Supplement Workbook to the Lt

8/20/2019 Supplement Workbook to the Lt

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03-15-07 04:52 AM

Quote from Hedge22:

I have ordered the Logical trader, but not recieved it yet, I a! ondering i" !o#eone could

an!er a $uic% $ue!tion or to&

'an you have #ulti(le )A u() brea%out!, !o i" it get! to #y A (oint, then later co#e! bac%

in #y *+, then goe! to #y A again, doe! i!her !ay that i! another buy .i#ilarly 'an u

have a 2nd )' u(/don) or u(/dn !aying you get a ' u( but it rever!e! again later in

the day&

han%! "or the hel(, i "ound the "ir!t cha(ter o" the boo% (o!ted online "or anyone not

"a#iliar ith it&

htt(://#b"cc&co#/boo%/Logicalrader&&&t'ha(ter*ne&(d"

First of all, there is no "E". Second, the A levels are not triggers. They are simply levels whereyou would be bullish above the A up once confirmed and bearish below the A down once

confirmed. So no, you can't mae multiple A ups and downs as they are not used that way.

Also, a little fyi for ya, the boo is meant to be a guide to forming your own A! strategy. The

material in the boo is #ust the foundation. $f you simply read the boo and follow it, you will getilled.

03-15-07 05:54 AM

Quote from Bernoulli:

I te!ted A' ith hi!torical data (robably only to or three year! o" (rice! a "e year!

ago u!ing i!her! (ara#eter! and it didnt (er"or# ell& 6oever, Ive been u!ing the

conce(t! behind A' "or year! ell be"ore i!her! boo% or even 'rabel! ca#e out and

they "or# the core o" ho I "ra#e the trading day&

%es, we did the same. &e completely broe it down and rebuilt the strategy to fit inde( futures

precisely and believe to have bar none the best adaptive strategy to trade inde( futures. So much

so that $'m actually getting an endorsement from Fisher himself. )reat guy.

03-1-07 08:15 9M

Quote from Sponger:

Maveric%74, care to e(lain hat you #ean a little "urther by you bro%e it don and re-

engineered

&ell for starters, the method Fisher outlined in his boo, "The *ogical Trader" is #ust a

foundation of A!. $t's not a strategy. $t was never meant to be read, copied and traded. $n fact,

http://mbfcc.com/book/LogicalTraderExcerptChapterOne.pdfhttp://mbfcc.com/book/LogicalTraderExcerptChapterOne.pdf


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05-02-07 08:33 9M

Quote from chud:

.ee#! li%e the #ethod outlined in the boo% relie! heavily on o(ening range high and lolevel! acting a! !u((ort and re!i!tance& Are you !aying your ver!ion o" the !y!te# doe!nt

u!e the o(ening range

7o, in the boo he does not say that. 0e says that the 8 is statistically significant. And he uses

the high and low of the 8 as his stop999 They are not used as support or resistance. 0e uses

those levels to determine bias.

ur version of A! does the same thing. $t does not use those levels as support or resistance, we

create a bias from the 8 and use the 8 levels for stops.

05-04-07 04:47 AM A>'6*+ 9*.

$ #ust don:t get what everyone's taling about here. The boo outlines a trading strategy that mayor may not have an edge. The boo doesn't give an e(act system with defined parameters that

must be followed in order to archive success. For someone to say that A! hasn't wored lately,

what does that mean6 &hat 8 are you taling about6 The boo never states a specific 8 timethat must always be used. $n the boo /ar gives e(amples of people who use 8 ranges from

one minute to si(ty minutes. ;nless one is testing 8 timeframes from one minute up through

two hours or more, how do you now it's not woring6

Furthermore, his boo is very unspecific when it comes to profit e(its. 0e never says close after

< number of points, or close at the end of the day. $n fact, he even outlines the possibility of

holding over night. 0e also shows how the 8 range could be used for longerterm trades =15days>.

