7- Reducing Stress, Chronic Pain and Talking to …...Kevin: Thank you, Katie. I'm extraordinarily excited to be here and I love what you're doing. Katie: Awesome. Thank you. I'm gonna

Copyright © 2017 Wellness Mama · All Rights Reserved

1

Episode7:ReducingStress,ChronicPain,&Talking

toDoctors


2

Katie:Hi,I'mKatiefromwellnessmama.com.Welcometoepisodesevenofthe"WellnessMamaPodcast,"whereIprovidesimpleanswersforhealthierfamilies.Thisepisode'sinterestingfactsarethatpeopleunderstresswhodon'thandlethestressoffinancialissuesaretwiceaslikelytodevelopgumdiseasethanthosewhodon't.Additionally,it'samyththatstressturnshairgrey,butitcancausehairloss.Telogeneffluvium,orhairloss,canstartuptothreemonthsafterastressfulevent.AndI'veactuallyhadpersonalexperiencewiththat,andImadethatconnection,butthere'shopebecausebangingyourheadagainstawallcanburn150caloriesanhour,andwhoknows,itmighthelpdealwithstress.Asyoumighthaveguessedwe'regonnabetalkingalotaboutstresstoday.OurguesttodayisDr.KevinCuccaro,whohasanamazingwebsiteandpodcastcalled"StraightShotHealth."Andhe'sadoctorwhostruggledwiththecurrenthealthcaresystem,andhewasfrustratedbecauseheonlygottoseepatientsoncetheyhadalreadygottensickorhadaproblem.Sohelefthisprivatepracticeandhenowworkstohelpeducatepatients,andfocusonmakinghealthychanges,andpreventingtheproblemsinthefirstplace.Sowelcome,Kevin.Thankyousomuchforbeinghere.Kevin:Thankyou,Katie.I'mextraordinarilyexcitedtobehereandIlovewhatyou'redoing.Katie:Awesome.Thankyou.I'mgonnagojumprightinbecauseIthinkyouhavesuchgreatinformation.Tostartcanyoutellusaboutyourbackground,andhowyougotintoyourcurrentareaofexpertise?Kevin:Yeah,sure.SoI'manOsteopathicphysician.IwenttoaD.O.schoolto...reallybecauseIwasinterestedinhowthebodyrelatedtohealth,andIwasmorefocusedholistically.Andthenwhathappenedisyougetintomedicalschoolandyoustartgettingintoyourrotations,andIfellinlovewithanesthesia.AndIlovedthatoperatingroomenvironment.Ilovedbeingabletoactuallyseetheeffectsthatcertainthingsthatwedidonpatient'sbodieshad.AndkindofalongthatsamerouteIfellintopain,andpainbecameveryinterestingtomebecauseIenjoyedthecontinuityIhadwithpatients,aswellastryingtosolvetheproblemthattheywerehavingandprovidethemsometools.SoIendedupgettingafellowshipinpainmanagement.Andthenafterthatwasalldone,Iwenttothemilitaryandservedtimetheretakingcareofareallydiversepatientpopulation.Itwasafantasticexperience.Practicedwithsixotherfellowshiptraineddocs,learnedfromeachother,butbecamequitefrustratedbecauseIthoughtthat...becausewehadsomanybasicallyhandsinthepot,thattheoutcomesthatwewerehavingweren'tasgoodastheycouldbe.SowhenIleftthemilitary,Iwentintoasmallertown,andreallyhadmyownpracticewhereIthoughtthat,ifIwasseeingsomebody,andIwasfollowingupwiththem,andIthenwastreatingthemwherewewere...youknow,andprovidingthetoolstotreatthemthatmadeoutcomes...particularlywithchronicpain,wouldbemuchbetterthanwhatweweregettinginthemilitary.BecauseIwasalittlebitmorecontrol,Iguessyoucansay,I'mkindofacontrolfreak.AndwhatIfoundisthattheoutcomesIwashavingwerenobetterthanwhatIwasgettinginthemilitary,and


3

somepeoplewouldsaythosewereokay.Butforme,whenI'mhavingpeoplecomeintoanoffice,Iwantpeopletofeelbetter,getwell,andthennothavetocomebacktothedoctoroverandoveragain.Sosomepeoplewouldsay,"Well,ifI'mseeingsomebodyeverythreemonthsthat'sagoodthing."Iwouldsay,"IfI'mseeingsomebodyeverythreemonthsthat'sabadthing."Becausetheyshouldbeouttheregettingonwiththeirlivesanddoingthethingsthattheyneedtodoandtheyshouldn'tbehavingtoseedoctorsalltime.Andthatwasquitedepressingforawhile.AndwhatIdiscoveredisI,youknow,justtooksometimetoreallythinkaboutwhatmytraininghadbeen,andIstartedreallygettingintotheresearchandliteratureandfoundthat,youknow,whenitcomestohealth,mostofthehealthproblemsthatwe'retreatinginthisdayandagearerelatedtolifestyleandbehavior.Andifwereallywannagetpeoplehealthy,andhelpthemtokeepawayfromthemedicalsystemandactuallylivefullandwelllives,we'vegottafocusonchangingbehavior.Andthecurrentmedicalsystemwehave,justdoesnotallowthat.Itdoesthebestitcan,butit'snotgearedtowardchronicdisease,it'snotgearedtowardschanginglifestyleandbehavior.Andtobequitehonest,doctorsaren'tpaidthatway.They'renotpaidtoactuallykeeppeoplehealthybecauseofthewaythattheappointmentsaresetup,andinthewaytheinsuranceprovides.AndIfinally,justsaid,"Youknowwhat?Ican'tdothis.I'mnotgonnastickaroundandstayinthismodel."AndsoIleft,andthat'swhereIamtoday.Katie:That'swonderful,andI'mrighttherewithyou.Alargepartofmyaudiencearewomenandmoms,andsothat'soneofmypoints.Thisisespeciallywithchildren,isthatlifestylesoimportantinthosefoundationalyears,andthentryingtohitoffsomeoftheseproblemsratherthanjusttreatthemwhentheyhappen.AndIknowIwritealotaboutstressanditsimpactonpeoplephysically,andmentally,andemotionally,andIknowthatyou'vedealtwiththatsideofthingsalotinyourdealingswithchronicpain.Soit'sprettycommonknowledgethattoomuchofacertainkindofstressisbadforusbutcanyouexplainthatphysiologicaleffectandwhatstressisactuallydoing?Kevin:Sure.Thekeyconceptswithstressisthatreallystressislife.Sowehavetohavesomeamountofstressinourlives.Stress...itbasicallycausesaresponse.Soyouneedtohaveahungerresponseandthat'satypeofstresssothatyougoeat,youhavetodootherthings.Thatyouhavetogetoutofbedanddothingsthatyoudo.Soifyoudon'thaveenoughstress,you'renotgonnabeabletogrow.Ontheotherside,thoughistoomuchstress,andthat'swhatwehavetoomuchnow.Andthere'sonebigthingaboutstressthat,Ithink,youprobablyhavetalkedabout.I'mgonnakindahitagain,isthatwhenweareinasituationwherethestressresponse,whichisreallywhatwe'retalkingaboutisinitiated,wehave...inourbodyitreleasesadrenaline,itcausesourheartratetogoup,itcausesourbloodpressuretogoup.Becausewhatisgettingusreadytodoisreallytoeitherfightoffsomethingortofleefromsomethingthat"fightorflightresponse."Now,again,that'snotbad.Theproblemiswhenthatkeepsgoingon.Becausewhenyouhavethateffect,whenyourheartisbeatingstrongly,whenyourbloodpressureisgoingup,whenthebloodflowinyourbodyisactuallygoingtobigmuscleslike,intoyourlegsandarms,thingsthatyou'regonnaneedtoswingaclub,ifwewerebackinthecavemandays.It'stakingthebloodflowandtheenergyfromotherareas,thingslikeyourstomachandyourintestines,soyoudon'tdigestaswell.Fromyourreproductiveorgans,sothatifyou'retryingtogetpregnantthatit'smoredifficulttoconceive.Psychologically,there'seffectsaswell.Sowhenyouareinthesestressresponse


