the order and misrepresent my direction of officers

Has officer’s gross’s actions impeded the department?I’ve had neighboring agencies that have talked to me and their concerns are hearing that I have put out an order that we were not to respond to assist them that has a negative impact of my relationship with police chiefs other officers, responding to situations, it creates bitter feelings that don’t need to be there, negativity it’s not the case not accuage at all, created situations internally with officer that were ont eh receiving end of hti s and ewr eupset bout it

JL what officers are upset about thisCPL fenstermaker, cpl boyers, concerns of other officers ic an’t think of eveyrboyd at this time but internally those would be the officers that have conveyed their concerns to me. You did no terminate officer gross you recommended termination right

That is correct You hd a conversation with odoug scoles What did you tell himWe discissed the letter that I receivedRightWhat did you tell him the policy wasFor Minerva park officers in these situations wheret hey perceive or believe there may be an impaired driver…I explained what I have just expained previously in my testimony, to get on the radio go ifnd the jurisdiction and let them make the ..You didn’t tell doug scoles on the telephone that this would not be a ptoblem at all there owul be a “real time” responseI didn’t state that no.

You didn’t tell him that the policy didn’t pose any therat to the public because the county or city didn’t respondI did not state that sir those are not my words.

CPL fenstermaker kept you apprise you knew he was using deceptive tactics After the fact yet Was that approved by youWas that a tactic you approve ofIt’s not one I would chose to use they just disclose itTo whomIn their reportNot to who they’re talking toIt’s not illegal He chose to use that tactic and itw as effective in that situation I’m not going to second guess them You tink it’s appropriate and don’ thav ea problem with MP officers using descptive tactics I’mg oing to state it’s not illegal I’m not going to second guess an officer during the course of his investigations He wasn’t disciplined for that No he disclosed it with me

Exhibit 12 is the general order, yes, who told you SB 22, I think it’s on the tab as 12JL it’s my mistake thank youWho told you that that was ctually the rule that was in effectI don’t’ understand the questionWho told you that this was the general order that was issue dot officers in NovemberThe mayor and legal councilYou haven’t seen the revised version? In paragraph nine will result in discipline. You haven’t seen another order that say smay result in discipline

Um, I don’t recall sir I know I have a copy of the general order thaw as given t me by the mayorWhich copy do you havethat says they weill or may? The one in front of me says they will.Right.

You, gross exhibit D chief I’m going to ask if you’ve ever seen that beforeYes I recall seeing this. You stil have the attached order with it You agree with me the order marked was the order I just gave you, correctWhich one is ion effect I’d have to ask legal council. ‘yYou sit here tonight and don’t know which one is in effectMy testimony is in effect you’er saskign my about chaning one word I’d have to ask which one but still wouldn’t effect my decision. I dind’t say that it did …That’s the order you issued in February, is that right (exhibit 7)Let me find that here …Yes it is. [[Lynn whispering something to Damon, about page. ]]Cold have a 30 second recess mayor, nevermind I found it.

Am I correct chief when you be ame chief of police that what you did in exhibit seven is essecntially to modify general order number one. You understand tat general order 1 said officers do not have authority to make …as an exception to ..being in those cases when there is a risk of serious physical harm that officers are supposed to take actionI do understand the general orderOyou agree or dong’ agree as an exception to order those cases when oan officer sees a risk of serious physical harm to take ationI agree with in the pactice that I gave out which is lawfully

I see you outline what seems the overrule of the exceptionNo sir it’s been in effect for years

You read the general order one to state that if you perceive a risk of serious physical harm you need to call another jurisdicationThat’s not in the order correctIt doen’t have to beNo it’s ni nthe mutal aid agreementMutual aid agreement county mutual aid agreemneTther eisn’t any reference to mutal aid in general order 1There doesn’t need to brYou issue this order, general order 1 is still in effectThere has be en no change to gen order 1That’s correctOfficers do not have the illegal authority to misdemeanor or ..

It appears there’s a words missingDo you tihk thiat’s grammatically correctThat’s how I worded itYou’re not suggesting in that order that the officers do not have the aurhotiryt undrer ohio law to enforce traffic laws on Cleveland ave, Westerville rd, or 161, is that correctUnder ohio law, MP officers have every right to enforce traffic laws on Cleveland aveNo it is not an accurate statement. Your testimony is that officers on’d haveJurrisidction still applesHave you done any research on this at allLeaving aside conferences with council who told you Minerva park officers don’t’ have any authority in ohio law Are you aware that our county prosecurtr has made that statement? Actually I’m not because that’s nota n accuagte statement…that’s the reason why …that’s correctis that beliefe come from anything other than conversations with oucnuilI’ve ben in law enforcement for 28 years, no toher jurisdiction has allowed …cases have been thrown out no other, jurisdiction does applyYou’re not aware of a case that arose out of here in franklin county that said on those three roads of course officers have the authority to amekt hose arrests The village has isuesd an order it’s alwaful roderdIt’s based then on your bvleiefi correct me if y’m wroing becase I don’t want there to be any confusion about it this whol dconencept os premised on your blief that the officers have no authority under ohio lawThat’s I my understandingIt’s not a situation of I know you have tha urthorty to do it wer’e gjust ogin to constrict it that s nto what doing onNo.

If in fat offices to have the legal authority to make traffic stops on those three roads would you mofity the policy accordingly thenNo I would notSo no matter if they have the aurthodity or don’t your policy That’s correct it’s not heir jurisdiction.