0ow could anyone say A! isn't woring6 /aybe someone is using a one minute 8 with theirown A levels as an entry point with profit e(it of 5 points, or ? @ 8, or any number of e(it

combinations. /aybe someone is using a two hour 8 with 12 AT8 as their A level and

e(iting profitable trades based on a /A.

The boo ;T*$7ES a strategyB it does not state a specific trading program. 0ow one uses the

strategy is completely personal. 0ow do people mae blanet statements about A! not

woring6 $'m asing honestly. $ really want to now. id $ miss something in the boo6

05-04-07 05:00 AM

Anchor, great post. %ou are not missing anything. %ou are one of the few on here that gets it.

There are so many combinations and permutations of A!, there are endless combinations of

trades that can be taen. For someone to say it doesn't wor anymore is completely asinine. That


5/19

is lie saying, no one is maing money trading futures right now, futures trading doesn't wor

anymore.

05-04-07 03:55 9M

Quote from optioncoach:

?ou %no I a# a big "an, but ye!terday! o(en a! 132@7 and the lo and high "or the day

a! a range o" 13230 to the don!ide 37 (oint! and 132@ to the u(!ide 18 (oint!&


6/19

Quote from AAAintheBeltway:

I acce(t hat youre !aying, but I dont !ee ho it tran!late! into i!her being a great guy&

y(ical !na%e oil ri( o"" !ound! #ore li%e it& ?ou !ee# to be !aying the boo% (lu! hatever

he !ell! ith hi! !ervice i! (retty #uch u!ele!! unle!! one i! %noledgeable enough tocon!truct a trading !y!te# around it& hat doe!nt !ur(ri!e #e at all, a! I !aid early on that

an *+ b/o !y!te# ould never be (ro"itable ece(t in a ild #ar%et& ?et everyone !ee#!

univer!ally to thin% that i!her i! in "act a great guy, !o I# trying to under!tand it&

he conce(t o" buying !trength and !elling ea%ne!! i! not eactly roc%et !cience nor did

i!her di!cover it& he conce(t o" u!ing "ilter!, ti#e and (rice, to $uali"y b/o! ha! al!o been

around "orever& 9eo(le ere u!ing the daily (ivot! long be"ore i!her a((eared& .o hat

eactly i! !o groundbrea%ing and u!e"ul about hatever he i! !elling I# not attac%ing

hi#, Ive never had any contact ith hi# or u!ed hi! !ervice, I# ;u!t curiou!&

Fisher being a great guy is pretty well nown. The guy is very generous with his time and hismoney. 0e has the longest running internship at the 7%/E< for ids in high school and college

to offer them the opportunity to see what trading is lie including disadvantaged ids.

0e holds an A! seminar usually once every year or two and donates all the proceeds to charity.

0e doesn't hoc his services anywhere on T or in trading publications, in fact, the guy doesn'teven do interviews. 0e is completely stays out of the limelight.

The guy has made more careers at the 7%/E< then other human being probably in the history

of any e(change.

These are some of the reasons why $ say he is a great guy. oes this guy really strie you as a

snae oil salesman6 7ot to me he doesn't.

0is system is not #ust about buying strength and selling weaness. $t's actually pretty involved.

And some of his macro stuff is the best stuff $ have ever seen. 0is numberline concept is genius.-T&, Fisher is not a breaout trader and his system is not a breaout system lie most 8

systems are. $ would highly recommend you read his boo. $ don't mind sharing what $ have

learned from his boo and from him with other people provided they have at least read the boo

and watched some of his online video seminars he has done and provided you have a genuineinterest in learning what he does.