4

situations,yourperspectivestartstonarrowdown,yourmemoryactuallystartstogethyperacutebecauseyourbodyistellingyou,"Hey,thisissomethingthat'simportant.I'mgonnaneedtorememberthisforthefuturesothatifitcomesupagain,I'llhavethismemorytorememberwhatmyresponsewasandwhetheritworkedornot."Butthatcanalsobebadbecausewhenyouhavethatkindofheightenedmemory,itcanleadyoutosituationswhereyouhavepost-traumaticstressdisorder.Whenthingsaresoimprintedonyourbrain,itcausesthiscontinualresponseinyourbodythisisoveractivefightorflight.Icouldtalkaboutthisforalongtime,I'mnotsureifyouwannagoalittlebitfartheronthatornot.Katie:Yeah,thatwasreallyhelpful.Ithinkyou'resorightbecausesometimesit'ssoblackandwhitestressisbadandnothavingstressisgood.ButIlovethatyoumadethatpointaboutstressbeingnecessarybuthavingtokeepitinthatproperbalance.Anditseemslike,anythingwithhealth,it'seasytoknowsomethingmaybeharmfultoyou,butthehardpartistoactuallymakethatchange.Socanyougiveussomepracticaltipstohelpusdealwithstress,andbecomemoreresilient,andtousestressinthatpositivewaywe'retalkingabout?Kevin:Absolutely.AsIsaid,whenstressreallykindofaffectsyou,inthiscase,thestressresponse,it'sturnedon,youknow,there'sthison-switchwhenyouhavethatresponse.Andthere'sacouplewaysthatyoucanviewhowthatswitchgetsturnedon,andIliketousekindof,like,alightswitchanalogywithit.Andifyou'veseensomeofthoselightswitchestheyhaveaslider,sowhenthey'reoffandthenyoucankindofslidethemup,andthelightscanbeeitherdim,oryoucanturnupreallyhighlightsareverybright,andstressisverysimilar.Soyoucaneitherturnthatlightswitchonreally,reallyhigh,oryoucanturnonjustenough,andyoucanturnitoff.Andsowhenwelookatstress,stressisturnedonbytwofactors.One,howweactuallyperceivetheevent.Soifweseesomethinghappeningandwethinkitisathreatweturnthatlightswitchonvery,veryhigh,allright?Soonewaythatyoucandotokindofminimize,andjustgettheamountofstressthatyouneedforthatsituation,isbeabletoviewitmoreasachallenge.Ifyoufeellikeyouhavethetoolstoovercomeit,thatkindofswitchesthatstressresponselessandlessharmfulthanitwouldotherwise.Theotherwaytodoitisactuallytogrowyourabilitieswithdealingwithstress,andthatcomesthroughfindingchallengingopportunities,thingsthatarejustalittlebitmoredifficultthanyou'reusedtoandpracticingwiththem.Sodoingthingsthatareslightlyuncomfortableovertime,doingnewsituations,learningnewskills,andthatgrowsyourabilitytodealwithothersituationsinthefuture,andyourstressresponseactuallybecomesless.Andthenthelastoneistoincreasetimestorecovery,andwhatthoseareiswhenyouactuallyturnthatresponseoff.AndthiswaswelldescribedinabookbyDr.HerbertBenson,who'saPhysician,he'sstillpracticing,Ithink,atHarvardMedicalSchool.It'safantasticbook.Firstwritteninthe70s,it'scalledthe"RelaxationResponse"itwasrepublishedin2006,Ithink,asthe"RelaxationRevolution."Itreallytalksaboutthestressresponseandtheoffswitchforthestressresponse,whichistherelaxationresponse.Andtherelaxationresponseisactuallyinourbodies,it'saphysiologicresponsethatwehave,anditturnsoffallthethingsthatthestressresponsedoes.Soit,youknow,makesthebloodgoawayfromthelargemusclegroups,andbackdownintoyourintestinesandyourstomacharea,backtothereproductiveorgans.Itdropsyourheartrate,decreasesyourblood


