Idwx chap 14

THE FIRST DECADE

C H A P T E R14

C O N T I N U I N G

10yearbook-CONTINUED.qxd:Layout 1 4/2/09 3:28 PM Page 14

IDW started publishing comics based on Angel in 2005

at the suggestion of Jeff Mariotte, who was the

company’s Editor-in-Chief at the time. Jeff was very

familiar with the property, having already written

several prose novels based on the show. He also wrote

IDW’s first series, Angel: The Curse. Over the next several

years, IDW would publish a variety of miniseries and

one-shots based on Angel, including several that focused

on the popular character Spike.

C H A P T E R

ANGEL14

10yearbook-FULL.qxd:Layout 1 3/19/09 9:32 AM Page 190

IDW started publishing comics based on Angel in 2005

at the suggestion of Jeff Mariotte, who was the

company’s Editor-in-Chief at the time. Jeff was very

familiar with the property, having already written

several prose novels based on the show. He also wrote

IDW’s first series, Angel: The Curse. Over the next several

years, IDW would publish a variety of miniseries and

one-shots based on Angel, including several that focused

on the popular character Spike.

C H A P T E R

ANGEL14


real low-budget movie called Big Helium Dog. Whenhe started the Movie Poop Shoot site, he asked me todo comics for it and Chris was running it at the time.So, Chris and I met online through that and inperson at the San Diego Comic Convention for thefirst time a couple of years later.

TA: Were you a fan of the Angel TV show beforeChris talked to you about writing the comics?

BL: Absolutely. And Chris knew I was because in a lotof the comic strips I would do for Poop Shoot therewere Angel and Buffy references. So, Chris knew that Iknew my stuff because they were very specificreferences that only a complete geek would know.

TA: I recently re-read Spike: Asylum and Spike: ShadowPuppets and you have a very confident take on thecharacters, particularly with Spike. You really get thecharacters and the dialogue is dead-on. What was thereaction from the fans when Spike: Asylum came out?

BL: In the beginning, when it was announced, allthey wanted to know was whether or not it wascanon, whether or not it was Joss-approved, or whatepisode the storyline fit in between. But once the firstissue came out, they were won over fairly quickly andit was a great feeling. It was really nice and from thenon they’ve been nothing but the most supportivepeople. Even when they had questions and theydidn’t know whether or not it had Whedon’s stampof approval on it, they were still excited to read it.But they wanted to know, I guess, whether or not it

________________________________________________________________These Pages and Previous Pages: Angel: After the Fall art by Alex Garner.

In 2007, Brian Lynch, the writer of IDW’s Spike:Aslyum and Spike: Shadow Puppets, was chosen by theshow’s co-creator, Joss Whedon, to write a story thatwould officially take place after the end of the show.That idea became Angel: After the Fall and launchedin November 2007–a series that quickly became oneof IDW’s best-selling titles.

• • • •

Ted and Brian discuss Angel: Afterthe Fall, including Brian’s meetingwith Whedon.

TA: I know that comic-bookwriting isn’t your main gig.What is your day job, Brian?

BL: My day job is screenwriting. I’m currentlyworking on the Puss in Boots movie for Dreamworks–a spin-off from Shrek. I’ve also done TV shows for Foxand Warner Brothers but it’s always the same type ofstuff, either comedy or horror/comedy. That’s whythe IDW stuff worked out so well, I think.

TA: And, I think you knew Kevin Smith and that’show you met Chris. [Chris Ryall ran Kevin Smith’sWeb site, moviepoopshoot.com, before he came towork for IDW].

BL: That’s right. Kevin was afriend of mine after I workedon a movie he produced calledA Better Place. He also produceda movie I wrote and directed, a


real low-budget movie called Big Helium Dog. Whenhe started the Movie Poop Shoot site, he asked me todo comics for it and Chris was running it at the time.So, Chris and I met online through that and inperson at the San Diego Comic Convention for thefirst time a couple of years later.

TA: Were you a fan of the Angel TV show beforeChris talked to you about writing the comics?