05-04-07 0:5@ 9M

Quote from AAAintheBeltway:

I# certainly not trying to attac% i!her& 6e doe! !ound li%e a great guy& 9erha(! I !hould

read hi! boo%& I# ondering ho hi! a((roach di""er! "ro# ony 'rabel, ho (retty

#uch rote the boo% on *+ trading&


7/19

It! "unny, but I alay! had heard that the >?M a! "ull o" !o#e o" the or!t, #o!t

corru(t (eo(le you ould ever !tand net to in a trading (it& ?et i!her i! a great guy, and

ric =olling certainly !ee#! to be& o ece(tion! or a! I ;u!t rong

The 7%/E< is pretty bad in general as is the A/E


8/19

"loor&

A' i! ba!ically orthle!! IM* "or any o""-"loor trader& It! al!o a cy(her "or "loor trader!&

Bu!t be on the bid in !trong #ar%et!, and on the o""er in ea% one!& ade !enti#ent

etre#e! once !to(! get triggered& Cno hen a #ar%et order i! al#o!t done, then "ade the

order& hat! (retty #uch it&

$ have met with /ar Fisher and have been to his trading floor at the 7%/Eo I do thin% that i!cher ha! !o#e good overall trading advice e&g& %no here you are

rong& 6oever, it i! #i!leading "or anyone to (retend that !i#(ly u!ing the A' #ethod

i! going to give the# any %ind o" edge& It! a%in to 9aul udor Bone! reco##ending lliot


9/19

I thin% i!her! boo% i! "anta!tic& o !ee ho a (ro "ocu!e! !o inten!ely on a "airly ba!ic

#ethod and tea%! it to #a%e it (ro"itable i! hat trading i! all about&

"The *ogical Trader" is one of the better trading boos out there. 7ot because it provides some

holy grail, but because the boo lays the groundwor for the basic mechanics in trading.

$ highly recommend viewing the 3 hours of live video's Fisher did at the 7%/E< from ?22.

That has to be one of the more entertaining lectures $ have ever seen on trading.

05-07-0 05:52 AM

Quote from limitdown:

hen there ere no (re-#ar%et trading '>! or globe arrange#ent!, then ort! o(ening

range trade! ere hugely !igni"icant, along ith the ***! o(ening only order! !trategy&

!ince the ability to o""!et trade! or (a!!ing the boo%, a! e u!ed to call it global trading

"ro# one #a;or "inancial ca(ital to another around the orld engage in trade! ell be"ore

the o(ening, then the rando# al% beco#e! a ell trodden (ath,

o(ening ga( theory ha! al!o "allen to the!e 24hour trading #ethod! and no longer ha! the

!a#e i#(act it u!ed to have&

thi! i!nt to !ay that the!e #ethod! do not !till have i#(act, ;u!t that they are no longer a!

hugely !igni"icant a! they once ere&

*et me offer a counter argument. True, you can trade around the cloc now, but that still does not

change the fact that a significant amount of li+uidty still trades withing the 8. Sure spoos tradeall night, but no where near the li+uidity you see between IJ2 and 4J22 central time. Same goes

for stocs. The other issue you are missing is options. ptions do not trade around the cloc. And

a good ma#ority of paper flows through the first ?2 minutes of 8T0. This has a significant impacton the 8.

And also, Fisher has had a lot of success trading currencies, and they trade around the cloc

obviously. 0e uses the home country for the 8. The levels wor great, even though in theory,the marets never really close during the wee.

*et me also add that $ have found that A! levels wor great on the inde( futures using theEuropean hours as the 8 time. $ have found that the 8 and the A levels are also significant

during ;S 8T0.

12-30-0 05:58 9M

$ have spent the ma#ority of the last ? years woring on the A! approach to trading. $ have

taen Fisher's method apart and rebuilt it to suit both inde(, stoc, and currency trading. $ have


10/19

met with /ar and was going to go into business with him and my business partner to start an

A! mentorship program.

As many of you now, $ run a prop group in !hicago and was getting tired of traders blowing out

and losing money. Teaching new guys A! was a very methodical and disciplined approach to

trading. $ would not teach guys anything else.

