A P P E A R A N C E S The Sole Member For the Tribunal · At one stage, he told us that the organisation that he was involved in had a special responsibility for dealing with sources

A P P E A R A N C E S

The Sole Member: His Honour Judge Peter Smithwick

For the Tribunal: Mrs. Mary Laverty, SCMr. Justin Dillon, SCMr. Dara Hayes, BLMr. Fintan Valentine, BL

Instructed by: Jane McKevitt

Solicitor

For the Commissioner of An Garda Siochana: Mr. Diarmuid McGuinness, SC

Mr. Michael Durack, SCMr. Gareth Baker, BL

Instructed by: Mary CumminsCSSO

For Owen Corrigan: Mr. Jim O'Callaghan, SCMr. Darren Lehane, BL

Instructed by: Fintan Lawlor Lawlor Partners Solicitors

For Leo Colton: Mr. Paul Callan, SCMr. Eamon Coffey, BL

Instructed by: Dermot Lavery Solicitors

For Finbarr Hickey: Fionnuala O'Sullivan, BL

Instructed by: James MacGuill & Co.

For the Attorney General: Ms. Nuala Butler, SCMr. Douglas Clarke, SC

Instructed by: CSSO

For Freddie Scappaticci: Eavanna Fitzgerald, BLPauline O'Hare

Instructed by: Michael FlaniganSolicitor

For Kevin Fulton: Mr. Neil Rafferty, QC

Instructed by: John McAtamneySolicitor

For Breen Family: Mr. John McBurney

For Buchanan Family/Heather Currie: Ernie Waterworth

McCartan Turkington BreenSolicitors

For the PSNI: Mark Robinson, BL

NOTICE: A WORD INDEX IS PROVIDED AT THE BACK OF THIS TRANSCRIPT. THIS IS A USEFUL INDEXING SYSTEM, WHICH ALLOWS YOU TO QUICKLY SEE THE WORDS USED IN THE TRANSCRIPT, WHERE THEY OCCUR AND HOW OFTEN.

EXAMPLE: - DOYLE [2] 30:28 45:17

THE WORD “DOYLE” OCCURS TWICEPAGE 30, LINE 28PAGE 45, LINE 17

I N D E X

Witness Page No. Line No.

PETER MAGUIRE

EXAMINED BY MRS. LAVERTY 2 2

CROSS-EXAMINED BY MR. DURACK 13 16

CROSS-EXAMINED BY MR. O'CALLAGHAN 14 7

CROSS-EXAMINED BY MS. FITZGERALD 15 23

CONOR HANLON

EXAMINED BY MR. DILLON 18 1

CROSS-EXAMINED BY MR. DURACK 31 2

CROSS-EXAMINED BY MR. ROBINSON 34 17

CROSS-EXAMINED BY MR. SMITH 36 14

RE-EXAMINED BY MR. DILLON 39 26

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Smithwick Tribunal - 26 April 2012 - Day 94

Doyle Court Reporters Ltd.

1

THE TRIBUNAL RESUMED ON THE 26TH OF APRIL, 2012,

AS FOLLOWS:

MRS. LAVERTY: Good morning, Chairman. The witness this

morning is Mr. Maguire, and Mr. Maguire is --

unfortunately, he has been late because he had come from

court, and he wanted to look at some files to update his

recollection of events.

CHAIRMAN: Thank you very much.

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PETER MAGUIRE, HAVING BEEN SWORN, WAS EXAMINED BY

MRS. LAVERTY AS FOLLOWS:

MRS. LAVERTY: Good morning, Mr. Maguire.

A. Good morning.

Q. I am not going to keep you very long in my questioning. We 1

heard from your colleague, Mr. Basil Walsh, yesterday.

A. Yes, Chairman, yes.

Q. And it was in relation to a matter that hadn't come before 2

the Tribunal in your earlier appearances before the

Tribunal, because it was to do with meetings that you had

with a Mr. Ian Hurst.

A. Yes.

Q. And you made statements in relation to that, both of you, 3

at an earlier stage in the proceedings, but there was some

question as to whether he would be called to attend this

Tribunal, or not. So, until now, we haven't dealt with

that.

A. Yes.

Q. And I think that, yesterday, if I -- I think that there 4

were two meetings with Mr. Hurst, in January and February

2000, is that right?

A. That's correct, yes, Chairman, we did have two meetings

with him.

Q. And I think that Mr. Walsh told us it was through the 5

intervention of the editor of The Sunday Times that the

connection was made, is that right?

A. Well, now, I have some anecdotal evidence to suggest that,

but I don't know, I don't know how it was made. I do know

that the Assistant Commissioner in Dublin had some contact

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with Mr. Hurst, or somebody on Mr. Hurst's part that

indicated that he was in some difficulty and that he wanted

to speak to members of the Garda Siochana, or,

alternatively, that it was deemed prudent, from the

knowledge that the Assistant Commissioner had, that the

Garda Siochana should interview him.

Q. Yes. And I think as a result of that, then, Chief 6

Superintendent Walsh and yourself - I think you were

Superintendent at the time?

A. I was, yes.

Q. Am I correct? 7

A. Yes.

Q. You went down to, by arrangement, to meet him in his home 8

in Carrick-on-Suir?

A. That's correct, yes, Chairman.

Q. And I think that, perhaps you might give us your 9

recollections of that meeting, and then, in case you have

forgotten anything, I'll tell you what Mr. Walsh said.

A. Well, my memory of it is, it was January 2002 -- or January

2000, it was, January 2000, we went to Tipperary and we met

Mr. Hurst. He had some apprehensions at the time that his

security was under some threat, for two reasons: first of

all, he was involved in a unit that he referred to as the

Force Research Unit in Northern Ireland, which was a unit

of the British Army, and, from his involvement in that

unit, his evidence was that he had access to very sensitive

information, and that he had knowledge of certain

activities that were certainly bordering on illegality that

had taken place in Northern Ireland at the behest of

security forces, and that, in those circumstances, he felt

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that, because of his peculiar knowledge of these things,

that he was at a personal risk, and the risk, I suppose,

was aggravated by the fact that he had left the security

forces at that time and he had started to leak some

materials to a well-known journalist, or at least two

well-known journalists, and, in the circumstances, he felt

that if something was to happen to him, he would want to

have on the record his apprehension for his own personal

safety so as to enable some type of authentic investigation

to take place into whatever incident he perceived was

likely to occur, or he anticipated was likely to occur as a

result of his talking to the media. He also felt at the

time that his telephone had been interfered with, or his

communications had been interfered with, and that arose

from circumstances where somebody called to his house late

at night with an English accent and asked to use the

telephone on the pretence that he was broken down on the

road, and, in the circumstances, he allowed him to use the

telephone, but he got sight of some materials subsequently

that indicated that a telephone conversation he had with

somebody else had been, at least, eavesdropped on and that

the contents of it had been reduced to paper, or to

writing, and, in the circumstances, he felt that he needed

to talk to the guards. So, myself and Chief Superintendent

Walsh, who were both in the Special Detective Unit at the

time - Mr. Walsh was the head of it and I was the

Operations Detective Superintendent - we went and

interviewed him. He didn't want to be formally interviewed

at the time, but he did make arrangements for us to

interview him subsequently and to come back to him

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subsequently. I came back, and I think I made some

arrangements to have his telephone examined and to see if

there was an intercept on it or if there was any grounds

whatsoever for his apprehension.

Q. And did this -- was that the first meeting, or are we 10

combining that meeting and a second meeting in Waterford?

A. Well, I think that was the first meeting where matters were

discussed in summary form, yes, and --

Q. Yes. Sorry. 11

A. In the second meeting, I think we took a statement from him

and we also -- there were matters which he wasn't prepared

to include in his statement, and I think I made some

records of them, and made a report to my authorities in

relation to what they were.

Q. Yes. And I think that Mr. Walsh has discussed those 12

matters; Mr. Hurst, indeed, himself gave evidence to those,

so you can feel free, Mr. Maguire, to discuss the content

of those documents now in this Tribunal. It has been

raised already in evidence.

A. Well, yes. Now, there are quite sensitive things in

relation to security matters in Northern Ireland, and I'd

want to be quite clear that I am not breaching any

confidences here.

Q. Perhaps you might confine yourself to matters that would be 13

of interest to this Tribunal.

A. Yes. At one stage, he told us that the organisation that

he was involved in had a special responsibility for dealing

with sources of intelligence, that would be hard sources,

human sources of intelligence in particular, within

organisations. Now, at that stage, he identified somebody

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who I knew to be a very active member of the Irish

Republican army, which was Fred Scappaticci, that is

referred to 'Stakeknife', and he referred to him as being

one of their chief intelligence sources. Now, that, of

course, wasn't known at that time, and it was a matter

which, certainly, I had some apprehensions about, because I

felt it was a grave breach of duty on behalf of Mr. Hurst

to release such sensitive information to somebody else at

the time, but, nevertheless, for what it was worth, I

recorded it and I informed my authorities about it. That

was, I think, in February 2000. I think some years

afterwards, Mr. Hurst proceeded to release

Mr. Scappaticci's name to a newspaper, a well-known Sunday

newspaper, resulting in Mr. Scappaticci having to be taken

away, and his family, in the middle of the night in

Northern Ireland.

Q. I think this was in 2004? 14

A. I think that happened in 2004.

Q. A book came out and the article. 15

A. Yes. Now, I think he also mentioned a number of other

people. He mentioned a senator who he said was a member of

the Senate in Dublin, Seanad Eireann, and that he was also

an agent for the British secret service and that he was

used for the purpose of trying to identify, or anticipate

what the Irish Government's reaction would be to any

contemporary British policy regarding Northern Ireland or

regarding Anglo-Irish relations, and that he was -- this

contact was ongoing for sometime. I pushed him for the

name of that source, which he said he didn't know. He also

said that there were two members of the Garda Siochana that

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were in contact with the Force Research Unit, as well. One

of them was somebody from Garda Headquarters in Dublin,

whom I got the impression he was conveying to me was a

senior Garda officer whom he referred to as 'Eamon'. He

said he didn't know his address or his name at all, and

that the name 'Eamon' was a code name or an operational

name that was ascribed to him by whoever his handler was.

He said he was met quite frequently. We pushed him in

detail in relation to that matter, and we couldn't push it

any further. He also said that there was a member of the

Garda Siochana in Donegal who was passing information to,

again, to the Force Research Unit, for a lengthy period of

time, and was getting paid for it. Now, I noticed from my

papers this morning, and I read them before I gave

evidence, just ten minutes ago, that I referred to this

member of the guards as being somebody associated with the

Task Force. My recollection of it is that he was somebody

associated with the Traffic Unit, and that the reference to

the Task Force was -- is not correct; that he was somebody

associated with the Traffic Unit, because I remember

pushing him in great detail as to what possible interest

they could have in a member of the Traffic Unit, that the

Traffic Unit would not have access to this type of

sensitive information that people involved in State

security would be interested in. And he was adamant that

he was a member of the Traffic Unit. But again, we were

very anxious to identify those people because, from our

position, anybody that was passing information of the

nature that was indicated, would have been in breach of the

Official Secrets Act here, and all the people concerned

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that would have been mentioned would have been bound by the

Official Secrets Act. Perhaps the position of the senator

might be a little bit more ambiguous, but certainly the

guards would be, clearly, and he wasn't able to identify

them.

Q. And this, of course, would have been of particular interest 16

to you because you had been primarily responsible for --

you'd been very deeply involved into the investigation of

Garda Denis Kelly, isn't that right?

A. Yes, I had, indeed, yes.

Q. And he was subsequently incarcerated for passing on 17

information to the IRA?

A. Yes, Mr. Kelly was arrested and charged, and got six years'

imprisonment for it.

Q. So you had a lot of experience in this type of 18

investigation?

A. Well, I had some experience in it, Chairman.

Q. Now, Mr. Walsh recalls that he asked Mr. Hurst about 19

Dundalk, about the guards in Dundalk, did he have any

particular information about them, and he said he did that

because of Mr. Hurst mentioning a member of the guards

giving him information in Kilkenny, and he said because he

had worked in Dundalk and the proximity of the two, that he

was just, out of curiosity, wondering if there was anyone

in Dundalk -- Letterkenny, at least -- was there anyone in

Dundalk passing on information. And he said that he had

never -- "Did he have anyone speaking to him in Dundalk?

Answer: I asked him that and he said he had never worked

there?"

So at that period of time, he didn't get any information

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about Dundalk.

Now, as I said, you prepared a report, and that was passed

up to Headquarters in the normal way, concerning the

allegations about the identity of -- the other identity of

Mr. Scappaticci, is that right?

A. Yes.

Q. And I think that the statement that was prepared and signed 20

by Mr. Hurst was pretty anodyne; it was just in relation to

concerns he had about a break-in, or something like that?

A. Yes, yes.

Q. There was no intelligence information in it at all?21

A. None whatsoever, Judge, no.

Q. And did you have another meeting then, or contact with 22

Mr. Hurst subsequently?

A. I think he phoned me on a subsequent occasion, maybe more

than once, in relation to, once, that his home was broken

into, or some indication that his home was broken into, and

that materials had been taken from it that appeared in a

newspaper, or were at least presented to him later on

during an interview by somebody on behalf of the British

Government, or the British security services. My

recollection of that is not good now, of that phone call.

Q. And what do you think he expected to you do in the course 23

of these interviews? What do you think he wanted from you?

A. I thought, initially, that he was concerned about his own

safety and his own security and I thought that he wanted to

impart certain information to us, certainly some of the

sensitive materials, that he was releasing that information

to us for the purpose of bringing home to us the gravity of

the risk which he was under, and that was my initial view

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on -- that was my initial assessment of what he was talking

to us. I am sorry --

Q. Carry on... 24

A. That was my initial view as to why he was talking to us.

Then I saw those materials released in the newspaper, and

perhaps I wasn't sure that my assessment, original

assessment of it was right when I saw the scale of

disclosure in the newspapers.

Q. Did he at any stage -- did you at any stage raise the 25

question of Owen Corrigan with him?

A. Never spoke to Mr. Corrigan [sic] -- I never spoke about

Mr. Corrigan to Mr. Hurst, it never crossed my mind, no.

Q. Now, there seems to be some confusion, certainly in his 26

mind, about this, because he, in his examination here, he

said that in the first two interviews he had with you, that

the question of Corrigan never came up, which I think you'd

agree with, is that right?

A. Yes.

Q. And he then said that it happened at a meeting in 2004 27

which he is of the belief you were at. You say you didn't

have any meetings with him, or did you?