BL: Absolutely. And Chris knew I was because in a lotof the comic strips I would do for Poop Shoot therewere Angel and Buffy references. So, Chris knew that Iknew my stuff because they were very specificreferences that only a complete geek would know.

TA: I recently re-read Spike: Asylum and Spike: ShadowPuppets and you have a very confident take on thecharacters, particularly with Spike. You really get thecharacters and the dialogue is dead-on. What was thereaction from the fans when Spike: Asylum came out?

BL: In the beginning, when it was announced, allthey wanted to know was whether or not it wascanon, whether or not it was Joss-approved, or whatepisode the storyline fit in between. But once the firstissue came out, they were won over fairly quickly andit was a great feeling. It was really nice and from thenon they’ve been nothing but the most supportivepeople. Even when they had questions and theydidn’t know whether or not it had Whedon’s stampof approval on it, they were still excited to read it.But they wanted to know, I guess, whether or not it

________________________________________________________________These Pages and Previous Pages: Angel: After the Fall art by Alex Garner.

In 2007, Brian Lynch, the writer of IDW’s Spike:Aslyum and Spike: Shadow Puppets, was chosen by theshow’s co-creator, Joss Whedon, to write a story thatwould officially take place after the end of the show.That idea became Angel: After the Fall and launchedin November 2007–a series that quickly became oneof IDW’s best-selling titles.

• • • •

Ted and Brian discuss Angel: Afterthe Fall, including Brian’s meetingwith Whedon.

TA: I know that comic-bookwriting isn’t your main gig.What is your day job, Brian?

BL: My day job is screenwriting. I’m currentlyworking on the Puss in Boots movie for Dreamworks–a spin-off from Shrek. I’ve also done TV shows for Foxand Warner Brothers but it’s always the same type ofstuff, either comedy or horror/comedy. That’s whythe IDW stuff worked out so well, I think.

TA: And, I think you knew Kevin Smith and that’show you met Chris. [Chris Ryall ran Kevin Smith’sWeb site, moviepoopshoot.com, before he came towork for IDW].

BL: That’s right. Kevin was afriend of mine after I workedon a movie he produced calledA Better Place. He also produceda movie I wrote and directed, a


should have a higher place on theirbookshelf–if it was canon or not.But either way, they were going toread it. It was whether or not they should pick itapart and get characters tattooed from it on theirbody.

TA: Spike: Asylum led into Spike: Shadow Puppets, whichclearly is a spin-out from the “Smile Time” episode.Was that an idea you had or was that something thatChris approached you with?

BL: I definitely wanted to make Spike a puppet atone point because I love theMuppets. One of the firstscreenplays I sold was an originalMuppets script thatI just wrote for fun and Henson found out about itand bought it from me. So, I know I brought up theidea to do a “Spike as a puppet” series. Chris wasthinking something along the same lines–as a sequelto “Smile Time”–so that fit perfectly.

TA: Did you get the same kind of response from thefans? Were they curious if it was canon?

BL: You know, they did. They definitely wanted toknow but at the same time, at this point, I was readyfor them. I knew that was going to be a question soin the very first issue we had Spike literally declaringthat he doesn’t like official canon. Meaning, not thathe doesn’t like the show–that wasn’t my message tothe fans, like “I hate the show”–it was that I hatetalking about whether or not it’s official canon. So,from that point on, I kind of won them over. I thinkthey said, “Let’s just go along for the ride. Let’s justenjoy it and not worry about it.” So, of course, thereare thousands of people that are worrying about itright now and are probably mad that I’m saying this.

TA: And that leads us to Angel: After the Fall, comicsthat are officially Joss Whedon-approved canon. Howdid you meet Joss?

BL: Itwas really strange. I was waiting outside of arestaurant for my friends the day before Spike: Asylum#1 came out and he walked out. Normally, even ifI’m a big fan, I never bother anyone. Joss is,obviously, a huge hero of mine but if Spike: Asylumwasn’t coming out, I would have let him walk rightby and not annoyed him. But, I just walked up andtold him what I did and I shook his hand and I said,“I have a book called Spike: Asylum coming outtomorrow. I hope if you do read it, you like it.” Andhe said, “Oh, okay, I’ll look for it.” Hewas really nice. I was talking amile a minute, the words werejust coming out but hecompletely humored meand was really warm, asweet guy, and then hewent on with his day.But, I didn’t eatbreakfast with myfriends. I just satand watchedthem becauseI couldn’t eatat that point.I was just soexcited and Iwas playingthe conversationback in my headtrying toremember whetheror not I saidsomething

195________________________This Page: Spike: ShadowPuppets art by Franco Urru.