The mentorship program never really too off because as $ discovered it taes an immense

amount of time on teach guy to really get them to be a sucessful trader. As the old saying goes,you can't teach discipline.

$ am proud to say the two guys that $ really spent a lot of time with teaching the method to, one

has turned into an e(cellent trader who is profitable, the other is a breaeven trader. That guy is aformer engineer in his 2's though with no trading e(perience.

ver the last two years, my partner and $ have spent a lot of time building on the A!

methodology. /y partner deserves all the credit for the software he developed for it onTradeStation which $ believe is second to none.

7ow before people start asing +uestions about how we are maing it wor and what we are

doing, let me #ust say that we have spent way too much time developing this to #ust chat about it

on message boards. $'m not trying to be a pric about it, $ #ust don't want to go into details aboutit here.

&e chose to #ust eep it in our office and under our labratory. &e have found the best way to

collaborate on wor of this nature is in person in an office setting.

$'m very proud of what we have done with it so far. $ highly reccomend "The *ogical Trader"

boo. Everything you need to build a sound and robust trading methodology is in that boo. As $ pointed out before, you cannot simply tae the material in that boo and trade it. That is not how

/ar wrote the boo. As he himself told me, anyone that simply reads that boo and tries to

trade it, will get illed.

12-30-0 0@:2@ 9M

Quote from #eaver:

>ot trying to be den!e, but hat! the (oint o" riting the boo% then

hat! li%e (ubli!hing a boo% containing a !y!te#&&&then !aying&&&)oh err&&&i" you u!e thi!

!y!te# you ill get %illed, but I !till anted to rite a boo% about thi! !y!te# and thi! ay

you can create a ne !y!te#&&&)

hat! great and all, but hy (ubli!h a boo% at all

I dont u!e A' and a# not really intere!ted in it, a! there are #any ay! to !%in a cat and


11/19

I dont thin% hi! idea! are really any better than hat Ive co#e u( ith "or #y on

trading, "ran%ly& >ot being arrogant, ;u!t !tating that I a# con"ident in #y #ethod&

I have ;u!t heard a lot o" (eo(le !ay that i!her (re!ent! a "laed !y!te# and !(end! an

entire boo% tal%ing about it, only to !ay youre e!!entially an idiot i" you u!e the !y!te# a!

i!&&&&no need to rite a boo% then&

Bu!t !lightly con"u!ed a! to the (oint o" riting the boo% in the "ir!t (lace only to re(eat the

!a#e old tired conce(t that you #u!t create your on !y!te# &

$ won't spea for /ar but the boo was written a few years bac and the maret has changed a

lot since then. *et me also correct my use of the word system as it's not a "system". $ lie to call

it a methodology or an approach to trading. A system is too rigid with strict rules that simplycannot wor in all marets across all time frames.

An approach is different. An approach is #ust a basic structure that is setup and allows the user to

input their own e(perience and ideas. Every trader is different. And every trader has their ownuni+ue personality. A trader must stay true to who they are and trade in such a way to e(tract

ma(imum benefit.

For e(ample, in his boo, in the bac /ar has trader interviews where they all tal about using

the A! method in their own way which is very different from each other.

As you now 8eaver, there is no such thing as a "formula" or "system" that is going to mae

money. Even when we thin we have a system and can show our own trading results as "proof"

that our "system" wors, in the end, there is a "8eaver" footprint that maes it wor. $t might besubtle, or it might be obvious. $t's the same with athletes, artists, etc.

$'m not trying to sell anything here, #ust giving my two cents. Trading is all about discipline andthe A! approach focuses on discipline. There are many ways to sin a cat as you said.

02-05-10 04:34 9M

Quote from cunparis:

'an you e(lain #ore about it I read the boo% but I dont get ho to calculate the A'

value!&

;sing ?2 to ?5 of either a 5 or 12 day AT8 is a good start for both the A and ! values.

