Effectively Engaging People - The Conference Peopletcp-events.co.uk/.../NSMC_Effectively_engaging_people_conference...Philip Kotler * Sameer Deshpande * Sudha Tewari ... Social Marketing

NationalSocial MarketingCentre

Effectively Engaging PeopleViews from the World Social Marketing Conference 2008

Philip Kotler * Sameer Deshpande * Sudha TewariNancy Lee * Dr Seynabou Mbengue * Dr Regina Ching

Katherine Lyon Daniel * Craig Lefebvre * Doug McKenzie-Mohr, Ph.D.Ed Maibach * Clive Blair-Stevens * Francois Lagarde

Tane Cassidy * Dr Robert Marshall * Paul Brewer Ewen MacGregor * Dr Ray Lowry * Professor Gerard Hastings

Professor Alan Andreasen * Dr William Smith * Professor Jeff French

Effectively Engaging People

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Contents

Introduction 3

Philip Kotler 4

Sameer Deshpande 5

Sudha Tewari 6

Nancy Lee 7

Seynabou Mbengue 8

Regina Ching 9

Katherine Lyon Daniel 10

Craig Lefebvre 11

Doug McKenzie-Mohr 12

Ed Maibach 13

Clive Blair-Stevens 14

Francois Lagarde 15

Tane Cassidy 16

Robert Marshall 17

Paul Brewer 18

Ewen MacGregor 19

Ray Lowry 20

Gerard Hastings 21

Alan Andreasen 22

William Smith 23

Jeff French 24


IntroductionThe 2008 World Social Marketing Conference showcased a fantastic range of expertiseand innovation. Along with our partners, the Chinese University of Hong Kong and theUniversity of Lethbridge, we at the NSM Centre are proud to have brought together somany delegates from around the world, and are grateful for the tremendous contributionthey all made.

The conference was enriched by the insights and experience of a diverse range ofspeakers, and I am delighted to present interviews with many of the keynote speakershere.

I hope you are inspired and informed by the wealth of social marketing know-how found inthese pages.

Professor Jeff French

Director, National Social Marketing Centre


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How did you becomeinvolved in socialmarketing?In the early 1970s I realised thatmarketing concepts and toolscould be applied to areas beyondgoods and services. They couldbe applied to market anyorganisation, person, place, causeor idea. My colleague GeraldZaltman and I wrote an articlecalled ‘Social Marketing: AnApproach to Planned SocialChange’. We chose the name‘social marketing’ to show that notall marketing is commercial.Marketers could address publicconcerns and contribute to theirresolution. Subsequently, Ipublished the first book on socialmarketing with Ned Roberto.Some years later, Nancy Lee, NedRoberto and I published a muchupdated version with new theoryand case examples. The book isnow in its third edition.

What is social marketing?Social marketing is the applicationof marketing concepts and tools toinfluence the behaviour change ofa target audience, in ways thatcreate net benefits for theindividual, community, and societyat large. Typically, socialmarketing centres on suchproblem areas as health,environmental protection, bettereducation, family planning andothers.

What advice would yougive to someonedeveloping their firstsocial marketingintervention?Frame the problem carefully andbe realistic in the results that youare seeking. Conduct theintervention with clearperformance measurements sothat cause and effect can beeasily identified, and the impactcan be measured in financialterms or other metrics.

What needs to be done tobuild the workforce insocial marketing?We need to educate businessmanagers, non-profit managersand politicians in the meaning ofsocial marketing and the majorsteps and processes it uses. Wemust avoid confusing it with socialadvertising or corporate socialresponsibility. We have formulateda distinct set of ten steps whichhas received high agreement onhow to develop a social marketingplan. If we can educate socialmarketing users in socialmarketing methodology, theinterventions are likely to besuccessful.

What book would yourecommend to people tohelp them understandsocial marketing? In addition to our third edition ofSocial Marketing (Sage, 2008), Iwould recommend AlanAndreasen’s book, SocialMarketing in the 21st Century.

If you were trapped in alift for ten minutes withyour nation’s President,what would you say? We are at that stage in time, MrPresident, where we arebeginning to have a methodologywhich is cost effective and couldhelp us resolve many of the socialproblems that have plaguedsociety. That tool is socialmarketing.

“A methodologywhich…couldhelp us resolvemany of thesocialproblems”

NAMEPhilip

Kotler

POSITIONS.C.Johnson &Son DistinguishedProfessor of InternationalMarketing,Northwestern University

PLACEUSA

WEBwww.kellogg.northwestern.edu/Faculty.aspx


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What got you involved insocial marketing?In my earlier commercialmarketing career, I liked thehammer called ‘marketing’ but Iwas unhappy promoting healthyhair…until I found socialmarketing, where I was bothpassionate and satisfied. So Iguess it was my desire to usewhat I like (marketing) to dosomething good (positive socialchange) that got me involved insocial marketing.

What is social marketing?Social marketing is a frameworkthat allows us to offer benefits thatattract our audience andsupersede barriers from theaudience perspective.

What one thing have youlearnt that you wish youknew 20 years ago?The importance of productmanagement in social marketing.

What example would yougive to highlight socialmarketing’s potential? Grameen Bank by MohammedYunus. Although Dr.Yunus doesnot label his work as socialmarketing, his work exemplifiesmany of the features that wesocial marketers use.

What one piece of advicewould you give tosomeone developing asocial marketinginitiative?Total commitment to audienceorientation. This would forcemanagers to carry out research atevery stage and producestrategies that remain consistentwith audience needs (not whatthey say, but what they desire orwhat moves them).

What are the mostchallenging aspects ofcreating a socialmarketing intervention?The lack of understanding of itscore concepts among socialchange managers.

“I liked thehammer called‘marketing’ but I wasunhappypromotinghealthy hair”

NAMESameer Deshpande

POSITIONAssociateProfessor,Marketing,Centre forSociallyResponsibleMarketing,University of Lethbridge

PLACECanada

WEBwww.uleth.ca/man/research/centres/csrm


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How did you becomeinvolved in socialmarketing?After a management degree, anda few years marketing industrialprojects began to make me feeluneasy, I wanted to do somethingmore meaningful. With anunmanageable population,widespread poverty, high maternalmortality and millions of unwantedchildren in my country, familyplanning was close to my heart. Alack of professional managementin development projects wasevident. Opportunity came myway when I was selected 28 yearsback, by a non-profit organisationin its infancy, to design anddevelop its family planningprogramme. It gave me animmense opportunity to apply mymanagement skills and knowledgefor 'social dividends' instead ofjust profits. I was not aware thenthat I was using the socialmarketing route.

What is social marketing?In social marketing, thecommitment to the mission andcause is paramount, rather thanprofits as in commercialmarketing. The person willing topractice social marketing must becommitted to the specific cause ofthe socio-economic condition ofthe target population, along withtheir real needs.

What advice would yougive to someonedeveloping their firstsocial marketingintervention?The cost-effectiveness of differentapproaches must be carefullyanalysed at the designing stageitself and a strong monitoringsystem set up at the planningstage. This will help to enhancethe effectiveness of the project,making it possible for it to sustainitself beyond funding. Its serviceswill continue to be delivered topeople, instead of abandoningthem at a critical juncture whenattitudinal change has begun totake place and they are ready topractice a different behaviour.

