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Executive Interview s
Page 12 1999-2000 Edition POLLSTAR
When the company relocated toLos Angeles, Bonde found a newway to unwind – surfing. Right
now, he’s probably looking for hiswaders, and his rod and reel be-cause he’s moving the shop back to
its place of origin. “We’ll be up andrunning again in Tahoe November1st,” he said. “I’ve always said that
we’re just visiting in L.A.”Some industry types may balk at
the business ramifications of mov-ing from a bucolic mountain town
to the music epicenter and back,but Bonde has always played by hisown rules.
“I’ve never worked for anotheragency. I don’t really know howthis industry is supposed to work; I
just know the way I do it.”Like many of his peers, Bonde
played in bands while he was in
college. He loved the San Franciscoclub scene and the music, but notrehearsing. “That’s why I got in the
business. I was the guy hustling upthe gigs.”
When his last band broke up, he
decided to handle business for someother acts, since that’s what he en-joyed the most, anyway. He started
managing bands in San Franciscoand Berkeley, and eventuallyhooked up with one he really loved.
“I put all my eggs in one basket forthis band that I really believed inand when they split up, I had no
say in the matter and no job. I re-alized that it would be better towork with more clients and on a
limited basis. That’s how I became
an agent. Bands can come and go,things change, but the business ismore stable.”
Bonde said he’s been reinventingthe wheel ever since. “Sometimes, Iwonder if it’s a good thing or a bad
thing that I’ve never worked foranyone else. I struggle to figurethings out when the answer should
be obvious. On the other hand, Ididn’t come into this jaded or witha narrow-minded way of thinking.”
An open mind combined with a
true understanding of the nichemarket made the Tahoe Agency thebooker of choice for tour stalwarts
The Skatalites, Less Than Jake,and The Aquabats. A number ofthird-wave ska and punk bands
were nurtured by Bonde and hesaw all-too-fleeting success whenSublime broke that scene wide
open. Then the death of Sublimefrontman Brad Nowell in May1996 caused Bonde to reevaluate
just about everything. “I’ve realizedthat I have to place equal impor-tance on quality of life and career.
When you do that, you end up do-ing better in both,” he said.
Now, he’s about to see his most
popular act, Blink-182, headlineits first arena tour. Once again,Bonde has played an instrumental
role in turning a good band witha cult following into a big-timeconcert draw.
Throughout his career, Bonde’sideals and business principles re-main firmly connected to his per-
sonal beliefs. “I came into it
wondering if someone could besuccessful if they weren’t a ruthless,raving lunatic. I thought I could do
the job, retain my humanity andtry to make deals that work foreverybody. So far, that approach
has been good for us.”
The Tahoe Agency has gone
through some interesting
changes in the past few years.
Yes, it has. We grew to a point
where the company got very large.
We had almost 30 clients and
there were seven of us working in
the office. It was kind of exciting
but at the same time, I found my-
self running a business instead of
being an agent and that was kind
of a drag because I like being an
agent. I like being on the phone,
talking to people and getting
things done. I needed to go back
to that. That’s the main reason
why we trimmed the roster and
the staff down considerably. My
former staff in Tahoe – Tony Mar-
tin, Corie Christopher and Sara
Vale – are all great and I continue
to value their contributions.
We’re going to keep it small. I
like the Jerry McGuire approach –
fewer clients, better service. It’s
more enjoyable, more relaxing and
I actually get to keep a little bit of
the money we make. Before, we
had such high overhead. It just
works better this way.
It’s not about my status in the
industry or my social status, or
how big the company can be.
It’s about following through and
doing the best job we can.
We’ve made a commitment to
our clients.
It seems like you’ve had the
freedom to learn as you go
and that you’re not afraid to
do things differently.
The bands are partly responsible
for the way we do things. Skankin’
Pickle drove it into my head: ‘We
do not play shows that are not all-
ages.’ Every tour, I’d get stuck
somewhere and bring them an of-
fer that wasn’t all-ages, and they’d
always say, ‘No, it’s not going to
happen.’ They really, really helped
me understand that there is a
world out there where the show is
for the kids. It’s not about selling
beer.
There are all kinds of opportuni-
ties at that level of touring. I enjoy
talking to independent promoters
and kids who want to promote
shows. I can always tell when it’s a
real young kid wanting to do a
show because they always say, ‘Hi.
Um, uh....’ they don’t know how to
start the conversation.