__________________________Opposite Page: Spike: Asylumart by Franco Urru.

194


should have a higher place on theirbookshelf–if it was canon or not.But either way, they were going toread it. It was whether or not they should pick itapart and get characters tattooed from it on theirbody.

TA: Spike: Asylum led into Spike: Shadow Puppets, whichclearly is a spin-out from the “Smile Time” episode.Was that an idea you had or was that something thatChris approached you with?

BL: I definitely wanted to make Spike a puppet atone point because I love theMuppets. One of the firstscreenplays I sold was an originalMuppets script thatI just wrote for fun and Henson found out about itand bought it from me. So, I know I brought up theidea to do a “Spike as a puppet” series. Chris wasthinking something along the same lines–as a sequelto “Smile Time”–so that fit perfectly.

TA: Did you get the same kind of response from thefans? Were they curious if it was canon?

BL: You know, they did. They definitely wanted toknow but at the same time, at this point, I was readyfor them. I knew that was going to be a question soin the very first issue we had Spike literally declaringthat he doesn’t like official canon. Meaning, not thathe doesn’t like the show–that wasn’t my message tothe fans, like “I hate the show”–it was that I hatetalking about whether or not it’s official canon. So,from that point on, I kind of won them over. I thinkthey said, “Let’s just go along for the ride. Let’s justenjoy it and not worry about it.” So, of course, thereare thousands of people that are worrying about itright now and are probably mad that I’m saying this.

TA: And that leads us to Angel: After the Fall, comicsthat are officially Joss Whedon-approved canon. Howdid you meet Joss?

BL: Itwas really strange. I was waiting outside of arestaurant for my friends the day before Spike: Asylum#1 came out and he walked out. Normally, even ifI’m a big fan, I never bother anyone. Joss is,obviously, a huge hero of mine but if Spike: Asylumwasn’t coming out, I would have let him walk rightby and not annoyed him. But, I just walked up andtold him what I did and I shook his hand and I said,“I have a book called Spike: Asylum coming outtomorrow. I hope if you do read it, you like it.” Andhe said, “Oh, okay, I’ll look for it.” Hewas really nice. I was talking amile a minute, the words werejust coming out but hecompletely humored meand was really warm, asweet guy, and then hewent on with his day.But, I didn’t eatbreakfast with myfriends. I just satand watchedthem becauseI couldn’t eatat that point.I was just soexcited and Iwas playingthe conversationback in my headtrying toremember whetheror not I saidsomething

195________________________This Page: Spike: ShadowPuppets art by Franco Urru.

__________________________Opposite Page: Spike: Asylumart by Franco Urru.

194


197

embarrassing. But then, about a month later, Josscontacted Chris. He did read it and he said, “I thinkthat Brian’s voice is good for doing the officialcontinuation.” That’s among the best e-mails I’ve evergotten and thank God I went to breakfast thatmorning.

TA: Yeah, no kidding. It’s funny how such afortuitous thing happened from such a casualencounter.

BL: I mean, if I had chosen any other restaurant inL.A., who knows? Although maybe Spielberg wouldhave been eating there and I would bewriting Indiana Jones 5 rightnow.

TA: What happened next?

BL: We went back to thesame restaurant about amonth later and we sat downfor a couple of hours and hetold me everything they weregoing to do if season six hadhappened on TV. And then hethrew out a bunch of ideas thathe said, “Well, now that we’re inthe comic universe, we can getaway with a lot more in terms ofhaving an unlimited budget.” So,that’s how Angel having thedragon came about.

