September 29, 2004 - sl.nsw.gov.au€¦ · Web viewSo I’m sitting down here instead of standing up ... just up the marble staircase to your ... more recently, we’ve been acquiring

Celebration: Jewish Community PhotographsPanel Discussion

ANNI TURNBULL: This is going to be a very informal and casual, fantastic discussion tonight. So I’m sitting down here instead of standing up there. So I’d like to welcome you to the library and I’d like to begin by acknowledging the traditional owners of the land on which we and this library stand, the Gadigal people of the Eora Nation and their elders past and present. Thank you for coming tonight.

My name is Anni Turnbull. I’m a curator here at the library. We’re really excited to host a discussion between photographer D-Mo on my left and two representatives of the Jewish community who are featured in her photographs, Rabbis Gourarie and Slavin, and this is part of the Library’s Celebration of Multicultural March.

The Library has acquired 43 photographs from D-Mo documenting the Jewish community in Sydney and they add to the library’s collection documenting the people of New South Wales, and particularly our cultural diversity. And if you have a chance after this talk, the display of photographs titled ‘Celebration: Jewish Community Photographs’ as above, are on level 1, just up the marble staircase to your right.

So the Library has collected documents and stories of many cultures and in many formats, including letters, manuscripts, paintings, oral histories and photography and, more recently, we’ve been acquiring the digital world and digital creations. I like the idea that we are actually a memory institution and our jobs are to collect, interpret and share the memories, whether it’s through web presence, exhibitions or talks like this one.

If I could introduce each person now. So on my left is D-Mo Zajac, who was born in Poland and came to Australia in 2010.

D-MO ZAJAC: No, 2004.

ANNI TURNBULL: 2004.

D-MO ZAJAC: Yes.

ANNI TURNBULL: But migrated 2010?

D-MO ZAJAC: No, I came to Australia 2004.

ANNI TURNBULL: Yeah.

Celebration: Jewish Community Photographs Page 1

D-MO ZAJAC: 2010 when I started the project.

ANNI TURNBULL: Photographing.

D-MO ZAJAC: Yes.

ANNI TURNBULL: That’s why I remember it.

D-MO ZAJAC: Yes.

ANNI TURNBULL: That’s when D-Mo started photographing communities.

D-MO ZAJAC: Yes.

ANNI TURNBULL: D-Mo has morphed from filmmaker to photographer and has photographed many different cultural groups here and in New York and also the documenting of the Jewish community in Sydney has been a personal journey for D-Mo, as she recently learnt about her own Jewish background.

I’ll start with Rabbi Dovid Slavin, who’s on the far left, who migrated from the United States in 1991 to take up a position of executive director of the Rabbinical College of Sydney, a role he still has. May I just say thank you so much to two of you taking time out of your busy schedules. I know you’re flat out. And other voluntary activities that Rabbi Slavin does is a member of the Ethics Committee of the Cancer Institute of New South Wales, co-founding director of the Gift of Life Australia, an organisation that maintains a register of prospective bone marrow donors. He was appointed chaplain in the Ambulance Service of New South Wales and in recent years founded and directed Our Big Kitchen in Bondi, a non-denominational charitable organisation that seeks to bring together people from all walks of life for community building activities.

Our other Rabbi, the one closest to me, is Rabbi Gourarie, who is the founder of director of BINA Sydney, which provides Jewish education for people of all ages and backgrounds. He was born in South Africa and educated in the US and Australia. He holds a Masters of Education and is a passionate educator and speaker, which I’m sure we’ll hear tonight. He lectures and gives classes on a wide range of topics, with special emphasis and passion for personal growth, self-development, including self-esteem, communication, conflict resolution and relationship building, which all sound great. If I can pick a couple of those up tonight, that would be fantastic.

We will be recording this event, just to let you know that. So thank you all for coming and I’d like to start by asking D-Mo a little bit about herself. So, D-Mo, can you tell me a bit about yourself and the journey, perhaps, from working in film to photography?


D-MO ZAJAC: Yes, of course. First of all, I would love to say thank you so much for having me and having Rabbis with us.

(MICROPHONE BANGED)

ANNI TURNBULL: I’ll just move it a bit. Yep.

D-MO ZAJAC: Okay. And also it’s a huge honour for me to be here and present my work for the library and also for the people. Can you hear me?


D-MO ZAJAC: Yes. For the people outside of the communities, because for me it’s a very, very important message to …

(LOUD MICROPHONE FEEDBACK)

UNIDENTIFIED SPEAKER: (Inaudible)

ANNI TURNBULL: No, I was wondering if it was the water.