You agree they have to be out on those roads as.I do agree and if they see something they’ll call I tin if they wnt to take action under our mutual aid agreement they can take ation.So your testimony is that if officer gross an dwillis on this may 3rd 2011 traffic stop perceived that the drier posed a risk of physical harm that was insufficient ..They couldn’t maek the stop without making a call to somebodyThat’s correct

And that applies to any traffic offense ont hose three roads

Obvsiously we’re talking about one of serious physical harm they’d be expected to intervene…..They are allowed to stop? You mentioned the exception to the general order in this conversationI thought what that menat was they had to call into dispatch and are you telling me now that if they do perceive a risk regardless of whether thye …I don’t understand what you don’t understand about the protocall if it’s not their jurisdiction on a traiffic issue they’re going ot have to call it in either rwya regardless of what action theyr’e takingThat’s all premised on your understanding of the lawI’m going on the fact that we have a genral order that is alwful I’m nto here to interpret the law or render an opinion on the law I’m here to follow what the village ha s put into effectLet me ask it one more time because I’m not cleanJenn: I’m going to object because this has been beat to deathLE I’m going to agree and sustainJL it’s not c clearn and I’m asking her to advise her ruling,LE can you take a different tact? JL in te case of Jason gross they ….regardless of whether they call dispatchI can’t answer that because I was very clear on my directions on how to andle the stop. Meant wat? They call it in on the radio what they are observing as they’re following the vhechile to the appropriate jurisdiction and wait for that jurisdiction to respond.

Before issuing your februrary j8 order did you make any attempt to contact thef ranlin county sherrif’s department or CPD to inform them Yes I did I talkedto nick solctice and chief’s meetingYou talked to chief fiscal swag about this? Who’d you talk to at CPC or the franklin county sheriff’s offie? No, nobody specifically at the Franklin County Sheriff’s office. CPL Boyers was counciled by you? He stopped somebody running a red lightHe received that from sergeant beachWhen did that occurI’d have to have it in front of meOn one of those three roads we’ve been talking aboutThe charges you referred against officer grossDi you draft them up yourselfI’m asking you if you drafted them Did you write themYesDid you have any assistance from anybodyI ran tem by our legal councilDid you discuss the with the mayor before you finalized them No

Did you tell the myor that you were going to recommend termiantinNoWas it your idea or the mayor’sI recommended it to the mayorHave you told other law enforcement officers in fC othersieNoHave you told anyone that this was not your idea it was the mayor’s No that would not be a true statement I did not make that statement. Di dyou hand deliver the charges to the mayorYes I gave her the report andDid you meet with herAfterwardsWhen, you look at the date of the charges, I think the charges were july 12 does that sound correct? I’m looking at exhibit 19. SB I thin it’s 21 tab 19. No actually 21 and 20 I’m asking about the charges, I think its behind tab 16, CN the one mared that 19. These were prepared on the 12 of july When did you meet with the mayorI can’t give you the exact date it was after I provided her with thisYou hand delivered them to officer gorss’s house on mondy july 18th Just the two of you in the meeting Yes

She tell you that she was going to terminate gross during tat meeting? I don trecal if she said anything I think she was till condiering and had questionsWhat questions dis he haveI can’t rememveAnything she said to youNo.

You didn’t know until , Before Monday july 18th

I ‘m sure I did I can’t recall the exact date As I say you hand delivered both the charges to officer gross’s home along with cpl fenstermaker Monday july 18th Officer gross had not received charges prior to that dateCorrectWho’s ide was that? To give him the charges and termination letter at the same timeI don’t recall it was anybody’s idea he just received it at that timeIn the charges exhibit 19, after each specification you have italicized list of what appears to be what I assume to be evidence in support of the charges That is correct

Your recommendation is set forth in exhibit 19 and the evidence in support of htose charges is followed in the italicized material That is correctHave you ever had any discussionas bout terminatiog gross’s employement prior to july 12 2011NoIs there are son in your feb. 8th 2011 order that you did not put in there that you testified aobut tonight what you’re supposed to do is call the dispatch.I explained it to the officers in personWhy wouldn’t that be put in an order with al this apparent confuseionThere should have been no confusion when I met with them on eon one there was a mutual iad agrreeement that …they had more than sufficient ofpprunity to come talk to me about it I clarified it several timesYou had a conversation with Jason Gross in which you told him exatly what you testified aboutThat is correctLet me finish the questionHe specifically in those situations is to cal a dispatch and it hey tell him to goThat’s not correct the way you’ve worded itThe correct was is to call it into the dispatch that agency that is responsible for the jurisdiction is decide by saying..Your testimony is you’ve said that to Jason grossI’ have said that o all the officers How many occasionsAt least twice (to Jason)That the council should believe youYes, this is not the first time these officers have received this directionThe fact of the matter is you were terminated for dishonesty were you notIt has a lot of evidence. It ahs to do with credibility of her as a witnessJL she doesn’t’ have to answer that question that she was fired as LE sustainedJL laughs. Because they have to judge credibility

After the 2 days suspension had recommended terminationI’m just asking does it have anything to do with recommending terminationYes it didMy recommendation would have been for an act of insubordination but he could have been terminated for the very first two insubordinations The 2 day suspension did you notify the mayor Giving her a copy of it is that the manner in which you did itI discussed it with her and given it to her in writing and legal folksBefore you issued it or afterI believe before

It appears Minerva park is advertising for a new police officer is that Jason gross’s position? No it is not. What is the villager, chief? It is the village newsletter that is put out by the Minerva park community association

Did you write an article for the May 2011 issue of the villager mentioning Jason GrossYes I did.

