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Re: Neologisms....
Hails Fredrik!
Some convincing suggestions there. We could go for a calque of the
Latinate "corporation", *leikous, mu (or yes, *ga-leikinassus,
although that sounds very much like `lekinessus' "healing", actually
spelt leikinassus' at L 9,15), but I personally would favour a more
internally self-explicable compound. How about something like: *ga-
waurki-hansa "profit company/band/cohort"? `hansa' is a cohort, a
body of men/soldiers in Gothic, but in Middle German was applied to
a group of people joined for business purposes, the Hanse (Hanseatic
League).
"Steam" -- well, weve got `milhma' "cloud". What are the oldestwords for mist and steam in German? We could have a German inspired
*damps, or a English/Dutch/Frisian inspired *staums, ma, or a Norse
+ German inspired *nibls, ma. Or *rauks, mi., whose cognates
mean "smoke" or "steam" (this has wide currency throughout the
Germanic lands). Or as Oscar suggests, Greek via Dutch inspired
*gas, a modern invented word. In fact, Oscar's compound idea would
be good for specific vapours:
wata-rauks, mi., *wata-nibls, ma. water vapour
sunna-stabi-rauks, mi. helium (sun-element-gas), see below...
*in-giba-nibls, ma, *aitra-rauks, mi. toxic vapour
Oscars suggestion, corrected to something along the lines of `midja-
aldeis', sounds good for the Middle Ages, which had feudal social
structures. As for the feudal system itself, Medieval
Latin `feudum', `feodum' is supposed to be of Germanic origin,
swaswe iudans unsar gemelida, but the exact etymology is
problematic.
under FEE, the Oxford English dictionary has:
"a. AF. fee, fie = OF. f, fi, *fiet (app. implied in fiez pl.),
fief, fieu, fiu, Pr. feo, feu, fieu, It. fio (prob. from Fr. or Pr.;
the Langobardic Lat. faderfium is a compound of Teut. fehu FEE n.1),
med.L. feodum, feudum (first cited by Du Cange from a charter of
Charles the Fat, A.D. 884), also fevum, feum, fedium, in Sicily
fegum.
The mutual relation of the various Romanic and med.L. forms is
somewhat obscure. According to some scholars, fief is a vbl. n. f.
fiever to grant in fee, f. fieu, which, as well as the other forms
of the n., descends from feodum or its Teut. source. The ultimateetymology is uncertain. A prevalent view is that the word is f. OHG.
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fehu cattle, property, money (= FEE n.1), + d wealth, property.
This must be rejected, because such an etymology could directly
yield no other sense than that of `movable property', which is very
remote from the sense of feodum as used in early records, viz.
usufruct granted in requital of service (often opposed to alodis,
originally meaning inheritance'); cf. the synonyms, Ger. lehen, OE.
laen (the same word as Eng. loan), and L. beneficium, i.e. something
granted to a subject by the kindness of his lord. A more tenable
theory is that the OF. fiu is an adoption of the Teut. fehu in the
contextual sense of `wages, payment for service'; the Rom. word
certainly had this meaning (see branch II below), and it is
conceivable that the feudal sense is a specific application of it.
The d of the L. forms, feudum, feodum, however, is left unexplained
by this hypothesis; some regard it as a euphonic insertion
(comparing It. chiodo nail from vulgar L. *clo-um from clavum);
others think that it is due to the analogy of allodium; and otherssuppose feudum to be a vbl. n. f. feudare = feum dare; but each of
these views involves serious difficulties. It is not impossible that
two originally distinct words may have been confused. A conjecture
proposed by Prof. Kern, and approved by some German jurists, is that
feodum represents an OHG. *fehd, related to the vb. fehn, which is
recorded only in the sense `to eat, feed upon', but is supposed on
etymological grounds to have had the wider meaning `to take for
one's enjoyment'. This would account fairly well for the sense, but
involves too much hypothesis to be accepted with confidence. It is
curious, if the word be of Teut. formation, that there is no direct
proof of its having existed in any Teut. language, nor is it found
even in the L. text of the Frankish laws."
From the last suggestion, we might get Got.
*fahous, mu. fief
*fahoisks, a. feudal.
For manufacture Ive been toying with the idea of: *handu-taui, -
waurstw "hand-work", *handu-taweins, -waukeins "hand-
making/working". But since the referrence to hands is just an
accident of Latin etymology, how about *ga-smions,
fi. "production, manufacture", from the attested verb `ga-smion'.
"Condition, stipulation", hmm, Im still pondering that one. To me
the word stipulation' implies not so much an agreement (gaqiss,
samaqiss, trausti, triggwa) as a demand (?) or requirement (Got.
aurfts) or a term that must be met. But looking now, I see that
the sense of an agreed term is given in dictionaries. Maybe that's
more of a specialised legal sense? I was thinking of ON kostr',
but then that's more of a term granted, I think, than arequirement. What other old Germanic words can we think of?