A. I am afraid, in 2004, I was a Chief Superintendent in the

north of Dublin City, and I had nothing whatsoever to do

with security policing, and I never met Mr. Hurst or would

have no interest in anything at that stage that he was

involved in.

Q. Yes. And he said that there was a discussion at -- he 28

confined himself subsequently to a meeting in 2004 where he

thought you were present. He said that there was a

discussion about -- a term used was "bad apples," and

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somebody said to him, "We know we have" -- the subject of

Owen Corrigan came up, and he said, he quotes that what was

said to him was, "We know we have a few bad apples like

Corrigan. Every time we try to do something, we get

stymied from above." Did you ever have a conversation like

that with him?

A. Well, indeed I hadn't, Judge, and indeed it would -- my

experience in the Garda Siochana would certainly -- I had

never -- such a proposition that is made in that statement

would be completely unsustainable. Any time that any

indication came to us that there was a problem of any sort

regarding dishonesty, security or otherwise, it would have

been -- we would have been under a very firm injunction

from our authorities to do something about it. And almost

invariably throughout my lifetime, something was done;

drastic measures were taken against members for it, within

the law now.

Q. I am informed by the Commissioner's team, and I have seen 29

some documents, that, in fact, there appears to be a

documented meeting with Mr. Hurst in 2004, but it was

attended by Chief Superintendent O'Sullivan and

Superintendent Kelly.

A. Chief Superintendent Kelly and Detective Superintendent

O'Sullivan. Mr. O'Sullivan replaced me in the position I

was in and Mr. Kelly replaced Mr. Walsh in Special

Detective Unit. So they were the people who would have

been tasked to go back to see him, but we never met him in

2004. He never mentioned anything to me about

Mr. Corrigan. The names that he mentioned to me are

clearly identified in the reports that are before the

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Tribunal.

Q. And the fact that you had been replaced by Chief 30

Superintendent O'Sullivan and Superintendent Kelly, and

they were now having a meeting with Ian Hurst, would, in

the normal course of events, it be expected that they might

come to you to ask you, "What about this chap? You have

interviewed him before"? Or to ask you to attend the

meeting?

A. Certainly, if they needed to be briefed before the meeting

with Mr. Hurst, they should have come to me, but in the

circumstances of this case, I had created a number of

reports, three reports: one that went to the Commissioner

and one that stayed in the Superintendent's office in SDU -

that's the Special Detective Unit - and one that stayed in

the Chief Superintendent's office. So all the knowledge

that I had in relation to Mr. Hurst would have been

available to them in the offices they occupied at that

time.

Q. And would they have had access to the special report that 31

you prepared in relation to the allegations about the

identity of 'Stakeknife'?

A. Yes.

Q. They would have seen that before? 32

A. They would have seen that. In fact, that report was in the

safe in the Chief Superintendent's office in the Special

Detective Unit.

Q. So can I say that, basically what you are saying is that, 33

in the course of your meetings with Mr. Hurst, he mentioned

various Gardaí and people that he said were giving evidence

to FRU, but despite being pressed by you, no names were

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forthcoming from him?

A. The only person that he identified specifically was

Mr. Scappaticci.

Q. And I assume you would have pressed him hard in relation to 34

the identity of the other --

A. Indeed, that would be a very apt assessment of what we did.

Q. And so, you didn't meet him, you are saying, in 2004, 35

because you had moved on and you had been replaced --

A. I had moved on to do other duties at that stage, Chairman,

and I had no connection with security policing at all.

Q. And you said that Mr. Corrigan's name was never raised, by 36

you or by him, in the course of the meetings?

A. No, no, Chairman, indeed, no.

MRS. LAVERTY: Thank you very much, Mr. Maguire.

THE WITNESS WAS CROSS-EXAMINED BY MR. DURACK AS FOLLOWS:

Q. MR. DURACK: Just to confirm a number of dates. I think 37

the first meeting in Carrick was the 11th of January?

A. It was in January, that's 2000, yes.

Q. I think that was in his own house? 38

A. Yes.

Q. I think the second meeting then that you were part of was 39

on the 8th February, 2000, and that was in Waterford Garda

Station?

A. That's correct.

Q. I think the file reveals that after the publication of his 40

book, 'Stakeknife', that there is a report from Detective

Superintendent O'Sullivan and Detective Inspector Kelly

relating to a meeting of the 9th July, 2004, that they had

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with him?

A. Yes - well, I had recently became aware of the fact that

there was a meeting with him on the 9th July, yes.

Q. And you were not at it? 41

A. No, I was not.

THE WITNESS WAS CROSS-EXAMINED BY MR. O'CALLAGHAN

AS FOLLOWS:

Q. MR. O'CALLAGHAN: Mr. Maguire, I appear for Mr. Corrigan. 42

I have a couple of short questions for you. One other

thing that Mr. Hurst said was, he said that at the meeting

with yourself and Mr. Walsh, one of you mentioned to him

that Mr. Corrigan had, to use his expression, "mental

problems". Did you ever say that?

A. Absolutely not. In fact, as I said, I didn't mention

Mr. Corrigan's name, and neither did Mr. Hurst, at any of

our encounters.

Q. Do you recall Mr. Walsh ever referring to -- 43

A. Never, Chairman, never.

Q. He also said that you asked him at the meeting about the 44

Tom Oliver murder. Do you recall that?

A. No, I don't, Chairman. In fact, I recall that I did not

mention it to him. I recall every issue that I raised with

Mr. Hurst, which has been documented pretty comprehensively

and, I hope, accurately, and, certainly, the matters that I

have given evidence to here before this Tribunal are the

only matters that I raised with Mr. Hurst.

Q. You mentioned, Mr. Maguire, that your initial view about 45

Mr. Hurst was that he had approached you and the Garda

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Siochana because he had a concern for his safety and

security.

A. Yes.

Q. What do you now believe, when you have had an opportunity 46

to review all of Mr. Hurst's involvement with writing books

and giving what we say -- I say is false evidence to this

Tribunal, what do you now believe was his motivation?

A. I think that -- I don't want to be uncharitable towards

Mr. Hurst, indeed, and I don't intend to be, but I think

the scale of release and the sensationalism that has been

associated with it, certainly has changed my mind about the

initial reasons why he wanted to speak to members of the

Garda Siochana, and he certainly seems to be somebody who

is deriving benefit financially, or otherwise, from his

trafficking in these materials from his time in the

security services.

MR. O'CALLAGHAN: Thanks, Mr. Maguire.

CHAIRMAN: Any other questions?

MR. COFFEY: No questions.

THE WITNESS WAS CROSS-EXAMINED BY MS. FITZGERALD

AS FOLLOWS:

MS. FITZGERALD: I appear for Mr. Scappaticci.

A. I am sorry, you are a long journey away.

Q. Just one quick matter. You'll be aware that my client has 47

always denied the allegations that are contained in the

statement?

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A. Oh, yes, I am aware from what I have read in the

newspapers, but I'm afraid I never met your client or never

spoke to your client and he never contacted me, directly or

otherwise.

MS. FITZGERALD: Thank you, Mr. Maguire.

A. Thank you very much.

CHAIRMAN: Any other questions? Any re-examination?

MRS. LAVERTY: No re-examination.

CHAIRMAN: Very well. Thank you very much, Mr. Maguire. I

am grateful to you for coming.

THE WITNESS THEN WITHDREW.

MRS. LAVERTY: The next witness I think is at --

CHAIRMAN: I have an idea that he won't be here at two.

CHAIRMAN: I thought three.

MRS. LAVERTY: Not before three. I stand corrected,

Chairman.

CHAIRMAN: Very well, three o'clock then, the next witness.

Thank you.

THE TRIBUNAL ADJOURNED FOR LUNCH.

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THE TRIBUNAL CONTINUED AFTER LUNCH AS FOLLOWS:

MR. DILLON: We have one witness for you this afternoon,

who is Mr. Conor Hanlon, please.

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CONOR HANLON, HAVING BEEN SWORN, WAS EXAMINED BY MR. DILLON

AS FOLLOWS:

Q. MR. DILLON: You work for Pfizer Ireland, isn't that right? 48

A. That's correct.

Q. How long have you worked for that company? 49

A. 15 years.

Q. In what capacity? 50

A. I am currently the security director for EMEA.

Q. Currently. How long have you held that function? 51

A. Since 20002.

Q. Since 2002. And prior to that, what did you do? 52

A. I was the EHS manager.

Q. That is the? 53

A. External Health and Safety Manager.

Q. I see. So they are the two functions that you have 54

occupied when employed by Pfizer, isn't that right?

A. Yes, sir.

Q. And when you say you are the security manager, just in 55

broad outline, what does that entail in terms of your

duties?

A. That entails looking after the people, the product and the

property.

Q. When you say "look after", how do you look after them? 56

A. Well, you know, you ensure that the people that enter the

facility are -- have authorisation to enter the facility.

You look after the property in ensuring the physical

security elements, electronic security elements and the

procedural security elements, and then look after the

product in both the manufacturing and the shipping of the

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product.

Q. Very good, OK. I am asking until you were contacted, had 57

you followed at all the workings of the Tribunal?

A. Just what's on the media.

Q. Fair enough. I think you were approached by a Detective 58

Inspector Heneghan, do you remember that?

A. That's correct, yes, I received a phone call on a Friday

evening.

Q. Roughly, when was that phone call? 59

A. That was the last day of January.

Q. Of this year? 60

A. Of this year, 2012.

Q. Have you ever dealt with this Detective Inspector before? 61

A. No, sir.

Q. This is like a cold call, is that right? 62

A. Yes, we had received information through our legal counsel

that the -- these are my notes --

Q. There is no difficulty about that at all. 63

A. We had -- Deirdre O'Sullivan, Pfizer legal counsel,

contacted me asking that there was an inquiry regarding a

theft of Viagra from Pfizer and could I assist, that she

had received a call from Mary Cummins from the Chief

solicitor's office.

Q. OK. Just to be quite clear, the sequence of events. So it 64

was Pfizer's legal counsel who was approached in the first

instance, is that right?

A. Yes, correct.

Q. And that was an approach through the Chief State 65

Solicitor's Office, isn't that right?

A. That is the information I have.

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Q. OK. And then this gentleman got in touch with you, is that 66

right?

A. Yes, she asked, Deirdre O'Sullivan, our legal counsel,

asked could she provide my telephone number and I said she

could, and she did, and I received a phone call.

Q. And that is when, it's on foot of that that you received 67

the phone call?

A. On the Friday evening I received the phone call asking that

could I assist the Tribunal and I would be in a position to

give a statement at Carrigaline Garda station.

Q. Did you ever meet the Detective Inspector? 68

A. No, sir.

Q. So it was entirely telephone communication? 69

A. Yes, sir.

Q. And he asked to you assist the Tribunal, is that right? 70

A. Yes, he explained to me did I know about the Tribunal. I

said I knew about it through media coverage. He gave me

some background to the Tribunal and asked me I would be in

a position to give a statement on a theft of Viagra from

Pfizer.

Q. Do you remember what he said by way of background to the 71

Tribunal?

A. No, sir, I can't.

Q. All right. OK. In your statement to the Tribunal, you 72

said that you understood Detective Inspector to mean that

he was acting on behalf of the Tribunal, is that right?

A. That's correct, sir.

Q. Very well. Then, what was the nature -- did you make the 73

next contact or was the next contact made by the Gardaí?

A. D/Sergeant Pat Murphy -- the detective informed me that I

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would receive a phone call from somebody from the guards on

the Saturday morning. I did receive a phone call on

Saturday morning, approximately 10 o'clock from a Sergeant

Pat Murphy and he asked me could I meet him to give a

statement. I said I could either meet him in Carrigaline

Garda Station or I can meet him in Anglesea Street in Cork,

and he said, look, it suits him so we arranged to meet at

two o'clock in Carrigaline Garda Station.

Q. Very well. You arrived and what, you were taken into a 74

room, is that the idea?

A. Yes, taken into Carrigaline Garda Station, into one of the

witness rooms, and Sergeant Murphy explained the background

and he asked me would I be in a position to give a

statement on behalf of Pfizer Ireland.

Q. Yes. And were you asked to subscribe to a declaration as 75

to the veracity of the statement?

A. Sorry, sir, can you clarify?

Q. It was drawn to your attention that you declared that your 76

statement to the guards was true to the best of your

knowledge and belief?

A. Yes, sir.

Q. And that portion of the document was read out to you, was 77

it?

A. Yes, sir.

Q. Very well. Now, Mr. Mills, could you put the first 78

document up. And if you just -- if you go to page 2,

please. You see where it says "signed" at the bottom. Is

that your signature?

A. Yes, sir.

Q. If you put the next document up, Mr. Mills, please. Now, 79

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this is the typed version, which I will read out, and if

you listen and confirm if I make any mistake.

So this is your statement. Your occupation is Senior

Security Manager and it was taken on 4th of February at

Carrigaline by Pat Murphy, D/Sergeant Pat Murphy and it

begins:

"I hereby declare that this statement is true to the

best of my knowledge and belief and I make it knowing that

if it is tendered in evidence I will be liable to

prosecution if I state in it anything which I know to be

false or do not believe to be true.

I am based at the Pfizer plant in Ringaskiddy, County Cork.

I have been made aware of evidence supplied to the

Smithwick Tribunal in relation to an illegal theft of 1

million tablets from Pfizer. I can say that Pfizer Ireland

do not and never did manufacture the finished product of

Viagra in Ireland. In the year 2000, the Pfizer plants in

Ireland, and there are six manufacturing plants, only

produced the finished powder and active pharmaceutical

ingredients for all products. The Cork plant only stored

Viagra in powder format, never the finished tablet. The

Viagra powder now, and in 2000, would be stored and leave

the plants in 50 to 100 kilo drums. The powder would be

shipped via Rosslare or Dublin to Freiburg, Germany or..."

A. "... Amboise..."

Q. "... or Amboise in France, where final packaging and 80

distribution would be completed. I say that Pfizer Ireland

have no record of an inquiry in the year 2000, or

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subsequently, by An Garda Siochana in relation to such a

large theft of Viagra. I can say that there is no recorded

theft of Viagra tablets in Ireland. I will check outside

the jurisdiction in relation to theft of such a large

amount of Viagra and supply the Gardaí with such

information, but I have no knowledge of such a large

amount. I have worked with Pfizer for 15 years.

This statement has been read over to me and is correct."

And it's signed by yourself and witnessed by Sergeant

Murphy. That is the correct account of your statement, is

it?

A. Yes.

Q. Now, I think you told us that you were in charge of 81

security; it was from 2002 onwards?

A. 2002, post-9/11.

Q. Exactly, yes. Now, this relates to an inquiry in the year 82

2000?

