COMMONWEALTH OF PENNSYLVANIA · 3 *** 4 [Timothy A. Fritsch, Esquire, Commission Prosecutor, 5 presented the Consent Agreements for File No. 15-56-6 09772 and File Nos. 14-56-01583

Sargent's Court Reporting Service, Inc. (814) 536-8908

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COMMONWEALTH OF PENNSYLVANIA 1

DEPARTMENT OF STATE 2

BUREAU OF PROFESSIONAL AND OCCUPATIONAL AFFAIRS 3

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F I N A L M I N U T E S 5

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MEETING OF: 7

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STATE REAL ESTATE COMMISSION 9

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TIME: 11:35 A.M. 11

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BOARD ROOM B 13

One Penn Center 14

2601 North Third Street 15

Harrisburg, Pennsylvania 17110 16

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Tuesday, April 30, 2019 18

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State Real Estate Commission 1 April 30, 2019 2

3 4 COMMISSION MEMBERS: 5 6 Joseph Tarantino, Chair, Industry Member 7 Anne M. Rubin, Vice Chair, Industry Member - Absent 8 Joseph J. McGettigan, Secretary, Industry Member 9 Alexis L. Barbieri, Esquire, Public Member 10 Armand Ferrara Jr., Industry Member 11 Jennifer A. Thomson, Esquire, Attorney General 12

designee 13 Annie Hanna Cestra, Industry Member 14 Edward L. Seebeck, Cemetery Member – Absent 15 Kalonji Johnson, Acting Commissioner, Bureau of 16 Professional and Occupational Affairs 17 18 19 COMMISSION PERSONNEL: 20 21 Juan A. Ruiz, Esquire, Commission Counsel 22 Ray Michalowski, Esquire, Commission Prosecution 23 Liaison 24 Timothy A. Fritsch, Esquire, Commission Prosecutor 25 Tiffany A. Raker, Esquire, Commission Prosecutor 26

Caroline A. Bailey, Esquire, Commission Prosecutor 27 Krista Linsenbach, Commission Administrator 28 29 30 ALSO PRESENT: 31 32 William McFalls Jr., ABR, CRS, Green, GRI, President, 33 Pennsylvania Association of Realtors 34 Henry (Hank) Lerner, Esquire, Director of Law 35 & Policy, Pennsylvania Association of Realtors 36 Timothy Quintrell, President, Schlicher-Kratz 37 Institute 38 39 40