Which book would yourecommend to people tohelp them understandsocial marketing?All books on social marketing arerelevant. Personally, I have beengreatly influenced by the writingsof Professor Philip Kotler.

What are the mostchallenging parts ofdeveloping a socialmarketing intervention?Keeping it focused on meeting theobjectives of the programme,without getting lost on thepackaging of it, to meet therequirements of different donorsand governments.

What should those withvery few resources do tocreate an effective socialmarketing intervention?Keep it small and simple. Dowhatever is possible, but beresult-oriented. This will give youimmense personal satisfaction.Your commitment and asuccessful model will eventuallylead to its expansion.

What one thing have youlearnt that you wish youknew 20 years ago?An organisation with a long-termdevelopment mission must not bedonor-driven.

Where will socialmarketing will be in 20years time?My assessment is that the gapbetween 'haves' and 'have nots'will further widen. To improve thequality of lives of people, socialmarketing approaches shouldassume more importance.However, the fillip given to socialmarketing would depend on thepolicy environment ofgovernments and donors as wellas advocacy by institutionscommitted to social marketing.

“Anorganisationwith a long-termdevelopmentmission mustnot be donordriven.”

NAMESudha Tewari

POSITIONPresident, ParivarSevaSanstha

PLACEIndia

WEBwww.parivarsevasanstha.org/home.php


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How did you becomeinvolved in socialmarketing?I read Philip Kotler’s book,Marketing Management ingraduate school that proclaimedthat marketing can contribute tothe quality of life - that it can beused to influence publicbehaviours that will contribute toalleviating social issues. Whilemarketing director of our region’schildren’s hospital, we developeda campaign to increase use of lifevests among children and I fell inlove with marketing behavioursand decided that’s what I wantedto do the rest of my life.

What is social marketing?Social marketing is a distinctmarketing discipline, one that hasbeen labelled as such since theearly ‘70s. It is focused oninfluencing behaviours for good –ones that will improve health,prevent injuries, protect theenvironment, and contribute tocommunities. Fundamentalprinciples at the core of thispractice have been used to helpreduce tobacco use; decreaseinfant mortality; stop the spread ofHIV/AIDS; make wearing bikehelmets a social norm; decreaselittering; increase recycling; andpersuade pet owners to licencetheir pets and 'scoop their poop’.

What advice would yougive to someonedeveloping their firstsocial marketingintervention?Focus on a single, simple, doablebehaviour and understand whatbarriers your target audience hasto adopting it.

How can we build capacityin social marketing?Make it a required or core coursefor degrees in public health, socialwork, public administration,political science, environmentalstudies - maybe even medicalschool.

Social marketingincreasingly encompassespeople from bothmarketing and the socialsciences. What are thechallenges in integratinglearning from differentdisciplines?The challenge is that thosewithout a marketing backgroundare often not comfortable orfamiliar with the other three crucialtools in the marketing mix:product, price and place. Myexperience has been that manycome with a bias againstcorporate/commercial marketing,primarily because they areequating marketing with sales andadvertising, which they findannoying at best.

What advice would yougive to an organisationwith limited funds toinvest in a socialmarketing intervention?� Do a pilot;.� look for partners who do have

funding and have something init for them to support the effort;

� use social media channels;and

� don’t spend the money oncreative development. Look forexisting and prior similarcampaign efforts and borrowfrom them.

What book would yourecommend to people tohelp them understandsocial marketing?The new edition of our book,Social Marketing: InfluencingBehaviors for Good, and FosteringSustainability by Doug McKenzie-Mohr and Bill Smith.

NAMENancy Lee

POSITIONPresident,SocialMarketingServices,Inc.

PLACEUSA

WEBwww.socialmarketingservice.com


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How did you becomeinvolved in socialmarketing?In 1994, the Futures GroupInternational was looking for aResident Advisor and Coordinatorfor their SOMARC (SocialMarketing for Change) Project inSenegal, a USAID-funded project.I was recruited, and that is when Iofficially started my involvement insocial marketing. But my initialinterest in social marketing grewfrom when I first started my career as a pharmacist, longbefore 1994.

What advice would yougive to someonedeveloping their firstsocial marketingintervention?I would recommend making surethey focus on the real prioritiesand well-defined issues prior toimplementation. Social marketingis a powerful tool for behaviourchange but in some areas, wherethe external environment is notfavourable, you face so manychallenges. Achieving results inthese circumstances at the targetgroup level takes much longer.

What are the mostchallenging parts ofdeveloping a socialmarketing intervention?The external environment can beone of the most challengingfactors. Specifically, when keystakeholders who set strategiesand policies for the country arenot convinced of the need forinvesting in social marketing, butwould rather purchase equipment,buildings, and so on. Such thingsmay not always be the mosturgent priorities when you lookholistically at the situation, but areoften the most visible.

What should those withvery few resources do tocreate an effective socialmarketing intervention?We have to work with all theresources at our disposal, whichrequires understanding theexternal environment so that wedon't overlook those that alreadyexist. Most often we have foundthat populations will contributemore in the area of health - as isseen with the Bamako Initiativesin African countries. Through theHealth Committees set up at thedepartment, region, or districtlevels, it is the community thateven recruits their doctors andnurses and purchase equipments.

If I had £10m to invest,tell me why it should go tosocial marketing ratherthan reducing a budgetdeficit or to other tools?Social marketing will help identifycauses, barriers and solutions onits own. Reducing a financialdeficit will not necessarily avoid anew deficit in the future. Socialmarketing is a more globalapproach, integratingdevelopment of tools and methodsto avoid future deficits.

If we are to develop socialmarketing what are thekey challenges now?It has to be more accepted as adiscipline in and of itself, and betaught at university andprofessional teaching schools, inhealth, business administration,agriculture, environment and soon. Organisations and institutionsin the domain will have tocontribute to the development ofdocumented knowledge andmaterials for such teaching to takeplace, and probably developtrainers’ tools and case studiesthat integrate the local needs.

What book would yourecommend to people tohelp them understandsocial marketing?I discovered Professor Alan R.Andreasen’s book MarketingSocial Change: ChangingBehavior to Promote Health,Social Development, and theEnvironment in 1997 while atGeorgetown University School ofBusiness. I think this book clarifiedfor me what social marketingreally is.

Where will socialmarketing be in 20 years?More and more, it will be knownas a successful approach toresolving many problems weencounter (health coverage,accessibility of services andproducts, environmental issues,and so on). I feel social issues areoften barriers to marketdevelopment. Improvement to thequality of life in general is auniversal need throughout theworld.

NAMEDocteur Seynabou

Mbengue

POSITIONExecutive Director,Agence pour leDéveloppement duMarketingSocial(ADEMAS)

PLACESenegal


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How did you becomeinvolved in socialmarketing?As someone practicing healthpromotion, social marketing is thebuzzword which I hear often andam interested to find out how itmay be applied in day-to-daywork.

