How did you become President of the Chinese Academy of Sciences?I spent my whole life in science and higher education. Aft er I graduated from university I fi rst was an assistant, a lecturer then professor and President of Zhejiang University, south of Shanghai. Fift een years ago I moved to CAS, where I joined the presidium, and eventually took over from Zhou Guangzhao as president in 1997.

What is the role of CAS?In my view, CAS is the leading organization for scientifi c and high-technology research in China. Compared with the other organizations, CAS has a comprehensive representation of all disciplines. Th e academic division consists of about 699 academics as well as about 94 research institutes that focus on basic research and advanced technology, but also on social and economic development. CAS has a leading function for our innovative system in China, to serve the national demand and to advance the frontier of science in the world. Of course, CAS has faced many new challenges since China opened to the outside world and is now seeing a rapid development of science and technology. When I took over the presidency from my predecessor in 1997, we saw a fi nancial crisis in many Asian countries. At the same time, the Internet and information technologies not only had a major role in science and technology, but also started to create a new economic wealth.

How did you advance CAS? Early on, my colleagues and I discussed how we could advance and develop CAS. In that time, the budget of CAS was relatively low, just to cover the not-so-high salaries of our researchers. Th at means that our staff had to apply separately for any research funds. However, this makes long-term research very diffi cult and hinders the freedom of ideas. Th erefore, in a report to our top leaders, President Jiang Zemin and Prime Minister Zhu Rongji, we advised them how CAS could have a strategic role for our nation’s innovation system. Fortunately, we got a very positive response. Our top leaders were very keen to recognize that CAS should have a strategic role not just

for short-term technology transfer, but also for long-term research and the support of a sustainable development of our nation. Th e decision makers understood very well that science and technology should be driven not just by demand but also by the curiosity of scientists, and that the funding of research and development should not just be project-oriented but should be stable. During that time we started our Knowledge Innovation Program that aims to put us at the frontier of science and technology of the world. We also changed our salary and resource allocation mechanism and established a so-called three-dimensional salary system — a basic salary plus a position-oriented salary plus a performance-dependent salary. It encourages innovations from our staff and promotes academic success.

You also restructured your institutes?Yes, the aim is to meet the demand of our nation and to be at the frontier of science and technology in the world. Th is means not just more basic science. We also merged institutes in overlapping areas to save resources. We transferred some institutes devoted to very applied research to companies. We established a system of criteria emphasizing three types of research: One of course is fundamental research. But in comparison with universities, CAS should be devoted also to long-term interdisciplinary and target-oriented

research. As a second part, we should be concerned with resource management and the study of the ecosystem, including also climate change. Th e third research activity is high-technology development, for example in information technology, biotechnology, nanotechnology and advanced materials, as well as aero- and space technology, nuclear energy and so on.

How do you see the relationship between CAS and the universities in China?We have good relations with the universities, particularly in the fi eld of fundamental research. CAS has many collaborations with universities and we also have some joint laboratories, for example in nanotechnology. CAS, jointly with Tsinghua University and Peking University, established a National Nanoscience Centre in Beijing. In some areas, CAS is running big facilities open to universities, such as in high-energy and particle physics or the central radiation facility. We also have lots of joint research projects with university research teams, particularly in relation to sustainability and in high-technology development; although in this area maybe we are more competitive.

Do you also have international collaborations at these big facilities?All our facilities are open to both national and international functions. Many bigger research facilities collaborate with their foreign counterparts, particularly the Peking colliders and the heavy ion facility in Lanzhou. With our foreign partners we do not just exchange personnel and ideas. Every year CAS hosts more than 300 seminars, symposia and conferences. More than 800 senior scientists of CAS now have a major leading role in international scientifi c organizations and communities, or as editors of journals.

You also have a joint institute with Germany’s Max Planck Society?Sure, three years ago we established a joint institute in Shanghai, the Partner Institute for Computational Biology, which is now growing very fast and attracts a lot of distinguished scientists from abroad, not just from Germany and China. We

Leader of innovation in ChinaNature Materials spoke to Lu Yongxiang, President of the Chinese Academy of Sciences, on the roles that the academy and its more than 100 research-related institutions have in advancing science and technology in China.

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now plan to build a computing science network, not just to raise the capacity of this joint institute, but also linked to other computing research centres for example in theoretical chemistry, atmospheric research and so on. I am very pleased to see the joint institute running so well, and we have now established a similar joint institute with the French Institute Pasteur. We have also started to reform the institutes within CAS. Usually, the research institutes are just located in one campus, with their budget supported from central government. But the situation has changed. We now encourage our best institutes to raise their capabilities and to establish national and international networks, and particularly to establish partner research groups at the universities, or to establish technology-transfer centres at rapidly growing enterprises — particularly in fi elds such as applied research, in the establishment of monitoring station networks for environmental research, agriculture and so on.