41 42 43 44 45 46 47 48 49 50


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*** 1

State Real Estate Commission 2

April 30, 2019 3

*** 4

The regularly scheduled meeting of the State Real 5

Estate Commission was held on Tuesday, April 30, 2019. 6

Joseph Tarantino, Chair, Industry Member, officially 7

called the meeting to order at 11:35 a.m. A roll call 8

was taken. The Pledge of Allegiance was recited. 9

*** 10

Approval of Minutes of the March 12, 2019 meeting 11

CHAIR TARANTINO: 12

The first order of business is the 13

approval of the draft minutes. Could I 14

have a motion? 15

MR. MCGETTIGAN: 16

So moved. 17

MS. BARBIERI: 18

Second. 19

CHAIR TARANTINO: 20

On the question, all in favor, say aye. 21

[The motion carried unanimously.] 22

*** 23

Report of Prosecutorial Division 24

[Caroline A. Bailey, Esquire, Commission Prosecutor, 25


4

presented the Consent Agreement for File No. 16-56-1

01032.] 2

*** 3

[Timothy A. Fritsch, Esquire, Commission Prosecutor, 4

presented the Consent Agreements for File No. 15-56-5

09772 and File Nos. 14-56-01583 & 17-56-12060.] 6

*** 7

Report of Commission Counsel 8

[Juan A. Ruiz, Esquire, Commission Counsel, noted a 9

proposed adjudication and order, three final 10

adjudications and orders, and five motions to enter 11

default for discussion during executive session. 12

Mr. Ruiz addressed House Bill 906, noting it to 13

be similar to Senate Bill 257 regarding land agent 14

registration. 15

Mr. Ruiz also discussed House Bill 1167, which 16

would establish the State Board of Cemetery Relief 17

Directors and the Cemetery Relief Fund. 18

Mr. Ruiz and Acting Commissioner Johnson met with 19

State Representative Keith Gillespie to discuss issues 20

concerning cemeteries and general issues concerning 21

the burial ground law. He discussed an issue raised 22

by Representative Gillespie with an abandoned cemetery 23

and investigating what can be done legislatively to 24

improve the burial ground law and preventing these 25


5

types of issues. 1

Acting Commissioner Johnson extended an 2

invitation to Representative Gillespie to attend Board 3

meetings and encouraged members of the General 4

Assembly to reach out with the various Boards to work 5

in conjunction with the interests and initiatives of 6

the Boards. 7

Chair Tarantino expressed his concern with the 8

requirement to become a land agent, where they have 9

less education than to become a real estate 10

salesperson and are doing broker work. Ms. Cestra 11

also commented on their being given the right to 12

transfer land and lease land without a real estate 13

license. 14

Chair Tarantino questioned whether these 15

individuals could be investigated by Mr. Michalowski 16

and penalized. 17

Mr. Ruiz referred to Section 604(a) of the RELRA, 18

noting a license or registration certificate could be 19

disciplined by the Commission. Chair Tarantino 20

suggested having the exemption to the law removed. 21

Mr. Michalowski addressed House Bill 1167. He 22

stated that Ms. Bailey has been acting as sort of a 23

cemetery specialist, looking at cemetery laws in other 24

states and ways to suggest improvement to burial 25


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grounds and the Commission’s jurisdiction in the 1