What one thing have youlearnt that you wish youknew 20 years ago?The total process planning modeland customer triangle of socialmarketing.

What advice would yougive to someonedeveloping their firstsocial marketingintervention?Follow the total planning modeland take heed of the messages inthe customer triangle as far asyou can.

If we are to furtherdevelop social marketingwhat are the keychallenges now?Make social marketing principlesand practice a core part of anyhealth promotion.

If I had £10m to invest,tell me why it should go tosocial marketing ratherthan reducing a budgetdeficit or to other tools?Wise investment in socialmarketing may maximise the cost-effectiveness of your undertaking,creating value for money, hencesecuring if not drawing in moreresources to sustain your work.

What book would yourecommend to people tohelp them understandsocial marketing?Resources uploaded to theNational Social Marketing Centrewebsite are very readable andpractical for beginners in socialmarketing. Practitioners need agrasp on the knowledge base thatworks, rather than knowledgebase that may work.

What do you consider themost challenging parts ofdeveloping a socialmarketing intervention?Having to embark on somethingnew without too much localguidance.

What should those withvery few resources do tocreate an effective socialmarketing intervention?Most important is a change inmindset to really serve your clientor audience better or moreeffectively. Practical toolsdeveloped by leadingorganisations can help to buildlocal capacity.

Where do you feel socialmarketing will be in 20years time?More real life examples andillustrations of how socialmarketing may contribute to thepromotion of healthy practices andpublic goods. Perhaps much wideracceptance and adoption in thepublic sector as well.

NAMEDr

Regina

Ching

POSITIONAssistantDirector (Health Promotion),Department of Health, Hong Kong SAR

PLACE China

WEB www.dh.gov.hk

How did you get involvedin social marketing?When I was working inbehavioural science and healthcommunications at CDC, in themid-90s, I heard about this ‘new’tool. To me, it made completesense to use commercialmarketing techniques: just writingprescriptions for health wasn’tenough, we needed to think aboutwhat moves and motivatespeople. I was impressed by thedepth of thinking within socialmarketing in this regard.

What is social marketing?I describe social marketing toothers as a process or tool toachieve positive behaviourchange. I personally think of it interms of health, but there aremany other areas it can beapplied to. It is informed bymultiple theories of humanbehaviour and, at its best, byevidence for how people reallythink and act.

What one thing have youlearnt that you wish youknew 20 years ago?I wish I’d started to help ‘market’social marketing earlier. Fundersand policy makers often think theycan achieve their goals in onebudget cycle and move on, butsupporting positive changethrough social marketing is a long-term investment. It would beeasier to get this message acrossif they had bought into the ideaearly on.

If you had to choose asingle example of socialmarketing to highlight itspotential, what would itbe?CDC’s ‘Learn the signs. Act early’campaign(www.cdc.gov/ncbddd/autism/actearly). The aim was to raise

awareness of and encouragescreening of young children fordevelopmental problems such asautism. Previous healthcommunication measures hadactually made some parents lesslikely to act, but the carefulapplication of the four Ps ofmarketing (Product, Price, Placeand Promotion) moved us toacknowledge the magnitude of theprice a parent pays in looking for aproblem with their child’s growth.And while there may still behidden prices, it dug deep enoughto enable us to address themmethodically. I am hopeful that wewill start to see positive results –that disorders are beingdiagnosed earlier – within the nextfew years.

What one piece of advicewould you give tosomeone developing asocial marketinginitiative?Bring as many people from alldisciplines to the table as you can,as early on as possible, and findout how they would define‘success’ in the initiative. We toooften don’t think beyond our ownconceptions of a project’ssuccess, but thinking about what itlooks like from the perspective ofpeople who are not directlyinvolved in a project is key tomoving it forward.

What are the mostchallenging aspects ofcreating a socialmarketing intervention?Competition! Proper funding canhelp break through it, but does notnecessitate success alone. Today,we are exposed to anoverwhelming volume ofmessages and products: if youwant me to do or buy one thing,I’m not going to do some otherthings. Our lives are incrediblycomplex, and we need to work outhow to deal with this.

Also, the term ‘social marketing’ isconfusing, which makes it hard tomarket. At CDC and in otherpublic health specialties, peopleconfused it with socialengineering, which is why we nowuse the term ‘health marketing’instead. More work needs to bedone on the brand!

What are you most proudto have achieved in socialmarketing?That I have contributed in somesmall way to social marketingbecoming accepted, throughorganisations like the NationalCenter for Health Marketing atCDC and NSMC, and inincreasing professional degreesand qualifications. Also, socialmarketing is successful only whenit is based on people, on theirneeds and feelings. You canalways be proud when you putpeople first.


NAMEKatherine Lyon

Daniel

POSITIONDeputyDirector,NationalCenter forHealthMarketing Centers forDiseaseControl and Prevention(CDC)

PLACEUSA

WEBwww.cdc.gov

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How did you becomeinvolved in socialmarketing?I came into this area with a PhD inclinical psychology and post-doctoral work in behaviouralmedicine. My first position waswith the Pawtucket Heart HealthProgramme. This was a NationalInstitutes of Health-funded heartdisease prevention programme inRhode Island that broughttogether the worlds of publichealth and behavioral health. Thisvery quickly led to me exploringthe world of marketing forpopulation behavioural change.From there, it was tripping overthe early social marketing writings,and thinking that it soundedsimilar to what I was trying to do. Istarted talking about socialmarketing with June Flora atStanford, who was already usingsocial marketing principles in theFive-City Project. We workedtogether, doing some thinking andexploring and experimenting withdifferent ways of using marketingprinciples in community basedheart disease preventionprogrammes.

What is social marketing?Using the techniques of marketingto improve people’s health andsocial conditions. And by that Iwould also say that the everydayexamples of marketing (such asproduct innovations; pricing anddistribution strategies; andadvertising and promotions), thathelp and encourage people to buyvarious products and services, arethe same types of techniques wecan use to encourage people toadopt healthy andenvironmentally-friendlybehaviours.

What advice would yougive to someonedeveloping their firstsocial marketingintervention?Listen to the audience. Don’tassume you know what is best forsolving or addressing a problem –listen to and talk with a lot ofpeople.

How can we promotesocial marketing torelevant practitioners andkey decision-makers?This is not so much an empiricalor evidence-based question ofhighlighting to them what studieshave shown social marketing tobe effective at doing, although thatis important. For practitioners anddecision makers, it’s about beingable to tell them stories about howsocial marketing was adopted in aprogramme in significant and verybasic ways and the improvementsin reach, service and benefits thatresulted. It’s that kind of narrativeof before and after, helping peoplesee and understand how socialmarketing approaches apply toand change practice and policydevelopment.

What needs to be done tobuild the workforce insocial marketing?It’s open to everybody. Right nowa short history of social marketingwould show it has lived andthrived with the links to publichealth – and there is much thatneeds to be done to bring it intopublic health as a discipline, notjust a practice. One of thefrustrations I have is that it doesn’tearn much value in academia. Weneed to give it more value as anacademic discipline in bothmarketing and public health. I want to see incentives to

encourage more people to enterand pursue an academic career insocial marketing within the publichealth and marketing fields.