02-1-10 12:1 AM

Quote from pwrtrdr:

a%e a loo% at Eold today, Eood (ivot A don& *nly to co#e bac% u( through the (ivot

high range&


12/19

Fue!tion i! i" you ta%e the !hort at the A don in hal" the o(ening range ti#e"ra#e,

(robably around 117&00 lo a! only 113&00 !to( a! to( o" (ivot at 118&00 area&&&&&

%ou don't get short at the A down. %ou have a short bias...big difference. %ou still have to trade

the product. The A level is not some magical level. $t's an e(pression of volatility. A! is allabout volatility, time and price action.

08-23-10 05:11 9M

Quote from osho$%:

I a# only trading ! &


13/19

correct

2i a# al!o con"u!ed on ho to #ea!ure the nu#ber line o" 30 (a!t day!& you #ea!ure it

de(ending here i! the clo!e& i" i trade $rude and let! !ay i u!e the o(en outcry 8:00 a# e!t

ti#e here i! the clo!e i u!e I= (lat"or# to trade and "or the crude oil it !ay! +egular

tradin" hour! i! 8:30 a# - 4:00 a# & !hould i u!e 4:00 a# a! the clo!e to cound thi! nu#berline,!hould i u!e the o(en outcry hich i! 8:00 (# to 2:30 a# or the end o" the day at

00:00

3the !a#e $ue!tion i have regarding the (ivot range&ho do i #ea!ure itta%ing acount

the o(en outcry 8:00 a# to 2:30 (#, the regular trading hour! a! #y (lat"or# !ay! i!

08:30 a# to 4:00 (# or the hole day "ro# 00:00 to 00:00 net day

i ;u!t #entioned crude cau!e i !ee in the "oru# #any (eo(le trade it but the !a#e $ue!tion i

al!o have "or currencie! here i dont %no hen i! the o(en and the clo!e a! the trade all

day&&&&

%es for the opening range you use the pit open. For the purpose of the number line you use the

pit close at the close. That is still used as the settlement price. For pivot ranges $ use the ? hourmaret cycle. As far as the time used for the opening range, that is entirely up to you. *et me

help you out here. $f you are a fader and counter trend trader, use a wider opening range. $f you

are a momentum trader, use a narrower opening range.

11-25-10 04:28 9M

Quote from tmathios:

Maveric% "ir!t o" all i ant to than% you "or the $uic% and (reci!e an!er you gave #e&

i al!o have a cou(le o" $ue!tion! "or you& a! Mar% !ay! to get an A u( you ve got to ait hal"

o" the o(ening ti#e& let! !ay your o(ening ti#e it! 15#in! and your Au( "or E' i! 135&15&

i" i have under!tand it correct he #ean! that gold have to trade 135&15 and higher "or

7Ghal" #in!& i" it trade! "or 4 #in! there, then dro(! to 1357&80 and then a"ter 1 #in goe!

over 135&15 !hould i have to !tart counting 7Ghal" #in! "ro# the beggining

.econdly i" it !tart! trading 135&15 and at the end o" the 7and hal" #in! have reached 13@2

!hould i ta%e the (o!itiono" cour!e i" all layer! o" acd #ethod !ay! #e !o or it! to high

"ro# the Au(

And la!t $ue!tion i! about ti#e& Mar% !ay! i" you ta%e the (o!ition and it goe! nohere "orti#e e$ual to the o(ening range ;u!t leave it& i" you go to hi! boo% at (age 13@ at the chart

o" unleaded ga!oline at May 11 it !ay! get !hort at Adon& i" you loo% the 2 "ollloing bar!

you can !ee that #ar%et didnt go anyhere,hy he %ee(! hi! (o!ition to the net day and

he doe!nt get out

than%! again "or your (reviou! an!er


14/19

*ie ingdong said =can't believe $'m saying that>, you have to be able to trade first and foremost.