5

pressure,youknow,widensyourviewpoint,kindachangesthewaythatyourmemoryisworking.Andthewaythatyouinitiatethatorcausethatresponsetohappen,though,isyouhavetodosomesortoffocusedactivity.Sounlikethestressresponsewhichisasurvivalmechanism,weneededthatoverthecenturiesanddecadesandthousandsandhundredsofthousandsofyearstosurvive,therelaxingresponseissomethingthatyoukindahavetoconsciouslyturnon.Andyoudothatbyfindingafocusedactivity,thatispassiveinnature.Andwhatthatmeansisifyou'redoingonlyonething.Ithastobesomewherequiet,sothere'snodistractionsaround,andthenyouhavetoperformitconsistently.Andthesearethingsthatyoucandosuchasmeditation,whichIdon'tnecessarilyliketousethetermmeditationbecausepeoplestartthinkingaboutpeoplebanginggongs,andMontrose,andincenseburning.Andreallyisjusttakingatimetositquietlyandfocusononething.SothewayIrecommendtopeopletostartisjustfocusonbreathing.Soifyoucangetupinthemorningandfindaquiettimeoryousitinachairanddodeepbreathing,whereyoureallybreathingfromyourbellyandyou'redoingthatstartingwithcoupleminutesadayandworkingupslowlyto10minutes,that'sgonnacausethisrelaxationresponsetogooff.You'regonnafindthattherestyourdayiscalmer,thatyourabilitytofocusisalittlebitbetter.Andthat'stheeasiestwaytostartreally,Ithink,intostressmanagement.Katie:Thankyou.Thosearesopractical.Andjustkindofasafollowuptothatquestionbeforewemoveontoanothertopic,obviously,like,it'ssomething...likeyoumentionedwehavetoworkondealingwithstress,andalotofusjustthinkofstressasjustkindofamentalmindsetorareactiontothings.ButonethingI'vewrittenalotaboutishowevenifwedon'tfeelstressed,wecouldbehavingastressresponsetoourenvironment.Whetheritbejustcompoundsorthingsthatwe'reinteractingwith,intheenvironmentorthere'sevenresearchonlightatdifferenttimesofdayandbluelightatnightcausingastressresponsethatwemaynotrealize,oreventhingslikeasedentarylifestylecancreatephysiologicalstressthatwedon'tnecessarilyidentifyasmentalstress.Canyoutalkalittlebitaboutthat,anddothosesamerelaxationtechniqueshelpwiththosekindofstressresponsesaswell?Kevin:Yeah,absolutely.Ithinkallofthose...whenyou'renotrecognizingstress,that'swherethatrecoveryprinciplecomesin.Soit'ssortof,like,ifyougointhesameenvironmentallthetime,itjustbecomesnormaltoyou.Thisissortofahorribleanalogy,butsomepeoplearelivinginabsolutelyatrociousenvironments.Ifyoulookinsomethirdworldnationsandthere'sconstantconflictallthetime,andpoverty,andfamine,and,youknow,peoplekillingeachother,thatbecomesyournormal.Andyoumayviewthatasyournormal,butyourbodyisunderthisconstantthreatresponse.Sothelittlebaseofthebrain,thatsurvivalmechanismhascompletelykickedin,that'stherootofthebrain,whatwewouldcallthebrainstemifwewannastartgettingintothegreaterdetailhere.Buttheconsciouspartofitdoesn'trecognizeitbecauseitseemslikeit'snormal,it'swhatyou'reinallthetime.It'ssortof,like,ifyougointoaroom,andit'sthesameroomthatyou'rewalkingthrougheverydayorthesamehallwaythatyou'rewalkingthroughallthetime,youstoptonoticethepicturesonthewall.Andwhatyouneedtodoistakeamomentwhereyouactually...orifsomeonechangesapicturethatyou


6

actuallytakeachancetoactuallyseesomethingdifferent.Thisisnotthebestwaytoexplainit,butyoukindofgetwhatI'mgettingatthere?Katie:Yeah,Ido.That'sreallyhelpful,andjustthatreminderforpeopletokeepaneyeoutforthat,andtobewarythattherecanbeothersourcesofstressbesidesjustlike,"Oh,Ifeelsostressedrightnow."Sothatwasreallyhelpful.Kevin:Well,I'mjustgonnastopyoujustkindakickedmybrainintogear.Oneofthethingsthathelpswiththisorthatpeoplekindofrecognitionwhenitoccursbutthentheyforgetaboutwhentheygetbackintothings,ifyou'rethisworkaholicpersonandyou'rebusy,busy,busy,busyandyoukindoffeellikeyourdaysarerunningintoeachotheroverandoveragain.Andwhatpeoplethendoiswhentheygoonvacation,they'llstartrecognizing,"Whoa,mybody...Ifeelsomuchbetter,Ifeelsomuchmorerelaxed."Andtheymayhavenotevenrecognizedthattensedupfeelingthattheywerehavingallthetimewhiletheywereatwork.Itwasjustwhentheyweretakingthatmomenttogetawayfromit,thattheysaid,"Youknowwhat?IwasmuchmorestressedthanIthoughtabout."AndIthinkIthinkthatexplainsalittlebitbetter.Isthatbetter?Katie:Thatwashelpful,andI'vedefinitelyhadthatexperiencehappenbothwithjusteverythinggoingoninlife.AndIsteppedbackfromitforaminute,andI'mlike,"Wow,Ididn'tevenrealizehowmuchpressureIwasunderorhowmuchstressIwasunder."Andforme,it'sbeenastrugglebecauseIfeellikeI'mmoreproductive,andIgetalotmoredonewhenI'munderalotofstress.It'skindofthatbusinessesbreed'sproductivitytypething.SoIhadtoconsciouslymakethateffort.ButsomethingelseIknowyou'rereallyfamiliarwithandtalkalotaboutischronicpain,andlikeyousaid,wasapartofwhereyougotyourstart.AndIknowthat'saverybigareaoffrustrationforalotofpeople.Socanyoushedsomelightontherootcausesofchronicpainandtheproblemsyoufoundwiththecurrentmodelofcare?Maybegivelistenersanideaofhowtheycouldgoaboutfindingtheirownanswerswhenitcomestochronicpain?Kevin:Ah,that'sahugetopic,butitdiddefinitelyinfluencemyresearchinpursuitofreallythestressandbehavioralstrategies.Sopainbyitself...soreallyyouhavetounderstandwhattheconstructofpainis,andthere'salotofmisconceptionsouttherewhenitcomestopain.Peoplethinkthatthereiseitherphysicalpainorthatthere'spsychologicalpain,andthatsortofleadsintothiskindofmindsetthatthere'srealpainandthereisno...likeunrealpainorfakepain.Andtheproblemwiththatisallpainispain.Ifyouhavepain,itspain.Itdoesn'tmatterwhetherit'sphysicaloremotional.AndifyouactuallylookatthedefinitionofpainfromtheAmericanPainSocietyorTheInternationalAssociationfortheStudyofPain,itisasubjective...excuseme,it'sasensoryandemotionalexperienceassociatedwithactualorpotentialtissuedamageordescribedintermsthereof.Andthat'sabunchoffancymedicaltalk.Sobasicallysayingit'sasensory,sothatthere'ssomesortofinput,andthenit'sanemotional,meaningthatthere'ssomesortofbrainprocessgoingonexperience.Soyoutapsomethinginyourbodythatprovidesanervesignalthatgoestothebrainandthenthebraintakesthatnervesignal,andsays,"Thisispain."Okay,butthecoreareawithallofthatishowthebrainprocessesthatsignalandthatarea,thatemotionaldriver


