Know How Waiters Read Your Table to Get Better Service

7/29/2019 Know How Waiters Read Your Table to Get Better Service

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timgray Thu 23 Feb 2012 8:56 AM

Edited by timgray at 02/23/12 9:04 AM

Dear Wait staff:

If my drink is almost empty bring me another one without asking unless it's alcohol or not free

refills. If when you arrive with the main course and you forgot something or the kitchen screwed

it up, go get it and bring it back right away, 20 minutes later when you get around to it is not

acceptable. Kitchen screw ups need to be fixed fast, and yes in front of other tables orders.

IF I get Exceptional service you get a 20% tip. Standard is 10%. Crap service get's a single penny.

Finally, if you did anything BUT exceptional service, offer the table a free dessert and an apology

or at least something like "drinks are free to make up for the problems" DO NOT MAKE THE

CUSTOMER ASK. If I feel that service was so bad I have to ask, I'll ask for the manager and at

that point I'm not restoring the tip as I had to do your job.

I understand that some places are ran by idiot managers that hate giving out anything free to

make a customer happy, feel free to tell the customer. "I am sorry for troubles tonight, I would

offer you a free dessert, but my boss is a jerk and hates customers." will go a long way.

Sitting there watching everyone else eat while they put my order in again is fine if resolved fast.

If everyone is done eating and I get my meal 45 minutes later? Epic fail. If my meal at that point

is still on the bill and not free.... Dont expect a tip.

Last: tip with cash. Tipping on the credit card reduces the tip.

singing_pigs @timgray

promoted bytimgrayGeez. I hope I never meet you in real life.

Schitso @timgray

Hasn't the "standard" tip amount gone up to 15% or something?

I'm bad at keeping up with these things.

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3/23

timgray @singing_pigs

Why? because I expect good service when I pay extra for it? Why should I happily pay an extra

20% to my meal so I can have garbage service from a moody goth chick who I only saw twice?

promoted bytimgray

It's 15% now. And my mother is a waitress so I heat a lot of stories about terrible restaurant

guests like timgray. If you're nice enough after a screw up you can get the whole meal for free.

They messed up my order at the place she works, she was off and I don't think the waitress knewwho I was, and as an apology for the delay in my food the whole bill was comped. I didn't have to

throw a fit or be a jerk, I hadn't even really minded that my plate came late. I treat every

waiter/waitress with respect because their job sucks and I don't like adding to the crap they have

jenjen @timgray

Why should the waitress risk losing her sub-minimum-wage job to sneak you freebies in order to

get more tip from you?

dnr1128 @jenjen

emannths approved this comment

Servers are not paid "sub-minimum wage" for their jobs. The minimum wage for tip-based jobsis lower than it is for other lines of work. When I waited tables, I was paid $2.12/hour, most of

which went to taxes. On a good day during the lunch hour, I averaged $15+/hour in tips.

Chrpeter @timgray

Either you're behind on the times or a tightwad. I'm a stickler for service too, but you make me

look like a saint.

Standard is closer to 20%, but 15% is probably the more widely known number.

While I don't work in the service industry, I have MANY friends that do. It's not their fault the

kitchen screwed up; they shouldn't get a bad tip for something out of their control, let that sink

in.

If you truly feel your service was anything under "good" then talk to a manager. But don't wastepeoples time just because you want a free meal. If it's busy then take that into consideration, you

won't get exceptional service if the server is "in the weeds"(service lingo for bogged down), but

they should be able to provide good service.

If they are "In the weeds"/the restaurant is busy, tip AT LEAST 15%, you cheapskate.

For crap service, save the penny for yourself - you obviously need it more than they do if you

can't tip even a couple bucks even for crap service. They get paid 2.13 an hour(at least in Texas

they do), don't waste their time.

Servers can't read minds. Good servers (even mediocre ones), have many more tables on their

mind than just yours. If you think the situation deserves a managers input, then speak up, you're

not doing "their job" by speaking to the manager.

In the event there was a problem and your meal gets there after everyone else is finished, AND

it's still on the bill, again SPEAK UP, maybe there was a miscommunication and it was

overlooked. Or maybe you said "It's OK" and they took it at face value (see the point about

servers can't read minds). I'm with you on this point that in this case it SHOULD be free, but

speak up if it is still on your bill and I'm sure they'll be more than glad to remove it.

IF they DO remove it, tip as if the full amount was still on the bill.

If you use coupons/gift cards, again, tip from the full amount, NOT the discounted/adjusted

amount.

And Last but not least. If you frequently tip crappy in a restaurant - the servers will talk about

you, and you'll never get "exceptional" service there because they won't see the need to bust their


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4/23

butts for MAYBE getting 20%. It's a vicious cycle, don't fall into it.

@singing_pigs Ha. Agreed. All points are mostly reasonable, but wow. @timgray Consider that

maybe the wait staff just doesn't think you as impressive as you do. Good tipping (though

deserved) only gets you better service when they don't think you are a dick, and when you keep

coming back and don't only see that "moody goth chick" twice.

"I treat every waiter/waitress with respect" I highly doubt that, because you seem to assume a

lot. for example: " lot of stories about terrible restaurant guests like timgray" SO where did I say

I stand there and scream at them? I treat them very nice but if they do not do their job, their tip

starts dropping.

emannths @dnr1128

The minimum wage for tip-based jobs is the same as other jobs. If you don't make minimum

wage after tips, your employer is required to make up the difference.

zuzoa @timgray

Sydneyapproved this comment

I work as a cashier at Cracker Barrel, which may not be the fine dining restaurants you're

referring to, but I can verify that I pay out 100% of the tips left on credit cards in cash to the

servers. If you leave a $5 charge tip, they get a five dollar bill when they leave.

Your food comes out faster depending on what you order. Yes, the table next to you who ordered

a bowl of soup will get their food before you if you ordered a steak well done. If you want fast

food, well, you know where to go.

Lastly, if there's a mistake concerning how your food was prepared, it's likely the fault of the

cook, or at Cracker Barrel, the SA (Server Assistant, the person who's job it is to make sure the

food matches what the server requested). The first question I always ask complaining customers

is, "Did you tell your server about it?" And 99% of the time, I hear "no." If you don't like the food,

tell them, and give them an opportunity to get a replacement for you. Servers aren'tmind-readers, YES YOU DO HAVE TO ASK.

justagigilo85 @timgray

I don't know why you received flak for your comment. I agree with you on all your points. It's

obvious that you don't go out to eat just to "eat" but also for the experience of going out to eat.

c.holsopple @timgray

Lol this can't be real!

Chris put it best, I think. Standard tip is only 10% if you're over 70 or a teenager, and both casesit's due to not knowing any better.

Tipping someone less than standard doesn't teach a server a "lesson". They will roll their eyes,

write you off as tight-fisted (which, right?), and shove you off to a newer, worse server the next

time you come back. I do hope for your sake you don't go back to establishments that you only

tip 10% on, because that would be a very frustrating experience for you!

