BSH Bonus DTI Transcript

Beyond Self Hypnosis - Bonus – Deep Trance Identification Progression Transcript

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Deep Trance Identification Progression Bonus – Skills Mastery

Part 1 – Joe/Playing Guitar & Singing

Igor: Hello and welcome everyone to the Bonus Session. I’m with an ASH graduate, Joe. We’re going to go through the Deep Trance Identification – the DTI progression – specifically towards increasing or building a skill. First of all, Joe, welcome.

Joe: Thank you.

Igor: Joe, I believe you’ve brought your guitar. Guitar playing is the skill that you want to improve on. Is that correct?

Joe: That’s correct.

Igor: Before we start, I want you to tell me a little bit about the guitar because I don’t play the guitar. I’m going to show you how to use the DTI progression to improve your own skill set. I’m not going to be teaching you the guitar because, let’s face it, I can’t.

What I need to start off with is roughly what level are you at? How much experience have you got? What are you good at already? What would you like to get out of your DTI session and that sort of thing? Just give me a general background here.

Joe: I’ve been playing guitar for several years and I am completely self-taught, so I don’t have any sort of formal training. I’ve never had a teacher other than someone saying you should put your fingers this way for playing a particular chord or something like that. The rest has been completely self-taught.

When I say it’s been a couple years that I’ve been playing, it’s not like constant. It’s not something that I’ve really sat down and honed as a particularly great skill. I can look at what would be called guitar tablature, which is basically a listing of where to put your fingers on the strings at any particular time.



It’s sort of like reading music, but particularly a lot easier for guitar players that don’t want to actually read music. So, I’m good at that and I can actually read if there’s a particular chord that says E flat, I know what that actually means and I can play any song that I have a chord progression for.

I find it actually particularly difficult for myself to sing and play guitar at the same time. That’s something I would very much like to get better at or actually really honestly be able to do it all. It just seems like I can play just fine and I can sing just fine, but if I do both it becomes a situation where I can’t really do much of either.

As far as being able to play, I think I can play decently well, but I mostly have to have music in front of me or kind of following along on a simple progression, and I can play along with that but anything more advanced, playing particularly difficult solos or something like that, I can practice them and become better at them and eventually memorize them and play them, but it takes me a while.

So, I’d just like to be an all around better guitar player. The thing that would be kind of a miracle would be to be able to sing and play at the same time.

Igor: So, you’d like to become an all around better guitar player. You’ve already got some core skills. You can play most songs if you’ve got some tablature that basically guides you along the way, right?

Joe: Yes.

Igor: Your big hurdle is learning to sing and play at the same time, correct?

Joe: That’s correct.

Igor: All right, now we can go two ways. We can go in the deep end or we can go into a quick and easy success, a quick and easy win. Normally I’d recommend people start with a quick and easy win to get used to the process, but seeing as you’re already an accomplished graduate, I’ll leave the choice up to you whether you want to start off first with a simple thing that you can get an easy win on before we go for the miracle, or if you want to dive straight into the miracle and see what happens.



Joe: Let’s go easy first.

Igor: So, then the question is what would be a simple skill or improvement that you can think of right now that would instantly let you know yes I’ve made a change? Before we started the session, I wasn’t very good at this or I had a slight hiccup with this or whatever it was, and now I’m clearly at a different level with this. Can you think of a skill or an ability or a simple task that fits that sort of criteria?

Joe: Yes, I think playing a simple three-chord song and being able to do that is very easy for me, so then playing something like that as well as being able to at least somewhat sing along to it would be pretty great.

Igor: Let’s do a couple of things. Does humming count, or does it actually have to be some words?

Joe: I can hum to it. That’s fine.

Igor: So, humming would be an equal sort of thing. So, if you could hum and play at the same time, it would be at least a starting point for you to say oh yes, I could do this. Is that correct?

Joe: Yes.

Igor: Great. Here’s what I’d like you to do just as a test measurement. I’d like you to pick a song, one in particular that you have the model in mind for that you can sing and play at the same time. I’d like you to just play a few bars and attempt to hum at the same time.

Joe: This is the first song I learned on the guitar that I can play all right, but it’s difficult for me to sing and play it at the same time. It’s The House of the Rising Sun. Would you like me to just play it first?

Igor: Actually, no. What I’d like you to do is just attempt to play and hum it at the same time just to see what will happen. In other words, where you are now in terms of the target skill that you’re looking for, just as a baseline so that we can have a sense of where we’re at, so we’ll have something to compare it to.

Joe: [Joe plays guitar and hums.] That was just a verse of it.



Igor: Did you attempt to hum as you went along with it?

Joe: Yes, could you not hear me?

Igor: I could not hear you, no. Sorry. How did the humming go? Can you describe that to us?

Joe: The humming went okay. It was off in certain areas and it just felt difficult to do both at the same time. It was like I could either focus on the playing or I could focus on the humming.

Igor: But not both at the same time. Excellent. What I’d like you to do is just do a quick warm-up. Just spend no more than a minute, maybe a couple of seconds, doing a couple of teleportation exercises just to warm up your inner mind. Feel free to keep hold of the guitar whilst you’re doing it, but you don’t have to. It’s up to you which way you do it.

Joe: Okay. So, I see myself in a log cabin and I am by myself. It looks like I’m in the house of the rising sun. There’s a sunrise happening kind of in the distance and it just feels nice here. There’s kind of light streaming in all over the place.

Igor: Okay, progress somewhere else.

Joe: So, the next place I would go to is I’m on what looks like a pirate ship and I am sailing the high seas, and there’s a bunch of pirates singings like sea shanties and they’re having a grand old time.

The next place I go to I see myself at what looks like a large skateboard park with ramps and all sorts of different places to ride a skateboard on. Never mind the fact that I actually don’t know how to ride a skateboard here but that’s where I am.

Igor: Whenever you’re ready, come on back. That’s enough. That’s just a nice quick warm-up. So, do you have a model in mind, someone that you would like to do a DTI with that can sing and play at the same time in a way that you’d like to be able to do just as well as?

Joe: Yes, a friend of mine. His name is Jamison and he is an extremely accomplished musician. He can not only sing but play guitar fantastically well. He picked up the guitar on a whim and the next week he was very proficient



at it, and then the week after that he was forming a band and is now a touring musician.

Igor: Wow.

Joe: He’s a great model. I’ve known him for a long time and I’ve seen him play the guitar a lot as well.

Igor: Excellent. What I’d like to do now is guide you through this a little bit just so you have the steps, but you’ll be able to do this on your own easily enough once you’ve done it once. Whenever you’re ready, go back inside and just go straight to a location or ask your inner mind to find you a location where you can do your lessons, where you can actually learn something here, and let me know when you’re there.

Joe: All right, I can see myself there.

Igor: Do you want to describe it a little bit? You don’t have to. It’s fine if you just know where it is.

Joe: Sure. A lot of the places where he and I would hang out and play together – he used to play at the local church and so we’d hang out there kind of in the room all on our own.

So, I see myself kind of in a really small room. He’s got a guitar and an amp and there’s some microphones and like a drum kit and stuff behind him, as well as just kind of few seats for people that are coming to see the full sermon and everything else.

Igor: Perfect. Whenever you’re ready, I’d like you to invite in two people. One will be your model Jamison, and the other one would be a mentor. You don’t have to know who it is. Just see who turns up.

Joe: Okay, so Jamison, my model, was already there. So, bringing in a mentor, I see he didn’t really have much of a form before but he looks like Slash, the guitar player of Guns N’ Roses.

Igor: So, you have both there now. What I’d like you to do now is just stand next to your mentor. Maybe just introduce yourself. Say hi or whatever. If you need



to do an exchange of gifts or whatever you feel is appropriate, by all means go ahead and do that.

Then whenever you’re ready, ask Jamison to start playing and singing, and alternate between playing and singing and playing and humming so that you can have a sense of that. In particular ask him to play The House of the Rising Sun, which is the song that we’re currently focusing on.

All I want you to do when that happens is both you and your mentor – Slash in this case – I’d like both of you to watch him intently. Remember the guided principles.

You’re going to watch all of Jamison.

Then you’re going to watch his facial expression.

Then you’re going to watch his breathing and how he’s singing or humming at the same time.

Then you’re going to watch his body. In this case, you’re going to particularly focus on the hands because that’s part of guitar playing, but also his whole maybe swaying or whatever.

Then finally, you’ll look at all of him again in complete context again.

Just do a couple rounds of that. Ask him to repeat the song when he’s finished if you run out of song. Then when you’ve done that for a little bit, we’ll stay in the scene but we’ll have a little chat, and then we’ll do the next step.

Joe: Okay. All right, so he’s playing now and he starts out just playing it first, just to kind of get the feel of the song and the rhythm for it, and then he begins to just hum the melody of the song.

As I’m watching him, he’s looking at his fingers to make sure they’re going to the right places on the fret board there, and his body is kind of swaying to the beat and his foot is kind of tapping up and down with the beat to keep himself in time.



For some reason it just seems to me like he’s not really thinking too hard about what he has to play next. It’s just sort of kind of coming to him and he doesn’t have to work really at all at it. It’s very easy and kind of a natural flow.

Igor: Keep watching him for a while and once you’ve had an observation – remember you’re looking at all of him, face, breathing and sound, physical movements and all of him again. Once you’ve done that a few times and you feel okay with that, turn to your mentor and ask him to point some things out for you that either you may have missed or would be of interest to you that might be helpful to you when it becomes your turn to do something similar to him.

Joe: My mentor says, do you notice how he’s using his whole body to kind of sway with the music and kind of keep time, and to look at that and just watch as he’s doing that and notice how his voice lands at specific times during what he’s playing.

So, it’s not too disconnected. They’re actually the same thing. It’s a connected thing where when he’s playing, that’s like timing for his voice and the melody of the singing, and that instead of it being very rigid and like notes, it’s flowing through those specific points which he’s playing.

So, it doesn’t have to be perfect. In fact that’s not the point of live music and the imperfections are part of the performance. So, you don’t have to worry about there being imperfections in timing. It’s actually more beautiful that way.