D-MO ZAJAC: Could be the water, yes, yes. It could be the water. Anyway, my name D-Mo Zajac. I was born in Poland and came to Australia in 2004. Back probably around 2006 I started to photograph people but before that I was educated in Poland. I studied film and photography but film was my major, major passion and took me to all Europe and also my university time to do lots of reportage and lots of documentaries in Europe, so I was very passionate about film. I was behind the filming camera then taking photographs before.

But taking photographs, of course, that was my second subject. Second subject is photography and my first assignment to take photographs, documentary photographs, was about Polish kids playing in the big suburban places and I remember, I think at the time I was 17, 18 when I was studying photography and I was really - I had my first camera. I was on a bike. I was looking for subjects to document and I noticed there was one guy on a bike wearing the clothes as a Charlie Chaplin and he was going from one suburb to another suburb to entertain the kids. And his name was - I mean, he was a little man exhibiting his performance for the kids and in one way it was fantastic to see him. Sorry, he’s kicking.

ANNI TURNBULL: Oh.

D-MO ZAJAC: I mean, he was the guy who was really performing for the kids and I wanted to capture him with the kids, so I was starting taking photographs; first photographs of him and the kids around and the people round because he


was the person who was very charismatic. The way how he was dressing up was outstanding as a Charlie Chaplin and, for me, it was like, “Who is this guy?” and, you know, he’s spending all his time for free to entertain those kids so I photographed him. And right now when I’m looking back after almost 20 years later, those photographs are like very old films but frozen images. But it didn’t took me so much time because, you know, I was really into film so much.

So what happened, I finish my film and photographic school. I also attended University of (indistinct), which is based in Poland. I was study mass media and psychology. So also it got me really into study of people. You know, I was really fascinated everything about the people, everything about where these people coming from, their culture, their religion and what they’re doing, and what the purpose that they have in life. So (indistinct) because my sister called me and she asked me to come to Australia.

And I finished all my schools and my work. I was working in the TV stations for a while. I was doing lots of documentaries for European TV stations and, you know, everything about the people and she called one day and she’s like, “Why don’t you come to Australia and just have a little bit different point of view because, as we know, Europe has got lots of historical moments and you can go crazy over there, and why don’t you come here, find yourself in the new form?” And I came here. I was study English and I was trying to find a job as a filmmaker but I couldn’t find right job, I mean, you know, in the film industry. So I needed to reinvent myself as a photographer to be close to my medium, which is the frames.

So I put that away. I sold my old filming equipment. I started to invest money into cameras and starting doing documentary about things around me. So I started taking photographs of portraits of people for family, kids. That was my beginning. So I learn how to be very fast and quick. Then later I was starting to document - I mean, taking for pictures of the events and somehow I just got into African culture and that was the beginning of documenting the first community in Australia.

So 2006 I become professional photographer. I could earn money and support myself and through these years up to 2010 I was working as a fashion photographer but in the meantime I was documenting the African culture, the Iranian community and, of course, in between I was travelling around the world, so I took different, different stuff.

So but by this time there was a bit of journey, because I allow myself to meet people from different countries and especially migrants coming to Australia, because for me it was like fascinating culture and, wow, this country is very open. And so I can see on every corner different personalities, you know, and it’s like, “Oh, where are you from and what are you doing?” And then people saying, “I’m from, you know, this part of Africa. I’m from the States. I’m from


South Africa and America”. So it’s like, wow, I can do something with this and I can start telling stories and share those stories with other people.

So my first documentary photography was about taking portraits of Sudanese refugees from Sudan and this journey become probably the longest one at the moment, because it took me a decade to document the refugees from Sudan and it’s a beautiful, beautiful journey as I met wonderful people alongs and make wonderful connections.

And by this time, 2009, there was a - it’s a beautiful moment in your life when you start asking yourself who I am and what’s my purpose is and where my family is coming from. So because those people were telling me stories about their relatives, their backgrounds as well and I ask them - ask my parents, you know, who I am. So somehow my mum revealed the secret a couple of years ago, 2009 - at the end of 2009 - which was very surprising for me because I was raised as a Protestant in Poland, which is also very different because, as we know, Poland is very Catholic and, you know, mostly people saying “Oh, Protestants”, you know. It’s like, “Okay”. So I was raised as a protestant and when my mum revealed that my grandmother was Jewish, it was very surprising for me because at the time I was 32 years old and it was like it was very fresh, very new but somehow, you know, I mean God bless good to ask sometimes right now.

And after this, it’s I kind of have a huge interest into the Jewish community. So that’s why I would love to take you guys into this moment why we’re here because it is my personal journey, which is wonderful, and also very having the deep connection with this, it’s kind of expanding my soul into (indistinct) but also tell the story - tell the story because I didn’t see so many pictures of the Jewish community in the mainstream so much. So I’m so happy that the library and the ladies who put things together allow, you know, have this moment like today and share these stories. And so the two things, yeah, personal one and also (indistinct 16.24.32)...

