Kelly SmithInterview with a Second Language Learner

Christos Lymberopolous is the Acting General Manager and Director at Armstrong

Pharmaceuticals, Inc. Armstrong Pharmaceuticals is a specialty pharmaceutical com-

pany working in the development, manufacture and marketing of aerosols focused on

pharmaceutical products, primarily in the area of inhaled respiratory drugs. Christos

was born in Athens, Greece where his primary language was Greek. While attending

school in Greece, Christos became proficient in the English language, eventually mov-

ing to the United States and enrolling in a PhD program at the University of Massachu-

setts-Boston. I met Christos several years ago when our daughters attended the same

childcare facility in the town we both currently live in. I am appreciative that he gra-

ciously accepted my request to learn more about this educational and cultural back-

ground. Although Christos was educated in English while living in Greece, I was able to

learn about his experience in formal schooling, as well as the transition he experienced

moving to the United States.

Kelly: Let’s begin with you telling me about yourself? Where were you born, and

what was your Primary Language at home? What language or languages did your par-

ents speak and in what context?

Christos: I was born in Athens, Greece. My primary language at home was

Greek. Both my parents spoke Greek. My father had studied English in his school years

and could still speak, read and write basic English later in life. He would not use the lan-

guage unless interacting with English speaking people.

Kelly: Can you tell me about your educational background? Where and when did

you first begin school and what language or languages were spoken in class?

Christos: I started school in 1977 in Athens, Greece. The primary language spo-

ken in class was Greek.

Kelly: At what age did you begin to learn English? Was it in school or at home?

Christos: I started learning English in 2nd Grade, at elementary school. I also

started taking lessons at home and then at an English Language school.

Kelly: I have been learning about different program models used for teaching a

second language. If I described some of these programs would you be able to tell me

which type of program if any that your school may have participated in? (Since his edu-

cation took place in Greece, I described a few bilingual programs that may have been

used to teach English; Transitional Bilingual Program, Developmental Bilingual Pro-

gram, Dual Language Program.)

Christos: There were no specific programs. English was taught as any other

class. All other classes were taught in Greek.

Kelly: Can you provide any details about the teacher, students, curriculum and

the amount of instruction provided in English and your native language?

Christos: Most of the English class(es) in Greece were taught by Greeks who

had studied the language in a Greek University and had graduated with a degree in

English. There were also a small percentage of teachers that were from abroad (mainly

England). Those could only teach in private English Language schools or work as tu-

tors. English classes whether at school or in a private setting, included spelling, mean-

ing of words, grammar, writing, speaking, reading and listening comprehension. Instruc-

tion was provided mainly in Greek.

Kelly: Was it a public school that you attended? Was English a standard class for

all grades beginning in second grade continuing to high school?

Christos: I attended a private elementary school and then public middle/high

school. English was not a standard class for grades 2-6. Each grade had its own cur-

riculum. In my middle/high school years I was taught English in a private English Lan-

guage school. At the M/HS we were taught French instead.

Kelly: Was the expectation that all students would be bilingual or biliterate? If so,

at what grade?

Christos: There was an expectation that students had to receive a passing grade

for every and all classes (including foreign language) to advance to the next grade. I re-

member examples of students that failed to advance to a higher M/HS grade because

they failed French.

Kelly: You mentioned instruction was from a teacher with a degree in English, did

this instructor teach only English or did you have the same instructor for all subjects?

Christos: The instructor taught only English.

Kelly: In elementary school when you started learning English did any of your

peers already speak English in class, or were you all at similar levels of English profi-

ciency?

Christos: There were very few students that had some basic knowledge. By that,

I mean they already knew a few words and basic phrases: “my name is….”, “this is a

dog”, etc. We all caught up with them fairly quickly.

Kelly: Did you have homework in English? Since your father spoke English, was

he able to help?

Christos: Yes, we had homework and since I was attending the English language

school on top of my elementary school, homework was double. My father was helping

me in the early grades. I became self efficient early in elementary school and preferred

studying by myself.

Kelly: I have a few questions about your English classes, if you can remem-

ber….I can’t remember any of this from elementary school! I’d like to describe a few tra-

ditional methods used in teaching a second language, and if you would you say your in-

struction in English fit into any of them? I’m hoping to learn about any lessons, activities,

strategies, techniques and material that were used to help you to learn English, and

how effective these lessons were.

(I went on to describe the Audio-lingual method, which Christos recognized as being

used, but not as the primary technique. “Oh yes…” he recalled the Grammar-translation

method. He remembers using Communicative Language Teaching but found it to be un-

successful because of “embarrassment and ridicule from the fellow classmates” when

students would try to have conversations in English. “ It was much more effective when

the interaction and conversation was between students and an English teacher, prefer-

ably one from England.” Content-based instruction was never used.)

Kelly: How easy or difficult was it to develop literacy skills in English?

Christos: It was somewhat easy. English grammar is much simpler than Greek

and quite a few English words have Greek roots so it was even easier to understand.

Also, “thinking in English” is very similar to “thinking in Greek”. That helped a lot.

I learned English in Greece. By the time I moved to the US at the age of 26, I could al-

ready speak, read and write fluently. Or so I thought. When I moved to Boston I had a

fairly hard time communicating with people. There were significant differences in cul-

ture, accent, use of idioms and phrases. Similarly, it was difficult for me to follow TV

shows and movies without using closed captions.