Igor: With these ideas in mind, with these thoughts in mind, what I’d like you to do is go back to watching Jamison playing, but keeping in mind now in particular the kind of lessons that your mentor has been drawing out for you, and see if you can spot some of what he’s been talking about in a more clear way, if you can kind of sense that more easily as you’re watching it this time around.

Joe: Yes, I can see that as Jamison’s playing, it seems like it’s not such a big deal. The mindset is that he’s really playing with – it’s coming from a sense of having fun and not the use of playing as making a sound. It’s actually having a good time. It looks like he’s kind of in that flow state of the music is rather flowing through him, through the guitar and through himself. Rather than him having to produce it, it’s just kind of happening for him.



Igor: Keep watching that for a while until you get a sense of satisfaction that you’ve acquired something. Even if you don’t necessarily know what exactly it is, you feel like yes, there’s something there. When that’s happened, then ask Jamison to just stop playing. Maybe put him on hold for a moment so that you can have a chat with your mentor, but let me know when you’ve put things on pause like that once you’ve watched the whole scene enough.

Joe: Okay.

Igor: There’s no rush on this. Just take your time and enjoy it.

Joe: Okay, he’s on pause. I’ve got also this sense like I know something but I don’t know what it is.

Igor: Perfect. That’s exactly what we want. I like that very much. The next step for you to do now is to have a chat with your mentor about Jamison in general in terms of what do you like about him as a whole person, and what you do not like so much about him as a whole person.

If you were to become him, what elements of what he is now would you like to keep, in particular in respect to playing music, which is what you’re interested in? What elements about his total personality would you want to make sure you don’t get? Also what elements about his music playing part of his personality would you also want to avoid?

So, there are things you want from Jamison in particular in terms of his musical talent, but there are also things that you would want to avoid from him. I’d like you to have a nice frank discussion with your mentor about what those things would be and see if he’s got some suggestions for you to bear in mind also until you’ve really got a full sense of yes if I were to be Jamison for a day, I’ve got to keep some things.

Here’s what I want to keep, here’s all the stuff I wouldn’t want to keep for sure, and everything else can just go back and kind of be ignored. Do you get the idea?

Joe: Yes.

Igor: Off you go.



Joe: So, I’m going to describe some of these things out loud because I think it would be helpful for me, as well as anyone listening. I really like the ease with which he plays and that’s something I would definitely want to keep, as well as – I’m not sure how he’s doing it but the proficiency with which he can kind of hear a song or read some music or something like that and easily be able to play it, a particular style that he likes or something like that and can emulate it very easily.

Something that I don’t want is something I saw in the beginning of his sort of more professional musical career was sort of the starving artist kind of syndrome of fantastically talented but just not actually doing anything professionally with it. It was particularly hard to see him as a friend to go through, so that’s definitely not something that I would want for myself.

Igor: Also, make sure you pay special attention to the actual skill you want to target today, which is the idea of playing and singing simultaneously. It is particularly important to focus on that as well. It may be all positive, which is great. It may be mostly positive with some things you want to avoid, which would be fine, but make sure you do discuss that fully before we go to the next step.

Joe: Sure. It seems like he doesn’t really – he has the confidence to say it doesn’t really matter if he messes up a line or a phrase or something like that or even some notes in the song. He can just get right back into it. That’s something I worked to develop in my own musical playing with other instruments, and it may just not have translated to the guitar for myself. I really like that he can just kind of play and go through that, and my mentor says that I have to be willing to make the mistakes in order to not make them.

Igor: Just consider that for a moment. He said something very important there and I want you to really reflect on what he said. Think about it and let it sort of seep in, and think about that a little bit because that’s an important thing to take with you before you do the full DTI Process.

Joe: Yes, you have to be willing to make those mistakes without having to make them. I know that I won’t make them because I can just be confident enough that if they happen, they happen, and treating it almost like an experiment.

In many cases I don’t really have much of an audience other than myself, so it doesn’t really matter if I make a mistake. In fact that can be for me a reminder



to let go, to play, to have some fun because that’s what the entire point for me at least of playing guitar is.

I’m not looking to be a professional musician or anything. I just like playing music and having a good time and possibly playing for friends and family and that kind of thing. So, if I make a mistake they’re not going to care and neither should I.

Igor: Very good. Is there anything else you want to discuss with your mentor, or have you kind of covered the important parts?

Joe: It seems like he has a competence to – it’s a different aspect but I think it kind of goes hand in hand of the competence of he sings and plays full out, not just kind of in a reserved or cautious way. He’s going to play what he’s going to play and the sense is whatever comes out is right, which has some interesting parallels to a lot of the therapy work that I do with other people. Whatever comes out is right.

Igor: Excellent. Are you ready for the next step then?

Joe: Yes.

Igor: Whenever you’re ready, re-engage your model Jamison and ask him to start playing again. Have your mentor of course keep watching and then once you’re ready, whenever you feel like it, step into Jamison, so you become him. You play the guitar the way he does. You move the way he does and all that sort of stuff.

Do that for a while. Because remember one of the things that allows you to bring the scenery to life is mimicking, feel free to mimic. Feel free to hum along if you feel like it. Just feel free to just get to engage with that whole process in micro waves like you’ve been doing before, whilst you’ve been stabilizing your inner world and so on.

Just do that for a while until you get a real sense of something clicking inside, something that you get a sense of yes, I’ve got something here. Then go back to the exit protocol, which of course is come back outside and have a debrief with your mentor. For safety’s sake, make sure that he does a good thorough body scan and that you keep the things about Jamison you wanted to have



and it’s all in good order, and then let me know when you’ve done that whole process.

Joe: Okay. So, I’ve finished being my model.

Igor: And you’ve had a thorough scan from your mentor to make sure that you left behind everything you wanted to leave behind. You’re back to yourself and you’ve kept whatever lessons or learnings you wanted to have with you.

Joe: Yes, he says I need to sort of adjust my posture a little bit.

Igor: Good.

Joe: And he says I got an idea of the confidence that I need to have but that he needs to increase it and so he said here let me just do it for you, so I can make it easy for you.

Igor: That’s jolly nice of him.

Joe: He said you need to have some rock star confidence. So, well that’s what I have now. So, he does another body scan and says yes you’re good.

Igor: The final thing is you’re about to of course come back in a moment to do some playing. Ask your mentor for advice. What is the one thing you should focus on when you go into the actual physical exercise in a moment from now, that you should focus on consciously at least to allow you to get the maximum out of this?

Joe: He says to forget the music and simply focus on having fun.

Igor: Well, thank him very much. Whenever you’re ready, use the exit protocol – go to a calm place, let things integrate a little bit and then do a quick body scan to bring yourself back fully to the present. Then let me know when you’re ready.

Joe: I just noticed I was a little uncomfortable, so I had to move myself. Okay.

Igor: Okay, great. I think you know what to do next, right?

Joe: Yes.



Igor: Just give it a go and see what happens.

[Joe plays guitar and hums. Then Joe plays guitar and sings.]

Joe: It’s getting easier.

Igor: Wow, Joe. How was that?

Joe: That was much better.

Igor: I could actually hear you singing that time. So, you went beyond the humming.

Joe: Yes, it turned from humming to singing. I think the humming just doesn’t come through as well on the microphone.

Igor: It doesn’t.

Joe: But I’m really – wow this is like – I’ve never been able to do that before. So, I have to just take a second to really…

Igor: Take more than a second. Joe, just sit there and sit with that because that is a lesson well worth integrating and appreciating. So, take some time to do that now and be excited.

Joe: Yes, I am really excited actually. That’s been a really elusive thing. If I look at it objectively, it’s not 100% of the way there and I don’t expect it to be quite yet, but it’s much more fluid and I could definitely kind of hear my mentor’s voice and him saying nope you’re not focusing on having fun yet. You’re not focusing on having fun, and at the moment, at which I did that, I could sing and then it sounded at felt good.

I actually stopped thinking about the music itself that I was playing. It was almost like okay that part’s down. I can let that do its thing and let’s focus on the words now. So, I’m like reading the music and the words right in front of me here on my computer screen, but even that felt more like an easily remembered song rather than something I was having to work on.



Igor: Awesome. Now from listening at my end – and please let me know if I misheard things, but it sounded like you started off okay and then it was a little bit hesitant at first, a couple of missed chords or something.

Then somewhere around a third of the way in, that’s where I would guess that the mentor came in because you could really hear suddenly the shift of gear and the music flowed more smoothly, and shortly after that of course we actually heard your voice singing as well.

Joe: Yes, I would say that’s about it. It was like I started off and I just kind of – it actually reminds me of the progression that I saw Jamison go through. I got kind of the feel for the music and the guitar actually was a little bit in kind of a weird position, so I had to adjust it as I was playing.

Then I started humming – and I don’t know if that will come through on the recording – but I started humming and I think it got slightly worse for a second, and then I could hear kind of my mentor’s voice saying no, no. Have that rock star confidence. Have that confidence just to play it and have fun and see what happens.

That’s when it got markedly better and then I could hum a little bit more, and then right after that it was like I could sort of feel the confidence as a bodily sensation, and that’s when the actual words and the singing came out.

Igor: That’s wonderful. How do you feel?

Joe: Like I said, it’s amazing. That’s not something I’ve really been able to do with at least that level of proficiency before, and it’s been years that I’ve been trying to do that.

Igor: Not bad for half an hour.

Joe: Like I said, I can sing just fine. I can play just fine with other people or by myself or whatever, but the two together has always felt very mechanical and very disjointed, and now they felt like they were together.

Igor: Joe, congratulations. I think you’ve done a huge thing. Are you wanting to explore this a little bit further and take it to the next level?

Joe: Yes, for sure.



Igor: Here’s what I’d like you to do. Whenever you’re ready, head back inside and ask to be sent to a place where you can practice. You won’t need Jamison for this one but you will need your mentor to be present. Whenever you’re ready, let me know when you’re there and your mentor is present in the practice room.

Joe: Okay. Oh, well this is actually quite an emotional place for me. I’m sitting in my new baby boy’s room.

Igor: Wow.