7

thatkindabuildswhatthatsignalmeansisinfluencedbyallsortsofthings.It'sinfluencedbyhowyouwereraised,it'sinfluenced...whatyouwereababy,liketheenvironmentthatthatwas.Thatcaninfluenceabitwiththefoodsthatyou'retaking,thephysicalactivitythatyou'redoing.Alotofithastodowithyourcopingmechanisms,thewaythatyouaredealingwithstressfulsituations,whichis,youknow,asIsaid,howIgotintostress.Andallofthatcaninfluencehowyouactuallyperceivepain.Sopainisallinourbrains,andIknowthatmaybesomechallengingforsomepeopletosay.Butifyoudonothaveabrainorifyourbrainisturnedoff,so,like,ifwetakeyoubackin...ifIwasgonnaputyoutosleepforanesthesiayoucan'thavepainbecauseyourbrainisnolongertheretoprocessthatsignal.Nowwhenyou'reunderanesthesia,andthere'sasurgeonworkingonyou,youarestillsendinglittlenervesignals...there'slittlenervesfiringinyourbodythataresendingthisinformationtoyourbrain.Butbecausethebrainisnolongerawake,itcannottakethatsignalandcauseittobepain.Sounfortunately,inourhealthcaresystem,wefocussomuchonmoreofthebiologyinthebodywhenitcomestopain,andweneglectmuchmoreofthecentral,thisreallycriticallyimportantareainthebrainandhowyouprocessthatsignalwhenitcomestopain.Andforchronicpain,especially,ifwe'renotdealingeffectivelywiththatbrain-basedmechanism,youknow,reallyunderstandinghowdepression,andanxietyinfluenceperceptionofpain,howifyou'reinastressfulenvironment,orifyouhaveapainthatcamefromastressfulexperience,therearesomecentralmechanismsforit,we'renotaddressingit.Andsowhenitcomestochronicpain,wefocusoninjections.Soifyoulookatchronicpain,youknow,peoplethathave...thetrainingthatIdid,wefocusoninjections,andepidurals,andburningthings,andeven...sofarasbacksurgeryforalotofthesethings.Andwe'renotgettingtothatcentralthatbrain-basedphenomena,andthat'swhywehavetheoutcomesthatwehavewithpain,whicharefranklyhorrendous.We'respendingover$600billionayear,they'reestimatinginthetreatmentofchronicpain,ouroutcomeswithchronicpainparticularlythingslikebackpain,neckpain,headacheshavenotimprovedinthelast20years.There'smorepeopleonnarcoticmedicationsthanhaveeverbeeninthepast.Andtheonlythingwe'vedonewiththatissendalotmorepeopleintodrugtreatment,andalotofpeople,frankly,tothemorguebecausethey'veoverdosedandthingslikethat.Sothemodelthatwe'redoingrightnow,whenitcomestochronicpain,isreallyalmosttheepitomeofwhatwe'redoingwithhealthcarebecausewe'renotdealingwithalotofthislifestylebehavior,copingmechanisms,stressreductionpracticesinwellness,notpromotingwellnessandwe'renotpromotingpreventativetypesofmedicine.Sothat'salonganswerforashortquestion,butasIsaid,thatcouldbeanepisodeinitselfrightthere.Katie:Yeah.Iagree.AndIthinktopeople...I'msureyou'vehadthisexperience,peoplewhoareinthatchronicpainsituation,eventhoughalotofitcanbe...likeyousaid,goingbacktothebrain,it'sstillaveryrealthingforthemandthey'redefinitelyabsolutelyfeelingpain.So,like,we'vemadethatconnectionbetweenstressandchronicpain,andIthinkthatmaybeahugekeytodealingwiththechronicpain.Butarethereotherpracticaltipsthatyouwouldsuggestorthingstheycouldmaybeworkwiththedoctor,ifthey'realreadybeingmedicatedforchronicpain,tohelplookatthoseotheraspectsaswell?Kevin:Thefourareasinchronicpainthathavethegreatestamountofbenefittothemarethesamefourareas


8

thatarereallyeffectiveforstress,andeffectiveforhealth,andotherchronicdisease.AndIthinkyouusethemasyourresetprinciple,Icallthem"thefundamentalfour,"butthey'rereallymakingsurethatyoumoveeveryday.Sodespiteyourpain,youhavetoactuallydosomesortofmovementbecausewhathappensifyoudon'tmove...Solet'stakeabackpainexample.Soifyouhavebackpainandyoudon'tmove,theshort-termreinforcementofthatbehavior.Soyou'relike,"Oh,mybackpainit'shurtingmereallybad.Idon'twannamove.I'mgonnasitinthischair."Well,whathappensinthatisthenyousitandyoustarttodecondition.Andonceyou'reovertheageofabout35,westartlosingmusclemasssoquickly,it'samazingtomehowfastyougetdeconditioned.Andmyownexperienceislike,ifIhaven'tbeenexercisingandIstopjustforacoupledays,andIgobacktosomething,youknow,IhavesomuchmoreachesandpainsfromthatbecauseI'mjustnotusedtoitbecauseI'vebeendeconditionedjustoverthosecoupleofdays.Soonceyoustopmovingwithyourpain,onceyoudohavetomoveagain,soyouhavetogodosomething,youhavetotakecareofyourkids,oryouhaveto,youknow,evengotoyourjobifyouhaven'tbeenmovingaround,you'regonnahurtmorebecauseyourligamentsaregonnatighten,yourmusclesaregonnabeless,you'regonnahaveabitmorewearandtearthanyoushouldhavebeen.You'regonnalosethestructuresthatarenecessarytokindakeepyouuprightmovingaround.Okay,theotherthingisyouhavetomakesurethatyou'reeatingtherightthings.Soaswesaid,whatyoueatiswhatyouare.Soifyou'reeatingjunkfood,crappyfood,alltheseprocessedthingsthatwehave,yourbodyisn'tgonnabeabletoheal.Sowhilethere'sthattworolesthatwehaveforpain,thatsensoryorbrain-basedphenomena,whatyou'retryingtodowiththefoodisyou'retryingtosupporthowyourbodyishealingitself,sowecanminimizealittlebitmoreofthatbody-based,sensory-basedthatthe...youknow,somepeoplesayit'stheorganicpartofpain.Andthenyouhavetotakethetimetorelaxanddealwithstress.Soyouhavetobeinsituationswhereyouperceiveitasachallenge.Again,seeingyourpainassomethingthatyoucanovercome,recognizingthatyoucangetbetterIthinkthat'sthebigone.Alotofitcomesintobeliefsofyourhealth,andIthinkthat'swhereIhavealotoffrustrationwithmedicalmodelthatwehaveisbecausealotofwedon'tsaythat,wesay,"Well,you'renotgonnagetbetter.Thisisjusthowitis."Orwetellyouthingsthat,"Allyourpainisfromabulgingdisc,andIgottatellyoubulgingdiscsarefoundinpeoplewithoutanypain."Butnowsinceyoubelieveit'scomingfromthatdiscpeoplestartthinkingthatthere'ssomethingwrong,andsothesebeliefsstartmanifestingandworseningyourpainbecauseyouthinkthatispermanent.Andthenthere'sthingslikesleepthatarerestorativetoyou.Soifyou'renotsleepingright,whichhappensalotwithchronicpain,you'renotgoingto...that'sgonnaincreasestressforyourselfandit'salsonotgonnaallowyourbodytoheal.Andthenyouhavetoavoidthethingsthataregonnaworsenyouoverall,thetoxinsthatwillmakeitworse.Andthebigoneisreallysmoking.Sosmokingcausesahostofbadthingsinyourbody,doesn'tallowyourbodytohealeffectively.Itbasically,youknow...Whenyou'relookingatthelowbackitself,that'soneofthelastareasthatgetalotofbloodflow,andsothenutrientsarelesswhenitgetsthere.Soifyou'resmokingyou'regivingitpoisoned,basicallytoxins,soit'snotgonnahealverywell.