What book would yourecommend to people tohelp them understandsocial marketing?Text books are all probablyequally as good – they all havetheir own strengths. I like Truth,Lies and Advertising by JonSteele. It is good at developingthe audience insight andtranslating that into practice,which I think is the essence ofgood social marketing. If you don’tunderstand the core value oflistening, use what you learn togenerate the insight and thentranslate this into practice, theother marketing skills will do youvery little good. This is missingfrom most work I review.

NAMECraig Lefebvre

POSITIONAdjunct Professor inPreventionandCommunityHealth atGWUSchool ofPublicHealth andHealth Services; formerChief Technical Officer atPopulation ServicesInternational (PSI)

PLACE USA

WEBsocialmarketing.blogs.com


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How did you becomeinvolved in socialmarketing?I wrote a book, FosteringSustainable Behavior, in the early90s, that merged knowledge fromsocial marketing with knowledgefrom psychology.

What is social marketing?From my perspective, socialmarketing involves five steps: � selecting behaviours; � uncovering the barriers and

benefits to the selectedbehaviours;

� developing strategies thataddress these barriers andbenefits;

� piloting the strategy; and � when the strategy is found to

be cost-effective, implementingit broadly.

This process can be utilised tofoster a wide range of behaviours.

What advice would yougive to someonedeveloping their firstsocial marketingintervention?Carefully select whichbehaviour(s) to target and conductformative research regarding thebarriers and benefits to thesebehaviours. If these first two stepsof community-based socialmarketing are skipped,programmes have a low likelihoodof success.

How can we build capacityin social marketing?Demand that governmentalbehavioural change programmesmust use social marketingapproaches.

What needs to be done tobuild the workforce insocial marketing? Encourage governmental andnon-governmental agencies to

hire social marketing staff andpromote those who develop theirsocial marketing skill base.

What are the key ethicalissues in trying toinfluence people'sbehaviour?The intended audiences of socialmarketing programmes need to beaware that efforts are being madeto alter their behaviour.

What should we be doingto support thedevelopment of a robustshared evidence base?Please see my website for anexample of an attempt to do thiswith respect to environmentalbehavioural change. The new site,which is being rolled out inNovember, combines fiveresources (our book; over 1000articles related to environmentalbehavioural change; case studies;discussion forums, which includea daily digest that reaches over6000 practitioners; and an onlinejournal, Journal of FosteringSustainable Behavior). We need asimilar effort on the broad set ofbehaviours addressed by socialmarketing.

What are the challengesfaced by an organisationwith limited funds toinvest in a socialmarketing intervention?The challenge of doing formativeresearch with a small budget. Weneed to see state and federalefforts to provide barrier andbenefit research to those who areunable to do this workthemselves.

What book would yourecommend to people tohelp them understandsocial marketing? Kotler and Lee’s recent edition ofSocial Marketing.

What other questionshould we have askedyou?It is useful to consider the level ofpenetration that social marketinghas reached within differentdomains. While social marketingis fairly broadly used - forexample, to foster health relatedbehavioural changes - it is rarelyused to foster environment-relatedbehavioural changes.

NAMEDoug McKenzie-

Mohr, Ph.D.

POSITIONPresident,McKenzie-Mohr &Associates

PLACECanada

WEBwww.cbsm.com


How did you becomeinvolved in socialmarketing? I was lucky to find myself in theright place at the right time,repeatedly. First, when getting myPhD in communication research atStanford in the mid-1980s, I gotfabulously lucky in the fact that myadvisor was June Flora – anextraordinary social marketer whocut her teeth on the StanfordHeart Disease Prevention Project.Next, while working as anassistant professor at EmoryUniversity in Atlanta, I learned thatBill Novelli – the father of socialmarketing – lived in Atlanta too.He ended up co-teaching mysocial marketing course with methe next semester (how’s that forlucky?). His old firm – PorterNovelli – recruited me to join theirsocial marketing team, which wasa marvellous opportunity totransition from research topractice and learn a whole newset of skills. Truly, I’m a lucky guy.

What is social marketing? Over time, I’ve become a bit of apurist on this point (possiblyfanatically so), largely because somany people wrongly equatesocial marketing with informationcampaigns. Therefore, I describesocial marketing as a process ofcreating, delivering and promotingproducts or services that elicitbeneficial behaviours frommembers of a target audience. Inother words, if there is no productor service, it isn’t social marketing.[Is this] a fanatical perspective?Yes, but it helps people see thatthey have more tools at theirdisposal than they previouslyrecognised.

What advice would yougive to someonedeveloping their firstsocial marketingintervention?Focus. Tackle one ‘non-reducible’behaviour at a time. If you don’tknow what a non-reduciblebehaviour is, read DougMcKenzie-Mohr’s forthcoming(2009) book.

How can we build capacityin social marketing?Commercial marketers can makethe transition, but they needtraining in the social content.Communication professionals canmake the transition, but they needtraining in the Four Ps. We couldall benefit from a large library ofwell-developed case studies.

What are the key ethicalissues in trying toinfluence people'sbehaviour?This question is ‘above my paygrade’, as they say here inWashington, DC, but I’ll make onebrief comment. We tend to focustoo much on changing people,and we don’t focus nearly enoughon changing the environments inwhich people live, work and play.Behaviour is so deeply influencedby the attributes of ourenvironment (products andservices, policies, and physicalattributes). Social marketingprogrammes will fully prove theirworth when they demonstratetheir ability to createenvironmental change.

How can we develop arobust shared evidencebase in social marketing?See my comment about casestudies above. And let’s importsome Six Sigma experts from GEor Toyota or Wal-Mart to teach ushow to build total qualityimprovement into everything we do.

What are the challengesfaced by an organisationwith limited funds toinvest in a socialmarketing intervention?They face the same problems asan organisation with a largebudget. The challenge isn’tmoney, it’s mindset. Focus on thecustomer, and use whateverresources you have to best effect.

What book would yourecommend to people tohelp them understandsocial marketing?My students are assigned to readPhilip Kotler and Nancy Lee’s(2008) book and Doug McKenzie-Mohr’s (1999) book. Those books– especially in combination – areso good that I hardly feel the needto lecture.

What other questionshould we have askedyou?If you were awarded a sabbaticalto take three months to become abetter social marketer, how andwhere would you spend yourtime?

NAMEEd

Maibach

POSITIONDirector,Center forClimate ChangeCommunication,George Mason University

PLACEUSA

WEBwww.climatechange.gmu.edu

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How did you becomeinvolved in socialmarketing?By being asked by Professor JeffFrench to work on the two-yearindependent review of socialmarketing, commissioned by theBritish Government in 2004; andhaving a background in public health,health promotion andcommunications.

What is social marketing?At the highest level I’d probably justsay it was about harnessingmarketing approaches to benefitpeople’s lives. However, increasingly Italk about it being the use ofmarketing, alongside other techniquesand approaches, to establish andsustain positive behaviours that helpimprove people’s lives. The criticalword here is ‘alongside’ so that wehelp people approach socialmarketing as an integrative discipline,one that connects with and integratesalongside other methods andapproaches. Otherwise we risk gettingdrawn into what I’d describe as the‘method wars’, where instead oflooking for the links between methodsand approaches, we simply getcaught into ‘my method is better thanyours’, and set up artificial boundariesthat pull people apart rather than bringthem together.