ANNI TURNBULL: Professional.

D-MO ZAJAC: Yes.

ANNI TURNBULL: So when did you first meet Rabbi Slavin?

D-MO ZAJAC: Yeah, it was my first event. I just - it was back in 2010, Hanukkah time. I just came back from New York and, I don’t know, I just - I was saying I want to see Hanukkah. I want to celebrate the news and everything. So I went to Double Bay and to the park. There was everything set up for Hanukkah, lots of people, menorah was getting ready for lighting and, yes, and Rabbi Slavin approached me and asked me if I can join after the festival with


his family to celebrate Hanukkah in his place. So I said, “Of course”. That was my first meeting, yes.

ANNI TURNBULL: And so the picture behind us is of a bah mitzvah.

(MICROPHONE BANGED)

ANNI TURNBULL: And that’s in Bondi?

D-MO ZAJAC: Yes, that’s the Yeshiva Centre.

RABBI SLAVIN: Mm hm.

D-MO ZAJAC: In Bondi. Just very close to Our Big Kitchen. I mean…

RABBI SLAVIN: That’s right.

(MICROPHONE BANGED)

D-MO ZAJAC: They are very close

ANNI TURNBULL: Wow.

D-MO ZAJAC: Yeah, it’s - I love this photograph because it’s showing what a wonderful connection with father and son. It’s a bah mitzvah, one of Rabbi’s son was turning 13 and that’s when the boy is turning 13 they are having a bah mitzvah. So I love this photograph because of the connection and the preparation and just as a parent with the child.

ANNI TURNBULL: Mm hm.

D-MO ZAJAC: And, of course, what I learn from film into photography is to tell the story in one frame so it’s a very - you very limited because if you have assignment and they tell you, okay, bring me only one picture about something, you have to think, okay, how can you tell the story in one frame? So I think it’s showing this bah mitzvah, you know, with all details and, yes. Yeah.

Another, that’s Hanukkah 2014, and it was my first time on a boat to celebrate Hanukkah on a boat and it was fantastic trip because we were on the boat and seeing this beautiful harbour, which is the most beautiful harbour in the world, I reckon. And, of course, as we see, we need lots of information in this picture. So we see the menorah. We see the sign of Hanukkah. We see the man is starting playing music and wonderful city, Sydney, with the Opera House. So it’s very symbol. Yeah, lots of symbols.

That’s back to a bah mitzvah at the Yeshiva Centre. Also I love the traffic in this


picture and showing boys and other men is praying. It’s a little bit hard, you know, because coming from raised as a Protestant and understanding the Jewish culture was a little bit hard for me to photograph, because I’m very limited. I have to be on the ladies’ side, so I learned those things. I can’t go to the men’s side so much. Maybe next life. So, yeah, it’s over to - everything is divided, so I’m trying to really sometimes jump in on the tables or chairs to see what the mens doing there, right? So just…

ANNI TURNBULL: So are you allowed to photograph the men at all?

(MICROPHONE FEEDBACK)

D-MO ZAJAC: From the women’s side, yes.

ANNI TURNBULL: Yep, okay.

D-MO ZAJAC: Right?

ANNI TURNBULL: So nothing’s illegal there. No, that’s fine. Okay.

D-MO ZAJAC: Yes. Yes. If I’m on the women’s side, yes, of course.

ANNI TURNBULL: Okay.

D-MO ZAJAC: And I have to go back to the story in New York and I was at Brooklyn and I went to the synagogue on 770 Synagogue and I was celebrating the Sukkot. What a beautiful event. And I think by 3 o’clock in the morning the whole synagogue was packed with lots of ladies and mens downstairs and over there is like the ladies are upstairs and I wanted to capturing what the men is doing, the praying. And, unfortunately, everything was packed and I’m telling this story to everybody because it’s so amazing. I saw so many women sitting and study at 3 o’clock in the morning and I saw behind the windows the men’s downstairs study and for me it was a fantastic but how difficult way to get into this window and capturing men downstairs studying. So I needed to really jump in on the tables and just go over the heads of women, saying, “Excuse me, I need to take photographs”. Luckily somebody said on the corner, it’s like, “Sorry, ladies, this lady is from CNN probably. Let her go. Let her go. Let her go”. So I went with my cameras, going over the heads of the ladies. Sorry, sorry. I have probably two minutes to photograph, between the glass and the gap and the bench, the men’s study, because for me it was the powerful picture of Sukkot and the celebration and I made it to one minute and go back, of course. Sorry, to disturb you and, of course, I went to the room to study, to learn things. So it was - this one was a little bit easy, because I had a space to be over so…



D-MO ZAJAC: Great. Oh, beautiful. That’s my first Hanukkah at Rabbi’s place. It’s his wonderful, wonderful Laya with his - with her son Shlomo and Mussia when she was small. I love this picture.