Joe: The reason that I want to get better at guitar is to be able to play for him – and I just set it up yesterday. I actually have the guitar that I’m holding in my hands right now hanging on the wall in there as a decoration, but it’s also a reminder for me to play for him as well when I go in there, and this feels like a really nice place to practice and have a good time.

Igor: Awesome. As you know, the rule of thumb is whenever you get a place of strong emotion coming up, just sit with it. So, just take a few moments to sit with that.

Joe: Okay.

Igor: Excellent. Very good. Is your mentor present?

Joe: He is now.

Igor: Excellent. I’d like you to take a few moments first of all just to celebrate your victory just now, your big success. Take a few moments to celebrate that with him and let me know when you’re ready to continue.

Joe: I give him a hug and say thank you, and he says it’s great and that we have a lot more work to do, but it’s like I get the sense that it’s not work. It’s just like we have a lot more fun to have together.

Igor: Excellent. I like that. He’s basically probably done the next step anyway, but just ask him if he’s got any feedback for you from your performance just now, although I suspect he’s just given it to you but ask anyway just in case.



Joe: Yes, he says two things. He says to begin with the end in mind. He says when you’re able to play the way that you want to play, you know that you’ll have that rock star confidence, and the answer of course is yes. So, he says begin with that first. Have that first. Feel that sensation that you felt first and then play.

Then the other thing he says – I think it’s kind of related – is to feed off of the audience that you have there and notice the enjoyment that they have of you playing and realize that’s what every musician is looking for.

They’re looking for the connection they get with another human being, and at that point it’s not about the music anymore. It’s about connecting with other people.

Igor: Excellent. That sounds like very good advice, so take a few moments to let that settle in. Think about it. Reflect on it or just sit with it and just take a few moments to set that up in your mind as your precursor to what we’re about to do. Whenever you’re ready, let me know to continue, but take your time to sit with that now.

Joe: All right, I think I can do those things.

Igor: Very good. What I’d like you to do now is use the practice room to do what it says – just to practice. You just had a go at experiencing doing something, which you’ve not been able to coordinate like that before, and you’ve enjoyed it as well I presume.

Joe: Yes, very much.

Igor: What I’d like you to do is repeat the performance but now inside the practice room, and because you’re inside the practice room you can do anything you need to. Whether you need to slow time down to make it easier or speed up or anything else, by all means do those things, but all I want you to do now is just practice that coordination of playing, singing and above all else just enjoying that process and maybe even using it as a method of connecting.

You have your mentor present of course, so you can always use that to connect with him. Basically you’re going to repeat the exercise you did in physical but now inside your inner landscape and really embellish it. Really let



more things come through about that feeling of being Jamison that you had before. Make sense?

Joe: I’m sorry. Can you just explain that one more time? I think I lost you.

Igor: All you’re going to do is you’re going to repeat the exercise that you just did a moment ago but this time inside your inner landscape.

Joe: Okay.

Igor: You can alter the dynamics of the landscape if you need to, to make it easier. For example, if you want to slow that time down so that each sound is longer and slower and your fingers have more time to get to whatever the chord is so that it feels more natural to you, by all means do so.

Joe: Okay.

Igor: I believe are three things that you were focusing on were playing the music, singing, and then feeling good and having fun whilst doing it. That’s kind of the three parts that I understood were the main ingredients here. If there’s anything else, of course feel free to do that.

Go ahead and do that and just enjoy that for a while, and then when you’ve had a couple of practice rounds, pause, come back and let me know how the practice thing went but stay in the practice room whilst we talk. All right?

Joe: Okay.

Igor: Off you go.

Joe: Okay.

Igor: How did that go? Was that easy?

Joe: Yes.

Igor: Excellent.

Joe: It’s feeling more natural now.



Igor: Good.

Joe: I initially sort of slowed time down to make sure that I was playing the right notes and singing at the right time now, and then I sort of sped it up to real time and now I feel pretty comfortable with playing the song and singing it as well.

Igor: Good. So, have a quick chat with your mentor if there’s anything you’d care to add to your performance. If you’re happy with it, that’s fine.

Joe: Yes, I’d like to add a little bit more emotion behind the playing and the singing as well, of sort of more feeling. I guess now that I’m saying it – I was going to say not just for me. In fact not for me really at all. I want the music, the sound to have some more emotion but my mentor quickly corrected me and he asked the question where does that come from? Of course that comes from me, so he said again I have to go back to any emotions that I want the song to have, I have to feel them first.

Igor: Right.

Joe: Then it just brings up the idea that it’s not really about playing the song anymore. For me it’s about experiencing those emotions and letting others experience those through the music that I’m playing.

Igor: Wonderful. Sit with that advice for a little bit. Just reflect on it, integrate it or just sit with it to let it sink in for a bit and let me know when you’re ready to continue.

Joe: I’m ready.

Igor: So, go back to the practice session just as you did before, this time focusing on the feedback your mentor just gave you.

Joe: Okay. I’m sort of miming playing the guitar right now.

Igor: That’s good.

Joe: It’s a lot easier. This is interesting. This is not something I could really do before. I’m talking to you, I’m miming the chord progression of the song and



it’s like it’s just happening. I can hear the song in my head and it playing as well as the lyrics of the song, but I can kind of be describing it as well.

Igor: Perfect.

Joe: Which seems like kind of the third level. It’s like this can kind of be going on and I can be thinking about other things or what’s coming next. Not to be thinking of just random thoughts, but it’s like suddenly I have the mental bandwidth freed up to be able to do more.

Igor: Excellent. Keep those lessons going and just rehearse a few more times until you feel satisfied, and then when that happens have a last final chat with your mentor for any advice and then come on back into the room, going through the exit protocol – the place of peace, integration breathing and the body scan.

Joe: All right, let me take a minute to do that.

Igor: Take your time, as long as you need.

Joe: Okay, I feel good.

Igor: Are you back in the room? Back in the physical room, that is.

Joe: Yes.

Igor: Excellent. In that case whenever you’re ready, pick up your guitar and have some fun.

Joe: Okay. There we go.

[Joe plays guitar and sings.]

It’s actually getting better.

Igor: That’s excellent. How do you feel about that?

Joe: Yes, it’s going great.



Igor: You can listen to the recording. The smoothness just of the guitar itself just in the first playing on its own to now, there’s a huge difference. Even the volume and smoothness of your voice and even the emotion in your voice from the last time you played it to this time, again a big difference. I presume you noticed all that, correct?

Joe: Yes, I can definitely tell it’s getting better. To me I have this sort of – I could play the record version, the studio version – the real version of the song I guess – in my head and kind of compare the two, and they’re getting closer and closer.

Igor: That’s awesome. More importantly, how do you feel about where your skills have gone? Think about it this way. We have been working together for less than an hour so far.

Much of that time has been me introducing you to the steps of applying the DTI Process and applying the skills and practice room principles in a practical sort of way, so a lot of it has been coaching and talking around stuff. Once you get used to the process, it will happen faster and faster because you’ll know yourself what you’re doing with it, right?

Joe: Yes.

Igor: But even so, for less than an hour’s work so far, how do you feel about your progression in terms of what you’ve done so far?

Joe: Well, I can tell you that in less than an hour’s worth of work – because even the real time of working for less than an hour in really just a few minutes of doing the DTI Process and using the advanced self-hypnosis work, some of which I already know and now that we’re continuing to expand on, I’ve got more progress in these last few minutes essentially than I have in the last several years of when I’m doing it, diligently working on it. It’s coming to mind that I was just doing it the wrong way.

Igor: That’s usually the way, right?

Joe: Yes, it was sort of the Law of Reverse Effect. I was pushing hard, like come on I’ve got to do this, I’ve got to make this work, and this is so much easier and obviously I’ve gotten so much more progress in just a little bit, and it actually



is exciting to me to see where I can go with it because now it’s like if I can do that, what else can I do?

Igor: I agree.

Joe: And not just with the guitar but with other skills that I want to develop as well.

Igor: I totally agree with that. Let me take a few moments to have a few words about what you’ve been experiencing and how to repeat this and so on. The first thing I think you’ll recognize is this. I think the whole DTI Process to me – people call it accelerated learning or some strange mystical speed learning and so on because as a rule we are progressing much more quickly than we normally do.

Like you said, in the last few minutes you’ve progressed more than you have in the last few years of attempting to do something that you’ve kind of failed at before, right?

Joe: Yes.

Igor: But the way I look at it is slightly different. I actually look at this thing called accelerated learning as natural learning. Everything else that we do, I look at as retarded learning. In other words, we’re doing things to get in our own way to slow things down.

You very aptly mentioned the Law of Reverse Effect, which is the harder you try to do something the more likely you’ll fail because the wrong part of your mind tries to take over a process that some other part of the mind is supposed to be running, and in doing so you’re basically tripping over your own feet, which kind of describes why most people are very slow to progress in anything from languages to here the guitar playing and so on, right?

Joe: Right and natural is the exact word that I would use for it because it feels very natural. You’re right. I’m not getting in my own way anymore.

Igor: Notice something very important here as well. I know nothing about playing the guitar, nothing at all. I know a little bit about listening to the guitar just because it’s nice, but I know nothing about playing it.



So, it’s not like I taught you any skills. It’s not like I was a teacher in the traditional sense because I can’t be. I know nothing about it. You taught yourself everything you need to know, and you’ve essentially accessed the same kind of mental capacity that your friend Jamison did when he picked up the guitar within a week and was a rock star within a month, right?

Joe: Yes.

Igor: That’s a very important thing to understand because it just shows you the testament to what we are capable of. Like you said, you should be very excited about the future.

The next thing I want to do is just lay out the steps that we did. The steps should be very familiar to you. It should be familiar to everyone listening right now because they’re already about part of the graduate program of the ASH System, and it’s basically the Skills Mastery Process and the DTI Process combined together.

The DTI Process opens you up to learning. It sets up your instincts and your intuitions and importantly, as you noticed in this case, it lets you bypass the blocks that are channeling you down the wrong way, channeling your behavior down the path to failure or slower progress, and by removing those blocks you have the access again open to exploring new ways of being, which of course will include succeeding at whatever you want to be doing.