Recognising that socialmarketing is understood(and misunderstood) in arange of ways, the NSMCentre developed the 8-pointBenchmark Criteria forsocial marketing, building onprevious work by AlanAndreasen. How useful doyou find them?As someone who developed thebenchmarks I obviously see these asimportant, and am pleased to thank

Alan Andreasen for his original workin proposing his six-point version. It isworth saying that in developing themwe have been really aware of theextent to which different people pickup on different language and ideas.Their value of them is less about thespecific descriptions of each point, butrather that they each represent a setof ideas, concepts or principles that itis important to build a wideunderstanding of. We continue towork on ways to communicate these,tailoring them to different audienceneeds.

What are the key ethicalissues in trying to influencebehaviour?For me, the two key ethical issues insocial marketing are:� How is the social good being

defined?; and� who is involved in the defining of

it?

How can we get high leveldecision-makers tounderstand the potentialbenefits of a socialmarketing-informedapproach?The critical issue is to start withdeveloping a sound understanding ofwhere the decision-maker is comingfrom, what’s important to them andwhat they value. Then, from thisunderstanding, looking at ways toengage them, rather than selling thebenefits of social marketing fromone’s own perspective. Quite oftenthis can mean not starting from asocial marketing framing at all.

What book would yourecommend to people to helpthem understand socialmarketing?It’s always difficult to recommendspecific books, but Alan Andreasen’sSocial Marketing in the 21st Centuryis an excellent introduction and arelatively easy read for someonetrying to get an overview of wheresocial marketing thinking is now.

What one thing have youlearnt that you wish youknew 20 years ago?It’s all about people and relationships:investing time in building connectionswith policymakers and practitioners aswell as the community we aim toserve.

NAMEClive

Blair-

Stevens

POSITIONDirector ofStrategy and Operations,National Social MarketingCentre

PLACEEngland

WEB www.nsmcentre.org.uk

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How did you becomeinvolved in socialmarketing? Through my work in public health– I was looking for a pragmaticand non-traditional framework toencompass the many facets ofissues with rigour, creativity andethics.

What is social marketing?Social marketing is aboutencouraging people to adoptideas and/or behaviours for theirpersonal benefit and for that ofsociety in general. You will have amuch better chance of influencingpeople to voluntarily adopt abehaviour if you: � know more about them; � understand that not all are

likely to be at the same startingpoint;

� consider your competition; � actually make it attractive and

easy for people; � partner with influential people; � communicate effectively; and � are in it for the long run.

What advice would yougive to someonedeveloping their firstsocial marketingintervention?Invest in formative research andaudience analysis to see whatpeople are thinking and doing.

How can we build capacityin social marketing? � Through training and ongoing

coaching for those interestedin it.

� By providing regularsummaries of insights on avariety of audiences andsubjects, and highlightingpossible implications forstrategies.

What are the key ethicalissues in trying toinfluence people'sbehaviour?� The legitimacy of the social

change agent and agenda; � how the ends being pursued

and priority audiences havebeen selected;

� raising anxiety unnecessarilywith messages that use ‘scaretactics’;

� what is ‘not’ said; the use ofresources; and

� unintended consequences.

What should we be doingto support thedevelopment of a robustshared evidence base?Evaluate initiatives that have usedsocial marketing as a framework(for a variety of issues in a varietyof settings) and publish them inthe most credible journals.

What are the challengesfaced by an organisationwith limited funds toinvest in a socialmarketing intervention?If they see social marketing as anisolated budget item orintervention, they face asignificant challenge! If they seesocial marketing as a frameworkfor planned change, they will seetheir whole budget as a socialmarketing budget.

What book would yourecommend to people tohelp them understandsocial marketing? Kotler, P. & Lee, N.R. (2008)Social Marketing: InfluencingBehaviors for Good.

“Not all arelikely to be at the samestarting point”

NAMEFrancois

Lagarde

POSITIONSocialMarketingConsultant and AdjunctProfessor,University of Montreal

PLACECanada

WEBwww.francoislagarde.com


How did you becomeinvolved in socialmarketing?When I first began working atHSC, it had already adopted asocial marketing mantra. I startedworking on discrete projects, andmoved on to applying socialmarketing to nutrition. Since mybackground is in health and notmarketing, I first had to get myhead around what the conceptactually meant!

What is social marketing?At a high level, it is employing amarketing paradigm to achievesocial change. We at the HSCalso use the term Nga HaporiHokohoko, which is the notion ofmutual and reciprocal exchangeswith people (such as sections of atribe, whanau (family), society,and community).

What one piece of advicewould you give tosomeone developing asocial marketinginitiative?Try to develop partnerships withgroups, individuals andorganisations who know whatthey’re talking about – althoughfinding them is not always easy!

What are the mostchallenging aspects ofdeveloping a socialmarketing intervention?First, clearly defining the problemand therefore related objectivesfor the intervention. Second,

determining the most appropriateand effective strategic mix for theallocated financial resources andavailable human capacity andcapability. Third, investing enoughtime and effort into establishingand nurturing good relationships.

What should those withvery few resources do tocreate an effective socialmarketing intervention?Look for the people who can helpyou. There are lots of groups outthere, such as community groups,local champions, and localorganisations, with establishednetworks, who may sharecommon objectives and who arewilling to collaborate. Also, try tofind good examples of successfulsocial marketing interventions withlimited resources. Access to adatabase of robust socialmarketing interventions would begreat.

What are the keychallenges we face infurther developing socialmarketing?1. Establishing agreed standards

or benchmarks of practice forthe discipline. If we have aunited view of practice thatmoves beyond relying on theforce of individual practitioners,then we are more likely tobring others, especiallydecision makers, along with us.

2. Determining the right mix ofindividual and upstreammarketing (includinginfluencing the decision-makers) for particular socialissues.

3. Breaking down the ‘system’silos we tend to get caught upin. Often we are funded toaddress single issues orspecific disease states. Thiscan create competition withinand across health and socialdisciplines, and may lead to asaturation of the market with allour messages, rather thanpromoting more collaborativeefforts.

4. Establishing good informationdissemination systems for thediscipline, so that we can learnfrom each other and avoidduplication.

5. Demonstrating good short-termsuccess measures as proxiesfor long term achievement.

NAMETane

Cassidy

POSITIONManager,BusinessDevelopment Unit, Health Sponsorship Council

PLACENew Zealand

WEBwww.hsc.org.nz

16


17

How did you becomeinvolved in socialmarketing?I was only vaguely familiar withsocial marketing before I attendedmy first national conference inFlorida in 1995. Some staff in ourFamily Health Division trainedthrough the Tufts-Emersonprogramme in Boston andconveyed an incredibleenthusiasm for social marketing.The conference really turned meon, so I came back to RI intendingto find ways to use socialmarketing to study and solvepublic health problems.