9

Sothosearereallythefourthings,ismakingsurethatyoumove,makingsurethatyou'reeatingrealfood,makingsurethatyou'recopingwithstressappropriately,viewingthingsasachallenge,viewingassomethingthatyoucanovercomesocially,onyourstressaswell.Makingsurethatyouhaveasupportiveenvironmentaroundpeoplethatsupportyoutowardsyourgoal,andwantyoutogetbetter.Andthenlastly,avoidingthethingsthataregonnamakethingsworse,andthoseareliketoxins,likesmoking.Katie:Thankyou.Yeah,Iwouldechoallofthosepoints,absolutely.AnotherthingI'dlovetohaveyoutalkabout,withyourownbackgroundinmedicine,andnowalsobeingmoreonthepatientsideandhelpingeducatepatients,I'dloveitifyoucouldshedsomelightonthemindsetthatdoctorshave.Because,asamom,Isometimesfeellike,it'sfrustratingwhenI'mtalkingtodoctorsbecausemaybetheydon'teitherhearme,ortheydon'tthinkthatthere'sanyvalueinmyresearchbecauseI'mnotalsoadoctor.ButIalsorealizefromknowingoflotofdoctorsthattheyareatthecore,usuallyverygoodpeoplewhogointomedicine,becausetheytrulyhaveadesiretohelppeople,andalotoftimesmaybethereareasfrustratedwithsomeofthesethingsasweare.Socanyoushedsomelightonmaybethemiscommunicationsbetweenpatientsanddoctors,orthemindsetofadoctor?Andhowtoeffectivelybeanadvocateinyourowncare,butstillrespectingdoctorsandtheirdesiretohelpaswell?Kevin:Okay.SoI'mgonnagiveyoumymindsetisbecauseIthinkthat'salittlebitmoreeffectiveforme.AndIdon'twanttoputmyviewpointsorexperiencesonanyotherperson,andIdon'twannabeunfairtoanyotherdoctors.Iwillsay,Ihavetalked...Imeanalotofmyfriendsaredoctors.SoIthinkthatthereisauniversalitytoit,butIdon'twantanybodytogooutandsaythat,"Thisis...youknow,Dr.Cuccarocameonandsaidthisishowdoctorsthink."ButI'mjustgonnaprovidemyopiniononit.I'mjustkindawannaputthatouttheretobegin.Sodoctorsarereallyundersiegerightnow,andtherearesomanypressuresthatarecoming...youknow,somanyothereventsthataresortofoverwhelmingtothem.Itisavery,verydifficulttimetopracticemedicine.AndIcantellyou,almosteverypersonthatI'veevermet,thatwenttomedicalschool,thereasonthattheywentin...Infact,ifyou'resittingonadmissioncommitteeforamedicalschool,whichIhavedoneinthepast,youstartgettingnumbtoit.Becausepeoplecomeinbecausetheyreally,really,reallywanttohelpothers,andwewannahelpothersgetwell,andthat'sthedistinctionthat'sreallyimportanttounderstand,wewantpeopletogetwell.Butonceyoustartgettingintothemedicalsystem...andIshouldsay,onceyougetinmedicalschool,it'saverystressfulenvironment.Youareabsorbinghugeamountsofinformation.Inmyschool,wehadtestsbasicallyIthinkeveryMondaysandThursdays.Soyouwouldjustabsorbawholebunch,andthentakeatest,andthenrightafterthetest,you'restudyingforthenextone.Andyoustartlosingthatfocusbecauseyou'reinthatstressenvironment,youstartnotseeingwhat'sgoingaroundyou,andyou'rejustfocusedontryingtogetdonewithwhatyouneedtodo.Andthenonceyoustartgettingoutanddorotationsoronceyoustartactuallygetting...youknow,havetodoaresidency,yourinternshipandresidencytofindyourspecialty,thehealthcaresystemissetupinsuchawaythatitdoesn'treallypromotewellness.Wehavewhatiscalledasickcaresystem,wearetreatingpatientsthathavesickness,andthatisverydifferentthanpromotingwellness.


10

AndIliketouseananalogybetweenacuteandchronicmedicalconditions.Soacuteconditionsarethingsthatarehappeningnow,soifyoubreakyourleg,oryou'reinacaraccident,orifyouarehavingaheartattackorastroke,that'swhatourmedicalsystemisvery,verygoodat.There'sprobablynoothermedicalsystemintheworld,thatisgoodattakingsomecareofsomebodyinacutecondition.Soifyou'reinacaraccidentwehavefantastictraumacentersandwewilltrytoputyoubacktogether.Ifyou'rehavingaheartattackandtheyrushyouintotheemergencyroom,wecanopenupthatbloodvesselandthingslikethat.Butwhatwe'vedonenowisweareusingthatmodelforacutecare,andwearetryingtoshoveinthiswholechronicconditionandchronicmedicalproblemparadigmintoit.Sopeoplewhohave...Youknow,we'renotfixingorwe'renotpromotingthelifestylethatwouldkeeppeoplefromhavingtheheartattackinthefirstplace.Andwhenpeoplegoseetheirdoctor,theywouldliketohavethatadvice,butthatkindofchronicdiseasemanagement,thatbehavioralandlifestylechange,takestime,ittakesarelationshipwithyourphysician,ittakesreallysomestrategiesthat,I'llbefrankwith,we'renottaughtinmedicalschool.We'renottaughtalotaboutdiet,we'renottaughtalotaboutexerciseandmovement,we'renottaughtabouthowtomotivatepeopleandgetthemtochangetheirbehaviors.ThatwasquiteenlighteningwhenIsortoflookedintothatalittlebitmoreanddiscovered,"Wow,we'redoingitallwrong.Wejustbarrageyouwithtoomuchinformationandoverwhelmyou."Butwe'renothavingthosetoolstoreallypromotepeoplegettingwell,andwe'reinamodelthatfixesacuteconditions.Brokenbonesandwesortofpatchyouupandeitherwaitforthattohappenforyouoryougooffanddoyourownthing.Now,theotherpart,aboutthisisthepaymentmodel.Sowealwayshavetoremembertoothatwhiledoctorsaregoingintomedicinebecausetheywannahelppeople,alotofthemedicalsystemsandevendoctors'officeshavestaffthattheyhavetotakecareof,theyhavebillsthatpay,theyhavetokeepthedoorsopen.AndthatthewaythatinsurancecompaniesandMedicarepayforservices,theyreallypromoteproceduresandinterventionsovertime.Andwhenyouhavethesortoffinancial...andIdon'tliketousethewordreward,butmoreofafinancialincentivetoeitherdosomethingtosomebodyortoseemorepeoplequicker,becausetheydon'tvaluetime.Insurancecompaniesdon'tpaywellfortime,soifadoctorcouldcomeinandtalktoyoufor45minutes...andIusedtotellpatients,whenIwasseeingthem,formetositandtalkwiththemfor45minutes,Igotpaidsignificantlyless.We'retalking300%,400%,500%lessinsomesituations,thanitwouldbetowalkinfor5minutesandsay,"Let'sgodothisinjectioninyou,andwe'lltakeyouintoadifferentroom,differentarea,adifferentplaceinthehospitalorcenteranddoaquickinjectionthatdoesn't...youknow,takes15minutestodo."Thatisvaluedorit'spaidmuchbetterthanspendingtimeintalkingtosomebody.Anddoctors...alotofdoctors,Iwouldsay,particularlyprimarycarephysician,thosearetheonesIhaveprobablythegreatestamountofempathyforandalotoffrustrationwiththeenvironmentthatthey'redealingwith.Becausethesearethedoctorsthataretryingtospendtimewithpatients,andaretoldoverandoveragain,throughhealthcareadministrators,oreveniftheyhavetheirownprivatepractice,youknow,