Then you have that test to get a sense of where you’re going with that. Then once you’ve got a win, once you’ve got a practical result, you went straightaway to the practice room to start engraining that particular skill because just because you got there once, you’re nicely primed, you’re nice and open. The circuitry, your neurology is open for it.

Now is the time to come back in and cement it. In fact when we finish our talk together here today, Joe, what I’m going to recommend you do is you spend a good 20 minutes doing nothing but mentally rehearsing that song over and over and over again using your practice room, using your mentor for feedback and so on, and then at the end of it if you want to do a little bit of physical practice as well just to kind of double check on it, by all means do so too. Really, what you do now is engrain and habituate much more of what you’ve done up to this point. Does that make sense?



Joe: Yes.

Igor: Let’s just discuss the steps very quickly again just so they’re very clear. We’re talking about a skill that you were already familiar with because you’re doing a skill test right afterwards.

If you are starting a whole new subject that you know nothing about, then there’s a slightly different protocol purely because you have no way of testing your knowledge afterwards because you have no physical aspect of it yet. Hence, there’s nothing to be testing yet.

The DTI Process can help to kind of set you up for learning something new that you’ve got no knowledge of and basically shape your instincts, but don’t expect it to create the same kind of miracle that you had here in this particular example, Joe, because there’s a difference between something you have practical experience of and some skill in, versus something you have no experience of at all.

In the latter instance, you can open your intuitions to speedier learning and pick up some things along the way, but you need to have some building blocks before you can actually use this as a practical building tool. Does that make sense?

Joe: Yes, of course.

Igor: The process is very simple. The initial test - play and sing or test play and hum is not strictly speaking necessary. That was more so that we could get a sense of comparison here.

Particularly because I’ve never heard you play before, it allows me to have a sense of knowing that we’re progressing or if there’s anything we need to go back to and fix and so on, but of course as the case may be, that wasn’t necessary at all, and of course it allowed us to hear a very dramatic shift.

You only played the guitar three times for us, and there was a dramatic shift between each of those three instances and I expect that kind of dramatic shift to continue as you maintain that process.



So, what was the actual process?

1. We do a quick warm-up, or we just use the teleportation exercise to make sure that our focus is in the right place and so on.

If you’re feeling a little distracted, the easiest way to refocus is to do some physical exercise, a little bit of aerobic exercise in particular, and mindful. That’s important. It’s not just a random exercise where you’re watching TV and forget about your body. We’re talking about mindful exercise because it collects your attention.

You did not need it in this case because your focus was at a perfectly good level, so we used the teleportation exercise just as a way of kind of warming up the circuitry we’re going to be using. Then we come back from there.

2. Next we set up the DTI space.

You went and chose a nice symbolic place, which is where you and your friend hang out and do these sort of musical exchanges anyways.

3. You’re going to invite your model & a mentor.

Your model happened to be there already, and you’re going to invite a mentor. Those are the three key figures – you, the model and the mentor inside of a stable space. Once you have those things, you’re ready to get going.

The first thing we’ll do is we discuss with the mentor a little bit about what you want to achieve, what you want to get out of the session. That sets your intention.

Then you get the model to start behaving or performing. You’re going through the standard DTI Process. You’re going to watch the whole model. You’re going to watch the model’s facial expressions. That’s a very key feature. We have special neurology designed just to decode people’s facial expressions.

You’re going to watch their movements as a whole and in particular their breathing or if they’re speaking, their speech patterns, their tone of voice and so on.



If there’s an activity that requires a special part of the body – like with guitar playing it requires the hands to be playing the guitar – pay particular attention to that, but also pay attention to the whole body – in this case the moving or rocking of the body and stuff like that.

Then we move onto the general pattern again. What does the whole thing overall look like? So, we’ve gone from:

1. General, 2. Specific Face, 3. Specific Body 4. Breathing, 5. General body all over again

Then when you’ve watched that a few times, keep the model playing. You’re now going to have a discussion with your mentor. That discussion with your mentor allows you to start noticing things that were normally outside of your conscious awareness.

In this case, your mentor pointed out some very important things like the element of fun, the mindset of not caring and the rock star confidence and so on.

These things are important to be pointed out to you so that your conscious mind has the chance to begin noticing things that are normally blocked out of awareness. So, as you’re watching and observing this, the more you get a sense of knowing your model, the better.

You did that for a little while. You got a sense of okay I’ve got a sense of something happening. You don’t have to know what it is. That’s not the point at this stage. You just have to have a sense that something is going on.

That’s the point at which you now have the next level of discussion with your mentor, which is pros and cons. What is it you want to have? What is it you want to make sure you don’t get? That’s both about the skill and also about the model as a whole.

For example, there’s a classic one in the Ericksonian world – the famous psychiatrist, Milton H. Erickson. A lot of people want to do a DTI with him but he also had a lot of health issues because he had polio and so on. So, you



don’t want to be taking on those health issues. You don’t want your inner mind to suddenly think okay in order to be as good as him at what he did, we’re going to have to give you a disease to overcome first, because that’s a very unpleasant way of learning.

So, there’s the safety check, which is very important, and we set that parameter up with your mentor ahead of time because your mentor is going to be an archetype that’s going to be really the protective aspect of your inner mind.

Once you’ve set up that protection mechanism, you’re going to step inside the model and then just basically have fun with it. Enjoy it. Move the way they move. Breathe the way they breathe. The miming parts are very important, especially for physical skills, and miming includes voice miming.

If you’re learning a language for example, just babbling sounds that sound like the language itself is going to be an important part of the process. Let yourself go with the feelings of the situation, the nature of it. It’s very important that you uncensor it, as you of course learned in the program already.

Once you had a satisfying experience of that – so you’re doing that for a while. You’re reiterating. You’re really engraining it. You have a sense of getting something. Again, you may not know what it is. You may do, but you may not necessarily know what it is. You just may have a sense of certainty that something is happening.

Then step back outside of the model and do your detox. Check with the mentor. Make sure that he does the body scan of you and if anything came across with you that you don’t want – for example a negative attitude, an idea of illness or anything like that, or maybe even an arrogance, something you don’t want to have – then make sure the mentor helps you remove it and place it back where it belongs with the model.

Then if there’s anything else your mentor wants to do in terms of tinkering, by all means let him do so. In your case, Joe, he did a great job by amplifying some of those rock star qualities that you really needed to use and made very good use of right afterwards.



The final step before coming back out is to ask the mentor for what I like to call the next small step. What is the one thing that I should pay attention to consciously so that unconsciously all the other things happen as well?

In this case, your next small step was just to focus on having fun. Forget everything else. Just focus on having fun. It doesn’t mean that you actually literally forget everything else because you still have to play the guitar. You still have to be able to sing. You still have to know the words. You still have to read the music if you haven’t memorized it and so on.

It just means your conscious mind is not really paying attention to that. You’re delegating that to your inner mind or your subconscious mind – however you’re going to think of it. So, that little piece of advice is very important. It just tells you what do I pay attention to so that everything else happens automatically?

With that in mind, we go through our exit protocol. You go to a nice place of peace and feel the peace inside yourself. Then start focusing on your breathing. Let your mind just kind of blank out. If any thoughts come, they come. If they don’t come, they don’t come. There’s nothing in particular for you to do. It’s just the integration phase. It allows the information to kind of settle down inside yourself.

Then bring yourself back with a simple body scan to get yourself grounded back into the physical external reality. That’s the classic DTI Process. Attached onto that now, is we want to do our first test. We’ve just gone through a process to prepare our mind for a learning experience.

There’s no point in having that if you don’t have the learning experience. Well, actually there is a point. In other words, you can still gain a lot of advantages out of that, but the real advantage, the real proof of the pudding is in the eating, as they say.

Here the test is can you now do something you couldn’t do before? Of course the answer very clearly was yes. Especially when it’s a big breakthrough like you had today, Joe, it will be accompanied by kind of an excitement, elation, a sense of joy, a sense of achievement, a sense of pride and so on. Because that’s a strong emotion and a positive emotion in particular that has arisen as a direct result of your internal work, really take time to sit with it. Appreciate



it. Enjoy it. Don’t try to hold onto it. Don’t try to make it last longer than its natural course.

If it fades away, it fades away and it’s no big deal. If it doesn’t and it stays, it’s no big deal. You don’t want to be attached to it but you do want to be appreciating it because it’s a very important step. It creates a nice feedback loop from internal work to external work and so on. Your emotions are your mind’s natural bridge between your inner reality and your outer reality.

Once you’ve accomplished something like that, now it’s time to engrain the skill. So, we return back to the inner world. This time we’re going to go to a practice room. We no longer need the model for now. We just need the mentor.

The mentor will help guide us in terms of our practice, and whatever victory you’ve just achieved, whatever breakthrough you just made, you’ve got to practice that element. Remember in terms of the practice room, you can organize things to suit your needs. You can speed things up or slow them down. You can make things larger or smaller.

An example of size being important is if the skill you were looking for is rifle shooting or handgun shooting or archery, then you may want to increase the perceived size of the target. It makes it easier to hit. You may want to increase the size of your sight to make it easier to see and so on. So, you basically get to rearrange your internal world to make everything easy for you. Then you’ve got to rehearse the skill until it feels natural.

Now it’s time to go back to the mentor for some feedback. Listen to that feedback and incorporate it in your next practice session. You may well want to do that several times.

We only did it twice today just for time’s sake just to get a sense of it, but you could it five or 10 times, as often as you need to until you feel satisfied that you’ve really accomplished something, that something seems to be settling in, something is cemented in and so on.

At that point, again thank you mentor for his kind help. It’s a good way to build a trusting relationship with yourself, and use the exit protocol – a place of inner calm, peace, tranquility or whatever you want to call it. Do the



integration, do some steady breathing and then finally back into your external reality with the body scan.

Then the final test comes in actual physical practice to again link up the inner world to the outer world. In time you can of course do all these steps separately.

In other words, if you’re waiting for someone, or if you’re at a restaurant waiting for the check or if you’re out shopping with someone and you’re waiting for them to try something on or something like that, then you can still go in and do a quick bit of mental practice. Rather than getting bored, use the time wisely.