A. Yes, sir.

Q. Before you went to Carrigaline Garda Station, had you any 83

idea about what you were going to be asked or what you were

going --

A. Only what I was told on the Friday evening when I received

the initial phone call.

Q. And what were you told? 84

A. It was to do with the supposed theft of Viagra tablets from

the Ringaskiddy plant as part of the Tribunal.

Q. Very well. Now, were you given a date for the alleged 85

theft?

A. No, sir.

Q. So the first you heard about it being in 2000 was when you 86

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turned up in Ringaskiddy, is that right?

A. That's correct, sir.

Q. Now, you have been in the security side of the business, if 87

I can put it that way from, the year 2002. So what was

your state of knowledge for what might or might not have

happened in 2000?

A. Well, sir, as part of my role as EHS Manager, I also

supported security on the sites, and we had a very close

EHS management committee across all the sites in Cork and

if a theft of this would have occurred, I would have known

about it.

Q. As something that would come to your attention? 88

A. Yes.

Q. In your previous capacity?89

A. In my previous capacity.

Q. Very good. Now, bear with me a second. You say at the 90

beginning there: "I have been made aware of evidence

supplied to the Smithwick Tribunal." What does that refer

to, can you tell us?

A. The statement was read out to me by Sergeant Pat Murphy

regarding a statement that had been from the Tribunal from

a witness, I believe Number 71, claiming that he had

possession of Viagra tablets that were stolen from Pfizer

Ringaskiddy plant.

Q. So this was the statement, is that right? 91

A. Yes, sir, part of the statement.

Q. And it wasn't the transcript of the evidence given by -- 92

A. Well, a transcript of the evidence that was presented to

the Tribunal.

Q. So it was the transcript rather than the statement? 93

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A. That's right, one page.

Q. OK. Now, Mr. Mills, if you put up the next document, which 94

should be 13th of December at page 80. Does this strike a

bell? If you begin at line 6 there. You have the document

in front of you. Begin at line 6. Now, this, I can tell

you, is the Witness 71, and to put it in context: Witness

71 is a retired member of the RUC. He was in the criminal

Investigation Branch, CID branch, and one of his functions

was to handle agents, Mr. Keeley -- sorry, just focus on

the first page, the second page is a different matter; you

will confuse yourself. And the witness was the handler of

Peter Keeley, you understand that?

A. Yes, sir.

Q. So he was asked, and this is 13th of December on page 80, 95

starting at line 6:

"And I think that subsequently Mr. Keeley" -- that is the

name of the agent -- "supplied you with certain information

relating to the theft of Viagra tablets in Pfizer in Cork?

Answer: That's correct.

Question: And they provided you with a sample tablet?

Answer: That's correct.

Question: I believe you passed this to the Garda fraud

Squad.

Answer: I did, and they were able to identify that as one

of their tablets but it was not yet issued on the market."

Now, going back to your statement, you say that Pfizer

produced only the finished powder and active pharmaceutical

ingredients.

A. Yes, sir.

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Q. The tablets are made elsewhere, is that the idea? 96

A. Correct.

Q. And they are packaged and sent back for sale in Ireland? 97

A. Correct.

Q. Are they sent back through Pfizer Ireland for distribution? 98

A. No, no they are sent back to distribution companies, like

United Drug, Cahill May Roberts, other distribution

companies.

Q. Very well. Now, could I ask you, then, to go to the next 99

page, which is 14th of December, page 114. Now, this I can

tell you, is the evidence of Peter Keeley, and if you begin

at line 8:

"At this time 'Mooch' Blair had come to me. They had

access to one million Viagra tablets held in a secure store

in the Irish Republic. Now, at that time Viagra tablets

sold for £10 a tablet on the black-market, and I told him I

had someone, a drug dealer, again it didn't exist, from

London who would give him £5 per tablet.

Question: This was for the Real IRA?

Answer: Right. But I said I need samples. Again, I

reported this to the CID and my handler" -- that's Witness

71, we assume -- "says get samples, so 'Mooch' did get

samples. He had a blister pack of four but two were taken

out of it so he gave me the blister pack and the serial

number was still on it. I gave that to my handler and then

he did his inquiries and came back that, yes..." "He must

have been to the Pfizer company and they confirmed that

this stuff was theirs. It was not in circulation and at

that time [a certain person] was trying to organise an

operation to do a sting to arrest Blair..." -- Mr. Blair

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was the object of the sting.

Now, here there is a slightly different presentation, in

that it is the blister packs, so that, presumably, is the

product wrapped up in the --

A. Yes, sir.

Q. -- in the way that it's sold, isn't that right? 100

A. Correct.

Q. And he says that it came from a source. So, going with 101

that, and I appreciate you can't say yea or nay as to

whether it's correct or not, but if that is correct, that

means going with the possibility that this might have come

from one of your distribution centres, is that right?

A. He could have brought this any from anywhere, sir. If you

had a prescription to buy Viagra, you can buy Viagra.

Q. But he is talking in terms of a million tablets, assuming 102

that figure is correct. One has to make certain

assumptions here but let's just go with it that it's

correct. If all this is correct, and again it's a big

'if', then it came from a distribution centre rather than

from Pfizer in one of its premises in Cork or wherever?

A. I can't say where it came from because I don't know that

there was one million tablets. We have not a recording of

one million tablets missing from any one of our

facilities --

Q. That's fine? 103

A. -- or distribution centres.

Q. That's of assistance. I am putting all these points to you 104

to see how you can assist the Chairman in assessing this

evidence. So, is it the case that -- I will start again.

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Was there ever a moment when there were, let's say, a

million Viagra tablets somewhere in Ireland in storage?

A. No. I couldn't say whether it was a million stored but we

never had a loss of a million recorded --

Q. That's fine. 105

A. -- in Pfizer.

Q. And when you say "we" that applies to you -- 106

A. That is Pfizer the corporation. Believe me, that would

make headlines in we had a million.

Q. I understand that, but do you include in that your 107

distribution companies as well?

A. Yes, sir.

Q. OK. 108

A. Any loss or theft of our product we are automatically

informed of.

Q. That's fine. Now, I can tell you that that was evidence 109

given when he was examined by counsel for the Tribunal. If

you take the next piece, Mr. Mills, it's 15th of December,

starting at page 153. And then this is what Mr. Keeley

said under cross-examination. If you start at line 14:

"He thought I was dealing with drug dealers but of course I

knew drug dealers because I was hanging them to the police

and Customs. He said he had access to a million Viagra

tablets so I says 'right.' I told 71" -- that's the

handler -- "that 'Mooch' had access to a million Viagra

tablets. So at that time they were selling on the black

market for £10 a tablet, so I told my friend, the drug

dealer, a rich guy in England would come over and give him

£5 per tablet but he needed a sample. So I remember I got

a blister pack off 'Mooch', it was a four-pack with

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blisters but two tablets were missing. So I handed the

sample to 71, my handler, and he checked this out; it must

have been with the Garda and everybody else, and the

factory."

Now, if I just stop there for a second. Here, it shifts

slightly in that Mr. Blair, the object of the sting, is

saying that he has access to a million. In other words, it

isn't the case that a million were actually stolen.

Possibly. Again we have to go on the hypothesis. Is it

possible that -- it comes back to my earlier question, was

therefore a time when there was in or about a million of

the tablets in Ireland?

A. I can't say, sir.

Q. OK. 110

A. Tablets are sold in a packet of four.

Q. Yes.111

A. So you could have up to a million tablets in storage,

potentially. I find it hard, but you could, potentially,

have a million tablets.

Q. Very good. If you go to page 154, at line 2: 112

"Question: Did you understand that 'Mooch' already was in

possession of these items?

Answer: No, no, 'Mooch' said he had access to them so he

got me a sample... The things were in secure storage, so

they had access to the secure storage."

If that is correct, that presumably refers to your

distribution centres, is that correct, or distribution

operatives? You see that there in line 6?

A. Yes, sir. At different stages all our distribution

companies would carry a lot of tablets, not just for us,

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for all companies. So, I can not say whether there was a

million tablets stored at any facility in Ireland during

that period.

Q. You see, the information that you were given by the Gardaí, 113

going back now to page 80, was that it related to the theft

of Viagra tablets from Pfizer in Cork, do you see that?

A. Yes, sir. I can certainly say, sir, that there was never a

million tablets of Viagra stored in the Pfizer Ringaskiddy

plant.

Q. No, no, just bear with me a second now. I am actually 114

wrapping up now, if just let me wrap up. The information

you were given was the evidence given by Witness 71?

A. Correct, sir.

Q. Which was that he said -- "and subsequently Mr. Keeley 115

supplied you with certain information relating to the theft

of Viagra tablets from Pfizer in Cork." Then when you look

to see what Mr. Keeley said in evidence, what he was

purporting was that this person who was to have been stung,

if I can put it that way, had access; in other words, it

hadn't actually been stolen but he had access. Do you

see -- you see a distinction, don't you?

A. Yes.

Q. Very well. OK. In the year 2000, what was the position 116

with Viagra in the year 2000, just to wrap up on that?

A. The Viagra went on the market. It was for sale and public

distribution on a prescription in Ireland.

Q. I think you said in your statement it was launched in 117

Ireland in 1997, isn't that right?

A. Correct, sir.

Q. Yes. Thank you. 118

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THE WITNESS WAS CROSS-EXAMINED BY MR. DURACK AS FOLLOWS:

Q. MR. DURACK: If I may just ask you a few questions. My 119

name is Michael Durack and I appear on behalf of An Garda

Siochana. You told us you got a statement or a transcript

of the evidence given by Mr. Keeley?

A. Correct, sir.

Q. How many pages did you get in transcript or? 120

A. The Garda actually literally showed me that and he then

read it out to me.

Q. Which one is that? 121

MR. DILLON: My understanding, we need to be clear on this,

it was the evidence of Witness 71 that was brought to you?

A. It was these pages, correct, sir.

MR. DILLON: Page 80?

A. Page 80 and page 114.

MR. DILLON: Both those pages were brought to you?

A. Were shown to me and then they were read out to me.

MR. DURACK: The witness has two more pages in his hand.

Can you just tell us what numbers they are?

A. They were just handed to me now.

Q. So they were just handed to you now?122

A. Yeah.

Q. So you got --123

A. I didn't get them, sir, I was shown them on the day and

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they were read out to me.

Q. I appreciate that. And just to be clear for the record, 124

they are which ones, the ones which were read out to you?

A. Number 80 and page 114.

Q. And page 114. Now, I think we all know Pfizer is a very 125

large operation?

A. Correct, sir.

Q. And your evidence is that basically the powder is 126

manufactured here, it's transported in large quantities as

powder, and then whatever is needed for the Irish market

comes back to the Irish market?

A. Correct.

Q. Is that right? And while Pfizer itself doesn't distribute 127

it, how many distributors are there?

A. We would -- in Ireland, we would have two main

distributors.

Q. Two main ones, and that would be United Drug? 128

A. United Drug and Cahill May Roberts.

Q. And Cahill May Roberts. And at that stage, without giving 129

away any trade secrets, what would the sort of annual sales

of Viagra have been in Ireland, have you any idea?

A. Off the top of my head, I can't -- I don't know that. I

can find out but I don't know.

Q. We have -- at the moment, we have a population of 130

four-and-a-half million, and presumably half of them are

female, and an awful lot of them would be very young. But

I take it that the tablets, in the ordinary course of

events, coming back into your distributors, would be

delivered on a monthly basis or some such thing; people

aren't carrying years of stock?

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A. No, sir. They would be on supply and demand to our

wholesalers.

Q. Yes. So on some sort of a monthly or a regular turn-around 131

basis?

A. Yes.

Q. Mr. Keeley talks of them being selling for £10. Was that 132

the sort of value they were?

A. It could be anywhere from £5 up to £10, depending -- on the

black-market.

Q. I am talking on the legitimate market, what sort of money 133

were they?

A. I don't know off the top of my head. I can inquire and

find out for you.

Q. You said you are the Security Director, I think, for EMEA. 134

Am I right in understanding that that means Europe, Middle

East and?

A. Africa.

Q. Africa. So you have a very broad remit? 135

A. Correct, sir.

Q. And I think you told us that you would expect that the 136

company would be advised if there had been any loss of such

tablets, particularly given the value of them, I imagine?

A. Of course. Any losses that we have in any country, we are

notified and we have a system of notification through our

distributors -- distributing companies so we would know of

any loss es.

Q. And, presumably, they are all security coded in some way, 137

or at least there is some way of tracking them, or is

there?

A. Well, every batch would have a lot number so we can track

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them through a lot number.

Q. That's what I thought. And as far as you are concerned in 138

any case, that there was no loss of any such significant --

A. There was no loss. there was no inquiry made to us.

Q. And I know we have talked about a million tablets but was 139

there any significant loss anywhere in Ireland?

A. There has been a loss in the last ten years, and that was

in the value of about 32 boxes of Viagra.

Q. I see. That is not a very significant amount? 140

A. Not a very significant amount, no.

Q. Thank you very much indeed. 141

CHAIRMAN: Any other questions?

MR. ROBINSON: Yes, sir.

THE WITNESS WAS CROSS-EXAMINED BY MR. ROBINSON AS FOLLOWS:

MR. ROBINSON: My name is Mark Robinson and I appear be on

half of the PSNI. Firstly, can I address, you mentioned

that there were two distribution companies?

A. Correct.

Q. Is that for the whole of Ireland or just for the south? 142

A. That is for the Republic.

Q. OK. And do you deal with security in relation to any 143

facilities in the north?

A. We have no facilities in north, sir.

Q. OK. Did the distributors have any in the north? 144

A. United Drug from the UK would have a distribution centre in

Northern Ireland.

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Q. And would it have stored Viagra tablets? 145

A. It would have.

Q. And the storage facilities in the Republic, how many -- how 146

many did the distribution companies have in the south?

A. We have -- Cahill May Roberts, I believe, have three: one

in Dublin, Cork and Limerick; and United Drug have one

based in Dublin.

Q. And do you retain any records regarding how much of your 147

product they store at these facilities?

A. Yes, sir, we would.

Q. And are those facilities used for this -- now I am talking 148

about the tablets when they are in the finished form and

they are brought back into the country, are they

distributed only to the Republic from those facilities or

are they shipped out overseas from those facilities?

A. It's my knowledge most of those companies would not have

the licence to ship abroad.

Q. And size wise and order wise, would they distribute into 149

the UK from those facilities?

A. To the best of my knowledge, sir, I don't think they do.

Q. And can I ask you this: when you were first approached by 150

way of telephone call, can you tell the Tribunal exactly

what words were said to you?