Gross exhibit e is that a copy of article in the villager that you wroteYou refer to officer gross as a good example to othersThat is correct In your freview of the traffic stop officer willis or gross made did you …It did not appear that she the driver posed a serious risk. What aobut he responses that received from them did they substantiate that they felt that wayThat was their beliefDo you believe that someone going across the center line on Cleveland ave…That did not appear to be the caseWhen you saw the video you didn’t see her going across the center lineNoIf she had, Yes

I’m sorry, let me rephrase those questions

What I saw on the video was her weveing within her laneYou did not see her at all go into the other southbound laneNot in the video that I sawYou understand that there were some circumstances that..Our videos have a capability of one minute prior to recording and what I saw in that ivdeo prior to recording still was not…Ok. Is it your testimony that driver posed no risk at allThat is not my testimonyDid she pose a risk or notI was not at the scene that woul be the officers to make that determinationOkFOP and JL whisper.

Ont hat tape that we listened to chief wasn’t there a question asking if they could respondCounty cars in zone 2 and blendon township officers, yesAll questions I have

Jenn I have just a few follow up if you look at exhibit D and general order number one exhibit d is the email with the revision. Generaal order 1 trhe one that was signed by Jason gross ad marked 7, 17, nope, 22. You notice the first thing that um, Shaw pointed out the difference between the may and will, you stated that it wouldn’t make a difference which one it was to your decisionThat’s correctMay result in discipline could still mean that I twould be an oral reprimand correct. If it was may result in discipline it oculd be oral reprimandYes If it will result in discipline it would still be an oral reprimandYesAcknowledgement the draft on exhibit d says received read and understand it says I have received and read do you see the difference thereYesUm, what do you believe the purpose of Minerva park officers are as far as being paid by the village to do? To enforce the laws and prevent crime in the village…Mr. Shaw pointed out that Jason gross the charges and …was Jason aware of the investigationYesAnd charges and termination were served on himYesAnd he had his time to appealCorrectAnd did you receive an appealYesLastly the stop that you disciplined officer gross forEsOfficer willisAnd is he a new officer,YesSo his perception of what did or did not occur may be difference form someone who has experienceYesIf the driver …there would have not been any order to followingNno furtherJL ( A few minutes? )

Lynn talks to Jenn and younger man (presumably from firm)

Jenn my next witness is the MayorSworn in Lynn EisnetroutDid receive a letter from MADD.

Previously marked exhibit 17

It is (letter from MADD)

When did you become aware of the investiagaion, first part of june

When did you first become aweare of violationsWhen I received the reportDid you have a discussion with the chief about brigning formal chargesShe just told me she was doing an investigationDid you ulitimately receive …Did you review the reportI didHand you what’s been marked exhibit 3 and ask you if you recognize that documentYes I diWhat is tht documentThis is the internal affairs investigations ummary for officer grosDid you review that document before making your decisionI didI’m going to hand you exhibit 19 and ask you…YesWhat is that documentThis is the order from police heif nuesse to me sayingthat there was in internal investigation and drected grgent..Did you review her memorandum to you prior to making investigation. YesAre you familiar with general order number one YesDid you sisue general order number 1YesWhat wast he purosIt was in response to complaints from residents and other agencies complaingina bout our officers jumping their gunsAnd we discussed earlier um general order number one which is um, it has Jason gross’s name on it, and um, eshibit d, hand you those two documents do you recognize those two documentsI doAs I discussed with the cief that has his name printed on it at the bottom that the word understand was removedCorretDo you have any recollection that why that ocuredBecause the officers were reluctant because they did not understand general order 1So the word understand was removedYesThe oe that has Jason gross’s signature on it is the final orderYesBetween when this was issued who was the heif or acting chiefSergeant beach

Did you asl have a liaison that was retained during the village duringtht timeJeff millerWhat thype of experience does he haveI don’t have his resume in front of me and was also helping us in search of chiefWere you aware if he met with officers on general order 1My request wasd for him to sit down tithe officers and explain general order number oneDid he doe tatYesDid you feel that any other investigation was necessary to come to a decisionI did notWhat was your decision I supported her recommendationWhich was watTerminationWhy? There was a pattern of insubordination tht ould not be toleratedI’m going t makr for you um, 24, Sharon? SB I don’t see anything after 23 Is it in the book? It’s the july 18th letter from the mayorI’m going to give you wat I’e marked at …This I smy letter july 18th upholding her recommendationWhat is that letter toOfficer grossDoes it stet., it sets forth your decision for terminationYesAre you aweare whether officer gross received yourYesI twas hand delivered to him by chief nuesse and corpral fenstermakerI have no further questions

JL I’m confused mayor, your testimony is that Gross exhibit D is not the ordre that’s in effectThat’s correctJL the initial order was put on November 1st gross exhibit d was put out by you email November 5, this is attached the testimony is, is this not accurateThis is the one I have in front of me was revised The one that was revised November 5th is my understanding what’s in effect yesSo Gross exhibit D is not what’s in effect

What’s the exhibit number? 22

it’s dated before the memo sent out revising it on the 5th correct?

The one that was revised November 5th?