You won’t necessarily be able to do it physically right afterwards, but that’s okay. You’ve now already started linking mental practice to physical practice, so the two will continue to go hand in hand. As long as you don’t ignore physical practice, you don’t have to do both simultaneously.

If you do both simultaneously of course it’s a nice direct test, direct proof of your mental practice paying dividends and so on. Do you get the idea of those processes there, Joe?

Joe: Yes, that’s very straightforward.

Igor: It is straightforward. I mean really you’re a graduate of the ASH Program, so it really isn’t anything other than applying the actual steps that you’ve already learned.

First of all, I want to thank you Joe for taking time to do this with me because it really allows you to experience and me to demonstrate the power of these things.

If you’re doing this just in a seminar context, the steps of the DTI, the steps of the practice session and so on are often not very testable. Unless you bring your guitar into the room and suddenly have a cacophony of people trying all kinds of different skills out in the same place, it’s very difficult to test that out, but you’ve seen how quickly the change can happen when it does.

You’ve seen how quickly you can make breakthroughs when you want to, and hopefully that gives you a lot of enthusiasm and a lot of motivation to keep up



the mental practice, to keep building your inner landscape and importantly when the time is appropriate, when you have time for it, translating it back into physical reality – in this case by actually playing the guitar, singing and having a great deal of fun with it, right?

Joe: Yes.

Igor: Awesome.

Joe: As you were explaining that entire process, it was like I was essentially going through it with other songs that I want to play, so I feel relatively confident that I could play other songs as well, and not just the particular one that I practiced.

It’s more the skill I was developing rather than practicing a particularly rote memorization of a particular procedure. It’s like I’m learning the principles and the skills behind what I actually want to do, rather than just memorizing a particular process.

Igor: You’ve just touched on a very important point here, Joe. So, thank you for bringing that up. That’s one of the great values of having your mentor in particular in the practice room.

As a rule the DTI Process tends to be more generalized anyways. In other words, your mind tends to apply it to maximum situations because that person, that model isn’t you anyway. It’s not as restrictive as say school learning is, which says this is the lesson, you must memorize exactly this and not deviate from that. We’re not doing that kind of planned lesson. We have a much more intuitive lesson going on.

The practice room could lend itself a bit to a kind of rote learning, which is one of the reasons why I think having the mentor present is so important because the purpose of the mentor is to break you free from rigid mental sets.

If you start becoming too rigid, the mentor will probably tease you or remind you or gently nudge you, or sometimes surprise you in some other ways to get your attention and pull you out of the rigid mindset, the rigid practice set into something more generally applicable in other ways as well.



Do you have any other comments or observations you want to make before we finish up today?

Joe: I did have a question. What would you do if the particular skill that you wanted to practice and really learn is if not the majority, all mental?

Igor: Give me an example of that.

Joe: If I want to improve my thinking in a particular area.

Igor: Let’s say mathematics. You want to become better at math or something like that?

Joe: Yes.

Igor: To be honest with you, you do exactly the same steps. The testing phase of it of course can actually be just a pure mental skill, like math can be. You may want to write your workings out and so on, but if it was pure mental skill then you can actually test it there in the internal environment, but the steps are the same.

Let’s say I want to do mathematics. I’ll get a great mathematician, preferably someone I know. If not, then I can read up – and it’s important to get to know your model well to get a sense of connection with them. I might get Einstein or someone like that to represent mathematic-ness to me but as a rule of thumb, the better you know the model the better it’s going to work for you.

Then you’re going to do the whole DTI Process just as before and, importantly, when you become the model for a while, you’re just going to be paying attention to your mental experience but whilst someone’s thinking, they still have physical expressions of those thoughts. It’s just part of the way we’re wired.

I’ll give you a quick example – an amusing example that a friend told me about. There’s a university professor some years back who was a philosopher and a friend of a very famous philosopher called Lichtenstein.

He’s got a girl in one of his classes, in his tutorials, who’s very bright and she does this weird thing. Every time she thinks, she kind of sits there and tenses every muscle in her body. She screws her eyes shut and she looks like basically



the picture of constipation, like she’s really trying hard to go to the toilet or something.

Then suddenly she’ll have a bright idea and then she’ll rattle it off and just be totally surprised. It’s a weird thing. One of the tutors who’s teaching this girl is talking to the professor and says there’s this girl I have who has this strange habit and so on.

The professor instantly recognizes the behavior and says oh, why don’t you ask her if she’s related to Lichtenstein because Lichtenstein apparently had the same mental habit? When he thought very hard on a point, he would literally physically screw himself up.

He would tense up. His muscles would tense up. His face would screw up and everything else, and that’s how he expressed his thinking process. It’s a bit extreme of course.

Sure enough, yes this was something like the great granddaughter or the great grand-niece or the grand-niece of the famous philosopher, and it appears that the family had this habit of very dramatically physically expressing a mental process.

Why did I say all this? It’s because even though you’re going through a mental process, it’s still important that you go through your process of observation of the model. What you’re doing is you’re warming up the mirror neurons inside your mind.

Basically you’re priming your mind to be able to do the DTI Process nice and smoothly and eloquently. It’s a lot easier if you begin that process with observation than with direct experience. At that point when you step in for the direct experience, the direct experience will be a lot more true to life, a lot more accurate because it’s already been primed by separate neurology.

These mirror neurons inside of you are actually designed to do DTI, so you can do deep trance identifications with other people, and that’s kind of the mechanism that you’re engaging. Does that kind of help you there, Joe, or did you have a follow-up question to that?

Joe: That’s perfect. My next question would be if I have the model in my mind – my friend Jamison – I can actually go and see my friend Jamison. If he’s not on



tour or something and he’s at home, I can actually go see him. Would you recommend doing something like that where I actually have my physical model in front of me and they’re performing the skill that I’d like to learn?

Igor: Totally, and whilst you’re at it, if you can adapt your practice so that you can do all the ASH processes with your eyes open – I do them with my eyes closed on my own, but when I’m in public I’ll kind of just stare off in the distance and still do my mental practice, just with my eyes open. It looks more like I’m daydreaming than falling asleep, which is good.

Just remember that when you go see the actual live model, bring your mentor along. Have him help you point some things out as you’re watching it so that you can watch the process and enjoy it, and then from time to time check in and ask is there anything I should pay attention to?

He might say just pay attention to the left hand over there. Then you’ll say oh wow, I didn’t see that before. That’s going to be a very useful part of the practice as well. It’s not strictly speaking necessary, as you’ve already noticed, but if you have access to the model the more you get to know them, the better it is for the skill transfer.

Joe: Okay. I’m semi answering my own question as I’m asking it, but what would you say is the minimal amount of exposure to a skill that you would want to have before you’d want to do a DTI Process?

Igor: What would be the answer if you’ve answered it yourself?

Joe: The answer would be as much as possible to immerse yourself in learning, but minimally enough that you can at least see the entire process once. That’s what I would think.

Igor: Right. There are a couple of things. In general, in terms of the actual learning cycle, you are correct and there’s a little trick that you can do if you know nothing about something, which is kind of like a fantasy version of priming.

You kind of do a DTI with what you think that skill will be about, but it’s very important when you do that that you discuss it with the mentor ahead of time and say you basically know nothing about this so that you just create an expectation without setting up blinkers ahead of time.



The mentor’s job at that point is to keep your mind open so that you have the fun, the enthusiasm and the sense of direction before you even have any experience of the skill whatsoever. Then when you go there, it will give you lots of questions to ask yourself. For example let’s take the skill of something like horse riding. You know nothing about horse riding, right?

Joe: Yes.

Igor: Then you might just attempt to do a DTI. You may attempt to actually do some horse riding processes inside your mind, but you don’t know what it actually feels like. What does it feel like to sit in that saddle? What does it feel like to stand in your stirrups? What does it feel like when the horse is trotting and galloping?

You don’t know the answers to these questions. You can fill in the gaps of course with a fantasy but you don’t know the answers to this because you’ve never sat on a horse.

So, it’s important when you do that that you discuss that with your mentor, and then your mentor can then help you keep in mind the questions. So, what are these questions? What does it feel like? What does it smell like? What does a horse smell like? What does it sound like? What do you feel like internally when you’re on the horse?

These questions are crucial to the learning process. Learning is not about finding answers. Learning is about finding the right questions to ask in the first place, which is one of the mistakes I think we have in our school system.

We’re richly schooled into trying to find answers or guess answers or memorize answers. We’re not actually ever taught the valuable art of finding the right question that’s worth answering in the first place.

So, that’s actually a very useful thing. The key caveat there would be when you’re going through these pseudo DTI Processes, you want to make sure that your mentor helps you keep a very flexible mind, and it’s more about asking questions and finding where are the gaps that I really want to be curious about so that when you actually have a live experience of it, or at least see someone doing it, you have a better sense of what to look out for, what questions to be asking and so on. Does that help?



Joe: Yes, that’s perfect.

Igor: Good. Do you have any other questions?

Joe: I think that’s it.

Igor: All right, Joe. Thank you very much for taking part in this and thank you for being such a wonderful model on how to do modeling with other people and really acquiring a skill in a fraction of the time.

In particular I really appreciate you going out on a limb to do this because we’re doing this live. It can show people how quickly and how easily these breakthroughs do come once you’ve mastered your fundamentals, and that’s really what the ASH Program is all about. On that happy note, Joe, thank you very much and I look forward to speaking with you some other time.

Joe: Thank you, Igor. I appreciate it.



Part 2 – Johnny/Beatboxing

Igor: Module 4 will be interesting in the sense that it’s not as personally transformational as Module 3 can be, but it is much more practical in the sense that you can specifically target certain skills that you want to actually achieve, improve upon and so on.

Johnny: Yes.

Igor: What I’d like you to think of right now is a simple skill or a simple task that you’d like to get better at. Can you think of something like that?

Johnny: A simple skill or certain task? Define simple.

