Letters to an Editor - Carver and Lish

7/26/2019 Letters to an Editor - Carver and Lish

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Letters to an Editor

Following are excerpts from Carvers correspondence with Lish, from 1969 to 1983.

November 12, 1969

Well, as it happens I do have a few stories on hand, and Im sending them along within th

next day or two. I hope you can find something you like.

July 15, 1970

Hombre, thanks for the superb assist on the stories. No one has done that for me since

was 18, I mean it. High time I think, too. Feel the stories are first class now, but whatever

the outcome there, I appreciate the fine eye you turned on them. Hang tough.

January 19, 1971

I think its a fine story. Took about all yr changes, added a few things here and there. Ho

to get it retyped by this evening and back off to you. No later than tomorrow, sure. Than

for going over it.Listen, something you said a long time ago, the thing itself is what

matters. Is true, in the end. Im not bothered. Ive always been the slowest kid in class

anyway, right down there. But I keep trying, even at this advanced age. So lean on it, if y

see things. If I dont agree, Ill say something, never fear.

November 11, 1974

Well, listen, cant exactly tell you how pleased and so on about the prospects of having

collection out under your aegis . . . along with McGraw-Hill, of course. First reaction was

to run out and buy two bottles of champagne for a champagne breakfast. . . . But all tha

is neither here nor there. What Im concerned about and thrilled about is having out a

book of stories, & from there on I intend, brother, to set the globe afire, believe me. . . . I

tell you this, youve not backed a bad horse. . . . About the editing necessary in some of

the stories. Tell me which ones and Ill go after it, or them. Tell me which ones. Or I will

leave it up to you & you tell me what you think needs done or doing.

September 27, 1977

The most wonderful thing about this stay in McKinleyville, though, is that Ive got sober

and intend to stay that way. Ive never done anything in my life Ive felt so good about as

getting and staying sober. What can I say? [Lish had left Esquire.] Youve made a single

handed impression on American letters that has helped fix the course of American lette


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And, of course, you know, old bean, just what an influence youve exercised on my life.

Just knowing you were there, at your desk, was an inspiration for me to write, and you

know I mean that. You, my friend, are my idea of an ideal reader, always have been,

always, that is, forever, will be. So you loomed large on the literary scene, and that is a

fact, as well as a truth, but you loomed large in my conscious and unconscious life as we

September 8, 1978

Tess Gallagher, that Irish lass, I like to have fallen in love with her. She left, went to Tucso

on businessshell be teaching there next year, shes on a Guggy this yearthen

returned and we spent a fine week together, I put her on a plane to Seattle yesterday,

today I get a dozen red roses from her.

February 1, 1979

Im going to Mardi Gras with Tess; and the Fords are coming down in March for spring

break and were going into Mexico by train for a week. . . . Im happy, and Im sober. Its

aces right now, Gordon. I know better than anyone a fellow is never out of the woods, bu

right now its aces, and Im enjoying it.

May 10, 1980

As for lunch, lord, it was the high point of my visit to NYC, nothing mindless or silly, at

least not on your part. I delight in your company, simple as that. You know, I feel closer t

you than I do to my own brother. Have for a long time, years. We dont see each other thoften, or talk on the phone weekly, etc., but I know youre there and its important to me

Besides, youre my herodont you know? Ever since you left PA [Palo Alto] and went o

into the Great World and began sending me messages back from time to time what it wa

like out there. Your friendship and your concern have enriched my life. Theres no

question of your importance to me. Youre my mainstay. Man, I love you. I dont make tha

declaration lightly either. . . . For Christs sweet sake, not to worry about taking a pencil

the stories if you can make them better; and if anyone can you can. I want them to be th

best possible stories, and I want them to be around for a while. . . . I never figured I was

going to get rich or even earn a living writing stories and poems. Be enough, you know,

have Knopf do a book of mine and have you as my editor. So open the throttle. Ramming

speed.

July 8, 1980, 8 A.M.

Dearest Gordon,


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Ive got to pull out of this one. Please hear me. Ive been up all night thinking on this, and

nothing but this, so help me. Ive looked at it from every side, Ive compared both versio

of the edited mssthe first one is better, I truly believe, if some things are carried over

from the second to the firstuntil my eyes are nearly to fall out of my head. You are a

wonder, a genius, and theres no doubt of that, better than any two of Max Perkins, etc.,

etc. And Im not unmindful of the fact of my immense debt to you, a debt I can simply

never, never repay. This whole new life I have, so many of the friends I now have, this job

up here, everything, I owe to you for Will You Please. Youve given me some degree ofimmortality already. Youve made so many of the stories in this collection better, far bett

than they were before. And maybe if I were alone, by myself, and no one had ever seen

these stories, maybe then, knowing that your versions are better than some of the ones

had sent, maybe I could get into this and go with it. But Tess has seen all of these and

gone over them closely. Donald Hall has seen many of the new ones (and discussed the

at length with me and offered his services in reviewing the collection) and Richard Ford,