How successful are you in attracting Chinese researchers back from abroad?In the thirty years since China opened to the outside maybe more than one million scholars went to study at universities abroad. As our economy advances and scientifi c research improves, many scholars return. CAS has established a special fund to support those people who come back and start research activities at CAS. Since 1994 we have received more than a thousand people, many of them leading scientists or directors of our institutes. We also started other programmes such as the international distinguished partnership programme, to support them returning for a part of the year only. Th is programme is very successful and allows us to keep close links with foreign universities and research organizations.

Is CAS on the right track to high-profi le research?We understand that personal creativity is important. But creativity has to be supported or encouraged through free discussion and interdisciplinary exchange of ideas. So we have to build up and improve scientifi c and innovative atmosphere within CAS and have a leading role for the scientifi c community in China. CAS has to make a real push for the strategic development of our nation and not just to make short-term eff orts. We need to pay attention to quality, not quantity. Also, it is not just a matter of choosing the right projects and having the right funding, but we also need the right criteria of assessment. For example, for fundamental research we have already introduced an international system for assessment of peer review. Applied research, on the other

hand, probably should be evaluated through our users — governmental departments and local authorities. For high-technology development, output in my view should be evaluated by the market and not just the scientifi c community itself. It is not so easy but we try our best.

Another key issue for CAS is education…Of course. CAS is not just a centre of R&D, but we are also a primary education force for graduate students. We now have a total of more than 42,000 postgraduate students. Th e students are closely embedded within our research activities. Th ese students are not only our future. Th ey are also the driving force for our present distinguished research activities. Most of the graduates from our programme leave for universities, go abroad, or go to industry. Th ey are the carriers of our knowledge and innovations. Th erefore, these students are the bridge between CAS and our society. It really is an excellent technology-transfer mechanism. I still think the diff erence between CAS and the universities is that the universities do a great job in education and that CAS does a great job in innovative research, including the nurture of younger talents.

How good is the communication between institutes? Indeed, we found that a barrier existed not only between the disciplines and diff erent institutes, but also between entire departments, and administration offi ces. Th erefore, we have now changed our administration procedures, and allocate more resources directly to institutes, giving them more autonomy and freedom. Also, we keep about 30 to 35 percent of our budget for interdisciplinary cross-institutional projects. Some fundamental research may just be funded through single research teams, but applied research projects oft en need to break through the barriers between disciplines and institutes.

Do you also create new institutes in emerging fi elds?Sure. Following the merger of some institutes with overlapping scope, we also established new institutions and changed the disciplines map. We even changed the geographic distribution of our institutes. Although we understand that an appropriate distribution of disciplines is important, we should also improve the geographic distribution of our research institutions to better meet the demand of our regional development. For example, aft er the reunifi cation of Germany, the Max Planck Society urgently established many new institutes in the eastern part of Germany. Jointly with local governments we also established some new institutions

across China. For example, we have new institutions in sustainability research, high-tech areas such nanotechnology, but also environmental research and the protection of urban areas. As China grows very rapidly, we need take care about the pollution of urban areas.

Th e budget of CAS has signifi cantly improved over the years. Do you think this trend will continue?I am sure. Generally, our national long-term plan for science and technology has already defi ned that the total R&D fund should reach 2.5% in GDP by 2020. My personal view is that 2.5% is not enough, and that we should reach 3.0% by 2020. Most OECD [Organization for Economic Co-operation and Development] countries have already reached 3.0%, and for example the Nordic countries and South Korea will continue to increase to 3.5% or even 4 to 4.5%. In addition, we should also keep the correct distribution of R&D resources between public institutions and commercial enterprises. A good ratio might be 30 to 70, respectively, or perhaps 40 to 60. And fi nally we have to consider again how to distribute funding within CAS. Should the proportion between fi xed budget and specifi c projects be 50 to 50, or 60 to 40? At the moment it is 50 to 50. Th is is an important issue, as a stable funding of basic research oft en is the driving force for many key innovations, such as the development of the internet. In my personal view, whether we should go for a ratio of 50 to 50 or 60 to 40 for stable funds and for competitive projects, respectively, depends on the structure of our innovation activities. In as far as fundamental research is concerned, then 60% stable funding might be better, but if we want to go more into high-technology areas, we might need a lower proportion. In the way we make use of our budget we of course have to follow the general rules of innovation, but we should also consider how to meet the demands of our nation, in order to support our economy and our social development.

Th e Olympics are taking place in Beijing this year. How is CAS involved?CAS and the scientifi c community of China contribute a lot to the Olympic Games through our knowledge and high technology. For example, the large laser display, the water-recycling facilities, the air-quality monitoring, the automatic transportation management systems, have all been developed or co-developed by CAS. We are providing many green technologies to improve the pollution situation, including for example hybrid and electrical cars.

Interview by Joerg Heber

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