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SHPANCER, Talma RG50.427*0003 June 1996 [One audiotape] Abstract Talma Shpancer (formerly Rena Deutch) came from a middle class family living comfortably in Belgrade. Her father, Atso, was born in Budapest, Hungary and worked as a traveling merchant in Serbia. After the bombardment of Belgrade on April 16, 1941, Rena’s family (her father Atso, her mother Matilda Levi, and her younger sister, Elvira) fled the city in her father’s car. They went to Berchivitch, where her father arranged to stay in the house of Shavitch, a business connection. Later, the father found a better location, the house of the Shtokovitch family, 2 kilometers from the road. They did not have to wear yellow badges and they moved freely about the village, although the villagers knew that the family was Jewish. In April 1942, someone betrayed the family. The gendarmes entered the house and arrested Rena’s parents and sister. Radmela, the 11yearold daughter of the Shtokovitch family, following her mother’s instructions, grabbed Rena and took her to another house, and hid her under a bed. Rena lived with the Shtokovitch family until the end of the war, when she was taken by the Jewish Community of Belgrade to a Jewish orphanage. She remained there until 1949, when the Jewish orphans were taken to Israel. Her parents were executed in Yanitsa, along with other Jews and Serbian partisans. Tape 1 of 1, Side A 000 Statement by Interviewer, Jasa Almuli, journalist from Belgrade. Maiden Name: Rena Deutch, born in Belgrade, Yugoslavia (now Serbia) in 1937. Rena was hidden by two servant peasant families until the liberation. In 1948, she emigrated to Israel. She lives in Rehovoth on Weitzman St. She is married with three children and three grandchildren. 015 Rena had a younger sister, Elvira. Her father’s name was Atso. He was born in Budapest, Hungary, a traveling merchant who sold dyes in Serbia. 034 Her mother was Matilda Levi, a housewife from Belgrade. They were a middle class family and did not live in the old Jewish quarters. Rena does not remember the (family, neighborhood?) religious life. 067 She remembers the bombardment of Belgrade on April 6, 1941. The father, who owned a car, drove the family, mother, Rena, and Elvira out of Belgrade. 078 He drove the family to the village of Berschevitch. The father had a business connection named Shavitch, who was a shopkeeper. He knew the family was Jewish. He provided the whole family with room to stay. The other villagers knew that the family was Jewish. 101 They did not wear a yellow badge. 102 Rena did not know whether the family was registered. 110 The father managed to find a better location. The Shtokovitch family agreed to let Rena’s family stay in their house, which was 2 kilometers from the road. http://collections.ushmm.org Contact [email protected] for further information about this collection This is a verbatim transcript of spoken word. It is not the primary source, and it has not been checked for spelling or accuracy.

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Page 1: USHMM Finding Aid · bombardment of Belgrade on April 16, 1941, Rena’s family (her father Atso, her mother Matilda Levi, and her younger sister, Elvira) fled the city in her father’s

SHPANCER, Talma 

RG‐50.427*0003 

June 1996 

[One audiotape] 

Abstract 

 

Talma Shpancer (formerly Rena Deutch) came from a middle class family living comfortably in Belgrade.  

Her father, Atso, was born in Budapest, Hungary and worked as a traveling merchant in Serbia.  After the 

bombardment of Belgrade on April 16, 1941, Rena’s family (her father Atso, her mother Matilda Levi, 

and her younger sister, Elvira) fled the city in her father’s car.  They went to Berchivitch, where her 

father arranged to stay in the house of Shavitch, a business connection.  Later, the father found a better 

location, the house of the Shtokovitch family, 2 kilometers from the road.  They did not have to wear 

yellow badges and they moved freely about the village, although the villagers knew that the family was 

Jewish.  In April 1942, someone betrayed the family.  The gendarmes entered the house and arrested 

Rena’s parents and sister.  Radmela, the 11‐year‐old daughter of the Shtokovitch family, following her 

mother’s instructions, grabbed Rena and took her to another house, and hid her under a bed.  Rena 

lived with the Shtokovitch family until the end of the war, when she was taken by the Jewish Community 

of Belgrade to a Jewish orphanage. She remained there until 1949, when the Jewish orphans were taken 

to Israel.  Her parents were executed in Yanitsa, along with other Jews and Serbian partisans. 