Toby Wolff, Geoffrey Wolff, too, some of them. . . . How can I explain to these fellows

when I see them, as I will see them, what happened to the story in the meantime, after it

book publication? Maybe if the book were not to come out for 18 months or two years, it

would be different. But right now, everything is too new. . . . Gordon, the changes are

brilliant and for the better in most casesI look at What We Talk About . . . (Beginners

and I see what it is that youve done, what youve pulled out of it, and Im awed and

astonished, startled even, with your insights. But its too close right now, that story. Now

much of this has to do with my sobriety and with my new-found (and fragile, I see) men

health and well-being. Ill tell you the truth, my very sanity is on the line here. I dont wanto sound melodramatic here, but Ive come back from the grave here to start writing

stories once more. As I think you may know, Id given up entirely, thrown it in and was

looking forward to dying, that release. But I kept thinking, Ill wait until after the election

kill myself, or wait until after this or that happened, usually something down the road a

ways, but it was never far from my mind in those dark days, not all that long ago. Now, I

incomparably better, I have my health back, money in the bank, the right woman for this

time of my life, a decent job, blah blah. But I havent written a word since I gave you the

collection, waiting for your reaction, that reaction means so much to me. Now, Im afraid

mortally afraid, I feel it, that if the book were to be published as it is in its present edited

form, I may never write another story, thats how closely, God Forbid, some of those

stories are to my sense of regaining my health and mental well-being. . . .

Please help me with this, Gordon. I feel as if this is the most important decision Ive ever

been faced with, no shit. I ask for your understanding. Next to my wife, and now Tess, yo

have been and are the most important individual in my life, and thats the truth. I dont


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want to lose your love or regard over this, oh God no. It would be like having a part of

myself die, a spiritual part. Jesus, Im jabbering now. But if this causes you undue

complication and grief and you perhaps understandably become pissed and discourage

with me, well, Im the poorer for it, and my life will not be the same again. True. On the

other hand, if the book comes out and I cant feel the kind of pride and pleasure in it tha

want, if I feel Ive somehow too far stepped out of bounds, crossed that line a little too fa

why then I cant feel good about myself, or maybe even write again; right now I feel its

that serious, and if I cant feel absolutely good about it, I feel Id be done for. I do. LordGod I just dont know what else to say. Im awash with confusion and paranoia. Fatigue

too, that too.

Please, Gordon, for Gods sake help me in this and try to understand. Listen. Ill say it

again, if I have any standing or reputation or credibility in the world, I owe it to you. I owe

you this more-or-less pretty interesting life I have. But if I go ahead with this as it is, it w

not be good for me. The book will not be, as it should, a cause for joyous celebration, bu

one of defense and explanation. . . . I know that the discomfort of this decision of mine i

at its highest now, its rampant, I feel nearly wild with it. But I know it will cause you grief

as well, explanations, more work, stopping everything in its tracks and coming up with

valid reasons for why. But, eventually, my discomfort and yours, will go away, therell be

grieving, Im grieving right now, but it will go away. But if I dont speak now, and speak

from the heart, and halt things now, I foresee a terrible time ahead for me. The demons

have to deal with every day, or night, nearly, might, Im afraid, simply rise up and take m

over.

Of course I know I shouldnt have signed the contract without first reading the collection

and making my fears, if any, known to you beforehand, before signing. So what should w

do now, please advise? Can you lay it all on me and get me out of the contract someway

Can you put the book off until Winter or Spring of 1982 and let them know I want to have

the stories in the collection published in magazines first (and thats the truth, several of

them are committed to places with publication way off next year)? Tell them I want the

magazine publications first, and then the book out when Im up for tenure here that spriof 1982? And then decide next year what, for sure, to do? Or else can or should

everything just be stopped now, I send back the Knopf check, if its on the way, or else

you stop it there? And meanwhile I pay you for the hours, days and nights, Im sure, you

spent on this. Goddamn it, Im just nearly crazy with this. Im getting into a state over it.

No, I dont think it shd. be put off. I think it had best be stopped.