ANNI TURNBULL: Yeah, it’s my favourite.

D-MO ZAJAC: Yeah, that’s Hanukkah.

ANNI TURNBULL: I think it’s really evocative.

D-MO ZAJAC: Lighting the candles.

ANNI TURNBULL: Mm.

D-MO ZAJAC: Also we see the whole story in one picture.

ANNI TURNBULL: Mm. Okay. And…

D-MO ZAJAC: And I think this one is, yeah, also back to Hanukkah 2010. This is probably the very, very first picture of this project when I started and I wanted to be high to see the perspective of the whole event and I asked the gentleman, “Can I go?” There was a big menorah when I was standing. Probably other pictures will show the upstairs, another menorah. So I climbed over there to have this beautiful perspective of the crowd of people and dancing mens. So and also if you see on the background, it’s another menorah. So, of course, another symbolistic picture of the Hanukkah.

Here we go, Shlomo. Here we go and Mussia. They grow up now, yes.

ANNI TURNBULL: Wow.

D-MO ZAJAC: And, of course, Laya and Rivka. Yes. So this is - yeah, this is the very first picture of this project so that’s how the story been revealed.


D-MO ZAJAC: Yes. Okay, preparation for Shabbat. It’s Slavin’s beautiful place and I love this one because it’s lots of happiness and that’s, you know, when you prepare for Shabbat it’s like celebration of this event and we see the challah. We see Mussia was very small there but now she grow up and Mendel. So, yeah, I love this one because it’s probably I have chosen only one colourful picture.

ANNI TURNBULL: Yes, out of the black and white and colour…


D-MO ZAJAC: Yes. Yes.

ANNI TURNBULL: …black and white wins.

D-MO ZAJAC: Yes. So, yeah, also as you see.

ANNI TURNBULL: Yeah. And then we might talk about…

D-MO ZAJAC: Go back to Our Big Kitchen.

ANNI TURNBULL: …Our Big Kitchen. Rabbi Slavin, could you tell me a little bit about this project and what it’s achieved?

RABBI SLAVIN: This was actually we did a Consul-General cook-in. So the kitchen is a big commercial kitchen, which is open to be able to help to connect and to empower people from different backgrounds and giving them opportunities. I’m looking, this is - it’s more black in my beard there, then it’s in black and white picture. And what we did on this particular day when Marie Bashir came to visit us - we were graced by her presence - was to bring consul-generals from a bunch of different countries. So we had the English and the American, and the Chinese and the Japanese, the Indonesian, the Pakistani all - about 16 - the German, all working side by side, each delivering their own dishes. This is the Sri Lankan here, the Honorary Consul of Sri Lanka, doing his dish and overlooked by our former Governor and it was just a really, really good day in the kitchen so it was - and it was great. I haven’t seen this picture. It was great to have captured that moment, which is fantastic.

ANNI TURNBULL: So how long has Our Big Kitchen been going? Was it 2010 or was it - I keep picking that date.

RABBI SLAVIN: Our Big Kitchen opened in 2007.

ANNI TURNBULL: Oh, okay.

RABBI SLAVIN: And has grown dramatically since.

ANNI TURNBULL: Can you tell me, you were talking before about you use it as a place to help train people and put people who have been in prison together with perhaps sometimes the judges who sentence them. I’m just - that kind of social justice.

RABBI SLAVIN: Yeah. The kitchen, in a nutshell, we’re - the food and the kitchen is really an excuse or a language or a medium, you know, no different than sport or music or photography, for that matter, or cinema. It’s just that’s the medium that we use but the actual product is rebuilding people’s confidence, community building, allowing people to feel a sense of belonging


and whether that’s mothers with post-natal depression or it’s the elderly or people who are socially isolated, it’s a place that it’s easy for people just to come to and to immediately feel needed and be a part of something.

And perhaps one of the things that we’ve done, which has been, as you mentioned, quite high profile, has been giving inmates an opportunity to rehabilitate because after serving time, in terms of the community, there’s a very simple choice. Either we, the community, give inmates a second chance because if we don’t the criminals definitely will. So that’s just the simple question that we have to ask ourselves. And we’ve had an incredible success rate with former inmates who have come to us; some who have been with us for a period of time and then moved on and some who are still with us now.