From that point on, I threw out ideasand characters I wanted to work

with. I could see from the look on his face whichones clicked with him and which ones to let go. Butthen, at that point, I just wrote up my first take on it,a big outline, not even dividing it in issues. He sentit back, circling everything he liked but basicallysaying, “I know you’re a fan but don’t worry aboutshaking things up. Do whatever you want. Really gonuts with it. Run the characters through the mill–ifthey’re going to Hell, really send them to Hell andtake more chances.” So, that was the best thing in theworld, to have the creator of the characters say, “Gocrazy, you’re being too tame.”

Angel was not a human in theoriginal take and then I thought,“There’s got to be a good twistfor Angel.” I remember sittingdown with my wife, whodoesn’t watch the show butshe works as an executive onmovies so she’s good withstory, and she said, “What’sthe worst thing that couldhappen to Angel in thissituation?” And I answered,“It would be that he’spowerless to help all thepeople. They’ve gone toHell and he’s powerlessto help them.” So, Idecided to make Angelhuman. And then Ithought, “Maybe Jossis going to fire mebecause it’s such astupid idea. It’s

196

_______________________________Top of the Page: Angel: After the Fallart by Franco Urru.

_______________________________Opposite Page: Angel: After the Fall

art by Franco Urru.

__________________________________________Angel: After the Fall #1 Rare Cover for Brian andCarrie Lynch’s Wedding art by Franco Urru.


197

embarrassing. But then, about a month later, Josscontacted Chris. He did read it and he said, “I thinkthat Brian’s voice is good for doing the officialcontinuation.” That’s among the best e-mails I’ve evergotten and thank God I went to breakfast thatmorning.

TA: Yeah, no kidding. It’s funny how such afortuitous thing happened from such a casualencounter.

BL: I mean, if I had chosen any other restaurant inL.A., who knows? Although maybe Spielberg wouldhave been eating there and I would bewriting Indiana Jones 5 rightnow.

TA: What happened next?

BL: We went back to thesame restaurant about amonth later and we sat downfor a couple of hours and hetold me everything they weregoing to do if season six hadhappened on TV. And then hethrew out a bunch of ideas thathe said, “Well, now that we’re inthe comic universe, we can getaway with a lot more in terms ofhaving an unlimited budget.” So,that’s how Angel having thedragon came about.

From that point on, I threw out ideasand characters I wanted to work

with. I could see from the look on his face whichones clicked with him and which ones to let go. Butthen, at that point, I just wrote up my first take on it,a big outline, not even dividing it in issues. He sentit back, circling everything he liked but basicallysaying, “I know you’re a fan but don’t worry aboutshaking things up. Do whatever you want. Really gonuts with it. Run the characters through the mill–ifthey’re going to Hell, really send them to Hell andtake more chances.” So, that was the best thing in theworld, to have the creator of the characters say, “Gocrazy, you’re being too tame.”

Angel was not a human in theoriginal take and then I thought,“There’s got to be a good twistfor Angel.” I remember sittingdown with my wife, whodoesn’t watch the show butshe works as an executive onmovies so she’s good withstory, and she said, “What’sthe worst thing that couldhappen to Angel in thissituation?” And I answered,“It would be that he’spowerless to help all thepeople. They’ve gone toHell and he’s powerlessto help them.” So, Idecided to make Angelhuman. And then Ithought, “Maybe Jossis going to fire mebecause it’s such astupid idea. It’s

196

_______________________________Top of the Page: Angel: After the Fallart by Franco Urru.

_______________________________Opposite Page: Angel: After the Fall

art by Franco Urru.

__________________________________________Angel: After the Fall #1 Rare Cover for Brian andCarrie Lynch’s Wedding art by Franco Urru.


199

either a great idea or it’s the worst idea.” It’s basicallyif we had the character of Batman and we’re notputting him in the suit for the whole run. So, Josscould either go, “You’re crazy,” or “Yes, that’s great.”He sent an e-mail back very quickly and said, “That’sit–that’s what has to happen. You’ve nailed it.” Hesaid, “We wanted to do that on the show for along time but we couldn’t come up witha situation where it would work.” So,all this stuff is going on around thetown that he’s been working tosave. They, literally, went toHell because of him–allthese people aredying, hisfriendsare

off in different directions and need his help but hehas no power to help them. So, that was the startingpoint for the series. From that point on, everythingkind of clicked into place once we figured out thatwas going to be Angel’s story.