A! is not a red lightCgreen light system and that is where people struggle with it. A! to me

wors best for price action traders and tape readers because A! is all about price action.

So tae gold for e(ample, if $'m trading gold, $'m also watching the euro, oil, spoos and silver.

$'m also watching the A! on those products and what they are doing. Are the spoos strong6 Arecommodities strong, are they confirming A ups6 $s silver stronger then gold6 $f so why6 &hat are

the macro signals, is )old trending up, has it been sluggish6 0ow is it responding to news6

All these things are very important. As far as the A! details, A! is about three things, time,

price and volatility. $f )old is maing an A up, it doesn't need to stay above the A up for half the

8 time, $ would lie to see it there at the end of the time period. And again, even if it confirms $

may not tae the long. -ecause it really depends on how price is acting. This is why you need to be a good trader. %ou can't #ust buy it there. %ou have to loo at all the other factors $ mentioned

above.

As far as the ! down. /ar would do those late day ! down trades and hold them overnighte(pecting a gap the ne(t day. This is usually a good trade because it's usually a maret reversal

day. &hen you get a really good strong signal and the maret is strong all day then late in theday, rolls over, maes a new low and closes below the ! down. There are a lot of longs trapped

that were buying the dip late in the day that got stuc and now need to get out. They are hoping

the uptrend resumes the ne(t day. $f it doesn't, then they need to get out fast. That is usually agood overnight trade. Again, though with everything else, you need to loo at all the other

factors. A! is not a magic formula. -ut if you are a price action trader, there is nothing better

out there because it captures the three dimensions of trading perfectly =time, price and volatility>.

11-27-10 11:0@ 9M

Quote from epi!tetos:

My advice i! to !%i( all the!e !tory boo%! Maveric% reco##ended and dig into Mar%et

9ro"ile and atch the *M "or a "e ee%!around certain ti#e!&

$ would "not" recommend maret profile with A!. ne of the problems $ thin traders have is

using too many different methodologies to trade. All maret profile will do is confuse the A!

stuff. $ have nothing against maret profile or any method for that matter. $f one wants to usemaret profile, then use that and not A!. $f one applies A! correctly, they do not need

maret profile.

As for those boos $ recommended, $ intentionally did not want him to read "how to" boos as

most of them suc. 8ather $ suggested boos that focus on "thining" and the more abstract ideas

of trading.

01-14-11 0@:44 9M


15/19

Quote from jsmooth:

?ou can really u!e any ti#e (eriod that ha! high volatility or a big order being "illed, then

;u!t u!e that a! your )o(ening range) value, then create !o#e a and c value! around

that&&&;u!t thin% about it, !o#eone i! aggre!!ively going to the #%t to "ill a large order, i" the

#%t i! going to trend in that direction and he! loo%ing to buy #ore, the #%t !hould nottrade the other !ide o" that )o(ening range) ithout turning bia! the other ay& It! !uch a

!i#(le conce(t yet overloo%ed by 88D o" the ((l in the #ar%et& I %no hen I# trading

on c$g and bored, and ;u!t need #y "i, Ill ;u!t ta%e the high lo o" any given (eriod and

create an A ' value around it to trade a brea%out&&&thi! i! a terrible trade cau!e I# ;u!t

trading to trade, but the #ethod o" under!tanding volatility and acd or%! to get you in

and (lace your !to(&&&

6i! (age on )good ne! bad action) i! (robably one o" the be!t conce(t! in the boo% a!

ell&&&

E(cellent point. So many guys get too stuc on the idea of what the opening range is. $t's notreally an opening range. %ou could #ust #ust as well call it a volatility range. The reason the

"actual" opening was used for many years is because before we had ? hours marets, the actualopen was very very volatile

01-2-11 05:02 AM

Quote from jsmooth:

oo %ee( thi! acd di!cu!!ion going, you #ay ant to loo% into thi! !etu(&&&the (a!t #onth,

ith the #ar%et! ;u!t inching higher each day and not really any range e(an!ion&

H=rea%out !trategie!, acd- a u( ty(e !etu(! - arent really or%ing& HIve been doing thi!