Did you have any conversations with anybody telephone or any other withfrom MADDI did not I called mr scoles and left two messagesDid you direct the chief to call himShe olunteered to do so

Exhibit 24,t hat’s the letter that you prepared and um had hand delivered to Jason gross on Monday july 18th 2011Correct In this document it’s clear what you’re doing is terminating his employment correctYesDid you draft this documentWith council’s adviceDo you remember when you met with the chief of police Sometime between july 14thand …probably around july 14th

You recall there are days when you were in the office and days that you’re notDid you come in to specially meet with herI’m in here every dayJust the two of youYseBefore you made decision to terminate officer gross did you seek approval from councilCan you answer the equstion first so we’re not interrupting each otherI’m not sure exactly when but I think during safety committeeWh’s on the safety committeeCouncil Preseident pam par curry Councilman todd walkterCouncilwoman Sharon bierman I do not recall the dateDid those three council members say that they supported your decusinoI do not recallDo they say that they didn’tI do not recallDid you ask them I believe that we met but I jut don’t rememberWhat do you remember talking about at the safety committee regarding Jason grossI’m drawing a blankYou have no recollection of anything that you discussed with the safety committee with Jason grossYou have reason to beleve that the village council supports your decision to terminate Jason grossI don’ tk now if they do or notBefore you made your decidsion to terminate officer gross on july 18th you did not provide him with an opportunity to review the charges that were filed against him and appear before you and provide you with reasons ws why she should not be firedCorrectDid you understand that was something you were supposed to doI was not required to do that

What was the source of thatLegal council Have you terminated other Minerva park employeesThe other employees have retiredYour understanding was you’re under no legal obligation to provide officer gross ith a predisciplinary hearingCorrect He did not et a predisciplinary hearingCorrectHe had no ooprutnity to appear before you with charges or evidence to persuade you why he should not be fired, in fact he wawnsot even given the charges That’s my understandingHe got them oth the same dayThat’s my understandingYou’re unaware of him being provided a copy of the charges provided against him before he got terminated,That’s my understanding

Leaving aside terminations have you ever conducted any type of predscipplinary hearinsI don tbelieve soHave you upheld suspentions before for other Minerva park employeesI believe soIn those cases when they’ve been suspended did you provide them with the opportunity for a predisciplinary hearing? ‘no

Exhibit FI don’t think there’s any dispute about this but this is a letter that I’ve sent to the village council appeal ing officer gross’s …Am I correct that’s your signarure of the certified mail receipt. YesThe village did get the appeal letter that he is appealing your decisionYes

I apprechiate that you’re not a law enforcement officer or lawyer but is it your general understanding that Minerva park police officers do not have any authority to enforce traffic laws on Cleveland ave, SR 161 or westerviller oad. do you have any , have you formulated any conclustions in yourmind about whther or not officers I think that’s all been asked of nuesseI’m asking youOn Cleveland ave, 161, Within our jurisdiction yesWel I’m talking bout on Cleveland ave where businesses I agree with the general order if there is a reason for them to stop someone after they call it into the jurisdiction just exactly what we’ve already talked about.

If you don’t have an understanding tell me it’s not a trick question I’m juts trying to get a sencse as to what you belive that chief nuesse belivesYesSpeak up YesYou agree with herYes

Before chief Nuesse became the chief, let me go back to exhibit 22 the general order that we’ve been talking about this evening this was your order rightCorrectDid you prepare it or did council prepare itLegal council’OkAnd do you interpret this order as providing for an exception in those cases in which an officer believes there is a risk to serious harmYesSo if a mp police officer believes that someone poses a risk they do have the authority to amek the stopAs long as they call the jurisdiction and apprise them exactly as we’ve already said several timesThe last part of that as long as they call the agency that’s not in the general orderWe’ve already covered thatI’m asking you..jeff miller explained that to the officers at their meetingwere you present at that meeting? I was notYoure testimony is that jeff miller told the officers they’re supposed to call the jurisdiction. That’s my understanding

If you could look at exhibit 21 mayor, it’s the suspension.

There is no indication that CN gave a copy of that to you did you receive a copyI believe I didYou took no formal action on that did youCorrect You did not render a judgment on suspensionNoYou understand under revised code that’s something you’re supposed to doI’m not aware ofYou’re not aware of the way suspension works for village employeesI can’t find anything in officer gross’s file that you did anythingYou took no action on officer gross’s suspension

I believe I didn’tNo one told you [that] you were supposed to take action on itCorrect.

If you could look at exhibit 14 mayor

Do you have exhibit 14 in front of you mayor? Is this the, That’s your signature dated 9/13/2010 right? That’s correctAnd this is Jason gross’s evaluation from 2009-2010To your knowledge he has not been evaluated since that timeThat is correct

Did you ever issue any orders or directives telling them they were not permitted to talk about general order one to anybody Not to my knowledgeAre you aware of any orders from anybody else?Perhaps from the chiefYou just don’t know?

That’s all the questions I have.

Jenn I have just a opule follow up questions exhibit D on the second page of the revised order that still has general order number one for the date 11/1/2010 correct. Even though the front page had November 5th

Correct.And you had testified that there had been others that have retiredYesHave there also been other officers that have resignedYesBut there have been no disciplinary ..Correct

I’m going to hand you wht I have marked as 25, it is exhibit 1. Can you tell me first of all doe the village of Minerva park have less than 5000 and is ther ea union in placeYes, noIf I could direct your attention to exhibit number one, the second paragraph the mayor shall inquire into the cause of the suspension.In this case did you inquire?CN volunteered informationDid you rinqurie the review of the hargesYes we discussed itAnd you hadd no other questions correct,Yes.

The suspension that was brought up earlier that CN discussed the suspension with youYesAnd if you’ll look at this pargraph right here it says suspentions of more than three days are able to appealed to the legislative authorityCorrectDid you have any objection to the 2 day suspentionNo

I have no further questionsJL I’m not yetWhat Is exhibit 25 mayorI don’t have itI thought she just showed it to youThis is from WesLaw it quites RC 737Have you ever seen this before? I haven’t seen this particular one but I have seen.You’ve reviewed section 737 of the revised codeI have seen it beforeWhen ms. Crogan asked you about part of a sentence that beigns with the word beigns five daysWithin five days after receiving the certification and render a judgement on itYou did not as you testified you never rendered a judgement on the two day suspention issued by the chief. That’s all the questions I have. Jenn I have no further witnesses for council.