Igor: Just a simple skill or a task that you can do. It could be something as simple as drawing a picture or going for a walk. I like to use martial arts just because it’s my default place to go to, so kind of a particular movement, a particular sequence or a particular idea, something simple that you can do, preferably a physical skill because it will be easier to stabilize that initially.

For you for example it could be dance movements. If there’s a particular dance movement that you’d like to improve slightly – just any skill that is simple, that you can do, right now would be adequate.

Johnny: It’s the strangest thing. Nothing is coming to me.

Igor: I guess it’s because you’re still on the transformational stage from before. Rest assured we’ll come back to transformational things again on the next module, but before that there are some skills you have to learn in this module that will help you deal with the inner therapist or the inner healer.

Johnny: Beatboxing.

Igor: That’s wonderful. It’s a simple little thing and again you’re not too overly attached to it hopefully. It’s something you’ve got some experience of but if you got a little bit better at it, it would be great.

Johnny: I’m not attached at all.



Igor: Great. So, the first level is going to be really easy. It’s going to take you hopefully less than a minute to do. All I want you to do is ask your mind to take you to a place where you can do something and do any simple task.

It doesn’t matter what it is. It doesn’t have to be related to beatboxing. It can be just filling a glass of water. It can be beatboxing if you want but basically any simple action or task that you can accomplish. It’s just getting used to a space where you can do things in. Does that make sense?

Johnny: So, I’m asking it to take me to a place where I can do a simple task.

Igor: Exactly. Once you get there, you can do whatever that task is. It could be as simple as drawing a circle on a piece of paper, getting a glass of water.

Johnny: It could be shoveling snow.

Igor: It could be shoveling snow.

Johnny: It could be mowing the lawn.

Igor: Exactly. It may even be beatboxing. Right now it’s irrelevant. I just want you to get a sense that you can go somewhere to do something specific, although you may not necessarily know what it is yet.

Johnny: Okay.

Igor: Off you go. Let me know when you get back. Take no more than a minute. This is just real quick, done, and then come back.

Johnny: Okay, Igor.

Igor: That was pretty straightforward, right?

Johnny: Yes.

Igor: Now we’re going to go back again. Ask your inner mind to bring you to a place where you can specifically practice your beatboxing skill. It doesn’t matter what level it is. Whatever you do, you’re doing it normally whenever you do it. Now you’re just going to do it inside of your mind instead of in a physical practice.



When you’ve finished practicing the basics with your beatboxing skill just go through your regular exit cycle – a calm place, some integration breathing and your body scan. Let me know when you’re back.

Don’t take too long practicing the skill. Just a minute or so is fine just to get a hint of like yes I’ve done a little bit of practice here. Then you can come back again.

Johnny: No problem.

Igor: How was that? Interesting?

Johnny: Very.

Igor: How so? Just tell me about that.

Johnny: I’ve never actually learned how to do it, so therefore I was experiencing myself making sounds and noises with my mouth and beats that I’ve never learned how to do before.

Igor: So, you’ve never actually done any beatboxing before?

Johnny: I’ve done some beatboxing before, but I’ve never learned certain sound effects, certain things that you can do with your mouth that I was doing when I was there.

Igor: Very good. Did you enjoy that?

Johnny: Yes, it was really interesting.

Igor: So, we’re going to do this whole thing again. You’re going to go back to the practice room and practice the skill again. What I’d like you to do this time is I want you to get a sense of changing time. Slow it down so that you can get a particular thing right.

For example, if you find it difficult to shape your mouth in a particular way or something like that, you can slow everything right down so that you get it in like a slow motion effect and you can really refine that little part of the skill



where there’s a blip in it or something like that. Do you understand what I mean?

Johnny: Yes.

Igor: Off you go. When you’re ready, just do that and come on back again.

Johnny: Like a minute?

Igor: A little less than a minute. Just don’t take too long.

Johnny: Do you want me to just slow it down or do you want me to speed it up too? Am I practicing changing time in only one direction?

Igor: The slowing down is usually the most useful initially because it means you’ve got more time. Let’s say you’re playing football and everyone’s coming at you at a quarter the pace. You’ve got much more time to think through what you’re going to do. That tends to be the more useful version initially.

Speeding up time – I’m sure that could be of value but it’s not necessarily useful at this point right now, so if you want to experiment with it by all means do so. The more valuable one at this point is slowing things down.

Johnny: Okay.

Igor: How was that? Interesting?

Johnny: Yes.

Igor: Talk me through it.

Johnny: Just slowing time down is interesting.

Igor: Okay, easy to talk through it. So, the first level was just practicing the skill. That’s really where most sports psychology is stuck at. Notice by the way how miming and pantomiming the skill whilst you’re doing it – I suspect you’re doing less of it now because you’re getting more used to your internal environment, but sometimes pantomiming the skill along with doing it mentally will help you to stabilize it and assist it.



Johnny: I can’t really pantomime this skill.

Igor: I’m sure you can. If it’s beatboxing you’re using your mouth. You can kind of use your mouth in different shapes.

Johnny: Okay.

Igor: You don’t necessarily have to make a sound with it. You just have to kind of casually move your throat around a bit and move your lips around a bit, open your jaw, close your jaw and that sort of thing. Again, you don’t have to do it but it’s a useful stabilizer if you need it.

Johnny: Got it.

Igor: Slowing down in time is very useful to refine a skill, specifically if you already know what to do. It’s just things are happening too fast for you to be able to do it all at the same time and get it right, so you don’t overload it.

Just slow it all down and then you can take all the time in the world to do each little piece of it. This is a good way of putting a sequence together that needs to happen as one unit but it’s not there as a unit yet, right?

Johnny: Yes.

Igor: The next step is I’d like you to go back inside, get ready to do your bit of practice. In fact do a short piece of practice – and I say short piece just because it’s just enough to get a feeling that you’re doing some practice.

Then I want you to pause. I’d like you to call in a mentor. Any mentor will do; someone who of course will be able to help you with the beatboxing skill, and then discuss what you’ve done with the mentor and see if they have any advice for you.

Then follow their advice, carry on practicing, thank them and exchange gifts if you want to – it’s up to you. Then go back to the exit cycle and come back. The whole thing should take about two minutes, no more than that. Spend a little less time doing the practicing so that you have a little bit more time to do the interaction with the mentor. Do you understand the exercise?

Johnny: Yes, focus on the mentor.



Igor: All right, off you go.

Johnny: Okay.

Igor: How did that go?

Johnny: It’s like I know what’s happening but I don’t.

Igor: Go on.

Johnny: The mentor is there. I gave props to the mentor because beatboxing is sort of a hip hop thing. So, he came up and he was like what’s up, Johnny? So, I gave him like the hip hop what’s up?

He just started giving me advice. There wasn’t any sugarcoating. There was no greeting or talking. He just sort of started giving me bullet points of things I could do to better practice, but none of it was physical. Like he didn’t say here shape your mouth like this or do this. It was more like ways to practice better.

Igor: Perfect.

Johnny: If that makes any sense.

Igor: Yes.

Johnny: Then I started doing it with him. He gave me a gift. I gave him a gift back. I said thank you and then I did my exit cycle.

Igor: Wonderful. How did you enjoy the exercise?

Johnny: Fun.

Igor: Good.

Johnny: Curious.

Igor: In what way?

Johnny: Because thus far consciously I’m not learning anything.



Igor: Well, we’re about to find out about that. Is there something in beatboxing that you would like to be able to do but has to date defied you, escaped your ability?

Johnny: Just holding a consistent beat.

Igor: All right, just give me an example.

Johnny: It’s almost as if I’m trying to change beats like all the time.

Igor: Just give me an example. How long would you have to go before you’d lose the consistent beat?

Johnny: A couple of eight counts.

Igor: So, go ahead and just demonstrate where you are at right now so that we can hear it, and then we’ll do something about that.

Johnny: Okay. [Beatboxing]

Igor: All right. What happened there? Towards the end is where it started changing. Is that right?

Johnny: Yes.

Igor: And that’s the bit that you want to change. You want to keep it consistent, is that right?

Johnny: Yes, not just consistent but there’s also – I’m already looking at a future goal, but yes. My future goal is to be able to make two sound effects simultaneously.

Igor: All right, let’s just keep it simple for now. We’re going to go through a set of progression, a set of steps, and we’re going to build it bit by bit. For these steps, I’m going to ask you to do something and then come back.

Do not worry about the integration cycle – the exit cycle in between these steps. These are actually all part of the same step, but I’m going to do it in a



little series for you so that we can discuss each little step along the way before you go on. Make sense?

Johnny: Yes.

Igor: All right. I want you to do this very quickly. I want you to go inside, find a practice space and I want you to just call up someone. If you actually know an individual that has this particular skill you’re looking for, call that person up – otherwise someone that represents someone who’s got the skill – and just watch them for a very brief moment in time just doing the beatboxing.

To make our timing easier, just tell me when you’re there. Tell me when you see them. Tell me what you’re watching and I’ll tell you when to come back with your eyes open for the next step. Off you go.

Johnny: Okay, I’m in the room. Okay, the guide is here and he’s basically teaching me.

Igor: All right, come on back.

Johnny: Okay.

Igor: Once again, you’re going back into the original exercise. We’re doing something slightly different here. Let me describe it.

Johnny: My unconscious mind took me to a different practice space.

Igor: That’s fine. That’s good.

Johnny: Okay.

Igor: The difference though is we’re looking for a different skill set actual practicing cycle. Right now you’re going to the old mentor tells me what to do and I try to do it, right? We’re not looking to do that right now.

Maybe this will help you if you do it this way. Go to a practice space. Call up two individuals, one of which will be a mentor, one of which will be someone who actually possesses the skill that you want.

Johnny: Got it.



Igor: Together you will observe the model doing a little bit of a beatboxing skill that you want. Just observe them and then we’ll come right back and we’ll do something with that. Make sense?

So, enter the space, mentor and role model. Get the role model to do his thing. Just observe him for a moment. I’ll pull you right back and then we’ll go right back in again and add something to it. Make sense?

Johnny: Yes, absolutely.

Igor: At this point, the mentor has nothing to do yet. He’s just going to hang out with you.