I love talking to kids and ex-
plaining how to make a deal. Then
they say, ‘But I don’t want to make
any money. It’s not about making
money for me.’ I tell them that we
want them to make money. If they
make money, then they’ll be in
business and we can work with
them in the future.
Quite often, we’re on the phone
teaching concert business 101.
Now we know where the next
generation of indie promoters
will come from.
The Tahoe Agency school of
promotion. We teach them our
way so we can take advantage of
them later. ‘What do you mean,
promoter profit? All deals are 90-
10 at the club level.’
No, we really want them to see
that they are entitled to make a
buck. Of course, I am responsible
for the artists I represent, but
Rick BondeThe Tahoe Agency
After a hard day of deal-making, routing tours
and negotiating, Rick Bonde likes to get
back to nature. When the Tahoe Agency was located
in Lake Tahoe, he would sometimes go fly-fishing.
s Executive Interview
POLLSTAR 1999-2000 Edition Page 13
some of these are really young
bands that aren’t being pursued by
every big promoter in the country.
I let the bands know that it’s OK
to give a reduction if someone
loses a lot of money on the show
because we want these people to
stay in business.
The relationships with the little
guys and the young kids are im-
portant. We want them to still be
in business the next time we come
around and we want them to be
excited about working with us.
Obviously, you don’t take
the rubber-stamp approach to
deal-making.
You have to look at the whole
pie and make the best deal you can
for your client without screwing
everyone else. I absolutely know
who I represent. My first responsi-
bility rests with my artist and I
make the best deal possible for
them. That means making the best
of what’s available.
I want to find out what the true
gross is, what the true expenses
are and make a deal based on that.
It doesn’t have to be the standard
deal that everyone has been mak-
ing over the years; it just has to be
the best deal we can make.
Now that Blink is blowing up,
promoters call me up and say,
‘What do you want?’ and I say, ‘I
want 110 percent of the gross.’ It’s
a joke, but it seems like that’s what
everybody is doing.
Do you have the added task
of keeping the ticket price low
since your bands have young
audiences?
Yes, and Blink is certainly an
example of that. They realize that
they could make more money, but
they want to keep the ticket prices
fair and they’re willing to take the
money that goes along with that
deal.
Blink-182 makes more or less
money based on the ticket price. If
they want to make more money,
the ticket price goes up. If they are
willing to make less money, the
ticket price comes down. We still
try to get all the money on a low
ticket price and that makes pro-
moters crazy. But they know that’s
coming. They know we’re going to
fight over the merchandise rate
and the ticket price, and I’m still
going to try to get as much
money as I can.
Blink wants to keep the T-shirt
prices reasonable and that is al-
ways the biggest fight. Promoters
say, ‘The band is going to have to
realize that they’re getting to the
next level and they’re going to
have to start living with these
merch rates.’
My answer to that is, ‘Why?
Who said we have to get used to
these merch rates? I didn’t make
that rule and I don’t have to live
by it.’
I won a $10 bet with a promoter
on the school deal where they said,
‘There’s no way this school is go-
ing to go with this merch rate.’ I
said, ‘I bet you 10 bucks that if we
ask very nicely and explain why
we want the lower rate, we’ll get it.’
We got it from 30 percent down
to 10 percent. It can happen; you
can change the rules.
Blink-182 and Less Than Jake
didn’t make these rules. When
someone wants to give me 40 per-
cent of the hot dog and soda sales,
they can have 40 percent of the
merch. It’s a good fight and we’ll
continue to fight it.
Do you go out of your way to
work with promoters who are
more flexible?
We absolutely want to work
with promoters who think that
way. That’s one of the many rea-
sons why we have such a strong
relationship with Goldenvoice. We
definitely pick and choose who we
work with based on how they treat
the audience.
I’ve seen promoters who treat
the audience strictly as a commod-
ity. Once they’ve sold the ticket,
that kid doesn’t matter anymore.
That’s not the way we do business.
The people I want to work with are
the people who understand that
they invited
these kids to
come to this
party. They are
responsible for
their safety, their
well-being and
their happiness at
their show. I
don’t think it’s
the band’s and
the agent’s re-
sponsibility to
drive that into
the promoters’
heads. The good
promoters are the
ones who already
understand that.
Their job is just
beginning when
the kids line up
outside the door.
Safety is always a concern
where kids are involved.