 

Tape 1 of 1, Side A 

 

000  Statement by Interviewer, Jasa Almuli, journalist from Belgrade. 

Maiden Name:  Rena Deutch, born in Belgrade, Yugoslavia (now Serbia) in 1937. 

Rena was hidden by two servant peasant families until the liberation.  In 1948, she emigrated to 

Israel.  She lives in Rehovoth on Weitzman St.  She is married with three children and three 

grandchildren. 

015  Rena had a younger sister, Elvira.  Her father’s name was Atso.  He was born in Budapest, 

Hungary, a traveling merchant who sold dyes in Serbia. 

034  Her mother was Matilda Levi, a housewife from Belgrade.  They were a middle class family and 

did not live in the old Jewish quarters.  Rena does not remember the (family, neighborhood?) 

religious life. 

067  She remembers the bombardment of Belgrade on April 6, 1941. The father, who owned a car, 

drove the family, mother, Rena, and Elvira out of Belgrade. 

078  He drove the family to the village of Berschevitch.  The father had a business connection named 

Shavitch, who was a shopkeeper.  He knew the family was Jewish.  He provided the whole family 

with room to stay.  The other villagers knew that the family was Jewish. 

101  They did not wear a yellow badge. 

102  Rena did not know whether the family was registered. 

110  The father managed to find a better location.  The Shtokovitch family agreed to let Rena’s family 

stay in their house, which was 2 kilometers from the road. 

http://collections.ushmm.org Contact [email protected] for further information about this collection

This is a verbatim transcript of spoken word. It is not the primary source, and it has not been checked for spelling or accuracy.

Page 2: USHMM Finding Aid · bombardment of Belgrade on April 16, 1941, Rena’s family (her father Atso, her mother Matilda Levi, and her younger sister, Elvira) fled the city in her father’s

117  The names of the Shtokovitch family: Dragutin Shtokovitch and his wife, Jivka—no children; 

Dragisha, Dragutin’s brother, and his wife, Melia, and their children Radmela (a girl born in 

1931) and Radonia (a boy).  Dragisha was in Germany, a prisoner of war for five years. 

150  In the village, the family moved around freely and Rena attended school there.  Her father 

traveled to Belgrade sometimes.  There was plenty of food. 

183  In April 1942, uniformed men with rifles came. It was not clear whether they were Nazis or 

“gendarmes.”  It was not clear how many there were, but they filled the yard.  They took Rena’s 

family ‐‐ someone had betrayed them. 

212  The situation was hysterical.  Early in the morning, Rena’s father took her aside and gave her 

instructions, which she does not remember now.  

223  Her mother pleaded with Melia, Radmela’s mother, to help save her daughter Rena.  Radmela 

took Rena out of the house.  They ran to another part of the village, to another house, and she 

hid her under a bed. 

230  A local villager confirmed that all the members of Rena’s family were present (which was not 

true because Rena was missing).   In doing so, he saved Rena’s life. His name is not known. 

281  At the time of the interview, Rena visited Koka, a member of the Shavitch family (Koka is their 

nickname.) Her married name is Midivoyevitch, first name Miloyka. She lives in the (?) area. 

312  Koka, who was much older than Rena, told her that she used to go to Belgrade with Rena’s 

father to help him buy supplies.  She also described Rena’s mother as an elegant, tall women 

and her father as a very nice man.  Rena was happy to hear Koka talk about her parents, 

because Rena does not remember them. 