What is social marketing? I would say that social marketingis a method for applying the toolsof commercial marketing to social,environmental and public healthproblems. The objective is topromote health and social welfarein a population through behaviourchange. Social marketing startswith the consumer and attempts toidentify ‘emotional hooks’ that canlink audiences with health-promoting behaviours.

What advice would yougive to someonedeveloping their firstsocial marketingintervention?I would remind them that socialmarketing is about behaviourchange, not about knowledge andattitudes alone. Paying attentionto behaviour change in a definedpopulation using the systematicapproach of social marketing iswhat makes the interventioneffective.

What advice would yougive to someone trying tomake a business case fordeveloping a socialmarketing strategy?I would point out that whatever weare doing is clearly not working. Ifbusiness can successfully usemarketing to change thebehaviours of target audiences topromote fast-food consumptionand sedentary lifestyles, then wehave to use the same approachesto changing those behaviours. Iwould also point out that socialmarketing is a useful approach topolicy development – probably theonly way we will be ultimatelysuccessful in changing thesehealth behaviours.

What are the challengesfaced by an organisationwith limited funds toinvest in a socialmarketing intervention?Social marketing can beexpensive, but we can learn fromeach other, apply lessons learnedfrom similar projects in otherareas and do other things to makewhat we have more effective.Partnering is a great way toincrease the amount of resourcesavailable for an intervention.

What is the best way tocreate effectivepartnerships between thepublic and privatesectors?I find public/private partnershipsboth extremely rewarding andentirely frustrating. It just takes alot of partnership managementand maintenance to make themwork out. Clear understanding ofmutual obligations andresponsibilities (’contract’) as wellas limits to the partnership (’dealbreakers’) are important.

What book would yourecommend to people tohelp them understandsocial marketing?I like the Kotler, Roberto and Leebook on social marketing. It isdown to earth and has lots ofexamples.

What other questionshould we have asked?What one thing would help mostto solidify the field? I think socialmarketing needs to find aprofessional organisation base,either in its own organisation or aspart of a larger existing one. Also Ithink it needs to be organised as a’community of practice’ so that itfocuses on inclusion rather thanexclusion of partners in differentfields (other than public health).

Where can people find outmore about your work?I don’t have a website or listing ofsocial marketing-based projects orpublications. However, that wouldbe something at a professionalassociation could provide to helpsupport the field. I am happy tosend information about projects toanyone interested.

NAMEDr Robert Marshall

POSITIONAssistantDirector,RhodeIslandDepartmentof Health

PLACE USA

WEB www.health.state.ri.us


18

How did you becomeinvolved in socialmarketing? By switching from private sector topublic sector marketing.

What is social marketing?Social marketing is a systematicprocess that uses a range ofmarketing concepts andtechniques to address short,medium and long-term issues withclearly identified and targetedbehavioural goals, to achieve aparticular social good.

What advice would yougive to someonedeveloping their firstsocial marketingintervention? Search for the customer insight.

How can we build capacityin social marketing? By inspiring, motivating andtraining the talent to do it.

What are the key ethicalissues in trying toinfluence people'sbehaviour?Developing trust and desire tochange through insight, ratherthan just translating policy tocommunications.

How can we support thedevelopment of a robustshared evidence base?Finding a mechanism to achievethis digitally.

What are the challengesfaced by an organisationwith limited funds toinvest in a socialmarketing intervention?Brainpower rather than spendingpower.

What book would yourecommend to people tohelp them understandsocial marketing? Gerard Hastings, SocialMarketing: Why should the Devilhave all the best tunes?.

What other questionshould we have askedyou?What will social marketing looklike in 2018?

“Search for thecustomerinsight”

NAMEPaul

Brewer

POSITIONDeputyDirector,MarketingDepartment of Health

PLACEUnited Kingdom

WEBwww.dh.gov.uk


19

How did you becomeinvolved in socialmarketing? While working on the TravelSmartbehaviour change programme inPerth, Western Australia. It is nowinternationally recognised for leadingand developing the multi-modal (orbehavioural) approach for thepromotion of alternative modes oftravel to the motor car.

What is social marketing?Social marketing comes from thejoining of two marketing disciplines:'social', from social sciences andsocial policy, and 'marketing' fromcommercial and public sectormarketing. The result is acomprehensive and methodicalapproach to voluntary behaviourchange programmes designed toinfluence target audiences.

What advice would you giveto someone developing theirfirst social marketingintervention?Scope, scope, scope – in myexperience, professionals do notspend enough time fully scoping theproject. In many cases there havebeen similar interventions that haveworked very well, which are ignored infavour of developing new approaches.This can lead to costly duplication.While the location may be differentand the audience may have specificlocal needs, an adapted approachusing audience insight from otherinterventions can lead to successfulbehaviour change.

How can we build capacity insocial marketing?Developing real capacity in the fieldcan only happen with a mentoringapproach, rather than organisationssimply undertaking and delivering thesocial marketing processes andinterventions. The Department ofHealth (DH) has a model that I believecould be developed to improvecapacity. Teams of specialists areemployed nationally, who workintensively in health organisations forshort periods in a facilitating andenabling role, rather than inimplementation capacity. Thisapproach, while more time-consuming, develops real capacityand skills at the local level.

What are the key ethicalissues in trying to influencepeople's behaviour?I have witnessed the confusion oflarge organisations who have wantedto deliver social advertising ratherthan true social marketing. Whilepublic sector bodies can use standardmarketing approaches to improve thepromotion of their relevant servicesand policies, this should not beconfused with social marketing. Weneed to ensure that our newprofession lives up to the coreprinciples of voluntary behaviourchange, not simply improvedadvertising or the delivery of policiesthat may or may not be desired by thepublic. If we do not, we risk losing themoral high ground, making socialmarketing a fad rather than a fashion.

What should we be doing tosupport the development ofa robust shared evidencebase?We need an agreed national(standardised) approach to sharinginformation, and an accessible,searchable database with a widerange of good practice examples. Atboth DH and the NSM Centre, weencourage the use of the socialmarketing benchmark criteria todevelop, evaluate and monitorinterventions. The issue is how manyof the benchmark criteria anintervention should include to be atrue social marketing project.

What are the challengesfaced by an organisationwith limited funds to investin a social marketingintervention?It is not about the money available orthe budget. Whether the project is£500 or several million pounds, youstill need to follow the samemethodical approach to scoping anddeveloping the intervention. Some ofthe best social marketing ideas havebeen developed with small budgetsand using volunteers.

What book would yourecommend to people to helpthem understand socialmarketing? I would recommend Doug McKenzie-Mohr’s website, www.cbsm.com. Ithelped develop my understanding ofthe principles of social marketing. Ithas tools and detailed case studies,and offers a simple practicalapproach.

I have also attended Doug’s advancedpractitioner courses and highlyrecommend attending one if you getthe chance.

For useful community-based socialmarketing tools, visitwww.toolsofchange.com.

NAMEEwen MacGregor

POSITIONSocial Marketing PolicyLead, Health ImprovementDirectorate, Department ofHealth;SeniorAssociate,NationalSocialMarketingCentre

PLACEEngland

WEBwww.dh.gov.uk/en/Publichealth/Choosinghealth/DH_0861


20

How did you becomeinvolved in socialmarketing?I caught the bug in 1989 when Iheard an international guru talk.