It's odd that those who are most judgmental about servers are people who have never waited

tables themselves. How do people seem to know so much about a job they've never worked in? I

want that ability. :(

Though as it's been said: It's an excellent judge of character to see how someone treats a server


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5/23

(and consequentially, how they tip them).

promoted byemannths

Edited by emannths at 02/23/12 9:45 AM

Do you make $4/hour or more in tips? That's probably why.

"If an employee's tips combined with the employer's direct wages of at least $2.13 an hour do not

equal the federal minimum hourly wage, the employer must make up the difference."

cgmisslecrisis @timgray

As a former server at some pretty upscale restaurants, 20% is the standard. 10% was the

standard in the 1980s.

If you walk into any well-managed restaurant with a party, you should expect to pay 20% in

gratuity automatically added to your bill.

With your current attitude on tipping, I can assure that you are looked down upon by the wait

staff, hosts, kitchen, management and other regular customers at the places you dine at.

Why should you tip 20%?

-This person is in charge of your food. Never screw with people who give you your food - watch

Waiting.

-20% is the standard in other gratuity based businesses such as valets, tattoo parlors, barber

shops, etc.

-In most states servers make less than half of minimum wage, or even less. Typically, this never

even makes it to their paychecks since the restaurants deducts taxes, uniform costs, insurance,

etc. from the servers paycheck.

-You want to have good service the next time you dine there.

-If you ask for separate checks. Yes, that's right, you should tip more since you cannot figure out

how to pay for the meal before you walked in to eat.

-Read this: [blogs.laweekly.com]

In reference to some of your other comments:

On the subject of refills, if it is water or soda/soft drinks, I agree. But I've seen people abuse this

to an insane extent. Like refilling their "water bottle" under the table in their purse with the diet

coke one just refilled. Cheap.

Kitchen screw ups are rarely the servers fault, therefore it's difficult to fix an issue in your

"acceptable" time limit depending on the situation. For re-burn steaks, re-done meals, don't

expect it to be 13 seconds before you get it back - unless you want your steak cooked to well-done

in a microwave.

Kitchen screw ups do not necessarily come before other tables. Restaurants often have, contrary

to popular opinion, more than one server. Typically another server, manager or assistant server

can and will bring out your "kitchen fix" if the server is busy with something else. I have often

seen complaining people expect their "redone" steak to be at the table before I serve another

table's fresh, hot food that is sitting in the kitchen. Steaks take time if you've ever cooked one

yourself - you would know. Selfish and unrealistic.

I agree on making the customer happy. If the kitchen ever messed anything up, I always did

everything in my power (free dessert/drinks/meals) to make sure they left the restaurant

pleased. Occasionally, depending on the management, they may prevent the server from doing


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6/23


As you said, I agree....when possible, tip with cash.

In reference to the above article, acting moody will NOT get you better service. Your dining

experience is 50% your attitude. Also, if you have to be somewhere soon after your meal - tell the

server BEFORE you order. This makes it 900% easier to speed up a meal - as a server one can

give the kitchen a heads up, ensure that your meal's order is placed a head of others, etc.

Here's a simple tip to get better service: Have a positive attitude and be kind.

I can't tell you how many free drinks/meals I've gotten just by telling the server that the mistake

was not a big deal. Reducing stress for everyone involved will speed up the process.


The kitchen is not their job. Getting things off your bill is not their job. If they are working as

hard as they can and the kitchen still crashes and burns and holds your food, or you ordered it

incorrectly and refused to admit it (had that happen to me a million times serving), or the

manager is a jerk, they are still doing their job, which is extremely hard especially when you have

overbearing tightasses at your tables who blame their waiter for everything from the wait being

too long in the lobby to the AC being too low. So unclench a little and maybe realize that goth

chick youve only seen twice has 4 other tables full of more tightasses, gets shit on for a living,

and more than likely is going to school or taking care of a kid or something in addition to getting

abused by people like you 40 hours a week.

Do the world a favor and start cooking for yourself, or get a restaurant job and walk a mile in her

shoes.

c.holsopple @emannths


That's a rule I'm sure every single restaurant in the United States follows.

BufordJustice @emannths

Every time tipping comes up, I can't help but

think of this.

emannths @c.holsopple


Maybe so, but don't come crying to the customer that you make less than minimum wage. Also,

$4/hr in tips (15% tip on $26.50/hr in sales) is a pretty low threshold--I'd be surprised if servers

even infrequently come up short.

PensoTroppo @timgray

Why?

Because for you, the cost of giving from 10% to 15% on a $20 meal is only a dollar.

One dollar. But that amount, when compounded among a shift's worth of tables, is enough to

fill up a car tank, pay off an electric bill, or, over a month, help make a sizable quality-of-life and


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7/23

That's why.

When I was a server, I waited on some of the richest men in my city. It was a true judge of

character to see how they treated me. Some of them were the worst human beings I've ever

interacted with, and that's a shame to see - especially since one of them owned (up until a year

ago) a national sports team that I was a big fan of. As a client in a restaurant, you can easily leave

a bad taste in a server's opinion of you. If that server waits on other business people, you can

easily kiss your future business opportunities goodbye.

Edited by YackoYak at 02/23/12 10:32 AM

Can you share where have you worked as a waiter or bartender before? You seem to have a

unique perspective.

I agree on anticipating your customers needs and taking care of screw ups as quickly as possible.

Where I worked though, I didn't have control over freebies, I had to get the floor manager. If I

asked my manager to comp a dessert every time I thought the customer was less than

"exceptionally satisfied" I would be out of a job. I love it how people want you to read their mind,

and only after the meal do they say "my food was too hot/cold/spicy/mild and wasn't the correct

portion size/level of crispyness/color/flavor". At which point I would happily bring my manager

over. But by this point I would be out of a tip since "you did my job". I know it may not be

obvious, but I would also be fired if I would tell a customer that "my boss is a jerk and hates

customers" or anything else negative about the restaurant.

Your "standard" service may be another table's "exceptional". If I ever got in the weeds, I

prioritized based on the tables that were easiest to please. To me, 20% from 3 out of 4 tables was

better than 20% from one. While I would do everything within my control to please the table,

believe it or not, sometimes that doesn't always work out. I would rather eat $6 or $8 on $40

than make my job hell to please a stranger.

BTW, some restaurants have an automatic tip pool that goes to the bussers, hosts, and bar staff.

Where I worked it was 3.5% of the ticket price. So the few times I was tipped $0, I pretty much

paid for the privilege of waiting on a difficult table. As someone else mentioned, waiters know

who the good and bad tipping regulars are and it's easy to get yourself caught in a rut.

I have a well paying job now, but I never forgot my years as a waiter. I want all my kids to have

that experience because it teaches you a lot about people.

slickromeo @Schitso

i think standard tip is anywhere between 16 and 18% by now.