A. The Superintendent introduced himself to me, said that he

was phoning me on behalf of the Tribunal and regarding a

theft of a million tablets of Viagra from the Ringaskiddy

plant and would I be in a position to give a statement

regarding that theft.

Q. So it was on behalf of the Tribunal? 151

A. Yes.

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Q. And the next day, when you went along to make the 152

statement -- sorry, there was a second phone call and that

was on the Saturday?

A. No, the Saturday was just basically with the Sergeant

trying to tie up a time for the meeting.

Q. Yes. And when you attended the station to make the 153

statement, what were you told about how that officer was

acting on behalf of the Tribunal?

A. The officer told me he was acting on behalf of a

superintendent and would I be in a position to give a

statement on behalf of Pfizer Ireland.

Q. I have no further questions, sir. 154

THE WITNESS WAS CROSS-EXAMINED BY MR. SMITH AS FOLLOWS:

MR. SMITH: I appear on behalf of Mr. Keeley. I only have

a few points for you because My Learned Friend on behalf of

the Tribunal has really addressed most of relevant matters.

Just to confirm. You have heard some of the evidence that

has been read out from the transcript. You can confirm

that the packs of the tablets comes in fours, isn't that

correct?

A. Correct.

Q. And that of course is what was contained in Mr. Keeley's 155

evidence of the transcript that was read out to you, that

there was a blister pack of four tablets, and that's

correct?

A. Correct.

Q. And you'd also, then, confirm that there are -- there is a 156

serial number, and that that can be tracked, is that right?

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A. Correct.

Q. And you are aware, having been shown Witness 71's evidence 157

in the matter, that he says when he was provided with a

sample, being the handler for Mr. Keeley, that he passed

this information to Garda Fraud Squad and he said "I did

and they were able to identify it as one of their tablets

but it was not yet issued on the market." You are

obviously, I take it, not in a position today to contradict

Witness 71's evidence, namely that he told the Gardaí, or

that he got feedback in relation to that the tablets seemed

to be one of theirs but not yet issued on the market?

A. I am not in a position to confirm or deny that.

Q. Would it be also fair to say that, really, the thrust of 158

your evidence today was that you, effectively, in your

inquiries that you undertook, you were looking to see

whether there had been a record of a theft of a very large

amount of tablets?

A. Correct.

Q. But, of course, it's been pointed out to you, and I think 159

this is on -- if you look again at page 60 -- it's Day 66,

I think it's page 114, I think that this, to a large

extent, most of it has been read out to you, and I am just

picking it up in the middle. He says, "... right, I says,

but I need samples. Again, I reported this to the CID and

my handler said get samples, so 'Mooch' did get samples, he

had a blister pack of four but two were taken out of it so

he gave me the blister pack and the serial number was still

on it. I gave that to my handler and he then did his

inquiries and it came back that, yes; he must have been to

the Pfizer company" -- this is obviously conjecture on the

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part of Mr. Keeley -- "and they confirmed that this stuff

was theirs. It was not in circulation and at the time

[deleted] was trying to organise an operation to do a sting

and arrest Blair and these people who were going to rob

these tablets."

And you will see it goes on and that was actually stopped

and for one reason or another the sting operation was

effectively halted. You have obviously given a statement

and very helpfully come to the Tribunal today, but isn't it

right to say your focus has been to concentrate as to

whether there had been an actual completed theft?

A. Correct.

Q. And insofar as what Mr. Keeley actually said was that he 160

was talking about a prospective theft, and, in fact, his

role, as it were, would be to ostensibly provide a buyer

for this person who was meant to be carrying out the

operation, and that was obviously halted. I take it, then,

you didn't make any inquiries in relation to prospective or

intended matters; indeed, you mightn't even find out about

that?

A. Well, I can't tell what is going to happen tomorrow.

Q. No. 161

A. If I could, I would be a millionaire. No, we had no

recorded thefts or losses of that at any stage.

Q. Yes. 162

CHAIRMAN: So if somebody planned a theft, it didn't

actually take place?

A. No, sir. Just the product was on the market in 1997.

Q. MR. SMITH: Yes. And just finally then, Witness 71 has 163

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been able to give evidence; in addition to him saying that

he was given the sample tablet, he said that that was

passed to the fraud squad, the Garda fraud squad, and, as I

say, they'd indicated that they were able to identify the

tablet and, also, that it was not yet issued on the market.

Would you agree with me that that seems to be two specific

pieces of information in relation to that tablet; namely,

that it was genuine, and, secondly, that it wasn't yet on

the market.

A. It is two specific pieces of information, but the tablet

was on the market at that stage.

Q. And you can't say, one way or another, and it's completely 164

understandable, as to how or when Witness 71 got that

information?

A. I can't, I can't say.

Q. And again, you can't contradict that that wasn't passed on 165

to the Garda fraud squad, or anything of that nature?

A. I can tell you that Pfizer had no inquiries from the

Garda --

Q. In relation to an actual theft?166

A. -- in relation to a theft or a sample of tablet, and we

work very closely with the Garda.

CHAIRMAN: Anything arising?

THE WITNESS WAS RE-EXAMINED BY MR. DILLON AS FOLLOWS:

Q. MR. DILLON: Just to be quite clear on a matter. When I 167

was asking you the questions, I was under the impression

that what had been shown to you by Sergeant Murphy was page

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80. The 13th of December, page 80.

A. There was two pages shown to me.

Q. No, no. Just bear with me. In reply to My Friend, 168

Mr. Durack, you said, in addition, you were shown page 114,

is that right?

A. Yes.

Q. All right. Now, in your statement to Sergeant Murphy, you 169

say: "I have been made aware of evidence supplied to the

Smithwick Tribunal in relation to an illegal theft of one

million tablets from Pfizer." You see that?

A. Correct.

Q. OK. Just help the Chairman with this: Page 80 seems to 170

refer to a theft; it uses the word "theft". And I think

the point being teased out by My Friend was that --

Mr. Smith, was that this may be an anticipated theft rather

than a theft that occurred. Do you get my --

A. I do, sir.

Q. Because, you see, on page 114, all that is mentioned is 171

that it is alleged that 'Mooch' -- 'Mooch' Blair had access

to the tablets, not that he had actually stolen them; do

you follow that?

A. Yes, sir.

Q. So, it's quite possible that when you were informed that 172

there was evidence that there was an illegal theft of one

million tablets from Pfizer, that, quite accidentally, you

were given the wrong information; that, possibly, what was

being spoken about was the fact that 'Mooch' Blair had

access to a million tablets?

A. But I can't say where he had access to these million

tablets and if he did have access to these million tablets.

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Q. Of course not, and we are not suggesting that. It's just 173

the two concepts: one is having access to the tablets and

the other is having stolen them, which is two different

ideas?

A. Yes.

Q. Whereas in your statement you refer to the allegation that 174

it was -- there actually had been a theft?

A. Correct.

Q. OK. Whereas you don't deal with the suggestion that 175

'Mooch' Blair had access. Now, I appreciate you might not

know that, but that is what was dealt with in page 114,

isn't that right, which is a different concept?

A. Correct, sir.

MR. ROBINSON: Chairman, just one matter to clarify. Was

Sergeant Murphy acting on behalf of the Tribunal?

CHAIRMAN: Well, the answer is, of course, he wasn't. I

mean, nobody -- people who act on behalf of the Tribunal

are my legal team and the office staff in the building. So

Sergeant Murphy was not acting -- or the Inspector who made

the telephone call was not acting on behalf of the

Tribunal.

MR. ROBINSON: My point then is, sir, that an explanation,

in my view, should be provided as to why a member of the

public was under the impression that they were being

inquired -- inquiries were being made on behalf of this

Tribunal.

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CHAIRMAN: Well, I think that doesn't concern this witness.

Is there any other question to the witness?

MR. ROBINSON: Two further points. Witness 80 referred to

a reference to the Garda fraud squad, and I wonder if a

witness is going to be proffered in relation to whether or

not that contact took place, and, also --

MR. DILLON: Witness 80?

MR. ROBINSON: Sorry, Witness 71, referred to on page 80 of

the transcript, to contact with the Garda fraud squad, and

I wonder if a witness is to be proffered in relation to

that aspect, and, also, an explanation as to why these

matters were not raised earlier and when Witness 71 was

giving his evidence.

MR. DILLON: Well, now, I just make one point at this

stage. I mean, with respect to Mr. Robinson, he has asked

questions that he needs to ask, but when it comes to who we

are going to call and if we are going to call people, that

is a matter in which we make up our own minds, if I may say

so, Chairman, and I say that with respect to Mr. Robinson.

I think he understands our position.

CHAIRMAN: I will deal with that afterwards, Mr. Robinson,

but, first of all, this witness, I think -- have you

finished with the questions?

MR. DURACK: Just one thing that might be of assistance;

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just while I asked the question, I didn't follow it

through. I was inquiring about the size of the Irish

market, and he said he would be in a position to provide

that information and --

CHAIRMAN: Is that very important?

MR. DURACK: Well, I only say it because he said that,

usually, these things are ordered on a monthly basis, so

there might not be a quarter of a million in stock

anywhere.

CHAIRMAN: We can't go endlessly on looking at the Viagra

market in Ireland, interesting though that subject may be.

MR. DURACK: I am not suggesting that. I merely thought

that he might be in a position to let you have a letter in

relation to it.

MR. DILLON: Well, this million is a suggestion apparently

made by Mr. Blair. I think that puts it in context.

CHAIRMAN: I don't think that we have to verify that. I

want to say to Mr. Hanlon, I want to thank him very much

for coming, if nobody has any further questions to ask him.

Thank you very much for coming, we are grateful for the

help that we have received from various witnesses, and you

are one of them. It was important that we had you here.

Thank you very much for coming. Safe home.

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THE WITNESS THEN WITHDREW.

CHAIRMAN: Now, Mr. Robinson, I just wanted to let

Mr. Hanlon away, but you are making the point that -- well,

the point you were making, first of all, that the guard

said he was acting on behalf of the Tribunal. He wasn't.

MR. ROBINSON: My point is that, in my view, an explanation

should be provided to you, sir, as to how that member of

the public, a witness today, was under that impression.

CHAIRMAN: Well, first of all, since Mr. Robinson has asked

it, Mr. Durack, I think that nobody should say they were

acting on behalf of the Tribunal if they weren't, not that

anything huge turns on it, but I am very grateful that

Mr. Hanlon came to give evidence today, but you might

perhaps look into that matter and you could mention it on

Tuesday morning next.

MR. DURACK: I can tell you, in fact, the reason -- the

reason for the connection, in fact, arose, because my

solicitor shares the membership of a committee with the law

agent for Pfizer, and asked the question, and, as a result

of asking the question, that is how, ultimately, the

information was provided. But if the impression was

created that it was by -- on behalf of the Tribunal, of

course we apologise for that. It was merely a matter for

checking --

CHAIRMAN: Thank you very much. I am grateful to

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Ms. Cummins for using her good offices. It was important

that the witness came in today.

MR. ROBINSON: So, to be clear, the witness said that he

was told the officer was acting on behalf of the Tribunal.

CHAIRMAN: He shouldn't have been told, and Mr. Durack has

apologised if such a suggestion was made.

MR. ROBINSON: And a following point is this: If

My Friend's solicitor is keen to track down evidence

regarding the Pfizer issue, is a witness from the Garda

fraud office or fraud squad to be provided in relation to

the contact with Witness 71? Because this witness,

apparently, was brought along to try and discredit the

evidence regarding the Viagra issue, and that's not only

touching upon Kevin Fulton's evidence but also Witness 71's

evidence.

MR. DILLON: This comes back, and I am sure Mr. Robinson

understands this, we take on board points but we just don't

discuss what we intend to do by way of our investigation in

public, we don't discuss that, but Mr. Robinson, I am sure,

he will understand this. We have taken on board his point

and it won't be forgotten.

MR. ROBINSON: I am obliged, sir.

CHAIRMAN: Thank you very much. Well, now, that concludes

the evidence for today.

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MR. DILLON: And the next sitting, it will be Tuesday at

11 o'clock.

CHAIRMAN: Yes. Unfortunately -- we had hoped we would

have witnesses tomorrow, and I am very anxious that we

shouldn't waste any time, but we won't have witnesses

tomorrow now, and our next witness will be Tuesday morning

at 11 o'clock. Thank you very much, ladies and gentlemen.

THE TRIBUNAL THEN ADJOURNED TO TUESDAY, THE 1ST OF MAY,

2012, AT 11 A.M.