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Yes, 'andwairs' is "present", which might include "modern",
although I suppose the New Testament examples tend to contrast
present unpleasantness with future relief, whereas the English
word "modern" contrasts the present with the past. Maybe 'niujis'
would be a better fit in some contexts? Another possibility, 'nu'
used as an indeclinable adjective (albeit matching Greek NUN), as at
2Tim 4,10 'frijonds o nu ald' "loving the present age".
Your suggestion *andwaibjan, which sounds as if it could literally
mean "unwind", makes a plausible calque for "develop", "entwickeln",
etc. I would suggest that for the intransitive form, the reflexive
pronoun would normally follow the verb, thus: *andwaibjan sik. This
is the rule where the reflexive pronoun completes the sense of the
verb (where the verb would have a different meaning without it) or
where it just serves to make a verb intransitive, gafalh sik `hid(himself)'. The exceptional word order of 2Cor 12,10 'mis
galeikai' I suspect might be due to exceptional emphasis: "me, I
take pleasure in illnesses [unlike other apostles who brag about
more normal things like visions and revelations]". But reflexive
pronouns may come before the verb where they have a full meaning of
their own independent of the verb, corresponding to
English "themselves", etc. Even there though, they can follow the
verb if not emphatic: gawasida sik "dressed (clothed themselves)",
ataugidedum sik "appeared (showed themselves)". Compare:
ni uslaubjandein faur mel sik gahaban "not allowing himself to be
captured prematurely"
ungahabandans sik "without self-restraint, (morally) incontinent"
In the first example, 'gahaban' has its ordinary meaning, and 'sik'
is just reflexive. In the 2nd, 'sik' alters the meaning.
Other words meaning to grow: liudan, keinan, wahsjan.
element. Your *grundu-stoma seems a fair suggestion, as far as I
can see. Cf. also: uf stabim is fairhvaus "under the elements of
this world". Greek hUPO TA STOXEIA "under the letters" (which might
be what inspired this translation) or "under the elements", or
anything arranged in sequence. A Gothic marginal gloss
explains 'stabim' as 'tugglam', dat.pl. of *tuggl,
neuter--cognate with OE tungol "heavenly body", ON tungl "moon".
I can think of a few on you list for which Gothic words are attested
already:
form. laudi, fjo, hiwi, nja., farw, na?, galeiki, njaoppress. (persecute) wrikan, sv. V., wrakjan, wv. 1.; (oppress as
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troubles) ana-praggan, sv. VII.; (oppress, burden) kaurjan, wv. 1.;
(burden, weigh down with) af-hlaan, sv. VI.
oppression. (persecution) wraka, wrakja, sf., wrekei, wf.
discover. finan, III. (A Gothic word formed in a similar way to
the German 'entdecken' is 'andhuljan', which Wright glosses
as "uncover, disclose, reveal, open".)
Some more suggestions:
*boka-leisei, fin. literature.
*ga-maini-hansa, fo. collective.
*faihu-fasteis, mja. economist.
*faihu-leisei, fin. finance, economics.
*stoma-stafs (b), mi. chemical element.
*tuggla-fasteis, mja. astronomer.
*tuggla-leisei, fin. astronomy.*wisti-fasteis, mja. physicist.
*wisti-leisei, fin. physics.
*wisti-stafs (b), mi. elementary particle.
*wokra-hansa, fo. banking company.
Now you can write:
Skohsl Aiwropa hvotei, skohsl gamainduiskeins. Ainhvarjizuh
Aiwropos reike in weiha triggwa gagahaftida sik du usdreiban
unhulon o: Rumos papa, Russalandis kaisar, Maitairnih jah Gizo,
uswaltjands ana Fragkam, sahsiskai wardiferjans. Hvar ist sa
andstandanda hiuhma, ammei fram aim waldufni habandam andastajam
seinaim, ni gasakada bi, atei gamainduisks sijai?
Llama Nom
Re: Neologisms....
--- In gothic-l@yahoogroups.com , "Fredrik" wrote:
>
> My neologisms that you havent commented I guess you find quite
> awright...is that really so??????????
Yes, I liked ainfaljan, aihtilaus, etc. They seem very logical.