JL are they downstairs, the witnesses? Jenn yeah. JL goes downstairs.

Officer Willis sworn in.

State your name pleaseIan WillisEmployeed as police offier for the villge of Minerva parkHired January of this yearDid you make a traffic stop on may 3rd of this year 2011 involving someone that you believe may be operating a vehicle under the influence of alcoholYes sir You were driving the cruiser and officer gross was with youYes sirI’m going to mark this as exhibit GI can either get my laptop out or..We can do it on here if it will work Officer Willis I’m about to show you a video I want you to watch it and I’ll have some questions for you

Is that the traffic stop from may3rd of 2011Yes sirAs part of your duties as a Minerva park patrol officer o you fill out a log sheetYes sirIs the log sheet the document of what happened during the shiftYes sir

I’m going to show you what has been marked as Gross Exhibit H can you turn ot the second page of that document. Can you identify what that is on Roll call, explains what we did during our shiftIs the traffic stop that we just viewed on the video referenced in this formYes sirWhere is thatA6 at Cleveland Ave and Green AppleJust advised her, no citationsWere you asked to provide an explanation to N as to why you made this traffic stop Yes sirDid you do that by emailYes sir

Marked as gross exhibit I and ask you to turn to the second page of that document is this your response to CN’s request for an explanation of what happenedYes sirDid you observe the vehicle make multiple Once we stopped her she actually hit the curbShe was going in the south bound lane on Cleveland aveYes sirWhy did you make that stopWe though thtat she had been drinkingAnd she was notYes sir

Were you disciplined about thisNoWere you counseled By the chief If I see possible drunk driver on the road and radio into Columbus ask them if they want me to make the stop until they can get a cruiser thereYou weren’t reprimanded for this? No sir That’s all the questions I have for you officer willis.

I hve a few questions when did you finish your academy training? August 2010DUI training

Field sobriety tests what to look for on the street for possible oviDid the training in the academy cover jurisdiction?? NoDid you go through additional DUI training? Yes mam July When did that occur? During my FTOField Training officerWhat officer was thatCorpral Fenstermaker I beliveWhen you were on this stop were you still trainingYesDid you discuss the stop prior to making itWhat she was doingWhat jurisdictionColumbusDid you know at the timeNot sureBut I did know about the general order 1Is this the first time you’v ehad nay issue about general order number oneYes maamDUI traffic stop with corpral fenstermaker where did that occur161It would have been within the jurisdiction On an area of 161 within the park? Yes sir

No further questions.

JL gets new witness

CPL BoyersSworn in.James BoyersRe you employeed as a police officer Since 1988. Since chief nuesse has become the chief have you been counciled about a traffic stops you’ve madeNo sirDid you stop someone from running a red light somewhereYessirWhere did that occurCleveland ave and walcrestThe light had changed to red and I was coming from the carwash at bretton woods and I ws stopping for the redlight going northbound on Cleveland a white vn kept on going

through the light I had traffic facing the southbound and figured everybody sitting there looking ta me in the cruisr saying why aren’t you doing something I went ahead and stopped the vehileDid you all anyone before you made the stopNo sirWere you counciled or disciplined bout itSergent beach reminded me to call ahead and ..Yuou were told you should not have made that stopThe person went by me and I hdad all the people lookingDid you think the individual posed a risk to the publicIf a car started to go on green it ould have bene an accident

Jenn cpl boyers I have a couple of questions with respect to general order number 1 I’m going to hand you marked exhibit 22 that was, did you receive a copy of that general orderYes I didAt the time that you received that order did you ever recerive any advice from the FOP or passed on advice from the FOP related to that order I’m not sure what you’re trying tor drerDid the FOP give you any advice or anyone in your department pass anything on to you bout general order 1If I remember right we were told we needed to follow the orderDso you did receive advice? I believe so yesAM I on 26? I’m going to hand you what I’m marking as exhibit 26 and as you review this documentWhat number is in this folderThe one I handed you earlier the email that I discussed with beach

Did you receive a co[py of that emailYes And what is that emailIt indicates that if we violate general order one we could be terminated or punishedWould you agree then in this third paragraph where it starts my intial reaction states that the order is validYesAnd the individual had the authority to enforce it being the chief ..Who is Jason PappisI believe FOPIt appears it as forwarded to you by silvermanAt the top is that who you recall receiving it fromAnd that was November 8th 2010That was shortly after the order was issued, correct, In the past there have also been toher orders about jurisdictional limitations would you agreeYes

I’m going to hand you exhibit 12 and ask you if you recognize that documentDo you recall chief hillard issuing this memorandumYes I do, vaguely What’s that memorandum about? Indicates that uh, brought up the issue about writing tickets on any street that’s adjacent to us and…may have the authority to…Would you aree that he’s advising police officers to stya within the jurisdiction of Minerva parkYesI’m going to hand you exhibit 13 and ask you if you recall receiving this document

SB tab 24Jenn his was just given to him

You did receive a copy of this emailYes Would you agree with me that this email talks about staying within the jurisdictionYesAnd tat tere were complaints that the officers were outside the jurisdiction and jumping callsIt indicates complaints but not jurisdictionWhether or not dispatch was requestedRightThis email was sent out December 24 2009 correctYesHave you seen Jason gross since hw as terminatedYesWhere did you see himUm, had a birthday party for another officer that was terminated hereWhen did that occurThe 17th of this month Do you recall if officer gross said anything related to his termination He vaguely mentioned some minor things but pretty much stayed away from talking to me about itH…

You just had heard some comments made about itThank youJL Can you take a 5 minute break?