''Eamon' [1] - 7:6'if' [1] - 27:20'Mooch' [11] - 26:13,

26:22, 28:25, 28:30, 29:21, 29:23, 37:25, 40:19, 40:27, 41:10

'right [1] - 28:24'Stakeknife' [3] - 6:3,

12:21, 13:28

11 [1] - 22:1610 [1] - 21:3100 [1] - 22:2511 [3] - 46:3, 46:9, 46:12114 [8] - 26:10, 31:19,

32:4, 32:5, 37:21, 40:4, 40:18, 41:11

11th [1] - 13:1913th [3] - 25:3, 25:14,

40:114 [1] - 28:2014th [1] - 26:1015 [2] - 18:7, 23:7153 [1] - 28:19154 [1] - 29:2015th [1] - 28:181997 [2] - 30:28, 38:291ST [1] - 46:11

22 [2] - 21:26, 29:202000 [14] - 2:22, 3:20,

6:11, 13:20, 13:24, 22:19, 22:24, 22:30, 23:17, 23:30, 24:6, 30:23, 30:24

20002 [1] - 18:112002 [5] - 3:19, 18:12,

23:14, 23:15, 24:42004 [9] - 6:17, 6:18,

10:19, 10:22, 10:28, 11:20, 11:28, 13:7, 13:30

2012 [3] - 1:1, 19:12, 46:12

26TH [1] - 1:1

332 [1] - 34:8

44th [1] - 22:5

550 [1] - 22:25

66 [4] - 25:4, 25:5, 25:15,

29:2860 [1] - 37:2066 [1] - 37:20

771 [13] - 24:22, 25:6, 25:7,

26:22, 28:24, 29:2, 30:12, 31:15, 38:30, 39:13, 42:11, 42:15, 45:14

71's [3] - 37:2, 37:9, 45:17

88 [1] - 26:1280 [12] - 25:3, 25:14, 30:5,

31:18, 31:19, 32:4, 40:1, 40:12, 42:4, 42:9, 42:11

8th [1] - 13:24

99th [2] - 13:30, 14:3

AA.M [1] - 46:12able [5] - 8:4, 25:24, 37:6,

39:1, 39:4abroad [1] - 35:17absolutely [1] - 14:16accent [1] - 4:16access [17] - 3:26, 7:23,

12:19, 26:14, 28:23, 28:25, 29:7, 29:23, 29:25, 30:19, 30:20, 40:19, 40:28, 40:29, 40:30, 41:2, 41:10

accidentally [1] - 40:25account [1] - 23:10accurately [1] - 14:26Act [2] - 7:30, 8:2act [1] - 41:19acting [9] - 20:26, 36:8,

36:9, 41:16, 41:21, 41:22, 44:6, 44:14, 45:5

active [3] - 6:1, 22:21, 25:28

activities [1] - 3:28actual [2] - 38:11, 39:20adamant [1] - 7:25addition [2] - 39:1, 40:4address [2] - 7:5, 34:20addressed [1] - 36:18ADJOURNED [2] - 16:30,

46:11advised [1] - 33:21afraid [2] - 10:22, 16:2Africa [2] - 33:17, 33:18AFTER [1] - 17:1afternoon [1] - 17:3afterwards [2] - 6:12,

42:26agent [3] - 6:23, 25:17,

44:23agents [1] - 25:9aggravated [1] - 4:3ago [1] - 7:15agree [2] - 10:17, 39:6allegation [1] - 41:6

allegations [3] - 9:4, 12:20, 15:29

alleged [2] - 23:27, 40:19allowed [1] - 4:18almost [1] - 11:14alternatively [1] - 3:4ambiguous [1] - 8:3Amboise [1] - 22:28Amboise.. [1] - 22:27amount [5] - 23:5, 23:7,

34:9, 34:10, 37:17anecdotal [1] - 2:28Anglesea [1] - 21:6Anglo [1] - 6:27Anglo-Irish [1] - 6:27annual [1] - 32:20anodyne [1] - 9:8answer [1] - 41:18Answer [6] - 8:28, 25:19,

25:21, 25:24, 26:20, 29:23

anticipate [1] - 6:24anticipated [2] - 4:11,

40:15anxious [2] - 7:27, 46:6apologise [1] - 44:27apologised [1] - 45:8appear [5] - 14:10, 15:26,

31:5, 34:19, 36:16appearances [1] - 2:10appeared [1] - 9:18apples [2] - 10:30, 11:3applies [1] - 28:7appreciate [3] - 27:10,

32:2, 41:10apprehension [2] - 4:8,

5:4apprehensions [2] - 3:21,

6:6approach [1] - 19:28approached [4] - 14:30,

19:5, 19:25, 35:21APRIL [1] - 1:1apt [1] - 13:6arising [1] - 39:24Army [1] - 3:25army [1] - 6:2arose [2] - 4:14, 44:21arranged [1] - 21:7arrangement [1] - 3:13arrangements [2] - 4:29,

5:2arrest [2] - 26:30, 38:4arrested [1] - 8:13arrived [1] - 21:9article [1] - 6:19AS [11] - 1:2, 2:2, 13:16,

14:8, 15:24, 17:1, 18:2, 31:2, 34:17, 36:14, 39:26

ascribed [1] - 7:7aspect [1] - 42:14assessing [1] - 27:29assessment [4] - 10:1,

10:6, 10:7, 13:6assist [4] - 19:21, 20:9,

20:15, 27:29

assistance [2] - 27:28, 42:30

Assistant [2] - 2:30, 3:5associated [4] - 7:16,

7:18, 7:20, 15:11assume [2] - 13:4, 26:22assuming [1] - 27:16assumptions [1] - 27:18AT [1] - 46:12attend [2] - 2:16, 12:7attended [2] - 11:21, 36:6attention [2] - 21:18,

24:12authentic [1] - 4:9authorisation [1] - 18:26authorities [3] - 5:13,

6:10, 11:14automatically [1] - 28:14available [1] - 12:17aware [7] - 14:2, 15:28,

16:1, 22:15, 24:17, 37:2, 40:8

awful [1] - 32:26

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20:21, 21:12bad [2] - 10:30, 11:3based [2] - 22:14, 35:7Basil [1] - 2:7basis [3] - 32:29, 33:4,

43:9batch [1] - 33:30bear [3] - 24:16, 30:10,

40:3became [1] - 14:2BEEN [2] - 2:1, 18:1begin [3] - 25:4, 25:5,

26:11beginning [1] - 24:17begins [1] - 22:7behalf [20] - 6:7, 9:20,

20:26, 21:14, 31:5, 35:25, 35:29, 36:8, 36:9, 36:11, 36:16, 36:17, 41:16, 41:19, 41:22, 41:28, 44:6, 44:14, 44:26, 45:5

behest [1] - 3:29belief [3] - 10:20, 21:20,

22:10bell [1] - 25:4benefit [1] - 15:14best [3] - 21:19, 22:10,

35:20big [1] - 27:19bit [1] - 8:3black [3] - 26:16, 28:26,

33:9black-market [2] - 26:16,

33:9Blair [8] - 26:13, 26:30,

29:6, 38:4, 40:19, 40:27, 41:10, 43:21

Blair.. [1] - 26:30blister [7] - 26:23, 26:24,

27:4, 28:30, 36:26,



1

37:26, 37:27blisters [1] - 29:1board [2] - 45:21, 45:24book [2] - 6:19, 13:28books [1] - 15:5bordering [1] - 3:28bottom [1] - 21:27bound [1] - 8:1boxes [1] - 34:8Branch [1] - 25:8branch [1] - 25:8breach [2] - 6:7, 7:29breaching [1] - 5:22break [1] - 9:9break-in [1] - 9:9briefed [1] - 12:9bringing [1] - 9:29British [5] - 3:25, 6:23,

6:26, 9:20, 9:21broad [2] - 18:20, 33:18broken [3] - 4:17, 9:16,

9:17brought [5] - 27:14,

31:15, 31:21, 35:13, 45:15

building [1] - 41:20business [1] - 24:3buy [2] - 27:15buyer [1] - 38:15BY [9] - 2:1, 13:16, 14:7,

15:23, 18:1, 31:2, 34:17, 36:14, 39:26

CCahill [4] - 26:7, 32:18,

32:19, 35:5capacity [3] - 18:8, 24:14,

24:15Carrick [2] - 3:14, 13:19Carrick-on-Suir [1] - 3:14Carrigaline [6] - 20:10,

21:5, 21:8, 21:11, 22:6, 23:19

carry [2] - 10:3, 29:30carrying [2] - 32:30,

38:16case [5] - 3:17, 12:11,

27:30, 29:8, 34:3centre [2] - 27:20, 34:29centres [3] - 27:13, 27:27,

29:27certain [6] - 3:27, 9:27,

25:17, 26:29, 27:17, 30:15

certainly [11] - 3:28, 6:6, 8:3, 9:27, 10:13, 11:8, 12:9, 14:26, 15:11, 15:13, 30:7

Chairman [14] - 1:4, 2:8, 2:23, 3:15, 8:17, 13:9, 13:13, 14:20, 14:23, 16:25, 27:29, 40:12, 41:15, 42:23

CHAIRMAN [22] - 1:10, 15:19, 16:9, 16:13, 16:20, 16:22, 16:27, 34:13, 38:27, 39:24,

41:18, 42:1, 42:26, 43:6, 43:13, 43:23, 44:3, 44:12, 44:30, 45:7, 45:29, 46:5

changed [1] - 15:11chap [1] - 12:6charge [1] - 23:13charged [1] - 8:13check [1] - 23:3checked [1] - 29:2checking [1] - 44:28chief [1] - 6:4Chief [10] - 3:7, 4:24,

10:22, 11:21, 11:23, 12:2, 12:15, 12:25, 19:22, 19:28

CID [3] - 25:8, 26:21, 37:24

circulation [2] - 26:28, 38:2

circumstances [6] - 3:30, 4:6, 4:15, 4:18, 4:23, 12:11

City [1] - 10:23claiming [1] - 24:22clarify [2] - 21:17, 41:15clear [6] - 5:22, 19:24,

31:14, 32:2, 39:28, 45:4clearly [2] - 8:4, 11:30client [3] - 15:28, 16:2,

16:3close [1] - 24:8closely [1] - 39:22code [1] - 7:6coded [1] - 33:27COFFEY [1] - 15:21cold [1] - 19:15colleague [1] - 2:7combining [1] - 5:6coming [5] - 16:14,

32:28, 43:25, 43:26, 43:29

Commissioner [3] - 2:30, 3:5, 12:12

Commissioner's [1] - 11:18

committee [2] - 24:9, 44:22

communication [1] - 20:13

communications [1] - 4:14

companies [9] - 26:6, 26:8, 28:11, 29:30, 30:1, 33:25, 34:21, 35:4, 35:16

company [4] - 18:6, 26:27, 33:21, 37:30

completed [2] - 22:29, 38:11

completely [2] - 11:10, 39:12

comprehensively [1] - 14:25

concentrate [1] - 38:10concept [1] - 41:12concepts [1] - 41:2concern [2] - 15:1, 42:1

concerned [3] - 7:30, 9:25, 34:2

concerning [1] - 9:3concerns [1] - 9:9concludes [1] - 45:29confidences [1] - 5:23confine [1] - 5:24confined [1] - 10:28confirm [6] - 13:18, 22:2,

36:19, 36:20, 36:29, 37:12

confirmed [2] - 26:27, 38:1

confuse [1] - 25:11confusion [1] - 10:13conjecture [1] - 37:30connection [3] - 2:27,

13:10, 44:21Conor [1] - 17:4CONOR [1] - 18:1contact [9] - 2:30, 6:28,

7:1, 9:13, 20:29, 42:7, 42:12, 45:14

contacted [3] - 16:3, 19:2, 19:20

contained [2] - 15:29, 36:24

contemporary [1] - 6:26content [1] - 5:17contents [1] - 4:22context [2] - 25:6, 43:21CONTINUED [1] - 17:1contradict [2] - 37:8,

39:16conversation [2] - 4:20,

11:5conveying [1] - 7:3Cork [9] - 21:6, 22:14,

22:22, 24:9, 25:18, 27:21, 30:6, 30:16, 35:6

corporation [1] - 28:8correct [42] - 2:23, 3:11,

3:15, 7:19, 13:26, 18:5, 19:7, 19:27, 20:27, 23:8, 23:10, 24:2, 25:19, 25:21, 26:2, 26:4, 27:8, 27:11, 27:17, 27:19, 29:26, 29:27, 30:13, 30:29, 31:8, 31:16, 32:7, 32:12, 33:19, 34:22, 36:22, 36:23, 36:27, 36:28, 37:1, 37:18, 38:12, 40:11, 41:8, 41:13

corrected [1] - 16:24Corrigan [9] - 10:10,

10:11, 10:12, 10:16, 11:2, 11:4, 11:29, 14:10, 14:14

Corrigan's [2] - 13:11, 14:17

counsel [5] - 19:16, 19:19, 19:25, 20:3, 28:17

country [2] - 33:23, 35:13County [1] - 22:14couple [1] - 14:11

course [14] - 6:5, 8:6, 9:23, 12:5, 12:28, 13:12, 28:21, 32:27, 33:23, 36:24, 37:19, 41:1, 41:18, 44:27

court [1] - 1:7coverage [1] - 20:17created [2] - 12:11, 44:26criminal [1] - 25:7cross [1] - 28:20CROSS [6] - 13:16, 14:7,

15:23, 31:2, 34:17, 36:14

cross-examination [1] - 28:20

CROSS-EXAMINED [6] - 13:16, 14:7, 15:23, 31:2, 34:17, 36:14

crossed [1] - 10:12Cummins [2] - 19:22,

45:1curiosity [1] - 8:24Customs [1] - 28:23

Dd/Sergeant [1] - 20:30D/Sergeant [1] - 22:6date [1] - 23:27dates [1] - 13:18deal [3] - 34:25, 41:9,

42:26dealer [2] - 26:17, 28:28dealers [2] - 28:21, 28:22dealing [2] - 5:27, 28:21dealt [3] - 2:17, 19:13,

41:11December [5] - 25:3,

25:14, 26:10, 28:18, 40:1

declaration [1] - 21:15declare [1] - 22:9declared [1] - 21:18deemed [1] - 3:4deeply [1] - 8:8Deirdre [2] - 19:19, 20:3deleted [1] - 38:3delivered [1] - 32:29demand [1] - 33:1denied [1] - 15:29Denis [1] - 8:9deny [1] - 37:12deriving [1] - 15:14despite [1] - 12:30detail [2] - 7:9, 7:21detective [1] - 20:30Detective [12] - 4:25,

4:27, 11:23, 11:26, 12:14, 12:26, 13:28, 13:29, 19:5, 19:13, 20:11, 20:25

different [5] - 25:10, 27:3, 29:29, 41:3, 41:12

difficulty [2] - 3:2, 19:18DILLON [13] - 17:3, 18:1,

18:4, 31:14, 31:18, 31:21, 39:26, 39:28, 42:9, 42:18, 43:20,

45:20, 46:2directly [1] - 16:3Director [1] - 33:14director [1] - 18:9disclosure [1] - 10:8discredit [1] - 45:15discuss [3] - 5:17, 45:22,

45:23discussed [2] - 5:8, 5:15discussion [2] - 10:27,

10:30dishonesty [1] - 11:12distinction [1] - 30:21distribute [2] - 32:13,

35:18distributed [1] - 35:14distributing [1] - 33:25distribution [15] - 22:29,

26:5, 26:6, 26:7, 27:13, 27:20, 27:27, 28:11, 29:27, 29:29, 30:26, 34:21, 34:29, 35:4

distributors [5] - 32:14, 32:16, 32:28, 33:25, 34:28

document [5] - 21:22, 21:26, 21:30, 25:2, 25:4

documented [2] - 11:20, 14:25

documents [2] - 5:18, 11:19

done [1] - 11:15Donegal [1] - 7:11down [3] - 3:13, 4:17,

45:11drastic [1] - 11:16drawn [1] - 21:18Drug [5] - 26:7, 32:17,

32:18, 34:29, 35:6drug [4] - 26:17, 28:21,

28:22, 28:27drums [1] - 22:25Dublin [7] - 2:30, 6:22,

7:2, 10:23, 22:26, 35:6, 35:7

Dundalk [7] - 8:19, 8:23, 8:25, 8:26, 8:27, 9:1

DURACK [9] - 13:16, 13:18, 31:2, 31:4, 31:24, 42:30, 43:8, 43:16, 44:20

Durack [4] - 31:5, 40:4, 44:13, 45:7

during [2] - 9:20, 30:2duties [2] - 13:9, 18:21duty [1] - 6:7

EEamon' [1] - 7:4East [1] - 33:16eavesdropped [1] - 4:21editor [1] - 2:26effectively [2] - 37:14,