Johnny: Got it. Okay, I’m in the space. My mentor is standing on my left. Tom is standing in front of me and he’s doing it.

Igor: When you’ve watched it for a bit, come on back. Just open your eyes. We’re not going to do the exit cycle just yet.

Johnny: Okay.

Igor: Good. Do the same thing again. You’re going to go right back to the same thing. This time when you’re watching your role model doing his thing, I want you to go through a cycle of observation.

1. Step one is exactly what you’ve been doing a moment ago. Just watch the general performance, the whole thing.

2. Step two, I want you to watch specifically his facial expressions, how they move, how they transition and so on.

3. Step three, I want you to pay attention in particular to voice qualities – how they sound and in other instances especially if they’re not actually using any sound, how they’re breathing, but of course now you can watch both breathing and listen to the sound at the same time.

4. Step four, focus on their whole body. How is their whole body moving? Is there rocking? Are there general mannerisms? How is their whole body moving?



5. Step five; once again, watch the entire performance as an overall thing.

So, the progression is:

All Face Voice or breathing Body Once again all

Johnny: It’s a little loop.

Igor: It’s a little loop. Exactly. Go inside. You don’t have to spend a huge amount of time on each of those steps. Just enough that you get a sense of what each step looks like. Then when you’ve done all five, just open your eyes. No need to do the integration stuff yet. We’ll come back and we’ll discuss that, and then we’ll do the next step.

Johnny: Okay.

Igor: How was that? Was that interesting?

Johnny: Yes, it seems to be jumping all over the place.

Igor: Tell me more.

Johnny: It’s hard to keep my focus on one specific part of the performance.

Igor: Did you go through the cycle of the all, the face, the voice, the body and then the all? Or was that the bit where you started finding it difficult?

Johnny: That’s what I did. It’s just like when I was watching his face it was like I wanted to be listening to his voice. When I was listening to his voice it was like I was watching more how he was moving. It was weird.

Igor: Okay good, but hopefully it wasn’t distracting. You can still do it. It wasn’t distracting. It was just that other elements were coming into it as well. Is that correct?

Johnny: Yes.



Igor: That’s fine. If it’s distracting, then I can give you a solution to that. If it wasn’t, then we can just keep it as is. It’s up to you which you would rather have.

Johnny: Give me the lesson on the distraction.

Igor: The simple solution on the distraction is this. This is the first cycle of the DTI Progression. Whilst you’re witnessing the performance – those five different stages – simply describe to your mentor what it is that you’re witnessing.

I’m noticing he’s breathing like this. His tone is like that. His whole body has this overall sense of this thing. I’m noticing his hands are moving like this. His left foot is doing these other things at the same time. The hand and foot are doing these two things.

Again, you’re using your natural ability to solidify things by describing them to stabilize the attention on what you want. However, what you just did, even though there’s some cross-fertilization, if it wasn’t distracting you then that’s just fine because actually you’re getting all around richer experiences.

I just want to make sure that you have some key pieces of observation. The whole unit – the face gives you a lot of information about how people are processing things.

Their breathing or their voice will give you a very important piece of information also. Their body as opposed to their face will be another kind of unconscious activity going on there. Then of course integrating the whole thing is one big thing.

Those are some key units to be able to separate different components of how people do stuff. Does that make sense?

Johnny: Yes, it does and for a pure data point, I’ve got this doubt in me.

Igor: Go ahead.

Johnny: I just doubt I’m going to learn anything like this.

Igor: Oh, with the beatboxing?



Johnny: Yes. I’m just letting you know I have a doubt there.

Igor: Great, in that case it’s perfect for the next level. Here’s what I want you to do. We’ll just add an extra bit with the doubt because that’s not normally there, but that’s fine. We can deal with that. We’ll do this in stages.

I want you to go back inside. This time there’s your model there. Before you start observing your model, I want you to discuss with your mentor what it is that you want from this role model. Are you with me?

Johnny: Yes, I’m here. I was contemplating what you were saying as you were saying it.

Igor: So, you’ll discuss with the mentor what it is that you want from this role model. In this case it’s a simple skill, which is the ability to maintain that beat that you’re asking for, right?

Johnny: Yes.

Igor: Whilst you’re discussing what you want, you may as well raise any doubts that you have and see what the mentor says about that. Whatever he says, if there’s an emotion involved – either good or bad – just sit with it for a while. Then come back and we’ll discuss it before we add the next layer to this particular part of the cycle.

Johnny: Okay.

Igor: Off you go.

Johnny: Okay.

Igor: Tell me what happened.

Johnny: I went into the practice space. The mentor was standing right next to me. I said all I want to learn from him is how to manage to keep the same beat over and over and over again pretty consistently, and he said okay cool, so why are you paying attention to more than that? He asked me that. Why are you paying attention to more than that?

Igor: And then?



Johnny: I said to him well I’m looking at the whole picture, and he goes yeah that’s the way you’ve believed you’ve had to learn your whole life. He goes that’s not how you learn. So, I expressed my doubts and he said go ahead and keep doubting while you watch.

Igor: And?

Johnny: And as I watched, the doubt went away.

Igor: So, how do you feel?

Johnny: Better.

Igor: Good. So, now let’s do something practical with it. You’ve discussed what you want with the mentor. You expressed your doubts and then you observed the role model doing his thing and your doubts sort of evaporated. Is that correct?

Johnny: Yes.

Igor: Great. In a moment you’re going to go back in. If you need to do that initial discussion again, feel free to do it. Otherwise just remind yourself of it. Once you’ve discussed what you want and any doubts that you may have, and observe the role model again. Remember, when we say observing we mean those five phases

the whole of their performance, just their face, just their voice or breathing, just their body and then the whole of that performance again

I want you to then timeout on the role model, turn back to the mentor and I want you to discuss the pros and cons of several things with this mentor.

First of all, the pros and cons of this role model in terms of the skill that you want.



He’s got these great things but I don’t necessarily want these things about him. These are good skills he has but these aren’t necessarily great skills. I don’t necessarily want that part of him and so on.

Included in these pros and cons – this is important – I want you to discuss the whole person of the role model.

In other words, there were things you like about that person or things you don’t like, things you would like to emulate about that person, specifically the skill, and there are many things you may not want about that person.

The classic example is Milton Erickson who had polio and diabetes. If you did a DTI with Milton Erickson, you wouldn’t necessarily want the polio and diabetes. You don’t want to be stuck in a wheelchair and feel pain every day. So, it’s an aspect of that person’s life you would not like.

In the same way, I don’t know this Tom figure but if he’s too arrogant you may not like that. If they’re too shy you might not like that. If they have a particular world you don’t like, you may not want that.

It’s not just the pros and cons of the skills that you’re interested in, but also the things that you wouldn’t want about this individual as a whole and things that are actually quite appealing to you about the individual as a whole. So, you give a balanced perspective. Does that make sense?

Johnny: Yes.

Igor: Do you have a question, or is that just a smile?

Johnny: Smile.

Igor: Good. Once you’ve done this conversation, then go back and observe the model again through the five cycles, having discussed all that. Then come on back and we’ll have another chat.

Johnny: Okay. Let me go over this so that I have it in my head really succinctly. I go in. My mentor is standing next to me. The role model is there. I may have to have a conversation again with the mentor or I may not. I’m just going to remind myself of it and see if anything comes up.



I observe the role model do their entire thing – the entire five cycles. I then turn to my mentor and I discuss the pros and cons of the skill set itself. Then I discuss the pros and cons of the person. I pick what I like and let go of what I don’t like. Go through the entire observation cycle again and then I come out.

Igor: Perfect.

Johnny: Okay.

Igor: Off you go.

Johnny: Okay.

Igor: How are you doing?

Johnny: That was interesting.

Igor: Tell me more.

Johnny: A feeling came up that I had to sit with.

Igor: Pleasant or unpleasant?

Johnny: I wouldn’t say it’s pleasant or unpleasant.

Igor: Okay, just a feeling. Okay.

Johnny: Yes, it was just a feeling. Interesting process. It’s like telepathy. I’m not actually talking with my mentor. I look at him and it’s like he gets what I’m thinking. I’m not actually like in the image anymore. I’m not actually physically talking.

Igor: Sure, I understand.

Johnny: But he gets it and he shared some stuff with me and then he touched me, my shoulder, and he gave me a gift by touching my shoulder. I have no idea what that was and it processed. I went back to watching my model again. That’s it.

Igor: Very good. Excellent.



Johnny: I haven’t done any exit cycles. I’m just letting you know.

Igor: I understand. There are three stages to the DTI Process. The first stage was the witness stage, which is basically just watching the model do their thing and go through the five cycles.

The second stage, is discuss what you want with your mentor, observe the model, then discuss pros and cons of both the skill and that person as a personality. Then observe the model again and then come back. You’ve done an elaborate version of that.

The third stage is this. Start again and if you need to, do the whole second stage again. Discuss what you want with the mentor, observe the model if you need to a little bit – or you can do the whole discussion in one go and discuss what you want. Discuss the pros and the cons. Discuss what you do and don’t want of their personality or what you do and don’t like of their personality.

Essentially this whole step basically adds a safety element. DTI, or Deep Trance Identification, as you know is one of the most fundamental and one of the most powerful and quickest ways to learn pretty much anything.

Kids do it all the time without realizing it, and when we get to harness this ourselves, we get to learn things at rates that far exceed the normal rate of progression. The problem with DTI is that it’s a form of implicit learning, which means you may well end up implicitly learning stuff that has nothing to do with what you want.

Johnny: Characteristics of that individual that I don’t want.

Igor: Exactly. What we’re doing here is we’re introducing a safety check to basically say this is the only area we’ll restrict ourselves to, and everything else I don’t want. Does that make sense?

Johnny: Got it. Yes.

Igor: Then once you’ve done your initial discussions – if any of them are still necessary to do them again – observe your subject, your role model briefly just to get a sense of them doing it, and then I want you to use your transformation skills that you practiced in the previous module and become, transform into being the subject whilst doing their thing.



Then experience yourself being the subject, doing the thing you’ve watched them doing from all kinds of different ways. Notice how you’re moving, how you’re breathing. You may actually want to mime out some of the elements.