How much responsibility falls
on the band and how much is
personal responsibility?
Ultimately, I think it’s a matter
of personal responsibility. I think
that, in this country, we’ve forgot-
ten about personal responsibility. I
remember when someone fell into
the Grand Canyon and they sued
the park service. It’s a big hole in
the ground; you get too close, you
might fall in.
I think parents need to know
where their kids are and what
they’re doing. They can call me if
they want to find out what hap-
pens at a concert. I’ve had a lot of
parents ask me if it’s safe for a 14-
year-old to go to a show. Parents
need to know what goes on at
concerts. Go with the kids, see
what goes on and decide for them-
selves.
I think kids need to be respon-
sible as well and realize what is
safe in a mosh pit and what isn’t.
A mosh pit can be safe, but it just
takes a couple of testosterone-
fueled knuckleheads out there
swinging their elbows and run-
ning into everybody. That drives
the true fans out, it drives the girls
away and it’s no fun.
Everyone needs to take respon-
sibility starting from the time
when we’re putting the deal to-
gether. I do not want to sell a show
until every dollar is squeezed out
of every kid in the market. I want
the place to be packed but I don’t
want it to be an unsafe situation. I
understand that the promoters
don’t make any money until the
last 20 people are in the door, so
oftentimes, they’re forced to cut
corners because of the way the
deals are structured.
The bands do need to take re-
sponsibility as well. Young people
in bands – at least the ones I work
with – understand the situation
well because we talk about it.
When you’re real young and all
of a sudden you have a micro-
phone and a PA in your control,
it’s a power thing and it can be
dangerous.
I think the bands need to
understand that power and use it
wisely. There’s a productive way
to use that power on a safety level
and on a social level.
THE AGENT and Universal Concerts Canada’s Elliott Lefkoat the 1998 CIC.
Executive Interview s
Page 14 1999-2000 Edition POLLSTAR
How do you help a band grow
with the fans and not fall victim
to trends?
You try to get ahead of the
curve. Bands like Less Than Jake
certainly transcend the ska craze.
They have pure musical ability and
an absolutely fantastic show. It’s
undeniable. A band like that will
always shine through no matter
what’s popular at the moment.
Long-term survival is all about
touring. There is really no other
way to ensure that a band can out-
live a trend. Less Than Jake has
never really had tremendous suc-
cess as far as radio goes. They
didn’t get a hit on radio when ska
hit the mainstream, but they’re the
ones who are still going and their
success is all about touring.
They’ve made great records,
they’ve made a lot of friends, they
work with other bands and they
work with the label. All those
things have helped, but with Less
Than Jake, it’s all about touring.
They simply wouldn’t be as suc-
cessful as they are if they sucked
live. Every time they play, in any
market, they attract more fans.
And it’s not based on radio play.
Isn’t that basically how Blink-182
broke as well?
It’s exactly the same. Blink
worked their asses off for years. It
was so cool – [guitarist] Tom
[Delonge] came to me a while ago
and said, ‘I always wondered why
you guys stuck with us. We used
to make $50 a night. It was a joke.
We’d wonder why you’d stick with
a band that never made any
money.’
Well, this is why. I knew they
had it, their fans knew they had it.
[Warped Tour organizer] Kevin
Lyman knew. The Warped Tour
was very instrumental in their
success as was their manager, Rick
DeVoe. He’s positioned them so
well in the surf and skate scene.
They now have a huge fanbase.
All it takes is a couple of radio
hits and bang! All of a sudden,
you’re selling out a 10,000- to
11,000- seat show in L.A. in 10
minutes. It’s absolutely amazing.
Universal Amphitheatre and Irvine
sold out that quickly.
How do you feel about House
of Blues buying the tour?
We have an agreement with
House of Blues Entertainment
that we’re absolutely thrilled about.
It’s a fantastic deal. It’s for 50 dates
running through this tour and
into the next tour.
I’m very excited to be working
with such a great company and
I’m absolutely sincere about that.
Jason Miller from the Denver of-
fice was instrumental in putting
this deal together. He had the fore-
sight to jump on this and bring
this tour to the company. It was
his idea. He should be considered a
great asset to the company. Mel-
issa Miller is a true professional
and a pleasure to work with, and
Kevin Morrow is ... Kevin Morrow.
This happened when HoB and
Universal were still two separate
companies and Kevin had the guts
to step out and make the offer. He
just did it and I thought that was
amazing. I think it’s shaping up to
be a tremendous company.