I thought the editing, especially in the first version, was brilliant, as I said. The stories I

cant let go of in their entirety are these. Community Center (If It Please You) and The


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Bath (A Small Good Thing) and Id want some more of the old couple, Anna and Henry

Gates, in What We Talk About When We Talk About Love (Beginners). I would not wan

Mr. Fixit (Where Is Everyone) in the book in its present state. The story Distance

should not have its title changed to Everything Stuck to Him. Nor the little piece Mine

to Popular Mechanics. Dummy should keep its title. A Serious Talk is fine for Pie.

think Want to See Something is fine, is better than I Could See the Smallest Things.

.

Im just much too close to all of this right now. Its even hard for me to think right now. I

think, in all, maybe its just too soon for me for another collection. I know that next sprin

is too soon in any case. Absolutely too soon. I think I had best pull out, Gordon, before it

goes any further. I realize I stand every chance of losing your love and friendship over th

But I strongly feel I stand every chance of losing my soul and my mental health over it, if

dont take that risk. Im still in the process of recovery and trying to get well from the

alcoholism, and I just cant take any chances, something as momentous and permanent

as this, that would put my head in some jeopardy. Thats it, its in my head. You have ma

so many of these stories better, my God, with the lighter editing and trimming. But those

others, those three, I guess, Im liable to croak if they came out that way. Even though

they may be closer to works of art than the original and people be reading them 50 year

from now, theyre still apt to cause my demise, Im serious, theyre so intimately hooked

up with my getting well, recovering, gaining back some little self-esteem and feeling of

worth as a writer and a human being.

I know you must feel angry and betrayed and pissed off. Gods sake, Im sorry. I can pay

you for the time youve put in on this, but I cant begin to help or do anything about the

trouble and grief I may be causing there in the editorial and business offices that youll

have to go through. Forgive me for this, please. But Im just going to have to wait a while

yet for another book, 18 months, two years, its okay now, as long as Im writing and hav

some sense of worth in the process. Your friendship and your concern and general

championing of me have meant, and mean still, more to me than I can ever say. I could

never begin to repay you, as you must know. I honor and respect you, and I love you mothan my brother. But you will have to get me off the hook here Gordon, its true. I just ca

go another step forward with this endeavor. So please advise what to do now. . . . As I sa

Im confused, tired, paranoid, and afraid, yes, of the consequences for me if the collecti

came out in its present form. So help me, please, yet again. Dont, please, make this too

hard for me, for Im just likely to start coming unraveled knowing how Ive displeased an

disappointed you. God almighty, Gordon.

Ray


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Please do the necessary things to stop production of the book. Please try and forgive m

this breach.

July 10, 1980

Please look through the enclosed copy of What We Talk About, the entire collection.

Youll see that nearly all of the changes I suggest are small enough, but I think theyre

significant and they all can be found in the first edited ms version you sent me. Its just,

not just, but its a question of reinstating some of the things that were taken out in the

second version. But I feel strongly some of those things taken out should be back in the

finished stories. Gazebo, for instance. In this, too, she was right. That ending is far

superior and gives the story the right, the just ending, the narrators sense of loss, and a

sharp, perfect ending for the story. Otherwise, the narrator is a lout, a son of a bitch, an

totally insensitive to everything hes been telling us. Otherwise, why even is he telling th

story, I wonder.

July 14, 1980

Im thrilled about the book and its impending publication. Im stoked about it, and Im

already starting to think about the next one. More than thinking about it, in fact. Fact is,

Im giving some thought to taking the second semester off to do nothing but write and

write through the summer as well. . . . Things are in full swing, and I am just generally

excited, specifically too. I know you have my best interests at heart, and youll do

everything and more to further those interests. . . . I wont harp or dog, for I know thebook is going to astonish and give pleasure. So just these last words on the matter: plea

look at the suggestions Ive penciled in and entertain those suggestions seriously, even

finally you decide otherwise; if you think Im being my own worst enemy, you know, well

then, stick to the final version of the second edited version. But do give those things a

hard third or fourth look. My greatest fear is, or was, having them too pared, and Im

thinking of Community Center and The Bath both of which lost several pages each

the second editing. I want that sense of beauty and mystery they have now, but I dont

want to lose track, lose touch with the little human connections I saw in the first version

you sent me. They seemed somehow to be fuller in the best sense, in that first ed.

version. Maybe I am wrong in this, maybe you are 100% correct, just please give them

another hard look. Thats all. That and what I said about Where Is Everyone?Mr.

Coffee, Mr. Fixit.

August 11, 1982

Now I dont know for sure how were going to work out some of the disagreements wer


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bound to have over some of these stories Ive written and am writing this very minute. A

Im going to give you the book [Cathedral] on schedule, in November. . . . Anyway,

youre the best editor there is, and a writer yourself, you bet, and you have to call them

the way you see them. Fair enough. But I may not be in agreement with you, and this is

whats worrying me right this minute. . . .