38:8EHS [3] - 18:13, 24:7,

24:9Eireann [1] - 6:22



2

either [1] - 21:5electronic [1] - 18:28elements [3] - 18:28,

18:29elsewhere [1] - 26:1EMEA [2] - 18:9, 33:14employed [1] - 18:17enable [1] - 4:9encounters [1] - 14:18endlessly [1] - 43:13England [1] - 28:28English [1] - 4:16ensure [1] - 18:25ensuring [1] - 18:27entail [1] - 18:20entails [1] - 18:22enter [2] - 18:25, 18:26entirely [1] - 20:13es [1] - 33:26Europe [1] - 33:15evening [3] - 19:8, 20:8,

23:22events [4] - 1:8, 12:5,

19:24, 32:28evidence [36] - 2:28,

3:26, 5:16, 5:19, 7:15, 12:29, 14:27, 15:6, 22:11, 22:15, 24:17, 24:27, 24:28, 26:11, 27:30, 28:16, 30:12, 30:17, 31:7, 31:15, 32:8, 36:19, 36:25, 37:2, 37:9, 37:14, 39:1, 40:8, 40:24, 42:16, 44:16, 45:11, 45:16, 45:17, 45:18, 45:30

exactly [2] - 23:16, 35:22examination [4] - 10:14,

16:9, 16:11, 28:20examined [2] - 5:2, 28:17EXAMINED [9] - 2:1,

13:16, 14:7, 15:23, 18:1, 31:2, 34:17, 36:14, 39:26

exist [1] - 26:17expect [1] - 33:20expected [2] - 9:23, 12:5experience [3] - 8:15,

8:17, 11:8explained [2] - 20:16,

21:12explanation [3] - 41:25,

42:14, 44:8expression [1] - 14:14extent [1] - 37:22External [1] - 18:15

Ffacilities [9] - 27:25,

34:26, 34:27, 35:3, 35:9, 35:11, 35:14, 35:15, 35:19

facility [3] - 18:26, 30:2fact [11] - 4:3, 11:19,

12:2, 12:24, 14:2, 14:16, 14:23, 38:14, 40:27, 44:20, 44:21

factory [1] - 29:4fair [2] - 19:5, 37:13false [2] - 15:6, 22:13family [1] - 6:15far [1] - 34:2February [4] - 2:21, 6:11,

13:24, 22:5feedback [1] - 37:10felt [5] - 3:30, 4:6, 4:12,

4:23, 6:7female [1] - 32:26few [3] - 11:3, 31:4, 36:17figure [1] - 27:17file [1] - 13:27files [1] - 1:7final [1] - 22:28finally [1] - 38:30financially [1] - 15:14fine [3] - 27:26, 28:5,

28:16finished [6] - 22:18,

22:21, 22:23, 25:28, 35:12, 42:28

firm [1] - 11:13first [13] - 3:22, 5:5, 5:7,

10:15, 13:19, 19:25, 21:25, 23:30, 25:10, 35:21, 42:27, 44:5, 44:12

firstly [1] - 34:20FITZGERALD [3] - 15:23,

15:26, 16:6focus [2] - 25:9, 38:10follow [2] - 40:21, 43:1followed [1] - 19:3following [1] - 45:10FOLLOWS [11] - 1:2, 2:2,

13:16, 14:8, 15:24, 17:1, 18:2, 31:2, 34:17, 36:14, 39:26

foot [1] - 20:6FOR [1] - 16:30Force [5] - 3:24, 7:1,

7:12, 7:17, 7:19forces [2] - 3:30, 4:4forgotten [2] - 3:18,

45:25form [2] - 5:8, 35:12formally [1] - 4:28format [1] - 22:23forthcoming [1] - 13:1four [6] - 26:23, 28:30,

29:15, 32:25, 36:26, 37:26

four-and-a-half [1] - 32:25

four-pack [1] - 28:30fours [1] - 36:21France [1] - 22:28fraud [8] - 25:22, 39:3,

39:17, 42:5, 42:12, 45:13

Fraud [1] - 37:5Fred [1] - 6:2free [1] - 5:17Freiburg [1] - 22:26frequently [1] - 7:8

Friday [3] - 19:7, 20:8, 23:22

Friend [3] - 36:17, 40:3, 40:14

friend [1] - 28:27Friend's [1] - 45:11front [1] - 25:5FRU [1] - 12:30Fulton's [1] - 45:17function [1] - 18:10functions [2] - 18:16,

25:8

GGarda [29] - 3:3, 3:6,

6:30, 7:2, 7:4, 7:11, 8:9, 11:8, 13:24, 14:30, 15:13, 20:10, 21:6, 21:8, 21:11, 23:1, 23:19, 25:22, 29:3, 31:5, 31:10, 37:5, 39:3, 39:17, 39:19, 39:22, 42:5, 42:12, 45:12

Gardaí [5] - 12:29, 20:29, 23:5, 30:4, 37:9

gentleman [1] - 20:1gentlemen [1] - 46:9genuine [1] - 39:8Germany [1] - 22:26given [12] - 14:27, 23:27,

24:27, 28:17, 30:4, 30:12, 31:7, 33:22, 38:8, 39:2, 40:26

Government [1] - 9:21Government's [1] - 6:25grateful [4] - 16:14,

43:26, 44:15, 44:30grave [1] - 6:7gravity [1] - 9:29great [1] - 7:21grounds [1] - 5:3guard [1] - 44:5guards [7] - 4:24, 7:16,

8:4, 8:19, 8:21, 21:1, 21:19

guy [1] - 28:28

Hhalf [3] - 32:25, 34:20halted [2] - 38:8, 38:17hand [1] - 31:24handed [3] - 29:1, 31:26,

31:27handle [1] - 25:9handler [9] - 7:7, 25:11,

26:21, 26:25, 28:25, 29:2, 37:4, 37:25, 37:28

hanging [1] - 28:22Hanlon [4] - 17:4, 43:24,

44:4, 44:16HANLON [1] - 18:1hard [3] - 5:28, 13:4,

29:18HAVING [2] - 2:1, 18:1head [3] - 4:26, 32:22,

33:12

headlines [1] - 28:9Headquarters [2] - 7:2,

9:3Health [1] - 18:15heard [3] - 2:7, 23:30,

36:19held [2] - 18:10, 26:14help [2] - 40:12, 43:27helpfully [1] - 38:9Heneghan [1] - 19:6hereby [1] - 22:9himself [3] - 5:16, 10:28,

35:24home [5] - 3:13, 9:16,

9:17, 9:29, 43:29hope [1] - 14:26hoped [1] - 46:5house [2] - 4:15, 13:21huge [1] - 44:15human [1] - 5:29Hurst [24] - 2:12, 2:21,

3:1, 3:21, 5:16, 6:7, 6:12, 8:18, 8:21, 9:8, 9:14, 10:12, 10:24, 11:20, 12:4, 12:10, 12:16, 12:28, 14:12, 14:17, 14:25, 14:28, 14:30, 15:9

Hurst's [2] - 3:1, 15:5hypothesis [1] - 29:9

IIan [2] - 2:12, 12:4idea [5] - 16:20, 21:10,

23:20, 26:1, 32:21ideas [1] - 41:4identified [3] - 5:30,

11:30, 13:2identify [6] - 6:24, 7:27,

8:4, 25:24, 37:6, 39:4identity [4] - 9:4, 12:21,

13:5illegal [3] - 22:16, 40:9,

40:24illegality [1] - 3:28imagine [1] - 33:22impart [1] - 9:27important [3] - 43:6,

43:28, 45:1impression [5] - 7:3,

39:29, 41:27, 44:10, 44:25

imprisonment [1] - 8:14incarcerated [1] - 8:11incident [1] - 4:10include [2] - 5:12, 28:10indeed [9] - 5:16, 8:10,

11:7, 13:6, 13:13, 15:9, 34:11, 38:19

indicated [4] - 3:2, 4:20, 7:29, 39:4

indication [2] - 9:17, 11:11

information [27] - 3:27, 6:8, 7:11, 7:24, 7:28, 8:12, 8:20, 8:22, 8:26, 8:30, 9:11, 9:27, 9:28,

19:16, 19:30, 23:6, 25:17, 30:4, 30:11, 30:15, 37:5, 39:7, 39:10, 39:14, 40:26, 43:4, 44:25

informed [5] - 6:10, 11:18, 20:30, 28:15, 40:23

ingredients [2] - 22:22, 25:29

initial [6] - 9:30, 10:1, 10:4, 14:29, 15:12, 23:23

injunction [1] - 11:13inquire [1] - 33:12inquired [1] - 41:28inquiries [6] - 26:26,

37:15, 37:29, 38:18, 39:18, 41:28

inquiring [1] - 43:2inquiry [4] - 19:20, 22:30,

23:16, 34:4insofar [1] - 38:13Inspector [6] - 13:29,

19:6, 19:13, 20:11, 20:25, 41:21

instance [1] - 19:26intelligence [4] - 5:28,

5:29, 6:4, 9:11intend [2] - 15:9, 45:22intended [1] - 38:19intercept [1] - 5:3interest [4] - 5:25, 7:21,

8:6, 10:25interested [1] - 7:25interesting [1] - 43:14interfered [2] - 4:13, 4:14intervention [1] - 2:26interview [3] - 3:6, 4:30,

9:20interviewed [3] - 4:28,

12:7interviews [2] - 9:24,

10:15introduced [1] - 35:24invariably [1] - 11:15investigation [4] - 4:9,

8:8, 8:16, 45:22Investigation [1] - 25:8involved [5] - 3:23, 5:27,

7:24, 8:8, 10:26involvement [2] - 3:25,

15:5IRA [2] - 8:12, 26:19Ireland [26] - 3:24, 3:29,

5:21, 6:16, 6:26, 18:4, 21:14, 22:17, 22:19, 22:20, 22:29, 23:3, 26:3, 26:5, 28:2, 29:12, 30:2, 30:26, 30:28, 32:15, 32:21, 34:6, 34:23, 34:30, 36:11, 43:14

Irish [7] - 6:1, 6:25, 6:27, 26:15, 32:10, 32:11, 43:2

issue [3] - 14:24, 45:12, 45:16



3

issued [4] - 25:25, 37:7, 37:11, 39:5

items [1] - 29:22itself [1] - 32:13

JJanuary [7] - 2:21, 3:19,

3:20, 13:19, 13:20, 19:10

journalist [1] - 4:5journalists [1] - 4:6journey [1] - 15:27Judge [2] - 9:12, 11:7July [2] - 13:30, 14:3jurisdiction [1] - 23:4

KKeeley [13] - 25:9, 25:12,

25:16, 26:11, 28:19, 30:14, 30:17, 31:7, 33:6, 36:16, 37:4, 38:1, 38:13

Keeley's [1] - 36:24keen [1] - 45:11keep [1] - 2:6Kelly [7] - 8:9, 8:13,

11:22, 11:23, 11:25, 12:3, 13:29

Kevin [1] - 45:17Kilkenny [1] - 8:22kilo [1] - 22:25knowing [1] - 22:10knowledge [10] - 3:5,

3:27, 4:1, 12:15, 21:20, 22:10, 23:6, 24:5, 35:16, 35:20

known [5] - 4:5, 4:6, 6:5, 6:13, 24:10

Lladies [1] - 46:9large [7] - 23:2, 23:4,

23:6, 32:6, 32:9, 37:16, 37:21

last [2] - 19:10, 34:7late [2] - 1:6, 4:15launched [1] - 30:27LAVERTY [7] - 1:4, 2:2,

2:4, 13:14, 16:11, 16:18, 16:24

law [2] - 11:17, 44:22leak [1] - 4:4Learned [1] - 36:17least [5] - 4:5, 4:21, 8:25,

9:19, 33:28leave [1] - 22:24left [1] - 4:3legal [5] - 19:16, 19:19,

19:25, 20:3, 41:20legitimate [1] - 33:10lengthy [1] - 7:12letter [1] - 43:17Letterkenny [1] - 8:25liable [1] - 22:11licence [1] - 35:17

lifetime [1] - 11:15likely [2] - 4:11Limerick [1] - 35:6line [7] - 25:4, 25:5,

25:15, 26:12, 28:20, 29:20, 29:28

listen [1] - 22:2literally [1] - 31:10London [1] - 26:18look [9] - 1:7, 18:24,

18:27, 18:29, 21:7, 30:16, 37:20, 44:17

looking [3] - 18:22, 37:15, 43:13

loss [8] - 28:4, 28:14, 33:21, 33:26, 34:3, 34:4, 34:6, 34:7

losses [2] - 33:23, 38:24LUNCH [2] - 16:30, 17:1

MMaguire [10] - 1:5, 2:4,

5:17, 13:14, 14:10, 14:29, 15:17, 16:6, 16:13

MAGUIRE [1] - 2:1main [2] - 32:15, 32:17management [1] - 24:9manager [2] - 18:13,

18:19Manager [3] - 18:15, 22:5,

24:7manufacture [1] - 22:18manufactured [1] - 32:9manufacturing [2] -

18:30, 22:20Mark [1] - 34:19market [16] - 25:25,

26:16, 28:27, 30:25, 32:10, 32:11, 33:9, 33:10, 37:7, 37:11, 38:29, 39:5, 39:9, 39:11, 43:3, 43:14

Mary [1] - 19:22materials [6] - 4:5, 4:19,

9:18, 9:28, 10:5, 15:15matter [11] - 2:9, 6:5, 7:9,

15:28, 25:10, 37:3, 39:28, 41:15, 42:22, 44:17, 44:27

matters [10] - 5:7, 5:11, 5:16, 5:21, 5:24, 14:26, 14:28, 36:18, 38:19, 42:15

MAY [1] - 46:11mean [3] - 20:25, 41:19,

42:19means [2] - 27:12, 33:15meant [1] - 38:16measures [1] - 11:16media [3] - 4:12, 19:4,

20:17meet [7] - 3:13, 13:7,

20:11, 21:4, 21:5, 21:6, 21:7

meeting [20] - 3:17, 5:5, 5:6, 5:7, 5:10, 9:13,

10:19, 10:28, 11:20, 12:4, 12:8, 12:9, 13:19, 13:23, 13:30, 14:3, 14:12, 14:21, 36:5

meetings [6] - 2:11, 2:21, 2:23, 10:21, 12:28, 13:12

member [10] - 6:1, 6:21, 7:10, 7:16, 7:22, 7:26, 8:21, 25:7, 41:26, 44:9

members [4] - 3:3, 6:30, 11:16, 15:12

membership [1] - 44:22memory [1] - 3:19mental [1] - 14:14mention [3] - 14:16,

14:24, 44:17mentioned [10] - 6:20,

6:21, 8:1, 11:28, 11:29, 12:28, 14:13, 14:29, 34:20, 40:18

mentioning [1] - 8:21merely [2] - 43:16, 44:27met [5] - 3:20, 7:8, 10:24,

11:27, 16:2Michael [1] - 31:5middle [2] - 6:15, 37:23Middle [1] - 33:15might [12] - 3:16, 5:24,