Jason Gross sworn in10:17Wetterauer speaks to Sharon, Matt, and Segovia leans in

[guy who runs mayor’s court]

My name is Jason grossWe’ve sat here for the last almost 5 hours I want to go over these charges that were refered against you Were you a memver of the franklin county dui task force Yes sirWere you designated to attend that meeting as a representative for MPYes sirYou heard sergeant hickey’s testimony earlier this evening about his conversation is that an accurate summary of what the two of you talked aboutYes sirWho is george franeyHe is the former chief of police of Mifflin townshipWas mr franey at the ovi task foreNo he was notDid you have any discussion with karl Johnson regarding mp officers respondingYes sir I didWhat was your understanding of what Minerva park officers were permitted to do or not do since chief nuesse became chief? We were only allwed to respond to emergency and felany dispatches Emergencies including officer in trouble calls? Yes sirWas that a change with twhat used to be the policy with miffilin townshipWe were rallwed to respond if we were dispatched by franlkin couny or other agencyI was notified by chief nuesse I was in resonse to a previous dispatch You heard kaycee atoms testify today is that na acuraty summary of your conversation with kaycee adams Yes sirWer you ever told you were not to discuss general order one? No sirDid you receive a telephone call from mr. doug scoles from MADDYes sirDid you provide any documents to mr scoles any documents before thatNoI bleive he got it from rick west or blaine allenAre they both residents of mpYes sire (where’d he get it general order 1)did you have tat conversation on duty or off dutyoff dutydid you call him or he call you

I’m going to object to what doug scoles heresayI told him I had been reprimaneded violation of general order number one I went and got the printed reprimand and read it to him that written reprimand

Going to show you the reprimand that mr. gross that’s been marked I think as village exhibit 1, is this the reprimand that you read off to doug scoles. Yes sir it isWho issued this reprimand to youHief kim nuesseOn or about what date? I believe it was written on may 3rd it was received on may 5th Um, could ou read off what chief nuesse said you were supposed to do in lieu of making the stopYes sir, if you observe a violation you are to radio the jurisidcion in this ase you should have contacted CPD through LEARN radio or franklin county sheriff department .Did chief nuesse ever tell you on stops liket his that you’e supposed to call franklin county or Columbus if they say there’s no car in the area you’re allowed to make the stop? It’s a long question, were you ever told that what you’re supposed to do if you observe a traffic violation you’re to call Columbus dispatch or franklin county and if the dispatch tells you there are no cares in the areas you have the authority to make thes topYou saw the video that was marked as gross exhibt G.Yes sir I didUm, was that viedo diepict the driver weaving in between the lanes of southbound trafficYes sir

Showing you what was previously marked as gross exhibit H and gross exhibit I if you turn to the second page of gross exhibit H that’s not any of your hand writing correctNo sir it is notWas officer willis in the car with you when you made the stop on the 3rd, why is it tht his handwriting Hew as the officer being trained so I had him fill that outHe was driving the cruiser at the time the stop ws being madeYes sirThe chief asked you to provide some explaination as to why you made the stopYes sirExhibit I why you made the stop? Yes sirIs that an accurate summary of what occurred that dayYes sirAre there things that are not shown in the video that were factors in the decision of you and officer willis to make this stop on may third Yes sirWhat are thoseWhy doesn’t what you’re about to tell me show on the videoThe video records the last 20 seconds prior to activating your emergency lights and we’d followed the vehicles at Cleveland ave on 161 they made an abrupt stopAt a traffic stopNo sirAre drivers permitted to stop in a roadway

No sir…..is there anything tht you asid or anyway attempt to mislead mr scoles about general order onehave you had ny other conversations with doug scoles other than the one time he called youno did you ask him to do anythingno siryou havent’ received any awards from MADDyes sir I haveExhibit JWhat is that? It’s a copy of a plaque that I received from MADDYou reeived that from MADD in 2011Yes sirDo you know what you got an award forI excelled in the amount of OVI arrests Do you know who nominated you for the awardI believe sergeant beach

How long have you been a law enforcement officer before you were firedI started here in February 2003 I worked in Mifflin township from 2001-2003Did you receive a copy of an order from CN on or bout feb 8th 2011YesPreviously been marked as exibit number 7YesPrior to receiving that order from the chief what had been your understanding as a law enforcement officer about your legal authority to make traffic stops on Cleveland ave, 161 and Westerville road I’m just asking you generally what was your authorityThat officers did have the authorityPrior to CN making that order had anyone you’d ever worked for in law enforcement ever tell you [that] you didn’t have the authority to make those stopsNoIs N just wrong in her understanding f the lawI believe so yesYou received a copy of general order 1 back in November of last yearYesThis is now prior to CN becoming chief what was your understanding of that order as it concerned your ability to make traffic stops to 161 Cleveland ave and Westerville road were there exceptionsYes it was my belief that if there were safety concernsHad you made stops like that before CN became chiefYes sirHad you been disciplined at allNo sir

Did you interpret chief Nuesse’s feb8th order as a change in the policy?No sirDo you know who Jeff miller is? Yes sirDid he have a meeting with MP officers at some pointYes sirDid he ever tell you that what you’re supposed to do call the dispatcher and if they say there is no cars in the area That was never discussedOk