11

lookingatthebills,andtryingtomakesurethattheycankeeptheirdoorsopen,andthattheycanpaytheirstaff,thattheyhavetogetpatientsthroughasfastastheycan.There'smanagementassociationouttheremanyofthemnotrunbydoctors,thataretalkingabouthowyoucanmaximizeyourincomebybasically,makingthiscattleprodding,drivingpeoplethroughtheseappointmentsinthemostefficientmanner.Andasmanypeopleunderstand,efficiencydoesnotmeaneffective.Imean,thefirstthingthatyouwannadoisbeeffective,andthenthesecondthingyouwannadoisafteryou'rebeingeffectiveasyouwannabeefficient.Andthere'stoomuchofafocusonbeingefficient,meaninggetpeoplethroughasrapidlyaspossibleandlessonbeingeffective.Soforpatients,ifyouaregoingin,andparticularlyifyou'renotseeingthedoctorallthetime,that'stheotherpartthatwehavetounderstandis95%ofhealthcaredeliveryisreally...andI'mhopingI'mgettingthisright.Iusuallygotoohighonthispercentage,butit'susuallylessthanthat,it'sabout5%or10%ofthepopulation.Ithinkiscloserto5%ofthepopulationisusing95%thesehealthcareresources.Now,whatdoesthatmean?Itmeans,oftentimes,thedoctorseeingsomeonethatiscomingin,thathasn'tbeentakinganycontrolovertheirhealth,hasnotbeenfollowinganyoftherecommendationsthat'sbeingdone,thatisnotdoinganythingtotakecareofthemselvesthat'snotalways...Imean,there'ssomesituationswhenpeoplehavebeeninacaraccidentandpeoplearegoingundertreatmentforcancerandthingslikethat.Butalotofthesebehavioralandlifestylediseasesthere'speoplecomingbackagain,andagain,andagain,thathaven'tlistenedtotherecommendationsinthefirstpart.Andbecauseyouhavethisenvironmentwherethedoctorsnowcan'tspendtimewithpatients,theyhavethisfinancialoverheadortheseotheradministratorstellingthemthattheyhavetocyclethroughthesepatients,youknow,quicker.Thattheyhavetogeneratewhat'sknownas,youknow,RVU,aRelativeValueUnit.Andthentheyhaveaselectpatientpopulation,thatiscominginover,andover,andoveragain,thatisn'treallyinterestedintakingcareofthemselves,thisiscausingalotofburnout.Andifyoulookatactuallysomethestatisticswhenitcomestomedicine,doctorshaveoneofthehighestburnoutratesandoneofthehighestsuicideratesofanyprofessionoutthere.Sofromadoctorstandpoint,IlookandItalktodoctorsaboutthis,andit'salittlebitmorechallengingontheirend.Fromapatientstandpoint,whatthismeansisyoureallyhaveto,numberone,knowwhatitisthatyou'retryingtogetoutoftheappointmentwithyourdoctor.Numbertwo,youhavetosortofunderstandthatmindsetthedoctorhastheyreallydowantyoutogetwell,buttheyhaveawholebunchofotherpressuresthataregoingon.They'restressedoutas...orgetoutinthefirstplace.AndI'mnotsayingthatyouneedtobackoffonthat,butyoucan'tgoinwithalistof25questionsandexpectingthatyou'regonnagetthemallanswered,it'snotgonnaworkthatway.AndIthinkConsumerReportssaidsomething,andtheysaid,"Listouteverythingthatwaswrongthatyouwantedtogoinfor,"andyou'renot.Youneedtofocuswhenyou'regoingintoanappointmentononeprimarything.Andthere'sastructurethat,Icangetintoitlater,ifwehavetimeonit,onhowtoactuallyframethatvisitandgettheanswersthat...whatyouneedforthatonething.Butreally,goingwiththatoneprimaryreasonthatyou'reseeingthedoctorfor,andifthereareotherissuesthatmaycomeup,thenifthere'stimeyoucanaddressit.Butyoureallywannafocusonthatonething.Andbecauseofthewaythatourhealthcaresystemissetup,ifyouhavemultipleconcerns,ifthereareotherones