And I even learnt a new English word "gradate". Till now Ive only
known been familiar with the noun "gradation". I would just say
that 'usdaudei' already exists with the meaning "diligence", inother words, the quality of making an effort, taking pains/care over
http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/gothic-l/post?postID=KgdAkNXC_BdANoW4Kun50paKyQkyr1OgqcpZ3cygwcsW58TY88CKImdpH9l4k5Ecnl_L4hMlj2ygsMPhjH-phttp://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/gothic-l/post?postID=KgdAkNXC_BdANoW4Kun50paKyQkyr1OgqcpZ3cygwcsW58TY88CKImdpH9l4k5Ecnl_L4hMlj2ygsMPhjH-p8/22/2019 neolog
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something. In modern English, the usual meaning of "industry" is a
sector of the economy, especially production, but people now also
talk about "the service industry" (shops, etc.), the airline
industry (transport)--so any field of official paid (and taxed)
employment. In slighly more old-fashioned language, "industry" can
also be a personal quality, and it's still normal to use the
adjective "industrious", meaning "hard working", something pretty
close to "diligent". How about:
us-daudei, fin. diligence, zeal, "industry" in the sense of making
an effort and being hard working.
*ga-smions, fi. production, manufacturing industry.
? "industry" where it means a "sphere of employment, a sector of
the economy". Not sure about this last one. *waurstw-, *tawja-kuni, nja.? *ga-waurki-asts, fi.? Or something with -fera, -
gawi "zone, area" used in a metaphorical way. Or *ga-waurki-
kreitus "profit-sphere", or *tawja-kreitus "work/job/task-sphere"?
At least that's bizarre enough that it won't get confused with more
basic concepts.
Also, you might want to consider the declension of "guild". The OED
says:
"Several distinct formations from the same Teut. root have here
coalesced. (1) The forms within initial g, y prob. represent mainly
OE. gild, gyld, (ield) str. neut., recorded only twice in this
sense, but frequent in the senses `payment, compensation, offering,
sacrifice, worship, idol'; corresp. to OFris. geld, ield money, OS.
geld payment, sacrifice, reward, OHG. gelt payment, offering,
tribute, money (Du., G. geld, money), ON. giald payment, Goth. gild
tribute:OTeut. *geldom. (2) OE. had also gegyld str. neut., where
the prefix ge- (see Y- prefix) expresses the notion of combined or
collective action. This has not been found later than OE., but as
the prefix ge- regularly disappeared in substantives (cf. reeve) its
representative in the 14th c. would coincide with that of the simple
gyld. (3) The pronunciation with (g) must be due to adoption of, or
influence from, the ON. gildi str. neut. guild, guild-feast,
banquet, also payment, value (Sw. gille, Da. gilde guild):OTeut.
*gildjom.
In continental Teut. the sense of `guild' was expressed by a
fourth formation from the same root, repr. OTeut. type *gildjn- wk.
fem., and occurring as MLG., MDu. gilde fem. and neut. (Du. gild),
whence mod.G. gilde; in Carolingian Latin the word appears as
geldonia, gildonia, explained by confraternitas; the later med.Lat.form is gilda; OF. had gilde, ghelde, gheude, jode, etc., in the
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senses guild, band of foot-soldiers.'
The root *geld- in these derivatives is prob. to be taken in the
sense to pay, contribute', so that the n. would primarily mean an
association of persons contributing money for some common object.
As, however, the root also means `to sacrifice, worship', some have
supposed that guilds were so called as being combinations for
religious purposes, heathen or Christian.
The sense `member of a guild, guild-brother', was expressed by OE.
gylda and gegylda, MLG. gilde wk. masc.; the Teut. word appears in
med.L. as gild (also congild, congilda), and in OF. gelde, geldon
(with many variants), one of a company (gelde) of foot-soldiers."
Which leaves us a few possibilities for Gothic, such as:
*ga-gild, na. (as in OE, medieval Latin)
*ga-gild(a?), fo.? (medieval Latin)*(ga)gildi, nja. (as in ON)
*gildjo, fon. (as in continental Germanic)
And for a guild member: ga-gilda (male), ga-gildo (female).
>
> > If you look at the examples, 'finan' seems to be more
restricted
> > than English "find". 'finan' has the sense of discovering
> > information, coming to know, or learning (finding out) a
> > fact. 'fan' and 'ufkunnaida' both translate Greek 'egnw' "came
to
> > know, learnt, discovered (information)". The more general sense
> > of "find" (e.g. find an object or encounter a person, also
discover
> > someone to be something) is covered by 'bi-gitan'.
> In the texte the sentence was to discover America...is it ok with
> finthan there?
Oh, in that case, I would go with 'bigitan'. 'finan' is discover
only in the sense of learning information, e.g. if you "discovered
*that* America extists", that is if someone tells you about it or
you read about it. But for physically finding the continent itself,
I would expect 'bigitan'.
By the way, a much rarer sense of English "discover" appears in
Chess terminology: "discovered check", where a piece moves out ofthe way, allowing another piece that was behind it to put the enemy
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king in check. This is more like "uncover, reveal", 'and-huljan'.
> > > I guess that it doesn't takes a
> > genius to understand what I'm tryin to do...at least Llama Nom
have
> > figured it out :)
> >
> >
> > Yes, even me!
> >
> I hope you didnt missunderstood me!
No, just teasing ;)
LN
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