Forgive me. But hear me out. Im saying that despite all and fuck all, Ive been writing

short stories ever since I landed out here in this woodsy cranny. Ive got five new ones, nsix, counting the one I just typed out a second draft of earlier tonight and hope to finish

at least have some more drafts of, before the week is out. Ive been writing as if my life

depended on it and like theres no tomorrow. And we both know that first may be true, a

theres always likelihood of the second. (And fuck no, I cant get off the cigarettes either

. . . But one thing is certainthe stories in this new collection are going to be fullerthan

the ones in the earlier books. And this, for Christs sake, is to the good. Im not the same

writer I used to be. But I know there are going to be stories in these 14 or 15 I give you th

youre going to draw back from, that arent going to fit anyones notion of what a Carver

short story ought to beyours, mine, the reading public at large, the critics. But Im not

them, Im not us, Im me. Some of these stories may not fit smoothly or neatly, inevitably

alongside the rest. But, Gordon, Gods truth, and I may as well say it out now, I cant

undergo the kind of surgical amputation and transplant that might make them someway

into the carton so the lid will close. There may have to be limbs and heads of hair stickin

out. My heart wont take it otherwise. It will simply burst, and I mean that. Dearest friend

of all, brother, you know what Im saying, and I know you understand. Even if you think Idead wrong. . . .

I love your heart, you must know that. But I cant write these stories and have to feel

inhibitedif I feel inhibited Im not going to write them at alland feel that if you, the

reader I want to please more than any, dont like them, youre going to re-write them fro

top to bottom. Why, if I think that the pen will fall right out of my fingers, and I may not b

able to pick it up. . . .

You understand Im not saying, or even remotely thinking, that these new and year-old

stories are beyond criticism, or that they wont need editing. Not true. Not true in either

case. Youre as close to me, and my work, you couldnt be closer, if you were my blood

brother. Youre the left side of me. Or the right side, take your pick. But I guess Im trying

to say here that were going to have to work very closely together on this bookthe mo

important book of them all for me, at every stage, and be careful and understanding wit

each other. Gordon, the last book passed as if in a dream for me. This one cant go that

way, and we both know it.


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October 3, 1982

Listen, Ive finished work on the new Knopf book of stories. Last week I got them all bac

from the typist and I spent all day today reading them through. Its going to be somethin

that book. I thought I would try and put them in order, the order Id like to see them in th

book, but just a few minutes ago gave up on that. Ill leave that up to you. I dont have a

title, either. We talked, a year ago, about calling the book Cathedral. Thats fine with m

and maybe lead off with that story and finish with Fever, a long story, or A Small GoodThing, another long story. But I will leave the arrangement of the stories up to you. You

know I want and have to have autonomy on this book and that the stories have to come

out looking very essentially the way they look right now. Im of course not saying we can

change words or phrases or a line here and there, and punctuation, sure. But after youv

read the book, Ill come down and well talk about titles, the ordering, or any suggestion

you might have.

October 29, 1982

As I said before, I would be happy with either title, Cathedral or Where Im Calling

From. . . . My biggest concern, as you know, is that the stories remain intact. Oh, Christ

sure, you know, if you see some words or sentences that can be trimmed, thats fine, tri

them. You know what Im saying. Please help me with this book as a good editor, the be

. . . but not as my ghost. I tell you, I may be reading it all wrongand if I am, I dont care,

in a very profound waybut I think there is a great deal of good will established toward

me, or for me; and this book, the stories, are going to be so different, in so many regardfrom so many of the earlier stories, that the book is going to be met with a good show of

enthusiasm, even celebration. And, yes, Im eager to have that artist you were talking

about do something for the cover, if she can. Yes, for sure. I hope that works out. (But

that, finally, will be yourfinal decision; the matter of the text, in this case, has to be mine

November 19, 1982

From Lish to Carver

Dear RayHeres Where Im Calling From reworked to the extent that I think it must b

as basic as I can keep it. Im aware that weve agreed that I will try to keep my editing

the stories as slight as I deem possible, that you do not want me to do the extensive wo

I did on the first two collections. So be it, Ray. What you see in this sample is that

minimum: to do less than this, would be, in my judgment, to expose you too greatly. At a

events, look: if this is in keeping with your wishes, call quickly and say soand I will the

be guided thereby in my handling of the rest of the stories. Love, G.


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January 21, 1983

From Carver to Lish

Whats the matter, dont you love me anymore? I never hear from you. Have you forgotte

me already? Well, Im going back to the [Paris Review] interview and take out all the goo

things I said about you.

Documents

Letters to an Editor - Carver and Lish