At the same time I enrolled in a PhD program at UMass Boston. Although I could easily

understand the text books, I could not easily follow the lectures. Keeping notes became

an impossible task so I started taping the lectures. That helped although not all profes-

sors approved my practice. The hardest part was when I had to do my own presenta-

tions as part of my PhD program or when teaching a Laboratory as a Teaching Assis-

tant. Both of these were taking place in front of an audience with superior English lan-

guage skills than mine. Those were probably a few of the most uncomfortable situations

I ever found myself in. Those same situations though and similar ones at my work,

forced me to get better.

I stopped using CC when watching TV, I would ask questions when I didn’t understand

something, I would read the newspaper and I would listen to the radio on my long com-

mute to work. NPR, Kiss 108 and WBZ1030, all proved to be a great school for me.

Kelly: Looking back on how you felt about when you first moved to Boston and

the difficulty you experienced with communication. What do you think you or instructors

could have done to have made this less of an obstacle?

Christos: I could have used more exposure to every day English probably

through casual conversations with the English teacher (you know, the one from Eng-

land….) and assignments that would have been more fun to complete and would not

look as another boring homework. For example, watch a movie without captions and

then write a report, talk about it in class or even answer written questions. This is proba-

bly something I could have done in my own too.

Kelly: Did you ever have to take any high-stake tests? How did you feel about

them?

Christos: After years of studying, knowledge of the English language was certi-

fied through an exam sponsored by Cambridge University, known as Cambridge Eng-

lish: First (FCE). I had earned that certificate before moving to Boston. I had also taken

a similar test offered by Oxford University. I personally did not like them. They were

very similar to the final exams taken by today’s students. The final course grade was

calculated using the average of the three semesters and that final exam. I was in the top

5% of my class so passing or failing a class was not an issue. On the other hand I

wanted to make sure my grades remained high since the overall grade from each HS

year counted towards the SAT score (a bit complicated school system). Still, having to

study hard right before the summer vacation for the sole purpose of taking a test was in-

effective and plain torture. I had spent an entire year studying, doing homework, dealing

with assignments and taking exams that all proved (or not) how knowledgeable I was on

a certain subject and class. Taking another exam at the end of the school year looked

totally administrative and had no educational benefits.

Kelly: Are there any other comments or observations you would like to mention

about your experience learning a second language?

Christos: The problem I see is that getting the certificate was the primary goal for

all students studying English, or any other foreign language. This is what you needed to

have to put on your future resume, this is what the parents were paying tuition for to the

English school, this is how the success of the English school itself was measured. To

achieve that, teaching focused on preparing students to pass an exam rather than

learning a language that they could use comfortably in a restaurant or at the grocery

store or at work by the water cooler discussing deflatefgate with their colleagues…...

Receiving that certificate works great when you apply for a job or seeking admission to

a college in England or USA but it does not prepare you for the every day interactions.

Although my transition period was not all that bad when comparing to other people I met

throughout the years, it still allowed for a few memorable moments that I could have

done without. When you are watching tv and someone asks “what’s on?” they do not

mean the coffee table. And when you want to compliment someone in public for offering

you good advise you do NOT call them a “wise guy”….

As Christos described his educational experience in learning English as a Sec-

ond language, I was able to make several connections with the theories learned in

class. The interview allowed me the opportunity to gain insights on his overall positive

experience, but also recognize the obstacles he needed to overcome. It is important to

acknowledge that his acquisition took over 8 years of actual English instruction in a pri-

vate school setting, and still he did not feel competent. English was taught using pri-

mary language instruction. It is clear that Christos and his family valued education and

that learning English was of great importance to them. He was also able to receive

some help in English at home from his father. I am left with the impression that the Eng-

lish instructors who were native English speakers were preferred over native Greek

speakers. Instruction sounded more traditional in the sense that some of his lessons

were viewed as habit formation through dialogue memorization and drills focused on a

particular language structure. Christos humorously recalled memorizing rules for gram-

mar and translating between Greek and English.

Although Christos became very competent in reading comprehension, it was the

oral proficiency and listening comprehension that caused him difficulty. As Horwitz

(2013) explains, whenever we listen, the words themselves are not the only source of

meaning. Christos mentioned that his initial submersion into a new culture impaired his

ability to use the language he had learned. Socioculturalists refer to communicative

competence as having the ability to know a language in a way that allows effective and

appropriate communication with other speakers of the language. It seems that the al-

though he had vocabulary and grammar, there was a struggle with issues related to

pragmatics and sociolinguistics.

In chapter 7, Wright (2015) noted that oral language is invisible and once it is

spoken that utterance is gone forever. In a real-life conversation an ELL cannot pause,

look up the meaning of a word or erase a mistake once it is spoken. As Christos men-

tioned taping his lectures he provide his own accommodation in making instruction at-

tainable while finding another opportunity for listening. Listening comprehension tasks

would most likely proven to be a helpful strategy throughout his education. Christos

mentioned that watching a movie and responding to it would have been productive task

to complete. This is a great example providing natural listening experience in which lan-

guage is provided in context and the use of visual clues with oral language conveys

meaning.

I though about Christos when he remembered giving presentations in college,

and how the different types of speech activities that we participate in have unwritten

norms that are known by native speakers. It was evident that this situation led him to

feel uncomfortable and insecure with his linguistic ability. Christos recognized that he

could have used more practice with oral language. There is little research on how in-

struction could promote the aspects of oral language development despite its impor-

tance. Also, it is an area of language that as in Christos’ situation, does not get included

on high-stakes tests. Perhaps if his language teachers did allow for more communicat-

ing in class and found ways to lower the affective filter, students in Christos’ English

classes would have benefited from the experience.