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8/23

Kocrachon @PensoTroppo

Uh... I think you need to go back to school. 10% of a 20 dollar meal is two dollars. Which means

a 20% tip is 4 dollars. So I am expected to pay 4 dollars to some one directly just because they

brought me food? Should I also start tipping customer service people because they answered my

This is why I miss living in the UK when my dad was in the Air Force. Not only was tipping not

expected, its actually a bad thing to do. My dad was stationed at Lakenheath, and we would go to

london for lunch a lot. This one time there were Tourist who tried to Tip the waiter when wewere eating at some British food chain, don't remember what it was. Anyways, when the tourist

tried to tip, the waiter tried to tell them he cant take the t ip, and the tourist didn't understand

why. Eventually the manager came out and explained it to them.

I miss those days... makes me hope the Army sends me to Germany or Korea soon...

blackbird_pie @timgray

Edited by blackbird_pie at 02/23/12 10:35 AM

I say this as someone who both enjoys going out to eat and works in service, and so is less

forgiving of bad service because I know what goes into this job. I say this to help you get better

service and to be a better customer (which will get you better service). I am not saying this to

attack you, but to help you understand this system from the other side and get the most out of it.

You sound like a typically over-needy customer. Ask yourself: do you need something different

every time the server comes over to your table? Do you ask for mayo, then when the server

brings the mayo, ask for a beer, then when the server brings the beer, ask for a side of fries, then

when the fries show up, decide you want a coke? Does the server stand over your table while you

are deciding on what you want to eat? If so, this is why you may be getting bad service. If I have a

table that makes me run back and forth like a golden retriever constantly, or makes me stand

over them for ten minutes, all while my six other tables are getting angry that they haven't been

served yet, then yes. I will ignore you. I will ignore you and the one tip I will (not) be getting

from you, in favor of keeping six other tables of people happy and collecting the six tables worth

of tips they will be giving me.

On bringing drinks: unless it is from a bottle that is already on the table, I never bring another

drink that is not requested, it's a waste of product and of my time. I will ask you if you want it,but if you want it, you have to tell me. I can't read minds.

If food gets fucked up-- TOTALLY. I will bust ass back to the kitchen and get them to send out a

new one as fast as humanly possible. But there are factors to how fast is humanly possible. You

got the pork chop well done? You're gonna have to wait, sorry dude. It's just how long the damn

thing takes. And sometimes there's more to it. If the kitchen doesn't like the server, they'll take

their time with the food that server puts in. (This shouldn't happen at upper-scale

establishments, but people are jerks all over.)

Also: I can't offer you free shit of my own accord. I can't. I can't. I can't. If I've fucked something

up, and you've been really rad about it, but the house is on a crackdown about comps and I can't

do anything about it, I might say something. But unless you've been super-duper nice to me, I'm

not gonna acknowledge it. And I'm DEFINITELY not gonna shit-talk my boss, who's probably in

his/her own tight spot about it, to a customer. It's downright unprofessional. Would you ever

talk crap about your boss to your client?

Finally, 10% is not standard tip. 10% is a shitty tip. If you are tipping 10%, as other people have

said, that is why you are getting shitty service, because the servers know it's not worth their time

to give you good service, so they give their attention to the people who tip them decently. And

every time you stiff a server because they were busy and didn't devote their time to you, you

reinforce this. You don't have to scream at a server to be an awful customer. You just have to

take up their time, then refuse to pay them for it. That's pretty awful, don't you think?


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9/23

Ryan Mendenhall @timgray

dxrebirth approved this comment

If your drink is half empty, I bring you a backup. I WILL ask if you would like another,

depending on how you present yourself, because not everyone wants a drink immediately after

they finish the first (I've encountered it). If I arrive with your main course, and I forgot

something, it was likely something I rarely do. However, if it does happen, I will consolidate it

into the things I must attend to before returning to the part of the restaurant where I would get

the thing I forgot. It does no good to one-step myself to go get your sauce or other type ofcondiment, and can actually cause other guests to become irritated, like you would already be. I

would rather deal with one irritated guest than an entire section of them. Sorry. However, it

rarely ever takes 20 minutes to correct a mistake like that. In fact, guests often exaggerate the

time they've waited in order to make the situation seem more dire.

If you get exceptional service, I deserve more than 20%. Standard is 15%. If I did terribly, and I

don't apologize, don't give me a think. If I do apologize, give me 10%.

If you had a problem with my service that I seems exceptionally bad, I will apologize, and I will

see if my manager can help you with what was wrong. This often DOES translate into something

free. If you're encountering service that was that bad, you are likely dealing with someone

without much experience, and you should at least make sure this isn't someone's first day

without a trainer before you decide to make such a brash decision.

I agree, if everyone else is done with their meal before you get yours, it is a bad thing. If the

mistake that lead to the issue was my fault, I will own up to it and try to get the situation

resolved as fast as possible. If the kitchen messes up my order after I input it correctly, I will

apologize for them, but you should never assume that every aspect of your experience is the

server's fault, because it's likely not. Kitchen staff can get very busy, especially during weekends

and holidays, and this often leads to long-time order tickets. It's unfortunate, but it's often

unavoidable, if the kitchen is busy beyond its capacity.

I do agree that tipping cash is better, because the credit card companies do charge a fee on the

tip. If you do tip credit, tip over what you were originally intending to tip to ensure the server

gets the amount you intended to give them.

Finally, timgray, I hope I never have you as a guest. You sound like the kind of guest that mostservers detest, and we get paid far too little to deal with that kind of nonsense. On that note, I

disagree with this article. The things it is telling you to do can lead to worse service, because the

server may become stressed and this can lead to an increase in mistakes.

Thank you,

SkateRyan

Server

PensoTroppo @Kocrachon

I think you need to go back to school.

A 10% tip on a $20 meal is $2. A 15% tip on a $20 meal is $3. The difference is one dollar. (And

you'll note in my original message, I stated, "cost of giving from 10% to 15%.")

So I am expected to pay 4 dollars to some one directly just because they brought me food?

Yup. The waiters are paid less than other minimum-wage employees and, therefore, bring down

the operating cost of the business. The cost of the food, therefore, is lower to create the margins

within which the business works. Your choice to pay more for service, therefore, supplements

the artificially-lowered cost of the food.

UK when my dad was in the Air Force.

So you don't understand the cultural nuance of tipping? That's fine. No reason to start accusing


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10/23

Edited by PensoTroppo at 02/23/12 10:44 AM

promoted byMiss Smith Drank Your Vodka

someone of being bad at math because you misread the comment, pally.

Standard tip is 15%. Your best bet is to always talk to a manager if you have a problem because

most waiters don't have the power to give out free anything unless they want it to come out their

checks. I agree with the drinks to keep coming and waiting on food is not cool if it was a mess up.

I would like to see you spend one shift in the shoes of a server at your favorite restaurant. You

need impeccable multi-tasking skills. And think of this, if the kitchen has screwed up on

something you ordered, you're just one of anywhere from four to eight tables in that server's

section. This means that it may take longer than "instantly" to get the food to your table, within

five minutes is acceptable.