For example, when Joe was doing this he started just tapping his guitar a little bit, strumming a bit. He started rocking his body a bit. He head swayed a little bit. His breathing changed slightly. He didn’t necessarily do the full motions of it but he kind of got into that groove because that’s who he was becoming. Does that make sense?

Johnny: Yes, it does.

Igor: Once you’ve been the subject for a little while, then transform back to yourself and debrief with your mentor. The final step is very important.

Once you’ve debriefed with your mentor, ask your mentor to do a full body scan of you as a general health check to make sure only those elements that you have agreed you wanted to take with you have come with you, and nothing extra has come along with you that you don’t want.

No personality quirks, no health issues, no elements of the skill that you’re not interested in or actually could be counterproductive to you – for example if he makes mistakes in some way. All those things have not come with you. They stay with the actual original model.

Once he’s done that body scan, if it all checks out fine, then do your exit cycle. If something needs to be done, then negotiate with the mentor to do whatever needs to be done so that you’re in a good place before you do your exit cycle. Do you want me to repeat that process or do you understand the whole process?

Johnny: Let me see if I can verify this. Go in. Talk to my mentor briefly if I need to. Watch the model do what he’s doing. Do the entire observation model – the five different steps of the observation model.

Then I transform into him. Do it from different perspectives so I’m like really feeling my body and I’m feeling the voice quality and how I’m breathing. Basically what I’ve been observing before I’m now doing myself.



Then get all the way through that and then transform back into me. Then debrief with my mentor. Have him do a body scan of me to check to make sure that all the things I do want are there and all the things I don’t want aren’t there. Receive anything I need to receive and then exit cycle.

Igor: Exactly. Whenever you’re ready, off you go.

Johnny: Okay, Igor.

Igor: How do you feel?

Johnny: Good.

Igor: Yes?

Johnny: Yes.

Igor: In that case, go ahead and try the skill out.

Johnny: Are you ready?

Igor: Yes.

Johnny: [Beatboxing]

Igor: And?

Johnny: That was sick. That was rad.

Igor: How do you feel about that?

Johnny: Gangsta.

Igor: Let me ask you about this. How satisfied are you about the performance you just gave?

Johnny: Beyond.

Igor: How long have you been trying to achieve something of that quality?



Johnny: A decade?

Igor: And how long have you been doing the DTI Process?

Johnny: Today.

Igor: So, if you think about it, it took a while to do the progression to get to this point. The actual full level DTI – the third level progression…

Johnny: Six minutes.

Igor: It was six minutes. Now admittedly some of the earlier setup work that you did also helped prepare the way. So, if you did this all from scratch, you may end up doing it in 10 or 15 minutes, but even so a skill that’s eluded you for 10 years in about 10 or 15 minutes of practice, you suddenly get like that. Isn’t that something?

Johnny: That’s amazing.

Igor: How do you feel about that?

Johnny: Yeah. Yes please. Oh, the amount of places I can use this.

Igor: Oh yeah.

Johnny: Oh yeah.

Igor: We haven’t finished the whole process yet. This is just basically the end of Module 4, which is the Expert Module. Do you get a bit of a sense now why it’s called the Expert Module?

Johnny: Yes.

Igor: Let’s just recap the main levels of the Expert Model. The standard approach to performance enhancement skills is just practice the skill mentally. That’s really the lowest level of what we’re doing here.

Then you learned to play with time because by manipulating time you then get to polish parts of the process that usually happen very quickly. Especially if



you’re in a time crucial environment – let’s say you’re doing boxing or a competitive sport – you can slow everything down to make sure that you do your bit smoothly and correctly and so on, and then speed it back up again to engrain it.

Thirdly, we introduced the mentor just to kind of discuss and give you some advice, and sometimes all you want to do is practice the skill and get a bit of advice and then that’s fine and you’re good to go.

Those were the first three stages, the first three levels of progression within the Expert Module. The next three levels were the DTI progression.

1. The first level of the DTI progression is the witness section, where all you do is you invite it a role model and you witness the five stage cycle – all, face, voice and breathing, body and all.

For example, people might ask what’s the difference between the body and the all? Well, let’s take the idea of horse riding. Body would just be what’s the rider doing?

All would be what is the rider doing in relation to the horse? What’s the horse doing? How are they riding on the track? How are they compared to the other players?

You get the idea. It’s a global picture. It just happens to be in this skill. Watching the body and watching the all will be a very close thing to each other, right?

Johnny: Yes.

Igor: So, that’s the first level of the DTI progression.

2. The second level of the DTI progression is the mentoring level.

You get a mentor in and you’re going to discuss several things. You’re going to discuss what you want and then that’s going to be a discussion that’s going on there.

If you have doubts, that’s the time to bring them up and of course you already noticed how your mentor helped you with those doubts at the crucial



moment, rather than progressing them as you went along. You’ll do that initial discussion and then you’ll do the observation cycle.

Then you’ll do another set of discussions about the pros and cons. What do you like and what don’t you like? What do you want to keep and what do you want to reject? What is it about the skill and about the individual that are positive and negative aspects that you want to keep or reject?

These are all safety parameters. Once you have that in place, you’ll go back to the observation cycle. That’s the second level – the mentoring level.

3. The final level is the actual DTI, that’s the full integration level.

Notice how they can all be done in a sequence. You do your initial observation, than you do the discussion and another observation, then the pros and cons discussion and another observation. Then you step into the subject and experience it from their point of view as entirely as you can.

Importantly, at this stage, is if you feel if the spirit so moves you then start miming out portions of the action. I don’t know if you did that. I suspect that you did though.

Johnny: I did.

Igor: You may have started rocking in a certain rhythm. You may have started making small or minor mouth and throat movements. You didn’t necessarily make a noise with it or maybe you did actually make a noise with it at the same time.

Johnny: I actually did.

Igor: Yes, you did make a noise. Actually, we didn’t hear you because you were on mute, but the point is you don’t have to have the full skill going on there, but just enough to kind of get into it.

This is probably true in beatboxing particularly. Whilst someone’s waiting in the wings to do their thing, everyone’s there just sort of beatboxing away with whoever the main person on stage is. They’re kind of joining in, right?

Johnny: Yes.



Igor: They’re actually doing a milder form of a DTI without realizing it. You just have the purer form now, which means it works faster and more powerfully with less time and effort.

4. Importantly, the final step once you’ve done the DTI Process, you want to return and debrief with the mentor.

Discuss what you learned. Discuss what’s coming up. Ask for any advice if any advice is necessary, or any kind of debrief that you need. You’re already kind of good at that whole process now.

5. Finally, use the body scan for a health check.

You want to make sure you don’t accidently bring with you any idiosyncrasies either in behavior, attitude or in physical health that create an unconscious blueprint that you end up following which you don’t want.

Once you’ve done the whole cycle, you just do your natural exit cycle, which is a calm place, integration breathing, allow it to settle in, the personal body scan to allow yourself to get grounded, and then if you can do it, go and practice or test the skill out straightaway because that gives you a very black and white test.

We did that today. You started off with your beatboxing skill and you were dissatisfied with the outcome. Then you did it again at the end and you were delighted with your outcome. Correct?

Johnny: Absolutely.

Igor: Over to you. What have you learned? What are you going to take away from this session?

Johnny: From this session or from the whole day?

Igor: Let’s start with this session and then we’ll go to the whole day. We still have some more bits and pieces before we finish up today.

Johnny: The biggest piece that I learned is breaking things down into steps, and the importance of really developing things. Even though you can develop a skill



set very quickly, it’s the steps that you do and the order in which you do it that allow you to attain a certain level of unconscious mastery with it.

Igor: Right.

Johnny: It’s not real true time but your internal time that governs the nature of the skill you’re learning.

Igor: Exactly. How long did it feel you were doing the whole DTI Process when we had that last six-minute cycle just now?

Johnny: How did it feel?

Igor: How long did it feel you were there for?

Johnny: Twenty or 30 minutes.

Igor: Right, which is actually what I was hoping for, it’s a very typical thing. You’re now learning the other side of time distortion. One version is when you’re inside there you can slow subjective time down in the sense that the world around you slows down so that you can have more time to think about what to do.

The other version is that you actually slow down your perception of objective time so that five minutes of clock time becomes in this case a half an hour of internal time. Just consider this as a future possibility. What if you developed the skill to the point where you can spend an entire day, week, month or even a year inside of just a few moments of clock time?

Johnny: God, that would be unbelievable.

Igor: Just to let you know, this is possible. Whilst I haven’t done this myself personally yet – it’s something I would like to of course achieve at some point – I do know of at least one person who’s a Shaman and he spent an entire lifetime in an altered state. In other words, he lived an entire life from birth through to death, got married, had children, died and when he returned I think the whole journey was only 20 minutes or a half an hour or something like that.

Johnny: Wow.



Igor: But it felt like an entire lifetime, and it was so real to him that he actually grieved for the loss of his wife and children when he had to come back.

Johnny: Wow.

Igor: I’m just giving you a sense of what is possible. In terms of skill building, it’s not necessary for anything like that to occur of course, but it is very useful to be able to slow down clock time so that you get a lot more practice time in less time. Right now your ratio is five minutes to half an hour. That’s pretty decent. Over time, especially if you intend for it to happen, you’ll be able to achieve more in less objective time, in less clock time.

Johnny: Got it.

Igor: Make sense?

Johnny: Yes.

Igor: Any comments or questions about the particular process or what you’ve done so far?

Johnny: Yes, wow! I’ve read about this. You know Milton Erickson’s done a lot of stuff like this, traveling through time, slowing time down, speeding time up. Didn’t he help somebody learn hypnosis – they became a master of hypnosis in such a short amount of time but inside their actual experience it felt like almost a year or something like that?

I remember reading a story like that. I don’t know if that’s the exact times or anything.

Igor: Right.

Johnny: I remember reading a story or something like that, but when you read it you’re like yeah sure, whatever. That’s wild.

Igor: It’s a little different once you actually have the experience of it, right?

Johnny: The actual experience of it? Yes.

Documents

BSH Bonus DTI Transcript