Commonwealth of Pennsylvania. 2

Mr. Michalowski mentioned that other states have 3

created a separate Board to deal with cemeteries, 4

rather than putting them under real estate. He noted 5

that Ms. Baily works with a lot of cemeteries that are 6

nonprofits for compliance with our law without having 7

to take disciplinary action. 8

Mr. Michalowski addressed for-profit cemeteries, 9

where the authority is there to take their business 10

away or impact their business or penalize them 11

monetarily because they are brokering sales between 12

people. He referenced the laws in Virginia. 13

Mr. Michalowski addressed cemeteries placed on 14

receivership. He noted problems with abandoned 15

cemeteries. 16

Mr. McGettigan questioned House Bill 906 17

regarding land agents and criminal background. He 18

noted the bill states criminal background will be no 19

more than one year. He suggested that the time line 20

should be within 90 days. 21

Acting Commissioner Johnson stated that all 29 of 22

the Boards have background checks as a matter of 23

policy. 24

Acting Commissioner Johnson addressed House Bill 25


7

906 as a way for persons who traditionally would have 1

identified as attorneys or contract agents to identify 2

themselves with the Commonwealth for the sole purpose 3

of representing an entity in the divestiture of 4

mineral rights. 5

Mr. Michalowski referred to the act, where the 6

terms employee and employment include independent 7

contractors. He noted that it has an unintended 8

consequence expanding itself out, because the law 9

states that these folks are treated like they are 10

employees of the extraction company even though they 11

are technically independent contractors. The act 12

treats independent contractors and employees, both as 13

employees.] 14

*** 15

Report of Commission Chair 16

[Joseph Tarantino, Chair, Industry Member, announced 17

that the Association of Real Estate License Law 18

Officials (ARELLO) and the National Association of 19

Realtors (NAR) are meeting in Washington on Friday, 20

May 17 and requested Mr. Ferrara attend that meeting.] 21

*** 22

CHAIR TARANTINO: 23

Could I get a motion that we allow 24

Armand Ferrara to attend the NAR/ARELLO 25


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Liaison Meeting? 1

MR. MCGETTIGAN: 2

So moved. 3

MR. JOHNSON: 4

Second. 5

CHAIR TARANTINO: 6


Any opposed? 8


*** 10

Report of Commissioner 11

[Kalonji Johnson, Acting Commissioner, Bureau of 12

Professional and Occupational Affairs, noted his prior 13

role as policy director for the Department of State. 14

He announced Marc Farrell will be stepping into that 15

policy role and will be responsible for reviewing all 16

of the Department’s rulemakings. He will be helping 17

to push policy initiatives and be liaising with the 18

Office of Legislative Affairs and stakeholders. 19

Acting Commissioner Johnson also introduced 20

Stephen Latanishen as the new director of 21

intergovernmental affairs, who will be responsible for 22

interfacing with public organizations and 23

stakeholders. 24

Acting Commissioner Johnson thanked the Board and 25


9

commended Mr. Ruiz and Ms. Linsenbach. 1

Chair Tarantino noted the Board’s appreciation of 2

all of the help Commissioner Harlow provided.] 3

*** 4

Report of Commission Administrator 5

[Krista Linsenbach, Commission Administrator, noted 6

the next meeting on Wednesday, June 12 in Pittsburgh. 7

She also reminded Commission members to make their 8

hotel reservations at ADTRAV and suggested the Wyndham 9

Grand. 10

Ms. Linsenbach noted tentative 2020 meeting dates 11

for the Commission’s review.] 12

*** 13

Public Session 14

[William McFalls Jr., ABR, CRS, Green, GRI, President, 15

Pennsylvania Association of Realtors, addressed 16

updates on legislative and regulatory issues. He 17

stated that PAR’s efforts to pass the First-Time 18

Homebuyers Savings Account Program continues to move 19

forward. 20

Mr. McFalls stated that Representative Rosemary 21

Brown reintroduced legislation earlier this year, and 22

her bill has been voted out of the House and is under 23

consideration in the Senate. He stated that Senator 24

Bob Mensch also reintroduced his legislation that 25


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passed unanimously out of the Senate Urban Affairs & 1