And, as you mentioned, we’ve always tried to do things a bit out of the box, whether it’s inviting Mike Tyson. D-Mo, were you there for the Mike Tyson event? So Mike Tyson came to talk to them, some of the mistakes that he has made in the past and didn’t want to see them repeated by others or getting inmates to talk to children at risk to say that jail may sound glamourous when you look at it from the outside but, trust us, it’s the last place you want to go, because when that door slams behind you for a five, eight year sentence, it’s a real wake-up call. And one of the things that we’ve done has been to bring judges who have sentenced those very inmates to talk to them now as equals across a table across a cup of coffee. And you could almost see the stress and the years just being peeled away as they sit there and talk just as two individuals. They could laugh about the case. They could talk about different things they could have (indistinct) differently but it’s just really turning society as we know it on its head.

ANNI TURNBULL: Sounds fantastic. Like, fantastic social justice. I think we’ll come back to you in a minute.

RABBI SLAVIN: Yeah.

ANNI TURNBULL: But we better give…

RABBI SLAVIN: No problem.

ANNI TURNBULL: …Rabbi Gourarie a chance. So this is the image of BINA. Can you please tell me a bit about BINA and why you started it?

RABBI GOURARIE: So thank you. I mean, it’s great to be here. BINA is essentially an institution dedicated to educate adults - adults of all ages, a very diverse group of adults - with the very strong belief that the continuity of any culture is really dependent very much on education, learning, understanding, growing. And in BINA itself, this particular picture, there’s in BINA itself, a very emphasised stream is a lot of education to do with personal growth and


character sort of development, where what we do is we take large groups as this one and we study ancient Jewish principles, ancient Jewish concepts but applying them to modern relevance in terms of relationship building, communication. Currently I’m doing a course of resilience. Again, sort of combing ancient principles with modern-day living and modern-day relevance.

(LOUD FEEDBACK).

RABBI GOURARIE: This particular group - there are many groups - but this particular group in this picture is the Thursday morning women’s group. We have 50, 60, 70 women who come. Every term we do a different course and some of them have - we have been doing this for like ten years, that particular group. Some of them have been there from the beginning and what’s amazing is to see people grow. The whole concept, I guess, is based on the belief that every human being can change. We have it within ourselves to be positive. We might have rough patches in our personality. We all have our weaknesses and our strengths but the uniqueness of the human being is the drive and the ability to actually improve, to challenge our comfort zone to improve our relationships, to expand ourselves into understanding other people’s perspectives, communicating with others and so on and so forth. So it’s amazing that some of these people have been coming every week. Some of them call it, like, their weekly therapy session but it’s not therapy. I’m not a therapist but it’s an education session and they talk about real changes in their own lives and their own relationships and their own family environments and so on.

ANNI TURNBULL: The both sound like they’re just aiming at making people better and is it based on self-esteem?

RABBI GOURARIE: Correct.

(FEEDBACK)


RABBI GOURARIE: And in very different way.

ANNI TURNBULL: So have people who have been in these photographs seen them D-Mo?

(FEEDBACK)

ANNI TURNBULL: (Indistinct) the echo.

D-MO ZAJAC: Did Rabbi (indistinct)?


RABBI GOURARIE: I actually haven’t yet but it’s something I have been planning to do. It was - we were kind of taken by surprise. I didn’t know. D-Mo just gave me a call one day. “Can I come and take pictures?” I have to be honest, I called Rabbi Slavin to say…

ANNI TURNBULL: Who is she?

RABBI GOURARIE: Rabbi Slavin said, “Great individual, please take her”. So she came to very different classes, some women’s classes, men’s classes, mixed classes and took wonderful, wonderful photos. We’re actually in the process of renovation, so what I’m hoping do, with D-Mo’s permission, is to in our new expanded facility, is to put up some of these photos and (indistinct)…

ANNI TURNBULL: That sounds fantastic. D-Mo, you’re interest in other communities and cultures started pretty early, didn’t it? You told me an example when you were a child in Poland of - can you tell that story of Uncle John coming to visit?

D-MO ZAJAC: Uncle John, yes. Yes, of course. I think I was six years old or seven years old and my father’s best friend came to visit us and he was the very first black person I ever saw in life. He was from Republic Dominicana probably and I’ll never forget the attraction when I saw him, because he was very different and, of course, he was (indistinct) a different word. But what happened, he was probably the cause of what I have become because he brought a photographic book. (Indistinct) this photographic book was forbidden for child’s to or for kids to (indistinct) photographs, documentary photographs around the world showing the war and hungry kids in Africa. So of course he hide the book in my father’s library and I saw it, you know. And, of course, everything was forbidden (indistinct) somehow. I don’t know, I was very naughty kid. And I grabbed this book. I saw those (indistinct) but very disturbing photographs and I never forgot. I cried and I cried with the world, you know. I said why - why those other kids don’t have food to eat, you know? They look (indistinct) you know and (indistinct) kind of changed my perspective of way of living as a kid and I said to myself I would love to see the world. It’s something much more to see (indistinct). So those photographs were really very powerful and that’s where I learn how powerful can be one frame change can your perspective of way of living or understanding (indistinct).