TA: Once you knew where Angel was going tobe, you could figure out how the othercharacters are going to play out andSpike ended up being an importantpart of the story.

BL: Absolutely. Because I’d previouslydone the two Spike series, when I wasannounced as the writer of Angel: Afterthe Fall, a lot of people were scared that itwas going to be Angel and Spike sharingthe spotlight. Like they were going to bepartners–they were concerned it wasn’t goingto be Angel’s comic. As a result of that, Iwanted to show people that it wasn’t goingto be that way, so Spike kind of got the shaftearly on.

And then, when you guys said, “Do you haveany ideas for a spin-off,” Spike: After the Fall was

the one that it had to be. We put Spike through someweird moments in the first couple of issues and,because it was Angel’s story, we didn’t really getto see why Spike was in that weird place anddoing these things that are out of character forhim. So, thank God that happened, becauseeverything seemed to click and not only werewe able to flesh out things that I should havedone earlier in Angel: After the Fall, it was a great

chance to show that Spike is still a hero and this iswhy he’s doing the things that may seem weird inthe main series.

TA: That’s one of the nice things about thecommercial success of the book, it gave us thefreedom to expand the storyline. Success is oftenhard to come by in the world of comics.

BL: And when it happens, it’s a great feeling–but youwant to see what clicked and you want to make itclick again.

198

___________________________________________This Page and Opposite Page: Angel: Old Friendsart by David Messina.


199

either a great idea or it’s the worst idea.” It’s basicallyif we had the character of Batman and we’re notputting him in the suit for the whole run. So, Josscould either go, “You’re crazy,” or “Yes, that’s great.”He sent an e-mail back very quickly and said, “That’sit–that’s what has to happen. You’ve nailed it.” Hesaid, “We wanted to do that on the show for along time but we couldn’t come up witha situation where it would work.” So,all this stuff is going on around thetown that he’s been working tosave. They, literally, went toHell because of him–allthese people aredying, hisfriendsare

off in different directions and need his help but hehas no power to help them. So, that was the startingpoint for the series. From that point on, everythingkind of clicked into place once we figured out thatwas going to be Angel’s story.

TA: Once you knew where Angel was going tobe, you could figure out how the othercharacters are going to play out andSpike ended up being an importantpart of the story.

BL: Absolutely. Because I’d previouslydone the two Spike series, when I wasannounced as the writer of Angel: Afterthe Fall, a lot of people were scared that itwas going to be Angel and Spike sharingthe spotlight. Like they were going to bepartners–they were concerned it wasn’t goingto be Angel’s comic. As a result of that, Iwanted to show people that it wasn’t goingto be that way, so Spike kind of got the shaftearly on.

And then, when you guys said, “Do you haveany ideas for a spin-off,” Spike: After the Fall was

the one that it had to be. We put Spike through someweird moments in the first couple of issues and,because it was Angel’s story, we didn’t really getto see why Spike was in that weird place anddoing these things that are out of character forhim. So, thank God that happened, becauseeverything seemed to click and not only werewe able to flesh out things that I should havedone earlier in Angel: After the Fall, it was a great

chance to show that Spike is still a hero and this iswhy he’s doing the things that may seem weird inthe main series.

TA: That’s one of the nice things about thecommercial success of the book, it gave us thefreedom to expand the storyline. Success is oftenhard to come by in the world of comics.

BL: And when it happens, it’s a great feeling–but youwant to see what clicked and you want to make itclick again.

198

___________________________________________This Page and Opposite Page: Angel: Old Friendsart by David Messina.


I just told Chris two or three days ago that I wroteeight or nine pages of an Angel book. I had an ideaand I thought, “I have to do this.” I wanted to get iton paper. And Chris said, “You can’t quit us.” And Isaid, “I know.” I love these characters.

TA: That’s great news. We can’t wait to have youback. The door here is wide open and not just forAngel, but for whatever you’d like to do. Althoughwe’re certainly anxious to have you back on Angeland Spike.

BL: Thank you so much, that’s cool.