What is social marketing?Being able to influence behaviourfor the better through intelligence-led design.

How can we promotesocial marketing torelevant practitioners andkey decision-makers?We have to treat them like anyother target audience. So, we firstneed to do some clever marketresearch with them to understandwhat their problems are and howthey view the world. We have toget our thinking caps on and becreative - how can socialmarketing make their lives better?- then engage them with ourintervention. It is easier said thandone, but we have got some wayalready: we have done someinteresting market research whichgives us great insight. The biggestchallenge for us is to be lean,effective and to take responsibilityfor what we promise.

What are the key ethicalissues in trying toinfluence people'sbehaviour?First there are the ethics ofintervening anyway: we have toearn the right to interfere, have amandate. Then, we need to takegreat care gathering intelligence inan ethical way (no easy task aswe have found). We may have togo the democratic route if we areto make changes that benefit allbut require a few to bear the bruntof the change. And we need to beseen as trustworthy.

How can we build capacityin social marketing?Build capacity by engineeringapprenticeships with successfulsocial marketers working on thefront line. Success breedssuccess.

How can we use socialmarketing to tackle thebig international issues,like climate change?No differently to anything else,except the target audience isharder to get to and influence.There are several segments thatneed to be tackled separately andcollectively: the power brokers,those behaving badly, the cultureand so on. Each segment needs adifferent intervention.

What book would yourecommend to people tohelp them understandsocial marketing?Gerard Hastings, SocialMarketing: Why should the devilhave all the best tunes?.

“We have toearn the rightto interfere”

NAMEDr Ray

Lowry

POSITIONSeniorLecturer,Newcastle University

PLACE England

WEBwww.ncl.ac.uk/dental


21

How did you becomeinvolved in socialmarketing?It goes back a long way - over 25years - when I took a researchassistant position at the Universityof Strathclyde‘s advertisingresearch unit. It was then fundedby the Scottish Health andEducation Group, a governmentagency doing health promotion.We pre-tested campaignadvertisements, everything fromrickets to obesity, which gave mea very good insight. One thing thatwas very apparent at that timewas that communications alonewere insufficient to effectbehaviour change: other leverswere necessary.

At the end of the 1980s, the headof the unit, Douglas Leather, diedand I took over and ended uprunning it by default. At that timethere was a lot of reorganisationgoing on and we had to create abusiness plan for the researchcentre which resulted in a farwider range of clients than theScottish Health and EducationGroup. It was very beneficialbecause it made us think aboutwhat we were trying to achieve.We changed title to the Centre ofSocial Marketing in the early1990s, broadening our clientbase.

“We are tryingto do the samejob as Tesco”

What is social marketing?In the UK, I think we are trying todo the same job as Tesco, but inthe social sector. People are veryfamiliar with how marketing worksin the commercial sector. Theynow understand a word like‘brands’. When I started, people inpublic health did not know whatbrands were. I would ask them totell me about marketing and Iwould say that is what socialmarketing is, but in a socialcontext. I would ask audiences tothink about what they boughtrecently and think and talk aboutit. It is a very engaging and livelytopic of discussion. We are verymuch a consumer society.

Social marketingincreasingly encompassespeople from bothmarketing the socialsciences. What are thechallenges in integratinglearning from differentdisciplines?In reply I’ll mention the oldChurchill quote about the Britishand Americans being divided by acommon language. People don’tmean the same thing. There areland mines to be looked out for.For example, it could trigger adegree of professional jealousy,particularly if people think it couldsupersede public health. But whatit does do is bring insights tointerested practitioners, like GPs.They have to be everything toeveryone, and they can be greatsocial marketers as they buildrelationships with people in thecommunity.

If you were trapped in alift for ten minutes withthe Prime Minister, whatwould you ask him?I would tell him that there is a lotto learn from Tesco aboutinfluencing behaviour, and thatpartnerships are the way forward,the way to pull people together toget some action to improve publichealth. I would try and sell him theidea of having a semi-independentorganisation headed by someonelike Sir John Krebbs, a scientistand independent thinker. Thiswould pull together keystakeholders on an equal footing,like the British Heart Foundationand Cancer Research UK, on aten- to 25-year basis, and with anagreed budget. The aim would beto improve public health by gettingpeople more engaged.

What one thing have youlearnt that you wish youknew 20 years ago?People are people. They arecomplex and do stupid things butthis doesn’t mean they are stupid.

NAMEProfessor Gerard

Hastings

POSITIONDirector,Institute ofSocialMarketing,Universityof Stirling

PLACEScotland

WEBwww.ism.stir.ac.uk/index.htm


22

How did you becomeinvolved in socialmarketing?It was some years ago, and it wasthe opportunity to get involvedwith Public Service International(PSI) and Porter Novelli. Both hadsocial marketing challenges. WithPSI it was family planning in thedeveloping world, and with PorterNovelli it was the high bloodpressure challenge in the US.

What is social marketing?My short answer would be theapplication of marketing concepts,many of them drawn from theprivate sector, that can be helpfulin developing programmes toinfluence target audiences toadopt socially desirablebehaviours.

What advice would yougive to someonedeveloping their firstsocial marketingintervention?My one piece of advice would beto make sure that you are trying toinfluence a very precise behaviouror set of behaviours, and knowexactly who your target audienceis and what they think about thebehaviour. Why? Because a lot ofcampaigns tend to try to tackle toomuch or try to worry about attitudechange or influence. They createwhat are really educationprogrammes rather than focusingon things that actually influencebehaviour.

How do you think we canbest build capacity insocial marketing?I think that the more we candevelop, and be seen to havedeveloped, good off-the-shelftools, checklists, examples,frameworks and so on, thatpeople can easily use, the moresuccess we will have. Also,providing methods for socialmarketers to communicate witheach other, through blogs,listservers and other media, canbe very helpful in advancing thefield.

What needs to be done tobuild the workforce insocial marketing?I am frustrated by the dearth ofacademic training in socialmarketing. At the very least, Iwould like to see more courses orinteresting programmes in schoolsof public health; in programmesinvolving the environment; and inbusiness schools, in order todevelop a future workforce.

What are the challengesfaced by an organisationwith limited funds toinvest in a socialmarketing intervention?Try to find allies towork with so youcan develop somelevel of scale.Another solutionis to be as narrowas possible inyour behaviourobjectives and inyour selected

target market. You have torecognise that you can’t go aftereveryone. The more ‘micro’ youcan be in your objectives andtarget audience, the more likelythe budget will be well spent.

What book would yourecommend to people tohelp them understandsocial marketing?There’s a very good one by RobDonovan and Nadine Henleybased on their work in Australia.The book by Kotler and Lee giveslots of examples and is valuablefor that. Gerard Hastings’ book isvery recent and especially good atgiving examples from a Europeanperspective.

What other questionshould we have asked?One question I don’t know theanswer to is how consistent we allneed to be in using the samebasic approach right now; wedon’t have the same frameworks.If a client was to hire me orsomeone from the NSM Centrewe would come at it in differentways. This may lead to confusion.