But through this journey there was another beautiful time when my mum said, please (indistinct) to uncle, let’s just go to the bakery pick up some bread and the bakery was 15 minutes away from our house on the bike. We used to travel on the bike all the time and never forget (indistinct) other people observation because they saw twins, my sister and me, (indistinct) bikes going through the village. We used to live in a (indistinct) village where there were like few houses. When you come closer to the bakery was a little bit (indistinct) people were saying, oh, (indistinct) start chanting and for me it was like, wow,


(indistinct) look at this person. He came to us, you know. He’s got something to offer and it’s like I was proud to have him next to me, very, very proud.

And it was kind of - and those pictures and memories stayed with me all the time and that’s how I kind of, you know - the journey of life is taking you and showing you lots of things. That’s why I was attracted to African culture (indistinct) starting documenting (indistinct) coming to Australia or even when I used to live (indistinct) United States just seeing how people can take things differently because (indistinct) different and they speak different and come from different culture and for me it was very disturbing. Like, how can we (indistinct) like this and so my job is probably, you know, I find my purpose to document and share these stories because people are - all people are so fascinating. They have stories (indistinct) I think this moment from my childhood (indistinct)…

ANNI TURNBULL: (Indistinct) why you weren’t black?

D-MO ZAJAC: Yeah, I was saying, yeah, I was - I was saying to my mum, “Mum, why I don’t have afro hairstyle and the black skin? You know, can you make it?” You know, (indistinct).

ANNI TURNBULL: Difficult question.

D-MO ZAJAC: Yes. Yes. Yes. I remember that I was like, oh, I wanted to be like one of them.

ANNI TURNBULL: So with the photographs of the Jewish community…

D-MO ZAJAC: Yes.

ANNI TURNBULL: …was there reasons that you shot some in black and white and some in colour?

D-MO ZAJAC: Good questions because I guess every project it’s different and, look, it depends what project I’m working on. You know, some of the photographs are black and white, yes, and I think they are more powerful in black and white than in colour because colours, you know, you can really focus on particular colour. You know, like red, you know, is screaming to you but I wanted to have everything equal and suddenly when you get your eye into photograph, you start seeing something beyond, you know? Something is no talking to you straight but if you really stared at the photograph, you see more. You’re mind finds different detail that surprise you. You know, so that’s why I’m a really big fan of black and white (indistinct). I don’t know, it’s just old way, old-fashioned way of (indistinct) photographs and (indistinct) this book from my childhood.


ANNI TURNBULL: Oh, okay.

D-MO ZAJAC: All photographs were black and white. There was like (indistinct).

ANNI TURNBULL: (Indistinct) you obviously grew up with it but could you explain a little bit more about (indistinct).

RABBI GOURARIE: Okay. So, ritual in Jewish life has many, many purposes and many layers. We have what’s called a mitzvah, a mitzvot. So in the Jewish tradition we have called what’s called 613 mitzvot. Some of them don’t apply today because we don’t have a temple and we’re not in Israel, et cetera, but we have things that govern our daily lives, things that we do on Shabbat. For example, one of those beautiful photos about the rituals of Shabbat, we light the candles, we say a certain blessing, we have certain prayers that we do every day, certain rituals and focus activities that we do every day and some of them are focused on bringing holiness into our lives, bringing something greater into the mundane. But on a very, very basic level, what many of them are able to do is actually keep us focussed in - as you said, in today’s very, very fast-paced life, where everyone is very distracted. We probably live with technology, which has its greatnesses but also it has weaknesses. We probably live in the most distracted society ever.

You know, one of the things - just going back BINA, one of the things that we did last year, we did a number of courses on mindfulness, which is very popular today but with a sort of a Jewish flavour and the power of mindfulness and one of them concepts being that we don’t get to be conscious and focussed and aware of what is actually happening or aware of the gifts that we have or aware of the greater potential that we can actually reach and very often some of these rituals, some of these things (indistinct) help us stop, focus, gives us a structure and helps us be aware of what is going on around us, helps us be aware of a higher purpose and creates that focus and that structure. It’s very, very healthy.

ANNI TURNBULL: I think…

RABBI GOURARIE: A lot of them are very focussed around family as well.


RABBI GOURARIE: Which strengthens the whole family relationship and makes that that much more stronger.

ANNI TURNBULL: (Indistinct) some who has a Christian background (indistinct) birth, marriage and death are the three main rituals of (indistinct)…

RABBI GOURARIE: (Indistinct)


ANNI TURNBULL: Yeah. (Indistinct) quite beautiful to me.

RABBI GOURARIE: Mm.