12

thatyouwouldliketotalkabout,youprobablygonnahavetomakeanotherappointmentforit.It'snotsatisfyingIhatemyself,butifyougoinatleastgetthatonethingoutofit,that'sbetterthan...youknow,onegoodanswerisbetterthansixreallynotverygoodanswers.Doesthatansweryourquestion?OrIcanclarifysomethingsifthereareotherthingsthatyouliketotalkabout.Katie:Yeah,thatwasagoodpoint.AndIwouldlovetohearmoreaboutyourframeworkforadoctor'svisit,Ithinkthatwouldbehelpful.BecauseIknowyourpoint'swelltakenaboutweareexcellentatacutecareinAmerica,andI'veseenthismainlyfromthepregnancyandbirthsideofthings.IhadaC-sectionwithmythird,thatsavedbothmineandhislives,andI'mextremelygratefulforthat,andIthinktheyhaveabsolutelyaplace.Butatthesametime,Ithinkregularpregnancysometimescanbemanagedlikeadiseasewhenit'snot.AndI'vehadtobemyownpatientadvocatealotandhaveswitcheddoctorsalmostwitheverypregnancy,becauseofthat.SoI'dlovetohearmaybesomesuggestionsforthebestwaytoapproachadoctorsothat,maybe,hedoesn'tfeellikeI'mtryingtosteponhistoes,butatthesametime,IcanbeanadvocateformyownwhatI'mtryingtoaccomplish.Kevin:Okay.Sotheonethingyoudon'twannagoinanddoisthehugesheafofpapers,allright,andpeoplecanbevery,veryeducatedontheirdiseaseprocess,butthatalsohasatendencytoraisesomeredflagsfordoctors.Andagain,there'saperspectiveissueonit,butthere'speoplecominginwhohavereally...Imean,peoplewillcomeinwithastubbedtoeandwillhave17differentpagesanddemandingMRIfortheirstubbedtoe.Thosearetheonesthatarereallyusingalotofhealthcareresourcesforit.Sowhatyouwannagoin,isyouwannahavebasicallyonesheetofpaper,andtherearesevenquestionsthatyoureallywannaknoworatleastwhatyouwannahaveananswerfor.Andwhatyouwannaknowiswhatisthekeyproblemthatyou'rehaving,youknow,whatisitthepain?Whatisthequestionthatyouhave?Howlonghaveyoubeenhavingitfor?Whereisitlocatedinyourbody?Doesitradiateordoesitmovefromthatareaormovearoundinyourbody?Whatmakesitworse?Whatmakesitbetter?Whatelsehaveyoufoundwithit?Doyouhavefevers?Doyouhavechills?Doyouhavearash,haveyounoticechangesin...youknow,you'regoingtothebathroomdifferentoryoucanblurvisionorsomething?Andthenlastly,whatyoureallywannaknowisifyou'vehaditbeforewhatworkedforyouinthepast,andIamdoingthisoffthetopmyhead,soIdon'tknowifIhitallseventhereexactly.ButIdidawholeepisodeofthatat"StraightShotHealth,"that,youknow,ifpeoplewannacheckoutthere,Ithinkitwasepisodenumberone.Ittalksaboutthesevenquestionsthatyouneedtoknow.Gotalittlesidetrackedthere,didIhiteverythingwithyourquestiononthat?Katie:Yes,thatwasreallyhelpful.I'veneverheardthatbutthat'sverygoodadvicetohavethosequestionsansweredforyourselfbeforeyougoin,that'sreallyhelpful.AndIhatethatwe'realreadycomingtowardtheendofourtime,butI'dlovetofinishwiththreequestionsthatIaskeveryguest.Andthefirstoneiswhathealthorevenotheradvicedoyouwishsomeonehadgivenyouyearsago,oratthebeginningofyourcareerthatyouwouldliketoshare?Kevin:Oh,Ilovethatquestion.Ilovethatquestionbecausethisissomething...Youknow,ifIcouldhaveanythingfromanyofyourlistenersgoout,andreadandsomeofyoumayalreadyknowthisbutittookme39yearsbeforeIreadthisbook.There'sabookbyCarolDweckandshe'saPsychologistatStanford,andit'scalled"Mindset."Thetitleofit"Mindset:TheNewPsychologyofSuccess,"andwhatitreallytalksaboutisthis


13

twotypesofmindset,afixedmindset,andagrowthmindset.Andtherearemanyofus,andIwouldincludethere'sprobablyalotofphysicians,itwasdefinitelyme,thathavethisideaofafixedmindset,andwhatthatfixedmindsetsaysisthatwehavesomeinnateability,thatthewaythatwewerebornorourparentsweresortofpredetermineshowweareinourlives,andyou'reeithergoodatsomethingornot.Soyou'regoodatsportsoryou'regoodatEnglish,andthat'snotreallytrue.Becausewhattheresearchhasreallyproven,isthisthingcalledthegrowthmindset.Andthisgrowthmindsetisfocusingongettingbetter,soeverysituationthatyougointo,everychallengethatyouhave,isnotaquestionofwhetherit'srightorwrong,oryougot100%oranA.It'sreallyareyouimproving?Areyougettingbetterovertime?Now,thelittletwistofthis,themostimportantconceptthatIgotoutofDr.Dweck'sbookwastheconceptoffailing.Whenyouhavethatgrowthmindset,whenyouhaveachallengeorifsomethingdoesn'tgothewaythatyouwishitdid,orsayyouhaveahealthconditionthatmaynotbesomethingthatyouaskfororoccurred.Whensomethingbadhappensittellsyouthingsthatarenotworkingforyou,ittellsyouthingsthatmaybeyouneedtochange,butittellsyouthatthere'sapossibilitythatyoucangetbetter.Becausethere's...again,there'snotthisinnatenesstoanythinganymore.Sowithoutadoubt,thatIthinkisthemostimportantbook,Ihaveeverreadinmylife.Katie:Awesome.That'sagreatsuggestion.AndI'dalsolovetoknow,whatisonepracticalandactionablestepthatlistenerscantakerightnowtoimprovesomeaspectoftheirlives?Kevin:IwouldgooutandgetCarolDweck'sbookiftherewasanythingelse.Ithinkthebigpartforme,andwhatIloveaboutyourshow,andIwhatIloveaboutyourwebsite,isthatpeopleactuallybelieveandunderstandthattheycantakecontroloftheirhealth.Sowe'reinadayandagenow,whenthereisahugeamountofinformationalittlebittoomuchinsomeways.Butthere'sanswers,andifyouarefrustratedwithsomething,youcanactuallyfindanswerstosomeofthequestionsthatyoumayhave.Youmaystartgoingdowndifferentavenues,youhavetoolsnowthatwedidn'thaveeven10yearsago,toallowyoutobecomemoreeducatedinwhateveryourproblemsmaybe.Andaswebecomemoreeducated,itchallengestheotherpeopleinyourlife,soparticularly,ifyou'relookingathealthcareagain,youdon'twannagoonwithasheafof25differentpapers,butyouwannagoinwithaperspectivebenicetoyourphysician,andrecognizingtheireducationbutsay,"Youknow,I'velookedinthismyself,andthisiswhat..."Youknow,choosingwisely.org,whichwedidn'tgetachancetotalkaboutrightnow,recommendspeopledo,ornotdointhisparticularsituation.ThisiswhattheAmericanCollegeofObstetricsandGynecologysayswhenitcomestothis,youknow,diseaseprocessorthisstageinpregnancywhichiswhereIthinkthatyouhavetoldmeIaminrightnow.Sothisprovidesyouasenseofcontrolanditreallyempowersyoumuchmore.Nowyouhavetobeabletoactuallyuseit,andIthinkthat'sthe...theimportantthingsis,weareinastagenowwherethere'sallthisinformation,usethatinformationeffectivelytostartfindinganswersforyourhealthconcernsandtakingamoreactiveroleinyourownhealthmanagement.Katie:Excellent.Thankyou,andobviouslybesidesyourownawesomewebsite,andyourpodcast,whatwouldbesomeotherhealthresourcesyoupointusers?Andyoumentionedagreatbookalready,butisthere