Did you tell Blaine Allen that you had been reprimanded on may 3rd 2011 for making this traffic stopYesWere you ever told or given an order that you’re not allowed to discuss disciplinary actions that you’ve received with people outside of the departmentYes sirDid you provide any false or misleading information to doug scoles when you talked to him on the phone. No sirWere you ever told by CN either in person or in writing that part of the general order 1 provides the exeption in those cases that physical harm I was under the impression that it still existedWas that because general order 1 was still in effectYesShe never told you otherwiseNo sirThat’s all the questions I have mr. gross thanks

Jenn Mr. Gross I’m going thand you what I’ve marked as exhibit 27 which is acknowledgement of police proceduresCan you look at that document? OkIs that your signatureYes maamWould you agree with me that that is an acknowledgement that you had received and read rules ..Yes Do you recognize that docuuemtnIs that a portion of the rules and procedures Yes it is I bleibve Would you agree with me that CN has the ability to issue ordersYesAnd that you are required to follow those ordrsYes

General order number 1 is it over there, exhibit 22, is that your signature ont hat document? Yes it is And that was, what date was that signed? 11/7/2010do you recall receiving an email from offier silverman discussing that orderI doDo you recall what that email statedIf I recall it was stating that he was confused as to the general order. Let me give you that so you can look at it

The email to Jason papaasWould you agree that you signed the order on the 7th

CorrectThis email is dated November 8th

YesStates that the order is legal by the mayorGeneral order number 1Ok, yes,Do you agree with thatYesDo you also agree that the email states that the chief or acting chief is able to enforce tht orderI’m sorry where does it say thatUnder the 3rd paragraph where it says the chief of plice the mayor is limited ot issue the order and..Do you agre that that chief or acting cief is ableYesSo you knew on November the 8th that general order number one was a legal order and the chief could enforce itYesSo when chief nuessse came on January she still had the authorityYesTestimony of sergeant hicky not being able to control that was a correct statementYesAnd do you recall that you stated that when you were interviewed by finstermaker and the whoel ovi situation did not permit you stop drunk driversI don trecall saying thatWould you deny that you said thatI don’t recall

June 22 2011 10:52 pm sergeant adam jbeach matthew fenstermaker Attorney Shoub representing mr. Jason GrossDoy ou recognize that this would have been your interview that you had with orproal fenstermaker

YesIf I’ts ok with you I’m going to skip ahead to the part where you’re talking bout your conversation with hickeyOkDid you speak with franklin county sheriff deputy karl hickyYesWhat did you tell himI asked him for adviceOn whatHow to handle the situationWhat situation was thatThe OVI situationWhat ovi situationThe ovi directive as far as us not being able to stop drunk driversOk did you specify to him at atny time the proceduresNotifiying agency if you spot a possible impaired driver?I don trecallIssue concerning traffic adjacent roadwayDon’t recall exactly what we taked about specifically

Do you recall now that you’v eheard that telling cpl fenstermaker and not bveing able to stop drunk drivers to sergeant hickeyYesThis was after you’ve received the um, disciplinary from CN related to the stopCorrect And this conversation took place at the DUI task force meeting 5/25OrrectAnd you looked at part of the write up with your, shoub you indicated in there that you had to radio in in order to make those stops correctCorrectWould you agree that the directive does not sotp you from pulling over drunk drivesrs so long as you radio inCorrectWould you consider your statement then inaccurateThat statement doesn’t cover the whole conversationThat’s your words that you just stated to cpl fenstermaker Out of context yesThose were your words correct(yes)

you saw me hand exhibits 12, 13 to other officers, from Chief hillard and adam beach about restrictions on jurisdictiondo you recall receiving thoseyes I doso both sergeant beach and hillard have issued orders restricting authority of traffic stops to jurisdiction

can you ask that againboth hillard and beach have issued directives to restricitign jurisdictionie believe this email refers to dispatch runs and not traffic stopsexhibit 13 he’s stating here that the same thing you need to call into dispatch beofe going outsie jurisdiction they’ve een receiving complaints outside yesstated the final complaints that officers are sitting outside jurisdiction and to make sure thye’re on village property doing soyes that’s what the email sayshe’s going to monitor the situation correctcorrectchief hillard would you agree that his memo limits jourisdiction or states that he was wrong and needs to stay within the jurisdictiondoesn’t say that he was wrong, I didn tsee that parthe was mistaken or…ummm, I have he thought we have the authority it’s a prividlidge not a right. Chief hillard is restricting the village limitsIt appears that he is limiting itDo you recall the mayor extending an opportunity to meet with anyone in the PD to discuss any issuesI do not recallWhat number am I on? 28 than youdo you recognize that document? YesDid you receive it your name is up thereYesDoes she make herself available to meet or discuss anythingI attempted to discuss it following my reprimand In the presense of willis I attempted to discuss it with her She stated Jason you do it again and you’re suspended She didn’t want to dicuss itDid you ever make an attempt to meet with her to discuss itI did notDid you ask to make an appointment with her or did you want to discuss it at that moment> Di dyou request to set up a time with herI did notShe approached me in the department downstairs in front of patrolman willisWe tlked about it yesI couldn’t tell earlier by your testimony are you stating that before you were issued the reprimand 5/3 tht the chief never explained to you as she testified on two occasions the nature of general order number oneShe said it was still in effect

That’s accurateDid you ever tell ct fenstermaker that you would not follow general order number one I did notYou testified earlier tat you did attend the Franklin county DUI task force and up here this has been marked as a previous exhibit is that your handwriting on the sign in sheetYes it isDo you agree that the chief assigned you to attend that on behalf of the villageYesLooking at what else has been marked daily cruiser logIs that your handwriting on the cruiser logYes it isI think it’s exhbit number 4That you did attend the OVI task fore and you attended in unfirom Yes I did