By the way, servers also sense how you're going to treat them, they can tell that you're the type of

person to give a 10% tip. Personally, I wouldn't put the extra effort in to your dining experience if

I sense that you're going to be a dick.

Pat McNaught @timgray


You're not paying extra, you know that most of these servers are working for far less than

minimum wage, correct? In NH, the hourly wage for a server is around $2.50, so they depend on

your tips. It isn't "paying extra."

emannths @Pat McNaught

Servers are guaranteed minimum wage. If their tips don't make up the difference, employers

must do so: [www.dol.gov]

Pat McNaught @dnr1128

I think she was more stressing that with such a lower hourly wage, the reliance on tips is more

important. If there's someone going into this with the attitude of timgray, they're not going to

put the effort in.

Enano330 @Chrpeter

Fantastic response! As a waiter once myself to get through college we knew who the jerk

customers were and we usually did just enough to keep them from throwing a fit and get them

out the door ASAP. The worse type are the customers that took 1 of my 4 tables and sat for 2 to 3

hours drinking coffee and tipped me for such. So instead of making money from 4 tables I'm

now down to 3. All I'm saying is be considerate of the time you spend just yapping your jaw.

Time is literally money for a waiter.

Enano330 @emannths


yeah, this is false. I waited tables for a few years in college and I made about $2/hr wage plus

tips of course. On many slow nights I wouldn't get enough in tips in a hour to equate to "normal"

minimum wage and I never saw a penny more from my employer.

emannths @Enano330

It's the law: [www.dol.gov] . Blame your employer, not your customers, if you were paid less

than minimum wage after tips.


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11/23

Pat McNaug @Chrpeter Very well put.

he doesn't need to go back to school. the difference between tipping 10% and 15% on $20 is one

dollar. a 10% tip on $20 is $2 and a 15% tip on $20 is $3. that's a difference of one dollar.

and to answer your question, yes, you're expected to pay a few bucks to someone directly just

because they brought you food. you don't have to, no. but you're expected to. it's customary. it's

not customary to tip customer service people for answering questions, and they're not expecting

it. but servers, delivery guys, drivers, valets...they l ive on their tips.

there's probably a lot of servers who hope the army sends you to germany or korea as well...

Pat McNaught @emannths

promoted byemannths

I can speak from experience (6 different restaurants in 3 different states) that this may be the

case on paper, but I've never seen it practiced. Luckily though, I've never had so bad a night that

I've made less than minimum wage. That's really hard to do.

emannths @Pat McNaught


As you say, I suspect we generally don't see it practiced because it's really hard to make less than$4/hr in tips over the course of a workweek (unless the business is failing dramatically). The

total wage is guaranteed on a weekly basis, so a slow shift on Tuesday won't get makeup pay if

you make it up in tips later in the week.

spamfeed @timgray

I'll bet with your attitude you've had some *special* service applied to at least a few of your

meals.

/and not in a good way

It's not your overall message, just the pompous way it comes across. I may be wrong, but I highly

doubt it.


Not all waiters are paid less than Minimum wage. Here in Washington state, they are paid a

minimum wage of 9 dollars. Should I still tip them 4 dollars, giving them a 13 dollar an hour

wage for JUST waiting my table? Not to mention that they server at least 4-5 tables per hours,

meaning the waiter is now making 29 dollars an hour?

I don't feel bad for waiters at all in most situations. My wife got a 4 year college degree, works in

a biomed research lab, and her friend who waits tables at Joeys Stakehouse makes about 40

dollars an hour because she makes so much in tips. So please, tell me, why should I be tipping

these people 20% when its clear that they are making more than enough. Sure, I can warrent a

3-4 dollar tip when I go some where like Denny's. But why the hell should I be expected to tip 20

dollars when I decide to go to a nice steak house like Daniels Broiler. So this waiter, who servers

3 tables, now makes at LEAST 60 dollars an hour because the average table ticket is 100 dollars.

I say instead of a "percentage" tip, it should be an "average" tip of a specific dollar amount.

So lets say, 4 dollars if the service is great, 2 dollars if the service is ok, and come to terms with

the fact that, even if they are paid "less" than minimum wage, the employer still has to pay AT

LEAST the minimum wage amount, and thus don't HAVE to tip them.

I think this is the most important part people forget...

EVEN IF THE PERSON WORKS FOR LESS THAN MINIMUM WAGE, IN THE END, THE

EMPLOYER IS STILL REQUIRED TO PAY AT LEAST MINIMUM WAGE EVEN IF THE


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12/23

spamfeed @YackoYak

QUOTE: "Uh... I think you need to go back to school. 10% of a 20 dollar meal is two dollars."

Consider your own advice for reading comprehension. The original comment was to go from

10% to 15%, which, duh, is 5% and thus $1 on $20.

spamfeed @Kocrachon

Wow, so that's what envy looks like. You're whining that your wife doesn't make enough money?

And once again, your math is way off because you have no clue and no experience in the

industry. Higher end restaurants don't turn tables each hour. More likely 90 minutes to 2 hours.

As for your complaint about the big tip for a "nice steak house," it sounds to me that you can't

afford it so why go and take it out of the waitress' comp? Stick with Outback and split a plate.

Or maybe your wife could get a job waiting tables to make a few more bucks?

Adam Plante @Chrpeter

Well, In Canada it is illegal to pay anyone below minimum wage. Which in BC is $8.90. Most

waitress make about $10/hr. So my tip is a direct reflection of how well the server did. It's not

about weather the cook screwed it up its about how the server deals with that.

Adam Plante @emannths

Thats crazy, in Canada you are required to be paid minimum wage before tips. The restaurant

never even knows how much you made in tips. You

dxrebirth @timgray

timgray walks into Macy's. The salesperson was having a bad day and wasn't smiling as much.

Also took way too long to ring his purchase of socks and velcro wallet.

DEMANDS FREE TIE!

rmaccrea @timgray

15% is the minimum. I always give 20% unless I get bad service. My wife used to be a waitress

and some of the stories she's told me make me hate humanity. It's pretty common for waitresses

to have to go hide somewhere to cry because people are A-holes.

Here's a little trick she told me though: if you give 15%, round to the nearest dollar, then add a

penny. That's restaurant speak for, you suck! But always give 15%. They're not slaves.

spamfeed @dxrebirth

QUOTE: "DEMANDS FREE TIE!"

You forgot "because he had to do their job" .....

deathsythe164 @timgray


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13/23

As someone who is one of the top servers for the company I work for (corporate has made me

well aware of this, primarily because of my avg. sales), I can tell you that your the kind of diner I

would rather not wait on. 10% is standard? Your exceptional service for me to earn 20% is to be

such a kiss-ass that I have to bend over backwards and treat you, and only you.

I've met quite a few of your kind in my time as a server, and your views and expectations are

ridiculous, but I understand it, you wouldn't see how much of a dick you really are unless you

were on the recieving end of your non-sensical bullshit, and you would see where I'm coming

from when I say that 10% is not standard, but rather shitty.