330  Rena visited the house of the Shtokovitch family. It is abandoned now.  The house belongs now 

to Nada, Radonia’s wife, who lives in Belgrade.  In this abandoned house, Rena found certain 

items that belonged to her family that the Shtokovitch family kept. These were embroidered 

tablecloths, silverware, and materials to repair socks. 

372  Interviewer’s comments: Ex‐Rena, now Talma, accompanied by her husband, Avi, and her son, 

Aviv, went to visit Berchivitch, in search of the people who saved her. 

400  Rena lived with the Shtokovitch family.  No one talked to her about her parents.  She began to 

think that she never had parents.  The Shtokovitch family changed her name to Rushka 

Shtokovitch.  She resumed going to school half a year later and moved freely about the village.  

The Shtokovitch family took her to the church.  Everyone knew she was Jewish.  She lived like a 

village child.  Melia was particularly affectionate with Rena. 

544  In 1945, representatives of the Jewish Community in Belgrade came to the village.  They found 

Rena, and asked the Shtokovitch family to let her go.  Members of the Shtokovitch family 

brought her to Belgrade to a Jewish orphanage. 

 

Tape 1 of 1, Side B 

 

000  Rena lived at the Home for Jewish Orphans in Belgrade from 1945‐1949. There were 

approximately 50 children in the orphanage. As a small child, she knew that she came from the 

Deutch family, but had no Jewish identity.   

http://collections.ushmm.org Contact [email protected] for further information about this collection

This is a verbatim transcript of spoken word. It is not the primary source, and it has not been checked for spelling or accuracy.

Page 3: USHMM Finding Aid · bombardment of Belgrade on April 16, 1941, Rena’s family (her father Atso, her mother Matilda Levi, and her younger sister, Elvira) fled the city in her father’s

040  In 1949, she learned about her parents when an aunt, sister of her mother, came from (?) to 

visit her. 

071  Rena’s parents and her little sister were executed in a prison called Banitsa in Belgrade on April 

17, 1942.  The names of all the people executed there have been catalogued in a book. 

080  The prisoners were handed over to the SS who transported them to Yanitsa, a village 12 

kilometers from Belgrade, where the Germans were executing Serbian patriots, partisans, and 

Jews they found in Serbia.  It was the place where they threw the remains of gassed men, 

women, and children killed in the Semlin Jewish camp in Belgrade.   100,000 people are buried 

there. 

099  In 1949, the children were dispersed among Jewish families, and from there they were taken to 

Israel by a boat named Radnik.  Tito’s Yugoslavia was the only Eastern European country to let 

Jews emigrate to Israel.  There were three trips from Yugoslavia to the port of Haifa. 

119  Rena was taken through the “Aliyat Hanoar” youth immigration agency to Kibbutz Ma’abarot, 

between Netanya and Hadera.  She stayed there until 1953, when she was drafted in the Israeli 

army.  After the army, she moved to Kibbutz Nahshon where she met her husband, Avi 

Shpancer.  They lived in the Kibbutz until 1988. 

163  Talma’s husband was born in Poland in 1936.  In 1939, when the Germans invaded, he escaped 

with his family to Russia.  His father served in the Red Army until 1945.  After the war, the family 

returned to Poland in Silesia.  In 1950, the family emigrated legally to Israel.  

223  Avi gives his impressions of Rena (Talma) and her family about the village Berschivitch, and 

about the villagers.  Talma wanted to forget this part of her life.  But now she is happy that she 

visited this place and its people.  It was a very exciting and emotional experience.  She wanted 

her children to know her story. 

261  The people in Berschivitch remembered her, especially her classmates. 

283  Talma recommended to Yad Vashem that the Shtokovitch family be honored as Righteous 

Gentiles. 

292  Talma’s son Aviv says that for the first time in his life he learned the whole story of his mother’s 

survival, and met the people who knew her as a child. 

http://collections.ushmm.org Contact [email protected] for further information about this collection

This is a verbatim transcript of spoken word. It is not the primary source, and it has not been checked for spelling or accuracy.