ANNI TURNBULL: So please tell me more about (indistinct)…

RABBI SLAVIN: Are you talking about in ritual or are you talking about the...

ANNI TURNBULL: (Indistinct)

RABBI SLAVIN: I just want to be able to add, I think, you know talking about photography, which is very, very creative, as D-Mo has done, creativity is seen sometimes as an impediment to ritual but the fact is that you need structure to have creativity so there’s a camera and it’s got to have a size, it’s got to be charged the right way. It’s got to be film. It’s got to be developed, temperatures. There’s a science to it. That science has to be consistent and only on the background of the consistency can you have creativity and it’s very much the case within our lives as well.

You know, sometimes you look at particular photos, you’re looking at a community and it could seem a bit insular, it could seem a bit detached, it could seem a bit removed from the hustle and bustle of cutting edge. And as Rabbi Gourarie mentioned earlier, the fact is that is very, very different. Real growth can almost only happen as a result of where there is a strong foundation, which we would call ritual. So some of the most creative people, some of the most creative artists and creators and sculptors actually lived a very disciplined life. So that’s, as far as that’s concerned.

And I think it’s very, very true if you take the same metaphor into the kitchen. The kitchen has two very distinct aspects. One of them is about heart. One of them is about inclusion, one about possibilities and saying really there isn’t anybody who we can’t help in some way or another to connect, to empower them and to assist them to bring them into the fold. The other side is very structured. We have health regulations and you can’t say because I think I really want to help these people, we’re going to rush through this and leave them eat outside or, you know, use vegetables which haven’t been washed.

So that discipline is really true in many, many parts of our lives. It’s true for photography. It’s true for lessons and it’s true for what we do in the kitchen, whether you have the structure of the systems that need to be in place, the temperature controls, the safety, the OH&S. That’s one side. The other side of that, that allows you to be more open, to be more creative, to be more adventurous with the ideas that we do.


ANNI TURNBULL: I’ve heard that expressed in a different way, where you have to know the rules before you can break them.

RABBI SLAVIN: Can break them, that’s right.

ANNI TURNBULL: So that’s a really lovely analogy.

RABBI SLAVIN: Absolutely. And I’m sure you have it here in the library as well, you know. There’s…

ANNI TURNBULL: We don’t break rules.

RABBI SLAVIN: The library is all about creative books but there is a science to even storing and maintaining and preserving and one may say, well, I want to know everything now and you’re going to run into a bit of a problem because you’re going to tell them they’ve got to get in line and they have to look for the shelves and they have to put it back on the shelves so that dichotomy is very, very important in the human condition.

RABBI GOURARIE: If I can just add something. I mean, that’s a great point Rabbi Slavin made and one of the things also in the Jewish community in particular - probably in all communities - is contrast or the combination of the individual and the community. You know, there’s a very, very strong sense of family and community, particularly within the Jewish community, like the synagogue at the moment. You know, in some of the pictures we saw before, everyone together, everyone praying together, and sometimes people think that that sense of community can sort of dull the individuality a bit but it’s actually the opposite is true. Just, you know, similar sort of point, that the sense of belonging actually is a sense of structure, sense of focus, but within that there is tremendous scope for individual expression and individual growth and creativity, so that kind of same sort of combination.

D-MO ZAJAC: (Indistinct) is community, yeah.

ANNI TURNBULL: Very important.

D-MO ZAJAC: Yeah, for all of us. You know, (indistinct) that we can do (indistinct) somehow (indistinct) getting us into the group of people. Community as a thing, it’s a blessing to have the group of people community to be surrounded by or grow up with them because how - we couldn’t achieve anything with ourselves. So, I mean, look at this having exhibition. I wouldn’t achieve, you know, sharing those photographs to you guys without, you know, the staff here, yes.


ANNI TURNBULL: Have you noticed in documenting different communities similarities?

D-MO ZAJAC: Yes, I mean, what’s - we have to ask ourselves what communities it’s mean, you know. It’s a group of people, you know, and they work together (indistinct) you know on something. So I think it’s a togetherness and that’s probably a very similar thing for all communities, yeah, to be together and share, support each other.

ANNI TURNBULL: And what’s your next project beyond a baby?

D-MO ZAJAC: That’s my next project, which is a blessing. Look, I’m a documentary photographer. My work never ends and, as you see, this particular project of the Jewish community took me already five years and I would love to continue as long as I can, maybe to the end of my life, which would be fantastic. In between, other different projects. So trying to keep myself busy because I’m very curious. I’m very curious person. I really love, you know, (indistinct) share those photographs with many people. So, yeah, just keep shooting.

ANNI TURNBULL: That’s great. We might end it there and I’d like to thank you very much for sharing your stories and your photography with us and we do have some time for questions, I think. Could we just thank the speakers, please?