-Hey Tim, we're people working an industry too. Let's go for 'Full-Service Dining Employees' as a

better way to address us, because the last time I checked I'm not a hobo.

"If my drink is almost empty bring me another one without asking unless it's alcohol or not free

refills."

-Sure, but if your teenage son or you is inhaling it literally within one minute of me setting it

down and I'm busy after I've refilled it 3 times already, bet that your waiting for that fourth one

longer than you expect.

" If when you arrive with the main course and you forgot something or the kitchen screwed it up,

go get it and bring it back right away, 20 minutes later when you get around to it is not

acceptable. Kitchen screw ups need to be fixed fast, and yes in front of other tables orders. "

- Agreed. My customer's food is the most important thing, and if there is an error it will be myfirst priority to fix it. That said, have respect for me when I do admit to a mistake, and don't be

super shitty that me or the kitchen made a mistake, ESPECIALLY in front of my other tables.

I've called out my own father for tapping a glass to get my attention in front of my tables. I'm a

man and will admit my mistakes, but don't be rude. If I've made a mistake, I do my best to fix it

as fast as possible, it only makes matters worse when you start acting like a prick to me. People

make mistakes. Look at Justin Bieber's parents.

"IF I get Exceptional service you get a 20% tip. Standard is 10%. Crap service get's a single

penny."

-You should get exceptional service every time, I agree. Especially as a server like myself, where I

have a ridiculously high standard I set for myself to the extent that I compare myself to the

server that I have and their service as I perceive it. Although, I understand the industry, you sir,

do not. 10% is not standard, I cannot say that enough. Especially if your rude to me in the

beginning, then I will not put 150% effort into making your dining experience pleasurable if all

you have done has been rude and cold since the moment I met you. I cannot tell you how many

times I've heard "Best server I ever had," said to me because I interacted, joked, even made fun

of some of my customers. But it's hard to do when your ordering while on your fucking phone or

you don't have enough respect to look at me the entire meal, while uttering a whopping two

sentences. If you don't give me an inch, don't expect me to give you a mile. But a penny? Come

on man, have some decency.

"Finally, if you did anything BUT exceptional service, offer the table a free dessert and an

apology or at least something like "drinks are free to make up for the problems" DO NOT MAKE

THE CUSTOMER ASK. If I feel that service was so bad I have to ask, I'll ask for the manager and

at that point I'm not restoring the tip as I had to do your job."

-This is the part that made me know that your one of the 1% of customers I've ever had. The ones

who think I should shine your shoes and dance for you while my managers comp your meal

because your tilapia got cold while you talked on your phone, because some how that's my fault.

As I said before, I admit my mistakes, and your right, we should offer you something if we made

a MISTAKE, but if your simply pissed because we didn't meet some bizarre expectation of yours,

well then your SOL. I once had a lady who demanded that I get her decaf coffee from the gas

station across the street after we ran out. Across the street was a 4 lane highway with a concrete

median in the middle. 4 feet high. She wanted me reprimanded because I refused. Somehow I

can see you as the same person, because your not doing our job. Our job consists of having to

have the composure and poise to deal with people who are nuttier than squirrel shit so that we

can HOPEFULLY make a couple of bucks off of you so we can pay our bills, because again, we

work in an industry too. Don't act that because you asked to cash in on a free dessert for our


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14/23


screw up that somehow your doing OUR job. And please, don't make the manager aware of how

bad a job I didn't do, especially if you have some whack ass rating system of service. If it was

blantantly terrible, if somehow your disgusted or insulted by the service, then sure, ask for a

manager. If not, then write a letter instead, but don't wreck the composure of a 20 year old girl

whose super sweet and just not a very good server, have some empathy for at least a moment

"I understand that some places are ran by idiot managers that hate giving out anything free to

make a customer happy, feel free to tell the customer. "I am sorry for troubles tonight, I would

offer you a free dessert, but my boss is a jerk and hates customers." will go a long way."

"Sitting there watching everyone else eat while they put my order in again is fine if resolved fast.

If everyone is done eating and I get my meal 45 minutes later? Epic fail. If my meal at that point

is still on the bill and not free.... Dont expect a tip."

Almost agreed with you again, until you determined that your well done 16 ounce ribeye will

somehow cook itself in 2 minutes. Again, not the servers fault, put some blame on the kitchen as

well, don't just target the server. It take 8 minutes to cook a Medium Rare 16 ounce ribeye, 14

minutes to make it well done. Sometimes shit takes time. Be patient, it will be worth it, and if I

can tell your slightly irritated or if I just know I fucked it up, it will be off your bill, but don't

make my tip hang in the balance for an ACCIDENT.

"Last: tip with cash. Tipping on the credit card reduces the tip."

Wrong. Tipping with a credit card will not reduce the tip. Here's where my biggest peeve about

your 10% standard bullshit comes in the largest fashion. At the place I work we have a system

that we as servers tip out 2.5% of our sales to the bussers, food runners, and bartenders. So let's

say I do $1000 in sales. I have to tip out $25 dollars, FROM MY EARNED TIPS. So if I made the

TIM "HIGH ROLLER" GRAY STANDARD 10% on that $1000 in sales, I've made $100 before

the tipout comes into play. After tipout, I've made $75. Or 7.5%. So you're not leaving me just a

cheapass tip, lets say $5 bucks on a $53 bill, but in reality your leaving me 3 bucks because I just

tipped out a portion of it(we have to round up or down based on the 50, so if my sales are only

$940, I tip out $23. If the are $960, I'm rounding up to $1000 and tipping out $25. So tipping

on your credit card doesn't mean anything you twit. But obviously, you know more about the

service industry more than me, obviously.

rothaar @timgray

Dear wait staff,

Hang in there. I used to wait tables, and by any reasonable measurement my current career

allows me to be paid way more for way easier work than what you're going now.

Thank you for dealing with the mess that my kids often make, and for taking it in stride. If I

couldn't bring them to your restaurant, I might never get to leave the house except to go to the

office. Your tip is bigger because I know how much of an imposition my family can be.

Thank you for putting on a smile and trying to make my dinner pleasant even though your feet

hurt, your back hurts, and you've been yelled at by co-workers, bosses, and customers all day.

Your tip is bigger because I know how much effort is required to act like you care about me and

my iced tea refill.

Thank you for being the fall guy for absolutely everything that can possibly go wrong in the

entire dining process. When the food is overcooked, undercooked, whatever... it's you out here

having to make the apologies for it. Your tip is bigger because you are the bigger person.

I tip 20-25%, and only the most horrific treatment by you will make me budge from that figure.

I'm not trying to brag or evangelize, but I know how hard your job is because I did it. Thank you.