Housing Committee. 2

Mr. McFalls noted that PAR continues to work to 3

introduce legislation that would define real estate 4

teams and qualifications for a team administrator. 5

Mr. McFalls commented that Representative Todd 6

Polinchock is expected to introduce the proposed 7

legislation in the coming weeks and is in the process 8

now of finding cosponsors for that legislation. 9

Mr. McFalls stated that PAR has also reviewed the 10

Commission’s draft team advertising regulations and 11

forwarded a policy recommendation for team advertising 12

last week. 13

Mr. McFalls noted that PAR is still receiving 14

questions and comments regarding the implementation of 15

the BPO (broker price opinion) rules. 16

Mr. McFalls mentioned that PAR continues to hear 17

complaints from both members and schools regarding the 18

Pennsylvania Licensing System (PALS) and that Mike 19

McGee, the CEO of PAR, will be meeting with Acting 20

Commissioner Johnson to discuss this and other areas 21

of concern. 22

Mr. Ruiz stated that the Rules & Regulations 23

Committee recently met and discussed the BPO temporary 24

regulations, where amendments will be made to the 25


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proposed regulations. 1

Mr. Ruiz also noted the advertising regulations 2

will move forward as well but some of the advertising 3

regulations could change depending on whether 4

Representative Polinchock’s bill is approved.] 5

*** 6

[Pursuant to Section 708(a)(5) of the Sunshine Act, at 7

12:20 p.m. the Commission entered into Executive 8

Session with Juan A. Ruiz, Esquire, Commission 9

Counsel, for the purpose of conducting quasi-judicial 10

deliberations on matters currently pending before the 11

Commission and to receive the advice of counsel. The 12

Commission returned to open session at 1:49 p.m.] 13

*** 14

[A Formal Hearing was held from 1:50 p.m. until 15

2:23 p.m. in the matter of the Application for a 16

Salesperson License of Russell W. Moss, Case No. 19-17

56-002558.] 18

*** 19

[The Board recessed from 2:23 p.m. until 2:26 p.m.] 20

*** 21

[A Formal Hearing was held from 2:27 p.m. until 22

2:42 p.m. in the matter of the Petition for 23

Reinstatement of Licensure of John Paul Dougherty, 24

Case No. 19-56-004747.] 25


12

*** 1

[Pursuant to Section 708(a)(5) of the Sunshine Act, at 2

2:42 p.m. the Commission entered into Executive 3

Session with Juan A. Ruiz, Esquire, Commission 4

Counsel, for the purpose of conducting quasi-judicial 5

deliberations on matters currently pending before the 6

Commission and to receive the advice of counsel. The 7

Commission returned to open session at 3:25 p.m.] 8

*** 9

MOTIONS 10

MR. RUIZ: 11

The Commission was just in executive 12

session conducting quasi-judicial 13

deliberations on a number of matters 14

currently pending before the Commission, 15

including deliberations on the two 16

hearings that we held this afternoon. 17

Is there a motion to deny the 18

Consent Agreement at File No. 16-56-19

01032 as being too lenient? 20

CHAIR TARANTINO: 21

Do I hear a motion? 22

MR. FERRARA: 23

So moved. 24

MR. MCGETTIGAN: 25


13

Second. 1

CHAIR TARANTINO: 2


Any opposed? 4


*** 6

MR. RUIZ: 7

Is there a motion to approve the Consent 8

Agreements at Case No. 15-56-09772 and 9

Case Nos. 14-56-01583 and 17-56-12060? 10

MR. MCGETTIGAN: 11

So moved. 12

MR. FERRARA: 13

Second. 14

CHAIR TARANTINO: 15

On the motion, any questions? All in 16

favor, say aye. Any opposed? 17

[The motion carried unanimously. The Respondent’s 18

name for Case No. 15-56-09772 is Jamie Kay Redden. 19

The Respondent’s name for Case Nos. 14-56-01583 & 17-20

56-12060 is Patrick Forney & Forney Realty Corp.] 21

*** 22

MR. RUIZ: 23

Is there a motion to direct Commission 24

counsel to prepare a final Adjudication 25


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and Order consistent with discussions in 1

executive session concerning the case of 2

the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania vs. 3

John Ronald Vira at Case No. 17-56-4

12602? 5

MS. BARBIERI: 6

So moved. 7

MS. CESTRA: 8

Second. 9

CHAIR TARANTINO: 10


Any opposed? 12


*** 14

MR. RUIZ: 15

Is there a motion to approve the 16

following final Adjudications and Orders 17

of Brian S. Collins at Case No. 15-56-18

06991, Noushig Hovhannesian at Case No. 19

17-56-08608, and Daniel A. Rossetti Jr. 20

at Case No. 16-56-04399? 21

CHAIR TARANTINO: 22

Motion? 23

MR. MCGETTIGAN: 24

So moved. 25


15

CHAIR TARANTINO: 1

Second? 2

MS. BARBIERI: 3

Second. 4

CHAIR TARANTINO: 5


Any opposed? 7


*** 9

MR. RUIZ: 10

Is there a motion to grant the Motions 11

to Enter Default in the following cases 12

of Allison Margaret Elizabeth Bethell at 13

Case No. 15-56-02510, Robert D. Graham 14

at Case No. 17-56-00964, Letisha Ann 15

Lindsey at Case No. 18-56-006409, and 16

Yvonne Perry at Case No. 18-56-003804? 17

CHAIR TARANTINO: 18

Motion to approve? 19

MS. BARBIERI: 20

So moved. 21

MR. MCGETTIGAN: 22

Second. 23

CHAIR TARANTINO: 24



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Any opposed? 1


*** 3

MR. RUIZ: 4

Is there a motion to approve the Motion 5

to Enter Default in the case of William 6

K. Kerschbaumer at Case No. 17-56-09054, 7

noting for the record that Annie Cestra 8

has recused herself from all voting and 9

deliberations on that matter? 10

MR. MCGETTIGAN: 11

So moved. 12

CHAIR TARANTINO: 13

Second? 14

MR. FERRARA: 15

Second. 16

CHAIR TARANTINO: 17


Any opposed? 19

[The motion carried. Ms. Cestra recused herself from 20

deliberations and voting on the motion.] 21

*** 22

MR. RUIZ: 23

Is there a motion to grant the 24

Application for a Salesperson of Russell 25


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W. Moss and place his license on 1