NAMEProfessor

Alan Andreasen

POSITIONProfessor ofMarketing,McDonoughSchool ofBusiness,GeorgetownUniversity

PLACE USA

WEB msb.georgetown.edu


23

How did you becomeinvolved in socialmarketing?I came from community organisingand was frustrated by thedependence on charismaticleadership and the lack ofmeasurable success. And yes, Ineeded a job. There was oneavailable in social marketing. I hadnever heard of social marketinguntil the job announcement. I wasyoung and inexperienced andthought I knew everything, butsocial marketing was a wonderfulway to learn about people.

What is social marketing?I still think the ‘Four Ps’ are thesimplest and best description.Social marketing is about creatingproducts and services that helppeople solve social problems.Then it prices, places andpromotes those products andservices in ways that motivatetheir widespread and correct use.It’s a practical and very effectiveway of tapping into people’slegitimate self-interest (notselfishness) to influence theirbehaviour for everyone’s benefit.You cannot understand socialmarketing unless you understandthe difference between self-interest and selfishness. Self-interest is often defined in socialmarketing as consumerorientation.

Recognising that socialmarketing is understood(and misunderstood) in arange of ways, the NSMCentre developed the 8-point Benchmark Criteriafor social marketing,building on previous workby Alan Andreasen. Howuseful do you find them?I think they are helpful as checklistfor experienced marketers.Marketing Mix is a problembecause too often we focus onpromotion only. Insight seems abit redundant with customer

orientation, but probably useful.I’m not crazy about the discussionof behaviour because it opensitself to this nonsense about'individual behaviour versus socialbehaviour’. All behaviour isindividual. There are powerfulsocial influences, but it is stillinfluence on individual behaviour.This is so hard to get people tounderstand. My favourites in thelist are Exchange and Competitionbecause I think they are newideas social marketing brings tothe social change table.

Social marketingincreasingly encompassespeople from bothmarketing and the socialsciences. What are thechallenges in integratinglearning from differentdisciplines?Social marketing, like commercialmarketing, is an eclectic practice.It assimilates other professions.That is one of its greateststrengths. As long as the goal isvoluntary behaviour change on alarge scale I am very eclecticabout tactics. I worry more aboutmissed opportunities when peoplecome to social marketing fromlong careers in advertising, healthpromotion or environmentaleducation or even from advocacyand don’t understand what elsemarketing can bring to the table.

What book would yourecommend to people tohelp them understandsocial marketing?There are so many. It depends onyour goal. As an introduction, I likethe materials that the NationalSocial Marketing Centre hasdeveloped. If you’re looking formanagerial insight I likeReinventing Government byOsborn and Gaebler. If you wantpractical every day advice you canuse on Monday, Made to Stick byHeath and Heath is one of myfavourites.

What other questionshould we have asked?Why do the NSM Centre believeso deeply in self-interest as thekey to voluntary behaviourchange? Because I am an old-fashion populist who believes thatpeople deserve what they want. Ihave great faith in the ability ofpeople to know what they needand in their right to have fun,choose the best course of actionand enjoy the praise of their familyand friends. Sounds a little likemaking social change fun, easyand popular for them.

Where can people find outmore about your work?Social Marketing Quarterly is agood place to look, and the AEDwebsite.

NAMEDr

William

Smith

POSITIONExecutiveVice President,Academy for EducationalDevelopment

PLACE USA

WEBwww.aed.org


24

How did you becomeinvolved in socialmarketing?I first got into social marketing in1988 after a long career in boththe private and public sectors. Iwas working in the health sectorat the time with a managementrole in public health, which alsowas responsible for corporatecommunications and publicinvolvement. When I discoveredthere was something called socialmarketing I had a ‘eureka’moment: this is what I’d beenlooking for!

What is social marketing?For me, social marketing is aboutbeing led around by the nose bythe people you are seeking toserve. It's about applying bestpractice evidence about what weknow works in helping peoplechange. And it's a systematicprocess that rigorously buildsevidence and data-drivensolutions that people will buy into.I would also want to saysomething about what socialmarketing is not, as there aremany misconceptions. Socialmarketing is not about developingsmart communicationsprogrammes. It's aboutdeveloping services and productsthat people want, and making thebenefits of socially responsiblebehaviours outweigh the costs ofnot changing.

What should we be doingto develop a robust sharedevidence base?We all have a responsibility tocapture and learn from what weare doing. In social marketing thisis key, so that we can reflect onwhat has worked and what hasn’t,and so build better interventions.Everyone has a responsibility toshare as widely as possible whatthey have learnt, especially whenthings do not go as planned.

What are the key ethicalissues in trying toinfluence people'sbehaviour?It seems to me that the key issueis who defines what a particularsocially positive behaviour oroutcome is. If you are lucky, as weare, to live in a democracy, peoplevote for administrations that setout policies that have politicalsupport. So I think a collectivedecision about what issues needto be addressed and how theyshould be addressed is probablythe best way of ensuring thatpeople are not manipulated orforced into behaviours that as acollective we would oppose. Thisdoes mean that some people willhave certain freedoms curtailed,or may be penalised if theybehave in certain ways. Forexample, smokers’ rights tosmoke may be restricted in certainplaces. Personally, I includeinterventions such as legalrestrictions and financialincentives as part of socialmarketing. They can be used togreat effect to encourage ordiscourage behaviour, andprovided that there is popularsupport for these measures andthey are arrived at throughdemocratic means and goodevidence, such restrictions orincentives should be used.

What book would yourecommend to people tohelp them understandsocial marketing?I would recommend Max DePree'sLeadership is an art. It’s not abook about social marketing, but itis a great little book, that I firstread many years ago, thatconvinced me that if you want tohelp people you need to firstunderstand them and then servethem.

NAMEProfessor

Jeff

French

POSITIONDirector, NationalSocialMarketingCentre

PLACE England

WEB www.nsmcentre.org.uk

National Social Marketing Centre20 Grosvenor Gardens

London SW1W 0DHTel: +44 (0)20 7881 3045

Office Email: [email protected]: www.nsmcentre.org.uk

About the National Social Marketing Centre

The National Social Marketing Centre (NSM Centre) creates solutions to behaviouralchallenges by applying science and intelligence from every relevant field of study.

The NSM Centre was established in December 2006 following a two-year review ofsocial marketing in England. This review found that a systematic social marketing

approach could provide an effective means for addressing a wide range of health andsocial issues such as obesity, road safety, and environmental sustainability.

The NSM Centre is now working to build greater understanding of what constituteseffective behavioural interventions and how a people-focused social marketing

approach can enhance public sector policy, strategy and delivery.

Rather than campaigns and projects, the NSM Centre focuses on building capacityand developing tools and resources to assist organisations to manage or commission

their own social marketing programmes.

The NSMC is astrategic partnershipbetween governmentand Consumer Focus

Documents

Effectively Engaging People - The Conference Peopletcp-events.co.uk/.../NSMC_Effectively_engaging_people_conference...Philip Kotler * Sameer Deshpande * Sudha Tewari ... Social Marketing