and it! been $uite e""ective to buying di(! and adding to the# "or a 2-3 day !ing trade&

Hind a !toc%&&&note the o(ening "or the year/#onth, ee%, day and "i!her! (ivot (oint

"or#ula& Hind a !toc% that! !old o"" and it! trading near/above the year and #onth

o(ening (rice&&&the net trading day, thi! level !hould !erve a! a long ter# !u((ort to (ut

thi! on&&&&let the !toc% o(en, note the o(ening (rint and the day! 99 and (ivot high-lo&

H?ou ant the !toc% to o(en don "ro# the *+, but not trade belo the year/#onth

o(ening level or i" it doe!, trade belo and have a "ailed a don ty(e action& HI" that

ha((en! note the current day! lo and (lace buy li#it order! above the #%t right above

the day! o(ening range and (ivot (oint hich !hould be ;u!t above the day *+ value&&&i"

you get hit (lace a !to( belo the day! lo or a #ental !to( i" it #a%e! an a don& HI" it

#a%e! an a u(, !tart adding to the long and #oving !to( belo the day! o(ening (rice&

H?ou ould be !ur(ri!ed ho e""ect thi! trade or%! in thi! ty(e o" #ar%et e!(ecially ith

a !toc% that ha! earning!, trade! don, but rebound! #id day& HIt or%! even better i" you

can "ind a (lay ith a nice tight (ivot, cau!e you can e(ect increa!ed volatility "or the day

and it ill turn into a trend day cau!e all the late !hort! are getting caught !elling !hort into

the lo& H


16/19

I (layed thi! action in >> ye!terday, getting long on buy !to(! at 3513&&&ta%e a loo% at

the chart and note the value! it ill give you a good (icture o" the !etu(&

$'m doing something very similar. $ use daily, weely, monthly and +uarterly levels and they all

interact with each other. nce you understand the dynamics of volatility in different time frames,

your mind starts opening up to all the different possibilities.

01-28-11 05:5@ 9M

Quote from #obert &an!s:

Fue!tion "or A' "ol%!: 'an one u!e the A' #ethodology u!ing !trictly end o" day data

IA "or your in(ut&

%es. /ost of the A! stuff $ use is based on end of day data

01-28-11 0@:00 9M

Quote from jo'(%%:

Ereat thread by the ay, Ive read it through nu#erou! ti#e! and gotten !o#e great in"o&

My $ue!tion relate! to *+, I u!ed it a cou(le year! ago hen I traded >a !toc%! in

Jniver!ity and it a! (retty cut and dry ith #ar%et o(en/clo!e ti#e! to deter#ine a

ti#e"ra#e that or%! ell "or you&

Ive been trading >at-Ea! 'a!h #ar%et! no "or a cou(le o" year! and been (retty

!ucce!!"ul at o(ti#iing day ga! "or an energy #ar%eter& lately Ive been branching out

into buying/!elling I' ba!i! and u!ing ban% !a(! to o(ti#ie calendar !(read!

a! they generally have better !(read ca!h "lo!&

I a! ondering ho hard and !et the rule! need to be "or *+ I" I can (ic% u( a

directional bia! on any given day, I can #anage #y boo% #ore e""iciently by buying early

or aiting until later in the day i" I can antici(ate a !ell-o""& A lot o" the ti#e, there i! huge

volu#e be"ore be"ore (it o(en ith !igni"icant #ove! but other ti#e! nothing be"ore o(en

outcry&

I! it detri#ental to the !y!te# to change *+ ti#e"ra#e! I# !ure con!i!tency i! i#(ortant

but i" I !ee large action (re-(it, I tend to #old #y *+ around that action v! u!ing a hard

and "a!t ti#e "ra#e&

Again, thi! i! !ub;ective and I ba!e it on hat I !ee on G. and #y chart!& Ive only !tarted

e(eri#enting ith the!e variable! !o i" I need to #a%e a correction, or all tho!e out there

ho are very %noledgeable ith the !y!te# !ee a "la I ould a((reciate any "eedbac%&