probation concurrent with his current 2

criminal probation? 3

MR. MCGETTIGAN: 4

So moved. 5

MS. CESTRA: 6

Second. 7

CHAIR TARANTINO: 8


Any opposed? 10


*** 12

MR. RUIZ: 13

Is there a motion to Reinstate the 14

License of John Paul Dougherty and place 15

his license on probation for a minimum 16

of two years? 17

MS. CESTRA: 18

So moved. 19

MR. FERRARA: 20

Second. 21

CHAIR TARANTINO: 22


Any opposed? 24



18

*** 1

MR. RUIZ: 2

Is there a motion to go forward with the 3

promulgation of the regulations at 16A-4

5624, which are the temporary 5

regulations dealing with broker price 6

opinion, and regulation 16A-5616, which 7

is the proposed regulation dealing with 8

advertising? 9

MR. MCGETTIGAN: 10

So moved. 11

MR. FERRARA: 12

Second. 13

CHAIR TARANTINO: 14

Any questions? All in favor, say aye. 15

Any opposed? 16


*** 18

CHAIR TARANTINO: 19

Could I get a motion to approve the 20

meeting dates for 2020, less the one for 21

December 29? 22

MR. MCGETTIGAN: 23

So moved. 24

CHAIR TARANTINO: 25


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Second? 1

MS. CESTRA: 2

Second. 3

CHAIR TARANTINO: 4


Any opposed? 6


*** 8

Report of Committees – Education/Examination Committee 9

[Annie Hanna Cestra, Industry Member, noted six 10

brokers’ applications to review for experience 11

qualifications.] 12

*** 13

MS. CESTRA: 14

We make the motion that we approve the 15

following applications to sit for the 16

broker examination: Adam Poznanski, 17

Joshua B. Reibstein, Kevin Cybularz, and 18

Jordan Cypher. 19

CHAIR TARANTINO: 20

Motion. Do I have a second? 21

MS. BARBIERI: 22

Second. 23

CHAIR TARANTINO: 24



20

Any opposed? 1


*** 3

MS. CESTRA: 4

I’d like to make the motion to 5

preliminarily deny the application of 6

Osmond Mincarelli. 7

CHAIR TARANTINO: 8

Do I have a second? 9

MR. FERRARA: 10

Second. 11

CHAIR TARANTINO: 12


Any opposed? 14


*** 16

MS. CESTRA: 17

Next, we have courses that were 18

presented that needed to be reviewed for 19

continuing education. We are going to 20

approve Commercial Real Estate as a 21

Career, the course, pending a name 22

change. 23

I move that we approve Commercial 24

Real Estate as a Career for continuing 25


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education (CE) pending a name change. 1