The purpose of the task force meeting is to dicuss DUI issues correct

You also received a suspension in may of this year for failure to follow orders for the DARE program at HawthroneIt has been marked as exhibit 21 can you verify that is your signatureYes that is my signatureDo you still have the other exhibit for the may 3 traffic stop the reprimandI think it’s exhibit 20Is that your signatureYes it isOk, um do you recall the chief advising that they were putting actual activities into their log books that they wre performingDid she ever tlak to all the officers about making sure their log books were accurate that they reflected what was actually bveing doneDo you recall failing to not log stopping to talk to a citizenYesCitizen bliane allenYesDo you recall going back and correcting itShe told me to go back and correct itI twas a guestimate how long I’d been thereThe log book you put down that was a guessCorrectDo you think you aired on the side of making it longer shorter anything like thatProbably overestimatedI think your logbook indicates you were there 20 minutes does that sounda bout right? I could not recall how long iw as there What number am I up to 29?SB yes…log sheet from (….)2011

is that the corrected log sheet it is with my notes on the bottom yesdo you agree that you were logged there for about 20 mintuesapproximatelyI was (on duty)You had testified that you told blaine allen about beign disciplinedYes I didWhen did that occurI can’t say for sure I belive it was the day I was reprimeandedStopped for his house I was driving by he was outsideYoud idnt yell out the windowSo you had to stop in order to let him knowDid he flag y ou down or did you just stopI believe I just stoppedIs that part of your responsibilities as a minera park police offier to stop inform residents you’ve been disciplinedNoMay 3rd stop that occurred ou knew that you were outside of your jurisdiction at the time of the stopCorrectYou did not radio inId id notYou stated that you uatkled to doug scoles What nuber did he call you on? Do you know how doug scoles get your phone numberBlaine allenHow did blaine allen get your numberHe’s had my number, we’re friendsDo you do anything outside of work with blaine allenI attempted to get him to have lunch with me at a restaurant. …(?)Anything elseNoAM I at 30? SB yesI’m going to hand you what I’m marking as exhibit number 30 can you identify that document for me.Is it in the notebook? 2008 performance rveiw oh that’s 23A marked as 30Do you recognize that documentI doLook at page 3Is that your signatureYes it isAnd chief bobby hillard was the chief at the timeThat is correctOccasionally seems to question new policies mandated mail policy per auditorsI do (see that)Was there a question that you had about policy related to the mail

Yes ma’amDo you recall when we pulle dup your performance evaluation 2010 when sergeant beach testified about hat, exhibit 14, look at the lsat page, is that your signatureYes it isDoes it note on there that you had some issues with showing up for courtYesDid you receive um, a written document for um, not doing so aw well from sergeant beach I don’t know if he called it a reprimand Verbal counseling Do you recal receiving thatYesYou also received discipline for failure to appropriately log in an impoundVerbal yesDo you recall chief hillard putting out a directive about cell phone use in vehiclesThat was back in ’05 I may have I don’t recall31, 32, is that the memorandum from bobby hillard yes it is32 what is tat? Interoffice memo from me to chief hillardYou responded by providing him your opinion about his order correct? YesI hand you what has been marked as exhibit 33You agree that you’ve had other discipline throughout your years here at MP24, chief hillard has written to you about faling to follow his order to pass along a message to the mayorI remember the incidentHe wrote you a memo stating you didn’t follow his directiveRightViolation 2009? This is 2004.

You provided cpl fenstermaker regarding his investigation correctCorrectI’m going to object to this is has nothing to do with this, it’s on the enge (2009)With respect to this investigation that cpl fenstermaker allowed you (provide him more info)Did receive a letter from mayor charges and decision and knew you were beign investigated and had noticeYesYou attened a party for rick west in SeptemberCorrectOfficers that are still in the department attendedOne that is still here that you saw that nightCorrect

Did your council advise you wou were not to discuss your termination with any members of the department Correct Did you make statement to your (?)Did you make comments to anyone else at the party about your terminationYsSo cpl boyers could hve heard hose comentsHe wasn’t present when I was talking

JL just wanted a couple of clarifications Mr. Gross, when you were asking questions from Ms Croghan about attempts to discuss general order 1 were you referring attempts to discuss that with CN or Mayor? With chief nuesse. OkEhibit 29 that’s where you went back and revised your log to refer your conversation with blaine allen you make some reference to introducing him to number 260 what does that refer to 260 is patrolman willishe as new I was introducing him to the residentsand that’s what you were doing tlkiing to mr. allen yes sirI think we’ve covered this but I want to be sure that the records is clearAt any point in time before you were fired did chief nuesse ever tell you if you were going to make a stop that you would call the dispatch and if either of them authroied you you were allowed to do it? nothat’s all the questions I haveI have no further witnessesAs I see it this council has two choices I’ll leave those up to you either they will summarize tonight or come back at a different date but I think you soul dhave the otion to present your case in total if you so chose if they agree to and come back I will leave that to the two of you as to what you velieve. I will defer to Grant. Given the hour itseems to make sense to ….Postpone that closing or review at later date, poll councilKent: I’d like to ponder this and come back to hear closings Todd: convenePPC ConcveneRS conveneMD conveneSB hear tonight

Coordinate as well (everyone)

Encourage expoditing council I would advise you of three things you have no right to discuss this with residents do not discuss among yourselfves not been deliberated or decided and discussion is prematureCouncil please forward available dates with this week and next so we can …I have no problem retaining hem on behalf of the village if he would prefer that the court reporter take tehm No I’d just like to be sure that ..Council you will maintain your own exhibits ….