The cool thing about the deal
with HoB is we succeeded, for the
most part, in not leaving out any
of the band’s usual promoters.
There are exceptions. Unfortu-
nately, my favorite promoter in
the world is not entirely thrilled
with us because they are not thepromoter in their market. That was
tough but it’s a matter of geogra-
phy. The Universal Amphitheatre
is now part of the HoB empire and
Goldenvoice doesn’t get to be the
sole promoter there. I certainly un-
derstand what that feels like.
But overall, I think this deal is
good for the promoters. I think it’s
healthy and good to remain inde-
pendent, but it’s also important to
have relationships with people in
the larger conglomerates. If a tour
is going to be bought by SFX or
HoB and you’re an independent
promoter in a market where nei-
ther of those companies has the
right building, you are going to get
those shows.
L.A.’s an easy call, but how
did you know this was the right
time to move into larger venues
in other markets?
It was an interesting process.
No one on the band or manage-
ment side really wanted to step
out too far and rightfully so. It was
a smart move to not go too big.
Obviously, the best thing is make
sure you sell out.
Jay Boberg, the president of
MCA Records, and I really be-
lieved all along that the band
would be able to do these types of
numbers. In certain markets, we
played it real safe and only went
to 3,000 seats, and in other mar-
kets, we went into arenas but we
did the deal based on half the
house. We went to the band and
said, ‘You’ve got a 5,000 seater and
let’s put it on sale and see what
happens. There’s no in-between.
You’re too big to play a 3,000
seater and 7,000 is iffy, but that’s
what we’ve got. So let’s go in at a
scaled-down 5,000. Then all of a
sudden, we’re on the phone to all
those promoters, increasing the
capacity in those rooms.
In a couple of markets, we’re in
too small of a venue and there
isn’t a bigger room. In New York
City, what do we do? Go to Madi-
son Square Garden? So we stayed
at Roseland and it’s sold out. We
didn’t have time on the tour to do
multiple nights in those venues.
It’s OK to save some of the juice
for the next tour.
Do you think there’s a way
for the national tours to work
for everyone?
I do. A few years ago, everyone
was scared for their job because
they thought the national promot-
ers were going to go straight to
the managers. Frankly, these deals
are rather complicated and the
managers don’t have the time to
wrestle with all the details. They
have so many responsibilities al-
ready. To negotiate a deal this large
and this all-encompassing ... I just
don’t think they have the time.
I think the expertise and experi-
ence of an agent is still valuable. I
think the system as we know it
will stay intact for a while. I also
think that as the consolidation
continues, you’re going to need
the agent to fight for what’s right
for the band. As you have fewer
and fewer options, you need to
make sure your deals are tighter
and better.
Would you ever tell a band
to take the lower offer in the
name of loyalty?
Absolutely. It goes beyond loy-
alty. It’s about doing the right
thing. I was talking to Mitch
Okmin about how it comes down
to playing the right room. It’s not
about getting the most money or
who the promoter is, it’s about the
right situation for the band.
On this Blink tour, we took less
money in a lot of situations where
we could have made more but it
wasn’t right. We’re looking for cer-
tain positioning right now and
that’s the priority.
How do you feel about the whole
promoter consolidation process?
Well, I can tell you I was be-
yond thrilled when HoB bought
Universal Concerts. It was a scary
time. Like everyone else, I was
thinking, what is going on here?
What’s the end result of all the
consolidation going to be?
It happens in every industry. In
some instances, it’s good, but in
some cases, it’s very questionable
because – at least from the artist’s
standpoint – you need as many
options as possible. That’s what
makes capitalism work. Every
time a promoter gets rid of the
competition – however big or
small the market is – the artist
loses options and negotiating
power.
You have firsthand knowledge
of what a lack of competition
can do?
s Executive Interview
POLLSTAR 1999-2000 Edition Page 15
Sure. I think every agent has
seen it. When a promoter puts in a
low offer, it just makes your heart
sink. I passed on an offer for the
Aquabats because it was so low it
made me mad. The promoter’s re-
sponse was, ‘Oh, wow, I didn’t
know I was up against anyone. I
didn’t know I had any competition
on this show.’ Well, you did. And
even if you didn’t, it doesn’t make
it OK to make a bad offer.