8:3, 12:5, 24:5, 27:12, 41:10, 42:30, 43:10, 43:17, 44:16

mightn't [1] - 38:19million [28] - 22:17,

26:14, 27:16, 27:23, 27:24, 28:2, 28:3, 28:4, 28:9, 28:23, 28:25, 29:7, 29:8, 29:11, 29:17, 29:19, 30:2, 30:8, 32:25, 34:5, 35:26, 40:10, 40:25, 40:28, 40:29, 40:30, 43:10, 43:20

millionaire [1] - 38:23Mills [4] - 21:25, 21:30,

25:2, 28:18mind [3] - 10:12, 10:14,

15:11minds [1] - 42:22minutes [1] - 7:15missing [2] - 27:24, 29:1mistake [1] - 22:2moment [2] - 28:1, 32:24money [1] - 33:10monthly [3] - 32:29, 33:3,

43:9morning [9] - 1:4, 1:5,

2:4, 2:5, 7:14, 21:2, 21:3, 44:18, 46:8

most [3] - 35:16, 36:18, 37:22

motivation [1] - 15:7moved [2] - 13:8, 13:9MR [40] - 13:16, 13:18,

14:7, 14:10, 15:17, 15:21, 17:3, 18:1, 18:4, 31:2, 31:4, 31:14, 31:18, 31:21, 31:24,

34:15, 34:17, 34:19, 36:14, 36:16, 38:30, 39:26, 39:28, 41:15, 41:25, 42:4, 42:9, 42:11, 42:18, 42:30, 43:8, 43:16, 43:20, 44:8, 44:20, 45:4, 45:10, 45:20, 45:27, 46:2

MRS [7] - 1:4, 2:2, 2:4, 13:14, 16:11, 16:18, 16:24

MS [2] - 15:23, 16:6murder [1] - 14:22Murphy [11] - 20:30, 21:4,

21:12, 22:6, 23:10, 24:20, 39:30, 40:7, 41:16, 41:21

must [3] - 26:26, 29:2, 37:29

Nname [11] - 6:13, 6:29,

7:5, 7:6, 7:7, 13:11, 14:17, 25:17, 31:5, 34:19

namely [2] - 37:9, 39:7names [2] - 11:29, 12:30nature [3] - 7:29, 20:28,

39:17nay [1] - 27:10need [3] - 26:20, 31:14,

37:24needed [4] - 4:23, 12:9,

28:29, 32:10needs [1] - 42:20never [20] - 8:27, 8:28,

10:11, 10:12, 10:16, 10:24, 11:9, 11:27, 11:28, 13:11, 14:20, 16:2, 16:3, 22:18, 22:23, 28:4, 30:7

nevertheless [1] - 6:9newspaper [4] - 6:13,

6:14, 9:19, 10:5newspapers [2] - 10:8,

16:2next [12] - 16:18, 16:27,

20:29, 21:30, 25:2, 26:9, 28:18, 36:1, 44:18, 46:2, 46:8

night [2] - 4:16, 6:15nobody [3] - 41:19,

43:25, 44:13none [1] - 9:12normal [2] - 9:3, 12:5north [4] - 10:23, 34:26,

34:27, 34:28Northern [6] - 3:24, 3:29,

5:21, 6:16, 6:26, 34:30notes [1] - 19:17nothing [1] - 10:23noticed [1] - 7:13notification [1] - 33:24notified [1] - 33:24Number [1] - 24:22number [10] - 6:20, 12:11,

13:18, 20:4, 26:25, 32:4, 33:30, 34:1, 36:30, 37:27

numbers [1] - 31:25

OO'CALLAGHAN [3] -

14:7, 14:10, 15:17o'clock [5] - 16:27, 21:3,

21:8, 46:3, 46:9O'Sullivan [7] - 11:21,

11:24, 12:3, 13:29, 19:19, 20:3

object [2] - 27:1, 29:6obliged [1] - 45:27obviously [4] - 37:8,

37:30, 38:8, 38:17occasion [1] - 9:15occupation [1] - 22:4occupied [2] - 12:17,

18:17occur [2] - 4:11occurred [2] - 24:10,

40:16OF [2] - 1:1, 46:11Office [1] - 19:29office [6] - 12:13, 12:15,

12:25, 19:23, 41:20, 45:13

officer [4] - 7:4, 36:7, 36:9, 45:5

offices [2] - 12:17, 45:1Official [2] - 7:30, 8:2OK [12] - 19:2, 19:24,

20:1, 20:24, 25:2, 28:13, 29:14, 30:23, 34:25, 34:28, 40:12, 41:9

Oliver [1] - 14:22ON [1] - 1:1on.. [1] - 10:3once [2] - 9:16one [35] - 5:26, 6:4, 7:1,

12:12, 12:13, 12:14, 14:11, 14:13, 15:28, 17:3, 21:11, 25:1, 25:8, 25:24, 26:14, 27:13, 27:17, 27:21, 27:23, 27:24, 31:12, 35:5, 35:6, 37:6, 37:11, 38:7, 39:12, 40:9, 40:24, 41:2, 41:15, 42:18, 42:30, 43:28

ones [3] - 32:3, 32:17ongoing [1] - 6:28onwards [1] - 23:14operation [5] - 26:30,

32:6, 38:3, 38:7, 38:17operational [1] - 7:6Operations [1] - 4:27operatives [1] - 29:28opportunity [1] - 15:4or.. [1] - 22:26order [1] - 35:18ordered [1] - 43:9ordinary [1] - 32:27organisation [1] - 5:26



4

organisations [1] - 5:30organise [2] - 26:29, 38:3original [1] - 10:6ostensibly [1] - 38:15otherwise [3] - 11:12,

15:14, 16:4outline [1] - 18:20outside [1] - 23:3overseas [1] - 35:15Owen [2] - 10:10, 11:2own [5] - 4:8, 9:25, 9:26,

13:21, 42:22

Ppack [7] - 26:23, 26:24,

28:30, 36:26, 37:26, 37:27

packaged [1] - 26:3packaging [1] - 22:28packet [1] - 29:15packs [2] - 27:4, 36:21page [25] - 21:26, 25:1,

25:3, 25:10, 25:14, 26:10, 28:19, 29:20, 30:5, 31:18, 31:19, 32:4, 32:5, 37:20, 37:21, 39:30, 40:1, 40:4, 40:12, 40:18, 41:11, 42:11

pages [5] - 31:9, 31:16, 31:21, 31:24, 40:2

paid [1] - 7:13paper [1] - 4:22papers [1] - 7:14part [6] - 3:1, 13:23,

23:26, 24:7, 24:26, 38:1particular [3] - 5:29, 8:6,

8:20particularly [1] - 33:22passed [5] - 9:2, 25:22,

37:4, 39:3, 39:16passing [4] - 7:11, 7:28,

8:11, 8:26Pat [5] - 20:30, 21:4, 22:6,

24:20peculiar [1] - 4:1people [12] - 6:21, 7:24,

7:27, 7:30, 11:26, 12:29, 18:22, 18:25, 32:29, 38:4, 41:19, 42:21

per [2] - 26:18, 28:29perceived [1] - 4:10perhaps [5] - 3:16, 5:24,

8:2, 10:6, 44:17period [3] - 7:12, 8:30,

30:3person [4] - 13:2, 26:29,

30:18, 38:16personal [2] - 4:2, 4:8Peter [2] - 25:12, 26:11PETER [1] - 2:1Pfizer [32] - 18:4, 18:17,

19:19, 19:21, 20:20, 21:14, 22:14, 22:17, 22:19, 22:29, 23:7, 24:23, 25:18, 25:27,

26:5, 26:27, 27:21, 28:6, 28:8, 30:6, 30:8, 30:16, 32:5, 32:13, 36:11, 37:30, 39:18, 40:10, 40:25, 44:23, 45:12

Pfizer's [1] - 19:25pharmaceutical [2] -

22:21, 25:28phone [10] - 9:22, 19:7,

19:9, 20:5, 20:7, 20:8, 21:1, 21:2, 23:23, 36:2

phoned [1] - 9:15phoning [1] - 35:25physical [1] - 18:27picking [1] - 37:23piece [1] - 28:18pieces [2] - 39:7, 39:10place [4] - 3:29, 4:10,

38:28, 42:7planned [1] - 38:27plant [6] - 22:14, 22:22,

23:26, 24:24, 30:9, 35:27

plants [3] - 22:19, 22:20, 22:25

point [8] - 40:14, 41:25, 42:18, 44:4, 44:5, 44:8, 45:10, 45:24

pointed [1] - 37:19points [4] - 27:28, 36:17,

42:4, 45:21police [1] - 28:22policing [2] - 10:24,

13:10policy [1] - 6:26population [1] - 32:24portion [1] - 21:22position [14] - 7:28, 8:2,

11:24, 20:9, 20:19, 21:13, 30:23, 35:27, 36:10, 37:8, 37:12, 42:24, 43:3, 43:17

possession [2] - 24:23, 29:22

possibility [1] - 27:12possible [3] - 7:21, 29:10,

40:23possibly [2] - 29:9, 40:26post-9/11 [1] - 23:15potentially [2] - 29:18powder [7] - 22:21,

22:23, 22:24, 22:25, 25:28, 32:8, 32:10

premises [1] - 27:21prepared [4] - 5:11, 9:2,

9:7, 12:20prescription [2] - 27:15,

30:26present [1] - 10:29presentation [1] - 27:3presented [2] - 9:19,

24:28pressed [2] - 12:30, 13:4presumably [4] - 27:4,

29:26, 32:25, 33:27pretence [1] - 4:17pretty [2] - 9:8, 14:25

previous [2] - 24:14, 24:15

primarily [1] - 8:7problem [1] - 11:11problems" [1] - 14:15procedural [1] - 18:29proceeded [1] - 6:12proceedings [1] - 2:15produced [2] - 22:21,

25:28product [8] - 18:22,

18:30, 19:1, 22:18, 27:5, 28:14, 35:9, 38:29

products [1] - 22:22proffered [2] - 42:6,

42:13property [2] - 18:23,

18:27proposition [1] - 11:9prosecution [1] - 22:12prospective [2] - 38:14,

38:18provide [3] - 20:4, 38:15,

43:3provided [6] - 25:20,

37:3, 41:26, 44:9, 44:25, 45:13

proximity [1] - 8:23prudent [1] - 3:4PSNI [1] - 34:20public [4] - 30:25, 41:27,

44:10, 45:23publication [1] - 13:27purporting [1] - 30:18purpose [2] - 6:24, 9:29push [1] - 7:9pushed [2] - 6:28, 7:8pushing [1] - 7:21put [6] - 21:25, 21:30,

24:4, 25:2, 25:6, 30:19puts [1] - 43:21putting [1] - 27:28

Qquantities [1] - 32:9quarter [1] - 43:10questioning [1] - 2:6questions [11] - 14:11,

15:19, 15:21, 16:9, 31:4, 34:13, 36:12, 39:29, 42:20, 42:28, 43:25

quick [1] - 15:28quite [7] - 5:20, 5:22, 7:8,

19:24, 39:28, 40:23, 40:25

quotes [1] - 11:2

Rraise [1] - 10:9raised [5] - 5:19, 13:11,

14:24, 14:28, 42:15rather [3] - 24:30, 27:20,

40:15re [2] - 16:9, 16:11RE [1] - 39:26

re-examination [2] - 16:9, 16:11

RE-EXAMINED [1] - 39:26

reaction [1] - 6:25read [13] - 7:14, 16:1,

21:22, 22:1, 23:8, 24:20, 31:11, 31:22, 32:1, 32:3, 36:20, 36:25, 37:22

Real [1] - 26:19really [2] - 36:18, 37:13reason [3] - 38:7, 44:20,

44:21reasons [2] - 3:22, 15:12receive [2] - 21:1, 21:2received [8] - 19:7, 19:16,

19:22, 20:5, 20:6, 20:8, 23:22, 43:27

recently [1] - 14:2recollection [3] - 1:8,

7:17, 9:22recollections [1] - 3:17record [4] - 4:8, 22:30,

32:2, 37:16recorded [4] - 6:10, 23:2,

28:4, 38:24recording [1] - 27:23records [2] - 5:13, 35:8reduced [1] - 4:22refer [3] - 24:18, 40:13,

41:6reference [2] - 7:18, 42:5referred [7] - 3:23, 6:3,

7:4, 7:15, 42:4, 42:11referring [1] - 14:19refers [1] - 29:26regarding [10] - 6:26,

6:27, 11:12, 19:20, 24:21, 35:8, 35:25, 35:28, 45:12, 45:16

regular [1] - 33:3related [1] - 30:5relates [1] - 23:16relating [3] - 13:30,

25:18, 30:15relation [24] - 2:9, 2:14,

5:14, 5:21, 7:9, 9:8, 9:16, 12:16, 12:20, 13:4, 22:16, 23:1, 23:4, 34:25, 37:10, 38:18, 39:7, 39:20, 39:21, 40:9, 42:6, 42:13, 43:18, 45:13

relations [1] - 6:27release [3] - 6:8, 6:12,

15:10released [1] - 10:5releasing [1] - 9:28relevant [1] - 36:18remember [4] - 7:20,

19:6, 20:21, 28:29remit [1] - 33:18replaced [4] - 11:24,

11:25, 12:2, 13:8reply [1] - 40:3report [5] - 5:13, 9:2,

12:19, 12:24, 13:28

reported [2] - 26:21, 37:24

reports [3] - 11:30, 12:12Republic [4] - 26:15,

34:24, 35:3, 35:14Republican [1] - 6:2Research [3] - 3:24, 7:1,

7:12respect [2] - 42:19, 42:23responsibility [1] - 5:27responsible [1] - 8:7result [3] - 3:7, 4:12,

44:23resulting [1] - 6:14RESUMED [1] - 1:1retain [1] - 35:8retired [1] - 25:7reveals [1] - 13:27review [1] - 15:5rich [1] - 28:28Ringaskiddy [6] - 22:14,