Kocrachon @spamfeed


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15/23

Wow, how ignorant of you to assume that I don't make enough. The point is, is people complain

about the "Poor minimum wage wait staff" but my point is, is they are still making AT LEAST

minimum wage, and in MOST states, they are making around 13+ an hour more. Considering

the amount of people in retail positions that make ONLY minimum wage, it doesn't seem that

And with the steak house, ok fine, so 3-4 tabes every 2 hours. Thats still means they are making

30 dollars an hour (just in tips, thats not including wages) waiting on tables. Still doesn't seem

that bad to me, considering that equates to roughly 60k a year, which is MUCH higher than the

Thus my argument of, why should I always pay a 20% tip when a $4 dollar tip should seem like a

And my wife makes a decent income, as a biomed tech she makes an anual income of 50k, and at

my current rank I make 42,000 a year, and thats not including my BAH allowance the army

gives me for housing, nor the food stipend I get every month from them. So I am far from not

being able to AFFORD to tip well. My complain is, Tipping is getting out of hand in this country.

10 years ago I was able to leave a 10% tip, 5 years ago it went up to 15%, and now its up to 20%.

At this rate, in 10 years I will be paying a 30% tip.

Id rather the Employers pay the employees better and increase the cost of my food, rather than

constantly have to increase the amount of tip I am giving the employees. Because that solves 2

issues. 1) Employees no longer have to rely on tips to survive. 2) If the waiter doesn't get tips, he

still can afford to rent a house.

But again, you have yet to answer the, why tip... Even if they make only 2.16 an hour, the law still

requires that they make minimum wage on their paycheck. So even if they get NO tips, they are

still making minimum.

But thats not even the case, EVERY waiter I have known or ever knew made more than

minimum wage. When I was living Idaho, I worked at a small pizza chain. I was making (at the

time) 5.15 an hour as a pizza delivery boy and cook assistant. On top of that, I was making at

least 2 dollar tips which each delivery, and I would make at least 3 deliveries per hour on a

standard night pending on how close they all were.

Not to mention my wife's friend, who her and all of her coworkers are making bank. Most ofthem have college degrees but dont want to quit because the income they make off of tips is too

good at this point.

So I really have a hard time understanding why its so necessary to give a RATED tip of 20%

when it should be a flat amount. There is no reason to ever float a 20 dollar tip for them bring

me a steak. I dont mind giving the waitress at denny's a 5 dollar tip, but giving a 20 dollar tip for

some one who waits less tables, (denny's waitresses are far more over worked) drives me crazy.

Samuel Gerry @Kocrachon

I agree, tipping based off some arbitrary percentage of the bill is pretty stupid IMO. Why would a

server get paid more for bringing me a plate with a prime rib than a grilled cheese sandwich?

With societies pressure to tip a certain amount, it's really no longer a tip. If it's going to cost me

$28.00 for a steak because you have to pay your cooks/servers/hostess a decent wage, then so be

it. If they provide good service, I'll gladly tip to let them know I appreciate what they did. But if I

go somewhere and I get awful service I'm not going to pay for it, go ahead and tell all the other

servers I'm a bad tipper, I'm not coming back anyway.

Miss Smith Drank Your Vodka @PensoTroppo

I love when people compare tipping in the UK versus the US. At the majority of places I've

patroned in the UK, my glass was not filled before I asked as Mr. Lovelypants TimGray

expects/DEMANDS. In fact, it was usually filled after the second time of asking because the

waitress/waiter had so many damn tables. And that was perfectly fine, as the service provided


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16/23

and expected in the UK isn''t at the same level of attention as is expected here in the US. Thus,

the tip isn't expected to be the same amount or customary as here either. In addition, the servers

can pretty much tell you to go frack yourself in the UK if they want to. Now, at the more high end

places in the UK dining world, the attention is on par of that expected by the Average Joe patron

at a US Chili's or Applebee's, and the tipping does hover around the 10-20% mark.

promoted byemannths

So please, tell me, why should I be tipping these people 20% when its clear that they are

Benefit of the doubt - because you don't know that every waiter is making bank like the situation

the employer still has to pay AT LEAST the minimum wage amount,

That's great if you want to sue your employer and burn every bridge you've built. [See also:

Interns doing work they should be paid for; blacklisting]

emannths @PensoTroppo

Yeah, but the interns don't blame the customers for their low pay.


Its burning a bridge to make sure that your employer is obeying FEDERAL laws? Seriously, the

economy is NOT so bad that a person who isn't making the minimum wage he deserves, cant go

out and find another minimum wage job. Infact, during the economic downturn, it wasn't even

the retail level hit the hardest, it was the middle class. So don't tell me that making your

employer obey federal laws is not worth the time. I would GLADLY sue the employer, make, at

the very least, thousands of dollars off of it (if not millions with the way American courts tend to

work)

A buddy of mine right behind me has a wife who worked (before she got pregnant) at a Seattle

downtown restaurant, she could make around 500 a NIGHT on fridays and saturdays in an 8

hour shift. That is how much retail employees are making per paycheck. So she is making

minimum wage, plus an additional 1000 dollars on her paycheck JUST from her weekends.

So again, please explain to me why a steak house needs a 20 dollar tip, when they are worth the

same 4-5 dollar tip any other standard waiter makes.

5 dollar flat tip should be good enough.

Sydney @zuzoa

replying to promote

Sydney @cgmisslecrisis

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Sydney @Joseph Shaver

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Sydney @deathsythe164

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Kocrachon @Miss Smith Drank Your Vodka

I have no idea what you are talking about. I lived in the UK and no employee was ever that


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17/23

promoted byMiss Smith Drank Your Vodka

disrespectful. Because yeah, they may not get tips, but doing that would cost them their job. On

top of that, there have been MANY times where I didn't get my soda refilled here in the US, even

after asking. Sure its not always, but its expected.

And one thing I REALLY hate, is how even if I get horrible service the tip is suppose to be the

I went to a local Ramen shop in Seattle. My wife and I got HORRIBLE service. The soda machine

was down so we just drank water, it never got refilled with out asking. We asked for a second

service of noodles. The girl forgot to tell the cook so we had to ask her again. My wife then asked

for a second boiled egg to go with her ramen, and the girl forgot, and instead of asking for it

again we just finished eating and called it good.

The place was not over loaded, she had other tables to serve and didn't even do that, she was

chatting with some other friend of hers at the bar. I left her a 10% tip and she looked at me with

anger and disdain.

So again, I don't agree with being EXPECTED to tip, nor expected to tip a specific amount. Tips

should be EARNED, not EXPECTED. Thus why its called a TIP

Now lets go to Asia. I spent a week in Japan. Again tips are not expected. And not only was my

service better than anything I experienced in America (they actually honor the mentality of, the

customer is always right) but they also don't take tips.

So you can expect great customer service and NOT be forced to tip. Japan does a great job ofthat.


Its burning a bridge to make sure that your employer is obeying FEDERAL laws?

Believe it or not, yes. Case in point: this person will, frankly, never got a job again.