(APPLAUSE)

ANNI TURNBULL: Thank you.

RABBI SLAVIN: Thank you very much.

D-MO ZAJAC: Thank you.

AUDIENCE MEMBER: Thank you for all that very interesting insight. I have a question for both rabbis. I think D-Mo’s photographs give us this wonderful gift of being able to see inside a community that me personally I don’t know much about but I was wondering if, from your perspective, what you got out of having your community photographed in this way, if anything? I’m sure something.

RABBI SLAVIN: Well, it affected me profoundly on many levels. Number one, it brought harmony into my home, because my wife is a passionate photographer. All of the iPhones at home are full of photos and we have to always be downloading them. So when she fills her phone, my phone gets filled and just being around photography already makes her happy. So that was great on that level. Secondly, we had - Rabbi Gourarie mentioned that he asked me about D-Mo. “Sure”, I said, “it was great”. A number of people came


up to me seeing D-Mo around us quite a bit. ...(Indistinct)... “I think she may be a spy from the East German people just pretending to be Polish”. I said, “And therefore, you never know. You could get killed. Who knows”. I said, “At least it will be well-photographed. It will be documented, which is great”. So it gave us really an opportunity to have some beautiful photographs. There are many, many, many photographs that D-Mo has taken and, you know, we have always believed, and I speak for Rabbi Gourarie as well, that we have a great and beautiful tradition. Australia has been extremely, extremely inclusive and welcoming of the many, many races that have come and called Australia home today and that’s really what’s made Australia the great country that it is and there’s almost a sense of responsibility to be able to share our story with those who otherwise wouldn’t be exposed to it and what better way than through photography. So this has been an incredible journey and one that is only halfway there. It’s a journey that’s going to continue, because D-Mo will continue to photograph and we look forward to being able to be part of that ongoing journey.

RABBI GOURARIE: Just to add a little bit, yeah, but that speaks for me as well, but I think one of the things that when D-Mo came to BINO was, you know, sometimes people do things week in, week out. They come, they study and to suddenly realise actually that it’s of interest to other people, it’s of interest to the maybe the wider community was quite an interesting thing and I have to say the way D-Mo took pictures, like you know, we have lessons and some of them are quite intense and complicated and complex in depth study sometimes and it was a great knack of just coming in and taking the photos and people weren’t distracted, which was a tribute to your photography. But, yeah, it was very interesting.

LAYA SLAVIN: (Indistinct) a question not so much of a question but to answer what you were just asked before, when D-Mo first met us was Hanukkah time. We had come home from a function after the dancing pictures and we began to light as a family the menorah. D-Mo sat with us and there was question after question. The photography wasn’t just a picture. She needed to understand it in depth, what we were doing, why we were doing, the history, the story behind it. So for all of us, I have to say thank you to D-Mo, because we got to learn a lot more. Instead of just doing the act, we actually got to understand it with the most incredible depth. I think we sat until about midnight. You know, it was hours and hours over this one candle lighting, which was so beautiful for us but allowed us to watch it being explained just took it to a whole other dimension, so for that I thank D-Mo. Thank you so much.

ANNI TURNBULL: Well, I’d like to thank…

RABBI SLAVIN: I just want to add this one thing on that last thing.

ANNI TURNBULL: Sure.


RABBI SLAVIN: It’s interesting because photography is an art form. One of the beautiful ways in which a very special woman whose name was Hannah referred to the almighty, referred to God, during a very difficult time in her own life when she was not able to conceive and she terribly wanted a baby and she says in Hebrew אין רוק כמו אלוהים, “Ein tzur ke'Elokeinu”, “There is no rock like God”.

In a play on words, “tzur” could change to “tzia”. “Tzia” means a sculpture, an artist, and what Hannah was saying to God was there is really no artist like you who is able to sculpt. We came - coming down here, you come through the park. There’s all these wonderful sculptures, but there is one sculpture who sculpts a sculpture within another sculpture. So you have one sculpture and inside that sculpture is another one. That’s obviously through pregnancy, where you have one very beautiful form and within that beautiful form and within that beautiful form, there is another form, which is forming and that’s the work of God. So I think to conclude here, D-Mo was incredible photography, incredible art. In the meantime, sculpting a new little miniature - who knows, maybe it’s one of two - coming along so we want to wish you good health and an easy delivery and a lot of job from this new gift which is coming your way.

D-MO ZAJAC: Thank you so much.

ANNI TURNBULL: Thank you so much. We will finish on that beautiful note. Thank you very much for coming.

RABBI SLAVIN: Thank you.

ANNI TURNBULL: Thank you.

D-MO ZAJAC: Thank you.

((ENDS))


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