201

IDW

_________________________________Angel: After the Fall art by Alex Garner.

TA: Right. It’s nice to feel like you’re doingsomething that people really like. Usually in comics,the sales decline with every issue–so, issue four sellsworse than issue three and issue five sells worse thanissue four. But with Angel: After the Fall, we saw salesincreasing between issues three and four and weeventually reached a really nice level plateau. It wasclear that this was the number of people buying thiscomic on a monthly basis.

BL: That’s cool. And I hope they were buying andreading it. That’s the big thing.

TA: I think they were. People weren’t just buying thisto put it in a bag and a box. I think that people reallywere reading it and enjoying it.

BL: I can take bad reviews but the worst thing iswhen nobody talks about it. I love when people arediscussing it–good or bad–and with Angel: After theFall, every panel gets dissected. That’s awesome. It’sa pretty good feeling.

TA: I tell everybody at IDW that you’ve got to havethick skin to work in this business. With any creativeendeavor, the feedback can sometimes be prettytough but when you’re talking about somethingthat’s as beloved as Joss and Angel, the fans can betough.

BL: I agree completely. I’ve gotten e-mail threats–notdeath threats but threats–because of things I’ve doneto the characters. Which is really weird. You knowwhat, I would definitely not be sending threats topeople but I would be very passionate about theseries even if I had nothing to do with it. So, I get it.I get why they get upset or they get excited becauseI get excited about books that I really enjoy. So Iunderstand it. It’s a big responsibility, it’s cool. It’s agood feeling.

TA: As we’re talking today, you recently finished thelast issue of Angel: After the Fall. How’s that feel?

BL: I think I finished the last issue on Christmas Dayand I took a week break and I thought, “I’m notgoing to have to do that again for months. And then,

200

___________________________________Angel: Old Friends art by David Messina.


I just told Chris two or three days ago that I wroteeight or nine pages of an Angel book. I had an ideaand I thought, “I have to do this.” I wanted to get iton paper. And Chris said, “You can’t quit us.” And Isaid, “I know.” I love these characters.

TA: That’s great news. We can’t wait to have youback. The door here is wide open and not just forAngel, but for whatever you’d like to do. Althoughwe’re certainly anxious to have you back on Angeland Spike.

BL: Thank you so much, that’s cool.

201

IDW

_________________________________Angel: After the Fall art by Alex Garner.

TA: Right. It’s nice to feel like you’re doingsomething that people really like. Usually in comics,the sales decline with every issue–so, issue four sellsworse than issue three and issue five sells worse thanissue four. But with Angel: After the Fall, we saw salesincreasing between issues three and four and weeventually reached a really nice level plateau. It wasclear that this was the number of people buying thiscomic on a monthly basis.

BL: That’s cool. And I hope they were buying andreading it. That’s the big thing.

TA: I think they were. People weren’t just buying thisto put it in a bag and a box. I think that people reallywere reading it and enjoying it.

BL: I can take bad reviews but the worst thing iswhen nobody talks about it. I love when people arediscussing it–good or bad–and with Angel: After theFall, every panel gets dissected. That’s awesome. It’sa pretty good feeling.

TA: I tell everybody at IDW that you’ve got to havethick skin to work in this business. With any creativeendeavor, the feedback can sometimes be prettytough but when you’re talking about somethingthat’s as beloved as Joss and Angel, the fans can betough.

BL: I agree completely. I’ve gotten e-mail threats–notdeath threats but threats–because of things I’ve doneto the characters. Which is really weird. You knowwhat, I would definitely not be sending threats topeople but I would be very passionate about theseries even if I had nothing to do with it. So, I get it.I get why they get upset or they get excited becauseI get excited about books that I really enjoy. So Iunderstand it. It’s a big responsibility, it’s cool. It’s agood feeling.

TA: As we’re talking today, you recently finished thelast issue of Angel: After the Fall. How’s that feel?

BL: I think I finished the last issue on Christmas Dayand I took a week break and I thought, “I’m notgoing to have to do that again for months. And then,

200

___________________________________Angel: Old Friends art by David Messina.


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Idwx chap 14