17/19

hK

The idea for the 8 is to pic a time period that has some significance to it. %ou also want to be

consistent. A lot of the price action that you see from the A! levels comes from understanding

how any given maret "should" be behaving under normal circumstances. So if you eepchanging the 8 time period around it may affect the way you interpret that price action. -T&,

there is nothing stopping you from using multiple 8's throughout the day or wee.

02-05-11 10:34 9M

Quote from )ing*ong+,':

I# trying to under!tand ho to u!e thi! conce(t on brea%ing ne! (lay! and ould really

a((reciate any "eedbac%& I# u!ing J>6 today a! there a! ne!

#idday that cau!ed great volatility in the !toc%&I under!tand that A' or%!

really ell ith under!tanding the volatility (lay! to !et the o(ening range&

.o #y "ir!t $ue!tion i! ith thi!, hen do you actually !et the range


18/19

momentum trader or a fader6 Are you only an intraday trader or do you hold overnight6 o you

lie to scalp or hold on for the bigger moves6 See all this will depend on how you set your A!

parameters.

n my intraday A! that day, the stoc first made an A down and then on the news confirmed a

! up. $t made a weely A up even before the daily ! up which is a great long setup. 7ow another thing you could do is use your normal intraday settings then when news comes out slap on

another 8 around the news event and see if the A! news levels coordinate well with the

normal intraday setup.

$n other words, maybe the news A up is the same area as the intraday A up. r, maybe you get

an A up on the normal A! levels and you are able to buy that wic on the failed A down on the

news A! level.

;se your creativity here9 There are a million ways to use this but it will be for naught if you it's

not compatible with how you lie to trade. At the end of the day, all technical systems are about

two things and two things only. )etting you to pull the trigger to get in a trade and getting you toget out when you are wrong. $f your levels and parameters serve that function, then you my

friend are shooting well over par.

02-08-11 02:22 AM


9erha(! you can clear !o#ething u( "or #e be"ore I decide to !(end a great deal o" ti#e

!tudying the A' #ethodology& >a#ely:


19/19

Glease understand that A! is not a technical indicator in that it produces absolute price levels

lie a moving average or a support or resistance level. $f you are not a good price action trader, itwill be difficult to grasp what A! is telling you. -ut everything you need to now about A!

is in Fisher's boo.

02-08-11 05:12 AM

Quote from bigarrow:

Maveric% do you u!e A' to daytrade co##oditie!

$ don't. &hat $ do though is use intraday signals for entering into weely trades. Dsmooth wentover similar type of trades. Such as using a failed A down on an intraday to enter a weely or

monthly signal.

02-08-11 05:17 AM


idnt realie the * *+ in"o i! o" a (ro(rietary nature& I rongly a!!u#ed !o#e general

* *+ (ara#eter! ould be covered in a later cha(ter or in the a((endi& hat!

a((arently not the ca!e&

han%! "or your in(ut& I a((reciate it&

*et me e(plain so my response doesn't come off as rude. 0ere is the thing about trading. &hen

you use standard stuff that everyone is using or watching, it creates traffic. $t means obvious

entries in the maret are going to generate lots of stops in that area which means the maret isliely to test that area and stop you out. This is the problem of maing obvious trades. The idea is

to find a part of the highway where there is little to no traffic. This means there will be a minimal

amount of stops there and more liely you will be able to stay in the position. Telling everyonewhere my 8's are is lie putting a sign out on where $'m entering the highway thereby creating

more traffic or noise. So it would be better if you found your own +uiet spot to enter trades.

0ope that e(plains it better.

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