You shouldn’t have to accept
whatever someone offers just be-
cause no one is bidding against
them. Even if you have a history
with someone, you still have to
find that fair market value. They
get the first shot at it, but they still
need to be fair.
Speaking of fairness, you’ve
worked really hard on bands
that have left you for another
agency just as they start to see
real success.
I have to say that, yes, we have
lost some bands. But everyone
loses clients. We’ve lost some cli-
ents right when they’re getting
really successful and I actually
take some pride in that because I
think it proves that we’ve picked
some darn good bands.
I started working with all of
these bands because I believed in
their music. I lost some belief in
their business tactics and I’m not
entirely thrilled with the way some
things have happened, but origi-
nally, I fell in love with the music.
I’m really proud of what we’ve
been able to do. Picking the right
bands is its own measure of suc-
cess and it’s brought me some
cool opportunities. I have an A&R
consulting arrangement with
MCA Records because I’ve been
able to pick some decent bands.
We’re a little tiny agency in
Lake Tahoe and we’ve had some
great success. If we did a mediocre
job, that wouldn’t have happened.
You’ve taken risks with certain
bands. When you picked up
Sublime, no one else would
touch them.
They had the worst reputation
for missing shows and you know
what? They missed one show in
the time that I worked with them.
They couldn’t get into Canada be-
cause of their previous records,
which I should have figured out
but was unaware of when I booked
the show.
Brad Nowell’s death must have
been devastating.
Losing a client for business rea-
sons means nothing to me; losing
Sublime meant everything to me.
I had gotten to a point where I had
really, really focused and dedicated
my life and my career to Sublime.
I felt the music was that important
– I really did.
I saw exactly what was going on
with the band; I saw how it was
working. In some ways, they were
on the same path as the Grateful
Dead. They had very loyal fans
and you never knew what was go-
ing to happen at a concert. It could
be the most spectacular thing
you’d ever seen in your life or it
could be a train wreck. They gener-
ated huge excitement.
I put everything into that band.
Of course, I was working with
other clients and I was running
my business, but when things
were starting to peak with Sub-
lime, that’s when I felt my career
had meaning to it.
I was crushed when Brad died. It
sent me into a tailspin. It took
moving to L.A. to break me out of
it. I was in a really heavy funk. All
of a sudden, it was like all the
meaning in my career was out the
window. I don’t want to take any-
thing away from my other clients
– I don’t want it to come across
that way – but it was a very per-
sonal loss for me.
I take responsibility for losing
some other clients because, in
hindsight, I wasn’t into it as much
as I should have been. A lot of pro-
moters noticed it at the time – all
of a sudden, I wasn’t handling the
bands, the other Tahoe agents
were. It was really tough but I’ve
kept the business going and
moved on.
I guess I’ve been in the busi-
ness for awhile because I’ve lost a
great client and musician to an
overdose, I’ve lost a good friend
and colleague to an overdose in
Gabe Bloom, and now I’ve lost a
client to old age in Roland
Alfonso of the Skatalites.
If you stick with this business
long enough, these things are go-
ing to happen and you adapt and
find ways to deal with it. It makes
you really evaluate what is impor-
tant. I don’t worry as much as I
used to. I don’t stay awake at night
worrying about business stuff or
things that I don’t have any real
control over. I don’t wonder all the
time if something is going to go
wrong. Things go wrong but I
have this confidence now, and I
know I can survive and cope.
Do you have a more “human”
perspective on the business
because of your personal
experiences?
Oh, definitely. That’s what’s
hard. I’ve always tried to run my
business on that level and this in-
dustry makes it really difficult. It’s
all about making the deals and
getting off the phone. Everybody
is in a huge hurry and I wind up
yelling at people who you really
like. When things like that happen,
you have to step back and remem-
ber there is no point in treating
people or yourself that way. You
can’t forget that, ever.
I always want to know, ‘What’s
the real cost of making money?
What is the social, environmental
or psychological cost? Is it worth
possible injury? Death? Are we
sacrificing long-term success for
the quick buck?
Making money is great; I love
making money. But I want to do it
the right way.
Has anyone ever told you
that you can’t be successful and
have a conscience?
Sure they have and I couldn’t
care less. I run my own life. And
besides, I’ve proved them wrong
and I plan on continuing to show
that there is more than one way to
do business. *
BLINK-182 guitarist Tom Delonge (L) Bonde and the band’s manager, Rick DeVoe(R) are ready to hang 10 during a 1996 tour of Japan.