[www.hollywoodreporter.com] Granted, I know this isn't the restaurant industry, but I'm hoping

to show via analogy that, yes, it's a huge problem.

please explain to me why a steak house needs a 20 dollar tip, when they are worth the same

4-5 dollar tip any other standard waiter makes.

Because the waiters at a steak house are more experienced and and higher quality than chain

employee waiters? (Sort of like why a steak at a steakhouse, too, costs four times more than what

you can get at a standard restaurant.)


I'm sorry but its hard to justify 20 dollars for a woman to come, take my drink order, come back,

take my food order, bring me said food order, and then come back maybe once or twice to refill

my drinks and ask me how it was. Personally, in that situation, I would rather that tip go to the

cook for making an excellent steak, rather than some waitress who moves plates and fill glasses.

I get the same service, basically the same quality, from any locally owned restaurants (which I

normally eat at) and I only have to tip about 5-8 dollars pending on what I am eating. Which iswhy I now eat locally where the food is reasonably priced and just as good.


I get the same service, basically the same quality, from any locally owned restaurants (which I

normally eat at) and I only have to tip about 5-8 dollars pending on what I am eating.

I can't debate with you about your tastes and whether you perceive certain services to be worth

what you're expected to pay (I find it hard to give a bathroom attendant more than a buck for

handing me a towel.)


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18/23

If that's your core argument, that's fine. But I hope I've been able to clearly explain why some of

us choose to tip according to different values.

promoted byemannths

You should because waiters/waitresses only make tips. They are paid less-than-minimum wage

by the restaurant they work for, and that salary has tax from tips subtracted from it.

If you give half a shit about whether or not your server can pay their bills, you'll tip them.

Well said.

dxrebirth @spamfeed

How did he have to do their job in either his scenario or mine? o_O

emannths @elindemann

Servers are guaranteed to make minimum wage regardless of the tips they get (see the DOL link

above).

I dislike the guilt-trip, tip-your-waiter-or-he'll-starve mentality. We don't tip every

minimum-wage worker I encounter, and no one is imploring us to overpay them in tips. To

expect the customer to consider the employee's financial well-being when paying is weird,

distracting, and judgmental. Asking the customer to pay based on the level of service provided is

much more sensible.

designjenquinn @Samuel Gerry

You have to remember that if you buy costly food and drink at any decent restaurant, there are

usually 2-4 OTHER people BESIDES your server that you are paying with that tip, who get a

percentage NOT of the tip you leave but of the SALE of that food. Just by ordering a $28 steak,

you add a percentage of $28 to that server's total sales that is then deducted from his/her tips at

their shift's end. In the case of a truly heinous tip on a costly bill, you actually end up stealing

from the server because they will have to pay porters, busboys, food runners, and bartenders for

the collective work that went into your dining experience no matter WHAT you leave them.

Leaving a customary tip percentage of your bill ensures that everyone gets an appropriate piece

of the pie and if it rankles you to throw that extra money at "food", you can buy a lovely steak at

the grocery store and cook it in your own kitchen for significantly less.

spamfeed @Kocrachon

QUOTE: "And my wife makes a decent income, as a biomed tech she makes an anual income of

50k, and at my current rank I make 42,000 a year..."

Oww, no wonder you have no fine dining experience. The remainder of your screed reeks of job

envy.

If you can't afford to tip 15% plus on the full price (not your BOGO Thursday coupon price), then

kindly attend to a lower t ier restaurant.

spamfeed @dxrebirth

It was in the original Tim "HighRoller" Gray post. Just mocking him, on my part. Your post was

absolutely spot on, good sir!


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19/23

designjenquinn @Kocrachon

Keep in mind a standard shift as a server is less than 8 hours, usually around 4-6. "So what?"

you may think, "They probably work enough shifts in the week to be full time." This may be true

in some instances, but oftentimes it isn't, especially in this economy when lots of folks who may

find themselves unemployed in other industries are vying for positions at restaurants and there

can be more servers on payroll than customers in the dining room. Also, restaurant managers

don't pay hourly wages to servers that are doing nothing, and servers are often "cut" (meaning,

not allowed to wait any more tables or get any more tips, and sent home after a certain amount

of "sidework" is done at only their hourly rate) after little more than a couple hours of their

scheduled shift, unless they are "closing" the restaurant - those 2 hours at $30 an hour may be a

server's whole day of pay depending on the day. Although this results in free time, it's not

dependable and certainly doesn't lend itself to seeking supplementary work elsewhere as no one

is going to hire you if you can only "maybe" come in at PM. I say all this just to point out that

even if the hourly money may seem amazing, on average it's just that - average.

I'm also a little taken aback that several commenters here seem to think it's fine for servers to

make only minimum wage. Unless your server is 17 years old, they probably have just as high of

a cost of living as you do. Do YOU make minimum wage and manage to live comfortably?

Probably not in most states. Servers and the restaurant industry as a whole provide a service

beyond calories to you, and if the extra expense is not worth it to you, it's simple. Cook for

yourself and don't go.

Miss Smith Drank Your Vodka @Kocrachon

I lived there too. London to be exact. You obviously didn't have the same experience. Doesn't

mean it didn't happen.

dxrebirth @spamfeed

Ah sorry sorry ^^;

This thread is getting confusing :)


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20/23

Kocrachon @designjenquinn

Again, what about OTHER retail employees who only make minimum wage? Such as the Target

here in Seattle has a 60 year old hispanic man making minimum wage and only 30 hours a week.

Why do food servers deserve more than any other retail employee who has the EXACT same

conditions? When I worked at a gamestop at 18 before joining the Army, they would send

employees home early if it was slow enough. So does this mean we need to start tipping

Wait staff dont have it any harder than any other mininum wage job, yet they are still expected

to be tipped. If it sucks SO much, find another job. Again, the economy is not so bad right now

that you cannot find another minimum wage job.

As for the cost of living, sure, living comfortable on minimum wage isn't easy... in a big city. Do

what my mother in law did. Move from a big city (Seattle) where rent is 1000 a month for a 1

bedroom, and move to a smaller town (Snohomish) where you can get the same place for 400.

And yes it is an option. If they are barely getting by, the first step is to find a new place else

where, and from there, find a new job (if you dont have a car, well, time to take the bus)

My mother in law works for slightly more than minimum wage right now. She lives fine now

after leaving a place that had such a high cost of living.

I will state it ONE more time. Wait staff do NOT have it any harder than any other retailer job.

They all get paid minimum wage at the very least, and they all generally get less than 40 hours a

week.

arbarrtheaardvark @Kocrachon

Waiters do much more than bring you your food. They also almost always spend time before and

after their shifts cleaning, stocking things, rolling silverware, doing food prep, etc. etc. The place

I work at, I'd say the waiters average about 45 minutes before and an hour or more after,

depending on what the duties are (a typical list of sidework for a late night server, for example,

involves sweeping and mopping the entire restaurant floor, restocking all of the sugars and salt

and peppers, rolling 100 silverware, and that's just the stuff to be done at the end of the shift.