23:26, 24:1, 24:24, 30:8, 35:26

risk [3] - 4:2, 9:30road [1] - 4:18rob [1] - 38:4Roberts [4] - 26:7, 32:18,

32:19, 35:5ROBINSON [11] - 34:15,

34:17, 34:19, 41:15, 41:25, 42:4, 42:11, 44:8, 45:4, 45:10, 45:27

Robinson [8] - 34:19, 42:19, 42:23, 42:26, 44:3, 44:12, 45:20, 45:23

role [2] - 24:7, 38:15room [1] - 21:10rooms [1] - 21:12Rosslare [1] - 22:26roughly [1] - 19:9RUC [1] - 25:7

Ssafe [2] - 12:25, 43:29safety [3] - 4:9, 9:26, 15:1Safety [1] - 18:15sale [2] - 26:3, 30:25sales [1] - 32:20sample [6] - 25:20, 28:29,

29:2, 37:4, 39:2, 39:21sample.. [1] - 29:24samples [6] - 26:20,

26:22, 26:23, 37:24, 37:25

Saturday [4] - 21:2, 21:3, 36:3, 36:4

saw [2] - 10:5, 10:7scale [2] - 10:7, 15:10Scappaticci [5] - 6:2,

6:14, 9:5, 13:3, 15:26Scappaticci's [1] - 6:13SDU [1] - 12:13Seanad [1] - 6:22second [8] - 5:6, 5:10,

13:23, 24:16, 25:10, 29:5, 30:10, 36:2



5

secondly [1] - 39:8secret [1] - 6:23Secrets [2] - 7:30, 8:2secrets [1] - 32:20secure [3] - 26:14, 29:24,

29:25security [22] - 3:22, 3:30,

4:3, 5:21, 7:25, 9:21, 9:26, 10:24, 11:12, 13:10, 15:2, 15:16, 18:9, 18:19, 18:28, 18:29, 23:14, 24:3, 24:8, 33:27, 34:25

Security [2] - 22:5, 33:14see [16] - 5:2, 11:27,

18:16, 21:27, 27:29, 29:28, 30:4, 30:6, 30:17, 30:21, 34:9, 37:15, 38:6, 40:10, 40:18

selling [2] - 28:26, 33:6Senate [1] - 6:22senator [2] - 6:21, 8:2Senior [1] - 22:4senior [1] - 7:4sensationalism [1] -

15:10sensitive [5] - 3:26, 5:20,

6:8, 7:24, 9:28sent [3] - 26:3, 26:5, 26:6sequence [1] - 19:24Sergeant [9] - 21:3,

21:12, 23:9, 24:20, 36:4, 39:30, 40:7, 41:16, 41:21

serial [3] - 26:24, 36:30, 37:27

service [1] - 6:23services [2] - 9:21, 15:16shares [1] - 44:22shifts [1] - 29:5ship [1] - 35:17shipped [2] - 22:26,

35:15shipping [1] - 18:30short [1] - 14:11showed [1] - 31:10shown [6] - 31:22, 31:30,

37:2, 39:30, 40:2, 40:4sic [1] - 10:11side [1] - 24:3sight [1] - 4:19signature [1] - 21:28signed [3] - 9:7, 21:27,

23:9significant [4] - 34:3,

34:6, 34:9, 34:10Siochana [9] - 3:3, 3:6,

6:30, 7:11, 11:8, 15:1, 15:13, 23:1, 31:6

sites [2] - 24:8, 24:9sitting [1] - 46:2six [2] - 8:13, 22:20size [2] - 35:18, 43:2slightly [2] - 27:3, 29:6Smith [1] - 40:15SMITH [3] - 36:14, 36:16,

38:30

Smithwick [3] - 22:16, 24:18, 40:9

sold [3] - 26:16, 27:7, 29:15

solicitor [2] - 44:22, 45:11

solicitor's [1] - 19:23Solicitor's [1] - 19:29someone [1] - 26:17sometime [1] - 6:28somewhere [1] - 28:2sorry [7] - 5:9, 10:2,

15:27, 21:17, 25:9, 36:2, 42:11

sort [5] - 11:11, 32:20, 33:3, 33:7, 33:10

source [2] - 6:29, 27:9sources [4] - 5:28, 5:29,

6:4south [2] - 34:23, 35:4speaking [1] - 8:27Special [4] - 4:25, 11:25,

12:14, 12:25special [2] - 5:27, 12:19specific [2] - 39:6, 39:10specifically [1] - 13:2spoken [1] - 40:27squad [6] - 39:3, 39:17,

42:5, 42:12, 45:13Squad [2] - 25:23, 37:5staff [1] - 41:20stage [11] - 2:15, 5:26,

5:30, 10:9, 10:25, 13:9, 32:19, 38:24, 39:11, 42:19

stages [1] - 29:29stand [1] - 16:24start [2] - 27:30, 28:20started [1] - 4:4starting [2] - 25:15, 28:19State [2] - 7:24, 19:28state [2] - 22:12, 24:5statement [31] - 5:10,

5:12, 9:7, 11:9, 15:30, 20:10, 20:19, 20:24, 21:5, 21:14, 21:16, 21:19, 22:4, 22:9, 23:8, 23:10, 24:20, 24:21, 24:25, 24:26, 24:30, 25:27, 30:27, 31:6, 35:27, 36:2, 36:7, 36:11, 38:8, 40:7, 41:6

statements [1] - 2:14station [2] - 20:10, 36:6Station [5] - 13:25, 21:6,

21:8, 21:11, 23:19stayed [2] - 12:13, 12:14still [2] - 26:25, 37:27sting [5] - 26:30, 27:1,

29:6, 38:3, 38:7stock [2] - 32:30, 43:10stolen [5] - 24:23, 29:8,

30:20, 40:20, 41:3stop [1] - 29:5stopped [1] - 38:6storage [5] - 28:2, 29:17,

29:24, 29:25, 35:3store [2] - 26:14, 35:9

stored [6] - 22:22, 22:24, 28:3, 30:2, 30:8, 35:1

Street [1] - 21:6strike [1] - 25:3stuff [2] - 26:28, 38:1stung [1] - 30:18stymied [1] - 11:5subject [2] - 11:1, 43:14subscribe [1] - 21:15subsequent [1] - 9:15subsequently [9] - 4:19,

4:30, 5:1, 8:11, 9:14, 10:28, 23:1, 25:16, 30:14

suggest [1] - 2:28suggesting [2] - 41:1,

43:16suggestion [3] - 41:9,

43:20, 45:8Suir [1] - 3:14suits [1] - 21:7summary [1] - 5:8Sunday [2] - 2:26, 6:13superintendent [1] -

36:10Superintendent [13] -

3:8, 3:9, 4:24, 4:27, 10:22, 11:21, 11:22, 11:23, 12:3, 13:29, 35:24

Superintendent's [3] - 12:13, 12:15, 12:25

supplied [5] - 22:15, 24:18, 25:17, 30:15, 40:8

supply [2] - 23:5, 33:1supported [1] - 24:8suppose [1] - 4:2supposed [1] - 23:25SWORN [2] - 2:1, 18:1system [1] - 33:24

Ttablet [11] - 22:23, 25:20,

26:16, 26:18, 28:27, 28:29, 39:2, 39:5, 39:7, 39:10, 39:21

tablets [44] - 22:17, 23:3, 23:25, 24:23, 25:18, 25:25, 26:1, 26:14, 26:15, 27:16, 27:23, 27:24, 28:2, 28:24, 28:26, 29:1, 29:12, 29:15, 29:17, 29:19, 29:30, 30:2, 30:6, 30:8, 30:16, 32:27, 33:22, 34:5, 35:1, 35:12, 35:26, 36:21, 36:26, 37:6, 37:10, 37:17, 38:5, 40:10, 40:20, 40:25, 40:28, 40:30, 41:2

talks [1] - 33:6Task [2] - 7:17, 7:19tasked [1] - 11:27team [2] - 11:18, 41:20teased [1] - 40:14

telephone [9] - 4:13, 4:17, 4:19, 4:20, 5:2, 20:4, 20:13, 35:22, 41:22

ten [2] - 7:15, 34:7tendered [1] - 22:11term [1] - 10:30terms [2] - 18:20, 27:16THE [15] - 1:1, 13:16,

14:7, 15:23, 16:16, 16:30, 17:1, 31:2, 34:17, 36:14, 39:26, 44:1, 46:11

theft [27] - 19:21, 20:19, 22:16, 23:2, 23:3, 23:4, 23:25, 23:28, 24:10, 25:18, 28:14, 30:5, 30:15, 35:26, 35:28, 37:16, 38:11, 38:14, 38:27, 39:20, 39:21, 40:9, 40:13, 40:15, 40:16, 40:24, 41:7

theft" [1] - 40:13thefts [1] - 38:24theirs [3] - 26:28, 37:11,

38:2THEN [3] - 16:16, 44:1,

46:11therefore [1] - 29:11threat [1] - 3:22three [5] - 12:12, 16:22,

16:24, 16:27, 35:5throughout [1] - 11:15thrust [1] - 37:13tie [1] - 36:5Tipperary [1] - 3:20TO [1] - 46:11today [7] - 37:8, 37:14,

38:9, 44:10, 44:16, 45:2, 45:30

Tom [1] - 14:22tomorrow [3] - 38:21,

46:6, 46:8took [2] - 5:10, 42:7top [2] - 32:22, 33:12touch [1] - 20:1touching [1] - 45:17towards [1] - 15:8track [2] - 33:30, 45:11tracked [1] - 36:30tracking [1] - 33:28trade [1] - 32:20Traffic [5] - 7:18, 7:20,

7:22, 7:23, 7:26trafficking [1] - 15:15transcript [8] - 24:27,

24:28, 24:30, 31:6, 31:9, 36:20, 36:25, 42:12

transported [1] - 32:9TRIBUNAL [4] - 1:1,

16:30, 17:1, 46:11Tribunal [37] - 2:10, 2:11,

2:17, 5:18, 5:25, 12:1, 14:27, 15:7, 19:3, 20:9, 20:15, 20:16, 20:18, 20:22, 20:24, 20:26, 22:16, 23:26, 24:18,

24:21, 24:29, 28:17, 35:22, 35:25, 35:29, 36:8, 36:18, 38:9, 40:9, 41:16, 41:19, 41:23, 41:29, 44:6, 44:14, 44:26, 45:5

true [3] - 21:19, 22:9, 22:13

try [2] - 11:4, 45:15trying [4] - 6:24, 26:29,

36:5, 38:3Tuesday [3] - 44:18, 46:2,

46:8TUESDAY [1] - 46:11turn [1] - 33:3turn-around [1] - 33:3turned [1] - 24:1turns [1] - 44:15two [23] - 2:21, 2:23,

3:22, 4:5, 6:30, 8:23, 10:15, 16:20, 18:16, 21:8, 26:23, 29:1, 31:24, 32:15, 32:17, 34:21, 37:26, 39:6, 39:10, 40:2, 41:2, 41:3, 42:4

type [3] - 4:9, 7:23, 8:15typed [1] - 22:1

UUK [2] - 34:29, 35:19ultimately [1] - 44:24uncharitable [1] - 15:8under [7] - 3:22, 9:30,

11:13, 28:20, 39:29, 41:27, 44:10

understandable [1] - 39:13

understood [1] - 20:25undertook [1] - 37:15unfortunately [2] - 1:6,

46:5unit [3] - 3:23, 3:24, 3:26Unit [12] - 3:24, 4:25, 7:1,

7:12, 7:18, 7:20, 7:22, 7:23, 7:26, 11:26, 12:14, 12:26

United [5] - 26:7, 32:17, 32:18, 34:29, 35:6

unsustainable [1] - 11:10up [16] - 9:3, 10:16, 11:2,

21:26, 21:30, 24:1, 25:2, 27:5, 29:17, 30:11, 30:24, 33:8, 36:5, 37:23, 42:22

update [1] - 1:7uses [1] - 40:13

Vvalue [3] - 33:7, 33:22,

34:8various [2] - 12:29, 43:27veracity [1] - 21:16verify [1] - 43:23version [1] - 22:1via [1] - 22:26



6

Viagra [29] - 19:21, 20:19, 22:19, 22:23, 22:24, 23:2, 23:3, 23:5, 23:25, 24:23, 25:18, 26:14, 26:15, 27:15, 28:2, 28:23, 28:25, 30:6, 30:8, 30:16, 30:24, 30:25, 32:21, 34:8, 35:1, 35:26, 43:13, 45:16

view [5] - 9:30, 10:4, 14:29, 41:26, 44:8

WWalsh [11] - 2:7, 2:25,

3:8, 3:18, 4:25, 4:26, 5:15, 8:18, 11:25, 14:13, 14:19

WAS [9] - 2:1, 13:16, 14:7, 15:23, 18:1, 31:2, 34:17, 36:14, 39:26

waste [1] - 46:7Waterford [2] - 5:6, 13:24well-known [3] - 4:5, 4:6,

6:13whatsoever [3] - 5:4,

9:12, 10:23whereas [2] - 41:6, 41:9whole [1] - 34:23wholesalers [1] - 33:2wise [2] - 35:18WITHDREW [2] - 16:16,

44:1witness [19] - 1:4, 16:18,

16:27, 17:3, 21:12, 24:22, 25:11, 31:24, 42:1, 42:2, 42:6, 42:13, 42:27, 44:10, 45:2, 45:4, 45:12, 45:14, 46:8

WITNESS [9] - 13:16, 14:7, 15:23, 16:16, 31:2, 34:17, 36:14, 39:26, 44:1

Witness [15] - 25:6, 26:21, 30:12, 31:15, 37:2, 37:9, 38:30, 39:13, 42:4, 42:9, 42:11, 42:15, 45:14, 45:17

witnessed [1] - 23:9witnesses [3] - 43:27,

46:6, 46:7wonder [2] - 42:5, 42:13wondering [1] - 8:24word [1] - 40:13words [3] - 29:7, 30:19,

35:23workings [1] - 19:3worth [1] - 6:9wrap [2] - 30:11, 30:24wrapped [1] - 27:5wrapping [1] - 30:11writing [2] - 4:23, 15:5

Yyear [8] - 19:11, 19:12,

22:19, 22:30, 23:16,



7

24:4, 30:23, 30:24years [5] - 6:11, 18:7,

23:7, 32:30, 34:7years' [1] - 8:13yes.. [1] - 26:26yesterday [2] - 2:7, 2:20young [1] - 32:26yourself [5] - 3:8, 5:24,

14:13, 23:9, 25:11

££10 [4] - 26:16, 28:27,

33:6, 33:8£5 [3] - 26:18, 28:29, 33:8

Documents

A P P E A R A N C E S The Sole Member For the Tribunal · At one stage, he told us that the organisation that he was involved in had a special responsibility for dealing with sources