14

anythingelsethatyouthinkwouldbeagoodresource?Kevin:Oh,absolutely.Yeah,sure.Sothere'sacoupleotherbooksIwouldliketomention.Numberone,whenyou'relookingatbehaviorchange,andrememberwhenwe'retalkingaboutmostchronicdiseases,andalotofthediseasethatwehaveinthewesternindustrializedworld,thediseaseoflifestylebehavior.Andoneofthebetterbooks,Iwouldsay,thatreallygotmethinkingdifferently,wasabookcalled"Switch"byChipHeathandDanHeath.Thisisabookthatisnotreallyrelatedtohealth,tobeginwith,Ithinkoneofthe...Heathbrotherisanentrepreneur,theotheroneisa,IthinkanEconomistatStanford.Buttheframeworkthatthey'reusingtochangebehaviorsoforganizationsisaframeworkthatyoucanuseasapatient,asapersontokindofsetyourselfupforsuccessinyourownbehavioralchangestrategies.Likeifyou'retryingtostartaexerciseprogram,ifyou'retryingtochangeyourdiet,theframeworktheyhaveisfantastic.Iguesswedon'thavetimetotalkaboutthathere,unfortunately.Theothertwo...I'mgonnagivetwospecificpainresourcesbecauseasIknow,painisapain,anditisahugeproblemandthatthereissomuchmisinformationandbadinformationwhenitcomestochronicpain.ThebestresourcesthatIfoundnowareacoupleofbooks.One,Ithinkthe"RelaxationRevolution"byDr.Bensonwherehetalksaboutthisrelaxationresponseisagreatstartforanybodyforyourhealthingeneral,butparticularlywithchronicpain.Andthenthere'stwootherones,one'scalled"UnlearnYourPain,"andthat'sbyDr.HowardSchubiner,whoisaninternistinMichigan.Thatbook...Iwilltellyouthere'saworkbooksectiononit,itisnoteasytodo,butthefirstfourchaptersalone,whenhestartstalkingabouttheseconceptsofpain,arequitegood.AndIhaven'tfoundalotofpeoplethathavebeenabletowriteitinsuchawaythatit'sunderstandable.Andthelastone,becausebackpainisreallyprobablythelargestpainconcern,itisthelargestpainconcerninthenationandtheworld,andwe'vehadsomeoftheworstoutcomeswithbackpainwe'redoingsomehorrendousthingswithit.There'sabookbyanOrthopedicSurgeoninWashingtonDavidHanscom.Itisadifficultbooktoread.AsIsaid,oneoftheproblemswehaveasdoctorsiswearenotcommunicatingverywell,andweforgetthatpeopledon'tspeak"doctortalk."Andwe'vespent8,10yearsoflearningdoctortalk,andsoweneedtostarttranslatingthatinabettermethodforpeoplesotheycanunderstandanduseit.Andunfortunately,David'sbook,alittlebitmoredifficulttoreadbutforbackpain,ifyou'reevenconsidering,youknow,goingtoasurgeonoradoctororyou'rehavingchronicbackpain.Iwouldreallystartwiththatbookbecausehe'sanOrthopedicSpinePhysicianhedoesthesurgery,soheprovidesalittlebitmoreofacredibilitythatalotofpeopledon'thave.Soforbackpain,Iwouldsaygethisbookandit'scalled"BackinControl,"andthat'sbyDavidHanscom.Sothreesourcesrightthere,"Switch"byChipandDanHeath,that'sforbehaviorchange."UnlearnYourPain"byDr.HowardSchubiner,that'saboutpainandparticularlythefirstfourchapterstokindofunderstandingpainalittlebitbetter.Andlastly,"BackinControl"byDavidHanscom,that'saboutbackpainspecifically.Katie:Awesome.I'llmakesuretolinktothoseintheshownotes,sothatthelistenerscanfindthose.Andlastly,justreminduswherecanlistenersfindyou,iftheywannalearnmoreaboutyou?


15

Kevin:Sure,somywebsiteisstraightshothealth.com,andmypodcastis"StraightShotHealthTalk."Thosearethetwobigareasthatyoucanfindme.I'malwaysinterestedinhearingpeople's,youknow,questionsthattheyhave,youknow,theotherdifficultythatwehavewiththeInternetisthere'sallthesesortsoflegalconcernsandmedical-legalconcerns.Soifthere'sgeneralquestions,Iwouldlovetohearthem,becauseI'mtryingtoprovidethoseanswers,Ican'tgiveanypersonalmedicaladvice,asIsaid,butIwouldlovetohearsomefeedback.BecauseIwannaknowfrompeoplewhatitisthattheyhavethebiggestquestionson.SoasIsaid,thedoctorswehaveourownsetoffrustrations,andIcansortofimaginewhatotherpeople'sfrustrationswouldbe,butmeimaginingwhatapatientsfrustrationis,isnotnearlyasgoodnorisitaseffectiveaspatientstellinguswhattheproblemsare.AndifIhearwhatthoseproblemsarethenIcouldtrytoaddressthem,Icouldtrytoprovidesomeoftheframeworkandtools.Andreally,again,Iwantpeopletogetwell.Youknow,asphysicianswewantpeopletogetwell,wewannastopfocusingonsickness,wewannareallystartencouragingpeopletotakecontroloftheirlives,andtogethealthier.AndanythingIcandotohelpyou,Iwouldlovetodoit.Katie:Thankyousomuch,andI'dencouragelistenerstogocheckout...Icheckedoutbothyourpodcastandyoursite,andtherearesomegreatresourcesonthere.Andthankyousomuchforbeinghere,andforyouranswers,andfortakingyourtime.Kevin:Katie,thankyousomuch.Ihadagreattime.IhaveawholelotofstuffIcouldtalkaboutoverandoveragain.I'msorrythatwewantalittlebitlongonthisepisode,butIlovewhatyou'redoing.I'mveryexcitedforyourpodcast.Iloveseeingpeopletakingcontroloftheirhealth,andyouknow,thankyou,thankyousomuch.Andifyoueverwantmeback,youjustask.Katie:Iwasgonnasaywe'llhavetohaveyoubacktoreallyelaboratemore.Andthankyoutoallofyouforlisteningtothe"WellnessMamaPodcast."Ifyouwould,ifyouhaven'talready,pleasetakeasecondandsubscribeiniTunessothatyou'llseeallthefutureepisodes,andyouwon'tmissany.AndIwouldalsobereallyappreciativeifyoucouldleavearevieworaratinginiTunessothatotherscanfindusaswell.Sountilnexttime,thanksforlistening,andhaveahealthyweek.

Documents

7- Reducing Stress, Chronic Pain and Talking to …...Kevin: Thank you, Katie. I'm extraordinarily excited to be here and I love what you're doing. Katie: Awesome. Thank you. I'm gonna