They also have to tip out the support staff, which includes myself (I'm a hostess and a busser).

At our restaurant, the waiters are required to tip a minimum of 2.5% of their sales out to the

support staff (bussers, expo) and it's extremely looked down upon to not tip extra on top of that

to a person who's going above and beyond (and that includes people who are not tipped

employees, for example there's one dishwasher at our restaurant who's super fast and runs all of

the bus tubs to the back when they're full, which is something that normally the waiters are

responsible for - they always throw him a tip because they know he's making their jobs easier

and he really doesn't have to). And it does benefit them to tip us better than the minimum,

because when it's crazy busy and I have to choose between clearing a table for waiter A or waiter

B, I'm going to pick the waiter who more regularly takes notice of my extra efforts and

compensates me for them - and that means that the waiter will end up with more customers in

the end, and more opportunity for their own tips. Now, let's say that a waiter has to tip out two

bussers and an expo, and it's super busy - that waiter could end up shelling out like 10% of

his/her sales. When I work overnight shifts, it's not uncommon for waiters to tip me a solid 20%

of their own tips; when I work afternoons and it's super slow, the waiters who didn't make

enough to tip over the minimum 2.5% apologize because they know I deserve more than $3 for

my hours of work cleaning up after them and allowing customers to treat me like I'm a

convenient back-up waiter - but they can't afford to give up more than that because they're only

taking home $50 themselves.

This is just the way that restaurants work. And you know what? Yes, good waiters who get

enough tables that tip fairly really can end up making a lot of money. I know some who average

around $20/hour. On my last paycheck, I averaged $17.50/hr and I'm just a busser. But when

your job involves 8 to 10 hours of moderate to intense physical labor as well as customer service,


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Edited by arbarrtheaardvark at 02/23/12 5:30 PM

I don't think that wage is too high at all.

No, mostly because you make a comment only tangentially related to the article, with a

Well, it's been 15% in the US for a good 20 years now...

Does anyone else think we should require these restaurants to actually pay their staff a living

wage instead of a guaranteed minimum wage and expect the customer to cover the rest? Tipping

is a socially required expense employers can tack on instead of pay out.

@timgray Making you wait 45 minutes for your food while everyone else at your table is done

eating, not bringing refills, and not offering some form of apology is FAIL. Of course, some

restaurants prohibit their wait staff from mentioning freebies unless the customer asks for it but

still.


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crashcodes @deathsythe164

Tip out on sales is prone to abuse; but so is % of tips. If the QAC or Kitchen is hurting your tips

in someway they aren't feeling the consequences. But with sales, and your service sucks, they

aren't feeling the consequences. I think the server should tip the kitchen based on their own

opinion of how the kitchen supported them with a stated standard base. So if 2.5% of sales is

standard and the kitchen kicked ass give em 3.5%+ instead. They screw you over enough times

0%. Since you know how it feels to be screwed over on tips, screwing your coworkers should take

For the folks that are tipping more because the server has too many tables, I say nay! They are

making up for their lost quality of service -> tips in volume. I say almost the same for a server

that has only one table. They make up for the lower volume by being able to offer higher service.

If they don't offer that higher service and they only have 1 table, I'm not having pity on their lack

of tables so I'll tip purely according to service. On the other hand if they do only have one table

and they hit a high service level, I'll probably toss in something extra even above a high service

level tip (25%-30% + a few extra $$).

I don't really understand why the tip range would move up from the 1980's to today, I mean

inflation hit the price of goods already. So its like a double raise. That said 18% is what I use as a

base. 20% for a little better than average, 16% for a little less. Generally 30% is the high end; but

that usually involves me somehow screwing something up and the server fixing my error.

Don't tip the tax.

When the server asks, "Are you ready to order?" Answer promptly. If you find yourself saying

"Ummm....", the correct answer is "No."

"Soup or salad?" is a trap. You seem to only have two options which implies either is included

with the entree. If you are like me and typically don't want either enough to pay extra, but

wouldn't mind having something to pick at while the entree is being prepared; make sure you

know if it is included with the entree. It may be a bit awkward to ask in front of your sessy date,

but by even posing this ambiguity you have been insulted on some level so don't be a doormat in

front of your date. Servers, this question may seem innocent enough especially if either are

included with the meal; but you are inadvertently supporting the trap at those other places that

do not include the soup/salad with the meal.

designjenquinn @Kocrachon

I've worked retail and I've worked restaurants. The physical and mental demands of food service

and retail are radically different. Clearly you've never worked in a busy restaurant to even call it

retail. (Listening to the stories of others doesn't count.) If you don't believe me, look around the

restaurants in your town and tell me how many 60 year olds work 30 hours a week at those. By

the way, no, you don't have to tip that gentleman as your taxes will likely already do that for you

in the form of Social Security.

As for what's stopping a server in an urban area from moving to a less expensive locale, what's

stopping you from living in a different country where you don't have to tip, since you dislike it so

ardently? There's a helluva lot more servers doing just fine in this country -- due to the majority

of people who believe in tipping appropriately -- than there are folks l ike you who don't want to.

So perhaps you're the one who needs a change of scenery.

Kocrachon @designjenquinn

Easy, if you read above, I am in the Military, I don't dictate where I live. Plus why would I change

locale? Seeing as tips are optional, I can easily still just not tip.

rraattbbooyy @timgray

Timbo, I would soooo spit on your food. And I'm not even part of the wait staff! I mean I would


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get up from another table, walk over, and spit on your food!

Since when is $90k a year for family income low? That's WELL above the national average... I

guess it depends on your opinion of "fine dining", but it's certainly above the "BOGO Thursday"

Absolutely. You can do that and no one is going to stop you, especially because you're literally

working for American freedoms like tipping badly since you're in the military. Doesn't change

the fact that its a tacky and inconsiderate thing to do and your justifications for it are faulty.

dieriding @timgray

Just kill yourself.

anomalytea @cgmisslecrisis

You have a few points, but fail on others.

One of your reasons to tip sounds like "oops insurance".

My policy? Tip is based on how well the server performed. Were drinks refilled promptly? Did Iwatch our food sit on the counter for 10 min before they brought it to us? Did we receive service

promptly after being seated? IF something is wrong with the food, did the waiter take it back

promptly or carry it around for 10 minutes?

It's important to realize which jobs are that of the kitchen and which are that of the waiter. My

tip is based on the performance of the waiter compared to what a waiter is supposed to do. I've

had horrible service where I've refused to tip (employers are required to bump their check to

min. wage equivalent if tips don't get them there), where it took 15 min after I asked to refill my

water and my food sat on the counter for so long that it was cold by the time it got to me. I refuse

to pay extra for that. As long as someone does their job halfway decently, they get a tip (usually

up to 20-25% from me. When I tip, it tends to be generous), which is more than they deserve -

they're already getting paid for it, and I'm already paying for it by paying my bill. It would

actually make more sense to give a few dollars to the random person held the door open for you -they didn't get paid to do that.


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