CHAIR TARANTINO: 2

Second? 3

MS. THOMSON: 4

Second. 5

CHAIR TARANTINO: 6


Any opposed? 8


*** 10

MS. CESTRA: 11

We have two courses to approve, and they 12

are How Does Your CMA or BPO Compare to 13

an Appraisal and Overcoming Consumer 14

Fears. 15

CHAIR TARANTINO: 16

Second? 17

MR. FERRARA: 18

Second. 19

CHAIR TARANTINO: 20


Any opposed? 22


*** 24

MS. CESTRA: 25


22

Two courses to deny are Kiss Your 1

Landlord Goodbye and Leading a Winning 2

Property Management Team. 3

CHAIR TARANTINO: 4

Second? 5

MR. MCGETTIGAN: 6

Second. 7

CHAIR TARANTINO: 8


Any opposed? 10


*** 12

MS. CESTRA: 13

We had two salesman applications to 14

review for education qualification. 15

I’d like to make the motion that 16

one of those, Chris C. Vericella, be 17

preliminarily denied. 18

CHAIR TARANTINO: 19

Second? 20

MS. BARBIERI: 21

Second. 22

CHAIR TARANTINO: 23


Any opposed? 25


23


*** 2

MS. CESTRA: 3

I’d like to make the motion to approve 4

the application of Gal Nechemia. 5

CHAIR TARANTINO: 6

Second? 7

MR. FERRARA: 8

Second. 9

CHAIR TARANTINO: 10


Any opposed? 12


*** 14

Report of Committees – Enforcement Committee 15

[Joseph J. McGettigan, Industry Member, we reviewed 16

three applications prior to this meeting.] 17

*** 18

MR. MCGETTIGAN: 19

We reviewed three applications prior to 20

this meeting. I make the motion that we 21

approve with no barrier, the applicant 22

Stephen James Schmidt. 23

CHAIR TARANTINO: 24

Second? 25


24

MS. BARBIERI: 1

Second. 2

CHAIR TARANTINO: 3


Any opposed? 5


*** 7

MR. MCGETTIGAN: 8

I make a motion that the applications of 9

Amin Quadree Stovall and Robert Martin 10

Van Eck be preliminarily denied and to 11

advise the applicants of their right to 12

informal conferences. 13

CHAIR TARANTINO: 14

Second? 15

MS. CESTRA: 16

Second. 17

CHAIR TARANTINO: 18


Any opposed? 20


*** 22

MR. MCGETTIGAN: 23

I’d like to make the motion that the 24

application of Mark Joseph Brown be 25


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approved with no restrictions. 1

CHAIR TARANTINO: 2

Second? 3

MR. FERRARA: 4

Second. 5

CHAIR TARANTINO: 6


Any opposed? 8


*** 10

MR. MCGETTIGAN: 11

I make the motion that the application 12

of Frank Volpe be approved pending a new 13

broker letter. 14

CHAIR TARANTINO: 15

Second? 16

MS. BARBIERI: 17

Second. 18

CHAIR TARANTINO: 19


Any opposed? 21


*** 23

MR. MCGETTIGAN: 24

I’d like to make the motion that the 25


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applications of Brian Nelson Diehl, 1

Nicole Alexis Truchan, and Greta Angela 2

Styles be approved and their licenses 3

placed on probation through criminal 4

probation and/or payment of restitution. 5

CHAIR TARANTINO: 6

Second? 7

MS. BARBIERI: 8

Second. 9

CHAIR TARANTINO: 10


Any opposed? 12


*** 14

MR. MCGETTIGAN: 15

I make the motion that the application 16

of Ginger Siobhan Coleman be denied. 17

CHAIR TARANTINO: 18

Second? 19

MR. FERRARA: 20

Second. 21

CHAIR TARANTINO: 22


Any opposed? 24



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*** 1

Old/New Business – No Report 2

*** 3

[Joseph Tarantino, Chair, Industry Member, thanked 4

Acting Commissioner Johnson for attending the 5

meeting.} 6

*** 7

Adjournment 8

CHAIR TARANTINO: 9

Motion to adjourn. 10

MR. MCGETTIGAN: 11

So moved. 12

MS. BARBIERI: 13

Second. 14

CHAIR TARANTINO: 15

Thank you. 16


*** 18

[There being no further business, the State Real 19

Estate Commission Meeting adjourned at 3:37 p.m.] 20

*** 21

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CERTIFICATE 3

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I hereby certify that the foregoing summary 5

minutes of the State Real Estate Commission meeting, 6

was reduced to writing by me or under my supervision, 7

and that the minutes accurately summarize the 8

substance of the State Real Estate Commission meeting. 9

10

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12

Skyler Hope Wilson, 13

Minute Clerk 14

Sargent’s Court Reporting 15

Service, Inc. 16

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STATE REAL ESTATE COMMISSION 1 REFERENCE INDEX 2

3 4

April 30, 2019 5 6 7 TIME AGENDA 8 9 11:35 Official Call to Order 10 11 11:36 Roll Call 12

13 11:36 Pledge of Allegiance 14 15 11:36 Approval of Minutes 16 17 11:37 Report of Prosecutorial Division 18 19 11:45 Report of Commission Counsel 20 21 12:05 Report of Commission Chair 22 23 12:06 Report of Acting Commissioner 24 25 12:11 Report of Commission Administrator 26

27 12:15 Public Session 28 29 12:20 Executive Session 30 1:49 Return to Open Session 31 32 1:50 Formal Hearing – Russell W. Moss 33 2:23 34 35 2:23 Recess 36 2:26 Return to Open Session 37 38 2:27 Formal Hearing – John Paul Dougherty 39 2:42 40

41 2:42 Executive Session 42 3:25 Return to Open Session 43 44 3:25 Motions 45 46 3:31 Report of Committees 47 48 3:37 Adjournment 49 50

Documents

COMMONWEALTH OF PENNSYLVANIA · 3 *** 4 [Timothy A. Fritsch, Esquire, Commission Prosecutor, 5 presented the Consent Agreements for File No. 15-56-6 09772 and File Nos. 14-56-01583